Kojima misses PS3 rumble

By Tom Bramwell Published 27 November, 2006

Hopes it'll come back.

Hideo Kojima, currently developing Metal Gear Solid 4 on PlayStation 3, says he's missing the rumble functionality.

"The controls in MGS3 got a little complex, so you'll have a little more direct control in MGS4," he told Official PlayStation Magazine in a preview feature. "That said, I miss the rumble and even now I hope it will come back."

Bad luck for Kojima though - with Sony's Phil Harrison saying as recently as last month that he has no regrets about the loss of rumble and thinks the "six axis of input puts the player in control in a much richer, deeper way".

As to whether the motion sensor is a worthy replacement in Kojima's view, MGS' mastermind doesn't seem to be sure yet. "We can't say how we'll use the motion-sensing functionality specifically but we'll use it for sure," he told OPM.

Kojima also offered a bit more detail on how the futuristic warfare of MGS4: Guns of the Patriots will play out, reportedly explaining how players will be able to align themselves with a particular nation, influencing the way they're perceived by enemies and those creepy hopping robots out of the trailers.

After the game's recent trailer displays though, particularly at the Tokyo Game Show, what we really want to know is who the young Snake was at the end? Alas, apparently we're no closer to finding out, but Kojima does admit that he included the scene to mess with us.

You can read more about MGS4 in our Tokyo Game Show preview. The full game is due out late next year.

Picture of Tom.

About Tom Bramwell

Tom is Operations director of Eurogamer Network and Editor-at-Large of Eurogamer.net. He joined the company in February 2000. Follow him on Twitter.

Read more articles from Tom by visiting the Tom Bramwell archive page.

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Comments (54) Latest comment 6 years ago

Comments for this article are now closed, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • space_ace #1 6 years ago

    kojima rumbles the industry

  • Tonka #2 6 years ago

    He did use it in a cool way back in MGS

  • AcidSnake #3 6 years ago

    You mean the arm massage Codec message?

  • Rambaldi #4 6 years ago

    Who needs rumble when second rate motion sensing will do!

  • Balסּr #5 6 years ago

    Kojima needs rumble = Hop
    Kojima needs a decent online infastructure = Skip
    Konami needs more money to cover massive dev costs based on poor performing PS3 sales = Jump in!

    ;)

  • TripSkyway #6 6 years ago

    I have missed the rumble a little, but the tilt sensor is excellent fun in Motorstorm as a wheel.

  • dadrester #7 6 years ago

    (imho) young snake is a blatant red herring... it's a cammo effect like the raiden mask in mgs3. if you watch the trailer he's wearing a cammo mask, and doesn't take it off, before the camera pans up to him.

  • AcidSnake #8 6 years ago

    I don't remember seeing a young snake...which trailer is this?
    Anyone have a download link?

  • Laserbream #9 6 years ago

    What does Kojima abuse? Robots that poo and moo and stomp on people - it's too fucked up not to be drugs right? I wish he'd hook me up with his dealer.

  • Skooch #10 6 years ago

    I've heard that due to the lack of weights in the PS3 controller (for the rumble mechanism) that the controller feels extremely light weight, cheap and rather weedy. Can anyone who has used a PS3 controller confirm either way? I'd be interested in any opinion having not used one myself.

  • dadrester #11 6 years ago

    posterity

  • dadrester #12 6 years ago

    as a fan of the dual shock i like the sixaxis... it does feel light, but not really cheap. kind of like the wavebird compared to the regular gamecube controller, but better build quality.

  • AcidSnake #13 6 years ago

    @dadrester:
    Thanks a bunch, hadn't seen this one yet...
    No audio at work though...

    Although I must say it doesn't seem impossible to make on a 360...
    Here's hoping...

  • kangarootoo #14 6 years ago

    @Skooch

    It does feel quite light when you are used to a PS2 controller, but after a while you just stop noticing. I wouldn't say it feels weedy, in fact I would suggest your "cheap and rather weedy" quote is not wholly objective ;)

    When I first got a mobile phone that was really dinky and light, it sort of felt a bit toy like compared to my previous one, but after a couple of days it was just... my phone, and I stopped thinking about it.

  • dadrester #15 6 years ago

    that'd be a massive blow for sony, losing exclusivity... MGS4 is a system seller, as was GTA.

  • Skooch #16 6 years ago

    @Kangarootoo - Not my words, but those of an Xbox fan friend of mine, so you can definitely say they aren't objective ;)

  • kangarootoo #17 6 years ago

    "that'd be a massive blow for sony, losing exclusivity... MGS4 is a system seller, as was GTA."

    Chances of MGS going crossplatform because of lack of rumble = 0%.

    These decisions are ones of business, not game design.

  • BartonFink #18 6 years ago

    A bit of a slap in the chops for Sony from Kojima there.

  • Yossarian #19 6 years ago

    it's okay, he'll be able to put it back in when MGS4 is ported to the 360

  • ecureuil #20 6 years ago

    it's okay, he'll be able to put it back in when MGS4 is ported to the 360

    While removing the motion sensing elements of the game. 8)

    I wish Sony would just admit defeat, and pay Immersion for the bloody rumble.

