Bethesda knew Skyrim could run into "a bad memory situation" on PS3

By Robert Purchese Published 16 February, 2012

UPDATE: Bethesda clarifies Howard's comments. Team "coded solutions they felt would work".

UPDATE: Bethesda has contacted Eurogamer to clarify Todd Howard's comments on the performance of the PlayStation 3 version of Skyrim.

Bethesda's statement is below:

"The team knew the PlayStation 3 version could [Bethesda's emphasis] run into a 'bad memory situation' and they coded solutions that they felt would work - and in their tests the solutions did work. Post release a 'small percentage' of users were still experiencing issues where it couldn't keep up, and the team went to work hard on solving it."

ORIGINAL STORY: Bethesda knew before Skyrim launched that there would be gamers on PlayStation 3 that would face a "bad memory situation", director Todd Howard has revealed.

But he believed only "a small percentage" would be affected, he told Kotaku. (A small percentage of 10 million shipped copies of a game is still rather a lot - a victim of your own success, you could say.)

Howard recalled how it was "obvious" when testing that Skyrim got in "situations where it taxes the PS3".

"We did a ton more testing this time around," Howard said, "so the game is definitely our most solid release regardless of platform.

save

"Here's my saved game!"

"The way our dynamic stuff and our scripting works, it's obvious it gets in situations where it taxes the PS3. And we felt we had a lot of it under control. But for certain users it literally depends on how they play the game, varied over a hundred hours and literally what spells they use, did they go in this building?"

The "common misconception", Howard revealed, was that PS3 frame-rate problems were caused by large game-save files. "No it's not," Howard said. "It's literally the things you've done in what order and what's running."

Howard thought Skyrim patch 1.2, the one that broke resistances and made dragons fly backwards, "took care of a lot of it". And he was stumped when this wasn't the case.

So Bethesda asked users for their saved games and set about putting together Skyrim patch 1.4, which Howard hopes has solved the problem. However, having been in this position before, he's hedging his bets.

"Now that we've been through this we're not naïve enough to say 'we have seen everything', because we have to assume we haven't," he verbally shrugged. "There are still going to be some people who have to come back to us and say, 'OK, my situation is this.'

"'OK, send us your saved game.' We literally need to look at what you have running. We tried doing it through e-mail. We need to open the saved game and look at it.

"We've got one guy who has seven dragons on the other side of the world, and a siege about to happen in this city and another 20 quests running. And, OK, this is what the game is trying to do and it's having a hard time running that."

Analysing the latest patch's performance.

Picture of Robert.

About Robert Purchese

Bertie is Eurogamer's Senior Staff Writer. When he's not hunting down news stories he's often found playing with his kids or gabbling about fantasy games and strange online worlds. @Clert on Twitter.

Read more articles from Robert by visiting the Robert Purchese archive page.

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Comments (109) Latest comment 3 months ago

Comments for this article are now closed, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Benno #1 3 months ago

  • Vanmunt #2 3 months ago

    Thanks, now can I have my money back..

    Seriously, just get Amalur.. it pisses all over this boring bug fest.

  • patch #3 3 months ago

    You shouldn't have made your game so damn addictive! If I'd given up after 80 hours I wouldn't have noticed.

  • coolbritannia #4 3 months ago

    Explosive stuff really. Knowingly shipping a faulty product.

    Good job they don't make planes.

  • Sodding_Gamer #5 3 months ago

    Not quite sure what to think of this... They clearly did as much as they can and obviously ran out of time. But knowing there was going to be a problem with a small percentage is pretty bad. And they knew they would sell millions.

  • Subquest #6 3 months ago

    Explosive stuff really

    You'll run out of adjectives if this is your benchmark for explosive..

  • TheNonk #7 3 months ago

    This customer also knew there was a "bad memory situation" which is why he only bought the game on the day latest patch released.

    Don't treat me like a punk, punk.

  • BigDannyH #8 3 months ago

    @coolbritannia
    Reminds me of Ed Norton's job in Fight Club. As long as the percentages are low enough not to warrant a recall ...

