Games of 2011: Dark Souls

By Simon Parkin Published 29 December, 2011

Fireside chat.

A hazy myth, an elegant contraption, an eccentric vision, an unforgiving mistress: Dark Souls has many sides. All bear the fingerprints of creator Hidetaka Miyazaki, who in 2011 established himself as the most interesting designer working in blockbuster games today. Not that this, sequel to Sony-born Demon's Souls, has much aside from giant sales figures to identify it as a big hitter. In all other ways it eschews the churning mainstream, taking design decisions that are both unfashionable and, prior to its chart-dominating success, seemingly commercially unworkable.

Because it's a game that obscures its precise systems with the fog of misdirection, whispering clues that lead nowhere, forcing you to feel out its systems and geography, absent of any handholding. For players used to explicit goals with well-furrowed roads to reach them, this feels like play with the stabilisers removed. Indeed, when it comes to your task and the route by which you arrive at it, Dark Souls has nothing to say.

Its tutorials come as paper cut admonishments; training levels that suckerpunch you back to bonfire save points with nothing to show for your troubles but some muscle memory, a bruised ego and another plan that must be torn up and replaced with something better. Dark Souls has nothing to say to players who wish to succeed simply by showing up.

The single save slot and constant recording of progress make rewinding the clock on your history impossible and as such this is a game that asks you to own your choices like no other, wearing failures as defining scars. Dark Souls has no mechanism for players wanting quick reloads that allow them to, attempt by attempt, write the perfect journey through the game.

The complex weave of non-player character storylines carries on about you regardless of your attention, and the lines between friend and foe are blurred. Favours are just as likely to be repaid with brutal backstabbing as shiny trinkets. For players used to being repaid in gold and reverence by their virtual quest-givers, Dark Souls has nothing to say.

Instead the game relies on the messages of others to give hope and inspiration. The mystified multiplayer is quite unlike anything else in games, the opportunity for voice chat barred by Miyazaki, limiting communication to messages scrawled onto the ground by other players in their worlds, and pulled into your own. "Ambush coming up," warns one. "Shoot its tail," instructs another. In the early stages of the game the sense of asynchronous camaraderie is beguiling, even though the deliberate down scoping of the console's features feels old-fashioned.

Dark Souls is a game that calls to screen horrifying terrors, crocodile-skinned leviathans, fire-breathing drakes and obese executioners that pound toward you with single-minded urgency. But the most frightening demons are perhaps those it summons from within us. The petulant child gamer, who throws her controller at the wall in frustration; the irascible teenager who stops playing the moment he stops winning, all red-faced sulk. These are ghosts from the past we have supposedly matured away from, and yet in Lodran's stony network of brutality, they are called to the surface. Dark Souls has no words of indulgence for the bruised ego. Rather, those demons must be exorcised if you wish to progress, or embraced if you wish to submit.

And how many submitted? Few who start a video game finish it, just as so many books remain opened but unread. Games require perseverance, commitment. But in Dark Souls' case, they require skill too. Not the kind of skill that has become fashionable in games over the past two years: fetch quest persistence, hunger to gulp down drip feed experience points that offer rewards for merely turning the cogs. This is the systemic cancer that is deforming gaming's DNA, a lowering of the barrier to entry that widens the pool of players, but at the cost of a diminished sense of accomplishment.

Don't be put off by Dark Souls - there's a difference between a punishing game and frustrating one, and this is rarely the latter.

Not all games have to be for everyone, despite capitalism's persuasive whispering in the ear of so many publishers. Dark Souls is a game for players willing to advance themselves, not just their avatar; to learn and perfect a skill, to improve. In this way, it silently summons the demons of an entire medium, before shooing them away with its single-minded philosophy.

It's not perfect, but that's somehow perfect for a game that centres itself around our imperfections. It frequently overreaches, with ambition outstripping technology in Blight-town as the framerate slows to a plod while the console strains to render the dank, cavernous walls and matchstick scaffolding. Likewise, the endgame competitive multiplayer player vs. player was ruined by some imbalanced covenant items - at least until the most recent patch - design shortcomings that stand out all the more starkly for the rest of the experience's brilliance.

Like Minecraft, the Gollum-like grip with which the game clutches its deepest secrets has forced the community outside of the game too, onto YouTube and forums and FAQs where scraps of knowledge are traded like precious gems. The value of the unspoken has been all but lost in video games, whose comprehensive tutorials and 'extras' menu options make explicit every inch of the developer's work. Dark Souls understands the worth in choosing to say nothing.

In part, that's because its silence it makes room for us to say something, and no game in 2012 has inspired not only such commentary, but also such communal storytelling. Fitting that the only moments of respite and safety in the game are bonfires, where flames scare off monsters, and warmth invites sharing. Outside of the game too, we come together around a virtual fireside, and begin to pick over our own personal stories, myths that pass from player to player, an oral tradition of play. We tell puff-chested of our victories, and murmur red-faced of our failures. There's humour and tragedy and wonder in these stories. And in them, we begin to understand that Dark Souls has so much to say. It simply asks that we are the ones to voice it.

Picture of Simon.

About Simon Parkin

Simon Parkin is an author and journalist on video games. A core contributor to Eurogamer since 2005, he is also a critic and columnist on games for The Guardian.

Read more articles from Simon by visiting the Simon Parkin archive page.

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Comments (171) Latest comment 5 months ago

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  • stee1gargoyle #1 5 months ago

    Excellent article that does justice to a truly glorious, wonderfully old-fashioned and supremely welcome game.
    Edited by stee1gargoyle at 29/12/11 @ 08:33

  • TheNonk #2 5 months ago

    Working my may through the first game at the moment. It reminds me that we've lost something important along the way in our world of checkpoints, difficulty settings, trophies, DLC and micro-transactions.
    Edited by TheNonk at 29/12/11 @ 08:37

  • justsomeone #3 5 months ago

    i think there's a word missing in the first sentence, last para. sub-eds?

    lovely article - i seem to have read loads about demons souls over the last few months, but never get tired to hearing about it...possibly because there's always something new to say, as in this article. many thanks.

  • richarddavies #4 5 months ago

    This is the correct answer for game of the year.

  • captain_mailinator #5 5 months ago

    My game of the year without a doubt. Cleared it with 3 different characters...one pure strength, one dex. int. hybrid, and one str. faith hybrid. Fantastic game.
    Edited by captain_mailinator at 29/12/11 @ 08:53

  • Inmediasress #6 5 months ago

    @TheNonk
    Now that's something I can agree with.
    Unfortunately I don't see it changing anytime soon, unless an industry wide crash occurs.(which may not even be that far of)
    That makes me very sad.

  • humanchu #7 5 months ago

    Great article. Makes me want to play.
    And makes me wonder why reviews can't be written this way In the first place. There may a format/tradition that may need to be challenged if it holds back this kind of writIng.

  • Pinewood_Groves #8 5 months ago

    I love Dark Souls. Nothing else this year came close.

  • furrykitty #9 5 months ago

    I would like to see From Software start a controller replacement program , and some support counselling to those stuck in the world of Dark Souls. It is not good for our health. Sleepless nights , daydreaming , panic attacks , i'm sure we have a case here.

  • havoc2011 #10 5 months ago

    @TheNonk You are spot on with this comment. Thank you.

  • jimmac #11 5 months ago

    GOTY by a long way. It wasn't perfect but nothing else came close for that sense of achievement and progress. Just finding a shortcut feels like a victory, getting to the next bonfire or finding a blacksmith, each of those small events mean more than completing many games.

  • BellyFullOfHell #12 5 months ago

    It's not patience I find I'm lacking as I get older. With a partner and three kids, time is precious, and much as I really enjoyed Dark Souls, after taking twenty hours to get to the Capra Demon, and realizing a full playthrough would take me roughly another 60-80 hours, I gave up. I simply don't have that time to dedicate to a single title anymore, I'd have to play one game and one game only for around three mobths to get those sort of hours in. Damn shame.

  • cardigait #13 5 months ago

    this game has eaten all the others game i planned to play, and already bought, in the last months.
    I'm heading to the endgame... and i don't want.
    Last time this happened was Planescape:Torment, totally different and equally legen...dary
    Edited by cardigait at 29/12/11 @ 09:54

  • BartsBlue #14 5 months ago

    @TheNonk I'm right there with you, man. Have been fighting my way through Demon's Souls this very month. And it's actually all the talk about Dark Souls that made me buy the prequel.

    I was discouraged to try original game by the tales of its scary difficulty and the fact that you could only play as a knight in shiny armour. Now at some point I realized both points were wrong. There are different classes and armor sets, there is magic, nothing forbids the player to play as something else. As for the difficulty...

    Difficulty is punishing, yes, but it mostly punishes player for not being prudent. Can't be saving these health potions (grass, actually) for later like in other games - if you don't have safety margin on your health bar, you might get killed accidentally. I don't have best reflexes and am easily discouraged, but so far I am loving my excursion through this dark world. It reminds me time when I was playing Diablo long time ago - I found that game both dark and hard. This one is even more so. It also got style and atmosphere, two things that I much value in game.

    Once I beat Demon's Souls, Dark Souls will be my next purchase.
    Edited by BartsBlue at 29/12/11 @ 09:56

  • UncleLou #15 5 months ago

    Not all games have to be for everyone,

    Exactly. That's one of the main problems in forum discussions (and sometimes in reviews) in general. Some people have difficulty understanding that a game that does not cater to them personally isn't shit, or overrated, and that sometimes it is better for a game if the developers do not compromise their idea instead of breaking it down to the lowest common denominator.

  • FogHeart #16 5 months ago

    The highs and lows hark back to a time when completing a video game was something important in your life - playtime bragging rights. It takes a game that remembers how to punish and reward to re-awaken that feeling. Instead of clustering around a desk, we post on a forum. We still get the warm glow of being able to tell someone else how it's done, what was once the thumbs-up across the classroom next morning now replaced by an all-caps post singing your praises at just past midnight.

    The minimalist communication paradoxically makes the game more profound and meaningful. I may have assisted a German teenager to vanquish a spider queen, had my life saved by a message left by a doctor from Sweden, and been torn to pieces by a father-of-three from Spain. Who knows? Whenever you see a player online, no words are exchanged, no identities determined, just a bow before assistance or a bow after defeat. Phantoms are just that - nebulous, fleeting, unknown. Atmosphere is retained, disbelief remains suspended.

    Game of the year, not just for tearing up the rulebook but for replacing it with a far better one.

  • furrykitty #17 5 months ago

    @BartsBlue Started Demons Souls a few days ago after completing Dark Souls , I feel it is even more punishing and unforgiving ,i actually hate it but can't stop playing it, you are not alone .

