Firelands raid will not be in WOW patch 4.1
Blizzard aims for smaller, more frequent patches.
Blizzard has told Eurogamer that the Firelands raid – the next tier of endgame raiding progression for the MMO – will not appear in the next patch, 4.1, as it had previously planned.
In an interview at the Game Developers Conference in San Francisco, lead producer J. Allen Brack said that players were not sufficiently advanced through the raid content that shipped with third expansion Cataclysm in December to handle the challenge of Firelands. He also suggested that Blizzard was thinking of creating "smaller" content patches for World of Warcraft.
"We feel like the player base isn't really ready for the next raid yet," he said. "And that led to some changes where Firelands is now actually going to be in 4.2."
"Our plan is to package... features into smaller content updates and to release them as soon as possible, rather than wait and release larger updates more infrequently," Blizzard added in a statement.
Firelands is a raid encounter on the Elemental Plane of Fire in which players will once again face Ragnaros, a boss made famous by the Molten Core raid in "classic" WOW. At its BlizzCon fan convention last year, Blizzard said that Firelands would appear in patch 4.1.
Patch 4.1 will now offer "a dungeon revamp, as opposed to an entirely new tier of content with an entirely new raid," Brack said. It will add two new Heroic dungeons for five level 85 players: new versions of the troll dungeons Zul'Aman and Zul'Gurub, previously small raid encounters for 10 players or more at lower levels.
The increased difficulty of raiding and Heroic dungeons in Cataclysm has come as a shock to the WOW community after the less challenging raid content in Lich King. Brack says it was a "conscious decision".
"One of our goals before Cataclysm was to make it a little bit harder than for Lich King," he said. "We feel like players were really able to be very successful very quickly and looking back, the way we handled the itemisation, we feel like we've learned some lessons from.
"In terms of whether it's the right difficulty, that's something that we evaluate on a pretty regular basis. Things have happened and we'll do tweaks and things to make things easier," he said. Asked if he was confident Blizzard had pitched raid difficulty right, Brack laughed, "Never. We're never confident... But so far we think we made the right decision."
The decision to move Firelands to 4.2 was also motivated by a desire to move away from the "monolithic" content patches World of Warcraft has received recently, towards smaller updates, Brack said.
"Tom [Chilton, lead designer] and I actually had a talk in January which was like, you know, our patches are getting so huge and so monolithic compared to the old days when you could just say, 'Hey, we're adding weather to these zones, go have fun.' And that was cool. Or, 'Hey, here's this one regular five-person dungeon. Great, go have fun.'"
"And now we're talking about always doing a raid, always doing a dungeon, always doing some single-player quest content, always doing some kind of daily quest hub with every single patch. And actually that in combination with the difficulty is sort of what led to doing 4.1 as just a dungeon revamp, as opposed to an entirely new tier of content with an entirely new raid.
"That's definitely something we're talking about – hey, it doesn't always have to be this huge monolith. It can be something just smaller."
Brack said that Blizzard was ready to listen to feedback. "I'm sure there'll be some grousing about the 4.1 decision, and if it ends up being the wrong decision, then we won't do it again, right? That's one of the nice things. We'll learn from this and make the right decision in 4.2."
After the interview, Blizzard gave Eurogamer the following statement about the decision to remove Firelands from patch 4.1.
"Patch 4.1 provides our players with access to the completely redesigned Zul'Aman and Zul'Gurub five-player dungeons, where they'll be able to experience challenging encounters featuring all-new boss mechanics, obtain updated epic-level loot, and possibly acquire rare mounts.
"One of our long-standing development goals is to release regular content updates for the community to enjoy. These updates are generally focused on introducing specific content, like a new raid or new gameplay features.
"Our plan is to package these features into smaller content updates and to release them as soon as possible, rather than wait and release larger updates more infrequently.
"The previously announced Firelands raid will be part of content update 4.2 which should come soon after 4.1.
"Our flexible approach to content updates allows us to release content like Zul'Aman and Zul'Gurub so that players will have new challenges to overcome (and loot to collect) until we're ready to unleash the Firelands.
"Our previous experience with content updates informed this decision. We feel like Call of the Crusade was released while raiders were still busy with Ulduar, which stamped out Ulduar raiding. We don't feel that Cataclysm needs a new raid tier just yet.
