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Braid would be cheaper if MS agreed News
Xbox 360 PC News by Robert Purchese
Braid creator Jonathan Blow is "less happy" Microsoft insisted on charging 1200 Points (GBP 10.20 / EUR 14.40) for the game, rather than 800 Points (GBP 6.80 / EUR 9.60).
But the increased price does help Blow guard against what he describes as the "Space Giraffe problem", where Jeff Minter offered his equally non-mainstream and unadvertised game at a low price, but still sold barely any copies.
"There is a significant possibility that Braid would have been the next Psychonauts or Beyond Good and Evil (critically acclaimed but nobody played it), even at USD 10. If that happens at USD 10 then I am in debt and have to get a job and can't make games any more. If that happens at USD 15, maybe I can still make games. That is the difference," said Blow on the Braid blog.
"And again, I don't know if I would have been able to convince Microsoft to release the game at 800 Points anyway, so it seemed my best move was to make the agreement and keep a good relationship with them."
If he could, Blow argues he would offer the game for as little as possible, but he has borrowed money in order to see the project through, which "makes the nature of the decision a little different".
Braid, wonderful Braid, was released today on Xbox Live Arcade and is due sometime soon on PC. We gave the game 10/10 for stretching intellect and emotion as well as being "beautiful, entertaining and inspiring". The price tag should be no obstacle here.
Head over to our Braid review to find out more.
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Braid now available for Mac [14]
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GDC: Braid cost 200k to make, says Blow [16]
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Braid price cut to 800 Microsoft Points [42]
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15 July, 2008 [2]
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convercide
06/08/08 @ 15:48
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I can see what's going to happen. They'll eventually reduce the price to 800 points and Microsoft will send an XBox Live message to people like me who spent 1200 points.
The message will simply be "LOL!" |
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Derblington
06/08/08 @ 15:52
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Hmmm, I didn't know it was 1200 points... For 800 I would have bought it at home, at this price I'll get it on partnernet and play it at work - that's the difference for me.
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asphaltcowboy
06/08/08 @ 15:56
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But the increased price does help Blow guard against what he describes as the "Space Giraffe problem", where Jeff Minter offered his equally non-mainstream and unadvertised game at a low price, but still sold barely any copies.
But that's because SG was arse! ;) |
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Silly if you ask me they will loose so many sales because of the higher price point.
While the game is good fun (not sure I agree with the 10/10 though!) From the demo I see no reason whatsoever as to why this games is priced higher than the normal 800 points for live games, especially as the game is incredibly short. I won't buy it at 1200 but if it comes down to 800 I'll probably buy it. Many will say "oh but it's only a few quid more" and indeed they would be right it's not much more money, but that's not really the point..... |
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"I suppose psychologically people are more likely to buy an 800 GP game than a 1,200 GP one because paying more doesn't necessarily mean that the game is better..."
Actually that's not entirely true. oddly, one of the ways in which people judge if something is worth buying is how much it costs. What you might call 'perceived value'. There's almost a point where people think 'well, if they only want that much for it it must be rubbish'. It's generally the case that if you halve the price of something which people have no other means to judge on, you don't actually sell anywhere near twice as many copies. In fact there are quite a few cases of people selling more stuff when they put the price up. This makes pricing something like Braid pretty tricky, I'd have thought. It doesn't really look instantly attractive so you can't price it too high but if you price it too low people will think 'well, it doesn't look all that pretty and it's cheap, so it's probably not very good, so I won't bother'. 800 Points is probably the bare minimum they could charge without falling into that trap and 1200 is probably actually a good price. It's cheap enough to not put too many people off but it's expensive enough to suggest it's not just some run of the mill platform game. Jon |
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kangarootoo
06/08/08 @ 16:01
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I think Jonathan Blow is doing himself a diservice. The core reason that in the end Space Giraffe didn't sell that well, is that it was bobbins.