  • Widge #18 5 months ago

    *emerges from ground*

    *bows*

  • mr2ange #19 5 months ago

    For me this easily gets GOTY.

    There have been some other great games too, but this had me from the moment the disc went in - and it didn't come out again until completed.

    (then back in for new game + :)

  • BartsBlue #20 5 months ago

    @furrykitty Indeed, there's more of us: TheNonk, you, me and judging by the number of phantoms I see around while playing, there's quite a lot of people still playing Demon's Souls.

  • trebellk #21 5 months ago

    Definitely my Game of the Year. This is my series of the gen.

  • Wyrm #22 5 months ago

    My game of the year too. Haven't been as affected by a game in years.

  • Hellion83 #23 5 months ago

    Post deleted at 20:12:17 01-02-2012

  • Windypops #24 5 months ago

    Have only been playing this for a few hours, so I'm at the controller-breaking petulant child stage, but I think the eulogising above needs a bit of a counterpoint.

    Difficulty is one thing, but wilful hostility is another. When you're getting your arse handed back to you on what is ostensibly the training level over and over and over again, the developer is doing something wrong. There are "so many books that remain unopened but unread", but they're usually good books; those that persevere will come away having learnt something, and that something may be of use in the real world.

    In Dark Souls, you come away having learnt the no doubt very sophisticated mechanics of yet another generic fantasy world. Oh look! A skeleton with a sword! Except the skeleton's really hard.

    It's elitism based on who has the most time to burn, ultimately.

  • eminusx #25 5 months ago

    I couldnt agree more, an amazing game!!

    Its main criticism seems to have been its difficulty, but the difficulty is entirely fair and has far reaching implications that many people seem to overlook, as you tentatively edge your way through the world, afraid of losing your cache of souls, you're pulled deeper and deeper into the world and your attention becomes so devoutly focussed. Any foe or obstacle can be overcome if you approach it wisely, its a strategy & skill based game played out in real-time.

    The world itself is magnificent, and the character styling is beautifully conceived and executed.

    A real triumph for gamers who want more than an interactive walk-through.

  • Paulie_P #26 5 months ago

    Might look for this in the sales today but I'm almost scared to start it.

  • Neppy #27 5 months ago

    No mention of the amazing music? Some people may not realize it, but its a big part that what makes bosses more stressful and challenging. My first battle with Gravelord Nito almost sent me into a panic because the music was banging into my head like I was about to die and there was nothing I could do about it; but in the end he's actually pretty easy (with a divine weapon). While the world barely has any music all the bosses have unique tracks which suit them completely; personal favourites are Ornstein & Smough and the quiet yet powerful track of the final boss. Hardest boss award goes to the four kings though, especially on NG+ when you can't just zerg them down.

    Dark Souls is my GotY too and I really hope there's more to come!
    Edited by Neppy at 29/12/11 @ 11:20

  • Architect_z #28 5 months ago

    Without a shadow of a doubt, its the best game of the gen. I love it because of 3 reasons.
    1) It doesnt hold back on difficulty, nothing is made simple, obvious or unfair. Everytime you die, its your fault, your mistake, the game rarely ever does anything cheap.

    2) The combat system works so well, a great balance of stratergy depending on weapons, stats, items, buffs, armour, endurance, weight...etc
    Practically everything you have can be used to aid you, and you can use them in different ways to defeat the enemies.

    3) The emotions it puts you through. I don't mean in terms of storyline (as most people know, Dark Souls doesnt have much of a storyline which also adds to the beauty of the game.) When you succeed, it feels like a huge achievement, because its so difficult, the odds are so against you, overcomming those odds feels like you won a marathon. On the flip side, theres the penalty for failure, never before have I been so angry as a result of losing all the souls I collected after dieing, but because Dark Souls is so addictive, you get passed the anger and keep trying.

    Sorry long post. But I just cannot believe so many play Skyrim and refuse to play Dark Souls.

  • Zyklonbzombie #29 5 months ago

    I really loved the style and atmosphere of the first one, but found it extremely joyless. I, like most gamers I suspect, tend to play games for an enjoyable experience, rather than an arbitrary sense of 'achievement' - so I don't really consider trial-and-error gameplay, leading to more trial-and-error in another identical environment particularly rewarding.

    I get that some people do. It's a niche game for the self proclaimed "hardcore" - and that's great. Its just a shame it has such an obnoxious, elitist presence online and in the gaming press. Praising a game for being uncompromisingly geared towards its fans is one thing. Calling accessibility "the systemic cancer that is deforming gaming's DNA" [a quote from this very article] is another.
    Edited by Zyklonbzombie at 29/12/11 @ 11:32

  • SteveHolt #30 5 months ago

    The difficulty is actually the least interesting thing about DS. It's not hard, it's just opaque. The art, the atmosphere, the level design, the combat system, the RPG mechanics, the exploration and so on are worth discussing. The difficulty, bleh, just play smart and you'll be fine.

  • guernican #31 5 months ago

    It is very interesting that, despite being well-written and compelling, this article really has nothing further to add to the Demon's Souls review of two (?) years ago.

    Miyazaki really has identified the sort of game / theme / ethos / DNA he wants, and he's mining it to the utmost. Admirable.

    I might perhaps take issue with this:
    This is the systemic cancer that is deforming gaming's DNA, a lowering of the barrier to entry that widens the pool of players, but at the cost of a diminished sense of accomplishment.
    Perhaps it's simply redefining achievement? It seems so easy for us to criticise this, whereas actually it may just be a fragmentation - in games as in so many other media - of output. There will be an ever-growing market for the simplistic and accessible, and there's absolutely nothing surprising (or wrong) about that. But as Dark / Demon's Souls demonstrates, there's still a strong desire for the uncompromising and the challenging, and the fact that these have both sold well should be reassuring to those of us who AREN'T, say, buying their first console to play Skyrim.

  • Fletche #32 5 months ago

    No game has managed to hold my attention as long as this one has for a very long time.

    I actually thought I wouldn't get on with it after hearing about the difficulty, but once it clicks and you get to grips with the mechanics, it becomes a joy, yes you die, but that just makes you more determined so you try again, and you die again, but now you have more knowledge and so on

    The elation you feel when you defeat a boss you have been trying to kill for a long time is like nothing else in gaming, you get a similar feeling when you have levelled a little and then go through an earlier area, only this time you are one killing everything and it feels great (Until you get over-confident and get a arrow in your head or you fall backwards off a cliff)

    GOTY for me, nothing else has come close

  • eminusx #33 5 months ago

    @Architect_z
    "Sorry long post. But I just cannot believe so many play Skyrim and refuse to play Dark Souls"

    I think the darkness and difficulty puts some people off, which is a real shame because it just takes a bit of effort and patience to get the most out of DS, I guess a lot of people dont associate these with "fun", but DS is more about achievement and adventure than pure 'joy'. Though mastering the combat is definately fun!
    Skyrim too is a fantastic RPG in my opinion, albeit the absolute antithesis of DS.
    Edited by eminusx at 29/12/11 @ 11:37

  • danjfor #34 5 months ago

    And in them, we begin to understand that Dark Souls has so much to say. It simply asks that we are the ones to voice it.

    That's a great way of putting it. A while ago I read somewhere someone saying Dark Souls gave games their dignity back, which is another good way of putting it.

    If games are art, I think Dark Souls is it. It's something that exists that doesn't bend to indulge you. So many other games, no matter how good their production values or how rich their writing, scupper any profundity they might have had by enforcing their rules only when you're willing to indulge them. Are Halo's Covenant Elites fearsome warriors? Only if it's on Heroic or above. But the knight in the tower just outside the Undead Parish won't change just because you want him to, and so you can learn something in how you deal with him, even if it's just that you suck tits at parrying.

    Seriously. Every character leaps off the screen, and yet they're all wearing big fucking helmets! What a game, what a game!

  • Alabzam #35 5 months ago

    Great article, For me, Dark Souls is easily my GOTY.

  • Empedocles #36 5 months ago

    My GOTY, Requires an almost Zen like mindset and acceptance of the inevitablity of numerous failures, been playing for over 100 hours on my first playthrough so far trying to find every nook, cranny and scrap of lore - immense!

  • Bullet_Tunnel #37 5 months ago

    got this at xmas and cannot put it down, bf3 and skyrim have sat in the box since and i cannot escape the trials hd syndrome of "1am-one more attempt at, shit its now 3am, one more attempt". i was thinking about how much this reminds me of an old gameboy game i had-fortress of fear, it wasnt a great game, but it was rock hard, and had a similar feel of not knowing where to go, what to do, and that you will die trying to find out. also it has inspired a feeling in me i havent recognised since sneaking out of bed to play doom on my uncles pc when i was a kid, i was out of my depth, didnt have a single clue what was going on, or how to play/where to go, but the need to explore, that instinct to seek the unknown and keep going, discovering little nuggets until you have evolved to be master of your surroundings from scratch, and put up with being bummed in a corner by relentless monsters. its the reason why i put games on hard from start, why i will attempt to pick off a squad of elites with a pistol because ive no other choice-and succeed,why i will sit trying to shave 0.001 of a time in trials hd and why im storming a 20-0 kd in a round of bf3 while my fried laments every time he runs blindly round a corner and dies-blaming "this fucking shitty game".
    more games need to recreate that feeling like dark souls does, it will make better games, it will also produce better gamers.

  • kwolf666 #38 5 months ago

    I love Dark Souls too. I just love it, seriously.

  • Architect_z #39 5 months ago

    @eminusx.

    Yeh, you are completley right. I don't blame anyone for not liking it if its not their thing. But I know quite a few people who refuse to try it because they are so obsessed with skyrim. These guys are much more into rpgs and gaming in general. I think they don't like it purely coz I go on about how amazing it is every 3 seconds. lol

  • wobbly_Bob #40 5 months ago

    I have been playing this for about a month, more or less, and i still think about it when i am not playing; i will be at work formulating tactics or im cooking breakfast and thinking on my upgrade path for a weapon or i could be shopping and wondering where i should adventure next. I still love this and am just as excited to play this now as i was when i first played it. I think this says it all. This is my game of the year. Its going to be one of my all time top games.

    I love the sense of community and have gotten so much help from others. As the article says, i think this game fosters a real sense of comradahip - we are fellow adventurers on an amazing quest to explore an amazing but dangerous land.