  • repeater #9 3 months ago



    (Courtesy of the neoGAF 2012 videogame anagram photoshop thread.)

  • gooner77 #10 3 months ago

    my gut instinct to get the 360 version proved correct. still after 127 hours I got my money's worth. but I think some free dlc might be in order as even patch 1.4 still hasn't fixed all the issues. still can't buy the house in wind helm despite doing all the related missions

  • BJ_Crackers #11 3 months ago

    Literally

  • guernican #12 3 months ago

    @coolbritannia

    Or condoms.

  • PixelPirate #13 3 months ago

    Why would we ever buy anything from them again?

    Of course they knew it was broken. They knew Fallout and Fallout NV were broke too, at least they FINALLY admitted it.

    But still, not buying their games again.

  • abigsmurf #14 3 months ago

    This doesn't inspire confidence about their bug fixing process.

    "this is a pretty major structural issue that results in significant reproducible performance issues..."
    "pfft, so few people will probably experience it, lets just leave it"

  • JoeGBallad #15 3 months ago

    The maths doesn't add up here. Despite a number of different SKUs, every ps3 is basically the same. The whole point of consoles is that they're a standard box that works for everyone. If they knew memory was going to be an issue, then it stands to reason that it'd be a potential issue for EVERY ps3, not just a small percentage.

  • Cjail #16 3 months ago

    This just confirms all my suspects: shame on you Bethesda!
    Edited by Cjail at 16/02/12 @ 09:25

  • Djimm #17 3 months ago

    Refund or GTFO. Neg away.

  • bad09 #18 3 months ago

    It's pretty poor they shipped knowing but sadly they are not the first and they won't be the last. The moral is do not buy at launch folks...or let others buy for you, on PC I got both Batman and Skyrim for free and the technical issues didn't seem so bad when it wasn't my own money :)

  • d80s0q #19 3 months ago

    I remember when we had KOTOR and for ~10 % of gamers that chose a route they couldn't kill the final boss without cheating. It was impossible. Why do games get let out like this, especially if you KNOW THE ISSUE IS PRESENT like Bethesda? It's insulting to the consumer who only sees a poor execution thanks to poor QA, or in this case management decisions.

  • uknortherner2000 #20 3 months ago

    I don't know about the PS3 version, but I have noticed that my PC version now stutters (and lags) a lot after transitioning from an interior cell (i.e. a cave) to an exterior one. At the moment it requires me to alt-tab out of the game and back in again to fix it, but I shouldn't have to do this.

  • Sodding_Gamer #21 3 months ago

    @JoeGBallad

    You didn't read the article did you? Howard say's it's NOT to do with the SKU's but what people do in the game and in what certain order. They can't predict what people are going to do but it was only a small number that had this problem. It is still bad and totally think they should give the ps3 users something free out of this but I think you got your facts mixed up a little.

  • colinjohnthomson #22 3 months ago

    never buying another game from them i wonder if they all wear masks when making the games robbing bastards
    im not sure if this is selling faulty goods now they have admitted responibility
    http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/sale-of-goods/understanding-the-sale-of-goods-act/your-rights/

  • des #23 3 months ago

    "Howard recalled how it was "obvious" when testing that Skyrim got in "situations where it taxes the PS3"."

    Lies,PS3 is a supercomputer.

  • ZizouFC #24 3 months ago

    I just want to know if it's possible on Vita!

  • coomber #25 3 months ago

    I'm surprised by the relatively calm responses this has received. The fact that the second biggest game of the year was released with a problem like this - and the publishers didn't give a flying one - is astonishing. Very pleased I got my money back.

  • The-Jack-Burton #26 3 months ago

    That's Bethesda for you. Ship it, make a couple hundred million, then say, "yeah, sucks for you".

    And to think, people were just going to run around a play the game all willy-nilly.

    When they did their cost / benefit analysis, I wonder what the numbers said. Was it something like 'Do not fix engine unless more than 500,000 units are estimated to be unplayable'?

