White Stripes man slags off music games

By Ellie Gibson Published 23 June, 2009

Led Zeppelin not big fans either.

Rocker Jack White, who recently signed a deal for his songs to appear in the new Guitar Hero game, has complained about kids playing Guitar Hero games.

As reported by the NME White said, "It's depressing to have a label come and tell you that [Guitar Hero] is how kids are learning about music and experiencing music."

While White tries not to dictate "which format people should get their music in" he added, "If you have to be in a videogame to get in front of them, that's a little sad."

White somehow managed to see through his tears to sign a contract that will see his band's tracks appearing in Guitar Hero 5, as announced earlier this month.

He wasn't the only one taking a pop at Guitar Hero. Led Zeppelin's Jimmy Page said music videogames don't teach players anything, telling a press conference, "You think of the drum part that John Bonahm did on Led Zeppelin's first track on the first album, Good Times Bad Times. How many drummers in the world can play that part, let alone on Christmas morning?"

Here at Eurogamer we've realised we'll never play golf like Tiger Woods or drive cars as fast as Jenson Button either, and are throwing all our videogames in the bin.

Picture of Ellie.

About Ellie Gibson

Since joining Eurogamer in the mid 2000s, Ellie has written about subjects as diverse as the fall of Gizmondo, the rise of Hollyoaks actresses in Red Alert games and the noise a bear makes under NSFW circumstances.

Read more articles from Ellie by visiting the Ellie Gibson archive page.

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Comments (96) Latest comment 3 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Vice.Destroyer #1 3 years ago

    I'd have a lot more respect for the opinion of Jack White, if he wasn't compelled to add to his perceived problem, by making his music available on Guitar Hero.
    I think that is what you call a sell-out.

  • zakrocz #2 3 years ago

    "Here at Eurogamer we've realised we'll never play golf like Tiger Woods or drive cars as fast as Jenson Button either, and are throwing all our videogames in the bin"

    LOL

  • patch #3 3 years ago

    Is there not an argument to be made for the fact that guitar hero / rock band et al. introduce people to music they would otherwise not experience? Is there really enough evidence to draw conclusions on whether games are detrimental or instrumental to people learning to play musical instruments? They all seem to assume kids would otherwise be playing a real guitar, rather than sitting around watching TV.

  • macmurphy #4 3 years ago

    I think it's a nice chance for talentless wasters like me to at least feel like they're making music and getting involved. Also there must be countless kids who start on Guitar Hero and then want to learn an instrument for real.

    I'm kind of in aggreement that when I see really good Guitar Hero players I do wonder if perhaps their time might not have been better spent learning the real thing. But for losers like me who haven't got the time or desire to do so, it's a great substitute. He should take his head out of his arse and realise there are a lot of people who just want to have a little fun.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 11:11

  • Doctor_What #5 3 years ago

    Games are a bit sad? Well, so's thinking that writing rock music actually makes you a sensitive, emotional, or intelligent person, but I don't see Jack stopping any time soon.

  • Raiftel #6 3 years ago

    I think White’s comments were more about the discovery of music more than anything else. That he was depressed that the only way to get kids into music was by making it into an interactive element. I wish Page would brighten up, I want to mash buttons on a plastic guitar along to Kashmir and Black Dog

  • FWB #7 3 years ago

    I don't see a hypocrisy in this. You want to get your music out to as many people as possible so fair enough signing up, although the money sure makes it extra special. But why should that stop you from disliking the medium? It's like those who moan about MP3s taking over from CDs but still purchase the former. One can be critical of something while taking it on board. Although I for one see no problem with using Guitar Hero as a medium. Never played the game, but in an age where the music is becoming freer one should be happy to get paid for it.

    Jimmy Page's comment is idiotic though.

  • Eraser #8 3 years ago

    Yeah, because MTV these days is a viable alternative to get our music needs... *switches on TV* oh, The Hills *turns off TV*.

    I don't see guitar hero as a way to get exposed to music to be honest. I have other, more vast channels for that. Guitar Hero isn't about finding new, interesting music, it's about having fun with music you already know. And the "worst" that could happen is that you stumble upon a band you haven't heard of before, like their GH songs and get their album. I don't see how that's sad.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 11:14

  • Mr_Dodger #9 3 years ago

    FFS. I'm sick to death of these up-their-own-arse musos slagging off these games (especially, as pointed out, whilst simultaneously putting their own songs in them. Ah, the siren call of the old greenback, amazing how it deafens out the tiny squeaks of conscience). They are GAMES. They aren't meant to teach you how to play the guitar (although more of a case can be made for the drums).