    To those that critise this as elitist and too hard, i think you are wrong :-) i dont think dark souls is really that difficult. Really. I will admit up frount i'm not very good at games. If i can do this ( and so far at least - i can ) then almost anybody can do it. There are plenty of games harder than this but this game is fair. If you are careful, plan ahead, and are prepared to learn then you will be ok. I think the elitist tag comes from people posting about beating the game or certain baddies or overcoming hard points. We are not bragging, we are just elated and proud of ouselves and want to share that! Victories are hard won, victoires are EARNED and the sense of achivment is huge. We are not elitist, i'm crap at games, we are a proud band of warriors and adventures sharing tales of battles, victories and defeats.

    my game of the year, give it a chance and it will be yours too.

    /bows
    Edited by wobbly_Bob at 29/12/11 @ 12:18

  • Arsecake_Baker #41 5 months ago

    A truly truly excellent and beautifully crafted piece of gaming art, everyone should own it and lets hope for sequel after sequel!

    Edit: kk maybe not sequel after sequel, but you know what i mean :p
    Edited by Arsecake_Baker at 29/12/11 @ 12:37

  • Dangerous_Dan #42 5 months ago

    Praise D'S.!

    Why play 10 different games in the last months if you can play just one - and I don't feel like missing out.
    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 29/12/11 @ 12:48

  • Gecks #43 5 months ago

    @Windypops
    I think everyone who loves Dark Souls has been at the stage you're at. That 15 minute trek through Undead Burg towards the Taurus Demon - I certainly must have done that 30+ times, cursing all the while.

    I didn't really enjoy that section, but if I did it again I could probably do it first time, because those failures teach you the basic combat system of Dark Souls better than a formal tutorial ever could. You learn, or you die. It's harsh, but it's that grounding that makes the rest of the game relatively easy to deal with. I don't think I've been stuck since and I'm rubbish at games!

    Stick with it! :)
    Edited by Gecks at 29/12/11 @ 13:01

  • randyronald #44 5 months ago

    @BartsBlue Didn't they shut down the servers for Demon's Souls? That's the only thing that has prevented me from getting it after enjoying Dark Souls (I know, I should get it anyway but without the community I feel I'm really missing something)

  • Bullet_Tunnel #45 5 months ago

    @gex... thats exactly what i was doing last night, from 12 till 2, its not the minotaur thats hard, its the effing dog/pigs that block you in, once they die its not to bad to keep a distance, but thats if i can survive going through the doorway first.

  • UncleLou #46 5 months ago

    There are "so many books that remain unopened but unread", but they're usually good books; those that persevere will come away having learnt something, and that something may be of use in the real world.

    In Dark Souls, you come away having learnt the no doubt very sophisticated mechanics of yet another generic fantasy world. Oh look! A skeleton with a sword! Except the skeleton's really hard.

    It is clear from your post that you do not want difficult games, sophisticated mechanics that take time to master, etc., but that you expect light entertainment from your games - and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. What I don't get is why thought it would be a good idea to play Dark Souls, then?

    It's elitism based on who has the most time to burn, ultimately.

    Really don't get the attitude. I am terrible at skill-based games like shoot-em-ups/high-scoring games (say, Geometry Wars), and I don't really get anything out of them - so I just don't play them. I'd never get the idea to be so judgmental like you about those who enjoy this kind of game, though.

    And "time to burn"? If that's someone's problem, he's much better off with Skyrim, anyway.
    Edited by UncleLou at 29/12/11 @ 13:18

  • papizdano #47 5 months ago

    just telling you that you wrote in the last paragraph that "no game in the year 2012..." typo

  • kwolf666 #48 5 months ago

    @Windypops It is not a generic fantasy world. It is pretty unique I thought, notably different from the elves/dwarfs/orcs/cat people style of most games. It is much much much darker. For example, there is no promise whatsoever given to player that there is a possibility of saving that crazy world in which Dark Souls takes place. The battle is lost before it even started, but still you fight it. I love this.

  • FuzzyDuck #49 5 months ago

    While not my personal cup of tea (not the challenge, the fantasy thing), i have to say that as a gamer of some 2 decades that the very existence (and the success) of a game of this ilk, is something to be very happy about indeed.

    Even if the casual are the majority, there's still enough want from the old-school to know that our hobby is in fine health.

  • AntiRad #50 5 months ago

    A superb article, cheers Simon. Full of passion for the game, the sheer nuance therein and that it really, really got to you. :)
    Also, great to see the game being talked up at a time when many journalists, despite the good reviews initially, have favoured others over it as their best of 2011.

    Hence it's interesting that when those Game Of the Year lists arrive on various sites, that in the comments that follow the sheer love from the public for Dark Souls is massive.
    For me, part of the enjoyment of the game came from that community. Everyone may well be having different experience, but the advice shared was always top notch and helpful, even if I ended up discovering another way, a new favourite weapon, whatever it may be.

    I'm still playing it, still on my first run through - slowly peeling back the layers, trying different things and making progress. At times it scares the life out of me, at times the odds seem insurmountable, but that feeling of progression is such a thrill - one of real pride and accomplishment.

    I also think the art direction is a joy. To walk into a new area, or be attacked by a new enemy and plain marvel at the level of beauty, grotesque and the collide between the two, is fabulous - often whilst reacting by putting a shield up or taking a swipe at something.

    A lot has been made of the difficulty, but I don't see it. It's a game that doesn't hold your hand, certainly, but it's one that allows you to get more powerful, even *over powerful* for a level and then push on through. It's also a game that rewards discovery and gets a little easier to play as the game goes on. Certainly the ring of the evil eye brought a huge sigh of relief.

    For me, £40 for a game is a more selective choice financially than it's been in some time. For a title to give me this much playing time, value for money, sheer awe and enjoyment is one I don't regret for a second.

    Love Dark Souls.
    Love it. ^-^

  • technicianTed #51 5 months ago

    I really did love this game, only completed it once but i'll return one day to it.

    The buzz you get when you find a decent shield or weapon to replace your previous rubbish ones was better than any other game i thought.
    Just a shame the framerate on a couple of levels was horrific.

  • Windypops #52 5 months ago

    @Gecks

    I'm trying, and I've played some more this afternoon, starting out with a fresh character. It's getting its claws into me, but I'm still not convinced.

    @Unclelou

    I wanted to play it because it received plaudits from people whose opinion I respect. I've played difficult games before (Ninja Gaiden springs to mind), and whilst I've not necessarily finished them, I've enjoyed the experience. Dark Souls isn't just a difficult game, it's a game that punishes you for not knowing how to play it when it won't tell you how to play it. It's masochism on a disk, only of a sort where the payoff is a dead boss and some power-up you won't know how to use until you use it wrongly and die again, rather than, say, a tickled prostate.

    And I'm not being judgmental about the people who play this sort of game - I'm one of them after all - it's the arrogance of the developer that pisses me off.

    @kwolf666

    I've not seen much of the world so far, but brown dungeons, shambling zombies, crumbling grey ruins and skeletons that reassemble themselves strikes me as fairly generic. Maybe there's a bouncy castle and water-slides level I've yet to see. Fingers crossed!

  • popej #53 5 months ago

    @Windypops
    Well one thing that may help based on what you just said in your last post.
    Don't go through the graveyard yet. That's a route you shouldn't really take until you're halfway through the game.

    From the Firelink shrine go up the path on the edge of the cliff past the well with the body hanging in it. If you fight a few zombies including one that chucks firebombs at you, you're going the right way.

    You'll reach the Undead Burg eventually which is definitely the recommended route for beginners. Of course the beauty of the game is that you CAN go more or less anywhere from the start (in my opinion anyway).

    Stick with it.

    edit: btw, it's not Windypops from Eve is it?
    Edited by popej at 29/12/11 @ 14:39

  • Biker_Bob_1971 #54 5 months ago

    Post deleted at 15:13:21 09-05-2012

  • kwolf666 #55 5 months ago

    @Windypops I think it's not only about visual design. People keep saying that there is no story in Dark Souls, but I think that's wrong. Part of what I feel is unique about Dark Souls is that it chooses to tell a story in a much less verbose way than many other fantasy games. Developers and fans of RPGs nowadays seem to be a bit obsessed with detailed game worlds and allegedly "realistic" political struggles, intrigues, ethnographic descriptions of exotic foreign tribes etc. They often overdo it, however. I find this kind of realism somewhat childish (I'm not accusing you here, it's just an observation). It reminds me of evidently very young players' complaints of something "not being realistic". In contrast I love the obscurity of Dark Souls storytelling, which I find much more intriguing than a story that forces every element of its narrative to daylight.

  • popej #56 5 months ago

    I'm with you on that kwolf666. Good explanation.

  • Obli #57 5 months ago

    Demon's Souls and Dark Souls - real gamers games.

  • UncleLou #58 5 months ago

    And I'm not being judgmental about the people who play this sort of game - I'm one of them after all - it's the arrogance of the developer that pisses me off.

    I disagree fundamentally that it has anything to do with arrogance whatsoever. To repeat my former example: I don't survive in a game like Geometry Wars longer than 3 minutes. My "high"score is ridiculously low. It's a far more masochistic and frustrating experience for me than a hundred Souls games could ever be. Would you think I made a fair point if I called the devs arrogant? It's just not the kind of game where I have the stamina and motivation (nor the skill) to get good at, that's all. It's just not my kind of game.

    I'd also fail miserably at Ninja Gaiden, because I am just not good at games that are purely skill-based. I'd argue that it's far more masochistic, because what you mostly need in the Souls games is patience, and you need to be careful,, which everyone can learn - as opposed to manual skills.

  • AntiRad #59 5 months ago

    @kwolf666 I think there is a story, but it's evolving without you - and when you stumble upon it and you notice changes, there's a real degree of *oh my God*

    The art of feeling very small and insignificant in a much more powerful world adds to the taste of delicious when you do kick on further and try to turn the tide.

  • Windypops #60 5 months ago

    @popej

    I'll give it a go. I don't think I'm Windypops on Eve. Is it a General Windypops you're referring to? I seem to recall some Eve players landing in my old blog's comments once and thinking we were the same.

  • popej #61 5 months ago

    Aye, that's who I meant. Nevermind then.

    Stick with Dark Souls. I'm sure it'll come good for you in the end.

    It sounds like you made it difficult for yourself in the graveyard, it doesn't give much guidance in terms of directions of course. Many players will find themselves in the same position if they haven't googled/strategy guided it first. The guy sat at the Firelink Shrine does give you some cryptic clues as to where to head. It's just not really immediately obvious where he's talking about though.

    Probably the best bit of advise for the first few hours is to walk everywhere with your shield up. Don't run unneccessarily and definitely don't run round corners. Check all angles all the time as death comes from everywhere.

    Seriously though, patience is where its at. Apologies if this is starting to sound a bit condescending. :p

  • geeza2020 #62 5 months ago

    Oh fucking hell, maybe they should put a plaster cast of Miyazaki's cock in the next game for you all to suck on.