I guess these things always come down to market factors. Sell 100 units at £1 each or 200 units at 51p, its hard stuff to predict. On that note, I would kind of guess that MS's marketing boffins are better at estimating this stuff than Jonathan Blow, but then I don't know his background so I may be totally wrong. I hope it sells well, as its is clearly turning out to be a poster buy for what XBLA should be all about. |
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Der_tolle_Emil
06/08/08 @ 16:01
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There's more to it. People automatically think that more expensive stuff is better. In a way the higher price point is just marketing, people wanting to make this game look better than others (I don't say it isn't, but there's no way to know that when you just browse the shop). Might also get people to download the demo if they don't regularily download demos just to see why this game is more expensive than the rest.
Edit: I missed jonbwfc's post before. Sorry, didn't just copy what you said :)
Edited 1 times,
most recently on 06/08/08 @ 17:03
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kangarootoo
06/08/08 @ 16:05
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"In fact there are quite a few cases of people selling more stuff when they put the price up"
Jewellery is a great example of this. A friend of mine studied silversmithing at uni, and when it came to her end of year show, the lecturer was taking all the students own prices (which they had based on material costs + labour time and so on) and adding arbitrarily to it, by 300% in some cases. The lecturer knew that people often buy jewellery BECAUSE it is expensive, and they would sell less if it appeared cheap. That diamond ring that some footballer bought his fiancee wasn't really WORTH £30k, but "he could hardly give her a £3k ring on his wage, could he". Don't know whether my little anecdote bears any relevance to video gaming mind. Probably not :) |
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kangarootoo
06/08/08 @ 16:08
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@jonbwfc and Der_tolle_Emil
I suppose my point is that I am not sure that video games are one of those product types that fits the definition for products that sell more based on their apparent cost. Items that follow that have as one of their key purposes, showing of the owners affluence. Jewellery, high fashion, cars, stuff like that. A top-end gaming PC, or a peripheral, or even a games console might fit the bill for some people. But I'm not sure the games themselves really meet the requirements. |
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kangarootoo
06/08/08 @ 16:08
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@lambtron
Ah, we might be disagreeing now after my more recent post :) |
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I don't like points, but not for that reason. I don't like points because people forget what a brilliant deal 800 points for some of these games actually is. Choose 5 great 800 point games (and there are enough of them) and that's about as much as you pay for a full price game. At 1,200 it's still a great deal if the game is good enough.
If Braid is as good as some people are saying it is, I just can't see how it isn't worth £10 of someone's money, even if it isn't the longest or most replayable game in the world. |
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asphaltcowboy
06/08/08 @ 16:34
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@Les - If you use real currency you have to have separate stores for every territory! Otherwise known as - "Why has said game been released in the US and not in Europe?!!" - I'm sure you can find plenty of examples.
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Prodigy_BE
06/08/08 @ 16:39
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Excuse me, but Space Giraffe is a relic. It used top be top notch, but we've moved on.
Jeff should have stuck to talking about the old days, instead of trying to make an easy but by just re-doing what he did 20 years ago. It blew up in his face, and rightly so. A true classic is timeless. Space Giraffe isn't. I hope for Braid that it sells well, which will prove it's a great game. If it doesn't sell well, then it's not a great game. The comparison with BG&E is totally pointless. As BG&E was a genre that was widely unpopular at the time, so they new it would fail. Arcade games are by definition aimed at a broad market. So this whole point of view is bollocks. |
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I posted up something about the price of Braid being 1200msp at the weekend - few hours later I had an email from the XBLA team to tell me the price for Braid was in fact wrong - turns out, it wasn't!
http://www.xbox360wire.co.uk/2008/07/30/... The headline on the story though is the plan to charge 1800msp for Castle Crashers - I can't wait to see what happens then. |
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Max_Powers
06/08/08 @ 17:11
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Don't worry Blow, already bought the game.