  • MyAfroAndMe #10 3 years ago

    Rock Band is all sorts of fun. Singstar is nearly as much fun. If you don't like these games, don't play them and don't moan about others having fun. Simple really.

    Also Jack White is happy to take the money so I don't get his objection.

  • Slim #11 3 years ago

    I'm sick of this 'play a real instrument' snobbery. Should people play with real guns instead of Call of Duty. It's a GAME you eejits, it's not supposed to be real.

  • FWB #12 3 years ago

    I don't think he objects to the game. He's not happy that the label has told him that the game is how kids experience their music now. Great if you're a big star and someone wants to sign you up, not so hot for those smaller artists. But to be honest, what's new? Most people don't hunt for music, they're just not that passionate about it. They let it come to them and take whatever they're fed. I'm exactly the same with films.

  • youhavenomail #13 3 years ago

    Perhaps if John Bonham had played videogames instead of drumming in an awful band he wouldn't be dead.

  • asphaltcowboy #14 3 years ago

    I think 'slagging off' music games is a little sensationalist, no?

  • FWB #15 3 years ago

    Not quite sure you can call Zeppelin awful. :) Not quite my cup of tea, but they were still great at what they did.

  • danathjo #16 3 years ago

    shame, if sales were good enough to have a Aerosmith and Van Halen version then imagine a Led Zep and Prince one? (Prince also has the same stance on these games)

  • TopKatt #17 3 years ago

    And I've realised that I'm never gonna look as good as Lara Croft does in a black and yellow bikini. I've tried it, believe me.

  • OllyJ #18 3 years ago

    What a Douchebag, I've been able to find new bands all the time and I haven't listened to the radio or watched a music TV show in years.

    The fact that i've discovered a load of new bands I like through RB and GH is a major plus.

  • DFawkes #19 3 years ago

    Music games are games. if I were a big name artist, I'd be happy people could pretend to play my stuff in a fun manor, in much the same way I'd be happy if I was in an action movie and the game of said movie was out. It's probably be rubbish though :p

    I don't think anyone would play GH or RB and think they could play for real, it's just a fun game. Plus I've discovered a liking for a few great artists, that I'd have missed out otherwise. I wouldn't say that's sad, presenting your music to a new audience.

  • menage #20 3 years ago

    Go play your analog crap and leave us the fuck alone then. Like they have real useful contributions to society.

  • dopeonthetable #21 3 years ago

    Normally, when ‘dumbing down’ is afoot, I would happily lead the charge. I believe that we live in a world where our personalities are being systematically sanded down and our autonomy reduced for the sake of profit and that we should fight this trend wherever, whenever possible. Contrary to Jack White’s opinion, I think one way of if not reversing this trend, stemming the blood loss, would be to engage in more activities like Guitar Hero, and less activities like listening to The White Stripes on your iPod. They play rock music for office workers. They write soundtracks to commutes. I think games like Guitar Hero offer a genuinely new way of interacting with music that is somewhere between passive listening and active playing. I say genuinely new because this has literally never happened before in the history of the universe and is pretty sweet.

    As for it being a distraction from playing ‘real instruments’ (a distinction that needs to be readdressed in the light of this new interaction), this is the exact opposite argument usually squared at videogames i.e. playing GTA turns you into a murderer. So which is it? Do videogames sap or bolster our behaviours? At any rate, however much a ‘distraction’ you believe Guitar Hero to be, it is certainly no more of one than simply listening through your stereo. So even live music purists will have to admit, ‘real instrument’ > Guitar Hero > passive listening.

  • djcool3005 #22 3 years ago

    "Here at Eurogamer we've realised we'll never play golf like Tiger Woods or drive cars as fast as Jenson Button either, and are throwing all our videogames in the bin. "
    Lmao good one. That made me laugh. I also realise I'll probably never shoot anyone in the head with an M4 so I'll bin COD4 while I'm at it.

  • Junglist95 #23 3 years ago

    +1 Slim, yeah instead of everyone going out & buying COD MW2 when its released why don't we all sign up to the army & go fight a real war in iraq or afghanistan

  • jack_klugman #24 3 years ago

    Which is more "sad" - people coming to music through video games or rock stars moaning about it?