    It would be better than this overrated turd of a game anyway. Get over yourselves.

  • kwolf666 #63 5 months ago

    @geeza2020 I would love to suck his cock. Any problem with that?

  • Po1ymorph #64 5 months ago

    It's dark, uncompromising, beautiful and beguiling and a game I will treasure for a long time.

    Thank you FromSoft.

  • Wildsleven #65 5 months ago

    Dark Souls is my game of the year! This game is full of imagination and the thought put into the level and monster designs is just awesome.
    I really doubt Dark Souls will beat skyrim but if it does it be the best christmas miracale :p

  • Po1ymorph #66 5 months ago

    @geeza2020 No need to get upset geeza, there will be another Call Of Duty out soon.

  • merseymal #67 5 months ago

    Would love to have played this but no PC version.

  • Trafford #68 5 months ago

    Nice article, the one I've been waiting for.
    Sony should thank From for finaly pushing me over the edge and buying a PS3.

  • Windypops #69 5 months ago

    @UncleLou

    At least with Geometry Wars you knew how to play it; anyone with a pair of thumbs does. With Dark Souls, you have the depth of an RPG, with all of its complexity, and the only concession to telling you how to play it is a few notes burnt into the ground telling you the basic controls. That's creating difficulty - and limiting your audience because few will persevere - through deliberately keeping the player ignorant, hence arrogance.

  • Stomp224 #70 5 months ago

    Dark Souls is not only my GOTY, but also my 2nd personal fave of all time (After the original Sonic). Incredibly deep and rewarding, its made Skyrim (which I played after completing Dark Souls) seem like a shallow puddle and a lot of naff amateur fantasy writing by comparison.

    Games like Dark Souls and Shadows of the Damned give me hope that games can still be interesting in this fad of military FPSs and space marine FPSs

  • geeza2020 #71 5 months ago

    @Polymorph - Hilarious! So I dont like Dark Souls, therefore I must be a retard who exculsively plays CoD games? This is exactly the kind of attitude I would expect from someone who's head is so far up his own arse, he cant see anything wrong with Dark Soul's game design.

  • Windypops #72 5 months ago

    @popej

    Not at all; I appreciate the help. Doubly so, because it kind of backs up my argument against the game, whilst simultaneously making me want to play it more.

  • whishman #73 5 months ago

    Demon's Souls is better.

  • Boomalla #74 5 months ago

    Dark souls & Demon's souls are amazing games.

    <3 From Software

  • Po1ymorph #75 5 months ago

    @geeza2020 No. It is your apparent anger and disdainful views towards those who wish to express there passion for a unique game that draws such conclusions.

    By all means express reason's for not liking the game, I can understand why many would not enjoy Dark Souls, but there is no reason to attack those that do as you have done.

  • riz23 #76 5 months ago

    Absolutely Spot On Simon! Every fucking paragraph. Well done. What an incredible game.

  • Dangerous_Dan #77 5 months ago

    @Windypops Actually you are right with the difficulty, I think this game is thought of as difficult because:
    1) You do not know anything about the mechanics - and they are more complex and have hidden stats that show up nowhere, then you'd think at the start - or exactly where to go and who to talk to.
    2) It requires patience(as mentioned by UncleLou) and a lot of people don't have it - it seems.

    But that's a big part of the mystery and what makes this game interesting, the not knowing and constantly improving. Learning by Doing.
    Hope you hang on a little longer, you might actually like it more and more.
    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 29/12/11 @ 16:31

  • SteveHolt #78 5 months ago

    @windypops: I put around 250 hours in dark souls, this is my GOTY, but I think you are right.

    But I don't think the game should be blamed for "creating difficulty" (to sum up your previous posts in one convenient expression). To me, DS is like some elaborate jigsaw puzzle - I want to crack it, to solve it.

    This is a game design "philosophy" I enjoy, it's like finding a way to platinum in trials HD, or finding the secret to high score heaven in geometry wars. The locations, NPCs and enemies of DS are a riddle you have to solve, just like the extreme tracks of trials HD or the obscenely high score one of your friends managed in geometry wars are riddles.

    It has nothing to do with skyrim. Both are awesome and flawed, but for different reasons, and have different purposes. Skyrim wants to allow you to do whatever you want at the moment, however stupid it might be; DS wants you to adapt and survive to a rigid set of rules and hazards. There's a lot of fun to be found in both, you just need to make sure you're in the right mindset before you start playing.

  • Hindle #79 5 months ago

    Post deleted at 23:04:43 04-04-2012

  • eminusx #80 5 months ago

    @windypops
    I know what you mean about it intentionally trying to shove your head up your own arse etc but at least you can argue your point fairly unlike some fucking nonces just writing a game off as shit simply because they didnt gel with it.

    . . .re: difficulty, I prattled on somewhere else on EG about the similarity between films / games etc and that not everybody is expected to like a game or film when its released etc sometimes neither ‘targets’ the generic audience, theyre just intentionally, gleefully difficult, but that adds to their attraction. Many people hate David Lynch’s films because theyre so oblique, dark and disjointed, its also the exact reason many people love them.

    For designers its incredibly difficult to think of new directions in which to take a tried and tested formula (RPG) to both please the consumer and keep the bean-counters happy. FROM have done a fantastic job of encouraging a different style of play. OK, the ramped difficulty may not be entirely new, but its how they have executed this idea that has presented a challenge that many current games simply cannot match, DS is engineered to be more about skill than simple button bashing, in this respect it isnt so different to SSFIV. Skill is one of the core ingredients of gaming itself, so as a gamer, hardcore or not, the 'test your mettle' challenge or stepping up to the plate is exactly the reason I switch on my console in the first place, and DS does a fantastic job of being a 'game' in its purest form.

    Honestly id stick with it, get out of the graveyard section and up to the Undead Burg and if you still hate it, well, fuck it, go for summat else! It is worth while tho mate!!

    @quedff $15 for your Ed Hardy bikini, thats my final, FINAL offer!!!

  • Arsecake_Baker #81 5 months ago

    I'm at a bit of a loss here. I never found it difficult at all!

    I found it stimulating, exciting, addictive, creative and overall a complete joy to play, like Lou mentioned, patience will get you through DS faster than any gaming skill you ever learned, this in turn engrosses you in a dark and delicious world full of intrigue and mysticism (a lot of it created in your own mind)

    Is it really GOTY? Yes yes it is!

  • HokutoNoKen #82 5 months ago

    Gametrailers RPG of the year 2011:

    http://www.gametrailers.com/video/best-role-playing-game-of-the/725240

    Winner: Dark Souls

    / Ken

  • magicianlord #83 5 months ago

    Absolutely fantastic game. My game of the year without question. They very rarely make 'em like this any more.

  • stryker1121 #84 5 months ago

    Very nice piece of writing, Simon. I'm going to have set aside my reservations about this game and just jump in.

  • Architect_z #85 5 months ago

    Difficulty: Dark Souls is as easy or as hard as you want it to be. Dark Souls could be potentially easy if you kept your shield up constantly and only attack when theres a definate opening, but that would take forever. The simple thing is, is that in order to progress you have to act very cautious, almost how you act if that world was the real world, you'd keep your shield high, you'd creep around and see what lurks around each corner, because if you don't, a huge demon with a 10ft axe will crush you suddenly.
    It's not like modern fps's where you can run in, get shot 5-6 times and hide behind a desk until your 100% healthy again, and pick off enemies with 1 or 2 shots.
    Dark Souls is a game that forces you to learn, this isnt fun to some people, alot of casual gamers need to kill lots of things quickly, thats not a problem, its how they get their gaming fix, which is fine. But in DS you have to be tactical, patient and you have to adapt depending on what kind of enemy you are up against.

    Getting the right stratergy can be difficult, infact everyone who has played Demon's Souls or Dark Souls has died enough to back me up on that one. But the beauty of this game is thinking up a different stratergy (because you obviously died on the first attempt), pulling off the new stratergy, and succeeding. You get a rush like no other game, it feels like you've overcome a huge milestone.

    Unlike Cod, where if you die, you go back 5 seconds and try again until you win. lol. Sorry for the Cod troll. ^_^

  • BigHal #86 5 months ago

    @wobbly_Bob Well said.

  • TOOTR #87 5 months ago

    "Dark Souls has nothing to say to players who wish to succeed simply by showing up."

    That's music to my ears.

    I missed out on Demon Souls due to not having a PS3 so was delighted to have Dark Souls released on the xbox.

    I have played around with early sections of Dark Souls and instantly appreciated it
    but am going to complete the smorgasboard of games released recently before settling in for the main course.

    Dark Souls will be the game I will focus on in early 2012. I hope to get the same sense of pride and achievement that I got from completing Ninja Gaiden on the original xbox.

    Early signs and this excellent article show this will be the case.....will just have to resist chucking the controller through the tv and accepting defeat as lessons learnt to take with me into the continuous battle.

  • melchaios #88 5 months ago

    This is something many people don't understand when I tell them I prefer Dark Souls over Skyrim. The latter may be much longer, but never in its 100-so hours has it given me the sense of acomplishment and thrill Dark souls has.

    Skyrim is like a long, looooong walk in the park with your girlfriend. Satisfying, compfortable, and aimed at the sole purpouse of enyoing yourself.

    Dark Souls is like running a 600m dash against Usain Bolt and having a cramp in your thigh in the middle of the race. Its pure adrenaline rush,it doesn't need a context to pump you up, its maddening, its facing impossible odds.......and winning in the end!!

    Point is, while skyrim decides to make you a demigod, dark souls decides to make you a common/fragile human being; and as a result, the game becomes the perfect combination between a hack n slash/RPG/survival horror

    Matter of choices maybe, but for some, myself included, no other existing game can touch this.

  • basstaverns #89 5 months ago

    I don't know what's wrong with everyone, this game's well easy and possibly the best game ever made.

  • AnotherIdiot #90 5 months ago

    This game is not as good as uncharted 3, the graphics are just not as good.

  • mcmothercruncher #91 5 months ago

    If you haven't played it you are a big poof.

  • BigHal #92 5 months ago

    When I first played Demon Souls I told my friend how much he would love it (we are both in our thirties playing games since late eighties) and for us Dungeon Master was the game so I knew it was his kind of game. He didn't buy it but for some reason he bought Dark Souls and absolutely loves it.

    My message to the unconverted. This game may not be for everybody but seriously give it a try at least if you haven't. You have far more to gain than to lose. Don't be put off by the learning curve (it's not difficult but requires you to plan ahead a little and understand the wonderful game system).

    Also the community of players are not elitist (on average) and are far better (behaved) than any MP FPS gamers.