    None of this matters, the press will keep stroking these guys, and people will keep buying the games, and Todd Howard will keep looking at you like your a fucking idiot.

  • richardiox #27 3 months ago

    They should have just not released it on PS3 at the same time as the much more acceptable PC and 360 builds. It's now obvious the PS3 version needed a whole lot of extra work.

  • JoeGBallad #28 3 months ago

    @Sodding_Gamer Sorry I should been clearer. I did read the article. What I'm saying is that it's not an SKU issue either because all ps3 owners have essentially the same console. Just because issues only presented themselves to some players doesn't disqualify all ps3 copies from having issues.

    As an illustration, imagine the bus from Speed: it has a bomb on it that activates if the driver exceeds 50mph. Now, imagine there were three buses in the film, but only one bus exceeded 50mph. Yes, it's true that the only variable is the actions of the driver (the player)

    But the other two buses still have bombs on them. Just because the bombs haven't been activated by the driver, doesn't mean the issues aren't there.

    Basically, it all boils down to bullshit on bethesda's part, even now. ALL ps3 copies of Skyrim have issues. They shouldn't be blaming the player for activating the bomb if they put it there in the first place.

    For my next trick, I'll be explaining how Zelda Skyward Sword's 'centring' issue is the players fault by making reference to another Keanu Reeves movie: Point Break.

  • CORIANA_SIX #29 3 months ago

    Boo-thesda!!

  • hiddenranbir #30 3 months ago

    Really, a small percentage? When every PS3 player has basically the same limited PS3 console? :\

  • Makeem95 #31 3 months ago

    The moral of this story is never buy Bethesda games at launch and always wait at least 3 months for it to be patched & reduced in price.

  • Sodding_Gamer #32 3 months ago

    @JoeGBallad

    Ok fair point I get what your saying. Which is what I meant by the last part of my comment, the fact it is bad that it is like that anyway. Shouldn't have released it being like it was back then. You may make a reference to Point Break but please don't take the piss out of my favourite movie of all time XD hahaha

  • darkcult #33 3 months ago

    Well that's what you get for buying ps3.

  • Shakey_Jake33 #34 3 months ago

    In all seriousness, if the cause is as he says, is there a reason that this affects the PS3 version specifically rather than the 360?

  • richardiox #35 3 months ago

    In the interest of balance and regarding Skyrim bashing, the Rimlag issue relates to only the PS3 version. 360 and PC users didn't have this problem. The game itself wasn't broken but the PS3 version was. The balance that being millions of users weren't affected by the problem (although quest bugs were in all formats).

  • Jay1983 #36 3 months ago

    Which is why, even before release i said id wait for the GOTY version that will have most of the glitches fixed (hopefully)

  • JoeGBallad #37 3 months ago

    @Sodding_Gamer Haha don't worry I bloody love Point Break!

  • Ramboness #38 3 months ago

    And this is why gentlemen, that you play on PC. :champ:

  • DrStrangelove #39 3 months ago

    Uhm, I don't think they're the only ones knowingly selling defunct products. They're just admitting it now.

    But I must say, that slowdown in the video really is devastating. I would have been really pissed too if I had bought that. Fortunately, I bought the PC version.

  • PixelPirate #40 3 months ago

    EG/Rob can we get an official re-review of Bethesda's games with this issue?

    OR at least an assurance (based on their track record) that from now on, sepearte versions will be tested and scored appropriately?

    The only way gamers will get a fair deal is if their metascore goes down.

    sad but true.

  • bad09 #41 3 months ago

    @Ramboness

    Well it did need a couple of patches to run smoothly on PC to so it wasn't all roses in the land of the elite either.

  • BigHal #42 3 months ago

    @JoeGBallad They were referring to the people 'played' the game. They were hoping people just got and done the quests and not gone round exploring the game world too much and building a mountains of items etc.
    This to me is what makes it inexcusable. They built and a sold a game on the premise of an open world to be explored but if actually did too much of that (on PS3) the game broke, not a bug as that is understandable but it simply became unplayable. No excuse - I still haven't actually read of any apology but instead we get mails to be patient.