  • Tiger_Walts #21 6 years ago

    Phil Harrison saying as recently as last month that he has no regrets about the loss of rumble and thinks the "six axis of input puts the player in control in a much richer, deeper way".

    Should read...

    "six axis of input puts the player in control in a much cheaper, legal way".

  • richardiox #22 6 years ago

    Count on one hand the number of games"enhanced" by rumble?

    Surely every game that has even used rumble is "enhanced" by the functionality as opposed to not having it. Or, to be more precise, at least every console FPS and Racer has been enhanced byrumble. Yes, it's not make or break a game territory but I'd rather have a game enhanced by rumble than one not using it at all.

  • dadrester #23 6 years ago

    Chances of MGS going crossplatform because of lack of rumble = 0%.

    These decisions are ones of business, not game design.

    of course. not in dispute at all. i dare say konami have some pretty good deal with sony, but it's not inplausable that the 360 will get a version of MGS4 eventually, after all the gamecube got twin snakes, and the xbox got substance. what i'm saying is purely hypothetical, if the 360 were to snag a version of mgs4 relatively near to it's launch on ps3 it would be a huge blow for sony.
    [edit] though i can't see that happening personally.
    Edited by dadrester at 27/11/06 @ 12:25

  • ecureuil #24 6 years ago

    If MGS4 went to 360, it would be at least 18 months after the PS3 version.

  • penhalion #25 6 years ago

    Why does it sound like they are still early on in developing this title?

    I didn't rate the last metle gear much and nore did many others so I guess I don't much care how he uses sixaxis just as long as I don't have to hear about it.

  • ecureuil #26 6 years ago

    You mean removing the gimmicks that add nothing to the game.

    Like rumble, then.

  • mkreku #27 6 years ago

    I can see a few scenarios where the tilt function could come to good use. Like, if you're taking cover behind something, you'd tilt the controller to quickly lean out from behind cover to take a few pot shots. Or something.

    I won't miss the rumble at all. It's only effect on me (in my Playstation 2 games) is to annoy me and make my controller dig itself down amongst the pillows in my couch.

  • chupachups #28 6 years ago

    "While removing the motion sensing elements of the game"

    PS3 only has tilt sensing, not motion sensing...

  • Darren #29 6 years ago

    I must admit to looking forward to getting a PS3 (particularly when it gets some other good games besides Resistance!) but I'm not looking forward to using the SIXAXIS controller at all. The analogue sticks on the Dualshock pad are pretty awful but now that Sony have removed rumble it means that games will surely feel flat... no thud of the ball hitting the racket in Virtua Tennis 3, no recoil from a gun in first person shooters, no rumble of the track in Motor Storm, no feedback when you hit the wall or sides of the road in Gran Turismo 5, etc., etc. :(

    I think Sony have made a huge mistake dropping something that both the Wii and 360 have. I tend to notice when rumble ISN'T there so I know I'll miss it in PS3 games. And all because Sony were too tight to settle up with Immersion!

  • dadrester #30 6 years ago

    EuroSexMachne is a pedo and sniffs glue and my dad could have his dad in a fight and he fancies boys.

  • dadrester #31 6 years ago

    i wonder what a camera control would be like mapped to a button and the tilt sensor. hold button to enable camera control. might be quite good if it were done right.

  • zozart #32 6 years ago

    Based on the cool and unusual way he used the rumble back in MGS, I suppose he'll find an equally cool and unusual way to use the sixaxis functionality.

  • Foxclose #33 6 years ago

    "Konami needs more money to cover massive dev costs based on poor performing PS3 sales = Jump in!"

    Yeah, jump in! (on 5 DVD9 discs) ;)

  • asphaltcowboy #34 6 years ago

    I miss the rumble in the ps3 pad :(

  • brooza #35 6 years ago

    Kojima: This is what you can do.

    Use the roll to roll left and right while the analogue stick controls the crawling direction.

    I was thinking something along those lines, but in a canoe

  • Psychotext #36 6 years ago

    MGS4 wont appear on the 360 because of the PS3 lack of rumble (it wont be back btw...) it will appear because Konami likes money. Oh and foxclose... what exactly about MGS4 would need 5 DVDs? FUD.
    Edited by Psychotext at 27/11/06 @ 13:46

  • sharpfish #37 6 years ago

    Rumble FTW (or something) ;)

    WOuld miss the rumble like crazy if it wasn't in Gears Of War or PGR 3 (for example) thank god MS pay their dues and sort their shit out before releasing a trojan-format-carrier *ahem* I mean a games console.

  • JediMasterMalik #38 6 years ago

    I really want to see what he does with it. The uses of it in Resistance are limited, but still quite intuitive, I'm sure Kojima could use it many many ways.

  • DanMW #39 6 years ago

    Well he can always change his mind and make it for 360, that has rumble, right?

