Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots Review

By Oli Welsh Published 30 May, 2008

Going out with a bang.

Version tested: PlayStation 3

Metal Gear Solid has always been a love it or hate it proposition. Millions love it for its involved, conspiratorial plotting, its arch sense of humour, its demanding stealth gameplay, its sprawling cinematic ambition, its preposterous stylishness and pretensions toward artistic weight. Millions hate it for exactly the same reasons.

Then there are those - this reviewer included - for whom Metal Gear Solid is a love it and hate it proposition. Flawed, intractable, unspeakably tedious at times, and yet blessed with incredible production values, imaginative design, and a brilliant, brave willingness to think and do the unexpected and impossible. At times they're barely videogames at all, but they're capable of moments of pure videogame genius, joy and shock that few other series can match.

So how do you review a new Metal Gear Solid? Do you assess it on its own terms, ones that its legion of fans will understand? Do you play the sceptic, and take Hideo Kojma and his team to task for their stubborn refusal to catch up with what the rest of the world expects of a videogame? Or do you walk the path of compromise, down the middle?

Well, if there's one thing Metal Gear Solid 4 isn't, it's compromising. Kojima has barred no holds in an extraordinary, kitchen-sink finale to the Solid Snake story. Plausibility is stretched to extremes as every character you can think of (and several you never would) makes a cameo appearance in this melancholy epic. Features that would be a tent-pole selling-point for other games are frittered away as Easter eggs and one-shot surprises. Such is the luxurious length and mind-numbing detail of the cut-scenes and codec conversations that you could put the pad down for almost half the game's ample length. (One character actually asks you to do so at one point, resulting in a typically self-aware and genuinely hilarious joke.)

'Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots' Screenshot 1

They tell us not to spoil the game in reviews, then they release this shot. Just use your imaginations, okay?

There's almost too much going on. With a see-sawing episodic rhythm that visits some starkly different locations and play styles, a wealth of incidental and hidden detail, more gameplay mechanics than you can fully explore in a single playthrough - and above all, an epic, elegiac, arcane storyline that seeks to tie up every last loose thread and honour the passing of a classic videogame hero - Metal Gear Solid 4 is, in most senses, the biggest Metal Gear yet. But the best? Maybe not. If the super-slick thriller of the first Metal Gear Solid remains Kojima's masterpiece, then this operatic monster is his magnum opus.

Guns of the Patriots tells the story of Old Snake, the prematurely ageing, terminally ill and newly moustachioed covert agent, as he hunts down his genetically-engineered twin brother and nemesis, Liquid Snake (now inhabiting the body of Revolver Ocelot, of course, but we must gloss over such details or we'll still be here next week). Liquid is attempting to subvert and destroy the ruling Patriot conspiracy and bring the world - currently overrun with mood-controlled private armies fighting meaningless wars in the name of the war economy - into chaos.

'Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots' Screenshot 2

A series known for its quality mullets delivers its finest yet.

Even keen students of Metal Gear lore are going to struggle to follow this tangled tale. Laden with sentimental sermons and metaphors for the evils of war, struggling under the weight of the resolving the plots of four previous games and the personal destinies of characters as diverse as Raiden, Meryl, Naomi, Vamp and Eva, it is in all honesty a mess. Motivation and consistency fall by the wayside and by the end it's totally unclear who is on which side, or what's at stake. Maybe that's deliberate, but it doesn't work, and the hours of talking-head exposition involved are too steep a price to pay for this muddled closure.

But that's just the plot. There's another side to this story, and it's the one told by the game's locations, action and dramatic high-points - and in some cases, by moments between its handsome, expressive and earnestly-voiced cast of virtual actors. This story is, by contrast, a richly satisfying success. Tune out the details, and Guns of the Patriots is a properly gripping yarn, full of thrills, spectacle, laughs, and even tenderness and pathos. You won't understand, but you will care.

Design-wise, MGS4 is mostly a refinement of what's gone before. The new gadgets are superb, the weapons are expertly realised and much easier to get hold of, and there are always plenty of options, even if stealth is still usually the best of them. Hand-to-hand combat feels more natural. The environments are more complex, but nothing like as large or open as you might expect, and this is still a linear game.

Only the new Stress and Psyche meters don't really gel with the flow of play; we suspect they come into their own in the highest difficulty settings, but at that level, Metal Gear Solid 4 is an exercise in teeth-grinding masochism for specialists only. Metal Gear Solid has always been either too easy or too hard, and too possible to get through by sloppy cheating or simple attrition, and that hasn't changed.

The first act is a tense infiltration of a war-torn Middle Eastern city, terrorised by the creepy Gekko biomechs and Liquid's personal guard, the sinister Frogs. The new enemies are great fun to gun down and outwit, and the sense of being part of a live battle-zone with several factions in play - as opposed to playing lone wolf against the guards - adds terrific atmosphere to the Metal Gear experience, even if it doesn't exactly revolutionise it.

'Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots' Screenshot 3

It's the toes that get us.

It's everything you've seen, heard about and expected from Metal Gear Solid 4. The relatively weak second act is more of the same in a much less compelling setting - a rather unconvincing, blandly designed South American backwater - and ennui starts to set in. This is a much more accessible game to play than the convoluted MGS3, with the OctoCamo suit and Metal Gear Mk II remote drone taking much of the pain out of stealth, while weapons trading and customisation, and the excellent new cameras, do the same for gunplay. A good thing, certainly, but it lays the decade-old gameplay systems bare, with only modest improvements in AI to make up for it.

Halfway through this section, a novel gameplay idea, a rousing on-rails shoot-out, and some thunderous cut-scene entertainment succeed in sustaining interest until the next episode. It's at this point that Kojima pulls the rug from under your feet. The MGS4 you were expecting, it turns out, is no more than half of the game you get.

'Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots' Screenshot 4

Prepare to like Raiden. Then hate him again. Then like him a bit. Then like him quite a lot. Then get bored.

We're not going to explain how, because everything that follows deserves not to be spoiled - not the plot, but the string of ideas that break Metal Gear Solid down and rebuild it, in several brilliant and surprising ways, before the game is done. The first of these is such a precise and enthralling distillation and of stealth gaming that it's a shame more people won't see it, but it's worth saving for the way it takes you unawares. Each time, atmospherics, graphics, tone and gameplay revisions mesh perfectly down to the tiniest detail, as Kojima Productions bombards you with references and mood-swings that leave your head in a spin. 1940s 'noir' cinema, the Iraq war, beat-'em-ups, Halo... take your pick.

You expect the boss battles to take a starring role in Metal Gear Solid, and the encounters with the Beauty and the Beast team of psychotic femmes fatales in robot animal suits don't disappoint - how could they? All different, all very well-staged, all with a slightly disturbing and mournful edge. But in this case it's actually the early parts of the game's chapters that leave your jaw hanging open with their audacity and invention; it's the Gekko confrontations that strike fear into your heart; it's the visually staggering on-rails set-pieces that provide the biggest bang per buck.

Despite Kojima's downbeat sentiments on the PS3, he has produced a technical and presentational tour-de-force. The visuals do have rough edges but the art, especially the character art, is flawless, somehow maintaining extravagance and understated cool simultaneously. Harry Gregson Williams' music, whether providing scripted excitement or dynamic accompaniment, hits all the right cues, and musters a memorable, delicate theme. And the surround soundtrack is clearly a labour of love and extreme dedication, probably the best in gaming to date, lacking nothing in either pin-sharp precision or rib-shaking impact.

(Take note, however, that there are several minutes of install time to be endured, not just at the start, but before each act - albeit graced with a fantastic animated graphic of Snake smoking next to some health warnings.)

It won't ease the pain of the cut-scene haters one bit, but the interactive elements to the in-engine cinematics are hugely impressive nonetheless, and do much to paper over the cracks and make MGS4 feel a little more like a whole and less like a split-personality hybrid of movie and game. You would certainly skip the interminable mission briefings if it weren't for the ability to explore Otacon's flying headquarters via Metal Gear Mk II and CCTV while the talk rumbles on; the flashbacks and camera changes add less than you'd think, but the sense that cut-scenes and gameplay are taking place in the same world, heightened by some gorgeous camera transitions, adds a whole lot more.

'Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots' Screenshot 5

The beginnings of Metal Gear Solid's least likely romantic comedy are somewhere on this screen.

There are even split-screen sections that provide simultaneous feeds of game and movie. In Guns of the Patriots' incredible, cathartic, climactic scenes, the lines are blurred so much that you can barely tell whether you're playing a videogame or watching a film. To some that might sound like an insult, but to Kojima and his fans, it's nirvana, something for which the series has been striving for ten years, and it could not be a more appropriate note to end on.

If only MGS4 did end there. An unbelievably lengthy and self-indulgent epilogue - you can't call it a cut-scene, it's an entire film in its own right, and a deeply boring one too - is how Solid Snake's career comes to a close. Too bad, but no hard feelings; you can ignore it if you wish. The drawn-out sentimentality is fitting, in a way. Snake may have started out as a gruff, two-dimensional cliché, but he bows out very gracefully in Metal Gear Solid 4, assuming the mantle of the world-weary samurai, or the enigmatic nameless cowboy from a spaghetti western, as if it were always his. David Hayter's voice performance isn't much more than an attempt to create the gravelliest, throatiest croak ever recorded by man, but as such, it's heroic.

'Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots' Screenshot 6

Best wrinkles, facial hair and grunting in gaming history. Way to go, old man.

You're sorry to see Snake go. But should you be? Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it. It just burrows deeper into what fans love and detractors hate than ever before, and it will make few converts. It's a crying shame, given how many genuinely classic gaming moments there are here, given the countless exquisite creative touches, but Metal Gear Solid 4 is its own worst enemy. You could not ask for a funnier, cleverer, more ambitious or inspired or over-the-top conclusion to the Metal Gear Solid series, but it's definitely time to move on.

We love you, Snake. Don't come back.

8 / 10

Read the Eurogamer.net scoring policy
Picture of Oli.

About Oli Welsh

Oli is Eurogamer's acting deputy editor and reviews editor and likes to take things one word at a time. He is among the best dressed people in South London.

Read more articles from Oli by visiting the Oli Welsh archive page.

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Comments (1948) Latest comment 11 months ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Aretak #1 4 years ago

    Uh-oh.

  • APHIZM #2 4 years ago

    Oh dear.

  • DaveLev #3 4 years ago

    wow only 8, i know its not low but it was meant to be a perfect game yes? ... PS3 realy isn't worth buying now. I'll stick with my trusty PC and XBox360
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:06

  • LeD #4 4 years ago

    Last PS3 great white hope blown out. What's left now to PS3 fanboys? FFXIII?

    The minute MS announces some kind of Blu-Ray playback facility for the 360, I'm selling my -largely unused- PS3.

  • Blerk #5 4 years ago

    The Eurogamer "Halo Curse" strikes again!

  • Camorrista #6 4 years ago

    There will be blood. Oh yes.

    Edit: Install... before each chapter!?!
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:16

  • peteb #7 4 years ago

    Most...not...do...it..:

    damn..

    As good as Halo then?

  • Vandrius #8 4 years ago

    Hahahahaha

    Oh gods, the "8" wars begin.
    But 8 is a good score! But 8 isn't a 10! But what about halo?
    Roflmfao.

    Seriously, though... we always knew MGS4 was going to be loved by MGS fans and disliked by others. So grow up.

    Please.

  • des #9 4 years ago

    So it is true that roughly half of the game are cut-scenes.




    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:26

  • Tyronne #10 4 years ago

    My `huge thread` sense is tingling with this one.

    8 is a pretty decent score and I will no doubt buy it.

    nuff said.

  • mkreku #11 4 years ago

    Not unexpected though. I mean, as the entire genre is flawed so is every game produced in it. 8 is probably as high as it gets for a game of this type.

    I really shouldn't speak though as I hate MGS myself. Not exactly unbiased..

  • Big-Swiss #12 4 years ago

    check out the new trailor on PSN, awesome!

    8/10 sounds fair, I'm very exited for this game!

  • Bennicus #13 4 years ago

    Seems like there's a problem with even-numbered MGS games and cutscenes, 1 & 3 both seemed to have the right gameplay-cutscene balance imo. MGS2 was mental, every time one of my flatmates came into the room I was watching a cutscene, eventually he didn't believe there was any game there at all.

  • gingerlink #14 4 years ago

    I think 8 is going to bring a better conflict of fanboy remakrs than a 7 would, a 7 is hard to justify as still an "amazing title"

  • MyPointIs #15 4 years ago

    There goes the neighborhood ...

  • Widge #16 4 years ago

    What? 3 pages? I wanted this at least 402 long!

    Stuck down a pre-order with Play yesterday, hoping that they actually deliver on the day.

    edit:

    don't know whether to read or not? don't want enjoyment spoiled by things being revealed to me.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:13

  • DFawkes #17 4 years ago

    Bloddy spoiler photo! Why put it in that first photo, and more mind-boggling why did Konami give it out as a promo shot! Still, it's probably just one of the playable flashbacks.

  • Inigo #18 4 years ago

    I've been tempted to get a PS3 for a while since my 360 is on the way out but there's still not a killer game for it. I think i'll wait for FF13 and the new model version.

  • Aretak #19 4 years ago

    "check out the new trailor on PSN, awesome! "

    It's not a new trailer. It's an ancient trailer that they've re-upped.

  • Eighthours #20 4 years ago

    Good "hedging your bets" review, Oli! About what I expected.

  • Widge #21 4 years ago

    Bloody hell, 9.9 on IGN!

    I so want a Zero Punctuation review since I bet this would make him tear his veins out.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:16

  • lambtron #22 4 years ago

    "Huh. I remember when MGS2 came out and all the reviews saidit was meh because darling Snake wasn't centre stage. It's seen as one of the highlights of the series now."

    Errrr???? Not by anyone I know. Myself and my friends consider 1 and 3 brilliant and 2 an abomination. I don't even really consider it part of the series.

    8 is good enough for me.

    /buys

  • Bitkari #23 4 years ago

    I would have liked to hear more on the control system! The unwieldly controls have always annoyed me about this series. I want to know if anything had done to address their horribleness.

    Still, looks like a lot of money has gone in to this, and it will no doubt shift a few more PS3s until the next Final Fantasy game trundles in... Just feels as if gaming has moved on past MGS and it's done nothing to catch up.



  • LeD #24 4 years ago

    Anyway, I'm a third of the way through MGS3 on my PS3, and enjoying it. So I'll definitely pick this up at some point, I'm sure it'll be a lot of fun and thrilling.

  • peteb #25 4 years ago

    wow big difference between IGN and here. I suppose it really is horses for courses.

  • Widge #26 4 years ago

    No I think thats a fair mark. People who detest the game structure would want the game marked lowly, people who love the game structure want it marked highly... its the middle "everyman" score.

    i.e. there have been enough people who have voiced general meh at the cutscene heavy aspect of the game, and then there's people like me who sat through all of them with intense glee. One persons 10 is another mans 5.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:20

  • _Morpheus_ #27 4 years ago

    this is officially the last review i have read from eurogamer.

    RSS feed gone as is the respect.

  • bad09 #28 4 years ago

    8 is fair enough. Metal Gear has never been a perfect game, just a great one. I'm still looking forward to getting my hands on it
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:24

  • ScarOnTheSky #29 4 years ago

    How long are the cutscenes exactly? Up to 90 minutes each, as CVG said?

  • SchumiF1 #30 4 years ago

    8/10?! That is the biggest joke ever! Everything points to a 9/10 AT THE VERY LEAST and they you come with an 8/10! Do the right thing and just change the score.

  • LeD #31 4 years ago

    Lol @ ScummyF1

  • Putty-Man #32 4 years ago

    Dam, there's goes another reason I thought I might have had to buy a PS3.

  • MrMarbles #33 4 years ago

    It's not even an everyman score, though, is it? There's no such thing with Metal Gear games. It's just a score tagged onto the end of the review because there has to be one.

  • BM #34 4 years ago

    Is everyone reading the same review? I've got a 360 and a wii, yet the review still tempts me to fork out for a PS3 and this. The review can be summed up in two words: flawed genius. 8/10 is a bloody good score, and I'll be telling my PS3 owning mates to get this bought pronto

  • lambtron #35 4 years ago

    "this is officially the last review i have read from eurogamer.

    RSS feed gone as is the respect."

    "8/10?! That is the biggest joke ever! Everything points to a 9/10 AT THE VERY LEAST and they you come with an 8/10! Do the right thing and just change the score."

    And so it begins. You've not even played it yet!

  • Foundry #36 4 years ago

    Brace yourselves.

  • APHIZM #37 4 years ago

    Upon reading the full review, I'm really looking forward to this. It's a shame the conclusion paints a bleaker picture than the rest of the review, and will surely fuel the MGS haters, but it sounds like an epic treat for fans. EG may have handed the lowest review score yet, but 8/10 is a pretty good low :)

  • miiiguel #38 4 years ago

    worse than Halo...

  • macksed #39 4 years ago

    maybe they meant to write 18?

  • boyakoosha #40 4 years ago

    oh man. how very depressing. was really looking fwd to this :(

  • Amoebalove #41 4 years ago

    Don't worry at least it's better than Haze!!!!

  • miiiguel #42 4 years ago

    let me use the ps3-only crow lexicon:

    "there it goes the last reason to buy a PS3..."

  • Tyranix #43 4 years ago

    I'm a huge Metal Gear fan, having played every single Metal Gear and MGS game since they began. And I find this review....

    Excellent. There's no bias, lots of clarity and I think 8/10 is the perfect score for this game...not that I've played it but y'know. It basically means it's a 10/10 for Metal Gear fans, but 8/10 for everyone else...worth picking up but it won't blow your world away because it caters to fans. Fanboys will start a Holy Crusade about this, but I really don't care. Roll on June 12th ^^

  • Eighthours #44 4 years ago

    The IGN review is insane. I'd bet my bottom dollar on this being the most sober (and reliable) verdict on the Web by the end of the reviews merry-go-round.

  • Putty-Man #45 4 years ago

    I actually thought the review read more like a 7 tbh. But as a previous poster said, a score on the end of a Metal gear review is relatively pointless.

  • psychokitten #46 4 years ago

    I'm stocking up on canned foods and water, I think we're in for a shitstorm.

  • schachmatt #47 4 years ago

    The next generation of games are actually hackneyed movies.

  • Shinji #48 4 years ago

    Whoever summed it up as "flawed genius" sounds like they're right on the money. It sounds like the kind of game that can't justify more than 8/10, but which will still - perversely - be one of my favourite games of the year, if not ever.

    A bit like the rest of the Metal Gear series, actually. I can see the flaws that make some people want to hate the entire franchise - but none of them stop it from being - to my mind - some of the best gaming experiences I've ever had. This sounds like more of the same, so roll on June 12th :)

  • boyakoosha #49 4 years ago

    http://uk .ps3.ign.com/articles/877/87761... - interesting...

  • lambtron #50 4 years ago

    "Take note, however, that there are several minutes of install time to be endured, not just at the start, but before each act - albeit graced with a fantastic animated graphic of Snake smoking next to some health warnings"

    Hmm. How many acts are there - this sounds like it sucks. Oh the irony! After people moaning about changing discs on 360 this sounds, far, far worse.

  • zoch #51 4 years ago

    the Review has not got a idea what he's talking about. this site is biased towards the 360!
    MGS4 should HAVE BEEN 10/10 SCORE.

  • bad09 #52 4 years ago

    @ lambtron

    I must admit that was the only thing that worried me :(

  • Artemis_Matsas #53 4 years ago

    Don't just look at the score... read the bloody review too.

    The game IS great, but i guess it's not for everyone. That's the way MGS has been from the beginning.

    I just hope i'll get my copy as soon as possible :)

  • barabbas #54 4 years ago

    I've been a huge fan of MGS series and all its over-the-top indulgences ever since MGS1, and every word in that review read like I would absolutely love this game. I just might have to buy PS3 now (and a new tv).

    Don't ever change, Hideo Kojima.

  • Big-Swiss #55 4 years ago

    its a new trailor on PSN, one I haven't seen yet on PSN!-))

  • Big-Swiss #56 4 years ago

    depressing??? an 8 is good, the game looks amazing and the Beta got good credits!

    have fun and enjoy!

  • Skooch #57 4 years ago

    An eight! Ouch!

  • dr_faulk #58 4 years ago

    Thanks, Eurogamer! I think I can hold off buying a PS3 for a while longer.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:40

  • Lexx87 #59 4 years ago

    "the Review has not got a idea what he's talking about. this site is biased towards the 360!
    MGS4 should HAVE BEEN 10/10 SCORE."

    I love these comments :)

  • kobashi #60 4 years ago

    it is a good review and 8/10 is not a bad score. The one thing that is annoying is that the A.I has not really improved. This was obvious when Konami first showed the gameplay walkthroughs last year.

  • espy #61 4 years ago

    How can you bash a review for a game you've never even played? Silly.

  • richardiox #62 4 years ago

    I have to wonder how many of the people (PS3 fanboys I guess) damning the score have ever played a MGS game before as traditionally they havent sold *that* well over here (I dont think MGS3 did good numbers)? Or is it a case of them pinning all their hopes on the game due to a general lack of exclusives on the platform?

    MGS has always been an acquired taste
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 09:46

  • XdarXideX #63 4 years ago

    It may just be me, but this review seems to have almost nothing to say about the gameplay. It's like he sat down and watched all the cut-scenes and got bored.

  • Madafunkola #64 4 years ago

    Another one bites the dust. When will these PS3 killer apps finally see the light of day? The posible list is dwindling. What do we have now? Killzone 2, FFXIIIXVIVXFDIDDLY, LBP... home?

  • Psiloc #65 4 years ago

    Wow.

  • betahoven #66 4 years ago

    Post deleted at 09:36:16 17-12-2011

  • peteb #67 4 years ago

    It may just be me, but this review seems to have almost nothing to say about the gameplay. It's like he sat down and watched all the cut-scenes and got bored.

    Because maybe that's all there was? I jest, I jest!! :D

  • DFawkes #68 4 years ago

    8 is a good score! Why is everyone hating it so much!

    Although I do disagree with the opinion of the review, as I like my cut-scenes, and he does make it clear at the start it's a very general review not pandering to his love/hate of the series. It's still a killer app.

  • Shinji #69 4 years ago

    Okay, ladies, shall we open a book on who's going to be the most excruciatingly annoying by the end of this thread - rabid PS3 fanboys screaming about how a game they've never played should be a 10/10, or vile, childish Xbox 360 fanboys coming along to gloat at a game getting, er, one of the highest scores we can award?

    My money's on the latter - at least the PS3 kids are entertaining.

  • InsoFox #70 4 years ago

    Ahahaha. Ha.

    Yeah, fanboys. You're right. Eurogamer sure do suck for saying MGS4 is really good.

  • Bitkari #71 4 years ago

    "But as a previous poster said, a score on the end of a Metal gear review is relatively pointless."

    Scores are relatively pointless for reviews generally.

    If you want a true reflection of the reviewer's opinion on the game in question, then just read the review!

    Eurogamer actually write rather good reviews, and it's a bit sad to see the constant shitstorm whipped up by the score at the end of the piece.

    If you're really that simple, perhaps you'd be better off sticking with OPM.

  • Gaol #72 4 years ago

    The EG reviewing crew will be stroking each other's epenises tonight on Live! :)

  • bad09 #73 4 years ago

    @ betahoven

    "Also, no mention of MGO? It's a pretty substantial part of the package."

    I thought that as well but my guess is it will get a separate review, as they did review the beta. What's the deal Oli?

  • EuropeGamer #74 4 years ago

    haha, what a big joke from a xbox fanboy. give it a 9, GODDAMIT!

