The cycling thread Page 222

  • Page

    of 356 First / Last

  • elstoof 16 May 2013 08:48:29 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    So, the seed of doubt is currently trying to germinate... I've always ridden with a fairly high saddle and a lot of bar drop - its never been something I've considered unusual or uncomfortable. I've never had a "bike fit" either, my first dealing in this area was a brief check over when I got my current ride looked at to guage what frame to order. A minute or two on the turbo later and apparently my position looks like it should be painful, my hoods are where my drops should be, that much drop would be aggressive on a TT, how long can you stay there for, knee bend is only about 20% etc - when downforce on a back below horizontal was brought up I stopped taking note but it did get me thinking - perhaps my saddle is bit high.. I looked over a few formulas and recommendations and it seems I'm currently at least 5cm over any formula, and people like Hogg claim that most riders are too high up. So how do you all set up your saddle height? I dropped mine as an experiment by a cm and it felt ridiculous, like I was on a toddlers bike sitting bolt upright, I don't see how I could even begin ride another 4cm lower than that. I'm in two minds whether to persevere though and see what happens when I get acustomed to it though.
  • elstoof 16 May 2013 08:49:47 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    Wall of text! Apologies.
  • pistol 16 May 2013 08:58:16 13,019 posts
    Seen 9 months ago
    Registered 12 years ago
    elstoof wrote:
    So, the seed of doubt is currently trying to germinate... I've always ridden with a fairly high saddle and a lot of bar drop - its never been something I've considered unusual or uncomfortable. I've never had a "bike fit" either, my first dealing in this area was a brief check over when I got my current ride looked at to guage what frame to order. A minute or two on the turbo later and apparently my position looks like it should be painful, my hoods are where my drops should be, that much drop would be aggressive on a TT, how long can you stay there for, knee bend is only about 20% etc - when downforce on a back below horizontal was brought up I stopped taking note but it did get me thinking - perhaps my saddle is bit high.. I looked over a few formulas and recommendations and it seems I'm currently at least 5cm over any formula, and people like Hogg claim that most riders are too high up. So how do you all set up your saddle height? I dropped mine as an experiment by a cm and it felt ridiculous, like I was on a toddlers bike sitting bolt upright, I don't see how I could even begin ride another 4cm lower than that. I'm in two minds whether to persevere though and see what happens when I get acustomed to it though.
    Why do you have bars so low?

    What sort of riding do you do, just for pleasure, Sportives? I'm assuming you don't race as most people that do will have had a few bike fits. What sort of distances do you do?
  • elstoof 16 May 2013 09:38:55 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    I have them that low because that's the most comfortable place I've found in my years of tinkering with position. I didn't even realise they would be considered low as I don't go by any measurements. I ride for pleasure, and do all sorts of distances, 4-5 hours in the drops isn't an issue comfort wise and I don't place much weight on my hands generally.
  • Salaman 16 May 2013 09:56:12 19,061 posts
    Seen 51 minutes ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    elstoof wrote:
    So, the seed of doubt is currently trying to germinate... I've always ridden with a fairly high saddle and a lot of bar drop - its never been something I've considered unusual or uncomfortable. I've never had a "bike fit" either, my first dealing in this area was a brief check over when I got my current ride looked at to guage what frame to order. A minute or two on the turbo later and apparently my position looks like it should be painful, my hoods are where my drops should be, that much drop would be aggressive on a TT, how long can you stay there for, knee bend is only about 20% etc - when downforce on a back below horizontal was brought up I stopped taking note but it did get me thinking - perhaps my saddle is bit high.. I looked over a few formulas and recommendations and it seems I'm currently at least 5cm over any formula, and people like Hogg claim that most riders are too high up. So how do you all set up your saddle height? I dropped mine as an experiment by a cm and it felt ridiculous, like I was on a toddlers bike sitting bolt upright, I don't see how I could even begin ride another 4cm lower than that. I'm in two minds whether to persevere though and see what happens when I get acustomed to it though.
    Book some time in a wind tunnel. You'll have it sussed in no time.
    ;-)
  • Psychotext 16 May 2013 09:57:40 54,200 posts
    Seen 9 hours ago
    Registered 8 years ago
    Talking of position, was driving to a trail the other day when I saw someone pedalling on a road bike with their knees basically out sideways. I don't know what they'd got wrong, but they'd got it MAJORLY wrong. :D
  • elstoof 16 May 2013 10:00:37 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    Must have had his heels on the pedals, that just shouldn't be possible otherwise. Your heels would hit the frame.
  • MikeP 16 May 2013 10:24:57 1,867 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 11 years ago
    Some thoughts from me, but if you really want to have a dig about then a professional fit is most definitely recommended.