"Releasing an epic raid dungeon before its time would, in the words of Ragnaros himself, be 'too soon!'"
Brack indicated that patch 4.1 is roughly two months away. "We've started to put a build up on the PTR [Public Test Realm] so that players can take a look at it. Usually we're on the PTR for six to eight-ish weeks, plus or minus four weeks I would say. So that's probably where we are in terms of the development of 4.1."
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Comments (18) Latest comment 10 months ago
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This is a VERY GOOD THING.
Let me briefly explain why - the situation with guilds and players in World of Warcraft means that only a SMALL portion of the playerbase has seen and experienced more than the first couple of raid bosses. This was shockingly true of most of Wrath of the Lich King - Naxxramas was easy, but Ulduar - I was lucky to see the whole of that place before the Argent Colliseum came along. And a lot of people didn't get to fully appreciate that until Icecrown came along - there were three months between each patch, and unless you are a super hardcore raider (which I am not anymore, I found after five years that's not sustainable at this stage of my life) you didn't get to see the content.
What I applaud is the dungeons revamp and making it easier to get into the raids. Truth be told, I'd rather they didn't call this patch 4.1, but I suppose their crude and broken numbering system dictates them no other option. If they want people to see the content they have designed, they have to make sure it's available to more people with less grind. That is something that the hardcore would balk at, but then, they're going to have to accept they have had months of this content. Other people would like to see it now.
That said, I suspect the true reasonings are this;
1) It's not finished.
2) It's going to be very hard.
3) They still haven't figured out how to patch the game without breaking it in some way...
Me? Cynical? No, surely you must be mistaken?!
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I'd argue however that the heroic dungeons thing was a big mistake for them from the very off. It was way too love or hate, too Marmite. Couple that with their stance that heroics shouldn't reward epics (which I said in another WoW topic, is a mott issue when many of the initial raid bosses and Baradin Hold are laughably easier) and it was all a bit of a cock-up. 4.1 is their chance to put this right and start opening the content up.
Besides, there's far more than three raids in the game - and I always feel that guilds who focus far too much on being "first and best" are stressful affairs. I ran Karazhan on Wednesday evening with my guild - some brought along their alts, a couple of us brought along our 85s to offset the 71's and 75's. But we had fun, it was a laugh and we enjoyed it as an offnight of dicking about. This weekend, we're going to hit Black Temple for a laugh and see how quickly we can spank the place (getting a warglaive would be nice too I suppose
Of course, that said, this is a u-turn from the initial Cata stance of "we have to make the game harder". Blizzard aren't stupid - the userbase at large revolted over much of the Cata changes, and are going back to a mixture of TBC and Wrath-styles of content introduction. Is that a bad thing? Perhaps it is for the upper guilds - but then, you have heroic versions of those raids as well. And the number of users doing those is even less than the ones forging through the basic versions.
I don't think a new raid is necessary for the most part in 4.1 - but then, if they want to churn out content patches faster, how long will we wait for 4.2? I think I'll wait and see, because if they give it another couple of months I'll admit they're slowing down and thinking more about players and content... if it's a matter of weeks, well...
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There actually is a decent amount of endgame content *right now*, the question is more whether that will still be true in 3-5 months. Very few guilds have cleared all content (that being all 14 raid bosses on Heroic setting), but even those that haven't will be bored of trying in a couple of months.
6-8 weeks for this patch to be tested, then two more weeks for the next one to hit PTR, then another 6-8 weeks for that to be tested. The first tier of Cataclysm raids will be getting very repetitive by then.
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If you are at step 1 and step 4 is released, why does that suddenly mean you can't or shouldn't do step 2 and 3?
'If they want people to see the content they designed', they should educate players on not being idiots and feeling like they have to be in the latest raid purely because it is there. Finish what you are bloody doing and if a new one is put in front of you while you are going up the ladder, bonus! your haven't had to wait for a length of time before you can progress.
They never should have got rid of attunements. Forcing you to have done the previous stages before you can play the next one was a good thing, rather than just farming the the new badges released with the raid to skip out huge sections of game...and then complaining about it.