  • Darren #75 4 years ago

    8/10 is a good score though so I don't know why some people are being negative about the game because, let's face it, the MGS games have always been a mix of the good and bad. The review reads as if the game was written to appease fans of the series not to attract new ones. It certainly sounds intriguing and one of my main gripes about the series, namely the horrible camera, has at least been addressed here which should make the game a more enjoyable experience for me. As for the lengthy cinematics, I confess they did drive me mad in MGS 2, a game I feel was the weakest of the PS2 trilogy, but these days I actually prefer story-driven games so maybe I'll actually enjoy these. Whatever, I'm definitely buying the game, it's obviously a good game, just one with enough flaws to bring the score down from the 'perfect' 10 people were expecting.

  • Kostabi #76 4 years ago

    Hmm, I was going to pick this up but having never invested much time in the previous games (mostly because I arrived to the MGS party late) I'm worried I'll have even less knowledge of what's going on than most.

    Is playing the previous games crucial to enjoying 4?

  • asphaltcowboy #77 4 years ago

    I read the review. And as someone who hasn't been a fan of the previous games... it sounds terrible :/

  • Shinji #78 4 years ago

    Konami has been promoting Metal Gear Online as quite a separate product from MGS4, and my understanding is that what you get with MGS4 is just a bare-bones "starter package" for MGO. It's an entirely different game, which is presumably why Oli is reviewing MGS4 separately from MGO. I'm sure EG will give MGO the coverage it deserves in due course :)

  • Kingofnothin #79 4 years ago

    good....but not great......shame.

    There goes the only reason for me getting a PS3.

    Maybe LBP and Home (if it ever comes out) will change my mind.

  • McBradders #80 4 years ago

    After the undeserved 10's of GTA IV, the guilty backlash begins with MGS IV?

    Ok!

  • keyboardmonkey #81 4 years ago

    So is this a AAA title or just AA ?

    I would have thought
    AAA = 9 or 10
    AA = 7 or 8
    A = 5 or 6

  • DanWhitehead #82 4 years ago

    The EG reviewing crew will be stroking each other's epenises tonight on Live! :)

    Well, it is Friday after all...

  • DomUltra #83 4 years ago

    Wow I always suspected EuroGamer of harboring drooling retards but this review and the comment section alone confirm my suspicions.

    Great job EuroFags.
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 09:56

  • Wash #84 4 years ago

    Haha... will look into this game for sure, but look at the tards come out in force.

    How it makes me laugh, muahaha. Look at yourselves.

  • Widge #85 4 years ago

    Kostabi, I think Gametrailers have been releasing retrospective round ups of the previous games. They're actually quite a good read. They've done up to MGS2 at the moment. Assuming the last ones have been the MG 1 & 2 and MGS1 games.

  • monkie_king #86 4 years ago

    This review contradicts my expectations.

    Therefore, I conclude that the entire World is in the wrong.

    /cries bitter salty tears

  • DanMW #87 4 years ago

    I'm surprised this review is up so early, I haven't read it as I don't want spoilers, although I must admit an 8 seems a little low, but checking previous scores for MGS games on Eurogamer most have scored 8 anyway so no surprises there. I enjoy MGS games so I'm not concerned about the score, which is a good score by the way. Roll on June 12th.

  • lambtron #88 4 years ago

    I thought MGO really was a completely separate game?

  • Steroyd #89 4 years ago

    Metacritics isn't going to like this one...

  • XdarXideX #90 4 years ago

    I'd advise that people read the review over on IGN UK as it has proper gameplay information that wasn't even mentioned here. Poor review Oli. Very poor.

    EG should get someone else to review it as a second opinion.

  • andromeda #91 4 years ago

    P.S.3.L.O.L.

  • EclipseMints #92 4 years ago

    So how do you review a new Metal Gear Solid? Do you assess it on its own terms, ones that its legion of fans will understand? Do you play the sceptic, and take Hideo Kojma and his team to task for their stubborn refusal to catch up with what the rest of the world expects of a videogame? Or do you walk the path of compromise, down the middle?

    So I'm guessing the reviewer wanted MGS4 to become a typical FPS with a cliche story or wanted it go the Wii games route and become 8 hours of mini games? Is that how he wanted Kojima to change to meet gamers expectations? Do you really think that that most of us wants developers like Kojima to cater to the "rest fo the world"? Most people out there buy "games" like Wii Fit. Is that how Kojima is suppose to cater?

  • syphaa #93 4 years ago

    As a MG fan this sounds awesome. You can't jump into a MG game without the knowledge that you are going to be swamped/engrossed in the story/cinematic style the Kojima always directs. 8/10 at a glance for people who don't know the series will instantly conjur up the usual shit like "so its not as good as X title" "must be shit then if its 8/10". PLAY THE GAME make the decision for yourself.

    Don't let a title like MGS4 slip away because of a stupid number on a page. Nice review, but I for one am definitely picking this up and buying a PS3 for it.

  • Steroyd #94 4 years ago

    8 on EG is a crap score, they score pretty much any old shit 9 or 10/10, like Dirtlol.

    No EG are just about the only ones who don't.

    Although with the recent spat of 10's being given to games this gen, it is a little surprising in that regard.

  • Kostabi #95 4 years ago

    @Widge

    Cheers, I'll go have a look as it'll save the OCD kicking in and trying to hurriedly complete MGS2 and 3 before picking this up.

  • SteveB #96 4 years ago

    Sounds good. My only reservation is the setting. The previous 3 games had quite unique settings at the time of their release, but this one's war torn setting has been used a lot recently.

  • Psiloc #97 4 years ago

    I'd admire the brave 8/10 score if it wasn't so contrasted to all the other review scores as of late. All the other AAA releases have had majorly inflated scores this gen.

  • Camorrista #98 4 years ago

    The rug-pulling thing really intrigues me. I have no intention to ever play this game, so does anyone know where I can find a nice, big spoiler of it?

    Don't post it here, of course :)
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:06

  • Widge #99 4 years ago

    Yeah, the bloke does a good summary. His breakdown of MGS2 was really good, I quite liked the twist of characters halfway through. Then again I liked taking over as the Arbiter from Master Chief, thought the perspective shifts were interesting.

  • berelain #100 4 years ago

    sounds like a reasonable score to me, and pretty much what I expected from a reviewer looking through the hype and fact that its MGS4 and looking objectively at it as a game.

    Like the review said, for the fans, it'll be wonderful. For everyone else, it'll have its problems. I fall into the latter group. I have bought and played and enjoyed every MGS game so far, but they have their flaws.

  • CannonAnBall #101 4 years ago

    Comments that follow the lines of...

    "Oh well, I won't be buying a PS3 yet then"

    ...are just as bad as those people slating the review score before they've played the game themselves. Get a fuckin' grip.

    8/10 seems fair. After a quick look Mario Kart Wii and Mass Effect on 360 also got 8/10 and I really enjoyed/enjoy these titles.

    With Eurogamer I will never look too much at the review score to be honest - not since they gave Halo 3 10/10. That was never a 10/10 - it was, and still is shit, but I digress...

    I'm getting this and I'm sure I will love it!

  • InsoFox #102 4 years ago

    Psiloc:

    "I'd admire the brave 8/10 score if it wasn't so contrasted to all the other review scores as of late. All the other AAA releases have had majorly inflated scores this gen. "

    I take your point, but Gears of War didn't.

  • Lemming81 #103 4 years ago

    I really wanted this to fail. Don't ask me why.

  • Skooch #104 4 years ago

    "Wow I always suspected EuroGamer of harboring drooling retards but this review and the comment section alone confirm my suspicions."

    @ DomUltra - don't be too hard on yourself :)

  • ps3_2310 #105 4 years ago

    I wonder how much Microsoft pay eurogamer these days?

  • mallocks #106 4 years ago

    I wonder if Oli had the slightest idea about just how much of a raging shitstorm he'd be in for after giving it OMFGWTFSRSLY only!1 an 8.

    Probably.

    For those of you linking to the IGN review as an alternative, I'd like to point you to the conclusion which begins "If you’ve ever loved any one of the Metal Gear games, or any moments from the series, there will come a moment when MGS 4 will send your spirits soaring. If you’ve loved them all, well then there’ll be many, many more." (Emphasis mine)

    Same sentiment, higher score.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:12

  • krudster #107 4 years ago

    You do all realise that the IGN review is written by Dave McCarthy? Someone who has written dozens of reviews for EG...


  • Kenshin001 #108 4 years ago

    Yeah, weird score for the tone of the review. The review had me psyched with all the superlatives and then the end was like what the...? Maybe that's like the game though. Odd that people are already dismissing the game based on the review though. I just read another one which was gushing over it (IGN, 9.9), so I think wait and see how it averages out. That goes for all the PS3 fans too who may feel it was under scored.

  • Darren #109 4 years ago

    @FluffyTucker - If 8 is a crap score on EG then does that mean you think Gears of War, Bully: S.E., etc. are rubbish games?

    No, they're not... a game that scores under 5/10 is below average, 5/10 is average and anything above that is decent or better. Thus an 8 is a good game with flaws, that's all. ;)

  • drumbaby #110 4 years ago

    Better than NG2 by one whole point.

  • CallousB #111 4 years ago

    "I thought the IGN review was so full of hyperbole it actually dismissed itself through childish excitement..."

    I'm amazed that anyone pays attention to IGN scores. The only credible part of the site is the Nintendo section where they don't seem afraid of pissing off fanboys.The PS3/360 sections always tend to fall over themselves to overscore the hyped games.

  • tonynibbles #112 4 years ago

    THIS IS GOING TO BE FUCKING UBERAWESOME

    www.littlebigplane toid.com
    Edited by 1 at 02/12/08 @ 21:34

  • drumbaby #113 4 years ago

    They certainly overscored GTA4.

  • Max_Powers #114 4 years ago

    I like to play games. I do not like watching cutscenes.

    Definitately no buy

  • DFawkes #115 4 years ago

    Reading it again, it is fairly poorly written for Eurogamer. Even if I disagree, I usually at least enjoy reading the well explained faults and fully described gameplay elements. They could've given this a 10 and it still have ben poorly written. I even checked Olis' other reviews, and they're all reasonably well written, so it's not a case of me just disliking a persons writing style.

  • Darren #116 4 years ago

    For those people complaining about why EG haven't reviewed the online mode; didn't it occur to you that they might NOT be able to test it under the servers are up and running near release time? I'm sure EG reviewed Gears of War and Halo 3's online modes separately too although my memory may be a bit rusty.

  • Widge #117 4 years ago

    13 long days to wait... (play delivery permitting)
    well, at least I've got into Oblivion for a bit again to get me through.

  • barrylyndon #118 4 years ago

    it sounds like sanity may be returning to the fevered masturbatory world of the game reviewer. check out ign.
    I was worried that every single reviewer was being paid off or could not be trusted. Halo 3 did not deserve a 10 or gta 4. they were very good games but not ground breaking.
    this review sounds unbiased and actually made me want to buy the game. a ten would just have made me groan and probably not bother.

  • panashe #119 4 years ago

    This is ,simply, one of the most unfair, false and ridiculous reviews I've read in all my life. I won't visit this web anymore.

  • butler` #120 4 years ago

    LOLPS3

  • Redeye #121 4 years ago

    So it didn't get eleventy-one out of ten? Big deal, still sounds like a top title to those who like 'this sort of thing'. Those of you that are having spasms about it, take a tablet.

  • richardiox #122 4 years ago

    "This is ,simply, one of the most unfair, false and ridiculous reviews I've read in all my life. I won't visit this web anymore. "

    You played the game yet then? Have you ever played ANY of the MGS series?

  • strange_powers #123 4 years ago

    Comparing review scores is a massive waste of everyone's time: don't we all know that by now?

    It's exactly like Nigel Tufnell saying his amp is "one louder".

    MGS4, praised as it is in this very well written review, is the only game out there making me want to buy a PS3 at the moment.

  • ZBlacktt #124 4 years ago

    The guy who wrote this report comes off as a totally biased person towards the game from the start to the end. Stating one awesome thing about the game. Only to follow up with 3 bad things in HIS own opinion. He's credibility to me and everyone else should be just crap. Since it's clear MG is not a game he likes very much if at all. It's also very clear he stands alone among all the other credible gaming source's world wide. Clever way to gain attention I'd say. So when the game sets records sells and boost the PS 3 over XBOX. He'll find something else to cry about. What a waste of a read......


    checks payable from Bill Gates himself? This site should check itself on trustworthiness reporting or just shut down.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:23

  • lambtron #125 4 years ago

    " This is ,simply, one of the most unfair, false and ridiculous reviews I've read in all my life. I won't visit this web anymore.
    ignore poster"

    Bye then.

  • XdarXideX #126 4 years ago

    I linked to the IGN review as it has some more Gameplay information. Not because of the score. Forget the scores!
    If you go by IGN's review, the game is 50/50, cutscene vs gameplay. So where is the gameplay information in EG's review? Admitedly there could be more on IGN UK too but at least there is SOME.

  • DomUltra #127 4 years ago

    I'm having a fucking laugh over people dismissing IGN scores. Although they're at least a hundred more times credible than EuroTrash, get over yourselves EuroFag supporters.

    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:21

  • lambtron #128 4 years ago

    "in HIS own opinion"

    Ummmm? Isn't this the entire point of reviews?

  • peteb #129 4 years ago

    @richardiox

    He can't read that because he isn't visiting this web any more. :D

  • miiiguel #130 4 years ago

    "I won't visit this web anymore. "
    yes, go to the other... web, little spider.

  • Widge #131 4 years ago

    in other news: I missed a call yesterday because I'd changed my ringtone to the Codec noise. I got the phone out, but rather than answer the call, decided to stand and admire my sheer awesomeness. Afterwards I realised I'd achieved fail.

  • des #132 4 years ago

    "This is ,simply, one of the most unfair, false and ridiculous reviews I've read in all my life. I won't visit this web anymore."

    So you have played the game then,where can i read your review?

  • panashe #133 4 years ago

    Before I leave this horrendous web I must say that I work in a spanish page and YES I've played all MGS games, included this, to make the review.
    When I said Eurogamer's review is unfair and false, believe IT'S TRUE!!!!!!
    Bye (for ever)

  • ParanoidZombie #134 4 years ago

    This review reminds me of the NG2 review: both games get good-but-not-great scores because they're "for the fans only".

  • Dizzy #135 4 years ago

    MGS can, by definition, never score more than an 8. The plot is a train wreck and game play has been stuck in the 90s.

    I love the fanboys crying... the "but Halo 3 never deserved a 10" defense is the best. So great.

    An 8 is still good guys... plenty of great games I played that were 8s on EG.

    ROFL at panashe . What a dick.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:25

  • asphaltcowboy #136 4 years ago

    @ZBlacktt: "Since it's clear MG is not a game he likes very much if at all."

    I take it you didn't read the gushing Hands On article for MGS4 that was written by the same guy then?

  • Beano #137 4 years ago

    Am I the only one who think 8/10 sound fair and unsurprising for a MGS game?... 8/10 is a good score, right?

    I didn't expect a revolutionary game and something that would change MGS, but a another epic episode in the series and MGS4 sounds like it is just that and will satisfy MGS fans (me) and PS3 owners (me again). Xbots will always yell and scream "ps3lol" even if MGS4 (or another PS3 exclusive title) got a 9/10 or 10/10.

    But I would have liked more technical details in the review - especially about length, install times, number of chapters, etc.

  • whoelse #138 4 years ago

    Looking for attention? First site to give it below a 9.

  • Dizzy #139 4 years ago

    "You do all realise that the IGN review is written by Dave McCarthy? Someone who has written dozens of reviews for EG... "

    Owned! :)

  • richardiox #140 4 years ago

    oliwelshsmom - wow, the lowest comment i have ever read on Eurogamer. SDF in full knee-jerk childish effect. Say also "eurofags" comments.

  • Jaybles #141 4 years ago

    Ok reading the comments on this review have annoyed me so much that i had to register on this site to say so, lol.

    Are some of you people serious?
    Since when was 8/10 a bad score, especially for a "marmite" game. And especially considering the review came from someone who straight away said he loves and hates metal gear solid games.

    For people then to base their whole decision on buying a PS3 around this review gettin a 9 or a 10 is so naive.
    Does this mean that if those very people read the OPM or IGN review first or even next they would decide its time to get a PS3.

    Reviews, with all professionalism taken into account, are very independant views on their personal enjoyment of a game.
    I wouldnt base my decision on a game on one review. The fact that this game has been gettin 9.9/10 and 10/10 elsewhere would suggest alot of people will disagree with this score, and yet by the nature of gaming, some will think the score is justified or even too high.

    My guess is people who have jumped into this thread dismissing the purchase of the PS3 on the grounds of this review were never going to purchase the console anyway, and are just looking to fan the flames of childish fanboyism, or justify their own decision not to buy the console.

    The fact is people should make their own mind up.

    Even an 8/10 suggests this game is worth playing, a 10/10 from other reviewers suggest its definately a game not worth missing!!

    Some people need to grow up and use their BRAINS to decide for themselves!!

  • RandomTerrain #142 4 years ago

    Less than 2 weeks to go! This will be epic, I can't wait.

  • Vasenor #143 4 years ago

    +1 To read the review not the score.
    +1 To Mass Effect which was one of the best and best selling games on the 360 got an 8/10.

    There are plenty of games with very high scores which I feel no urge to play. This review did a good job of breaking down how MSG4 differed from the others in the series and roughly what to expect from the game.

  • LeD #144 4 years ago

    Slightly off topic, but FYI I've just had a wank. It was pretty good.

  • Darren #145 4 years ago

    Sweet Jesus, the game got 8 out of 10, a GOOD score, so why are people acting totally over the top toward the review? Anyone would think the game had been panned the way some of you are going on!!! Calm down, breathe slowly then take a chill pill, you'll feel a whole lot better, I guarantee it! ;)

  • keyboardmonkey #146 4 years ago

    A guy could make a lot of money on here selling tissues.

    Some for mopping up the tears, some for mopping up the excitement of others.

    8 is still a good score same as rock band, and at least it's better than Haze.
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 10:30

  • krudster #147 4 years ago

    [link url=http: //www.eurogamer.net/archive.php?author=152
    ]http://ww w.eurogamer.net/archive.php?aut...[/link]

    Just to emphasise the point: 95 features for EG.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:30

  • shogo10 #148 4 years ago

    The very last line throws away any credibility that the reviewer had. If he were smart and critical he wouldn't have put that and I might have taken the review more seriously.

  • Physically_Insane #149 4 years ago

    So GRID's better. Wow.

  • oMonarca #150 4 years ago

    Sounds really good, and I don't even own a PS3. Quite entertaining, but definately not a killer app. Sounds like fan service for sure. And what fan does not appreciate that?

    At least it's not dumbed down to appeal everyone else.

  • panashe #151 4 years ago

    My last comment: EGamer gave Forza motorsport 9: JAJAJAJAJA.
    Their reviews are very bad: bad explanation, worse texts,...

  • Binglybob #152 4 years ago

    For God's sake, this is a website providing information on all platforms, I'm sure each review is based on the game at hand. People need to stop with this console war bollocks. Just get both 360 and PS3 if you can. Pointless, pointless chatter about which is better. The review seems about right - MGS is a marmite game. I think any 8 is worth a buy, especially with PS3's modest software line-up. Finally, I can use my PS3. I can't wait for Lego Indy!!!! Two great games within a week of each other. Anyone else hardly played GTA IV due to its repetitiveness? It was definitely over-hyped. It's great, but just another GTA.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:35

  • miiiguel #153 4 years ago

    Japanese games are in disarray. PS3 just happens to suffer a bit more with this because their key titles are made in Japan.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:34

  • Amoebalove #154 4 years ago

    Hey leave poor panashe alone. His English may be poor but he speaks fluent retard!

  • peteb #155 4 years ago

    @panashe

    I thought you were leaving? I was happy.

  • CannonAnBall #156 4 years ago

    @ Dizzy

    ...in my opinion Halo 3 was never a 10/10. No defense at all in that statement. I'm certainly no fanboy either so fuck off if your comment was aimed at me. I was merely putting the 8/10 in context with other scores.

  • Physically_Insane #157 4 years ago

    People are acting a bit over the top because this is the biggest release on the PS3 this year. It's meant to be a game not worth missing not just a good game. Now it looks like it's not an essential game you must own.

    I'll still buy it though.

  • Aloominum_man #158 4 years ago

    Can we just get a list of names from all the slobbering Sony strokers that have actually posted critical comments in this thread AND have played the game to completion?

  • Darren #159 4 years ago

    I have a PS3 and I have MGS 4 pre-ordered. Whether the review score was 7 or 10, it wouldn't have had any impact on my decision to buy it, it tells me everything I needed to know and the number at the end is just the reviewer's subjective score. I might think it's a 6, I might think it's a 9, I dunno yet 'cos I haven't played it but one thing I do know is that I'm looking forward to finding out because it sounds like a good game! 8)

  • Killerbee #160 4 years ago

    Funny how some people read that review as sounding like a 7, yet I read it thinking "9" - maybe that's just because I'm a big fan of the series and even some of the criticisms aren't going to put me off. All in all, I actually thought it was a fair and good review - it made me want to play the game and see how Snake's story ends and the hints at changes to the traditional MGS gameplay got me a little more excited. 8 is a fine score and I'm pretty confident that for me, as a fan of the series, that means a 9.

    This will be the game that eventually gets me to buy a PS3, I've no doubt about that. Just as soon as that 80GB model launches over here...

  • OnlyMe #161 4 years ago

    So, what other games within the genre is better? That's what I want to know. There's no way that 8/10 is the highest score a game in this genre deserves, but what's the other game called?

  • jonsaan #162 4 years ago

    Add +2 to EG PS3 scores and it all starts to make sense ;)

    Haze=6
    MGS4=10

    Flame on!

  • Tonka #163 4 years ago

    Dave McCarthy is the biggest Moffat this side of the Atlantic

  • ZBlacktt #164 4 years ago

    Ummmm? Isn't this the entire point of reviews?


    HHmmmm, unbiased journalist reporting? Ever heard of it or is this not a practice there? Someone who is neutral should have did the report. Not a clown that gives Halo 3 a 10/10? The manner inwhich he even words the review gave me the impression he lacks the motor skills to play games of this level. He should stick with those one's like Halo for lesser of a challenge. That way he still gets those kick back checks from Microshit. But I'm outta here now. This clown gave many of us a good laugh. Now,, it's just a waste of time...... I'll deleted this site address.


    again, checks payable from Bill Gates himself?


  • zuljin #165 4 years ago

    Hmmm, I got MGS 3 few months back and I can't say I was too impressed. Based on the review, I'd say maybe catch it at a friends house first, but then the IGN review is pushing me to pre order.

    Gonna look up some more on the online bit - think that will make me decide more easily.

  • Dizzy #166 4 years ago

    "...in my opinion Halo 3 was never a 10/10. No defense at all in that statement. I'm certainly no fanboy either so fuck off if your comment was aimed at me. I was merely putting the 8/10 in context with other scores. "

    Good for you. The rest of the reviewing world didn't agree. I always like it when emo whiners like you drop into a review and mention a game that has nothing to do with the review and is even a totally different genre. Cry for attention? You have a need to be special? Does it hurt much? Next time provide some valid opinions please.

  • Steroyd #167 4 years ago

    Sweet Jesus, the game got 8 out of 10, a GOOD score, so why are people acting totally over the top toward the review? Anyone would think the game had been panned the way some of you are going on!!! Calm down, breathe slowly then take a chill pill, you'll feel a whole lot better, I guarantee it! ;)

    But people were going to buy a PS3 because of this review!

  • Yossarian #168 4 years ago

    The Halo 3 review was by a different reviewer.

    Some of you are totally, round-the-twist loopy.

  • roquito #169 4 years ago

    The problem is : the review is strange: I think the have only a few visitors on the site, and if they give MGS the worst note they can, more and more people enter Eurogamer to see the review.
    Also another problem is that the review is bad written and not well explained. Something dark is behind this 8.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:42

  • Beano #170 4 years ago

    "Beano - you read the NG2 review comments section? Think you'l need a new name for PS fans if you insist on giving Xbox owners the Xbot label. "

    No - I'm a Xbox 360 owner myself. I'm talking about the sad Xbox 360 fanboys (=xbots) who constantly toll various forums with useless "psp3lol" posts in every PS3 thread. PS3 fanboys are equally sad when they troll 360 threads.