    To Beth, up yours.

  • CaptainKid #43 3 months ago

    And this is why you should play Bethesda games on PC.
    If something goes wrong most of the time you can use a console command (cheat) to fix things. Or get a mod.

  • uknortherner2000 #44 3 months ago

    @bad09 True, but due to the open nature of Skyrim on PC, it wasn't long before the modders got to work on some of the problems.

  • TheEarlOfZinger #45 3 months ago

    Not even a single apology.

  • mkreku #46 3 months ago

    Skyrim on the Vita.. what an idea. I wonder if it would be technically possible? Intriguing thought at least.

  • Kaminari #47 3 months ago

    @richardiox

    The thing is, the bug is present in every version of the game as it's part of the flawed script engine, and can potentially kick in on any platform.

    It's a good thing somehow that one of them was ostensibly more affected than the others, or Bethesda would have denied the problem existed at all.

  • des #48 3 months ago

    "never buying another game from them"

    Might as well stop buying games from Sony.This game,just like any other,had to pass some pretty expensive Sony QA.

  • cloudskipa #49 3 months ago

    Even with the latest patch the performance is sub-par with stripped back visuals. PS3 just doesn't seem to have the power to handle these complex/vast open world games too well which is a shame.

  • Goonboy #50 3 months ago

    @mkreku they cant even get that shit running on a PS3, never mind Vita.

  • Lemming81 #51 3 months ago

    He's saying a small percentage of people will have tons and tons of content 'on the brink' and taking up memory instead of completing the quests - that's what I'm reading. Nothing to do with SKUs.

    In short, don't just skip across the entire continent hoovering up quests. Start in one town, complete everything local then move on. That's how I've been playing it anyway.
    Edited by Lemming81 at 16/02/12 @ 12:08

  • cianchristopher #52 3 months ago

    It almost sounds like they never expected anyone to play it for more than a dozen-or-two hours if that's the case. Given that their whole selling point is the length of their adventures, it's utterly self-defeating.

  • Snufkin #53 3 months ago

    Feel a bit bad for them, they were obv pressured to push out an unfinished product and hedged their bets, weighed the risks etc. They got it wrong.
    I'm about 90-odd hours in and still a LONG way from finishing, stuck in a cave with a bunch of bad-ass Silverhands nailing me over and over and over and thinking maybe it's time to move on.... sigh...

  • GamesConnoisseur #54 3 months ago

    @Shakey_Jake33
    PS3 got 256 mb for general use, 256 mb for graphics only plus in the general usr ram they also need to set aside a chunk of it for PS3's operating system.

    X360 got one 512mb shared ram and a lower O/S footprint.

  • KingFunkIII #55 3 months ago

    @bad09 Worked fine for me. In fact, I was shocked. "How can it look AND run better than Oblivion on the same rig?!" thought I. At least no one can claim that PC gamers lost out to consolification...

    I used to care about people's experience on other platforms, but then I took an arrow of indifference to the brain...

  • lucky_jim #56 3 months ago

    I bought this for the PS3 instead of the 360 for a range of reasons which were in hindsight a bit daft (I thought it'd work for one, plus I was offline for several months at the time and didn't want to get stuck with the texture issue). I paid £50 for it here in Prague.

    Yesterday I got turned away by a second-hand games shop when I tried to raise some cash to put towards a copy of the 360 version. The owner said there was no way he could sell it, because it's Skyrim. This in a country where the 360 is little more than a footnote (it's all Playstation out here).

    So, my £50 game is literally worthless. Fuck you, Todd Howard. The only thing that can save your reputation now is to offer all PS3 players a full refund or a straight swap for another version.