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They just need to slow the fuck down a bit, and so do most raiding guilds. Raids need to be meatier when they are introduced (like Ulduar was) and the playerbase need more than 12-14 sodding weeks between patches. You shouldn't be expected to rush through raid content and heroic modes in that time. What does that prove? That you spend more time raiding than enjoying the game as a whole? Congratulations, you have missed the point.
It's not enjoyable when you are being forced to rush-rush-rush content. I said this back in WotLK and I'm sorta glad they're seeing sense - there's no need for a new raid every three months, especially when you end up with Icecrown Citadel - which we had for over a year, and got bored of it.
They're just going to spread the content out a bit. Don't misunderstand, I want bigger and BETTER raids, but equally I don't want it to be a bumrush to get firsts, or get them finished before the next tier of content is thrown out. In short, both Blizzard and the players of WoW need to take a chillpill, slow down and enjoy the game - otherwise we're all going to be suffering burnout.
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At least, that's what I'm hoping.
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If Blizzard released a new raid every week there is absolutely nothing forcing you to go through them at any particular pace, except the cross on your own back.
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I don't like feeling that that I can't experience the rest of the game just because I don't play it enough for other people's standards.
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Also the difficulty is based on rote learning not hardness. Knowing to move away when Boss X does Y is not challenging its simply a learning task and really not fun.
Blizzard's policy of rampant gear inflation was a disaster in Lich King and destroyed Ulduar raiding, which was a terrible shame since it was a fantastic raid. If they kept the item level movement to a minimum between raid tiers you would keep relevance, and also allow casual to experience more of the game through pugs.
Finally the end game zones are rubbish when compared to all previous WoW expansions. You need a decent over world.
Ive cancelled my sub and am going to try Rift, and continue messing around in LOTR online, while waiting for Guild Wars II.
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Pick a different game.
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I see what you are saying, but this is how Blizzard have set raiding up - in Vanilla and TBC, it was a case of doing it for the love of it. When they removed attunements and added access to top-ilvl tier epics, that became the point they ACTIVELY ENCOURAGED what he have now - a game where only the newest content matters. Blizzard have actively encouraged and throughout Wrath, they nurtured that attitude - the fruits those seeds have born are not sweet at all.
I do raiding for the lulz, I will do any old raid because hey, I was there in the olden days and in my old-age in WoW I'd like to share that love with other people. But you and I Shika are a minority in the game - I was hardcore, I know their attitude and I know they still exist. I defected to casual because simply the frequency of raids was too much - you did need to do four or five nights a week for twelve weeks to do normal content and have a hope at doing some heroic content.
I don't have that kind of time on my hands anymore. I used to, but now I don't. WoW does sometimes suffer from split personality - it never knows if it wants to be easier for people to get into or harder to sate the hardcore. After all this time, that is the games biggest failing - it still doesn't quite know who or what it should be targetting, so we've had the hard part and in 4.1, it gets easier for people - much to the disgust of the hardcore, who already have begun to bitch and moan about it.
They have bred a raiding system which is always making the previous version obsolete - ironically, I found in the old days some of the better raid gear was found in earlier raids. My hunter needed some bits and bobs from SSC, my rogue made use for ages of Lantro's Sword from bloody Black Morass - I didn't have much of a choice of offhand sword back then as a combat rogue. We used old gear - now old gear is made obsolete, people only look at the new current shiny stuff as a guide.
But Blizzard only have themselves to blame. We said it in Wrath that they should have slowed down - we should have had months more time with Ulduar, it was and still is a glorious example of raid design... but no. Blizzard tried to rush guilds through it so they could get out their next bit of content and ilvl gear (which I believe wasn't in any way worth the rush).
Blizzard have made lots of mistakes - I fear in Wrath their biggest and most unforgivable mistake was letting GearScore survive for as long as it did. It was a symptom of where Blizzard were going, but never as obvious or as annoying. People only really cared about higher numbers, not skill or talent or if the person was nice and friendly. They just wanted big numbers.
And now we have a game where the current devteam on WoW has realised they have to slow down a bit...
... the question is, after two years at full throttle, are the playerbase they have been taking for a ride really that keen for them to hit the brakes? Time will tell, but I fear not...
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If you were able to read my comment in full you would see that is exactly what i have done, muppet.
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Yeah, thats what all veterans have done. Mostly newbs playing now...