    Also I wrote "PS3 owners" and "MGS fans". This is not the same as "PS3 fanboy".

  • gohda #171 4 years ago

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

  • FirewalkR #172 4 years ago

    Well, I've preordered this quite some time ago and it's mine day 1. However, I respect different opinions and kudos to EG for having the balls to clearly state their opinion :D , no matter how much I may come to disagree with it.

    The review read mostly like at least a 9, though.

    I'm surprised about the low(ish) score though, especially after GTA4's 10. Many people in the gaming press are now stating they may have overscored it... perhaps the same will happen with all the MGS4 10's and high 90's. Or perhaps you'll realize you underscored it haha. :)

  • CannonAnBall #173 4 years ago

    @ Dizzy

    ..and the rest of the reviewing world agrees with EG on MGS4?


  • Jaybles #174 4 years ago

    The closing comments on the IGN review sounds like a fair way to sum it up!

    "Closing Comments
    If you’ve ever loved any one of the Metal Gear games, or any moments from the series, there will come a moment when MGS 4 will send your spirits soaring. If you’ve loved them all, well then there’ll be many, many more. It’s a masterpiece. But forget you read that. Go play it and find out for yourself. Because it’s the kind of game that, if you play it after being told it’s a masterpiece, might end up disappointing you because of the hype. So forget the hype. Forget that it’s a magnificent, ground-breaking, masterpiece. Just play it, and enjoy a dazzling, heart-lifting, voyage of discovery. "

  • Darren #175 4 years ago

    @jonsaan - Well I agree with a 6 for Haze but I don't think what you say is true of every review... I mean Halo 3 is a 12 scoring game?!? No, IMO that's an 8 at most. ;) LOL

    Nah, a review is just ONE person's opinion on the game and not everyone will agree. So long as the review is objective enough to gauge whether you'll like it or not then the number at the end is meaningless. Read the text and make up your OWN mind whether the game is worth buying THEN you decide how good it is. One 8/10 review is NOT the end of the world people, it may well be the lowest score the game actually receives, not that should make the slightest bit of difference.

  • Max_Powers #176 4 years ago

    Again:

    This is lolling!

    Reading the review, without the MGS title attached to it, this game would have gotten a 6 or 7 max. The future of video gaming is not 90 min cutscenes.



  • roquito #177 4 years ago

    8 is not the problem: the problem is when you have the feeling that a review has something dark and bizzare, something that makes you feel you're reading an opinion that isn't based only in the cuality of a game..
    Trial of time will put Eurgamer's review in the history of wrong opinions, I'm sure of it.

  • EuropeGamer #178 4 years ago

    No mention of online mode? That alone should've made it a 9.

  • Wendelius #179 4 years ago

    Arbiter,

    You sound a bit sad getting worked up about this review. I don't own a PS3, have only played Metal Gear Acid on the PSP but I actually read the review (instead of focusing like some others in this thread on the score) and the review actually makes me think that I might enjoy giving the game a try. I am forewarned that it might indeed be a love and hate relationship. I am forewarned that I'll be sometimes amazed and sometimes bored and annoyed or confused. But it still sounds like a game to experience.

    And the last sentence says nothing more that it's maybe time to renew the formula. The reviewer is hardly sentencing MGS to imprisonment in an oubliette, never to be seen again.

    That's what I got from the text of the review as someone who only pays little mind to MGS normally and doesn't even have a PS3. It made me curious.

    So what were you complaining about?

    Wendelius

  • Dizzy #180 4 years ago

    "..and the rest of the reviewing world agrees with EG on MGS4? "

    Bit early to call that one. I expect quite some 8s and 9s.

    "No mention of online mode? That alone should've made it a 9. "

    Probably a different review for online.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:48

  • richardiox #181 4 years ago

    @Roquito - have you ever played an MGS game before?

  • Aloominum_man #182 4 years ago

    Roquito - I'm not sure you're best positioned to judge how well written a review it is.

  • Jaybles #183 4 years ago

    Bit early to call that one. I expect quite some 8s and 9s.

    Well this is the 3rd review i have read, OPM and IGN scored it 10 and 9.9

  • roquito #184 4 years ago

    I will say another time: The review is crearly not impartial at all.

  • XdarXideX #185 4 years ago

    Aspic>At least that's the (wrong) impression you'd get from EG's review text.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:53

  • ParanoidZombie #186 4 years ago

    Since MGS3 got a 8 on EG too, I fail to see the problem. And if you think that an 90 minute cutscene is a good thing in a videogame, well you may understand that some of us disagree.

  • krudster #187 4 years ago

    "waits for the edge review..."

    Both Oli Welsh and Dave McCarthy have written dozens of reviews for Edge ;)

  • phatb0y #188 4 years ago

    8 is a good score, and spot on by EG standards.

    -1 For it being MGS/Marmite

    -1 For it being a PS3 game

  • SteveB #189 4 years ago

    "This is ,simply, one of the most unfair, false and ridiculous reviews I've read in all my life. I won't visit this web anymore." etc.

    "New research released by ISFE has revealed further insight into who is playing games across Europe.....The results of the research also indicate that gamers are getting older, with the UK boasting an average gamer age of 33, compared to 30 in Finland and 26 in Spain".

    Does. Not. Compute.

  • JonFE #190 4 years ago

    @Darren:
    You miss the obvious my friend. You are supposed to add 2 to the PS3 scores and subtract 2 from the x360 ones, in which case Halo 3 comes down to 8 8-D

    @SteveB:
    You are right, it does not.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 10:57

  • roquito #191 4 years ago

    ¿¿¡¡¡¡¡¿¿¿¿MGS3 got and 8 tooo????!!!!! ¡Jajajajaja!! This is absolutely ridiculous.

  • macaonghusa #192 4 years ago

    ah, this game was making me consider getting a ps3 soon but not so sure now, was really hoping they would sort out the ridiculous cutscene to gameplay ratio but that doesn't seem to be the case

  • DAL9000 #193 4 years ago

    Wait a se... so, the game is SUPER-AWESOME because, starting roughly halfway through its length, there are a series of moments where Kojima tinkers with the game design and plays around with the user's expectations, but the reviewer /doesn't want to tell us exactly what he means by that/ because it would /spoil the freakin' experience/?

    Examples, please! Because right now I have no idea WTF the review is talking about, and it baffles me. I thought reviews were supposed to, y'know, discuss the game's content. If the play-style shifts markedly halfway through the game, surely that's worth discussing in depth?

  • chicknstu #194 4 years ago

    Nice to read a review that's honest, not blurred by hype.

  • Kostabi #195 4 years ago

    Dave McCarthy gave Folklore a 5. Scientific proof that his opinions on games are wrong. ;)

  • Kenshin001 #196 4 years ago

    "8 is a good score, and spot on by EG standards."

    True, Gears of War got an 8 on EG and that seems pretty popular. Don't know what the other -1 was for with that one though.

  • morriss #197 4 years ago

    Sounds awesome to me.

  • prolific8 #198 4 years ago

    @CannonAnBall

    You may think Halo didn't deserve 10/10 (and if I'm honest, even as a fan of the game I would agree with you), but to dimiss it out of hand as "shit" is just plain idiotic. I expect you couldn't quantify it if you tried.

  • ParanoidZombie #199 4 years ago

    @roquito: when will you understand that 8 is a very good score by EG's standards? Read the scoring policy, FFS.

    EDIT: funny thing is, the comments section of the 9.9 IGN review is full of whiners complaining that the game didn't get a 10!
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:01

  • DAL9000 #200 4 years ago

    @ Wendelius:

    Admit it, dude. The only reason you bothered posting was that you wanted an excuse to use the word "oubliette." But the excuse you found was quite a good one, so hey! Well done. A hundred cocktails to you, good sir!

  • roquito #201 4 years ago

    IGN uk: 9,9
    Meristation 10
    Swedish Magazine 9'7
    Chief:9'7
    Hobby Spain:9'6
    Gamepro: 5/5(=10)
    etc.... ad infinitum
    Congratulations, Eurogamer.

  • johnboy_johsnon #202 4 years ago

    Just tp point out that Psychonauts, one of my fave games of all time, got an 8/10 on this site http://ww w.eurogamer.net/article.php?art... The game ended up being voted game of the year (for 2006 I believe).

    People get a little hung up about the score at the end of the page, it's personal opinion at the end of the day. This whole thread just reminds me of when they awarded Gear of War 8/10. To be honest I thought they were being generous then.

  • LeD #203 4 years ago

    All baiting aside, reading the review really makes me want to pick this game up.

  • CannonAnBall #204 4 years ago

    @ prolific8

    ..maybe saying it was "shit" was a little harsh, so I stand corrected on that one. My problem with Halo3 and it's scoring was that the leap from 2 to 3 was very very minimal when I was expecting so much more. I say it was shit because for me it is probably one of the biggest let downs.

  • smoothpete #205 4 years ago

    roquito, please leave now you utter bellend

  • miiiguel #206 4 years ago

    I thought IGN was 360 biased..., and EDGE was the god of the magazines, but they aslo gave Halo3 10/10, and it seems by the comments to be a shitty game...

    Man, this video-gaming world is very confusing.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:03

  • slivir #207 4 years ago

    All this bullshit talk and complaining about the score... you guys are gonna be put into a mental asylum one of these days, chewing your fingernails and muttering obscenities and random digits from 1 to 10.

  • SeesThroughAll #208 4 years ago

    Sounds like the game was reviewed by someone who dislikes MGS to begin with.

    The game is good, what are the PS fanboys worked up / XBox fanboys excited about?

    I'm buying it.

  • Darren #209 4 years ago

    @JonFE - Ah right, sorry I'm a bit slow today so thanks for explaining that... it does make sense (kind of) and it certainly fits my example anyway as I believe Halo 3 is more an 8 than a 10! LOL

  • TheNinkyNonk #210 4 years ago

    Every new PS3 review makes me glad I shifted the old girl on ebay.

    Shame.

  • roquito #211 4 years ago

    It seem Eurogamer only love the- like we say in Spain- "Macarra games"( Games for punks). Because hte most rated games on EG are cars games, music games, games for MACARRAS, and without any plot at all

  • peteb #212 4 years ago

    Meristation
    Swedish Magazine
    Chief
    Hobby Spain

    yes...the pillars of game reviewing.

  • anamenos #213 4 years ago

    very good review from EG. NJ2 deserved 7, it got 7. The same with MGS4...

  • InsoFox #214 4 years ago

    @roquito and everyone else in the world:

    Since when does a review have to be impartial? (+ ????, for good measure)

    If that were so, every review would say the same thing.

    If that were so, all a reviewers job would be was to state facts about the game - something that you could do without even playing it.

    If that were so, people wouldn't have favourite review sites, because there would be no sense that one site closely matches your own opinions and another site differs from your opinions.

    A review is a combination of facts about a game, combined with personal opinions about a game, presented in such a way as to describe and evaluate the game for someone who hasn't played it and wants to know more before buying it. This person then reads the review and, based on the words in it, can be helped to decide whether it sounds like the kind of game they like and, significantly, whether any flaws the reviewer found in the game will be ones that will particularly bother them.

    Of course, the fanboys complaining (about what is, after all, a great score!) will buy the game no matter what, so they're forgetting one important point: THIS REVIEW IS NOT FOR THEM.

  • Volcane #215 4 years ago

    Strange review, reviewed by someone who seems like they don't like MGS series. The closing comment of We love you Snake, don't come back seems to go against the score of 8/10, because if it is good why wouldn't you want another game.

    Oh well, Ill see what it is like in 12 days time.

  • magikdodo #216 4 years ago

    This review is incomplete in my opinion. No words on the gameplay mechanics, how
    the controls work, and how the little metal gear nuances feel also a la octocamo
    and mk 2.
    So many issues unresolved and i thought it would get a 10/10. I'm sure it
    will be better than GTA 4 and that got a 10/10..Hmm..

    Anyways does anyone in the UK know when the stores will start putting out
    MGS 4 console bundles? I've been saving up my pennies a while now and i pray i get
    my hands on the game in another 13 days now.

    Thanks

  • roquito #217 4 years ago

    For PETEB: Meristation is THE FIRST SITE OF GAMING IN SPANISH. It's very important. At least has 99% more visits than EGamer, and it's more important taht you and me, of course.
    And INSOFOX:The only fanboy is you, because the only site with the 8 note is Eurogamer. Stop defending the imposible.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:09

  • septimus #218 4 years ago

    For some reason to the Xbots on this site, 8 is now bad. As is 7 for some reason. Yet not going to stop them getting Ninja Gaiden 2 and masturbating over it furiously.


    Seems like every other MGS, it has it own way of doing things and it's going to keep doing them. No bad thing. MGS will never get a 10 anywhere, it's to fractured in what it is trying to achieve. Anyone who thought different (I guess I would expect a nine at best) was kidding themselves.

  • Kostabi #219 4 years ago

    What are you raging idiots going to do when EG end up reviewing Metal Gear Online as a separate entity? Are you going to start singing EG's praises because the combined score equals 18 out of 10 or something?

  • miiiguel #220 4 years ago

    Meristation... er... macarras..., man...

    more!
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:11

  • Dizzy #221 4 years ago

    "Dave McCarthy gave Folklore a 5. Scientific proof that his opinions on games are wrong. ;) "

    He gave Bangai-O a 10. Proof that his opinion is right and that god exists.

  • Wash #222 4 years ago

    IGN uk: 9,9
    Meristation 10
    Swedish Magazine 9'7
    Chief:9'7
    Hobby Spain:9'6
    Gamepro: 5/5(=10)
    etc.... ad infinitum

    wow, just wow.

  • DomUltra #223 4 years ago

    @peteb - yeah like this shitty website is any better than those. Give it a break shit streak.

  • Beano #224 4 years ago

    "Throw-away games like GRID get a 9."

    I agree.. I was a bit puzzled by that one. GRID looks like a nice game (have ordered my copy) but judged by the demo, it's not 9.

  • klanger13 #225 4 years ago

    Seriosuly does anyone know if you get the online with it. None of the reviews have mentioned it at all?

  • tobsen #226 4 years ago

    "David Hayter's voice performance isn't much more than an attempt to create the gravelliest, throatiest croak ever recorded by man..."

    That is just soooo true, thanks for calling it like it is. This guy is the most overrated voice actor in the industry. His style nearly spoiled every single MGS game for me, too bad that V4 still has the same "issue".

  • roquito #227 4 years ago

    Dizzy Folkore was not a good game
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:11

  • peteb #228 4 years ago

    @roquito

    My bad, I haven't heard of it.

    Anyway, I'm just saying lets wait for more reviews to get the full picture. I trust EG reviews more than any of those others though. I remember being annoyed at the 8 score for Gears. They were right though.

    Anyway, sounds like fans of MGS will have no complaints with this game, and that's all that matters anyway.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:14

  • XdarXideX #229 4 years ago

    Of course, these people complaining about the cutscenes do realise they're skipable, right? Yes? Please? Ok? Got it?

    Isn't MGO an entirely seperate game? I was under the impression it's not even on the disc, but downloadable. Or maybe they're just not allowed to say anything about it yet.

  • miiiguel #230 4 years ago

    macarras!

    piri-piri!

    oh, please, more!

  • stampax #231 4 years ago

    Why are some people upset? 8 is a good score. It suggests the game is really really good - where's the problem?

  • Dizzy #232 4 years ago

    "It seem Eurogamer only love the- like we say in Spain- "Macarra games"( Games for punks). Because hte most rated games on EG are cars games, music games, games for MACARRAS, and without any plot at all "

    The irony. MGS has a plot? I can write a program that would generate the "plot" in MGS.

    Also please look at your Spanish games top 10 and then come back and say you guys have taste in games.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:15

  • DAL9000 #233 4 years ago

    @Arbiter: "The fact that there isn't a single word about MGS online in the review struck me as misleading, and based on the H3 precedent I just described, very unfair.

    Am I being unreasonable?"

    There's a pretty good chance that you are, in fact, being unreasonable. How do you know that they COULD review the online component? It's a couple weeks yet before this game comes out -- what if the servers aren't up yet? Somebody else mentioned that earlier in the thread; you seem to have glossed over the possibility.

    So, uh, any thoughts on that?

  • roquito #234 4 years ago

    Eurogamer "Macarra" is ,at the moment, like a driver in wrong direction, thinking that all that are driving good are crazy
    And for DIZZY: your last post is so ridiculous that doesn't deserve more comment (MGS doesn't has plot:JAJAJAJA)
    Edited by 3 at 30/05/08 @ 11:15

  • Yossarian #235 4 years ago

    "For some reason to the Xbots on this site, 8 is now bad. As is 7 for some reason. Yet not going to stop them getting Ninja Gaiden 2 and masturbating over it furiously."

    The people in this thread complaining about this score vastly outweigh the people crowing about it.

  • T4RG4 #236 4 years ago

    If reviewed by MGS lovers it'd get 9.5/10, if reviewed by Eurogamer dude who has the same problems with MGS in general as a large slice of gamers do (I think MGS is an ego trip for one guy) it gets 8/10 which is still a superb score. What's the problem?

    However, the review makes it plain that its still got the same fundamental design content and mechanics that I've always disliked.

    The only time I've really disagreed with a Eurogamer review was after playing Halo 3... christ, now that MUST have been reviewed by a Halo lover... dull, dull meh. But I digress.

  • mcmonkeyplc #237 4 years ago

    Same as Halo:CE then! This game must rock!

  • DarthKebab #238 4 years ago

    I loved the PS1 game, removing the joypad from port 1 to port 2 so that boss (Psycho Mantis?) could not read your mind was genius.
    Did not get on with MGS2 as much for some reason, seemed a bit too backtrack for me, one of my pet hates about MGS1 - crawling in that box through that cave of wolves was just too boring, did not really play Snake Eater as it seemed a bit more fiddly control wise.

    It was a well written review that makes it sound excellent but still may retain some old annoyances, will be buying though for definite.

  • mkreku #239 4 years ago

    What the hell.. this comments section exploded for no reason at all!

    8 is a great score! And if you read the review, I'm sure you'll find out why it got what it got. It even managed to make me (who hated MGS2 and 3) slightly interested in playing this game.

  • bad09 #240 4 years ago

    I don't see why people moan so much about the scores. Reviews are exactly what InsoFox put so well and if it doesn't tally with your own opinion so bloody what. I like to read an opinion on a game but I don't base my purchase on it. Many games score different to my own view. AC was a 6 on EG and that was one of my favourite games last year. SMG got 10 and I thought it was utter rubbish that should grovel in shame before Mario64!

    Sure sometimes I agree (GTA4 and H3 were 10/10 games to me) but it's not the end of the world if the reviewer feels differently about a game.

    (gotta admit it is suss there was no mention of the MGO starter pack at all, come EG why no mention at least!)

  • miiiguel #241 4 years ago

    roquito, love is in the eye of the beholder. You know the game is 11/10, and you find yourself to be be smarter than the rest of the populace. I know the feeling, I've been there. Then I grew up (and stoped listening only to Joy Division).

  • Yossarian #242 4 years ago

    "The only time I've really disagreed with a Eurogamer review was after playing Halo 3... christ, now that MUST have been reviewed by a Halo lover... dull, dull meh. But I digress."

    Actually it wasn't. As far as I can recall, Rob was underwhelmed by the series before the third installment.

  • roquito #243 4 years ago

    Next future Eurogamer reviews:
    Grid part 22: 9
    Forza 34:9,9
    Carmaggedon XX:9
    Resident Evil XX:6
    MGR:7
    Truck me men:9
    They love macarra games

  • miiiguel #244 4 years ago

    you said that before... (thrice). Why don't you indulge us with your review, macarra man ?
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:19

  • MrDurandPierre #245 4 years ago

    I was expecting higher, but an 8 is good and I'm still stoked. I can understand a lot of Oli's criticisms and will likely agree with them (all the MGS games have had unnecessarily convoluted stories with way too much unnecessary boring exposition and some cheesy dialogue to boot), but I've found that the MGS hold up better on repeat playthroughs once you know the story and gameplay mechanics and can then just skip through the more boring cutscenes and codecs. I recently went through MGS3: Subsistence again in preparation for MGS4, and since it had been a couple years, I decided to sit through all the cutscenes and codecs and good lord are they long and often boring! But the gameplay still hold up spectacularly even after 2+ years and 5 playthroughs. There's just so much depth and variety to how you play that even as a single-player linear game it has more replay value than just about any game in my collection. MGS2 doesn't hold up as well though, but even that game is significantly better once you know the story and can skip past the fat. So yeah, I don't expect my first playthrough of MGS4 to be spectacular, but I think it'll age well and that's something that wouldn't come across in early reviews.

  • strelok #246 4 years ago

    so basically the text says "if you liked mgs 1-3 you will love this".
    works for me.

  • roquito #247 4 years ago

    Miguel, I'm too old for this. I am a gamer of the spectrum era, and I know when a review is wrong, and even why .

  • deem #248 4 years ago

    hahahah PS3 is carp.

  • mkreku #249 4 years ago

    But still, the most jarring example of a missed score must be the 10/10 for Oblivion, right? ..right?

  • miiiguel #250 4 years ago

    You do think you are "smarter", don't you... ;)

  • roquito #251 4 years ago

    ¿Eurogamer or MicroGamer?

  • XdarXideX #252 4 years ago

    Dizzy I would love to hear what your opinion of a decent plot or story is. As far as I'm aware, the Metal Gear Solid series has some incredibly detailed and creative storylines, plotlines and conspiracy theories. It's also intelligently connected to the modern world surrounding us today.

  • M83J01P97 #253 4 years ago

    So is this another movie with a bit of game play thrown in to justify it's 'game' status? Don't get me wrong, I love the MGS series, but I buy a game to... you know... play a game, not be subjected to hours of deep, overly-complex narrative, only for it all to be blown away and reveled to be something even more confusing at the end...

  • DjFlex52 #254 4 years ago

    wow...people are joining EG just to complain about an 8/10 for MGS4.
    roquito? You have 10 posts...all of them whining in this thread.

    Who are you? And why post a bunch of bogus sites with high MGS4 scores? Who cares?
    This is madness....it's just a fucking game!

  • Beano #255 4 years ago

    Deem: "hahahah PS3 is carp."

    LOL... instant classic :)

  • Aloominum_man #256 4 years ago

    Roquito - how do you know? Have you played it? Finished it?

  • Yossarian #257 4 years ago

    Metal Gear Solid is in the same relation to great narrative as a Magic Eye book is to great painting.

  • Les #258 4 years ago

    So it's a next gen game with the same faults as its previous gen versions and this time it only gets an 8?!?!

    Even in not making sense EG makes no sense...

    The 10/10 of GTA4 is a travesty, that's for sure and I think this score is fair: MGS is a (rather big) niche game franchise and definitely not something for the inexperienced.

  • mkreku #259 4 years ago

    I am sure they will review the online component later.

  • Dizzy #260 4 years ago

    "Dizzy I would love to hear what your opinion of a decent plot or story is. As far as I'm aware, the Metal Gear Solid series has some incredibly detailed and creative storylines, plotlines and conspiracy theories. It's also intelligently connected to the modern world surrounding us today. "

    Please.. don't push it. Read more books FFS.

  • moggsy #261 4 years ago

    So, not a system seller then.

  • Redeye #262 4 years ago

    Quite possibly one of the most bizarre comment threads ever. Some of you guys really need to step away from the keyboard, go outside, take a deep breath and wipe the froth away.

  • Derblington #263 4 years ago

    roquito - you're acting like a 5 yr old, that you claim to be an adult amazes me.. If you don't agree with the score, fine, now go away.
    The fact that your English isn't fluent suggests that you may not grasp the complete meaning of the text of the review, in the same way that I wouldn't understand a review in Spanish, French or German. Seriously, if you don't like it here, stop spamming the board with rubbish and just go back to the sites that you do appreciate.