  • Triggerhappytel #25 3 years ago

    I expect he'll start to feel better when the royalty checks start coming through.

    Knew this was written by Ellie the moment the sarcasm started to filter through. Made me chuckle away :)

  • reaperjon91 #26 3 years ago

    I can sort of see where Jack White is coming from and sort of not.. I mean surely you must already be interested in rock music and like it to want to play the game? so the chances are you already listen to a little rock music. so if a person heard one or two tracks of Jack White's music and likes it, arn't they more likely to go and buy an album, other than maybe just sumbling across some of his music one day. Also, I find that games such as Rock Band and Guitar Hero actually make the younger generation want to pick up an actual instrument and learn to play. So on the whole, I really don't see any problems with these music games. I also thought Jimmy Page's comment was stupid..

    Bring on DJ Hero! ^^
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 21:51

  • kinky_mong #27 3 years ago

    If they're putting White Stripes tracks into Guitar Hero won't that require an Easy - mode for drums to fully replicate Meg White's drumming style?

    And why is my comment displayed in bold when I haven't used the tags to do so?
    Edited by 3 at 23/06/09 @ 11:46

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #28 3 years ago

    It's no different to Kareoke

    Ah, but it is different to karaoke. At least until somebody gets an album deal, a national tour and makes it to the final of Britain's Got Talent based on practicing pushing buttons in time on a plastic guitar.

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #29 3 years ago

    Alert! Alert Bold tag leak
    [/b]

    Won't somebody please think of the children?
    Edited by 2 at 23/06/09 @ 11:47

  • ArcMonkey #30 3 years ago

    In some pieces on EG, there's one phrase that makes me look up and think 'this one is Ellie's'. This time it was "White somehow managed to see through his tears to sign a contract".

  • MeBrains #31 3 years ago

    just yesterday I purchased PS2 GH:LoR for €29,90, which seemed quite a reasonable price. I bought it for my kids as well as myself, since I never knew what the fuzz was about. That is clearer now. First thoughts are: yes, it is a fun game. But I was amazed to see how difficult it quickly became. You have this practice mode, where you really need to play the same song time and again in order to hit the notes correctly. Before you can play all songs - I suppose you need to invest hours. All very well, since it is fun.

    Since you need to invest so much time to learn these songs, I did start wondering (and will continue to do so) if it would not be better for my 8y old son to invest that amount of time he will undoubtedly need to master GH in playing a real guitar... but what with the ease of which GH leads you to its mastery? You do not have that kind of interactive experience with a real guitar and I can see he'd quickly grow bored of the real thing... So, I do understand the real guitar heroes: in the end, this all leads to nill. I'll have my son have fun with it though. If nothing else, he'll learn some classic songs. Feel the rythm and improve his eye-hand coordination. All of which do seem to be necessary even if you want to play the real instrument...
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 11:50

  • beep #32 3 years ago

    I could see people who are decent at drumming in Guitar Hero/ Rock Band, becoming decent at real drumming too, as there is almost no difference in terms of coordination and developing a sense of rhythm, even if it misses on the technique side of things (hi hat control, pressure control, etc). I think paying GH guitar can benefit learners in terms of their dexterity, but that's about it.

    In the end, the games are just supposed to be fun, and people who moan about them not benefitting the youth are pratts.

  • AphoticCosmos #33 3 years ago

    Music Industry: "Whine whine whine; we aren't making as much money as games, and we aren't growing anywhere near as fast, but we still think we're better than them as an artistic medium."

    You know, maybe kids these days don't want to pay however many hundreds of quid it is for a nice guitar only to realise that they can't play for shit and that it was a big waste of money. Games are about fantasy, if that fantasy is to be a rock star in their living room then I suggest that they go buy Guitar Hero or Rock Band. All these music legends who think they know it all about the relationship between music and games can go back to their mansions and cry themselves to sleep at night, for all I care.

  • Progguitarist #34 3 years ago

    I think some artists believe that these games draw kids away from wanting to play/learn real instruments. As a full time music teacher my own experience is completely different. When I ask 11 year old kids how they started liking ACDC et al they usually reply "Guitar Hero".

    I often do feel sometimes that yung uns miss out on the experience of clamouring for your favorite band to release a new album. It seems like everything is almost too accessible now...No more mystery around artists and certainly no more larger than life rock stars anymore.