    This is not fanboyism. I just want gamers (which I presume people reading Eurogamer are) to at least try this masterpiece.

    I still don't understand why this never got 10/10 and marked down down for being similar to Demons as this is not at all consistent when when compared to Skyrim (10/10) and Oblivion (latter being my third most played game - after Souls games). Both great games but not a patch on Souls series.

    Happy new year to all Eurogamer readers.

  • Windypops #93 5 months ago

    @SteveHolt

    250 hours is an astonishing amount of time to invest in a game. You could learn to drive, or probably fly a plane, learn a foreign language or some other life-changing skill in that time.

    I'd come back to my original, much-negged point about it being "elitism based on who has the most time to burn". Perhaps I have a low tolerance for the trial and error gameplay because I have less time to devote to gaming.

    Having played it further this afternoon, I'm struck by how archaic some of the design decisions are. Instadeaths, levels design that leaves you with no idea where to go next, respawning bad guys (didn't Kieron Gillen do an article for this website - or PC Gamer mag, not sure - called the Ten Commandments of Gaming, that took developers to task for such things? Google's not helping).

    Plus, as far as I can tell, you can't even pause the damn thing. That is astonishingly arrogant; nothing else in your life can be as important as this game when you're playing it.

  • JayKwon #94 5 months ago

    The satisfaction, oh it's so great! This game has changed my perception of what videogames can be.

    Whereas games as Uncharted and Cod fly you in a helicopter to the top of a mountain, Dark Souls lets you climb the mountain yourself and makes you fight for every step. The view on top of that mountain afterwards is so much better.

  • Dangerous_Dan #95 5 months ago

    @Windypops -
    Yes some aspects are archaic. But some like that kind of archaic. For example I'd really like them to do a big maze next time where you really have to work your way out without automap.

    Yes, enemies respawn but I guess most people enjoy it because the combat itself satisfies them.
    That's the real issue here, me thinks... is the combat itself a good experience for you? - because that's the essence of the game(play). If not, I'd not bother playing.

    Well and the pause thing, I guess it can sometimes be annoying but I wouldn't call it arrogant - or do you press pause in CoD multiplayer? You are always online in this game and if you are in human form you can be constantly invaded.

    It's okay to have your gripes with it but I'm very sure the developers did not include certain features or aspects just to form an elitist club or make people frustrated. All these elements like not knowing where to go, respawning enemies and so on were deliberate decisions to achieve this kind of experience - which, reading these comments, at least some people really liked.
    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 29/12/11 @ 21:50

  • Slipstream #96 5 months ago

    Simply a beautiful game, even though I've finished and know most of the areas like the back of my hand I keep going back,

    Creating that perfect character for yourself through the trial and error process of restarting the game from scratch is actually very addictive, and you can get back to where you were in a very short amount of time if you know what you're doing. Yeah I love this game, oh, so much.

    The truly verticle environments, the encounters, the graphics, the subtle music, the VA, the weapons, the online aspects, just everything, I love it.

  • Widge #97 5 months ago

    @AnotherIdiot what? Game with best graphics is the best?

  • vudude #98 5 months ago

    @Windypops
    So I take it you are a pilot and speak about 30 different languages? Dark Souls only takes like 50 hours to complete. But if someone spends 250 hours on a game they enjoy, what's the problem with that? That's how much time some people spend playing Skyrim or CoD multiplayer. It just depends on what you find satisfying. People who like Dark Souls like it for the combat and challenge.

    Dark Souls may not give much explanation but anyone with a little common sense can figure out what to do. Did anyone ever complain about not knowing where to go in Castlevania SOTN? Do you really need a tutorial to tell you what each button is for? Just push the damn button.

    As far as having to redo parts over and over again, how is that really much different from any other game? Isn't CoD Multiplayer or any sports game just the same thing over and over and over again? And is the first level in any FPS really all that different than the last? If you take away the scenery, every level is basically the same gameplay, same objectives. Again, it's just a matter of what you find satisfying.

    I think people need to understand that progress in Dark Souls is different than most other games. It's not about "experience points" and getting to the next cutscene. Progress is learning the enemies, the environments and getting better at the game. Your strength is little to do with stats but rather the things you learned and the skills you've mastered. That's what people find rewarding about it.
    Edited by vudude at 29/12/11 @ 23:39

  • freethinker101 #99 5 months ago

    @randyronald Altus were shutting down the DS servers in October, but are keeping them open now. This only affects the US copies. The EU and Asia servers are still running so take your pick. All 3 versions have different trophy sets. It's a great game, and one you should play!

  • asho #100 5 months ago

    Fab game and my game of the year. I've never been so addicted to a game as much as this and stopped playing Skyrim to check this out and so far put in 80 hours and never went back to skyrim.

  • goldenbone #101 5 months ago

    Easily my game of the year. Love pretty much everything about it, the world, characters, ambience, enemies, weapons, spells, and the core control and combat mechanics.. all excellent. It's such a tactile experience. I'd love a new version on the next generation of consoles.

    No game has challenged me so enjoyably, and been so continuously rewarding. Brilliant, glorious game.

  • Zyklonbzombie #102 5 months ago

    @Windypops I get the feeling those standards don't apply to trendy Japanese games. I guarantee if this game was made by a western developer, it would have been mercilessly panned as a badly designed, unfinished mess.

  • Sonic_D #103 5 months ago

    GOTY by a mile. The only sequel released this year that lived up to the first game.

    A game made for gamers by gamers.

  • figaro7 #104 5 months ago

    Not quite my goty but its up the top, even after 5 weeks of time out from dark souls, it lingers on my mind and i will be back to try and finish it off...somehow.

  • ToAks #105 5 months ago

    One of the best games the last 10 years this one, Demon's Souls was better and quite a bit more difficult .

    Controls and response is better in dark souls but some of the immersion is gone because of it compared to Demon's Souls.

    that said, both games are fantastic and i really need to give both more time and platinum both.

    amazing how fromSoftware managed to make yet another Hit game without globalizing it and make it too user friendly/mainstreamin or whatever.

  • TazerFan #106 5 months ago

    I was more put off by the awkward menus and presentation than anything else. Maybe it explains my indifference to the RPG genre outside of Mass Effect 1, but I just loathe looking at menus and comparing items and DS sure feels like a SNES or PS1 game in that regard.

    The combat seemed satisfying enough but I just don't have enough hours available for gaming each week to get into this one. With a job and a relationship and a dog something like MW3 is just more my speed; I can jump in and have fun for an hour every Saturday morning. If that's my only hour of gaming for the week, I still feel fulfilled. Does this make me hate myself as a gamer? Yes. But that's where I'm at.

  • SliderNL #107 5 months ago

    I love Dark Souls, but the MP is so broken that you can hardly call it a feature (and yes I have played Demon Souls a lot so I know how it works) but in Dark Souls it doesn't work at all.

  • Dangerous_Dan #108 5 months ago

    @SliderNL Why is it not working?

  • Inmediasress #109 5 months ago

    @TazerFan
    That's not the problem.
    The problem is when the gaming indsutry thinks that RPGs need to be mainstream ala COD to serve your type of audience.
    Obviously COD numbers are enticing but I don't know why must every game be for everyone just for the sake of increasing profits.
    Capitalism at its finest there's never enough money.

  • ktej #110 5 months ago

    @Windypops actually, I would say it's giving the player the chance to use that lump of jello, most people call a brain, to figure things out for themselves instead of just slavishly following the instructions in the game/manual.

  • ktej #111 5 months ago

    @AnotherIdiot Right,
    welcome good sir, you are from troll country I suppose ? :)

    I can't deny that Uncharted has great graphics, but DS is equally impressive in a more subdued and dark way.

  • Gecks #112 5 months ago

    @Windypops
    Re: respawning enemies. they only respawn when you use a bonfire/die, so it's all part of the risk/reward thing. do you go back to cash in your stock of souls, at the cost of having to cut a path through those enemies again? or do you risk losing everything trying to find the next bonfire? it's absolutely a design decision they made 'on purpose'.

    same with instadeaths. we wouldn't be here singing it's praises if it didn't have those punishing moments. they don't happen so often as you progress through the game, but the prevailing fear that almost anything in the game seemingly has the potential to kill you and temper your progress is what makes everything else so rewarding.

    pausing: just quit the game using the menu option; it saves you exactly where you are and reloading takes seconds.

    all these thoughts you've had are exactly where i was early on in the game, but ultimately i 'get' it now. i think once the taurus demon goes down, the game opens up and - more importantly - you feel like you're beginning to 'solve' dark souls. and it can be solved!

  • vudude #113 5 months ago

    @Dangerous_Dan

    As much as I love Dark Souls, I have to agree that the multiplayer is a bit broken - mostly because of the backstab. Instead of having a face to face duel, you just have people trying to circle around each other for a backstab.

  • UncleLou #114 5 months ago

    Having played it further this afternoon, I'm struck by how archaic some of the design decisions are. Instadeaths, levels design that leaves you with no idea where to go next, respawning bad guys

    I think you're confusing "archaic" with "not my personal preference". I can hardly begin to tell you how happy I am when I play the rare game that isn't full of linear corridors, glowing quest markers and hand-holding. And the whole concept is built around respawning enemies - it allows you to harvest souls and items, it demands the tactical decision when to use a bonfire, etc. It's a perfectly valid game mechanic for this kind of game, just like it is for, say, Diablo.

    If they did what you want with Dark Souls, it would obviously be a completely different game. It is - sorry - almost selfish of you that you want a game that obviously is not your kind of game at all to change so radically that you would like to play it - at the expense of all others who enjoy exactly the points you criticize.

    What Simon wrote in the article and what I quoted earlier bears repeating: Not all games have to be for everyone.

    And again: the "time to burn" argument is non-sensical. Most RPGs will take more time to finish than either of the Souls games will. If someone has played it for 250+ hours, he's in NG+ or further. I am also not quite sure why that bothers you so much - is it a bigger waste of time to play one game for 250 hours than it is to play 25 games for 10 hours?

  • Windypops #115 5 months ago

    @Dangerous_Dan

    I wouldn't press pause in an online multiplayer game, no. But Dark Souls is essentially a single player experience with a little online interaction built in to add atmosphere. Not being able to pause it - to answer the phone, go to the toilet, whatever - strikes me as an arrogant decision.

    @vudude

    I don't necessarily need a tutorial to tell me what every button is for; what I do need is for a game to not make me play the same ten minutes over and over again until I work out what to do. If you look back through the comments, there's a few referring to online wikis and forums and such; resources that people have been using to work out how to play the game. If you're resorting to such things then I'd say the game itself has failed on some level.

    @Zyklonbzombie

    I suspect you're right.