  • T4RG4 #264 4 years ago

    "The only time I've really disagreed with a Eurogamer review was after playing Halo 3... christ, now that MUST have been reviewed by a Halo lover... dull, dull meh. But I digress."

    Actually it wasn't. As far as I can recall, Rob was underwhelmed by the series before the third installment.


    Yeah, I should have checked :D Now I'm even more convinced the score was rigged ;)

    Oh, and GRID 9/10 I disagreed with... (note *I* I'm not saying it's wrong).
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 11:28

  • Yossarian #265 4 years ago

    This thread will do Halo 3/Gears of War numbers I can just see it.

  • americorloliveira #266 4 years ago

    Isto é uma vergonha depois de dar 9 ao Grid vão dar 8 a este jogão que está a ter 9 e 10 em todo o lado.

    A Microsoft anda aqui é mesmo uma vergonha.

    Não percebem, problema vosso, é que este site não merece eu estar a escrever em inglês!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • space_ace #267 4 years ago

    hip-hop gear solid, that would be solid gold!

  • XdarXideX #268 4 years ago

    Go fuck yourself Dizzy. Stop dodging questions.

  • DjFlex52 #269 4 years ago

    @americorloliveira

    Your first post isn't in English on an English game site...novel way to make new friends ;)

  • Derblington #270 4 years ago

    Arbiter - MGO beta has already been covered by the site and Shinji has confirmed that they will be looking into the MGS4 bundled 'starter pack', etc, at a later date. Regardless, it's not unreasonable to leave it out depending on whether a) it's not a complete mode in itself, rather just a little bonus (something that can easily be covered in a seperate article), and b) the review of the game is of the game itself or the complete disc package. Either is valid.

    The reason that the MP was mentioned in Halo3 is that it has, arguably, become the most important part of the game. MGO will never do that for the MGS series and therefor it doesn't require the same page space in the review.

    Either way it comes down to the importance you put in that part of the game, something a review mirrors itself. No two people will agree 100%. Accept this for wht it is and move on.

  • miiiguel #271 4 years ago

    americolol

  • DAL9000 #272 4 years ago

    @Dizzy

    "Read a book" is exactly right -- I've always thought the MGS series would fail MISERABLY as novels. Or as movies. Or as stage plays. Kojima genuinely doesn't seem to grasp the most basic rules of storytelling, or if he does he feels free to ignore them. MGS, really, strikes me as a series of great games that are buried beneath a heap of slush-pile-quality crap.

    Whether the game is worth suffering through the slush-pile crud for is another question -- one that I go back and forth on, honestly. It's why I /buy/ the MGS games but then tend to give up on them halfway through.

  • NickD7 #273 4 years ago

    Lolz, I said Lair and Haze scores were just tremmors, the real earthquake was coming when MGS4 flopped.

    I was right,

    lolz once again, EPIC FAILURE.

  • PotajiTo #274 4 years ago

    8 is a great score. If you have a ps3 you HAVE to buy it.

  • bad09 #275 4 years ago

    @ Derblington

    I have to agree with Arbiter. Starter pack or not it comes WITH MGS4 so it deserves at least a mention in the review, or at least tell us it's being reviewed separately. I am keen to know what's in the starter pack.

  • MyPointIs #276 4 years ago

    8 is a number

  • Quint2020 #277 4 years ago

    PS3lol?

    /gets coat

  • OrgasmicMutton #278 4 years ago

    To be honest I think Eurogamer chose the perfect guy for a review in someone who both loves and hates the series. For these are the only people the review actually matters to.

    If you already love the MGS series then you'll have pre ordered this already and your mind wont be change by any criticisms of over long cutsequences and impenetrable plot.

    If you already hate the series then no review on earth will persuade you to touch it with a barge pole.

    So what of people like myself who (if I actually owned a PS3) would be swithering about whether to buy the game? What of the people who enjoyed MGS but disliked MGS2? Who enjoyed the gameplay but who found the CODEC rather tedious? Who liked the silly characters, boss fights, and silly jokes but disliked the crudely handled pompous metaphors and sometimes dodgy voice acting? We're the people who need a review that weighs up the good and the bad and tells us whether the game is worth out hard earned cash.

    This is EXACTLY the type of review that does this. An almost entirely positive review clearly written by an enthusiastic fan (see IGN's review for an example) is all well and good but tells us little. Whereas a review like this that is a bit more objective would hold much more sway over any decision to part with hard earned cash?

    So the big question is - would I part with said cash?

    The answer; based on this review is yes. The review did have a lot of negative points but the overall feeling I got was that this was a game worth playing. While not as good as Metal Gear Solid (explicitly stated in the first page) it sounds like a mostly enjoyable experience interrupted by some tedium but nowhere near as much as in MGS2. I got a good impression from the review and if I had a PS2 I'd be buying it now.

    While the score is less relevant an 8 is enough to persuade me to by a game like MGS4.

  • Widge #279 4 years ago

    I think if it comes on the disc/package that you buy, then you review the whole wadge. Otherwise its like reviewing an album but deciding to omit the last two tracks from your critique.

  • Eurytus #280 4 years ago

    How did this maracca guy get out of kindergarten so early?
    Is it half days on Friday or something?

  • InsoFox #281 4 years ago

    Well, I guess I'll have to stop saying things like 'the function of a review is to provide facts (to describe what happens when you play the game) combined with personal opinions (to describe what the reviewer actually thought about the game, and why).'

    Because apparently, according to roquito that means that 'the only fanboy is me.' You're right. I'm a massive fanboy for common sense. What was I thinking?

    If you'll excuse me, I need to go to Tesco now to restock on my irony.

  • miiiguel #282 4 years ago

    anyway, I found the review very well written and if I had the time to own 2 (different) consoles, this would be instant buy for me, because I dig this kinda game. I also like racers, and shooters, and RPGs..., macarra and other stuff, in a nutshell.


    Guess I'm just a normal guy, it's really a shame I can't be above the populace like a true "MGS fan" or whatever they call themselfs nowdays.
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 11:45

  • NickD7 #283 4 years ago

    I would just like to say thank you to Eurogamer for not putting out a over hyped review like IGN ect. Because of your honesty in calling this game a massive flop I have saved myself 300 quid on a PS3 and have 0 reason to buy one now.

    Thanks again.

    lolz at epic flop of the century.

  • Masarin #284 4 years ago

    I love you Eurogamer!

  • PlugMonkey #285 4 years ago

    So how do you review a new Metal Gear Solid? Do you assess it on its own terms, ones that its legion of fans will understand? Do you play the sceptic, and take Hideo Kojma and his team to task for their stubborn refusal to catch up with what the rest of the world expects of a videogame? Or do you walk the path of compromise, down the middle?

    You do neither. You review it from a position of objectivity. That's what you do when you review anything. What are they teaching kids in journalism school nowadays?

    SO! The cutscenes/codec conversations are still as intrusive and annoying as ever. OK. I can deal with that. Even if it does leave me with the impression of trying to get on with some work with my mum phoning me up every 5 minutes.

    What about the controls? Do they still feel like they've been dug up by an archeologist?

  • rotmm #286 4 years ago

    roquito,

    You originally registered as panashe, said you were leaving twice and then reregistered as your current name to continue your childish rantings about how this review is unfair.

    The question is why? I am guessing you are just a paid Sony shill, spreading FUD on reviews that do not make the Sony PR grade.

  • Eurytus #287 4 years ago

    This install before each chapter bit sounds very problematic. Does it wipe out each previous install when you change chapters or do they accumulate? If so how many gigs is this game going to take up?
    At this rate anymore than about 10 games and the hard drive will be out of space.

  • Camorrista #288 4 years ago

    IGN uk: 9,9
    Meristation 10
    Swedish Magazine 9'7
    Chief:9'7
    Hobby Spain:9'6
    Gamepro: 5/5(=10)
    etc.... ad infinitum
    Congratulations, Eurogamer.

    Yes, this is precisely why I come to Eurogamer.

  • lennon #289 4 years ago

    "Such is the luxurious length and mind-numbing detail of the cut-scenes and codec conversations that you could put the pad down for almost half the game's ample length. (One character actually asks you to do so at one point, resulting in a typically self-aware and genuinely hilarious joke.)"

    See this is why Eurogamer is so useful. I have no need to read any further. I already know that at this point in the game I would be throwing the controller through the TV as I absolutely would not find that funny.

  • indotoonster #290 4 years ago

    Would just like to say, excellent review!

    Full disclosure: I really loved the original Metal Gear Solid (albeit very bizarrely, on the PC -- I was at a friend's flat and he demo-ed MGS2 on his PS2, and being a skint student the next best thing I could do was buy MGS for my lowly PC), but when I eventually took the plunge into console gaming and got MGS2 from the budget bin years later, found it underwhelming. Didn't bother with MGS3. This review really captures everything that I like and hate about MGS.

    Can't say I'm going to rush out and buy this... perhaps in a year or so, once it's hit the platinum series, or whatever the PS3 budget range will be called...

  • Razzajazz #291 4 years ago

    This is just embarassing... To all those people who disagree with the review, is it going to stop you buying the game? If not, what's it got do with you, then? Why the hell do you need Eurogamer to validate your belief system? People, please, just calm down! I am a total MG/MGS fanboy, and yet I completey agree with the review! IMO, only MGS1 was/is deserving of a 10, becasue back then it was innovative. And while MGS may well have pushed the storytelling medium foward, didn't we all get into this hobby to play games?

    Basically, to make a long story short, if you don't agree with EG, just fuck off and go play the game when it comes out. There really is no need to try and demonstrate superior taste or intellect, it's just a game! And a game that got a good score at that!!!

    And breathe....

  • dr_faulk #292 4 years ago

    I'd just like to point out that Sega Bass Fishing on the Wii got 7/10.

  • Ali_sdf_pwn3d #293 4 years ago

    hahaha what utter bullshit...this game is easily a 10...as soon as i play it it will be confirmed!

    XBOTS just dont get it...go back to playing halol which is the worst game ever!!! we'll be playing this, and lbp, and gt5, and KNOW we have the best console!! sony ftw!

  • InsoFox #294 4 years ago

    rotmm -

    Props for pointing out the re-registering, but I think Sony wanted to pay someone to secretly post on message boards for them, they'd probably pick someone with the ability to string more than 3 words together without tripping over them and falling flat on their face.

    I know this is not his first language but, considering he is commenting on the writing in the review, I think it's fair game.

  • Widge #295 4 years ago

    ooo! gardening sim on the way!

    [link url=http://uk.ps3.ign.com/arti cles/877/877899p1.html?RSSwhen2008-05-30_004700&RSSid=877899
    ]http://uk .ps3.ign.com/articles/877/87789...[/link]

    fingers crossed for We're Fossil Hunters HD!

  • thewolfiv #296 4 years ago

    8? 8? if your an MGS fan thats a 9 at least - eurogamer you have just killed my last hope for my PS3, god i hope your wrong...

  • CitizenGeek #297 4 years ago

    Haven't actually read the review (or the score yet) but ZOMFG!!! That picture of Metal Gear Rex is AMAZING!!

  • Widge #298 4 years ago

    Cancelled my play pre-order for this .... : (





    because I've noticed its cheaper with the MODGAMER code and 11% quidco from game!
    (and probably more reliable)

  • #299 4 years ago

    Interesting score.

    But I don't get it, how can any reviewer go into a review with openly saying" he loves and hates MGS", this in itself is not objective and give little credibility to his review. He should have acknowledged his subjective opinions based on previous games and set them aside.

    Not that this affects me, but Ive always considered MGS games to be above anything in their genre. I mean compare Halo3. What exactly did it do differently to HALO1 in comparison to MGS1 to MGS4 ?

    Theres a certain false dichotomy at work here imo and this review just doesn't hold water.

  • DAL9000 #300 4 years ago

    "DAL9000 isn't emo enough. UNMAN UP, BOY!"

    I'm working on it! I'm trying to find tight jeans and, like... ironically well-pressed white shirts, but those are expensive. And I'm trying to grow my hair out to a slightly androgynous length, but that takes time.

    Do I have to resort to DRASTIC MEASURES here??! /Do I need to raid my mother's makeup/??? (Or at least her eyeliner.)

  • psychokitten #301 4 years ago

    This comment thread is beyond embarrassing. I was going to +1 Shinji's prediction but I think a select few idiots have turned that around.

  • Baki #302 4 years ago

    Ok, Eurogamer. What I want to know is why would you give MGS 4 to a reviewer that doesn't like the series. (which in my opinion is made crystal clear by his last comment) I don't understand the logic behind this.

  • claymore #303 4 years ago

    /reads review

    so, is 8 a bad score these days? also, i hear haze is selling well. ~:p

    /interweb implodes

    seriously, if you're a fan of the series you'll buy it regardless.

  • monkie_king #304 4 years ago

    MGS4 is twice as good as Haze!

  • lb003g0676 #305 4 years ago

    I would trust this score over IGN, but they both lied to em abotu GTA4 beign so amazing, when it's actually crap, so I'll assume this is equally underscored, as GTA is overscored.... shame you can't go to 11/10 then.

    This website is a mess, nice try to mess up the meta score, it's still bloody high up.

  • DanWhitehead #306 4 years ago

    You review it from a position of objectivity. That's what you do when you review anything. What are they teaching kids in journalism school nowadays?

    A review is pretty much the opposite of objective writing. That's sort of the point.

    Also, reviewing videogames is not journalism.

  • Widge #307 4 years ago

    So what you're saying is, unless the score is exactly what you think it should be, its a lie.
    NICE.

    not at Dan! :D
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:05

  • NickD7 #308 4 years ago

    CVG says don't believe the hype

    Hello, Early reviews for MGS4 are creeping out on the internet and, like GTAIV, it's another near-perfect whitewash. "Without a doubt, one of the greatest games of all time", screams US magazine Gamepro, "Every once in a long time, a game will come along that changes all the rules... and MGS4's potential influence on the current state of gaming is nothing short of tectonic". Exciting? Yes. Accurate? No - it's total bullshit.

    We've finished MGS4. Twice. And while it's an incredible achievement, it's no more a seismic leap for games, than GTAIV was from GTA: San Andreas, or GTA3. It's merely - and we say this with a hefty pinch of salt - a wonderful next-gen polishing of a largely last-gen experience. The gameplay mechanics - while surely the series' most polished - are instantly recognisable, and despite reasonably freeform opening levels, it's not a shock reimagining of the series. 'Shocking' or 'tectonic' gameplay would have been fully destructible levels with truly 'nowhere to hide', as once billed. Or *huge* open world crowds where you need to use disguise, or body language, or real voice reading via an audio mic, to blend in seamlessly - but despite some excellent stealth sections, MGS4's best efforts are 'only' a polishing of MGS3's camouflage-led jungle sneaking; bar an unexpected, if fairly linear, stealth episode half-way through.

    Last gen experience confirmed. Game is a flop, deal with it people. People say Itagaki is a over rated dev, well Kojima is way more over rated. People should have expected these average scores after he tried to damage control his game last month by saying PS3 wasn't up to the job.

    More like your game is the flop of forever Mr Kojima.

  • monkie_king #309 4 years ago

    EG is totally biased, Sega Bass Fishing is easily an 8 if not higher.

  • Paulanator #310 4 years ago

    Sounds bloody brilliant.

    Everyone complaining about the score, just remember that EG have given 8's to Mass Effect, Gears of War, Halo and many other top games. Some of the best games ever made in fact.

    It basically sounds to me that if you've loved previous MGS games then this is more of the same (a very good thing for people like me) but if you've hated them then this isn't going to change your mind one bit.

    As soon as Sony pull their fingers out and release a decent PS3 bundle over here, I'll be getting this sharpish.

  • Pulsar_t #311 4 years ago

    This is exactly why I play solo. Most gamers are obsessive morons period.

    As an MGS enthusiast I'd never rate any entry in the series more than 9/10. The storytelling is fantastic and I like it, but it's an acquired taste. The gameplay is also prehistoric, and has been superceded by certain other franchises. But I still love the games, and I frown at the "perfect scores" from this immature so-called videogaming journalism. Halo3 and GTA4 are both vastly overrated as well.

  • NickD7 #312 4 years ago

    Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it.

    Sounds more like a 6/10 than a 8/10, score should be lowered imo.

  • RESIDENT_nEVILe #313 4 years ago

    I agree that this is a genuinely fair and unbiased review. The text clearly explains that for fans of the series - this is the sacred cow. But this being such a fair and balanced reviewed calls into question the score for: Halo3=10 and GTA4=10. Halo3 is a bit of a fanboy pleaser but to the average gamer twas, well..... average. And GTA4, whilst technically impressive (if not a little buggy) became very repetitve in places. Anyway, horses for courses, different opinions/reviewers. If the whole fan versus average gamers' opinion were balanced in every review - Halo 3 would be an 8, and GTA4 would be a 9.

    EDIT: Hmmm, basically what Pulsar said :)
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:12

  • luckettx #314 4 years ago

    One of the worst reviews I have read from this site. The reviewer clearly has an agenda to speak all the way through the review, constantly discussing how he hates all the characters from the series and holds that against the game as a whole. Then pepper the review with outright FUD like "Despite Kojima's downbeat sentiments on the PS3" and you have a review that reads like a lengthy message-board troll.

    I'm not one of the raving 'Score-collectors' that would find an 8 'unacceptable', but rather the content of the review is poor. You don't like the MGS games, we get it. But perhaps you werent the best choice for a review of a game that unashamedly advertises itself as the complete conclusion to the series.

    I'm also curious as to why all MGS4 reviews have conveniently forgotten to even mention the existence of the packaged MGO. Is there an embargo on that, as Konami themselves seem quiet on it, as I really enjoyed the beta and wondering what game-modes and extra's are in the full experience.

  • markypants #315 4 years ago

    Metal Gear Solid?

    Metal Gear Floppy more like!

    /Flame on.

  • DAL9000 #316 4 years ago

    @ Dan Whitehead: "A review is pretty much the opposite of objective writing. That's sort of the point.

    Also, reviewing videogames is not journalism."

    For a dude whose name is just another word for pimple, you, sir, are surprisingly AWWWWW-RIIIIIGHT.

    No, really. You /get/ it, which is why I'm glad EG employs you aaaaand a stable of reviewers who /likewise/ get it. Really, EG's reviews are an excellent mix of factual presentation aaaaaand personal opinion, unlike a great many other sites-- I'm looking at YOU, Gamespot -- which tend to have a much more bland, impersonal tone.

    So, uh. Yeah. Basic'ly what I'm trying to get at here is this: having a recognizable authorial voice is good in reviews, but bad in journalism. Letting your personal likes and dislikes show through, again, is good in one, bad in the other. Leaving the reader with a sense that it was written by somebody who is, ultimately, just some random dude with an opinion? Again: GOOD in reviews, BAD in journalism.

    So, SUMMING UP: yay for Eurogamer! It puts the e, u, r, o, g, a, m, e, and /other/ r in "a decidedly better-than-sucky game review site."

  • JonFE #317 4 years ago

    @Arbiter:
    The IGN UK review doesn't mention MGO at all too. Is that unacceptable also???

  • monkie_king #318 4 years ago

    I guess you should add a mark if you're a fan of the series, or if you like staring an an old man's asscrack for hours.

  • Les #319 4 years ago

    "and this is still a linear game."

    As if that's a bad thing?! GTA4 is linear as well, which didn't stop it getting a ridiculous 10/10. Review scores should be banned, they add nothing but page hits...


    "And the surround soundtrack is clearly a labour of love and extreme dedication, probably the best in gaming to date, lacking nothing in either pin-sharp precision or rib-shaking impact."

    Finally some recognition for audio in a review!

    \o/

  • #320 4 years ago

    Alot of sites are questioning why they left out the MGO aspect as it apparently was a fine addition to the game then IGn doesnt either..perhaps they included as a whole?

    Eurogamer ??
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:15

  • peteb #321 4 years ago

    @monkie_king

    if you like both those things then its a 10!

  • freeman29 Verified Editor EGTV, Eurogamer Portugal #322 4 years ago

    This is a strange review :(

  • mallocks #323 4 years ago

    "The reviewer clearly has an agenda to speak all the way through the review"

    Oh yes, clearly he'd made up his mind about the score before he even started playing it! Where's the endless praise for the best game ever that I woke up expecting? Bloody reviewers with their sodding agendas, if only I could go to a different site to find a review that provides the unstoppably postive delivery I'm after.

  • CitizenGeek #324 4 years ago

    I'm one of the people mentioned regularly in this review, that absolutely adores MGS, and completely understands it and how it works. So, I'm almost certain that I will enjoy this game much more than most! :)

  • Widge #325 4 years ago

    JonFE:

    I think so! Perhaps that would have topped off their Lasting Appeal mark!

  • Widge #326 4 years ago

    GTA 4 isn't linear? Linear suggests A to B progress throughout the game. Halflife2 for example. Whereas GTA 4 there is ample route for diversion away from the main objective. Its a bit like saying Oblivion is linear.

  • Widge #327 4 years ago

    GTA 4 is 10/10 in my book.
    Kotor was 1/10 in my book.
    Opinions ftw!

  • bad09 #328 4 years ago

    "The IGN UK review doesn't mention MGO at all too. Is that unacceptable also???"

    Hell YES! At least tell us why no mention. Konami have said the MGSO 'starter pack' will be with MGS4, it's of the package you pay for when buying MGS4 so why so quiet on it?

  • ps3owner #329 4 years ago

    8 = lucky number in china :)

  • itsfuzzy #330 4 years ago

    Is MGS4 a PS3 exclusive for good? Or are they going to port?

  • Les #331 4 years ago

    "GTA 4 isn't linear? Linear suggests A to B progress throughout the game. Halflife2 for example. Whereas GTA 4 there is ample route for diversion away from the main objective. Its a bit like saying Oblivion is linear."

    Exactly, GTA4 and Oblivion are linear. You can only start at A and end at B (for the few gamers that will actually finish both titles before they realise how terrible and boring they are). The fact that you can do most of the linearly structured mission sequences in a semi-random order, as well as some filler activities that do nothing for the general progression of the game, doesn't change the fact that they are essentially linear games.

  • BobsUncle #332 4 years ago

    Ok, So bought a PS3 for this and Little Big Planet.

    If LPB is shit then the only reason I'll keep it is for Blu-Ray.

  • andijames #333 4 years ago

    Whatever score they gave this game albiet 8 or 9 or even a 10 then some people would moan. It's called individual opinions and freedom of speech! Everyone should be intelligent to forge there own opinion from the review and make up there mind themselves. Period.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:33

  • Widge #334 4 years ago

    Ok, but where I'm getting at is that there is A to Q to V to C to M to E to B with the likes of Oblivion, whereas MGS being linear means that there is only the driving force of A to B with no diversion.

    (I'm sticking my neck out here with MGS4 as, like with everyone else, I don't have it yet!)

  • Yossarian #335 4 years ago

    "Plus I Eurogamer voided any respect when they gave GTA4 10/10."

    So what sites are left to you to read, hmmm?

  • freeman29 Verified Editor EGTV, Eurogamer Portugal #336 4 years ago

    Sad day for EG.net

    :(

  • Cider-X #337 4 years ago

    U R TEH 360 BIASED ERGOGAMER HGOW CAN U SAYS THIS ABOUT THIS GAMES?!?!?!?

  • ghearoid #338 4 years ago

    "Review scores should be banned, they add nothing but page hits... "

    And that's exactly why we have scores on EG - not to mention reviews over 3 or 4 pages...

    Plus, what else would you guys get to argue about?

    ;o)

  • bad09 #339 4 years ago

    Les that is plain silly! Of course there are goals to achieve it doesn't make GTA linear. It's how and when you decide to achieve those goals that makes it non-linear. By your definition chess would be a linear game, you have still a goal no matter how you do it.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:42

  • InsoFox #340 4 years ago


    "A review is pretty much the opposite of objective writing. That's sort of the point. "


    +1. See my comments a few pages back for my thoughts about objectivity and reviewing, but basically what I said is that if you had to be objective to write a review, it would just be a list of facts. Which you could do without playing the game.

