Crytek protests against new German law News

MAXIMUM PROTEST

I guess they could relocate to their Turkish location... But yeah it sucks.

Don't they own Free Radical in Stapleford?

It's a far cry from the laws we have in good old Blighty.

Them having to move maybe will give the hardware enough time to catch up with their software.

"It's a far cry from the laws we have in good old Blighty."

Yeah, but it's not quite at crysis point yet.

"would you rather risk ww3 and allow violent creativity or have peace. I am with the joker"

I have no idea what this means. Especially the joker bit (am I ignoring a poster perhaps?).

laws make devs cry

This is all based from the highschool masacre that happened in germany last year i belive Apparently the kid that did it played Far Cry 2 before and was keen on his FPS. Now it seems the german goverment believe that the games was an influencing factor in the incident - Maybe, but if you want to blame games you need to also look at the other factors like gun control. not to mention any mental issue he may of had.

German government trying to control people!??

I'd never of thought that :p

If u blame games for killings etc then your a complete retard....if some loser plays a game and kills then he would do the same with movies/Internet etc.
It's more to do with sad teens who have no REAL life!

Sheeesh

Never mind, Cevat, move to Brighton and we'll take you for fish and chips on the pier, then you can make us a Eurogamer-themed FPS where readers get to blow our faces up with grenades and nail bombs.

+1

Your neighbouring country Belgium will welcome all German developers with open arms. Your creativity will not be bound by law here. In our country Sasha Baron Cohen's latest flick "Brüno" is shown uncensorred and it's available to be viewn by all. Meaning little kids of 10 yo can get in and view the movie without any problem.

Never mind, Cevat, move to Brighton and we'll take you for fish and chips on the pier, then you can make us a Eurogamer-themed FPS where readers get to blow our faces up with grenades and nail bombs.

Would probably be better than Halo.

Meaning little kids of 10 yo can get in and view the movie without any problem.

Belgium loves them little kids


User was canned for this roast

This is all based from the highschool masacre that happened in germany last year

I think the real root behind these decisions is still WW2.

There's no new law as of yet, not even "near" ratification. There's just discussion, and probably (or rather hopefully) it stays that way. We have elections in September, so ALL of you voting Germans out there... do us and yourself a favour and do NOT vote for the fat old parties, which ARE going to take your games away!

@Mkwone
"This is all based from the highschool masacre that happened in germany last year i belive Apparently the kid that did it played Far Cry 2 before and was keen on his FPS."

I have it on good authority that he (probably) took a shit before the shootings too...
Are they gonna ban Bowel movements too?
(not snapping at you btw ^^).

"It's a far cry from the laws we have in good old Blighty."

Yeah, but it's not quite at crysis point yet.

I see what you did thar.

I'd be interesting to see what happens if Germany does actually ban "kilerspiele." I predict an underground rebellion of Germans playing Counterstrike in abandoned warehouses.

If u blame games for killings etc then your a complete retard....if some loser plays a game and kills then he would do the same with movies/Internet etc.

A priori denying any possibility of negative influence whatsoever of media is equally retarded, and that many gamers build up just this opposite front has not helped the discussion here in Germany at all - on the contrary.

This suggestion (it's not a law yet) is utter nonsense, but best results are achieved where both parties are ready to listen to each other, and unfortunately, many gamers are just as stubborn as the politicians, which also undermines the admirable efforts of other gamers (and the gaming press) in Germany to have a balanced, intelligent discussion about the whole matter.

ein reich, ein volk, kaine killerspiele

"A priori denying any possibility of negative influence whatsoever of media is equally retarded"

+1

If world history teaches us anything it's that dogmas do little good.

If they ban games because a lunatic goes shooting crazy on his schoolmates after playing a game, then can they ban the news too? Because I'm pretty sure most lunatics who've committed horrible crimes watched the news once or twice at some point and I am really tired of the crap they put on it, so lets seize this opportunity to rid ourselves of an actual annoyance!

"would you rather risk ww3 and allow violent creativity or have peace. I am with the joker"

I have no idea what this means. Especially the joker bit (am I ignoring a poster perhaps?).

Whoa! Freaking deja-vu, me too.

Crytek -> England

Please.

Move to the UK and pipe some money into Introversion!

Of course videogames are corrupting the youth, just like comic books and rock and roll did, right?

Come mothers and fathers / Throughout the land / And don't criticize / What you can't understand / Your sons and your daughters / Are beyond your command / Your old road is / Rapidly agin'. / Please get out of the new one / If you can't lend your hand / For the times they are a-changin'.

it's all too easy to blame media they don't understand for the actions of youngsters they do not understand either.

that said -> to me it is clear that there certainly are more reasons than just videogames what drives these youngsters to madness. In fact, it might very well be possible that videogames - even the violent ones - give a welcome refuge to troubled youth. ... ... as do movies, and books etc. Are they all going to be banned?