  • IXSpAcEMoNkEyXI #57 3 months ago

    Well at least Bethesda have been dedicated to resolving the issue. Releasing the PS3 version in that state wasn't probably their choice anyway. Finally I have started my new game with peace of mind. Give it a year and I'm sure we will all gather round the eurogamer fire and reminisce about days of lag, Fus-ro-dah's and the odd arrow in knee joke ;)

  • Zerobob #58 3 months ago

    Haven't Bethesda broken the law then, selling a product not fit for purpose?

  • Azilis #59 3 months ago

    Lol, if I had to picture what "a bad memory situation" looked like, I don't think I could have done any better than that still from Memento at the top of the article.

    I'm just not sure how a game like Skyrim can be effectively QA'ed other than to do what PC developers have been doing for ages. That is, release it and patch it once you have enough feedback to be able to solve the problems.

    I don't want to just write this off because it really does seem inexcusable to release a product that doesn't work for a lot of people, but Bethesda has always had trouble with the PS3. Being primarily a PC gamer myself (I also have a PS3 but no 360), I just can't get too worked up about a game not working well at release.

  • Darren #60 3 months ago

    I still maintain that Bethesda released the game with known bugs on all formats just to meet that long-announced 11/11/11 release date. On reflection, they really should have delayed it a few months for further quality control as it is only now in February 2012, after months of beta testing by us gamers, that the game is now stable and more bug-free across all formats. An outstanding game but one that could and should have been better at release had they done the beta-testing and not us. ;)

  • FortysixterUK #61 3 months ago

    I had no idea the issues were this bad for P3. I played through on Xbox first time around, completed with a 91 hour save, only experienced 3 crashes ( lockups when zoning) in the whole 91 hours.
    My next play through will be on PC, but I'm leaving it a while longer yet, as there have been several patches it would seem, and I want the best experience on PC when I play it.

  • KingFunkIII #62 3 months ago

    @Azilis I guess the other option would be to do a public beta per platform. But with a game of this high profile and size, that would be one tricky operation...

    And I can't resist: You see those PS3 users? They've got righteous anger. Righteous. Anger.

  • Darren #63 3 months ago

    @Vanmunt - Your opinion but while Amalur may be more stable and less buggy, it is also a more dated, blander, more generic and soulless experience than Skyrim in mine. It excels in its combat and character levelling and little else IMO.

  • Cappy #64 3 months ago

    @lucky_jim

    Perhaps you could put it on eBay next time you have an opportunity. You should still get £20-30.

    That's not bad for a three month old game.

  • coolbritannia #65 3 months ago

    @Subquest You mock me, but I expect a class action lawsuit will be filed against Bethesda based on the confessions of knowingly shipping a broken product in this interview.

  • betrayerofhope #66 3 months ago

    In any other industry, there would be lawsuits and repercussions.
    In the gaming industry, it gets you game of the year.

    what a fucked up system

  • space_ace #67 3 months ago

    only "a small percentage" would be affected

    Famous last words?

  • lucky_jim #68 3 months ago

    @Cappy

    Thanks for the advice, but my problem's compounded by the fact I don't live in the UK anymore. I wouldn't get nearly that price trying to sell it to a Czech, and the hassle of posting it from here (plus my lack of faith in the Czech postal service- had too many parcels from home not turn up) means that isn't an option.

    I'm literally stuck with a £50 coaster. Oh, and a nice map.

  • Toothball #69 3 months ago

    The "small percentage" tends to be the most vocal when it comes to the internet. It might not have affected all players, but now everyone knows about it. Not really doing Bethesda's reputation much good.

  • Saint_of_Killers #70 3 months ago

    Yeah, this is why you play the game on a PC (you know, if you have one that can do it justice) or, just wait a few months for it to be patched and buy it for your console of choice then.

  • UkHardcore23 #71 3 months ago

    @coolbritannia

    Well they were working on a conosle with shared memoery, Surly you cant expect the PS3 version to run like PC or 360?

  • Stevonymo #72 3 months ago

    So you shipped a known faulty product. Thank F you don't make pace makers!

  • Weezer #73 3 months ago

    @coolbritannia I said this in the comments about a month ago. Can't believe one hasn't already started gathering momentum - especially in the US where litigation is taught in pre-school.