    Reviews are necessarily subjective, and while it is bad practice to let someone who wants or expects to dislike a game review it, that's actually not because that person would be too subjective. It's more subtle than that; it's because that person is not best placed to represent views to the target audience.

    Let me give a clearer example. You wouldn't get someone who dislikes italian food to review an italian restaurant. Why? Because someone reading the review probably does like or is at least curious about italian food and are wondering whether to go to the restaurant. It's not that the reviewer is too subjective, it's just that they're not the right person to talk to someone who likes (or is at least curious about) italian food to persuade them one way or the other.

    On the other hand, someone who appreciates italian food can be **as subjective as they like** ('the portions were too small', 'the cheese was too mild') and still be useful to the consumer ('Well, I hate small portions, but I actually like mild cheese, so that doesn't bother me.')

    In the case of this MGS4 review, there's no evidence at all that the reviewer set out to dislike the game, not to mention the fact he gave it an 8, a very good score. So he's perfectly entitled to review the game and give his own subjective opinions of it.

  • mallocks #341 4 years ago

    @freeman29

    Yes, nothing quite spells the end of a gaming site like giving a widely anticipated behemoth 8/10.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:36

  • Lexx87 #342 4 years ago

    "Sad day for EG.net

    :( "

    Oh. My. God. IT'S ONE MANS FUCKING FUCKING OPINION. Thank god some of you get that, the rest of you, I really really do hate you all. Really. Die.

  • #343 4 years ago

    @InsoFox

    Not when you go into something with a preconceived idea of how you`ll like/dislike it so evidently apparent from that review. Reviews are not like writing articles for a newspaper. To review something you must bracket your subjective opinions and eventually formulate your subjective opinion based on your experiences from the context your reviewing, not go into it with a history of " like/dislike "

  • Lexx87 #344 4 years ago

    Also, it got a good score!!!!?!?!?!!1!?!?!!?!1111!?!?!?!!?!111111!!?!?!

  • Les #345 4 years ago

    "Ok, but where I'm getting at is that there is A to Q to V to C to M to E to B with the likes of Oblivion, whereas MGS being linear means that there is only the driving force of A to B with no diversion."

    No, in Oblivion (and GTA4) there's A1 to A2 to B1 to C1 to C2 to C3 to A3, etc. All strings of linear sequences that can be mixed but they all have a fixed order themselves (e.g. you can't do thieves guild missions in a random order). So they are linear games that allow you to experience the linear segments in a semi-random but strictly linear order.

  • Yossarian #346 4 years ago

    Not when you go into something with a preconceived idea of how you`ll like/dislike it so evidently apparent from that review. Reviews are not like writing articles for a newspaper. To review something you must bracket your subjective opinions and eventually formulate your subjective opinion based on your experiences from the context your reviewing, not go into it with a history of " like/dislike "

    I'm sorry, but you have this completely backwards.

  • Yaster #347 4 years ago

    8/10, thats a respectable score. Can't wait for this game :)

  • foamy #348 4 years ago

    Definitely buying a PS3 for this. Maybe in Christmas.

  • Derblington #349 4 years ago

    bad09/Arbiter - I thought that the game was reviewed behind closed doors at a Konami-rented location. The reviewers had 3 days to play the game and the reviews that are out are based on that experience. MGO may not have been available to play at that time, suggested by the fact that both 'high profile' site reviews so far do not mention it. It may not be the fault of the review/reviewer but that of Konami for not providing code to be seen/played.
    As I mentioned earlier, it makes no difference if the review is only reviewing the SP game and not the "whole package" (should they comment on black and white versus colour manuals and box art too?).
    It's a review of the SP game, nothing more - surely it's not so hard to realise that and pull your opinions in line, rather than shouting that it's not what you wanted? You can't change it afterall. Move on...
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:49

  • BobsUncle #350 4 years ago

    Fuck me Lexx, calm down mate.

  • evilboo #351 4 years ago

    i'm cancelling my preorder for swedish magazine. thought it was something else entirely.

  • InsoFox #352 4 years ago

    @DaemonB

    Um, but my whole point was that there isn't any evidence of a preconcieved notion of like/dislike in the review, except in the imaginations of people who want the score to be higher.

    People keep citing the last sentence, the 'don't come back' part, but they are taking it completely out of context. He's saying that he thinks this is a good end to the franchise, and that possibly having another game would be overstretching it. You could say that about a lot of -great- games. Personally I'm dubious about a sequel to the excellent BioShock. And I don't really want to see another Halo, despite thoroughly enjoying the previous games (to the tune of about 8 out of 10, I think).

  • Widge #353 4 years ago

    will power failed, read review
    sounds bloody fantastic!

  • Les #354 4 years ago

    "By your definition chess would be a linear game, you have still a goal no matter how you do it."

    No it would not. Unlike GTA4 and Oblivion, chess moves can be executed in principle in any order and are not tied together in sub-sequences that follow a strict order (there are of course standard openings but a player can divert from them).

  • _Price_ #355 4 years ago

    Good review. As has been reiterated thoughout the thread; 8/10 means that the reviewer thought it was a very good game overall and the text supports this.

    I don't actually enjoy MGS titles all that much, but I can appreciate that they're good, solid (heh) examples of the genre, a notion reflected by the number of people who like the games.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:54

  • knocker #356 4 years ago

    I appreciate some people need validation for their favourite games/system - but the attacks on the author's integrity and character are out of order in my opinion. Opinion - a word some of you a clearly lacking in your vocabulary.



  • Diomedes #357 4 years ago

    An 8 ?

    Go to hell EG

    When a mag cant recognize a masterpiece as this with a proper score due to some elitist congenital stupidity its something very bad ....for the mag.

  • NickD7 #358 4 years ago

    People can compare this score to other scores, other reviews, at the end of the day it's a 8/10

    flop.

  • bad09 #359 4 years ago

    @ Derblington

    You're missing the point. Sure that sounds reasonable but why not say that instead of saying absolutely nothing about part of the game people are interested in (even if it is just a starter pack). You may not care about that part of the game you are buying but it's clearly important to others, like myself and Arbiter. A big part of me buying MGS4 is the online starter pack after playing the beta.

    How you can compare SP and MP modes of a play to colour manuals and box art though is beyond me.

  • deem #360 4 years ago

    So does this pretty much confirm that the PS3 is crap?

  • #361 4 years ago

    @Isofox

    Oli said right at the start..
    "Then there are those - this reviewer included - for whom Metal Gear Solid is a love it and hate it proposition. !"

    IMO invalidates his review, he clearly sets out with an preconceived opinion.

    @Yossarian
    Im sorry i dont think i have, can you enlighten me please? You want a completely unbiased objective review? Give it to me, I havent played one single game of MGS ever. I have no clue or knowledge of the characters or mechanics.

    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 12:58

  • Rash' #362 4 years ago

    What I enjoy most about the MGS series is it's self referencial post modernist statements about war. In today's political climate it's more relavent than ever. It does more than 90% of the self indulgent crap on the market today because it encourages us to think. Not by taking itself seriously, but by constantly remaining us that what we are involved in is an outlandish gaming experience. Judging by the review 8 imo seems a justified score, but will hold out for Edge's review. Still picking this up though.

  • Pulsar_t #363 4 years ago

    I just watched the latest official trailer.. It's quite underwhelming :/

    Also, no mention of the blatant homoerotism in this game? :p

    I still feel compelled to play this, but Hideo Kojima is one odd screwball. He agreed to port the first two games to other formats, yet with 3 and 4 we're not going to be "privileged" with any conversions (I did play MGS3 on my PS2 however).. Or are we?

  • Nillsens #364 4 years ago

    I honestly feel confused. I don't know what to think when it comes to review scores these days.

    I feel like I could say more, but I feel empty. It's sort of like when you find out Santa isn't real.

    From today on I think I'll stop reading reviews. They seem to be completely superfluous.

  • InsoFox #365 4 years ago

    @dameonb

    Seriously, what? Because someone has things they love and hate about MGS they're not allowed to review it? As I said in my previous comments, someone setting out to dislike a game shouldn't be the person to review it (for reasons previously stated that I'm not going to say again). But judging by your criteria, the only person who's entitled to review a game is a person who has absolutely no preconcieved notions about it whatsoever. Good luck finding one of those, among people who are, after all GAMES JOURNALISTS.

  • mallocks #366 4 years ago

    @Rash'

    "post modernist"? Really? How so?

  • Chufty #367 4 years ago

    Maybe EG shouldn't give scores at the end of reviews?

  • Emth #368 4 years ago

    "oh man. how very depressing. was really looking fwd to this :("

    Jesus christ it's 8/10 not 4/10..

  • MangoBen #369 4 years ago

    Good review. Shame I can't stand overly long cut scenes about a story that I don't give a flying haddock about or this would have been an incentive to a get a PS3. As it is, I'm in no rush to get one now at all. Shame.

  • mallocks #370 4 years ago

    @Diomedes

    "An 8 ?

    Go to hell EG

    When a mag cant recognize a masterpiece as this with a proper score due to some elitist congenital stupidity its something very bad ....for the mag."

    If you can't realise just how ridiculous this sounds ... well, I really don't know what to say.

  • Pike #371 4 years ago

    A review is by definition an opinion piece. There is no objectivity involved, Arbiter.

  • bitesize #372 4 years ago


    bloody hell. people sure do get angry when another person's opinion doesn't match theirs, don't they?

  • johnnybrn #373 4 years ago

    I think there reason this is such a flame is not about MGS4 at all but the PS3 as this was the killer app that was going to pwn the 360. As this is now not the case fanboys are out in their droves pitchforks in hands ready to burn down eurogamer.

    8 is great score. I was soo looking forward to MSG1 on the PS1 but was let down incredibly by long cut-scenes, confusing story and unwiedly controls and have been put off since. To some this is the pinnacle of games. But for other this is not the case. This is not a game to can pick up and play and so does not have the mass-market appeal of other games like Halo or GTA.

    Its still an excellent game, but like Final Fantasy its not for everyone.

  • holey_cheeses #374 4 years ago

    They gave Halo 3, 10 out of 10 so they must now what they're going on about, right?

    Right?

  • bad09 #375 4 years ago

    @ Les

    "No it would not. Unlike GTA4 and Oblivion, chess moves can be executed in principle in any order and are not tied together in sub-sequences that follow a strict order (there are of course standard openings but a player can divert from them)."

    OK well with a few replaced words...

    GTA MISSIONS can be executed in principle in any order and are not COMPLETELY tied together in sub-sequences that follow a strict order (there are of course standard PROGRESSIONS but a player can divert from them).

    sounds pretty much the same to me.

    Sure a lot of the time you need to clear missions to a point then someone else will call with a new option but how and when you tackle the all different missions is down to you. That's the point you never seem to get about GTA you can have fun on your own without the missions just doing your own thing (and there's lots to see and do). Although the actual missions are the same the way I play GTA would be different to yours. That is the non-linear beauty of GTA games and others like Oblivion.

    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 13:09

  • Gaol #376 4 years ago

    EG clearly have an agenda, hell Shinji even admitted on the forums that the staff all discuss the reviews before they are published. What the agenda is, or what motivates it, who knows. After recent scores I don't see how there can be any doubt, unless you just accept the other possibility, which is their just shit at reviews.

    Wait for the AoC review which will be 7 or 8 even though its a heap of crap.

  • evilboo #377 4 years ago

    'oh no my identity is being shaken by a review score slightly lower than i anticipated (sob)!'

    grow some balls you whining cissies.

  • Foxclose #378 4 years ago

    The bottom line is that it's getting good reviews from everywhere now. A sign of a great game? Definetely a great story/experience in my opinion.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 13:09

  • DAL9000 #379 4 years ago

    @Arbiter: After all, who wants to read the rantings of an unfair, partisan, and biased critic

    I lol'd. 10/10 for the incredible irony, and a hundred cocktails to you, sir!

  • lambtron #380 4 years ago

    This thread is at once both hilarious and at the same time depressing. There are people bawling like spoilt little kids along the lines of:

    "The score for the game is without question (insert arbitray number here), oh I'm so special and misunderstood its only me that's sees teh truth! Why does no one undestand meeeeee, boo-hoo-fucking-hoo. I'm never reading this site again."

    The best part of all is that they have not played the game. I believe I even read one barely-veiled death threat to the reviewer. All because a freaking video game got 8/10.

  • JonFE #381 4 years ago

    @Arbiter:
    It's not the score that should hold any real value to the reader, it's the text before it. You are actually admitting that the 8/10 score forced you to read carefully and find the "holes" of the review (in this case the "antagonistic tone" and the omission of MGO). This, in my book, actually served a purpose higher that IGN's perfect 9.9 one - it made you think about how the reviewer sees the game and whether you agree with him or not.

    As for MGO, it may be a whole different ball game that deserves a review of its own, when the game servers are up and running and actual players are stressing the system. Who knows? Surely though, it's not a government secret that it's coming (although details may be scarce at the moment) especially among those reading an online review, don't you think? Nevertheless, it's a strange omission, but one displayed on both serious online reviews so far, so maybe it's not a coincidence...

  • Coughthulu #382 4 years ago

    After having spent my entire lunch hour just reading the comments after the review, I have come to a new GUTOR.

    That's "Grand Unified Theory Of Reviews."

    1) Games may only be reviewed by automatons. This is the only way people will agree that a score is truly objective. Emotions are not allowed, and merely cloud the issue.
    2) The scoring system does not work. 8 is obviously a rubbish score, befitting only the latest version of "Barbie Horse Adventures" (unless you like it, in which case, it's a 10. Naturally).
    3) If the FOX Network ever starts doing game reviews, its incrediblly unbiased and objective style would be met with celebration and joy from all who read them. It would not, I repeat not, cause the internet to physically explode in a torrent of emotional lava.
    4) Something about "maracas". Is Samba di Amigo involved?

    All this review said to me was "Hey, I liked it, but it's got a couple of flaws. If you liked previous MGS games, buy it, enjoy it.". I certainly will be. What's the problem?

  • DAL9000 #383 4 years ago

    Oh also! Wonga! "You should always try to be objective, otherwise the review is pointless as one can never really get inside the reviewers head to understand their personal tastes and biases."

    Seriously, you don't think /the text of the review/ can ever reveal anything about the reviewer's tastes and biases? This is why I'm a big fan of having a strong authorial voice in a review: it helps /reveal/ those little foibles, so the reader can tell if his or her personal tastes match up with those of the author. That's a lot better than a faceless, voiceless review that leaves you guessing on all counts, IMO.

  • daithi90 #384 4 years ago

    :o

    Blasphemy! 8?
    Same as Halo?

  • IronGiant #385 4 years ago

    It's highly amusing and somewhat sad to read all the pillocks who think we care one bit about whether their 'only reason to buy a PS3' exists or not.

    I didn't buy my 360 for one game nor my PS3. Twats.

  • #386 4 years ago

    @InsoFox

    I didn't say that at all, what i am saying, this guy `Oli` wasn't the best person to have reviewed it obvious from his opening statement which I bolded for you.

    In the end I couldn't care less but this sites reviews are becoming wonky as fuck.

  • baphomet777 #387 4 years ago

    This Oli Welsh person must enjoy licking the sweat off of Bill Gates' bollocks. IGN UK gave this game a 9.9, and Game Pro and The Official Playstation Magazine UK both gave it 10 out 10.

  • Bangaioh #388 4 years ago

    Yep, not buying a PS3 any more...

  • Madafunkola #389 4 years ago

    Would you want a crack-head writing a paper about crack - "Hey kids, crack is GREAT"?
    Nor would you want a gregorian monk to review the latest chanting compilation CD...
    So why would the GENERAL POPULACE want a die-hard MGS fan writing a review on MGS4. This "everyman" position is how a review should be.

    Personally - I hated the few bits of MGS games I have played and can think of nothing worse than hours of cut-scenes, but this review put them in a context (and with an overall score) that has actually got me curious.
    This is a NICHE game, and the hardcore Kojima fans need to realise that this review is pitched at the average gamer.

  • lambtron #390 4 years ago

    "and The Official Playstation Magazine UK"

    Oh yes OPM that bastion of unbiased reviews. They gave The Getaway 9/10...

  • NickD7 #391 4 years ago

    PS3 fans living up to their reputation as man babies and crying a river over a review score. Almost as bad as the time they made a petitiion when they were butt hurt over DMC4 going to 360.

    MGS4 is a flop, get over it already. Go play Uncharted, it's a better game. It's not Eurogamers fault that this game turned out crappy, blame Kojima.

  • ghearoid #392 4 years ago

    Ooh, teh dramz!

    ;o)

  • NickD7 #393 4 years ago

    THANK YOU EUROGAMER, NOW I DON'T HAVE TO BUY A PS3.

    that is all.

  • knocker #394 4 years ago

    @arbiter You are both humourless and humourous at the same time. I think the humour is unintended - but funny as fuck all the same.

  • bad09 #395 4 years ago

    Hey I liked the Getaway! Can't wait for the next one, being a Londoner :)

  • Les #396 4 years ago

    "GTA MISSIONS can be executed in principle in any order and are not COMPLETELY tied together in sub-sequences that follow a strict order (there are of course standard PROGRESSIONS but a player can divert from them)."

    No they can not. It's a very linear, branching tree that you must follow. That you can tackle (some of) the branches in any order doesn't take away from the fact that you still have to follow the branch (so you can't start in the middle of a branch, then go to the beginning and finally do the end). It's completely different from chess.

    "That's the point you never seem to get about GTA you can have fun on your own without the missions just doing your own thing (and there's lots to see and do)."

    I understand that that's a point of GTA. It's just a point that I happen to think is worthless. Those 'doing your own thing' elements (e.g. cycling, exercising, ambulance missions, etc. in SA) are in general very poorly executed (from a gameplay perspective, most of them resulting from the awful controls and bad camera) and just not fun to play. It's a bit like wasting your time on an MMORPG: too much like life and too poor to compete.

  • rob230 #397 4 years ago

    This thread roxorz

  • JonFE #398 4 years ago

    "I bet Eurogamer will be the ONLY site to review below 9/10 for MGS4."

    I doubt it will come true, but why is that bad exactly?

    Edit: BTW why do you exclude printed reviews?
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 13:36

  • baphomet777 #399 4 years ago

    Alright 360 m*therf*ckers, how's this for ya. This is my personal review: If MGS 4 is an 8, then those POS's Gears of War and Halo 3 on 360 are at best 1.5s. The Gears of War and Halo 3 discs aren't even worth letting a cat take a sh*t on. suck it!!!


    (if) MGS4 = 8.
    Halo 3 and Gears of War = 1.5
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 13:35

  • Beek4257 #400 4 years ago

    Wonder how EDGE is going to score this one.
    (being an optimist, I'm guessing 8)

  • Rizo #401 4 years ago

    Is it just me or does Eurogamer do this once a year.

    i.e Halo, Gears of war.

    It's simply an attention stunt to increase readership.

  • DAL9000 #402 4 years ago

    OMG, baphomet777! The combination of your SUPER-edgy name and your INCREDIBLY cutting, nay, /piercing/ commentary is too much for me! MY SYSTEM IS OVERLOADING!

    ::explodes::

  • Amazing Bryan #403 4 years ago

    HAHA! PS3 = Dead. Not that it ever really came to life. It will probably still get 10/10's from all the people that are still living in denial.

  • mallocks #404 4 years ago

    @Rizo

    Yep, I'm sure they're just dying for this sort of attention.

  • Emth #405 4 years ago

    I'm not convinced with this idea of giving games lower scores because of series/genre specific niggles - if you are playing the forth game in the series you are going to be aware of the story, general game play and the large number of cut scenes. You do not see this being done in many other cases.

    Many niche and specialist games get 9/10, for example Civ, Disgaea and Sim City, despite lacking any mass appeal, having genre specific quirks, and often not even earning a glance from the 'average 00's gamer' earn acclaim because they appeal to the fans of the series/genre - even if no one else.

    The question is, is MGS4 still an 8 with this taken into account (which it doesn't appear to be in the in review)
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 13:39

  • Les #406 4 years ago

    "Eurogamer is overrun with Sony hating XBOTS and Eurogamer knows it's audience."

    Don't underestimate the power of Live. On the one hand focusing on the hardcore gamer (a.k.a. video game reviewer) was a master stroke: They love the system and that's bound to reflect in reviews, consciously or not. On the other, it has limited 360's mass appeal so that we have a situation of a console with a lot of critically acclaimed games that isn't selling that well.

  • IronGiant #407 4 years ago

    I'll reserve judgement until my copy arrives but an EG score of 8/10 is quite a way off these scores from IGN.. at least with Ninja Gaiden2 most reviews seem to agree that it's good but not great, with MGS4 its either amazing or just good! Anyone who seriously believes this game was the saviour of the PS3 is incredibly niave. MGS games are loved by fans of the series and left well alone by pretty much everyone else, this one will probably sell more than MGS3 because the PS3 is early in it's lifecycle and has a relatively small selection of AAA games. It'll do good business in Japan for sure but it's far from the PS3's Halo.. in fact i don't think the PS3 will ever have one game or franchise that is head and shoulders above other games. The only game that could have taken that role would have been GTA but Sony missed the opportunity, or just couldnt afford to, make it PS3 exclusive.

    "10 Presentation
    From the opening videos to the end credits, the attention to detail throughout Guns of the Patriots is astonishing, setting new standards for production values in games.
    10 Graphics
    The visuals in MGS 4 are as cutting-edge as you can rightfully expect from the latest videogame blockbuster, boasting as much style as technical expertise.
    10 Sound
    The surround sound effects are stunning, having actual in-game effects, from using birdsong to detect enemies to choosing your own tunes.
    10 Gameplay
    Guns of the Patriots is the definitive MGS, taking stealth mechanics to new heights and throwing in so much more that you just have to discover it for yourself.
    9.5 Lasting Appeal
    Aside from the fact that the cut-scenes bear repeated viewing, you’ll want to play through MGS 4 again and again, simply to unlock ever more exotic weapons, items and player rankings."

  • NthSimulachum #408 4 years ago

    Perhaps all you crybabies and zealots on both sides could work out a modifier system based on ADVANCED DUNGEON AND DRAGON.
    Yes, there was only one of each.

    Eurogamer Score = D6 + (charisma/ (internet *wisdom) )+ stupidity.

  • Foxclose #409 4 years ago

    I just thought MGS 2 was ahead of its time (and maybe still is)

    As for this review, the vibe I got was that the reviewer was trying his best to hate the game and the Metal Gear series, but still had to give it an 8. The same score as Halo! ;)

  • septimus #410 4 years ago

    Well it should be a good thing. Anything EG gives an 8 to always turns out better than anything they give a 10.

  • muscleblade #411 4 years ago

    Relax PS3 owners it peobably get higher ratings by other reviewers. This is as good as Wartech: senko no rondo on the 360 according to Eurogamer lol. Anyone played that?

  • Grantelicious #412 4 years ago

    I can't take a review seriously from a site that actually gave Halo 3 a 10/10 LOL! Halo 3 was sucha mediocre FPS gaming experience.... seriously I've played sooo much better on the PC and yet they don't seem to like the Half-Life series as much even though it kicks Halo's shitty mediocre arse.

  • Moz #413 4 years ago

    Why do people seem to think that 8/10 is a bad score??????

    If it wasn't for EG throwing 10s at Halo and GTA4 every one would just be happy that the good lives up to promise more or less anbd carry on with their day.

    From the review i'd say this is a 10/10 for the fans of MGS in the same way that GTA is 10/10 for people who like that.

    But again it's all just subjective numbering, personally i tend looking at scoreing as putting a game in one of 4 catagories.