    I was very happy with the people I went to, and I can give you their details if you like.

    The amount of drop you can run, and the height of the saddle, is determined by a load of factors including core strength, back strength and flexibility, hamstring flexibility and obviously the actual length (absolute and relative) of your arms, legs and torso.

    If you can ride in comfort for 4-5 hours in the drops with that level of difference then it sounds like you're in decent condition. The knee angle you can cope with (i.e. how straight your leg is) is partially determined by hamstring flex. Cancellara has a super-high saddle & straight leg, but apparently he is very very flexible, so can handle it.

    Before I started my winter of of core and flexibility work I had 117-120 degrees of movement in my hamstrings. Now, it's over 140, and I'm continuing to work on that.

    I've been able to put the saddle up 1.5cm and drop the bars significantly as a result. The change in position also means I can better recruit more muscles when I ride, so I can go longer with less fatigue.

    There's a huge range in physiological capability on the bike, but if you can ride the way you want, at the speed you want, without feeling complaints in your back, neck or knees then you're probably not far off.

    Do you do any other forms of exercise, out of interest?

    PSN ID: Mikenetic

  • elstoof 16 May 2013 10:38:56 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    I used to do a lot of weight training, for definition rather than bulk. I don't have time or inclination for the gym anymore so I do kettle bell training 4 times a week or so for 30 minute sessions. This is good for the core I find as with a single bell you're often unbalanced and need to activate your core to maintain form, also I work the hams with a few excercises like straight leg dead lifts and windmills. All of this is low weight stuff, high reps and low recovery time, mainly back, shoulder, and leg work with the core utilised for all of it.
  • Psychotext 16 May 2013 10:39:03 54,200 posts
    Seen 9 hours ago
    Registered 8 years ago
    How do you test your flexibility? I'm interested as I'm a bendy bastard. :D
  • MikeP 16 May 2013 10:44:09 1,867 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 11 years ago
    @Psychotext You get an exercise physiologist to bend you about while using fancy protractors called goniometers. Plus other tortures.

    @Elstoof - sounds like that sort of routine is going to have a really beneficial effect. One thing I was told was that cycling tends to result in shortened hamstrings due to a tendency to overdevelop the quads and it's a form of exercise that doesn't use full leg extension. Anything that compensates for that is going to help.

    Edited by MikeP at 10:44:33 16-05-2013

    PSN ID: Mikenetic

  • Psychotext 16 May 2013 10:47:10 54,200 posts
    Seen 9 hours ago
    Registered 8 years ago
    Sounds sexy. Where can I find one of these physiologist fellows?
  • MikeP 16 May 2013 11:21:42 1,867 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 11 years ago
    If you get a fellow you're doing it wrong. :)

    PSN ID: Mikenetic

  • elstoof 16 May 2013 11:30:32 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    The bigger and more specialist LBS's usually have someone on hand for that sort of thing, but there's a hundred different schools of thought available. There's several places in London like CycleFit or Le Beau Velo, don't know what you'd have local to you. It's big business, people travel from all over the world to see people like Steve Hogg in Australia.

    Thanks for the consultation though guys, I think I'll stick with what I know for now as it seems to work well enough, just needed to put the doubt to rest I guess. If you ask this sort of thing on a cycling forum you either get the slamyourstem crowd or militant 109%'ers chiming in.
  • MikeP 16 May 2013 11:52:40 1,867 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 11 years ago
    elstoof wrote:
    If you ask this sort of thing on a cycling forum you either get the slamyourstem crowd or militant 109%'ers chiming in.
    Indeed. Which is why the EG cycling group may be small, but it's perfectly formed :p

    Interesting that you mention Le Beau Velo, that's where I went. Mal is the guy who does the fits, but he works alongside a woman called Jo McRae, who's been helping me with my conditioning.

    PSN ID: Mikenetic

  • elstoof 16 May 2013 12:03:31 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    They came to mind as I recall a fiting that was covered on road.cc a while back, before they did a Viner review. It was some Italian guy doing that fitting though, unless they italianed him up to add some gravitas to the article :D
  • gang_of_bitches 16 May 2013 17:00:14 5,558 posts
    Seen 6 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    elstoof wrote:
    Must have had his heels on the pedals, that just shouldn't be possible otherwise. Your heels would hit the frame.
    Being a fat bugger my left leg tends to hang out to to the left unless i consciously hold it in. It's entirely possible, just not desirable.