    :(

  • Freek #35 3 years ago

    They'd prefer it if people just bought a CD and listened to the music passively? You're not going to learn about music either way, that's not why people buy music. They want to be entertained, and a video game gives them more then just the listening experience.

  • finty13 #36 3 years ago

    @youhavenomail

    I hope your joking, right? Despite Jimmy's daft comments here, Led Zeppelin in my eyes are still the best rock band ever to walk the face of the earth.

  • smartgun #37 3 years ago

    Let's put it in context. Some horrible twats from a record label, intent on establishing multiple revenue streams from what they see as their product (The Stripes), tell Mr White "Yeah Jack, that's how kids are learning about music now. Just sign here."

    He naturally feels a bit depressed by this bullshit.

  • McBradders #38 3 years ago

    "I hate new ways of making money off my old stuff, I really do."

    Music Games could be considered the new MTV, you know, actually exposing people to new bands, songs... hell, even just thinking about music in a different light. I know that thanks to GH and RB I've been exposed to stuff I would never have thought of, especially since the demise of Music actually making up the bulk of MTV's airtime... the less said about Radio the better, at this point.

  • MyAfroAndMe #39 3 years ago

    He should have gone with Rock Band 2, it's quite a ways better then Guitar Hero: WT.

  • Redeye #40 3 years ago

    If I were to go solely by these and previous similar comments, it'd strike me that said musos don't really grasp the concept that such games are meant to be entertainment rather than replacement. If anything, it might actually inspire some to learn how to play the real things - I'd wager that's happened in more than a few cases already.

    And besides, if it gets people into music period, surely that's no bad thing?

  • Progguitarist #41 3 years ago

    Why has he allowed his music to be used?

    Not all artists have control over what and how it is used by their respective labels.

  • alpha-0ne #42 3 years ago

    ""If you have to be in a videogame to get in front of them, that's a little sad."

    Smell the coffee music man videogames are your bitch

  • paulf #43 3 years ago

    he's not slagging off music games though is he? he's saying it's sad that they are learning about music that way, but at least they are learning about music (in a fashion)

  • Toothball #44 3 years ago

    Since I started playing Rock Band I've started buying all manner of music, both from artists whose music is included in the game or as DLC, and artists who have never appeared in music games and are unlikely to due to the style of music. Apparently that's a bad thing?

    Metallica do seem to have a much better attitude to this. While I don't much care for their choice of rhythm action platforms, they seem to see it as a way to get their music out to more people than would otherwise hear it.

  • Bigglesworth #45 3 years ago

    I'm curious as to whether he'd be equally upset to have his music on the soundtrack of a regular game (ie, in a non interactive manner). By extension, would he be annoyed to have one of his tracks on a movie soundtrack? What's the difference?

  • kevwinter #46 3 years ago

    I've bought cd's/mp3's with songs on that I've heard on guitar hero:WT and other games. It may not be the games main goal but it can be a good way of getting your music heard.

  • JahB #47 3 years ago

    i'd totally understand his point if he was a great guitar player, but come on, it's the white stripes we're talking about. it takes about the same amount of time to learn how to play guitar hero as it takes to learn half of their songs on a real guitar. dude should stop talking until he actually writes a song with more than three chords in it.

  • jonsaan #48 3 years ago

    No country for old men.

  • kangarootoo #49 3 years ago

    I have no time for this elitist tosh. If kids aren't listening to music AT ALL, then start f*cking worrying. If they are appreciating music by any means then that is a good thing.

    And I know for a fact that a number of people will have taken up an instrument after playing one of these games, which would not have otherwise happened. This is a good thing surely Mr White?

    Music games are good for music, and I just wish a few more musicians would pull their heads out of their butts and realise it. People fear what they don't understand or identify with, simple as that.

  • towser #50 3 years ago

    56th! \o/

  • Petulant_Radish #51 3 years ago

    I would have thought Jack White is more saying that he finds it sad that the youth of today are not actively seeking out music, and rather having it handed to them on a plate through different mediums. Though this is not that different to listening to it on the radio when you think about it.

    Oh and Jahb, just because a song is simplistic in its chord structure does not mean its shit.