  • DrStrangelove #74 3 months ago

    @mkreku
    Skyrim on the Vita.. what an idea. I wonder if it would be technically possible? Intriguing thought at least.
    Why not? If the PS3 can handle... oh, erm.

  • 32768Colours #75 3 months ago

    I just don't see why the freedom of a game can be touted as a plus point when that very same freedom is capable of causing anything from permanently broken quests to crippling framerates.

    Seriously, when the game first came out I was quite happy to defend Bethesda given the scale of the game they've created. In the intervening months, I've changed my mind entirely. Games should not be shipped in such a poor condition. To do it mistakenly is bad enough, to do it knowingly is just offensive.

    It actually manages to put paid to the mocking suggestion that we're all effectively beta testers. Now we know that's not the case and in fact its worse than that; they found the fault but actually thought the product was still good enough to release.

    Comparisons of pretty graphics and sound be buggered; if they can't get the fundamentals right (quest reliability, performance etc) on a particular piece of hardware, then they simply shouldn't have released it until they did.

  • Cobalt_Jackal #76 3 months ago

    @coolbritannia

    Or vitally important medical equipment/instruments.
    Edited by Cobalt_Jackal at 16/02/12 @ 13:10

  • sfp_noodle #77 3 months ago

    Bought this game on the 360 after reading about all the problems on PS3. I've still yet to read any article where Bethesda have actually had the decency to apologise to their customers. They really do need to offer some kind of good will gesture such as offering the first DLC for free. The fact that 360 owners get DLC first is just another kick in the teeth.

    Even though I enjoyed a more playable version I'm never buying a Bethesda game brand new after this. They don't deserve our money. When publishers are this fucking ignorant, buying games pre-owned is the only way of protesting. Hit them in the pocket and they'll learn, otherwise they'll stick two fingers in their ears and up at their customers too.

  • TheEarlOfZinger #78 3 months ago

    @Lemming81

    Just lol at the idea of blaming the player for playing the game wrong.

    "Start in one town, complete everything local then move on"

    Well no, actually - people shouldn't be forced to play the game in such a linear way.

  • Darren #79 3 months ago

    Skyrim on the Vita would be awesome and possibly do-able considering the lower resolution and extra 128 MB of memory. In fact, I'd be happy to play Kingdom of Amalur on my Vita as it is perfectly suited to a handheld, more so than my PC to be honest, and would be a terrific way to while away an otherwise dull lunch hour at work.

  • coolbritannia #80 3 months ago

    @UkHardcore23 If they can't release a game that works on the PS3, they shouldn't have released on PS3. Delay the launch on that system, give the gamers something that works.

  • Golgo #81 3 months ago

    @Benno: I can't stop laughing at that ridiculous fucking animal! Seriously creased up here! What is it, and where'd you find it? I want one!

  • KingFunkIII #82 3 months ago

    I'm not surprised I got negged for my "Righteous. Anger." quip, but let me just point out that a quick Google of "righteous definition" gives us:

    1.(of a person or conduct) Morally right or justifiable; virtuous.
    2. Perfectly wonderful; fine and genuine.

    So although I was cracking a joke, I was also empathising. I'm sure I'd be crying if it was me, but it's not so hey ho...

  • UKPartisan #83 3 months ago

    The best thing to do with Skyrim is to accept a quest then complete it, resisting the urge to accept more along the way. It can be difficult, but if the game is trying to keep track of loads of quests at once, it's then that you start to notice the significant lag increases. This dynamic is something that should of been picked up on in testing, as I've managed to replicate the issue more-or-less on all three versions. It's peculiar as to why it's so pronounced in the PS3 version, though it's clearly an issue with the PS3's memory architecture. Still there's no excuse for releasing a game that is as fundamentally buggy as Skyrim.

    I pity the poor buggers who bought the PS3 version and dont have easy access to the internet. Bethesda should go about ensuring that future standard copies are pre-patched before leaving the factories.