    To elaborate- if anything I have my cleats towards the toe end of my shoe but the bend comes from the ankle and the hip.

    Can't think of any names but you see the odd pro who certainly has a slightly knee out riding position.

    Edited by gang_of_bitches at 17:12:13 16-05-2013
  • gang_of_bitches 16 May 2013 17:02:10 5,558 posts
    Seen 6 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    Hope it doesn't constitute a spoiler for those who haven't seen today's highlights but they're now saying Wiggins has an infection/bad cold that's hampering his performance.
  • Psychotext 16 May 2013 17:09:25 54,200 posts
    Seen 9 hours ago
    Registered 8 years ago
    They said that yesterday in fairness... so any bad performance today (I've not seen it) was covered in advance. ;)
  • gang_of_bitches 16 May 2013 17:13:49 5,558 posts
    Seen 6 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    @Psychotext

    Phew. Only saw the highlights yesterday and wasn't paying much attention.
  • elstoof 16 May 2013 18:18:48 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    Well covered indeed.
  • Trafford 16 May 2013 18:21:56 5,791 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 6 years ago
    A bit late to the bike set up conversation.
    I've got dirt drops on both my 29ers, the traditional position here is saddle nearly level with the drop. It looks weird, but comfy as hell.
  • pistol 16 May 2013 21:57:06 13,019 posts
    Seen 9 months ago
    Registered 12 years ago
    MikeP wrote:
    elstoof wrote:
    If you ask this sort of thing on a cycling forum you either get the slamyourstem crowd or militant 109%'ers chiming in.
    Indeed. Which is why the EG cycling group may be small, but it's perfectly formed :p

    Interesting that you mention Le Beau Velo, that's where I went. Mal is the guy who does the fits, but he works alongside a woman called Jo McRae, who's been helping me with my conditioning.
    I know Le Beau Velo if you're talking about the guys near Liverpool St. Occasionally Dr Garry Palmer uses their facilities to test athletes and I've been tested there. Google him.
  • elstoof 16 May 2013 22:55:29 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    So Wiggins will most likely be pulling out of the Giro if his chest infection doesn't clear it seems, thats the current possibility thrown up by the team and they have a habit of easing these types of announcements out. Shame really, some media camps are claiming there's no point in him carrying on - I would disagree with that, they've got a team member in a decent position to mount a challenge so I would want to stay and back Uran up once healthy if it were me. Millar did as much a few years ago on the tour with a dose Delhi Belly.
  • urban 17 May 2013 11:05:35 10,945 posts
    Seen 2 days ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    I'm so fucking clumsy, yet another fall last night. Slightly drunk, really gotta stop doing that but I fell because there was unexpected roadworks dotted around The London Wall, approaching the lights at the crossroad for Moorgate (The Globe pub is on the corner)

    Cars set off and then braked suddenly and rather than smash into the back of one of them I braked too but couldn't unclip fast enough and just toppled, couple of scrapes and a bruised ego.

    Least a motorist asked if I was ok!
  • Psychotext 17 May 2013 11:06:17 54,200 posts
    Seen 9 hours ago
    Registered 8 years ago
    elstoof wrote:
    So Wiggins will most likely be pulling out of the Giro if his chest infection doesn't clear it seems, thats the current possibility thrown up by the team and they have a habit of easing these types of announcements out.
    Called it.
  • elstoof 17 May 2013 11:11:13 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    :D

    My next call is for Brailsford to tell of the "tough lessons learned on the Giro that there's always the chance of losing the team leader" and announcing Froome and Wiggins co-leaders for the TdF to widen the options.
  • elstoof 17 May 2013 11:12:53 7,345 posts
    Seen 2 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    Could have been worse urban, you could have cycled straight into the lovely big hole dug for one of these unexpected roadworks.
  • Salaman 17 May 2013 11:22:49 19,061 posts
    Seen 51 minutes ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    elstoof wrote:
    Can't think of any names but you see the odd pro who certainly has a slightly knee out riding position.
    There's that French chap ... teammate of Voeckler at Europcar I think. Bouyer, possibly?

    He was getting himself some screen time in a breakaway in the classics a few weeks ago and was hilarious to watch.

    Edited by Salaman at 23:45:12 17-05-2013
  • urban 17 May 2013 11:38:00 10,945 posts
    Seen 2 days ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    @elstoof They actually just filled in a fucking grave on my home straight.

    I swear this thing was 2 foot deep and 3 foot long, it was a spectacular pothole...
  • Page

    of 356 First / Last

Log in or register to reply