  • paulf #52 3 years ago

    'dude should stop talking until he actually writes a song with more than three chords in it. '

    all the best songs have only three chords :)

  • gabsta69 #53 3 years ago

    I know, instead of us going to the cinema, lets act out our own films! instead of playing COD4, lets all go buy guns and shoot each other....no, wait.

  • autogunner #54 3 years ago

    whatever jack at least im not banging my bandmates and filming it...

  • Les #55 3 years ago

    I personally think music games suck (as games) and I love Mr. White's music but he's a bit of a hypocrite here. If he really has a problem with these games, he shouldn't license his music to them.

    edit: On closer reading, I think the guy was probably mis-/selectively quoted to create a news story. Apparently he thinks it's sad if people in the future would experience music only through games. That's something I agree with but not really that interesting as most people would likely agree with it, hence the out of context derived stories we see on sites like EG.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 20:00

  • Br0ken_Engli5h #56 3 years ago

    @ autogunner
    You're not? Well, you're missing out there, my friend. XD
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 12:56

  • kinky_mong #57 3 years ago

    @ HenryVIII: "I take it your a better drummer, to make that comment?"

    I doubt I am, but it's a fallacy to say I can't criticise her drumming because I can't do it myself. Or do you never criticise computer games because you can't programme one yourself?

  • FWB #58 3 years ago

    @JahB. So less than three chords = shit? That's all of punk thrown out of the window. Might as well chuck blues and all those 12 bars away too. I tend to be more impressed with good songs that develop out of simple progressions than complex ones, though that's not a rule either. What it does highlight is that music is not just about chords. There's rhythm, melody, dynamics, tempo, texture.... the list goes on.

  • kangarootoo #59 3 years ago

    Whether he makes good music or not is irrelevant and largely a matter of taste. I rather like a lot of his stuff, but I still think he is full of it on this particular issue. Lets not cloud the discussion with pointless stuff about whether he makes good tunes, its not the issue at hand.

  • MikeN #60 3 years ago

    I can think of worse ways than a videogame to introduce kids to music like say a Coke ad
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 13:16

  • JahB #61 3 years ago

    @FWB
    of course i didn't mean songs with less than three chords are shit - i could name 3 dozen awesome songs with 3 or less. but that's not my point. my point is that Mr. White is a mediocre guitar player/musician at best, so i don't understand why he complains about kids playing the plastic guitar when playing his own songs doesn't require more effort to play than plastic guitar playing does.

    @HenryVIII
    selling out stadiums and going on world tours says nothing about the quality of your music. if you judge music by that standard, britney spears and christina aguelera (sp?) must be amazing musicians to you.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 13:17

  • Petulant_Radish #62 3 years ago

    JahB, Jack White is an incredibly talented musician on quite a few instruments, you only have to look at his bands and side projects to realise that. Also, Rolling Stone once placed Jack White at number 17 in the greatest guitarists of all time, so why are you now better placed to judge him as a musician?

  • kangarootoo #63 3 years ago

    "I can think of worse ways than a videogame to introduce kids to music like say a Coke ad"

    Sweet jesus.


    "selling out stadiums and going on world tours says nothing about the quality of your music"

    Well what it does say is that clearly musical quality if subjective. Which is my point really when I say the quality of JW's music is irrelevant.

    If his music was better, would we then accept his word about mostly unrelated subjects? What kind of semi-religous craziness would that be? I say he is wrong on this matter, regardless of whether anyone likes his music or not.

  • kangarootoo #64 3 years ago

    "Also, Rolling Stone once placed Jack White at number 17 in the greatest guitarists of all time, so why are you now better placed to judge him as a musician?"

    We aren't! See, this is what happens when people start introducing irrelevant shit to a discussion. We are now debating whether or not JW is a good musican. Seriously, who gives a f*ck whether he is or not. If you want to talk about that, take it to YouTube or something.

    Nothing personal you understand :)

  • El-Dev #65 3 years ago

    Would people buy a GH game if they weren't into music of that particular genre? If I didn't like rock music I wouldn't buy it.

    Also music is a big part of gaming now, GTA and GT now have massive soundtracks that add a lot to the game, I'm sure there are others but they are the 2 that sprung to mind the quickest.

    On another note, anyone seen the Meg White sex tape? Horrible.

  • Petulant_Radish #66 3 years ago

    None taken Kangarootoo, it wasn’t aimed at you, it was at JahB who clearly stated that JW was a mediocre musician at best, though beside the point I was just pointing out that he was both against critical and popular opinion, and was wondering why he was in such a position to judge it? As by doing that he is doing exactly what he bemoans Jack White for doing, which was the point of this whole conversation, no?