    @ktej

    What is this jello of which you speak?

    @Gecks

    I don't doubt that there's a great game there, underneath the cretinous design decisions, and I will persevere with it. I'm saying that, but I'm now getting routinely twatted by some creepy-armed ghost things that seem impervious to my weapons and chase me when I run away. Bastards.

  • Windypops #116 5 months ago

    @UncleLou
    I'm not confusing any such thing. Instadeaths in particular are often cited as an example of poor game design. I can understand that the developer is making a statement about the hand-holding that most modern games offer; I think it's a bit of a stupid statement. By all means create difficulty by having hard, intelligent enemies. Creating difficulty through poor instructions, forcing the player to replay big chunks after dying and so forth is just a means of deterring them. Arrogance again.

    Not all games have to be for everyone, but deliberately limiting your audience to people with the requisite time to burn isn't genius. What's especially irritating is the sense of misplaced machismo coming across when this game is being discussed. You're a proper gamer if you like this game: old school, not one of these COD, space marine, hobbit-molesting gamers of today. And I suppose in a sense you are; I can still remember the days when I could spend eight uninterrupted hours playing a single video game, alone in my room, wishing I had a girlfriend.

  • Ostinato #117 5 months ago

    @Windypops
    I'm not hardcore by any means, but I'm playing Dark Souls and loving it. The instructions aren't poor. If you play the first stage, the messages on the floor will tell you the controls. They will tell you what you need about combat. Only thing missing (I think) is the instruction on how to jump. After that, you will learn while playing. For instance, you will need to learn the importance of stamina.

    Having 'to replay large chunks after dying', well isn't that the way with lots of games? (Mario, any tower defense game, ...) Remember Ghosts 'n' Ghouls?

    It's been said before: you will learn from every death in DS. Next go, you will make sure that ninja doesn't get behind you. And you will progress further.

    Anyway, about DS being hard: yes it's hard, but not terrible hard. And it somehow gets easier as your soul level rises.

    But if you don't like it, well, it's just a game, right? Noone forces you to play it, do they?

  • SliderNL #118 5 months ago

    @Dangerous_Dan we just can't find each other in Demon Souls i could set a sign and a friend of mine would see almost immediately.

    In Dark Souls it worked 1 evening after that I cannot find one of my 4 friends playing it.

    We have the same player level
    We are in the right area
    We have the right status (Human, vs undead)

    We tried every possible variation but nothing works
    I see other souls signs BTW

    Why this game has blocked party chat and invites on the 360 is really annoying (I wonder if that is allowed by MS)

  • Gecks #119 5 months ago

    @Windypops looks like you're in the ruins of anor londo? those ghosts can only be defeated when you are cursed (there are items you can pick up from that area that give you a temporary curse), but in any case, that's somewhere to avoid for now. stick to going upwards through the undead burg, killing that taurus demon :)

    you can sprint around that graveyard area with the skeletons and pick up some decent items. the skeletons will kill you but you keep your items even when you die, so it's definitely worth doing!

  • Paulie_P #120 5 months ago

    I bought this yesterday. Still prefer Skyrim but this is a brillant game.

    The difficulty reminds me of the old Mega Man games, its initially hard when you don't know whats coming but soon you learn the areas and tactics for the bosses and you eventually succed.

    Lost a lot of souls and humanity yesterday when I missed a shortcut back to a bonfire, when I noticed the shortcut, I could've cried. What does the humanity do anyway? I feel it's important.

  • TrevHead #121 5 months ago

    @Windypops

    The term "bad game design" when it comes to oldschool nintendo hard game design is more akin to a buzzword started by the industry that is only thinking about selling to as wide an audience as possible and has been used in the past by gamers and reviewers who dont really know what they are talking about.

    Ive no idea how old you are and how many console generations you have been playing but so many popular trends in the past stem from the industry marketing the "next big thing" where they label everything thats old as bad and out of date, take 2D games for example. Its like narrow minded teenagers who only listen to the latest pop music and label anything old as daddy's music. Later on when that person matures and has had chance to experience different types of music that they can appreciate the classics.

    Atleast these marketting tactics seem to becoming a thing of a past as this console generation is starting to hit the ceiling in tech and is running out of fresh ideas that everyone is starting to rediscover the classic games and mine them for ideas and tweaking them for an modern audience much like how the music biz recycles classic genres every 15-20 years.

    Lets put it another way free to play, microtransaction MMOs and Facebook games are the next big thing that sells the casual market that is bigger than the "mainstream core gamer" market how would you feel if they started using the term "bad game design" to describe tried and tested aspects of game design common with core games

  • BartsBlue #122 5 months ago

    @randyronald No, I believe they have not. I see messages of other players, I see their ghosts locked in fights in other dimensions with enemies I cannot see... Looks to me that servers are still up. :)

  • fluff_the_tiger #123 5 months ago

    A great game, but Demon's Souls was better. They didn't even bother to fix the corpses sticking to your feet in the sequel - grr!

  • Ostinato #124 5 months ago

    @BartsBlue
    The game tries to find players in your covenant (when you want to help out on bosses, or want assistance).
    For PvP, it tries to find players no more than 10 levels higher or lower than you (or 10%, jury's still out on that).

  • TrevHead #125 5 months ago

    ^ If you are talking about the Demons Souls servers. IIRC There was an anoucement from just before Dark launched that From planned to maintain the servers for another 6 or 12 months (I forget which)

  • UncleLou #126 5 months ago

    What's especially irritating is the sense of misplaced machismo coming across when this game is being discussed. You're a proper gamer if you like this game: old school, not one of these COD, space marine, hobbit-molesting gamers of today. And I suppose in a sense you are; I can still remember the days when I could spend eight uninterrupted hours playing a single video game, alone in my room, wishing I had a girlfriend.

    Hm, I'd guess that CoD multiplayer and hobbit-molesting games are much more likely played by gamers that have eight uninterrupted hours playing time, but whatever. :p

  • SvennoJ #127 5 months ago

    I love exploring in Dark souls but the boss encounters have so far all been disappointing. Either it's find a spot where they can't get to you and wear it down slowly or put a summon stone down and someone way higher in level comes in and kills it in 3 seconds.

    The Capra Deamon was especially cheap. Immediately on entering you get jumped on, instant death. On the 5th try I finally managed to get around it to climb the stairs with my last pixel of health. After defeating the rats the standard way there was nothing more to it then chucking spells and arrows at it until it was dead 15 minutes later.

    Of course not much later instant death again and a curse that takes away half your health permanently. This game simply punishes you for not reading online wikis first.

    The game is great but saying there are no cheap deaths goes a bit far.

  • mcmothercruncher #128 5 months ago

    Ironically, Windypops, it's you that's coming across as arrogant far more than the non-mainstream design decisions From Software made for their game.

    The respawning enemies are intentional. They're a penalty imposed on you when you "save" at a bonfire and prop up the key game mechanic, namely, the question you need to ask yourself constantly whilst you play- do I save or do I press on but risk everything even more?


    Either man up and go with this new flow, or go back to the world of glowing hints and enemies conveniently gathered around explosive barrels. We won't think any less of you.


    We fucking will.

  • Gecks #129 5 months ago

    @SvennoJ the room with the capra demon has a set of stairs in it, so i guess the implication is that you're supposed to use them! it looks like it must have glitched for you with the demon just stuck at the bottom, but when i did it he would chase me up the stairs after a few seconds.

    what i ended up doing was dashing up the stairs and dropping down on him with a plunging attack - didn't take long!

    i found the knife wielding dog a bit boring - just had to level up to tank through that fight - but most of the other bosses have some sort of 'solution' to them, IMO.

  • Windypops #130 5 months ago

    @mcmothercruncher

    You haven't really been keeping up have you?

    I'm aware that the design decisions are intentional; that's why they're called "decisions". I'm saying that some of them are bad ones, which will alienate a significant chunk of the potential audience. I get that that is what the developer is trying to do, and I think that's arrogance.

    And thanks for saying "man up", brilliantly illustrating my point about misplaced machismo.

    Oh noes! Your opinion is so important to me!

  • Kostas #131 5 months ago

    For me at least, this and Zelda Skyward Sword are the games of the year bar none. There are of course other awesome titles at hand but these two just stand head and shoulders above all else available.

  • mcmothercruncher #132 5 months ago

    And as I said Windypops- never a more apt name by the way- it's you that is looking arrogant here chiefly because you loudly proclaim that the framework is bad, rather than what it actually is which is different.


    So it doesn't suit you because you don't like playing sections over and over until you've perfected them and because you can't pause. That's fine, but it's laughable to claim it's about machismo- it's simply about risk and reward.

    The Souls game contain far, far more risk than just about anything else out there but bring with that far more reward. And that is why we're all so passionate about them.

  • TelexStar #133 5 months ago

    @Windypops - calling something a "bad design decision" is such a subjective thing. That implies some sort of universal truth. It's not. The design decisions you're criticising (which you agree are deliberate) are the very same things that the majority of people have hailed as refreshing and welcome. So they're not really "bad" are they. They're just not to your liking.

    Is this the same as arrogance? Perhaps it is but I have an awful lot of respect for a developer that's consciously decided to make their own game, rather than pander to common paradigms in the industry at large.

    I'm not saying you're wrong in your opinions but I think you are largely missing the point of Dark Souls (with all due respect to you :) ). Personally, I hope you do persevere with Dark Souls because in my opinion, it really is a wonderful game.
    Edited by TelexStar at 30/12/11 @ 17:43

  • Kostas #134 5 months ago

    - In Dark Souls, you come away having learnt the no doubt very sophisticated mechanics of yet another generic fantasy world. Oh look! A skeleton with a sword! Except the skeleton's really hard.

    It's elitism based on who has the most time to burn, ultimately. -

    Mate your got the whole thing wrong. Truly. Dark Souls -requires- you to learn the basics. If you feel you get pummeled to dust from mere skeletons and zombies then what can i say, you just learned that all your enemies must be there for you to just plow through with no resistance whatsoever.

    And truly, you say this a generic fantasy world? You got this from the first few hours of play? Elitism on whos got the most time to burn? Really? I got 2 characters in the game, one with 20 hours and one with 55 hours. Thats way less than what i would spend normally in an RPG game. Hardly elitism now is it?

  • vudude #135 5 months ago

    @Windypops

    If anything, the design choices show the developers have complete faith in the player's ability to learn and figure things out. Not arrogant at all. Do I agree with every design choice? No. I wish I could pause too. And I wish one of the NPCs would explain to me what humanity was. But these in no way ruined the game for me. It's a game to be explored and discovered, not presented to you. And sometimes people prefer to look stuff up instead because they are either short on time or don't want to miss any secrets. It's preference, not necessity.