    All the Elder Scrolls games have been buggy upon release, (Daggerfall was a bloody nightmare) but this time round I think the damage may just be too much.

  • billythekid #84 3 months ago

    Why the picture of Peter Crouch?

  • Subdominator #85 3 months ago

    @des A supercomputer with only 256 MB RAM. Well, make that 213, the rest is reserved for the OS.

  • dagas #86 3 months ago

    Just buy more RAM for your PS3. You can get 8GB for a song, that 256MB isn't nearly enough. Oh that's right, you can't...

  • Wot_the_Melon #87 3 months ago

    "We did a ton more testing this time around," Howard said, "so the game is definitely our most solid release regardless of platform.
    A) ...but if you only test it but not fix it... how does that make the game more solid?
    B) LOL. If that's true, that's rather sad though... I wouldn't know as I haven't played many Bethesda titles.

  • kangarootoo #88 3 months ago

    @JoeGBallad

    "then it stands to reason that it'd be a potential issue for EVERY ps3, not just a small percentage."

    I'm not sure that is what they said.

    They were talking about how many people would see the bug, not how many had the potential to see the bug.

    Not defending the decision - just being a pedant for the words.

  • kangarootoo #89 3 months ago

    @coolbritannia

    Or explosives.

  • evarofzentral #90 3 months ago

    There may have been some problems but iw was still far better value for money than the vast majority of games. Bethesda haters can die.

  • FenderMaster #91 3 months ago

    I bought this game a couple of weeks after launch knowing full well that the game had some serious issues. I bought it because I wanted to see what all the fuss was about and explore the beautiful world.

    There have been some horrendously laggy bits, most notably when a dragon shows up in a town, or when you're using destruction magic and theres a few enemies around, and that is inexcusable, but still it hasn't had a huge impact of my enjoyment of the game.

    My bigger issue is that I keep following quests to underground Dwemer ruins and getting KO'd in 3 hits from some random Dwemer Orb, Draugrs or Falmar. I'm Level 22 and 40+ hours in, when the **** am I supposed to do these quests? I always doggedly follow through with them by exploiting enemy A.I. and slow tedious stealth (shoot an arrow at their back, then run and hide until they calm down), but I can't say it's fun experience. When you have to abandon hours of slow progress in a dungeon and turn back because you just have no way past the next enemy, it really makes you appreciate linear and scripted gamees!
    Edited by FenderMaster at 16/02/12 @ 15:32

  • ronuds #92 3 months ago

    Not that they should be excused, but they're hardly the first to ship a known faulty product. I'm fairly certain every game released today is released with known bugs. Small credit for actually admitting to it.

    Now, what do you think would have been worse for Beth: Release the game for the PS3 with known bugs? Or, delay the PS3 version and make every PS3 owner have to wait, probably resulting in a lot of lost sales for both Bethesda AND Sony?

    I'm thinking option 2 would have turned out much worse for them and Sony. Sony's making money off their sales too, ya know. They got to keep sales, but maybe lost a little integrity, which probably won't matter very much to anyone when the next ES is released.

    Remember when everyone ranted and raved they wouldn't buy another ES after MW and then after Ob? Sales for the series continue to rise exponentially, so someone isn't sticking to their guns!

  • globalisateur #93 3 months ago

    5 years later, the PS3 hardwire architecture is still a major problem for developers it seems.

    They visibly acknowledged the fact that their own technology ( complex cpu/gpu from sony with chronic memory limitation) is not suited anymore cause the vita is completely different that the PS3 (twice main memory, and CPU and GPU are from subcontractors)
    Edited by globalisateur at 16/02/12 @ 15:03

  • General-Apathy #94 3 months ago

    Oh, for fuck’s sake!

    IF cost of delaying the PS3 release is MORE than the (estimated) cost caused by the bug then you RELEASE THE GAME ANYWAY. Any company would do the same. Any. Other. Company.