    1 - 3 - Stand clear this game sucks
    4 - 5 - Probably buggy, dull, not worth bothering with unless it really appeals to you
    6 - 7 - Solid game
    8 - 10 - Outstanding, gameplay and graphics a cut above the rest.

    Personally i think reviews should just bronze silver and gold recomendations (with rubbish games getting nothing)

  • DAL9000 #414 4 years ago

    @Arbiter

    If you seriously want an example of you being humorless and funny at the same time, you can just read my post from the last page. Enjoy your hundred cocktails, sir!

  • Graham_Bark #415 4 years ago

    "Eight is that tricky "almost brilliant" category, that for fans of the genre in most cases will still warrant serious recommendation to go out and buy, while even people into other genres will probably still draw plenty of enjoyment from. You should at the very least try and play the demo, borrow it or rent it first, but bear in mind that it's not necessarily going to appeal to every person who plays it."

    Eurogamer's idea of an eight, and that sounds just about right from the review. I doubt very many people ever bother reading the scoring system, it can be enlightening to know about before you start complaining. As for some PS3 - 360 comparison, 8 is the same score that Eurogamer gave Mass Effect, if somewhat contentiously, in much the same way as this. Honestly, if they're saying MGS 4 is as good as Mass Effect then no one really needs to complain about anything.

  • baphomet777 #416 4 years ago

    "OMG, baphomet777! The combination of your SUPER-edgy name and your INCREDIBLY cutting, nay, /piercing/ commentary is too much for me! MY SYSTEM IS OVERLOADING!

    ::explodes::"

    Thank you for the compliments DAL9000. :) Sorry about your system.

  • Les #417 4 years ago

    "The only game that could have taken that role would have been GTA but Sony missed the opportunity, or just couldnt afford to, make it PS3 exclusive."

    No, they just knew it wouldn't be as much of a deciding factor any more and not worth the money. And given that console sales don't appear to have been impacted much by GTA4's release, they were right. Of course they couldn't have dreamed that the next big thing would turn out to be a game like Wii Fit...

  • thedaveeyres #418 4 years ago

    Hilarious. Most over-rated gaming series ever.

    I'll still buy it, but that's coz I'm rich innit lolz. :p

  • Dizzy #419 4 years ago

    "Halo 3 was sucha mediocre FPS gaming experience.... seriously I've played sooo much better on the PC and yet they don't seem to like the Half-Life series as much "

    Plenty of idiots streaming in I see (probably from Kotaku). Orange box also got a 10 on EG BTW ;)

  • baphomet777 #420 4 years ago

    "HAHA! PS3 = Dead. Not that it ever really came to life. It will probably still get 10/10's from all the people that are still living in denial."

    Denial of what Amazing Bryan?

    If PS3 is dead there's no way I would buy the next version of either Nintendo (unless they finally decide to put out a good new home console next time -- something they haven't done since the Super Nintendo)'s or Microsoft's gaming machine...I wouldn't buy the next XBOX console even if Bill Gates personally promised to throw in free games for life and a personally delivered daily rim job.

  • JYM60 #421 4 years ago

    Nice one EG. Enjoy your hits.

  • PlugMonkey #422 4 years ago

    A review is pretty much the opposite of objective writing. That's sort of the point.

    Really? You don't think criticism should be at all objective? It could just be a fanboy rant? Interesting. I'd rather read an objective review that informed me sufficiently about a product that I could then make my own decision about whether I might like it or not. You can explain what you think works and doesn't work, but again I'd like that to be objective if possible. If you tell me a turn-based game is shit because you don't like turn-based games, that's roughly 3/5s of fuck all use to me.

    Unfortunately, in video games criticism, objectivity's a damned hard thing to find. I generally have to wade through pages of what the frustrated author would have done if they'd made the game. And really, I don't care.

  • muscleblade #423 4 years ago

    @baphomet777 : You havent played either Gears or Halo 3 thats a given. Those are amazing games no doubth. You havent played MGS4 either. To compare a game you havent played to 2 games you havent played is just stupid. You are a moron.

  • Emth #424 4 years ago

    @Ronan_Crawford

    But that's the point, it isn't trying too - it's the forth and final installment. You can't reasonably criticize it for not suddenly going mainstream.

  • lambtron #425 4 years ago

    "And given that console sales don't appear to have been impacted much by GTA4's release, they were right."

    Of course that had nothing to do with it being available from launch for the first time on a rival system that is cheaper, has a larger games catalogue and bigger install base???

  • muscleblade #426 4 years ago

    "I wouldn't buy the next XBOX console even if Bill Gates personally promised to throw in free games for life and a personally delivered daily rim job"

    Your loss. You dont know what your missing not owning a 360. Thats a pity really.

  • Rash' #427 4 years ago

    mallocks, It's pastiche of other games as well as it's self referencial material are post modernist trets.

  • miiiguel #428 4 years ago

    Like in every thread, soon everyone forgot this is MGS (or whatever), and Halo spawned! Man..., that Halo is really something...

  • mallocks #429 4 years ago

    @Rash'

    I think you're thinking of modernism, which is intensly self-referential. Post modernism is characterised (if memory serves) by a rejection of the validity of any given overarching meta-narrative, something which I think is fairly central to the MGS series.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 14:00

  • Rash' #430 4 years ago

    Emth, That's a valid point. It's why I prefer Edge's take on games. It's more measured and confident.

  • baphomet777 #431 4 years ago

    "@baphomet777 : You havent played either Gears or Halo 3 thats a given. Those are amazing games no doubth. You havent played MGS4 either. To compare a game you havent played to 2 games you havent played is just stupid. You are a moron."

    Yeah, I've played Gears. What was up with that game this is the 2k decade. I thought black and white tv went out in the sixties. Haven't bothered to play Halo 3 yet, but it was so embarrasing quality-wise to Bungie that they decided to drop out of MS after making the POS. I have every confidence that MGS4 is terrific as Game Pro, IGN UK, and OPM UK say.

    A new review:
    If I'm a moron, then
    You're a c*cks*cker.

  • dsmx #432 4 years ago

    You can't give MGS4 anything higher than an 8, sorry to break it too you MGS fanboys. The game is for fans of the series, it's not going to win over new fans so that's a 10 score out and nor is it a ground breaking game as it is still using game mechanics that are 10 years old so that's a 9 score out. At least that is how I would score the game what other websites do is up to them.

  • DAL9000 #433 4 years ago

    @Muscleblade: "To compare a game you havent played to 2 games you havent played is just stupid."

    Actually, he's comparing like to like, so in a WAY, it makes perfect sense. And besides, he expressed his sympathy for my brief system overload. That makes him OK in my book -- if he's actually having fun with this instead of just spewing pointless bile, then he's clearly... uh... clear...ly...

    ::reads baphomet's last post::

    Oh. Right. Continue mocking him, then.

  • DanWhitehead #434 4 years ago

    Really? You don't think criticism should be at all objective? It could just be a fanboy rant?

    I don't think criticism can - or should be - an objective pursuit, no. That's because when you review something, you're putting across your opinion of it - and that's the dictionary definition of subjective writing. And, yes, such a review could just be a fanboy rant. And you, as the reader, would be perfectly able to identify it as such and process what it says accordingly.

    You see, it's perfectly fine to disagree with a review provided a) you've actually played the game as well and formed a different opinion of it and b) can actually argue against the review itself and not just throw up your hands and say OMG THIS REVIEW IS BIASED AND THE REVIEWER IS OBVIOUSLY DOING THIS BECAUSE OF BLAH BLAH BLAH.

    But the idea that reviewers should form no opinion whatsoever is ludicrous.

  • Les #435 4 years ago

    "Of course that had nothing to do with it being available from launch for the first time on a rival system that is cheaper, has a larger games catalogue and bigger install base???"

    Not just PS3 sales, 360 sales haven't gone up much (except for UK where they were a bit low before the release). Furhtermore, Wii sales haven't been impacted at all. Conclusion: GTA4 didn't have any impact on the console war at all.

  • bitesize #436 4 years ago


    one thing that always confuses me - all you sony lovers who have managed to convince themselves that EG has some sort of anti-sony (or pro-microsoft) bias, why on earth do you keep coming back to the site? personally, if i think a site has a bias against something i hold dear (as you all seem to do with your beloved sony corp), i just shrug, go somewhere else and don't visit the site again - why do you keep coming back just to moan about EG?

    or do you have some kind of fantasy that you're actually educating us poor saps (who just want to read the site + comment about the games) about how horrendous EG are?

  • #437 4 years ago

    @DanWhitehead

    they should form their opinions at the end of the review, not at the start of the 2nd paragraph.

  • bad09 #438 4 years ago

    Les for the millionth time it won't impact Wii sales, different markets!!!!!!

  • lennon #439 4 years ago

    @DaemonB - I disagree. As I said before. First few paragraphs told me that this game isnt for me. Saved me the trouble of reading the whole thing. It could have been a 10 out of 10 for all I care.

  • Rash' #440 4 years ago

    mallocks, maybe it's dependent on the form. In architecture (if my memory serves me correctly) Modernism did away with everything that came before it in an attempt to reinvent itself. In the age of post modernism, it borrows heavily from the the past to deliver something new. I'm not inferring MGS is completely of post modernist design, but it certainly has trets that can be relented to other forms of post modern expression.
    Edited by 3 at 30/05/08 @ 14:13

  • rob76 #441 4 years ago

    All you console patriots are so sad. Get over your allegiances ffs you are JUST consumers!!!

    How many of you bitching about this review have actually played and finished the game??

  • dr_faulk #442 4 years ago

    @ Resivent nEVIl

    "The storytelling is fantastic and I like it, but it's an acquired taste."

    Completely true. I felt the same about MGS3. I loved so much of it, but then my Dad would walk in and I'd die of embarassment.

  • miiiguel #443 4 years ago

    Les continues to be a funny guy, I mean...

    "will I buy Wii Fit or Haze ?"

  • Les #444 4 years ago

    "Personally i think reviews should just bronze silver and gold recomendations (with rubbish games getting nothing)"

    No, reviews shouldn't have a score/recommendation at all because they're useless (a.k.a. opinion). Just the text and maybe some pros and cons for people not willing to read...

  • baphomet777 #445 4 years ago


    "one thing that always confuses me - all you sony lovers who have managed to convince themselves that EG has some sort of anti-sony (or pro-microsoft) bias, why on earth do you keep coming back to the site?"

    This is the first time that I've been to this site. I came here after reading the comment that Eurogamer gave MGS4 this p*$$ poor review over in the comments section of IGN UK's 9.9 review for MGS 4. So, I came here to see if that was true, and yes, sadly I did discover that it was true and that the reviewer likes giving Bill Gates' rimjobs. I'm getting tired of the press trying to tear down Sony and build up MS. If Sony is dead in the next gen and if Nintendo is not doing Super Nintendo quality next gen stuff on a super hd system that puts the 360 and PS3 to shame instead of havng something with slightly better than original xbox graphics than does the wiiwii then I'm getting out of this hobby. I'm not buying some MS 680 bs.

  • Rash' #446 4 years ago

    "How many of you bitching about this review have actually played and finished the game??"

    And the answer is: zero

  • DAL9000 #447 4 years ago

    I do look forward to checking out the user reviews/user scores when this game comes out, though. I wouldn't be surprised if user feedback had this game at something like a 9 -- I predict it will get a WHOLE lot of 10s balanced out by a smattering of 5s and 6s and a vanishingly small handful of 7/8/9 reviews.

    So, yeah. I really should go check the user scores at Gamespot or something on, saaaaaaaaaay... June 17th, and see how that prediction played out.

  • krudster #448 4 years ago

    I love how opinion only seems to be 'useless' when it doesn't tally with what people want.

  • BeersOfWar #449 4 years ago

    Can I ask an honest question please?

    Are posters here actually serious, or can we all admit that we're just having a bit of a laugh by winding each other up?

  • Madp #450 4 years ago

    Try this review... No score and no literally retarded biased comments such as, we hope you don't come back snake.

    http://reelgame rs.com/games/mgs4.html

  • baphomet777 #451 4 years ago

    "Oh and baphoment is a cunt. Thankyougoodnight!"

    Yeah, and I could kick your b*itchy little a$$ any day of the week by more lengths than Big Brown won the Kentucky Derby and Preakness combined. So what's new, Bonobo?

  • bitesize #452 4 years ago

    baphomet777: This is the first time that I've been to this site.

    yet you keep coming back again and again to post how a review on a game you've never played is completely wrong and biased cos it doesn't agree with what you think that the game will be like, when you get to play it. don't you realise how ridiculous that is?


    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 14:23

  • Aloominum_man #453 4 years ago

    I love how people like baphomet777 have signed up specifically to come on here and complain about Eurogamer, thus increasing their traffic and advertising revenue.

  • DanWhitehead #454 4 years ago

    they should form their opinions at the end of the review, not at the start of the 2nd paragraph.

    You don't seriously think reviews are written with one hand on the joypad and the other typing away on the keyboard? That the first line is written as we start playing, and the last paragraph as we finish the game? Of course a reviewer has made their mind up before they write the review. That's what good writers do - think about what they're going to say before they start typing. That's not remotely the same thing as bias.

  • smoothpete #455 4 years ago


    THIS POST WILL PROBABLY BE DELETED. . I READ IN THE SUN THAT THE PC NAZIS ARE GETTING FREEIBES BECAUSE I AM NOW ASHAMED OF BRITAIN. EVERY BRITISH WORKING MAN MUST CARPET BOMB THEM FLAT. THAT WOULDC ERTAINLY CAUSE A BIT MORE CARE TO BE TAKEN!??

  • Widge #456 4 years ago

    So Oli here says 8 where Dave at IGN UK is a fraction off a 10. As people have different views on everything, go and read all the reviews if you want to read a balanced breakdown of the game and use all that knowledge to formulate your own bottom line.

  • Les #457 4 years ago

    "I love how opinion only seems to be 'useless' when it doesn't tally with what people want."

    I take it you're not referring to my posts as I think (and have repeatedly said) that any opinion that's not mine is useless...

  • DAL9000 #458 4 years ago

    @Dan Whitehead: "And, yes, such a review could just be a fanboy rant. And you, as the reader, would be perfectly able to identify it as such and process what it says accordingly."

    Yep. That's because, to return to pretty much the main point I've been harping on here, /authorial voice in reviews is a good freakin' thing/. It lets you determine the author's biases and react to them accordingly-- whether in a good way, as in "Oh hey, I agree with this gentleman's tastes!" -- or in a bad way, as in "Eh, whatever, this guy's obvious hard-on for point-and-click adventures doesn't do it for me."

    Unfortunately, it's also possible to interpret it in a /batshit crazy/ way, as in "LOLOLOLOL TEH AUTHOR HAS TEH BIAS AGAINST PS3!!!!! TAHT BASTARD!!!!!!!!!"

    But eh, what can you do? The crazies won't magically grow some freakin' common sense just because we all think it'd be extremely awesome if they did.

  • BanjoMan #459 4 years ago

    globla warming climate change, no such thing, its just another tax!. i read in the sun that paedos are getting tax-payers money. every british working man must chpo their hands off, see how they like it .it' political correctnss gone mad!!!!!

    and mgs4 is a 9 fitlhy commie eurogaymrer bumhed

  • muscleblade #460 4 years ago

    @baphomet777

    "If I'm a moron, then
    You're a c*cks*cker"

    I see you are quite affected by this review getting agressive like that. Only a complete moron calls somebody a c*cks*cker.


    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 14:21

  • peteb #461 4 years ago

    I'd love to be in the EG office just before they upload "controversial" reviews. I imagine a group of EG staff crowding around the computer saying "go on, go on, submit it!!"

    CLICK

    "Wooooooooo, you're in trouble now!!"

    Please tell me its really like this.

  • Darren #462 4 years ago

    Krudster - "I love how opinion only seems to be 'useless' when it doesn't tally with what people want."

    Oh that is so truuuuuuuue. You could almost guarantee that had this game scored a 'perfect' 10 there'd have been just as many people down the line complaining that it was undeserved, like what happened with GTA IV, as there are people now who think it does deserve a 10 (despite not having actually played it... but that's not a small insignificant detail!). LOL

    EG just can't win really... except maybe if they'd given the game 9/10! ;)

  • Pike #463 4 years ago

    @DanWhitehead

    they should form their opinions at the end of the review, not at the start of the 2nd paragraph.

    I assume he actually formed his opinion before even writing the review, and then decided state part of his opinion early on in the review, as a stylistic choice.

    You know the way most reviews are written.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 14:22

  • Camorrista #464 4 years ago

    This thread is absolute gold and the best Friday afternoon lecture ever.

    I thank you all, you're doing a great job.

  • Fwing #465 4 years ago

    EG "Review the Review" meeting:
    Oli "Well its about an 8.5 I reckon. Can't quite decide which way to go to be honest"
    Darth Bramwell "Make it an 8 then and we can reap the delicious traffic of the ensuing fanboy meltdown. Muha. Ha. HA. MUUAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA"

  • bad09 #466 4 years ago

    Wow MGS really brings out the nutters, I might actually leave MGSO alone now......

  • BanjoMan #467 4 years ago

    i couldnt care less but nu-labour is taking our country away from us beause they are traitos! simple answer: build more prisons lock em up and throw away the key. next we'll have pedofiles teaching our kids to swim!!!

    fnuggin gayos metal ger is defonotelay a 10+++++++!!!?

  • Les #468 4 years ago

    "Les for the millionth time it won't impact Wii sales, different markets!!!!!!"

    Only in MS's dreams (and probably Sony's as well)... All three machines hope to be mass market gaming devices. Only Wii achieves this. In that regard, they might be in 'a different market' but they're definitely in the market MS and Sony would want to be in.

    /spelling and stuff
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 14:26

  • Dizzy #469 4 years ago

    >baphomet777:This is the first time that I've been to this site.

    I hope it will be the last time as well.

  • DAL9000 #470 4 years ago

    @BeersofWar: I can't speak for the others, but /I'm/ having a laugh. Sometimes a painful laugh, or at least a laugh that's delivered simultaneously with a wince, but a laugh nonetheless.

  • w00t #471 4 years ago

    the media wont amdit that pedophiles rae run by communists. simple answer: vote bnp. what do you think?!!!

  • crazymonkey66 #472 4 years ago

    another first timer. i find this review a bit lacking IMO. it doesn't really say anything about the gameplay or plot that you couldn't pick up from the various previews. found the ign uk review the same. also how come the european sites have a review before any american sites. i just have this sneaking suspicion that they're both fake reviews to get attention or something.

  • baphomet777 #473 4 years ago

    bitesize,

    yeah I hear stuff like your last comment about coming back here quite often on forums to be honest. It is because after I have had my say, and I scroll down the page to look at what I've said, I notice all these people trying to personally attack me like the two or three I've responded to so I feel I have to take my part against them so as to not lose face and it turns into a big circular argument, you dig...I swear I do wish sometimes there were ways we fans could quit biting each other's a$$es like that.

    The thing that keeps these comments from being all in fun as someone said is because gaming is a business whoever wins these races is going to determine the kinds of games that are available to play in the future. I prefer the games that Sony has traditionally had and I still think they are great; however, if MS wins in a dominating fashion then there will be more MS kinds of games to play in the future than Sony type games and the prosepects don't make me go, "oh me oh my, that's so wonderful!"

  • Buztafen #474 4 years ago

    All these peeps who are saying it should be a 10, how the fuck do you know it should be? Have you played it? Quit bitchin and moaning....

    Cocks....

  • moggsy #475 4 years ago

    I must say Oli is completely correct with his review score.

    I mean, I haven't played the game or anything but with a name like Oli, how can he be wrong?

  • mattigan #476 4 years ago

    Honestly now, how old are the posters on this thread?

    I'll start the ball rolling...

    34

  • Nithron #477 4 years ago

    I'm almost tempted to buy a PS3 just for this.


    Almost.

  • Prodigy_BE #478 4 years ago

    I haven't read the article (I want to play the game first, and not let some journalist spoil half the fun for me)

    I am a proud PS3 owner, but why attack EG, when you haven't even played the game yet.
    Assassin's Creed got 95 and 99 scores all over the place, and is was just not that good.
    Maybe EG didn't get carried away by the hype this time.

    I too think that the 10 out of 10 for Halo 3 was too high, but I'm not going to start wining about the fact that MGS4 only got an 8.

    If anything, EG is not biased towards MS, Sony, or Nintendo, they just want pageviews.

  • BanjoMan #479 4 years ago

    Its simple. when will people realise that This country is overflowing with illegal immigrants, even the local chippy is run by poles. Thye are giving away are rights to health tourists. It is vital that we bring back Mary Whitehouse. Soon this country will be majority muslim with a mosk in every village!!!!?!

  • Trigga_Tybalt #480 4 years ago

    woah. they gave pes2008 an 8 and that was utter shit! i hope this isn't the same... still don't know how they gave halo 3 a higher score?...
    did he even mention MGO?
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 14:31

  • monkie_king #481 4 years ago

    Is this copypasta from the Sun's forums or something? If so, well played Sirs.

  • LeoliansBro #482 4 years ago

    You don't spell a$$ like that baphomet. You spell it Arse. It has no monetary denominations in it at all.

    And I can't help pointing out that while you think that baphomet is a cool demon name to choose, and all rockstar and shit, it is actually the Zionist name for Isabella. For such an obviously butch man you have a surprisingly girlie name. Coupled with your constant references to the arses of other men, I am forced to reach only one conclusion.

    And you're a tedious, whining fanboy.

    These comments make me cry for humankind. Apart from pete, gibbon and W00t, who make me cry with laughter.

  • moggsy #483 4 years ago

    Personally I blame Gordon Brown. This sodding recession is hitting review scores now!

  • BanjoMan #484 4 years ago

    im not being racist but the human rights brigade are raping our kids because they have been incompetent since day 1! simple answer: build more prisons lock em up and throw away the key. this sounds totally crazy, but it is sadly, probably true!!

  • bobshirunkel #485 4 years ago

    This is such an epic clusterfuck of retardation that it's developed its own gravity well. Can't... stop... looking...

    It's like a bunch of Chelsea fans who didn't watch the Champions League final berating a football journalist for telling them that Man Utd won. Amazing.

  • baphomet777 #486 4 years ago

    Whatever, sex monkey. Yeah, you wish.

    Anyway, I haven't played the game yet. I wish it had scored higher. Whatever happens from here on out I will not buy a MS 720 or a WII 2.

    Over and out.



  • w00t #487 4 years ago

    Twas ever thus Im not being racist but evironazis are turning our kids gay because they are clinically insane It is vital that we put them in loony bin. If you like it so much why dont you go live there!!!

  • InsoFox #488 4 years ago

    I've said it enough times, but one more for the road. Reviews are subjective. It's a good thing they are. It's what makes them worth reading. It's what makes them reviews.

    THE IMPORTANT BIT:

    The best part is that they're useful even if you don't agree with all the points. Maybe in the review of DeathMonger 2008, the reviewer didn't like that the game used save points. Perhaps save points are your favourite thing in the world, so you can knock that flaw off the list. Maybe even give the game another point in your head. Maybe he said that the AI was poor but it wasn't much of a problem, but you won't even consider buying a game with poor AI, so you can magnify that flaw by 10.

    The function of a review is not to make you agree with it, but to provide a viewpoint which may help you reach an informed decision.

  • DAL9000 #489 4 years ago

    @Mattigan

    Your game sounds fun. I'll play!

    I'm 23. Wait, no, is it... ::checks what year it is:: ::Does a quick bit of subtraction:: yes. I'm 23.

    I'm also slightly absent-minded, and prone to forgetting such minor details as whether I'm 23 or 24, or whether my middle name is Alan or Andrew, both of which can cause a bit of embarrassment.

    OK, so now the /next/ person has to reveal their age /and/ a tiny insight into their personality /and/ their favorite alcoholic beverage, if applicable. Let the game begin! And expand.