  • rhubarbandcustard #67 3 years ago

    I am definitely the exception here but...

    the only time I now listen or show any interest in music is when I play guitar hero/ rock band.

    CD's/MP3's/MTV/Radio...what a bloody yawn fest.

  • kupocake #68 3 years ago

    The Jenson Button joke wouldn't have worked half a year ago. Curious.

  • JayeM #69 3 years ago

    The White Stripes are one of the great bands of our time.

  • Domovoi #70 3 years ago

    We're not paying you to talk about video games, music man. Now get back to strumming.

  • Paulie_P #71 3 years ago

    @McBradders

    Does music make up any of MTV's airtime anymore?

  • FWB #72 3 years ago

    Jack White isn't an amazing technical guitarist and quoting Rolling Stone means nothing - if I listened to the coke fueled music journalists I'd be listening to utter shit. But he's a great song writer and produces some lovely textures. Granted all taken from previous musicians, but hey, wasn't Picasso who said bad artists copy, great artists steal.

    I know this is all irrelevant to the article, but tough. I'm hijacking.

  • nasanu #73 3 years ago

    Standards are really falling at Eurogamer. Where is the comprehension?

    He is not ''slagging off music games' at all. His comments are more directed at the state of the music industry. Getting sick of these sensational headlines only to read quotes which are completely unrelated.

    Has Eurogamer been taken over by Fox at any point?

  • rhubarbandcustard #74 3 years ago

    Poor Nasanu - it looks like he has a stick up his ass

  • kangarootoo #75 3 years ago

    @nasanu

    Nonsense sir.

    Mr White states he is depressed that record labels are saying kids are getting their music via GH. Now why would that depress him, unless he feels GH is somehow a lower form of music consumption (lower than Cola adverts, it would seem)?


    "While White tries not to dictate "which format people should get their music in" he added, "If you have to be in a videogame to get in front of them, that's a little sad.""

    If that doesn't read like a negative view of videogames to you, I'm not sure what to say (other than some snide remark about new glasses perhaps ;) ).

  • kangarootoo #76 3 years ago

    What is up with the bold text?

  • lucky_jim #77 3 years ago

    I think people aren't closing their bold tags after they've opened them. [/b] Let's see if that fixes it.

    Yep. Remember to close your bold tags, people!
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 16:19

  • owl #78 3 years ago

    jonsaan cuts through the debate with the swiftness of a katana

  • Lukus #79 3 years ago

    Music games are the new GTA.

  • kangarootoo #80 3 years ago

    Like this [/b].

    Testing?

    Edit: Seems it fixed itself.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 16:34

  • brownium #81 3 years ago

    To compare the band experience in GH to shooting in FPS games or driving in race sims is a bit silly. I could, if I wanted to, learn the guitar, it is cheap (a 2nd hand guitar costs less than GH and periperals) and can be done in my own home.

    I will never be able to drive an F1 car, racing in general is dangerous and expensive - so a race sim is an acceptable alternative. Same applies to FPS games, I do not want to be shot at, but I enjoy the experience of stalking and shooting: I'll give COD a call.

    Music games are simply a lazy quick fix, all fine, we're gamers after all, but what makes them so uninteresting to me is the fact that the "real life" alternative is so readily accessible.

  • Feanor #82 3 years ago

    Bullshit it's readily accessible. To get good at playing a guitar requires months and years of practice for most people and is very expensive if you have to pay for lessons, which is why there's nothing wrong with these music games.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 17:07

  • kangarootoo #83 3 years ago

    @brownium

    All of that is moot really. It is humanly possible to do all of the things you listed, so who are you or I or Jack White to decide which is "acceptable" and which is not.

    Yes learning a real guitar is easier than learning to parachute jump, but so what? Are we really going to base all our videro game choices on whether we can duplicate the real life alternative? What happened to playing games purely because they are fun to play?

    Sometimes the alternative isn't even more fun (the real life alternative to COD4 almost certainly isn't). And even then whether it is fun or not is a personal thing. I play a real guitar, but I also remember what it was like when I was first learning (something perhaps you and JW have forgotten). I was nothing like a Rock God I can tell you, plunking cack handedly along to the vocal line of "18 and life" on a single string.