    Sales and profit are all that matter in this and all other industries. The ‘vocal minority’ needs to grow the fuck and wait for a patch, instead of clogging up comments sections with their faux-outrage and bogus ‘I got my refund’ stories. ‘Refund’ my hairy arse, who are you kidding – Skyrim’s probably still spinning in your PS3.

    Jeez.

  • mcmothercruncher #95 3 months ago

    How the hell do you "verbally shrug"?

  • FuzzyDuck #96 3 months ago

    Anyone got an email for them so i can personally tell them i won't buy another Bethesda game ever again?

  • djkav #97 3 months ago

    LOL its not the game that's broke. It works because you can still play it. Its the stupid PS3 you all bought that's the root of the problem. The game is too much for the PS3 to handle. This just shows what design flaws are hidden deep within the PS3.

  • knocker #98 3 months ago

    Edge cases are a bitch.

    Tester : hey guys, can you build me a save game with seven dragons on the other side of the world and a siege about to happen with 20 quests running ?
    Dev lead: when would that ever happen ?
    Tester: doesn't matter whether it would happen, it can happen
    Dev lead: ok
    Tester: oh, that really f'ks up on the ps3 (a more formal bug report may be appropriate)

    Not saying this stuff is that easy, but it is achievable. Stating you've done "more testing" is meaningless. If you have people doing exploratory gameplay testing you might end up testing the opening scenes thousands of times but not all the permutations.

    Permutations are a bitch too.

    (disclaimer : I've never worked on anything as complex as skyrim, nor with such minimal impact if things go wrong. But the rules don't change cos of that)

  • neilnimmo #99 3 months ago

    @Subquest Maybe he's making a clever Ford Pinto reference? After all, that was another product that was knowingly shipped when faulty.

  • neilnimmo #100 3 months ago

    @JoeGBallad The problem comes with the order people do things in the game, not the hardware itself. With a game as open-ended and as large in scale os Skyrim, bugs are impossible to avoid. Countless variables interacting in countless ways, something has to give.

  • knocker #101 3 months ago

    @djkav if that were true then a software patch would have made no difference.

  • JoeGuy #102 3 months ago

    In fairness Microsoft shipped a whole new console 'xbox360' with known faults and hoped people wouldn't run the systems too much so the majority wouldn't break. It was a business decision from faceless suits looking at the cost of fixing it before it shipped, not the development team.

  • juliankennedy23 #103 3 months ago

    In all fairness PS3 owners are a small percentage.

  • juliankennedy23 #104 3 months ago

    Simply put they should have delayed the PS3 version but of course hindsight is 20/20 and lord knows the screaming and claims of Microsoft payments (Above and beyond the payments for DLC exclusivity) would have been deafening. Damned if the did damned cause they didn't.


    I can't forget that plenty of games launched with deadly gamebreaking bugs (I am looking your way Dragon Age 2) that received much less negative press.

  • Rodster #105 3 months ago

    They should've waited until..." The next generation doesn't start until we say it does," said Hirai.

  • funkateer #106 3 months ago

    "Its the stupid PS3 you all bought that's the root of the problem. The game is too much for the PS3 to handle. This just shows what design flaws are hidden deep within the PS3."

    Wow, Sony should hire you because they obviously need your deep insight.

  • tomkuryakin #107 3 months ago

    Great. Now fix Fallout 3 and Fallout NV please. I've got Fallout 3 GOTY on PS3 and I'd like to try playing the DLC with a frame rate in double figures please.

  • man.the.king #108 3 months ago

    @sfp_noodle

    Even though I enjoyed a more playable version I'm never buying a Bethesda game brand new after this.

    Seconded.

    Till now, I have ALWAYS bought current-gen games new.

    Going forward, I'll bend this unwritten rule of mine for just one Dev/Publisher - Bethesda.
    Edited by man.the.king at 16/02/12 @ 21:14

  • man.the.king #109 3 months ago

    @evarofzentral

    Bethesda haters can die

    Allow me to be as pettily spiteful as you are and respond: "No! You can DIE!!!"