  • LeoliansBro #490 4 years ago

    This just shows us EGs real agenda.. I have been realising over the past few years that this communist governmet are sponging off the taxpayer. Seven words: elect Jeremy Clarkson as prime minister. What next? Giving benefits out willy-nilly? Oops. They do it already!!!

  • BanjoMan #491 4 years ago

    SEX HATS














    CHILLAX

  • ghearoid #492 4 years ago

    I love this thread. Andy Murray is losing at the tennis so it's something to amuse me and pass the time.

    By the way, since when was 8 not a good score? I mean, if any game I had my eye on got 8 then it'd be a definite buy!

  • LeoliansBro #493 4 years ago

    I think we all know what going on here .everyone knows Prince Phillip s raping our kids. The only solution is to rise up agains tthem. Publish this one if you dare!!

  • LittleVoice #494 4 years ago

    Post deleted at 18:03:32 01-02-2012

  • DanWhitehead #495 4 years ago

    @Arbiter

    Basically that viewpoint is a nice way of stating that the reviewer is more important than the work they are assessing. Its an appallingly egotistical and arrogant perspective, and one that deserves to be stamped on until it is D-E-A-D.

    No, it's simply acknowledging that criticism is an inherently subjective endeavour. Bias is not the same as subjectivity. This really isn't debatable - it's a fact of the language.

    It's got nothing to do with the writer being more important than the work they're reviewing, and everything to do with acknowledging that a review is - by its nature - a subjective piece of writing. If you agree or disagree with what is said, that's fine, but trying to redefine the very nature of criticism simply because you don't like what somebody says is nonsense.

  • DAL9000 #496 4 years ago

    @monkieking: It's copypasta made of FAIL.

    @copypasta-ers: The BNP is not a meme. But, as with Milhouse, it /may/ be the cause that "the BNP is not a meme" is itself a meme. The jury's out on that.

    @copypasta satirists: 100 cocktails to you! Distribute it amongst yourselves as you see fit.

    (Yes, I'm a recovering /b/-tard. But, ssh! It's a sekrit. Tell no one.)

  • BanjoMan #497 4 years ago

    I can’t believe any of you OPPOSE this idea. It beggars belief, really it does. Anyone would think you wanted to have a terrorist murder you in your beds at night!!!

  • BeersOfWar #498 4 years ago

    Gaming *is* so last century.

    Reading about them and then complaining is WHERE ITS FUCKING AT.

    This thread gets 9/10.

  • moggsy #499 4 years ago

    Property prices are falling, and now review scores. Whatever next!

  • Zerimski #500 4 years ago

    I couldnt care less but the EG is sponging off the taxpayer because they want to destroy us from within! Read my lips: bring back hanging PS If you are offended by this then leave the country!!!

  • #501 4 years ago

    Nice comment I thought on the GAF..

    """"
    Reviews from the major media sites are VERY LIKELY driven by some agenda that run the gamut from trying to please fanboys/fan bases to trying to stir up controversy and website hits. Just saying...


    """"


    Thinks this really sums up most reviews.

  • DanWhitehead #502 4 years ago

    ...literally retarded biased comments such as, we hope you don't come back snake.

    The final line is actually "We love you Snake. Don't come back". The first part is rather important.

  • Beek4257 #503 4 years ago

    Here's an objective, unbiased review:
    Gamedisc is round with a hole in the middle and therefore fit for purpose: 10/10.

    Riveting...

  • evilashchris #504 4 years ago

    I COULDNT CARE LESS BUT THOSE MORONS IN THE GOVERNMENT ARE GIVING AWAY ARE RIGHTS TO HEALTH TOURISTS BECAUSE OF GORDON BROWN! THE ONLY SOLUTION IS TO NUKE THEM. THIS IS VERY DISTURBING TO ME!

  • BanjoMan #505 4 years ago

    SEX HATS, SEX HATS, I'VE GOT SEX HATS

  • HyperShadow #506 4 years ago

    @Madp "....no literally retarded biased comments such as, we hope you don't come back snake."

    I'm assuming that that comment at the end of the review was placed to say that MGS4 rounds Snakes story off nicley and bringing him back at a later point for marketing reasons or whatever would literally ruin whatever meaning his fate had in this game.

  • LeoliansBro #507 4 years ago

    FIRST THINGS FRST! IM NOT BEING RACIST BUT HOMOSEXUALS ARE TAKING OVER THE GOVERNMENT. SEVEN WORDS: SEND THEM ALL BACK WERE THEY CAME FROM.

  • InsoFox #508 4 years ago

    Yes, yes, it was funny for a while, but can we at least get back on topic? Not that that was much good, either...

  • johnboy_johsnon #509 4 years ago

    I remember the days when eurogamer were labelled as pro-sony (can you remember the threads re: Sonys Presentation at E3 2005 - The True Next Generation). There's just no winning for them.

    Also just as a side note, Rob Fahey, who gave Halo 3 10/10 was constantly labelled pro-Sony (check out the thread from his 5/10 review of Blue Dragon). In hindsight he was right to awards it with this score (although it didn't deter me from purchasing it).

  • BanjoMan #510 4 years ago

    THIS JUST IN:

    "@copypasta-ers: The BNP is not a meme. But, as with Milhouse, it /may/ be the cause that "the BNP is not a meme" is itself a meme. The jury's out on that.

    (ARTICLE CONTINUES)

    (Yes, I'm a recovering /b/-tard. But, ssh! It's a sekrit. Tell no one.)"

    WHAT A DIRTY ROTTER. PROBABLY A PAEDOGRANT SPONGING OFF OUR WIMMINZ HUMAN TRAFFICKING.

  • Beek4257 #511 4 years ago

    For another example of how to write an unbiased and objective review, read Sony Defense Force's review of Haze.

    /Irony mode off

    No really, it's hilarious! Guess the score, go on, guess!

  • miiiguel #512 4 years ago

    IGN last week was on MS pay roll because they gave NG2 8.7, and everyone knows it's a 6.45 game, if that much...

    Today IGN rules..., EDGE rocks, but be sure to talk real fast when you mention their Halo 3 review.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 14:47

  • NickD7 #513 4 years ago

    I think PS3 owners should create a petition like they did for Devil may cry 4, and like demand Eurogamer change the review to 10/10 and call it the best game of forever, if not they should put Eurogamer on their ignore list and pretend they are not real.

    They should add this picture to all of their posts as well

    <a href="http://i31.tinypic. com/jzzkmh.gif
    ">http://i31.tinypic. com/jzzkmh.gif
    </a>

    Let Eurogamer know just how upset they are about this score which gives them a severe case of uncurrable butt hurt.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 14:51

  • w00t #514 4 years ago

    publish this if you dare! I couldnt care less but paedos are allowing us to be swamped because they want to destroy us from within!. Read my lips: say enough is enough. Oh wait but what about their 'human rights'!?!

  • Widge #515 4 years ago

    *goes to read Blue Dragon review*

  • Darren #516 4 years ago

    @ghearoid - Well any game that scores 7 or higher on EG and interests me is a worthy purchase as far as I'm concerned and re-reading that MGS4 review it seems clear to me that the reviewer did enjoy the game, it's just that certain aspects of the game, like the overlong cutscenes and dated gameplay dragged the final score down for him. If those are the things you love about MGS then they're not going to be issues. I thought it was an honest and well-written review.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:00

  • muscleblade #517 4 years ago

    Shinji wrote:

    "Okay, ladies, shall we open a book on who's going to be the most excruciatingly annoying by the end of this thread - rabid PS3 fanboys screaming about how a game they've never played should be a 10/10, or vile, childish Xbox 360 fanboys coming along to gloat at a game getting, er, one of the highest scores we can award?

    My money's on the latter - at least the PS3 kids are entertaining. "


    After reading baphomet777 s posts its pretty clearly that you lost your money my friend. LOL.

  • DAL9000 #518 4 years ago

    @ Kelly's H: For once, I'm not being even slightly sarcastic; I'm genuinely curious, here.

    Do you really think you'll be able to /follow/ the plot's many twists and turns? MGS games have always left me going, "Wait, so... /what/ just happened?" far too often for my tastes. Is it that you just don't /have/ those moments of bafflement, or is it that you just don't really care about them?

    Basically, what I'm askin' here is: have the stories of the last two MGS games actually made sense to you? If so, you're a better man than I am, sir.

  • InsoFox #519 4 years ago

    @Darren:

    Cheers. You just gave a working demonstration of the thing that I was saying on the previous page about what reviews are for. :)

  • NthSimulachum #520 4 years ago

    "Reviews should be objective"

    You can describe a sunset objectively, sure. You could even describe the colours with their hexidecimal tags, and describe the non-linear diffusion patterns with mathematics. It wouldn't be interesting though. Our subjective experience of life is what's interesting.

    Do not go gentle in to that good night!
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light!

  • Widge #521 4 years ago

    The Blue Dragon comment thread reads the same as this one!

  • tinners #522 4 years ago

    ill wait until the film comes out thnx :)

  • Fwing #523 4 years ago

    I've hated the MGS series since about 1 hour into MGS1.

    But this review has piqued my interest so I might pick this up.

  • dogboy #524 4 years ago

    Fucking Xboxer Fanboy page

  • miiiguel #525 4 years ago

    ^^ classy

  • Widge #526 4 years ago

    I would love the £80 special edition, but effectively only for the bonus bluray... and no way I'm paying another £40 odd for a bluray.

  • dr_faulk #527 4 years ago

    lol, EG should really close comments for these kinds of reviews

  • Widge #528 4 years ago

    For DAL9000,

    I only went through MGS3 the once so can't quite remember it in detail, however with MGS2, I was properly on board for it. Even though there were moments of surprised, I didn't feel out of depth with grasping what was going on.

  • w00t #529 4 years ago

    IMO the Lib Dems are destroyign our once great country because they have been incompetent since day 1. Read my lips: riot in thes treets. This is a Christian country we must all have christian values!!!

  • JayeM #530 4 years ago

    Surprised.

  • Mainman00 #531 4 years ago

    Giving this game ONLY an 8 out of 10 is an instult to the develepors and gamers all over the world (gamers including the one's that like and dislike this genre). The production value's in this game is top-notch, no other game even comes close. MGS is being loved because it is MGS, and yet the reviewer gives it minus points for it just because he doesnt like MGS, which is BS.

    A reviewer is supposed to have an unbiased look, but yet he reviews MGS4 on a personal level. The reviewer, that doenst like MGS in general, says that MGS4 will fail to attract non-fans of the series. How would he know? Not everyone is/thinks like you Oli!!!!

  • Widge #532 4 years ago

    Which is why you read more than one review to garner various viewpoints and opinions

  • monkie_king #533 4 years ago

    I'm confused now, I can't tell which MGS fanboy posts are genuine and which are satire. WHAT IS THE WORLD COMING TO?

  • DFawkes #534 4 years ago

    @Widge
    It's an extra £40 for the Blu-ray, soundtrack and figure, most likely in a fancy box. Still a rip-off, and still from Play.com who I've read aren't very punctual. Still a bit of a rip-off, but didn't stop me ordering it.

    I find it weird the number of people here who have decided it's rubbish now, despite all the other glowing reviews and this one still being an 8, still a good score. I've never read a review and thought "Oh, it got only an 8 out of 10. Must be rubbish."
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:14

  • miiiguel #535 4 years ago

    I'm insulted... allover the world. Haven't played the game, but the production values, and the name itself.

    An insult!

  • DAL9000 #536 4 years ago

    Widge,

    Fair 'nuff. As I mentioned earlier, I only got about halfway through both games before I went, "Awwww, NUTS to this. The gameplay's pretty nice, but there's FAR too much crap around the edges." and switched the console off, so I can't even properly say I've played through them all the way for the big reveals. It's just that my memory of both games' plots is mostly, "Wait a second, what? What's happening? Why should I /care/?" for MGS2 and "... will that stupid bitch stop TALKING about fucking Godzilla already?!" for MGS3.

    But in all likelihood you're just better at piecing stuff together than I am. Sniff. It's sad but true.

  • DanWhitehead #537 4 years ago

    Seriously, how have people got the impression that Oli doesn't like Metal Gear Solid? Just because he said that there are elements of the series that he loves and some he hates?

  • ghearoid #538 4 years ago

    "lol, EG should really close comments for these kinds of reviews".

    Yes, but it's kinda fun too, though in a way that makes me feel dirty. Besides, there have been enough knifings lately and the kids need to vent their frustrations somehow. Rather on EG than in my belly!

    ;o)
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:24

  • DUFFKING #539 4 years ago

    MianMan00, please let me be the first to call you a total retard in this comment section.

  • Widge #540 4 years ago

    You got the full box set coming then Mr DFawkes? It looks lovely!

    [link url=http://www.spaceworld.no/space world/frontend/files/PRODUCT//Metal_gear_2-v03-2.jpg
    ]http://ww w.spaceworld.no/spaceworld/fron...[/link]

    The Game set is £75 and all you get is a bluetooth headset for your troubles. Bog off says me. I love ltd edition stuff, but I'm off on holiday and can't afford the outlay. I think Play has sold out now too.

  • Fairlane #541 4 years ago

    this is funny stuff

  • Ace_McCloud #542 4 years ago

    IMO opinion, a game that you have to install on a console - More than once!:o - in an age where loading times are usually irrelevant, CAN NOT be a 10. That part is ridiculous...

    Still if this comes out on Xbox I might get it, the bit the reviewer talks about that flips stuff on its head sounds really interesting... codec cut scenes are almost a deal breaker though

  • M83J01P97 #543 4 years ago

    This is stupid. I'm all for freedom of speech, but maybe this is one time EG should cut their looses and just stop commenting on this review. No one is saying anything useful or interesting either about the game or the review.

  • NickD7 #544 4 years ago

    I remember when Double agent got 9/10 here on Eurogamer, who would have thought it would be better than MGS4. Not me as I didn't think MGS4 would be THE BIGGEST FLOP EVER

    never gets old saying that. BIGGEST...FLOP...EVER

    today has been a pretty good day so far.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:18

  • sneetch #545 4 years ago

    Gah, madness! Sheer madness.

    Here's the deal with reviews, for the incredibly vocal minority that don't seem to get it: Oli thought that this game merited an 8/10. That's his opinion, that's all a review is; simply someones opinion. Just because their opinion doesn't match yours doesn't make it wrong or dishonest or biased just different. Once you get that concept the internet will make more sense.

    Some people here seem to think reviews follow a scientific process and if the results don't match up with their expectations then it's obvious to them that the reviewer is, at best, a fool unable to operate the "review machine" properly and, at worst, a treacherous dog in the pocket of the vile and hated enemy (the actual identity of the hated enemy depending on the game being reviewed)!

    If you think MGS4 is worth more than an 8/10, then fair enough, to you it's worth more (although as it hasn't been released yet, I'm wondering where that conviction comes from). Surely you don't have to have EGs approval before liking a game? Are you so insecure that you need others to tell you whether or not you're allowed to like a game before you try it? To some others it will be worth less and, shocking though this next bit may be, that's alright too.

    If you liked the previous games then feel free to stick on a point or two, we don't mind, no really, we don't care at all.

    The "OMG this is teh worst EG review EVAR! I r quiting! EG R biased for !" style of over-reactionary bullshit that these big title reviews cause people to spew up is pathetic. (I'm talking about fanboys in general, not PS3 owners, this is just the biggest thread I've seen here for a while). Just as stupid are the people expressing amazement that GRID got higher scores, yes, you're right; how DARE they score a game from a entirely different genre more than this!?!! Very valid point.

    EG should add a review personalisation function, where people can add or subtract points to or from a revew based on whether you like the prequels or genre.

    Normally, I'm much more diplomatic in my criticism of people; but sometimes you just gotta call stupid when you see stupid.

    And you people winding them up, you should be ashamed of yourselves, you know who you are. ;)

  • Widge #546 4 years ago

    By the way, I've not been one to sit on comment threads at all until this year ... has there always been this furore about review markings? Or is this a recent next gen phenom?

  • miiiguel #547 4 years ago

    No one actually cares about the game. I doubt that 10% of the buyers will watch the whole cut-scenes or pay any attention to the script itself (which is a shame).
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:23

  • monkie_king #548 4 years ago

    Widge: never seen one quite this frenzied. I think MGS4 has a lot riding on it.

  • zuljin #549 4 years ago

    @monkie_king
    "I'm confused now, I can't tell which MGS fanboy posts are genuine and which are satire. WHAT IS THE WORLD COMING TO?"

    Does it matter? To me the "sarcastic" fanboy comments (which also has some usual suspects), is just as annoying as the real ones.

  • ishigo #550 4 years ago

    >> HIS "REVIEW" (OPINION) IS COMPLETELY WORTHLESS.

    and you keep posting. *slow clapping*

  • DAL9000 #551 4 years ago

    @sneetch: "And you people winding them up, you should be ashamed of yourselves, you know who you are. ;)"

    Ashamed, or basking in the warm glow of accomplishment? You must admit, the fanboys /have/ been wound up most impressively. (Ohwait. I hope that doesn't mean /I'm/ one of the winders-up. Sniff. My mommy would be terribly upset if I didn't play nice with other people on the Internet.)

  • LeD #552 4 years ago

    I remember krudster once stated that reviews are only purchasing advice, at the end of the day.
    So in that respect, clearly this game's received a big thumbs up. The problem is that the score introduces the notion that the game is evaluated on some kind of artistic scale, which is why people quickly take offence when the mark is not what they expected.
    Instead of scores, maybe a review should finish with a box titled: "Should you buy it?".
    There the reviewer could have stated that the game is a must-buy for fans of the series and warned the others that certain aspects of the game may confuse them.
    This would also avoid the debates over why GRID got a better score than MGS4, for example, as there would be no way to compare and correlate their respective achievements.

  • Calgon #553 4 years ago

    Wow... I just skipped the review straight to the score(everyone should know pretty much what to expect from a MGS game) and came to look at the reaction and it shows which set of fanboys are the most immature and well whats the word... deluded/loony?

    I mean there were a few questions about the NG2 review and score... but nothing like this. Its a good score, I expect the fans of the series will thoroughly enjoy it, the only people who thought it was "the most important title of the year" were hopefull Sonybots. It will shift some systems(to fans of the series and perhaps new fans of the genre) but I dont see how anyone was expecting this to be a huge system seller/AAA game for everyone.

    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 15:26

  • George-Roper #554 4 years ago

    What a gigantic mass of mostly incoherent, garbled, responses. Much like the storyline and dialog in MGS.

    See what I did there? :D

  • DAL9000 #555 4 years ago

    @lolerdongs: First, "lollerdongs" has three l's in it. LRN2SPELL TEH INTERNET CATCHPHRASES N00B.

    And second, lemme see if I correctly understand you: Eurogamer, by assigning a /section editor/ to do its MGS4 review, has somehow shown it's not taking MGS4 seriously at all?

    All right then! Troll gently on into the night, my nonsensical friend. Troll gently on.

  • Henni_playd #556 4 years ago

    zomg! Is this the end of the line for PS3?

    I'm cancelling my pre-order NOW! And I think Im just gonna sell that BIG USELESS TUBE OF NIP LARD! And cremate anything that ever touched it, which includes my cock btw!

    There is simply no other choice.

  • M83J01P97 #557 4 years ago

    Why do people continue to feed the trolls?

    Internet Rules 101: Ignore trolls!

  • monkie_king #558 4 years ago

    LeD: oh yeah, I'd forgotten GRID was out today. Think that's a must-buy based on the EG review.

  • monkie_king #559 4 years ago

    "the HONOR of reviewing a MGS game"

    lulz

  • andywilkie35 #560 4 years ago

    all i know is that i absolutely loved the first three metal gear solid games, and this clearly sounds like a game that if you loved them before, you're going to love this. i bought a PS3 only for this game (that shows a) how much i love MGS and b) how poor the console is in terms of literally not having any games. i downloaded the haze demo, i want those 5 minutes of my life back) and even if it only got an 8, it sounds like a 10 to someone who loves it like me. i can't wait

  • miiiguel #561 4 years ago

    "the HONOR of reviewing a MGS game"

    lulz, indeed. Made my afternoon...
    Got to work now.

  • thedaveeyres #562 4 years ago

    Do not go gentle into that good night,
    Fanboyism should burn and rave at close of day;
    Rage, rage against the unfair review score.

    Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
    Because their words had forked no lightning they
    Do not go gentle into that comments thread.

    Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
    Their frail deeds might have danced in a PS3LOL,
    Rage, rage against the unfair review score.

    Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
    And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
    Do not go gentle into that comments thread.

    Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
    Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be teh gay,
    Rage, rage against the unfair review score.

    And you, my favorite game franchise, there on the sad height,
    Curse, bless me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
    Do not go gentle into that comments thread.
    Rage, rage against the unfair review score.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:30

  • chrisjm #563 4 years ago

    i knew it was less than 9 when i saw almost 700 comments on a review that hasnt even been up half a day.

    LOL

  • BanjoMan #564 4 years ago

    DAL9000 IS THE INTERNET EXPERT. EVERYBODY GIVE HIM A ROUND OF APPLAUSE.

  • Widge #565 4 years ago

    monkie_king: I dunno, the GTA4 thread was page after page of, "this should be 10!" "this should be 7!" over and over. NG2, Mass Effect PC, Haze (ok, that was fighting over 4 versus 6, but still, it was a numbers scrap nonetheless).

  • LeD #566 4 years ago

    "LeD: oh yeah, I'd forgotten GRID was out today. Think that's a must-buy based on the EG review."

    Yes, provided that you want an arcade racer. And that's really all you should get out of a review.

    Likewise, MGS4 is a must-buy according to this review, assorted with a few warnings to customers who are not specifically into the series, genre or kind of gaming experience on offer here.

  • DAL9000 #567 4 years ago

    Lollerdongs was already taken? OK, that made me laugh. Good ol' Internet.

    But sadly, MS isn't paying me at all. Can you point me towards some kind of sign-up page where I /can/ get them to pay me? It sounds like a fun way to make money from home!

  • Shinji #568 4 years ago

    And second, lemme see if I correctly understand you: Eurogamer, by assigning a /section editor/ to do its MGS4 review, has somehow shown it's not taking MGS4 seriously at all?

    Yes. It's well known that Eurogamer hires its section editors by looking for the least literate looking tramps who hang around underneath Brighton Pier - and not, say, by hiring well-established, experienced and respected games writers. That would be silly.

  • monkie_king #569 4 years ago

    "WHILE GEARS OF WAR AND MGS4 GET 8/10's?"

    DON'T CROSS THE STREAMS!!

  • DAL9000 #570 4 years ago

    @BanjoMan: I totally am. For $7.21, I'll answer ALL your Internet questions. Why 7.21? WHY NOT??? Sign up for my answer service TODAY!

  • That_Happy_Cat #571 4 years ago

    This game is about cocks, right?

  • #572 4 years ago

    How do I delete my profile from this piece of shit site?

  • Calgon #573 4 years ago

    LOL evilfoxhound :D

  • JonFE #574 4 years ago

    @baphomet777 said:
    "It is because after I have had my say, and I scroll down the page to look at what I've said, I notice all these people trying to personally attack me like the two or three I've responded to so I feel I have to take my part against them so as to not lose face and it turns into a big circular argument, you dig...I swear I do wish sometimes there were ways we fans could quit biting each other's a$$es like that. "

    Let me remind how you open your very first post on this site:
    "This Oli Welsh person must enjoy licking the sweat off of Bill Gates' bollocks."

    You stormed in here, insulting someone you don't know, over a review of a game you may or may not hold dear but haven't played yet, on the grounds that he underrated it (compared to what I wonder, since you can judge from personal experience) and you talk about personal attacks??? You've got a lot of nerve mister...

  • PedroTheLion #575 4 years ago

    let me respond to the lovely americo,

    Ouve, tu por acaso já jogaste o jogo? Não? então cala-te, 8 está muito longe de ser um mau resultado por isso controla a tua ira de fanboy e fala depois de o experimentar, ok? beijinhos.

  • Henni_playd #576 4 years ago

    My lawyer says he knows its bullshit but we can't sue.