They've already banned killer whales.

"If u blame games for killings etc then your a complete retard....if some loser plays a game and kills then he would do the same with movies/Internet etc.
It's more to do with sad teens who have no REAL life! "


Funnily enough, germans have no issues with sex - which is a much more natrual thing to be doing than killing people.

But yet show a nipple on american tv, or try to release "hot coffee" mod and see what happens.

it's all too easy to blame media they don't understand for the actions of youngsters they do not understand either.

To be fair, the guy (mainly) fuelling the politicans here is a well-respected, well-known criminologist who usually knows very well what he's talking about - which doesn't mean that I agree with him - but he doesn't have an agenda as such, he's just mostly a scientist with a persuasion based on his own research, and pioneered some frankly awesome things in the past, like perpetrator/victim compensation.

You can believe I am annoyed as anyone about him (or the consequences politicians draw), but it's way too easy to dismiss him as an idiot with a political agenda.

Famed criminologists still reach entirely wrong conclusions in their research, it seems. Would be a pretty nazi thing for Germany to do.

It's just PR by Crytek. No one gives a shit about it.

Those agreements by the ministers happen every second year. Normally in a year with a moron running amok. The current administration (which is in it's fourth and last year, elections in September) had the aim to ban violent games. Nothing happened. Nothing will ever happen.

Crytek just wants to be back in the press. And: no one would miss them here. They made two games (and some Addons/Ports) that wouldn't be missed when they wouldn't have been made.

@Koalabaerchen : You DO know that EVERY german game which is even remotely violent or has even a bit of red pixels in it is censored dont you? And has been for at LEAST 10 years now?

Those germans are very weird cars can drive like 200 km on a high-way.
Where I think alot of people die beceuse they couldn't re-interact on time, but they are not allowed to make game.

@Uncle Lou
Yes it is retarded to deny any possibility of negative influence, but this should really not be the point of discussion here. We are all shaped differently from various ideas, media and literature. There are people who fight for the rights of minorities and gays, and in some people they produce even greater hate towards them. Should we ban them, because there is a possibility of negative influence?

Beside that, nobody can prove a direct link between media influence and violence. In fact, modern psichology made some contrary observations. Yes, there may be a connection, but it is not a causal one, in most cases. That means, even vhen you can find violent games in a violent person's house, you can not make a statement, that it became violent because of them, but more likely, it plays them, because there was violence present before, and the person likes to play them even more as "normal" persons do. To develop such an ucontrolled aggression, there are many interlinked causes needed, as genetics, ubringing (or lack of), abuse...

Even in cases, where playing FPS game should be made accountable for tipping the scale, you can not ( or at least should not) base the ban of such games because of that, because of the simple three facts, that are cofirmed in everyday life:
1.) FPS and similar games are one of the most popular genres in our game culture, if not the most popular even, and are sold in millions
2.) Such incidents remain rare and are widely known because they are rare, that means they get media time because they are still very much uncommon.
3.)There is much evidence, that such games serve as very useful stress release vent, and are as such at least partially responsible for calming someone in some cases (see, what I meant, we are influenced differently by media).

I lived in Germany for 5 years, and moved back just because a mental climate there. It seemed to me, that it hasn't changed nothing from the 1930's when Hitler came to power. Three quarters of a population there are still inflexible, uninformed, stupid and passive aggressive fucktards, which are prone to succumb to various ideologies.

But now we must admit, they are mostly in other direction, like protect diversity, minorities, gays ( not that it is something wrong with that), but the aggression remains the same, proponents try to impose their views on everybody, even with most unsuccesfull and uninformed laws, like agressive dog breeds ban (Result: there are still many thousand dog bite injuries per year, because dogs are individualists and can not be categorised on breed terms alone).

What appalls me in this discussion is the aggression of this "noted criminalist", who at least in this case doesn't know what is talking about. Namely, the teories of vicarious or observation learning of aggression are surpassed in modern psichology. I should know, as this is my line of work.
So again one of inflexible, uniformed passive aggresive fucktard, which is using one "good" idea, like protecting the others as a tool to express his aggression.
This same state of mind is responsible for the rise of Neonacism, not only in Germany but all over the world.Same zealots but Nacis are expressing themselves more openly.

Violence is a direct product of a moment in history in which we are living, where with a reinstatement of a religious fundamentalism and a wild capitalism and recession the working people and free minds are loosing the already acquired social and human rights. And no " killerspiele" ban will change that.

edit: Post deleted. I really can't be arsed. I can't take someone serious who actually thinks the current climate in Germany is like in the 1930s.