    I know this might seem like heresy, but for many people, Guitar Hero is simply more fun than learning to play a real guitar. There I said it, I'm out of the "gaming is fun" closet. Now you might say "yeah, it might be more fun, but its not as valid", to which I would just roll my eyes and wonder at what point you forgot the point of the whole gaming thing.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 17:12

  • zuljin #84 3 years ago

    @brownium
    "To compare the band experience in GH to shooting in FPS games or driving in race sims is a bit silly. I could, if I wanted to, learn the guitar, it is cheap (a 2nd hand guitar costs less than GH and periperals) and can be done in my own home."

    Comparing bands to FPS and racing sims is a perfectly good analogy. You are just as likely to play in a band in front of thousands of people as you are to be a world class racecar driver. Just as you can buy a guitar and play at home, you can take your car down to Germany and speed down the autobahn, or go paintballing.

  • brownium #85 3 years ago

    @ kangarootoo

    I agree, gaming should be all about the fun, but personally I get more fun from playing the real thing - and I'm with you on that first steep learning curve. To a great deal of people these games must be fun, after all, if it wasn't fun they wouldn't be buying the myriad of add-on tracks and new versions available. Just not my cup of tea.

    But I still disagree with the analogy used - OK, it was more than likely an exaggeration to prove a point - but that doesn't make it right. Even if you throw such experiences as Paintball and Go-karting into the mix, this still knocks out a large portion of our sedentary population from taking part, so there is very little way to recreate the feeling of doing these things.

    I just thought it was a cheap way to rebuke Jack Whites comments, especially as it ended the article, instead of focusing on the point he made, which is more: "Is this good for Music?" which is a very good debate to be had.

  • Stratus #86 3 years ago

    @brownium,

    A valid point in a sense but why are all the bloody sports titles so popular? If I want to play tennis, or football, or basketball all I need to do is GO OUTSIDE or join a league for fun. I personally despise sports games simply because I'm not into sports but I don't wonder why gamers that purchase EA's same frickin' game every year don't join a real team.Hell, a lot of gamers that play sports games ARE ACTUALLY ON A REAL TEAM!! Sorta shoots your theory all to shit now that I think about it.

    I consider myself very good at RB2 on Expert guitar and have been enjoying it since it came out in Canada. I have no idea how many hours I've played but it's well into the hundreds (if not more.) I really enjoy the game because I found it impossible even on Medium at first but with practice found I was always getting just a little better. Expert at first made my bowels quiver and I slagged it off as literally IMPOSSIBLE. Sort of like watching some Japanese robot-kid finish Ikaruga on Hard without dying. Now when I try playing on Medium or am forced to watch my mates attempt to play on Easy or Medium it bores me stupid.

    But I also know that if I picked up a real guitar I couldn't play Mary Had a Little Lamb and may struggle with it after weeks of practice. But I don't care. I am now a very good phony guitar player. It impresses the hell out of my friends and to a certain degree, isn't that part of the reason people learn real guitar? Well, apart from getting laid and rich and famous, but I digress...
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 17:50

  • Wyrm #87 3 years ago

    From a musical point of view, I can see his point. Finding out about a new band through seeing a gig at a bar or buying an album is a better situation to be in than seeing what is on your next setlist for Guitar Hero. However, I think the two can go along together. Jacky boy always has never been one to embrace technology though so it's to be expected.

    The man is a modern day musical legend though, so he can say what he likes :)

  • Ryze #88 3 years ago

    Sad. I'll avoid buying their albums, then. Meanwhile, I've been buying up the albums of all of my favourite tracks from the Guitar Hero games I own.

    The world is changing, and they've out of touch. So many people who just wouldn't bother with their music, are now exposed to it, and in many cases - love it.

    Their loss...

  • Skurmedel #89 3 years ago

    he's not slagging off music games though is he? he's saying it's sad that they are learning about music that way, but at least they are learning about music (in a fashion)

    People don't read though raulf, they just jump to a conclusion and blindly defend their beloved games.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/09 @ 19:23

  • SniperZoz #90 3 years ago

    I'll just stop killing zombies in video-games and take it up as my real work job .... so call me on 0-800-ZOMBIE for all your zombie slaying needs!