  • kangarootoo #40 6 years ago

    @dadrester

    "but it's not inplausable that the 360 will get a version of MGS4 eventually"

    Oh I agree. Bad choice of words on my part. I meant exclusive release rather than "never on another platform".

  • Xerx3s #41 6 years ago

    As to whether the motion sensor is a worthy replacement in Kojima's view, MGS' mastermind doesn't seem to be sure yet. "We can't say how we'll use the motion-sensing functionality specifically but we'll use it for sure," he told OPM.

    IOW, when we finish the game, we'll see if there is enough time left to see if we can fit it in somewhere. 0_o

  • dadrester #42 6 years ago

    "As to whether the motion sensor is a worthy replacement in Kojima's view, MGS' mastermind doesn't seem to be sure yet. "We can't say how we'll use the motion-sensing functionality specifically but we'll use it for sure," he told OPM. "

    IOW, when we finish the game, we'll see if there is enough time left to see if we can fit it in somewhere. 0_o

    ...or... "sorry mr press man, i'm afraid i'm not going to tell you about what's in the game just yet"

  • Salato #43 6 years ago

    Damn I agree with Kojima, I want the rumble back, not the bloody sixaxis. I'm sure he would have wanted to use it in MGS4, for example with the new Metal Gear stomping around the battlefield all the time, an increasing rumble could have given you an idea that they were approaching from far off and getting closer, forcing the player to try and rush to find some cover to hide from them. But because Sony are cheap bastards and won't settle with Immersion, looks like thats not going to happen. Well, I guess me, Kojima and others can still live in hope.

  • Freki #44 6 years ago

    The benefit of rumble is that it is feedback to another sense. Without it you get visual and audio only. The more feedback you can give to the player than the more immersive the game can be. I would miss it from quite a few games to be honest.

  • Freek #45 6 years ago

    Phil, you can spin it as much as you like but everybody knows motion control and rumble are not mutually exclusive if you would juts think of the gamers and settle the fucking lawsuit already!

  • Takeuchi_Riki #46 6 years ago

    Folks what do ya say about this pic
    http://www.love-boots.com/lb15va-eng.jpg

  • richardiox #47 6 years ago

    Love and Boots 15?

    /orders

  • Takeuchi_Riki #48 6 years ago

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    [link url=http://www.love-boots.com/video17eng.htm
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  • thinktank #49 6 years ago

    Another one of MS business ploys to bring down sony, they really are ruthless.

    Buying shares in the business that owns the rumble tech
    Forcing sony into the next gen b4 it realy wanted to
    creating PC and 360 as the common dinominator for devs
    Expanding into every country on the planet
    Forcing sony to run an exspensive online network to compete with live
    Giving devs reducing licienceing costs if they make 360 exclusives
    cutting the price of the 360 in the first xmas peroid sony will have numbers to compete (2007).
    Xbox 720 already in the works to cut the life span of the PS3 before sony can milk it.

    The verdict is out wheather MS can out do sony in the tradition sense of providing a more compelling platform. But they sure as hell will be able to out business them, its wot they do.

    Ruthless, i like 360 but i dn't won't sony to go away. I mean who wants MS as the only kid on the block?
    Edited by thinktank at 27/11/06 @ 23:01

  • kangarootoo #50 6 years ago

    @Salato

    "But because Sony are cheap bastards and won't settle with Immersion"

    Dude, how many times does it have to said. MS own a big chunk of Immersion. For Sony to license tech from a company that a direct competitor can control would be ill advised lunacy. So it won't happen and its not about the money. Yes it sucks, I miss rumble too, but thats life sometimes.

  • Salato #51 6 years ago

    I know kangarootoo, I know, I'm just a little pissed at Sony for their lack of insight, Sony handed Microsoft a little victory so easily back then when Immersion was after both Microsoft and Sony. Microsoft played that one very well, and Sony screwed up.

  • floppylobster #52 6 years ago

    It would be easy for them to release a non-axis version of the controller with rumble. But this is not about axis being better than 'dual-shock', this is about avoiding the payout that Microsoft had to make to license the rumble feature.

  • Psychotext #53 6 years ago

    kangarootoo: You do realise that competitors licence tech from each other all the time? Nvidia did it with ATI, MS did it with Oracle, AMD did it with Intel. It's really not that risky once you get the contracts tied up.

  • YourMessageHere #54 6 years ago

    I must admit that I don't often play console games but when I do, I hate rumble. I always turn it off. OK, I'm all for authentic simulation of experiences and as such tactile feedback is a good idea, but in my limited experience it's just vibration to a greater or lesser extent. That's just irritating and makes my hand ache. Why do I want the controller to be fighting me when it's not even fighting me convincingly? And the likes of recoil? Recoil is a shove. A weight on a motor cannot shove.

    If I could actually get some kind of variable, versatile tactile feedback from a controller that went beyond this, I'd be more interested. I had a force feedback mouse at one point, and while the only supported game was UT2004 and implementation was a bit crap, the demo software did point up some impressive capabilities; it managed to make the mouse feel like it was running over different surfaces etc. It COULD be good, it just never was in practice.