Hallo, I really didn't mean to offend you. I didn't meant to generalize either.And I wrote about "mental climate", that means personalities are still the same, even when on the outside, You were forced to change, because You lost the war.
I personally think of you as an exception in this "mental climate", but if you feel offended, because you can not see above state frames or you recognised yourself, I am even more pleased.

Haha an FPS Doug quote goes well with this. "There's no respawn point in RL." But seriously games get blamed for everything these days it seems. Obesity, murdering, violence etc. If people are stupid enough to be influenced in real life by a game then they shouldn't be allowed to play games.

"Beside that, nobody can prove a direct link between media influence and violence."

No, nobody has proven it yet. And maybe they'll never will. Either way, it's good if proper scientists keep investigating the matter and not let populist politicians run away with it.

"Violence is a direct product of a moment in history in which we are living"

No, violence is a direct result of human nature. Doesn't mean we can (or should) do nothing about it but it is just as much part of us as our good qualities are.

@Les
Proper scientists are investigating it, and the fact that someone blames the games for the Germany shooting incident means that he didn't gather all the latest facts, that are available, or is trying to capitalize in politics with false facts, which is one definition o f populism. So we agree on that.

I agree with you also on the other note. Violence was always present, it's a part of Human nature, and we can and should do something about it.I meant extreme violence acts, as above, because it was used as an excuse.
Better arms control, education and ratings supervision, but real, not on paper, should provide better protection measures, than accepting such laws.And laws should protect people, or show at least some effect in this direction. Otherwise they shouldn't be accepted.
Also, by allowing to play such games even to adolescents, in some cases, but supervised, under observation, and assesing them, how it affects them, should enable much better prevention, because they could be enrolled in treatment of such behavioural dissorders much before it comes to such incidents.
To ban an entire media or cultural genre is nothing else as reinstatement of mind control, which is common to all totalitarianisms.
But Germans even synchronise their films still ( a practice which remained from 1930-40's ) because they don't want to hear the sound of another language and exercise their minds.

"But Germans even synchronise their films still ( a practice which remained from 1930-40's ) because they don't want to hear the sound of another language and exercise their minds."

I don't agree at all with your anti-German sentiments. And as far as I know pretty much any country except The Netherlands uses native language dubs instead of subtitles for foreign language films

FromTheLandUnknown:
"Three quarters of a population there are still inflexible, uninformed, stupid and passive aggressive fucktards, which are prone to succumb to various ideologies."...

FromTheLandUnknown:
"I really didn't mean to offend you. I didn't meant to generalize either"

lol :)

@UncleLou
I think the problem people here have is the idea that a single medium is responsible for completely influencing the actions of an individual

I'd guess this is partly due the millions of people playing games and don’t then feel the need to act out in this way (in comparison to the handful that do)

Partly because it suggests people are unable to act on their own volition and are lead like cattle by the most abstract notion (that playing a game like Far Cry 2 suggests going out and shooting people is an acceptable course of action) or the most basic presentation put before them.

Partly because there have already been a number of studies carried out in this area already which suggest the is no connection between the two events

Partly because the media has tended to make very spurious/openly debunked links between violent individuals and their influence under video games.

But mainly because it would seem - to me at least - that these massacres are unstable individuals with mental issues which allow themselves to not only perform the actions but validate the actions to themselves. That they would probably done the same thing were video games available or not - To paraphrase Bill Hicks, there was plenty of violence before video games were first created (admittedly Hicks was talking about porn).

It would seem wiser to spend the money on identifying and helping these people rather than the knee-jerk reaction of hitting out at an easy target... It's the same way British politicians tend to react to the media rather than meeting the needs of their constituents - Especially since the media's opinion is based on what will sell the most advertising space :)

@Les
First of all, my sentiments are really not anti German, (at least not in general). But I expressed my aversion against some modes of thinking in their society, that are more common there. I can be critical in the same way against my own state or nation. To have sentiments against a nation is a mode of thinking, which is totally against my belief.As I said, I lived there for 5 years and made some of my nicest friends and memories.

Also, I wrote about three quarters of population, thinking that the other quarter can be just fine. I profile myself politicaly in the same way always, even on local terms.

And for your information, I know many countries beside mine, which do not dub their films. This dubious practice is common only in some latin countries (France does not dub all of their films, as far as I know) Germany and Austria.Films are destroyed this way believe me, as voice of an actor is a powerfull media which completes the performance.

@IronCladChicken
As You present my quotes, yes i agree with You, lol.. I see what you meant, Maybe I should put it in more subtle words. Otherwise you could not complement my thoughts more precise and nicely. Thank You.