    Dark Souls is one of those few RPGs you can play an hour at a time since it is more action focused. If you have been paying attention, you CAN stop and save anywhere in the game. The time commitment is no different than any other RPG. If you are short on time, maybe the logical thing to do is to NOT purchase the game? By the way, I noticed you own Skyward Sword - not exactly a game for someone with limited time and a girlfriend.
    Edited by vudude at 30/12/11 @ 18:51

  • TheMillionDollarMan #136 5 months ago

    Everybody hurts...take comfort in your friends!

  • Windypops #137 5 months ago

    @mcmothercruncher

    Oh dear. Do you recall telling me to "man up"? It's a few posts up if you've forgotten. You're suggesting I need to stop being a big pansy in order to play the game. You're associating being able to play the game with being more of a man, hence "misplaced machismo". Do keep up.

    @TelexStar

    I'd like to reply properly, but I'm replying to mcmothercruncher and your post is lost behind the reply bubble. I think you're doing the whole "bad design is subjective" thing, which is fair enough. I've just not heard a compelling argument in favour of the things i've criticised.

    @Kostas

    OK

    @vudude

    I suspect I may have traded Skyward Sword in quite soon after getting it as I have no recollection of playing it. Though you're quite right regarding Skyrim; I have put a fair chunk of time into that (despite wife, three kids, a dog and a cat). I've avoided mentioning it because I don't think the comparison is helpful. I want to enjoy Dark Souls, despite my protestations, and some of the more helpful comments on here have made me go back to it and make the effort. My main point, really, is that I shouldn't have to do that to enjoy something I've purchased.

    It reminds me of the interview Dara O'Briain did for - I think - Gameswipe, where he was talking about not being able to get past a certain point in Gears of War. His argument was that he'd paid for a pile of content that he simply couldn't get at because he was stuck and that this wasn't fair. I kind of agree with him.

  • Dangerous_Dan #138 5 months ago

    @SliderNL - There are various lobbies you can be connected to. If your friends don't see your sign you should set it anew after 30 seconds or so and hope you join the same lobby as your friend. I guess this could work better if you try to join in areas where there are not a lot of summon signs, maybe the game then actively searches for signs that are a match.
    Just a guess but if you still want to try, try to be like level 30 at the Taurus Demon level and try to summon them, there should be less people in that area with that char level - but that's just guesswork.

  • vudude #139 5 months ago

    @Windypops

    I think one complaint many people have with Dark Souls is the first portion of the game is like the hardest because you start as such a weakling. I think I replayed the Undead Burg area for a good 5 hours. But once you find new weapons and magic, and can upgrade your equipment the game gets really addicting. You start to notice how everything from the weight of your equipment to the length of your weapon affects combat.

    I wouldn't recommend Dark Souls to someone already playing Skyrim. I find with RPGs, I can only do one at a time since it usually takes like 5-10 hours for things to "click." You can beat most games in that amount of time. I played Dark Souls over the last 3 months and just now got Skyrim.
    Edited by vudude at 30/12/11 @ 20:01

  • Dangerous_Dan #140 5 months ago

    @Ostinato - Actually this 10 levels or 10& rule is not true for PvP. If you invade someone he will just be higher level than you, that's the only rule.
    I am at level 9 and I have invaded some players who are obviously in their NG+ or higher (have to be definitely, due to gear they can only get if they already defeated that particular area boss), and, have a much higher soul level due to the weapons and miracles and magic they are able to use.
    For assisting players it seems to be +/-15% as stated by the wiki.

  • TheMillionDollarMan #141 5 months ago

    Windy,

    I understand your issues with the game. As a Demons' Souls acolyte iI bullied my best mate into buying DS and he almost took it back. No explicit tutorial. No instructions. No idea! He's a skilled gamer, no doubt like yourself but he hated it but he persevered through the Burgh!
    He learnt, as we all do, from his mistakes and its community. Suddenly those initial stages could be speed ran and he had ownership of every step he took...nobody tells you anything...and it's then that the majesty of this game hooks you. Stick with it. Keep your shield up and never rush in. :)

  • vudude #142 5 months ago

    @Windypops

    On a side note, Geometry Wars 2 is like the best game ever! You play it over and over again and after a while, you notice little details like enemy patterns, how they make a different sound when they spawn, and how to increase your multiplier by circling the enemies around the gravity well before destroying it. None of this is really explained in the game, you just discover it from your own observations...kind of like Dark Souls.

  • Dangerous_Dan #143 5 months ago

    @Windypops - The thing with the pause button. Well if that is arrogant then it means designing the game with that kind of online aspect is arrogant. I don't see a way around this, either you have a pause button and no online feature or you have no pause button. The only thing I could imagine is, to have a pause button if you start the game offline.
    I think it's great that they didn't include the pause button - but that's just my elitist arrogant nature that is speaking now. haha

    What I do actually find interesting is, that you are obsessing so much about the bad design decisions of this game.
    They say the opposite of love is not hate but indifference - still, these design things are bothering you.

    Or is it the people who are so arrogant and silly, who defend these archaic design decisions that bother you?

    Or a third option the ghosts have angered you too much already...
    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 30/12/11 @ 20:36

  • Windypops #144 5 months ago

    @TheMillionDollarMan, @vudude

    I shall stick with it, shield aloft, and one day rediscover my testicles. Thanks :)

    @Dangerous_Dan

    I don't think I've accused anyone of elitism or arrogance other than the developer. I've tried to avoid any name calling and, apart from a bit of badinage with MrMonsterMunch up there, I think things have remained largely above the belt.

    My intention from the start was to provide a counterpoint to the article and express some of the frustration I was feeling at the game's early stages. I've said my piece and things have got a bit circular now.

    Anyway, I've pretty much lost this one since it looks like I'm going to carry on playing the damn thing. HAPPY NOW, BASTARDS?

  • mr2ange #145 5 months ago

    @Windypops Its ok man, just keep going, once you have walked a little further down the Dark Souls pathway, its very very hard to turn back.

  • Dangerous_Dan #146 5 months ago

    @Windypops Victory Achieved. ;)

    Agreed, it was largely above the belt and a challenging discussion - good.

  • SvennoJ #147 5 months ago

    @Dangerous_dan Are you sure about that +/-15% for co-op?
    I was going for the Belltower gargoyle and after a couple of tries I was getting the hang of staying behind it and was starting to get his health down, until a 2nd one unexpectedly showed up and fried me in one go.
    So I see a sign and think let's try co-op. The phantom runs up to the gargoyle, kills the first 1 in 2 hits not even trying to dodge and I didn't even get to see the 2nd one getting killed. His phantom was gone not 5 seconds after we got on the roof. "Victory achieved" That was the most disappointing part of the game so far, not tactics or skill just equipment and levels that do the work apparently.

    Maybe I screwed up my character by keeping him balanced? Is it better to specialize early in this game?
    Not knowing how anything works I've wasted many souls on buying things I can't use and I've also been raising my faith hoping I could cast the healing spell at some point, but I guess I need something special to cast it with?

    Plans for tonight are already laid out, back to the blacksmith for repairs and to the bell tower to buy purging stones, damn curse.

  • Slipstream #148 5 months ago

    @vudude I'm prepared for those who fish for backstabs. The moment it becomes apparent that this what they're doing they will enjoy a 50 faith Wrath of the Gods to the face.

  • Arsecake_Baker #149 5 months ago

    Edited by Arsecake_Baker at 31/12/11 @ 04:27

  • vudude #150 5 months ago

    @Arsecake_Baker

    Damn, the dude doesn't even use a shield. What was his final playthrough time?

  • Dangerous_Dan #151 5 months ago

    @SvennoJ I have soul level 9 in one character and I kill the bell gargoyle with my lightning + 5 longsword in 4 hits and I have 10 strength and 12 dexterity - but elemental weapons have a fixed high damage without stats bonus. If I had a Claymore, which I could easily have skilled for at soul level 9 - if I'd have wanted too - I would eat them with 2 blows, just like the Carpa Demon - the one guy I assisted didn't even get to kill one of the attack dogs, the Carpa was down in literally 3 seconds.

    Not a testament to my skill but to getting a powerful elemental weapon and returning at still low level for co-op in early sections.

    This imbalance of the elemental weapons destroys parts of the early PvE. In NG+ the cards are shuffled again but the NG early part is not meant for co-op because of such episodes.

    I think they should introduce some sort of requirement for high level elemental weapons, like you need a certain soul level to use a +3 lightning and so forth.
    This and the dark wood grain ring leads to low level poise tanks with huge elemental weapons destroying a lot of PvP.
    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 31/12/11 @ 08:06

  • eminusx #152 5 months ago

    @Arsecake_baker

    That guy is fkkin amazin. Missin half the fun if you speedrun through though so im perfectly happy with my 'easy does it', tip-toe method, not like i have a choice really! :-)

    someone said earlier about level design. . . watch that series of vids if you have time but check how each distinct area flows seamlessly into the next and the variety of imagination that is on offer, the interlocking verticality in the levels is such an amazing piece of game design, each zone is intricately woven into the next and flows beautifully in all directions, personally, I haven't seen it done any better than DS anywhere else!

    Couple that with the depth of combat, intrepid exploring and the palpable dread instilled by the save or persevere mechanic and DS is an utter monster of a game! Possibly one of the best ive ever played in my 30 years of gaming, which is really saying something!
    Edited by eminusx at 31/12/11 @ 08:04

  • Dangerous_Dan #153 5 months ago

    @vudude about 1h and 30min.
    There is ony guy exploiting a glitch doing it in about 27min.

  • Gecks #154 5 months ago

    Re: co-op match-making. I'm not sure how it works but I would say that equipment level quickly becomes more important than soul-level, so if it's based on the latter then it's feasible that someone can be your soul level, but several times more powerful.

    I think you could probably complete the game at level 20ish, if you just spent all your points on equipment/weapon upgrades, pyromancy, etc.

  • Dangerous_Dan #155 5 months ago

    @Gecks You can complete the game at soul level 1, if, you start as a pyromancer ;) - everybody else is already higher level.

    And if you are level 20 and invested in the right stats it's actually not difficult.
    Of course all that if you leveled your gear accordingly.
    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 31/12/11 @ 09:34

  • SvennoJ #156 5 months ago

    @Dangerous_Dan I didn't have better then a reinforced club at the time. Then I used all my titanite to get it to +5 and I finally found something better.