  • tic2000 #91 3 years ago

    "Here at Eurogamer we've realised we'll never play golf like Tiger Woods or drive cars as fast as Jenson Button either, and are throwing all our videogames in the bin. "

    You should keep some games that requires the use of intellect (if you have any - games, not intellect). Or maybe read some books. After that maybe you will realize that "the two renowned guitarists said they don't believe video games are an ideal way for people to be exposed to music or learn to play instruments" it doesn't translate to "slags off music games" and you will present the news and not create the news.

  • superdelphinus #92 3 years ago

    heh @ "seeing through his tears"

  • sharky_ob #93 3 years ago

    @ tic2000

    Good post! To be fair to the Eurogamer staff, they are writing for their target market. See this comment thread for details.

  • YourMessageHere #94 3 years ago

    @Kangarootoo
    Yes learning a real guitar is easier than learning to parachute jump, but so what? Are we really going to base all our videro game choices on whether we can duplicate the real life alternative? What happened to playing games purely because they are fun to play?

    If you actually had a realistic chance to do any of the things you've enjoyed doing in a game, wouldn't you do it? Conversely, if you don't enjoy doing things in real life, why would you find them fun in a game? I play games that allow me to simulate an experience I could never concievably have in reality (e.g. if I were an agent/soldier/spy/racing driver/pilot, or if there were mecha/spaceships/zombies/magic etc), and I don't play games that simulate an easily replicated feat (e.g. Guitar), or an experience I don't enjoy (e.g. sports), or which only provide abstract amusement (e.g. platform games); that of course is my personal preference, but since fun is wholly subjective, there's more to this than "play games because they are fun".



    @Stratus
    A valid point in a sense but why are all the bloody sports titles so popular? If I want to play tennis, or football, or basketball all I need to do is GO OUTSIDE or join a league for fun. I personally despise sports games simply because I'm not into sports but I don't wonder why gamers that purchase EA's same frickin' game every year don't join a real team.Hell, a lot of gamers that play sports games ARE ACTUALLY ON A REAL TEAM!! Sorta shoots your theory all to shit now that I think about it.

    What you're not taking into account here is that sports games are just as pie-in-the-sky as racing or shooting, in that they don't just simulate sport. They simulate skilled and professional sport - playing against recognisable opponents with recognisable playing styles and in recognisable locations, and without the bit where you accidentally smack the ball out of the court and have to go and get it or let go of the bat and send it flying or twist your ankle or fall over and graze your elbows. Hence why it's "EA Sports FIFA(insert year)" rather than "EA Sports Kicking a Ball Around Down the Park with Friends Last Saturday". I've yet to see a game that eschews pressing buttons for requiring you to run around a large outdoor area in winter in shorts, either, making them fairly good choices in the comfort stakes. Also worth noting is that not everyone can get to a real sports venue and afford equipment and keep fit. Plus, controlling a team sports game puts one person in direct control of the entire team, which won't be happening any time soon.

    By contrast, it's hard to see how playing GH etc. and learning an actual guitar could actually be more similar without the instrument actually being used to make sounds.

  • m0thr4 #95 3 years ago

    I'm kind of in agreement that when I see really good Guitar Hero players I do wonder if perhaps their time might not have been better spent learning the real thing. But for losers like me who haven't got the time or desire to do so, it's a great substitute. He should take his head out of his arse and realise there are a lot of people who just want to have a little fun.

    I sort of agree, but those really good GH players are only actually good at pressing/flicking a small number of plastic coloured buttons in correspondence with what they see on a TV screen.

    On a real guitar, of course, you need to be able to press thin metal strings to a fretboard while plucking them with your fingers in any of several thousand (or million?) possible combinations. Then there's hammer-ons, pull-offs, bends, slides, whammy bars, scales, arpeggios, chords, harmonics and so on to master until you can start calling yourself a real Guitar Hero.

    Btw, I am a genuine Guitar Hero, but I'm absolutely shit at the video game. I wonder if that's what all these whiny musos are really complaining about?

  • m0thr4 #96 3 years ago

    @kangarootoo
    Yes learning a real guitar is easier than learning to parachute jump, but so what?

    Umm... no. You see I was in agreement with everything you said up until that point.

    Learning to parachute jump is actually piss easy. 8 hours' training with an instructor and you're ready to go on your own.

    Learning the guitar, as you probably know, takes months of frustration before you even start to sound acceptable.
    Edited by 1 at 30/06/09 @ 16:36