And as has been mentioned here before, you're doing yourself a disservice with the Space Giraffe comparison. Space Giraffe no-one bought because it was utter shit. |
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I don't see the likes of Endless Ocean and Brain Training suffer from a low price-point - nobody sees them as inferoir games.
I think with the new 360 front-end we'll see a change, people will hopefully be more likely to find things they are into, at whatever price point, and give the demo a go. Space Giraffe is an interesting case in point. The 'conversion' rate from demo to full game was low, but the demo download rate was (as with anything on live) nowhere near even 50% of people with the system, which for a free go at something you might like (which is any demo at all realy) is unfortunate. There must be very many people who'd be willing to shell out on SG or a hundred other titles, who don't even chance upon it at the moment, and a better means of delivering the opportunity to try it to the end user can't hurt for any title. I managed to utterly forget Geometry Wars was on Live until about two months after I got my 360, the marketplace did nothing to remind me t was there. If Live Marketplace were doing the job MS would not be changing it so drastically, so I think reserving conclusive judgement to six months after the new 360 UI arrives is the best plan. |
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Prodigy_BE
06/08/08 @ 17:50
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@Paulf
Not all games, arcadegames. Arcadegames are always aimed at a broad market. If you make an arcade game and is doesn't sell, then you probably made a low cost hardcore game (which won't sell, because of the low production value), or you made a bad arcadegame. ALL good arcadegames pull their weight (earn more money than they cost) |
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Space Giraffe is ace - and the reason Jonathan Blow uses it as an example is probably because he thinks it's ace too:
http://braid-game.com/news/?p=100 |
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I must be missing something but what is supposed to be special about Braid? :?
I've just tried the trial demo and it seems to be a pretty but soulless platformer to me in the style of an old SNES game. The backgrounds are nice and it's colourful but the character looks pasted on and the game as a whole lacks charisma or charm IMO. The music is nice though and I liked the option to compensate for overscan in the options menu. Clearly I must be overlooking something because EG gave it 10/10 so it's clearly better than I'm perceiving it. Maybe I didn't give it long enough but the game just wasn't demanding my attention at any point. I'm not going to say it's rubbish, just not for me at all. |
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SomaticSense
06/08/08 @ 18:30
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I have to add myself to the 'Space Girafe was ace' crowd and stick up for it considering all the abuse it seems to be getting here. SG was fantastic as an arcade game the same way Geo Wars is. It starts a bit 'meh', but gets better and better the more you play and after you've unlocked some of the crazier levels, until you find yourself hopelessly addicted.
I don't really understand all the complaints over not being able to see much. It is true, it can be a blurred mish-mash of random neon colours forcing you to rely on sound and reflexes, but that's the point. Geo Wars can be exactly the same at times as regards to filling to screen with so much neon you can't see a thing, yet everyone drools over that game. The difference being that SG trains you to react by sound ready for the inevitable colour-craziness. Once you're in the zone, there's nothing on XBLA better as regards to arcade thrills. |
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Having played the trial it seemed ok once I was out of the first world which completely sucked!
However, I did find the music extremely annoying and the lead character looked a bit weird for a protagonist, I would therefore only have considered buying it for 400 points since the only thing which really intreged me was the moving left and right with the time changing which seemed the most innovative feature - hardly worth 10/10 EG! |
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yagisencho
06/08/08 @ 19:03
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He's "less happy" about being 'forced' to charge more for the game but in the same breath admits he needs the money.
Um...okay. I certainly don't begrudge him the money. If it's worth playing, it's worth paying. |
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Derblington
06/08/08 @ 20:04
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@Derblington: Wouldn't supporting games like this make the games industry (on average) a better place for all of us to work?
In my opinion that's worth paying a little extra for. I very much doubt this game, as great as it may be, is going to change the industry as we know it. And even if it did, it doesn't change the fact that I have rent/food/travel, etc, to pay and I can't really afford to put another £20 into buying points just to make up the extra 400 that I'm short. Especially when, as I said, I can get it for free. They've priced it badly for me to make a purchase. |
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