    I started a new game using some tips, I'm almost back to where I was in 1 night.
    It's more fun with a sword, thrust attack is much better then clubbing. I still don't do a lot of damage, 37 thrust dmg against the knights back in the undead asylum. I got them down eventually with the 8 pyromancy hits I have and another 15 thrust strikes, patiently waiting and dodging until the right opening. One hit from him takes 70% of my health. It took a couple of tries and resulted in a 15 minute battle in the end, but way more fun then the boss battles so far.

  • TrevHead #157 5 months ago

    Tips for DS noobs and will make the game so much easier

    -Even though pyromancy has been nerfed in patch 1.5, the pyro is THE character for the early game. Faith is best for PvP imo.

    -Dont bother farming souls and creating a Jack of all trades ballanced character (unless its NG+) its a waste of skill points and can ruin PVP and Co-op since you can only summon players who are near youre level. Either youre too weak compared to others or youre too high a level to find others in the same area youre at (DS wiki has some stats for the avg level most characters at at certain stages)

    - Instead pick one type of magic and ignore the rest. Although low level socery can be useful early in the game. Pyros spend your souls upgrading the glove. Best to level up stamina and vitality. it makes combat so much easier.

    - Master Key is THE starting item to pick imo.

    - Grab the Dragon / Drake sword it makes the early game so much easier. Then grab the lightning spear and Quelags Firesword. Use fire (best on undead), Lighting and other enchanted weapons carry one of each type.

    - Grab a shield that blocks 100% of damage asap or learn to parry. When in combat lower your shield to recharge your stamina, dont fight with no stamina! (farm the hollow soldiers for a hollow soldier shield and helmet)

    -Poise is important, if you are always getting staggered when taking hits even with your shield raised, you poise stat is too low

    - Aggro one enemy at a time, makes the game much easier, the bow is great for this.

    - Keep your weight below 50%, best to be nimble and not a slow tank imo. Dont bother wearing a complete armour set. Best to wear differnt types. IE a heavy helmet and gloves (stoneware helmet rocks and adds poise (and gloves if you can) with gold hemmed armour for poison protection (torso) Crimson armour for curse (leggings). Wear the wolf ring if you need a boost in poise when fighting giants. For the stating game wear the pyro armour with a helmet and gloves for a heavy armour set for poise.

    - Use the terrain to your advantage and fight at a range if you are having a hard time with hand to hand. The enemy AI while good isnt perfect and sometimes climbing starts shooting once and jumping off before the baddy closes in is usefull (rinse and repeat) usefull for the carpra deamon and the second black knight

    - Keeping atleast 1 humanity is usefull for farming as your get a boost to the drop percentage

    - Kindle most bonfires atleast once. Kindle the lordstar hub bonfires to max

    - Grab the lordstar asap it saves on legwork

    - Grab the curse ring (or atleast some armour that gives curse protection) Curse ring is in the New londo Ruins. You dont need to fight the ghosts just use a map and dash through the stage for it.

    - When farming best to do it in an area you havnt killed the boss as you will get humanity every so often. Killing Rats in the Depths is a good sourse of huminty.

    - shooting the tails of bosses often drops weapons. IE the dragon in the undead burg drops the drake sword (shoot the tail with the bow and arrow from under the bridge.

    - I havnt used them myself but I hear that katanas are better than swords as they cause bleeding. Me I like something like a long sword that has both swing and thrust (baddies can be weak to certain attack types). Use spears or short swords in narrow corridors

    - Every boss has a weakness (fire, bleeding, lightning etc)

    I was only ment to put a few pointers but i got carried away lol.
    Edited by TrevHead at 01/01/12 @ 07:59

  • Lunatic4ever #158 5 months ago

    I totally respect players loving this game but for me the respawning really ruins the game. And I'm not saying this because back in the days it was okay and now we moved on...nope. I never liked respawning and never accepted in videogames. It always ruined the atmosphere of games for me. You try so hard to clear an area and yes it's fun and then you die and you have got to do it again,and again,and again. Some say "then don't die" but the game is definetely based on trial and error. You have to play it perfectly in order to work for you and I just don't think that this should be the essence of a videogame. But, of course there is a wonderful appeal to Dark Souls. The atmosphere is amazing and I wish I could enjoy it as much as others do :S

  • Lunatic4ever #159 5 months ago

    @Architect_z
    I love it how everyone keeps saying "It's not unfair because every time you die it's your fault". Well this applies to most games I played over the past years. You never just die from standing around but rather from being at the wrong place at the wrong time,doing the wrong thing. So I don't see why this is something special in Dark Souls

  • BillyBrush #160 5 months ago

    Well i get a weird little visual glitch before it loads up...which is admittedly nothing (is that just my copy?)...and the framerate is patchy, and not just in blighttown.

    It is a pretty good game, but i think it seems to bring out the worst in a lot of people in that...it has to be teh best game ever or they won't accept your views...it's got a few flaws, that just can't be papered over...merely spinning the camera around is often enough to highlight the main one.

  • vudude #161 5 months ago

    @Lunatic4ever

    You obviously don't know what you are talking about. In a usual RPG, everything is based on stats so sometimes you'll die because you aren't at a high enough level to beat a certain boss. And every other game, the difficulty is so cheap you wouldn't even be able to beat the game if there weren't a checkpoint every 2 minutes. As the above video demonstrates, you can beat Dark Souls with skill alone without gaining a single level.
    Edited by vudude at 31/12/11 @ 20:02

  • SvennoJ #162 5 months ago

    @Vudude that;s nonsense. Equipment and equipment upgrades are basically the same as upgrading your level. And in DS they are a lot more important then your level. You can level all you want, but now try to finish the game with your starting equipment without upgrading that a single time. Skill in DS is finding the right items and upgrades, either by using a guide or painful trial and error.

    What took me 20 hours the first time, took only 4 the 2nd time after I followed a tip to get the master key starting gift and grab Astora's sword and dragon shield. It's a different game when you can block 100% and kill in 1 hit.

  • Dangerous_Dan #163 5 months ago

    If you have to hit an enemy 2 times to kill him or 50 times is a big difference in skill if one blow from him kills you. You can play through 98% of the encounters in Dark Souls with one health point but the skill and precision you need would be godlike.
    The skill argument is not wrong after all because if you have no skill you will die in many encounters although your char is maxed out with skill and equipment.

    But also equipment makes you much stronger and is everything in PvP where lag prevents often perfect evasive skills and hard hitting prevails.

    @Lunatic4ever What does unfair mean in context of a video game? Someone with average skills should in 90% of the cases deal properly with an ingame situation?
    I don't understand what fair would be...
    End of segment.


    Some people have to win - all the time.
    I get bored by winning too much and I get weak, careless, indifferent. Dark Souls is not difficult if you have learned about it - it doesn't require cat like reflexes but what it does demand is usually respect and a careful approach.
    I see some people playing this game like the usual unmotivated hack n slash and they die, no wonder they are frustrated, they would have to change and I think most don't have the wish to do that.

    It's all fine though, it's not for everyone - what the f*** is the problem with that? What a communist/1984 nightmare. (not directed at one specific person)
    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 01/01/12 @ 02:54

  • mr2ange #164 5 months ago

    @Lunatic4ever Tell me the name of a great, recent, open world game where NO enemies respawn.

    Oh yes... There aren't any, because it would be a shit boring open pointless world once you go through it once.

  • mr2ange #165 5 months ago

    @Lunatic4ever "I love it how everyone keeps saying "It's not unfair because every time you die it's your fault". Well this applies to most games I played over the past years. You never just die from standing around but rather from being at the wrong place at the wrong time,doing the wrong thing. So I don't see why this is something special in Dark Souls"

    Actually, its pretty hard to die in most games now, because all you do it sit back and wait for 5 seconds and Ka-Ching! your health has magically returned...

    I fucking hate that shit, ooh i've not been a total dick for 5 seconds, here you are have a full health bar again. Dogshit of the modern gaming world.

  • SvennoJ #166 5 months ago

    Dark souls plays a lot like a single player version of Everquest, just as obscure and unforgiving, relying on gear and learning patterns and level layouts.
    It's a lot more fair then EQ though. No deaths simply by zoning in at the wrong time, or from someone else's mistakes, or from lag/disconnects/server crashes. You keep all your inventory when you die, and it doesn't take your (spent) xp away and eventually de-level you.

    There are still cheap deaths, like the floor suddenly collapsing under you, falling into a pit with a still unbeatable monster but surviving just long enough so your retrieval orb stays down there. Bye bye saved up humanity.

    It would be nice if DS explains itself a bit better in some areas. It relies too much on other people leaving random clues but restricts the available communication to be wary of left and praise the sun type stuff.

    "You never just die from standing around but rather from being at the wrong place at the wrong time,doing the wrong thing."
    Actually you do in DS, I was simply standing at the bonfire getting a drink, when I got back someone had invaded and killed me.
    The game doesn't tell you what the wrong place is. Every time you see a white wall, make sure you spend your saved souls before entering.

  • TrevHead #167 5 months ago

    But the fact that DS doesnt explain itself is what makes the game so fun for many who love it, in that its mentally stimulating which so many modern games are lacking since everything is sign posted to the player.

    So many mainsteam games have a really slow difficulty curve, in that the game starts off assuming that the player has never played a video game before and doesnt get intresting until 1/3rd or 1/2 way into the game. Most game designers drip feed new actions and abilities to the player in an effort to keep them intrested because its lacking in other aspects to keep the player intrested.

    One of the best aspects of DS and other oldschool games is that they are made for ppl who are expeienced in games (IE most gamers) and assumes that players have a certain level of skill, which is great for those of us who get bored to tears until the game starts to get intresting hours into the game.

    Personally I blame ingame tutorials that have slowly morphed to be the 1/3 of the game, its much better when games have a seperate tutorial level that most of us can skip without missing out any of the plot.

    For games like DS (at the undead burg) and other oldschool games like shmups and fighters they all have that intial "man up and get over it" where the player has to use their own brain to discover how not to suck and. Anyone needing extra help can look to the internet IE forums, FAQs, You Tube to learn 2 play.

  • JawzPause #168 5 months ago

    Ever since the infamous Uncharted 3 review, i have taken a liking to Simon as his articles are written like no others. He saw past the hype of Uncharted 3 and wrote down flaws of the game that i never noticed.
    Brilliantly written article, as per usual with Simon Parkin.
    :)

  • quadfather #169 5 months ago

    Cracking article.

    And possibly one of the most superlative games ever created.

  • Squidgywidgywoo #170 5 months ago

    I still haven't developed a Dark Souls boner. Hopefully I'll get aroused if I stick with it for a few more hours.

  • Seoh #171 5 months ago

    @furrykitty

    I think Dark souls is a Fairer game than demons souls though, the regenerating health potions, no wt cap on non equiped items and the bonfire system is a better approach.