    Only thing left is to report Eurogamer to the BBC Watchdog programme for this.

  • thedaveeyres #577 4 years ago

    Do you like biscuits?

    I like biscuits.



    Not all biscuits...




    ...but most biscuits.

    Yes, on balance I would say that I liked biscuits (not withstanding the rare biscuits that I do not like).

    I like biscuits.

    Do you like biscuits?

  • psychokitten #578 4 years ago

    "Yes. It's well known that Eurogamer hires its section editors by looking for the least literate looking tramps who hang around underneath Brighton Pier - and not, say, by hiring well-established, experienced and respected games writers. That would be silly."

    That's crazy talk, if you hired PROPER writers then they'd give all games the scores that the fanboys want and expect... nay... DESERVE, anything less is clearly just bullshit.

  • #579 4 years ago

    How do I delete my profile from this piece of shit site?

  • killest #580 4 years ago

    "WHILE GEARS OF WAR AND MGS4 GET 8/10's?"

    DON'T CROSS THE STREAMS!!

    "Try to imagine all life as you know it stopping instantaneously and every molecule in your body exploding at the speed of light."
    —Egon Spengler on crossing streams
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:36

  • sneetch #581 4 years ago

    @lolerdongs
    "If I don't see at least a couple of 8/10 or less scores from other "major" review sites, Eurogamer will be tagged as a joke review site in my book."

    Oh NOES! The site will go under! The staff will all be made homeless! Forced to sell their own internal organs to live! Oh the inhumanity!

    You've posted the same nonsense shite at least twice (in the last two pages) now talking about people getting the "HONOR" of reviewing a MGS game? What are you on? What fucking honour? Its a game, not the Victoria Cross!

    Sounds to me like you've already decided it's fantastic and won't stop shouting until the rest of us agree with you.

    I've decided to surf the wave of lunacy on this thread! Wooooo! Awesome, I hereby award this thread a 9/10!

  • gerald #582 4 years ago

    *Saving lolerdongs comments for future fanboy ridiculisation purposes*

  • JYM60 #583 4 years ago

    I heard from a very trustworthy source that there are six 10 minute installs during the game. The reason for this is that there are some huge cut scenes in the game which the console struggles to handle so an install before these cutscenes helps them to run super smooth.

  • Widge #584 4 years ago

    I recognised "Ok" "8" and "Fanboy" in there. Which actually is the forthcoming sequel to We're Fossil Diggers! Fanboy8 OK!

  • BanjoMan #585 4 years ago

    QUICK, PRESS THE EMERGENCY 'I HATE EG' BUTTON.

  • Widge #586 4 years ago

    Thats a bit strange, I seem to remember that MGS2 ran pre-rendered cut scenes from DVD. Rendered using the game engine.
    Or are the MGS4 cutscenes interactive, thereby rendering pre-renders useless.
    Bit of a render overload that comment.
    Rendererered.

  • morriss #587 4 years ago

    From what Ollie says in the review, it sounds like a 10/10 FOR ME PERSONALLY.

    I wonder why those last three words were in capitols?

  • Shinji #588 4 years ago

    In future, any time I have a massive incoherent rant about something, I'm going to end it with the phrase "and lollerdongs was already taken."

    I tip my hat to you, sir.

  • DAL9000 #589 4 years ago

    @Shinji: "It's well known that Eurogamer hires its section editors by looking for the least literate looking tramps who hang around underneath Brighton Pier"

    Aaaaall right, that made me laugh. And wonder if I'm scruffy-looking enough to get a job in the games journalism business. Maybe if I start to grow a neck-beard. And would the stench of liquor wafting from my mouth with every breath be more of an /essential/ qualification or a /bonus/ one? Inquiring minds want to know!

  • PedroTheLion #590 4 years ago

    What the Hell is happening here, how can people complain about the score of a game they haven't played yet? and more importantly it got a freaking 8! That's like an A- or a B+, if one of you is a teacher I'd hate to be in your class.

  • JonFE #591 4 years ago

    OT: Can any mod count how many "new" users registered today, after the review was posted, only to vent their anger or ridicule the PS3? It could be interesting...

  • Shinji #592 4 years ago

    The stench of liquor is important, yes. Do you have a dog-onna-string? Dog-onna-string is a real bonus at the interview.

  • JYM60 #593 4 years ago

    Advice

    Turn off cunts
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:41

  • Super_Zee #594 4 years ago

    Holy shit, going from the good review, to the first page of comments, to this page is hilarious and a little scary.

    8 is a good score, MGS sounds great, blah blah blah
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:43

  • BanjoMan #595 4 years ago

    PEEPL ARE GETIN STABBED COS OF GAMES LIK THIS BAN PAEDOGRANT IMMOGRAPHIELS NOW

    ALSO, EG IS BUM HOLE SMELY MICORSOFT BUMLIK SPUNKYCHOPS GRAVYBALLS

  • InsoFox #596 4 years ago

    @arbiter

    And as *I* said before, why on earth would you want the *impression* of objectivity rather than the flat out honest truth of how someone felt about the game? Objectivity is boring and not particularly useful. The following are objective statements about MGS4:

    MGS4 is a game on the Playstation 3 console.
    There are cutscenes in the game, some of which are (x) length.
    There are stealth elements in the game.
    The game goes through an installation process before each mission.

    Some of these statements might be useful to find out whether it's the sort of game you enjoy, but they're absolutely useless as far as getting an impression about how the game feels to play. I'm not even sure what the sort of subjectivity-but-in-an-objective-wrapper you seem to be advocating would look like. I'll give it a go (hypothetically)

    "The game has some cutscenes that just feel too long and prevent me from being fully immersed in the game. Then again, long cutscenes might be the sort of thing you really enjoy, so if that's true, they're brilliant!"

    While what I just wrote is fair enough, as I explained before, you don't need that second sentence. If someone loves long cutscenes then they're not going to be worried about the first sentence. No need to give them a wink and a nod just to keep them happy. See?

  • nickthegun #597 4 years ago

    Ive sat here for 5 minutes trying to think of something more stupid to say than some of the posters here, but I just cant do it.

    Fuck.....YOU HAVE BEATEN ME, INTERNET RETARDS!!

  • DanWhitehead #598 4 years ago

    @Arbiter

    Of course any piece of opinion-based writing is inherently subjective, but to validate that opinion (to their readership) the writer first needs to demonstrate that their internal critical process is fair and unbiased. As I wrote, its all about giving the *impression* of objectivity, not lazily assuming that the position of authorship automatically bequeathes credibility.

    But how does a reviewer demonstrate that their internal thought processes are free from bias? It's impossible because, as these comments show, no matter what is said there'll always be plenty of people who assume that by giving MGS4 a mere 8/10 that Oli picked up the joypad with red hot hatred burning in his eyes.

    Objectivity is completely the wrong word to use in this situation, even more so if you claim that all that matters is the impression of objectivity. A reviewer should approach each game with an open mind, but that's not the same as being objective. Their knowledge and experience of previous games, similar games, and everything else should inform and shape their opinion because we're not sitting on the jury in a murder trial, we're sharing thoughts on videogames in the hope that our opinions might help you make a decision.

    It's even OK - if not exactly desirable - for a reviewer to start by saying "I hate Metal Gear Solid" provided this preconception is openly admitted and followed through in the review. If that person ends up enjoying the game, that's useful to know. If the things they've always hated are still there, that's useful to know. There's no rulebook other than to be informative and entertaining. Notions of bias only seem matter to those with a vested interest in the outcome - those who've already decided the game is awesome and want their assumptions validated.

    What bothers me though is when the reviewer finds that their "vision" of a title differs from that of its creators, and proceed to beat down on it for not living up to these lofty -but personal to them- aspirations. Thats subjective, but its also reckless, irresponsible and disrespectful. And the sad truth is I see this all the time in reviews.

    That's not the same as wanting reviews to be objective though. What you're railing against is bad criticism, and I'm with you all the way on that one. However, it's a thin line between a reviewer saying "I think the game would have been improved if they'd done X, Y and Z" and the reader thinking "You're criticising the game for not being what you want it to be".

    Critics should be free to make whatever comments and comparisons they feel are necessary to evaluate a game (or film, or book, or album). It's up to the reader to decide whether those words are valuable to them. Too many people look at reviews - or, more accurately, the number at the end of a review - and treat it as some holy writ issued from on high. That's why people get so defensive and angry about these things - review scores have been fetishised as some sort of gilted gateway to Scientifically Proven Quality and it can only lead to pathetic flare-ups like this thread.

    As has been said before, the purpose of a review isn't to dictate what is correct or to tell you what to think. It's an opinion - an informed opinion, hopefully written by someone who knows what they're talking about and can express their feelings clearly - but nothing more than that.

  • BanjoMan #599 4 years ago

    GET A BLOG YOU HUMAN TRAFFICKERS

  • Henni_playd #600 4 years ago

    BRING BACK THE CONFEDERACY!

  • [maven] #601 4 years ago

    NthSimulachum:
    You can describe a sunset objectively, sure. You could even describe the colours with their hexidecimal tags, and describe the non-linear diffusion patterns with mathematics.

    This is inherently wrong as you'd need to bring some form of colour-space mapping into it. I recommend counting photons. It's the only way to be sure.

  • Widge #602 4 years ago

    Well its all good PR I suppose, all everyone knows today is Metal Gear Solid!

  • nickthegun #603 4 years ago

    There wouldnt be mandatory installs before each chapter if this was on the 360.

    Fucking blu-ray.

  • Emth #604 4 years ago

    At the end of the day, if one 8/10 score is enough to put any fan off buying the game, they weren't a fan in the first place.

    This thread is going to set records..

  • Widge #605 4 years ago

    Ummm, I don't know if Oli is on hand, but one feature I liked the sound of was being able to flick back to references to older MGS games mid cut-scenes? Wanted to know how these pan out. Do you press a button when prompted (or even hidden ones) and you get cut to the older games to highlight a point?

  • Widge #606 4 years ago

    People should phone Bethseda, they can do a game with no installs!

  • nickthegun #607 4 years ago

    First Haze, now this.......lol

  • krudster #608 4 years ago

    This thread makes baby Jesus cry.

  • DanWhitehead #609 4 years ago

    Baby Jesus is teh biased.

  • Henni_playd #610 4 years ago

    Hay guys where's the internet petition to get nazigamer to change the score to at least a 9 or face the consequences.

  • thedaveeyres #611 4 years ago

    Screw 9... this game deserves a 10. Henni you are a hater. A GODDAMN HATER!!11!

  • PedroTheLion #612 4 years ago

    I'm pressing f5 repeatedly on this page and on the Neogaf MGS4 topic and it's being one of the most entertaining afternoons I've spent at work. I'm not doing much work though.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 15:58

  • smoothpete #613 4 years ago

    On the plus side, it's friday afternoon and I've got some champagne at home

  • rob76 #614 4 years ago

    Pint o clock draws ever nearer hurray!!

  • nickthegun #615 4 years ago

    I think everyone has shot their bolt.

    /flounces away, dissapointed

  • Jaybles #616 4 years ago

    Ive just decided Im cancelling my PS3 pre-order too now...

    Idiot.....

    So if i point you to the ign review, will you keep your pre-order and upgrade to the special edition?

    Does one persons opinion hold that much sway over you?

    This game is going to get on average around 9.5 going on the reviews iv seen.
    If it got on average 7 or even 6 i would probably still get it as i am a fan of the series.

    If you want to play it, then play it and dont let one persons opinion (and still high score of 8/10) stop you.

    My guess is you dont even have a pre-order.

  • Calgon #617 4 years ago

    Wheres apolol and spwam? There most be some more lulz left in this thread yet.

  • EuropeGamer #618 4 years ago

    It's an embarassing review. At least change the score to a 9!

  • Camorrista #619 4 years ago

    Why do people continue to feed the trolls?

    Internet Rules 101: Ignore trolls!

    I concur. the trolls in this thread are really starting to detract from the meaningful, enlightened discourse we were having before.

  • nickthegun #620 4 years ago

    They just did. CLear your cookies. Victory for the internet!

  • IMO #621 4 years ago

    I'm seeing 9 too. Strap in, this is gonna be fun!!

  • Henni_playd #622 4 years ago

    Squarejaw! unbelieveable- its changed to a 9 4 me as well. Was it a typo all along? Or did nazigamer buckle like DITHERING GORDON to popular demand?

    It always read like a 9. Its still a disgrace as its clearly a ten.

  • Psychotext #623 4 years ago

    @squarejawhero: Woah... I can't get it to display on this machine (maybe NTL cache or something?). But I just tried it on my work laptop and yeah, they've changed it to a 9. What the hell? Talk about backing down just because of fanboy opinion.

  • Jaybles #624 4 years ago

    First Haze, now this.......lol

    Really??

    what is your point, first haze underwhemled expectations and not what??? MGS4 gets a good review?

    great connection

  • rauper Verified Managing Director, Eurogamer Network #625 4 years ago

    "Hansi320: How do I delete my profile from this piece of shit site?"

    I'll do it for you.

  • Calgon #626 4 years ago

    Jaybles yeah I should have put a wink in there(my bad, just havin a bit of fun), it was a response to the people getting worked up about the score as if this was ever a huge system seller.

  • BanjoMan #627 4 years ago

    A NINE?!! WHAT IS THIS CUNTRY COMIGN TOO?!

  • nickthegun #628 4 years ago

    I cant believe they changed it.

    How much money have sony got?

  • Widge #629 4 years ago

    I hope that person wasn't taking inspiration from me cancelling my pre-order!
    I was merely shifting my money saving from Play to Game.
    Plus the fact that Quidco seem happy to still give me cashback on stuff I order and cancel.

  • cubbymoore #630 4 years ago

    I haven't read the article or the score, or even any of these comments, I don't even own a PS3, or a 360 or Wii for that matter. But I am appalled at this review that my mum told me was not as good as IGN's. This website which I have never been to before is funded by Bill Gates and half the pictures on its servers are close ups of the geeky man's scrotal sack, I'm guessing with cock-sure bravado. I am never going to return to this website as it does not agree with what I believe to be good. And by good I mean 10/10. Anything less is shit obviously, why would anyone settle for less than perfect? Not me, which is why I don't own any consoles until one of them gets 10/10 on IGN.

  • nickthegun #631 4 years ago

    "First Haze, now this.......lol

    Really??

    what is your point, first haze underwhemled expectations and not what??? MGS4 gets a good review?

    great connection"

    No, two massively disappointing games after another. Ones that looked good too. Luckily someone wants my PS3, so im buying a Wii.

  • Psychotext #632 4 years ago

    Seriously that's such a joke. Since when do you change reviews after they've gone up?

    At least post an explanation ffs.

  • Calgon #633 4 years ago

    lol Spwam strikes again.

  • Onny #634 4 years ago

    LOL! Score changed to a 9! BOW TO THE POWER OF SONY PRESSURE!

  • Henni_playd #635 4 years ago

    i bet all the idiots who cancelled will be well gutted now the typo score has been corrected. THIS GAME IS GUARANTEED TO SELL OUT NOW.

  • BanjoMan #636 4 years ago

    FUCK ME SIDEWAYS AND CALL ME JEMIMA

  • PedroTheLion #637 4 years ago

    Now to a more serious topic, who do do you guys think is the last Cylon? My money's on President Roslin.

  • Super_Zee #638 4 years ago

    Whoa, I'm glad I'm not the only one who saw the score change to a 9. Why change it? Will the review be pulled or re-written?

    I suppose they are allowed to change their mind. Maybe rauper's a rabid MGS fanboy!

  • sneetch #639 4 years ago

    @Jaybles
    "So if i point you to the ign review, will you keep your pre-order and upgrade to the special edition?"

    Don't do that! He'll have two different opinions and won't be able to reconcile them both. In my medical opinion (I'm a software engineer btw) he will slip into catatonia and eventually die! It'll be YOUR fault! Will you be able to live with yourself?

  • InsoFox #640 4 years ago

    Heck, it's just a score. But if 8 was the intended score, rather than 9, then changing it to 9 to pander to a outcry from a bunch of people who are going to get the game anyway and are therefore only reading the review to satisfy their cravings as a fan (I'm not knocking that, I do it all the time) is...

    ...disappointing.

  • nickthegun #641 4 years ago

    "Now to a more serious topic, who do do you guys think is the last Cylon?"

    Boxy

  • JayeM #642 4 years ago

    9/10 seem fair. I'm glad they've changed it.

  • Jaybles #643 4 years ago

    Thank fuck. I wasn't going to get this game, but now that they've corrected the typo and made it 9/10, roll on June 12th!

    Again......really..???!!!

    How does that number hold so much sway over you and other people.

    "shit it got an 8 im not going to buy it now, quick cancel pre-order cancel commemorative limited edition figures and take down my metal gear solid poster..................WAIT no they just chaged it to 9.....wow that must mean its a must buy system seller......quick upgrade my pre-order, import every differnt version for the artwork BUY BUY BUY"

  • BanjoMan #644 4 years ago

    HOW DOES ONE CLEAR ONE'S CACHE? IM STIL SEEING A FUCKNIG 8 GRRAGRGRRHH HULK SMASH

  • PedroTheLion #645 4 years ago

    Boxy? as in Deanna the boxed model?

  • nickthegun #646 4 years ago

    Its a pretty big difference. A 9 means its close to perfect.

  • UncleLou #647 4 years ago

    ""Hansi320: How do I delete my profile from this piece of shit site?"

    I'll do it for you.
    "

    rauper FTW \o/

  • nickthegun #648 4 years ago

    "Boxy? as in Deanna the boxed model?"

    No, the dagget.

  • cubbymoore #649 4 years ago

    "HOW DOES ONE CLEAR ONE'S CACHE? IM STIL SEEING A FUCKNIG 8 GRRAGRGRRHH HULK SMASH"

    Squint real hard.

  • Calgon #650 4 years ago

    Only explanation... the check was in the mail... they got it now.

    Bless you EG its all downhill from here the moment you give in to peer pressure is the moment you lose respect from the none fanboys.

  • #651 4 years ago

    Wheres the 9 you speak of? I think im getting old, my eyes fail me!

  • Aloominum_man #652 4 years ago

    It's still an 8 for me (as in, when I view the end of the review). It's also an 8 if I boot up Firefox (which I haven't used previously to view the site). I can't believe I just admitted to doing that.

  • JonFE #653 4 years ago

    What are you talking about? It still says 8 on my end... Don't make me look again...

    /fooled me once, shame on you; fooled me twice (or thrice :) shame on me...
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 16:10

  • mallocks #654 4 years ago

    heh, you guys. made me look

  • thedaveeyres #655 4 years ago

    Can't believe my eyes. 9! Had to refresh 3 times just to be sure.

    Eurogamer, where is your integrity?

    Stick by your GUNS man, stick by your guns.

  • moggsy #656 4 years ago

    It's a 10 on my screen - praise the lord!

  • Calgon #657 4 years ago

    I must confess Im taking their word for it as its still showing 8 for me here.

  • des #658 4 years ago

    Come on Sony 10/10 within an hour,you can do it:)

  • nickthegun #659 4 years ago

    U NEED TO CLEAR UR CASH IF U CANT SEE THE 9!

    Your browser already has one copy of the page, so its not loading the new one.

  • Bertie Verified Senior Staff Writer, Eurogamer.net #660 4 years ago

    Haha. That's awesome!

  • Calgon #661 4 years ago

    Quick lets change the NG2 score too then... everyone pile in. lol \0/

  • krudster #662 4 years ago

    I think the score variances are down to Nectar intake.

  • Henni_playd #663 4 years ago

    ffs yesterday's news it's been changed to a 9.

    DITHERING EUROGAMER IN BLATANT SPINELESS U-TURN NON-SHOCKER

  • DrR0b3rts #664 4 years ago

    I poked a dart in my eye and now the score is 80.

  • baphomet777 #665 4 years ago

    "baphomet777:This is the first time that I've been to this site.

    I hope it will be the last time as well."

    It might be if they don't have a Babes section like IGN which features old pics of Briggite Lahaie (sp), Maria Rohm, Maria Forsa, the Castel Twins and modern pics of Tania Derveaux from time to time.

  • Bartacus #666 4 years ago

    I'm so pleased MGS4 isn’t a 9 or 10 game I would have felt compelled to have bought a PS3 if it was, now I can save my cash.

    New rule; my scarce money is spent on EG 9 or 10 scoring games only; which should mean I will never need to buy a PS3 at this rate.

    Thanks EG.

  • rauper Verified Managing Director, Eurogamer Network #667 4 years ago

    You have to reboot your PC & router to be sure you are seeing the correct score... something todo with the internet's flux capacitor.

  • DAL9000 #668 4 years ago

    Yeah, the score's still an 8 on my other browser too. But I salute the dedicated lulz engineers who first claimed it had been changed to a 9. Well PLAYED, good sirs!

  • Jaybles #669 4 years ago

    Calgon:

    ahh sorry mate, unfortunatly sarcasm doesnt always hold up in written form lol.
    And there are delusional people who actually have that view point.

    Still far too many people basing their decision to buy the game or the console on a single review.

    Sheep.....Sheep i tell ye.

    I will be interested to see why Eurogamer changed the score?
    I bet its all to increase internet traffic, or maybe the 8 was a typo lol

  • PedroTheLion #670 4 years ago

    Jesus you still hung up on the 80's show, it was utter crap man, utter crap.

  • Aloominum_man #671 4 years ago

    @deathgibbon

    Primarily Safari, but I fired up Firefox which always clears its cache/history etc on shut down to check. It's an 8 in both browsers, multiple refreshes included.

  • IMO #672 4 years ago

    @ DAL9000:
    "Yeah, the score's still an 8 on my other browser too. But I salute the dedicated lulz engineers who first claimed it had been changed to a 9. Well PLAYED, good sirs!"

    You sure you've not got a mutual cache running on your machine? What OS you using?

  • Super_Zee #673 4 years ago

    If you turn the monitor sideways, the first score is actually infinity/10. That's more than perfect, it's God-like.

  • Calgon #674 4 years ago

    Wait it was a joke?

    Damn it I'll have to cancell my pre-order again now. 9lol

  • Aloominum_man #675 4 years ago

    bathmat777 - are you still here?

  • DanWhitehead #676 4 years ago

    It's changed to 9/10, but then the internet went upside down so now it's got 01/6.

    ONE OUT OF SIX? THIS SITE IS A JOKE AND I HOPE YOU ALL *EXPLODES*

  • JonFE #677 4 years ago

    Oh, c'mon EG, stick to your (patriot :) guns...

  • Aloominum_man #678 4 years ago

    To be honest deathgibbon, I'm not going to bother, but thanks for the tip!

  • PedroTheLion #679 4 years ago

    If someone is still falling for that joke they must be some of the most moronic people to have walked this earth

  • Les #680 4 years ago

    "This thread makes baby Jesus cry."

    Given that baby Jesus doesn't exist (except as a figment of the imagination) why should we care?

  • Calgon #681 4 years ago

    I know what theyve done... you see for the most loyalist Sonybots they will be on Linux and non MS browsers obviously so to keep them happy they see a 9 and everyone can have some peace. \0/

  • Super_Zee #682 4 years ago

    Welcome to EG comments section! :)

  • DFawkes #683 4 years ago

    Oh course baby jesus doesn't exist, he grew up, died for our sins and now cries over EG comments threads. Apparently. They need to update the bible for the last bit.

  • Henni_playd #684 4 years ago

    Im confused? Is Nazigamer deliberately trying to confuse the People? I'm seeing a 9 for sure. I'll c& p

    "Note to Readers: Eurogamer apologises to the readers for a typographical error in the review score, which could not be corrected due to unnprecedented volume of traffic immediately as the review was made available. The current score is and always was the score which the author envisaged when writing the text of the review."

    Lots of big words for DITHERING weaklings.

    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 16:22

  • thedaveeyres #685 4 years ago

    Baby Jesus would've given it a 10. No doubt.

  • andromeda #686 4 years ago

    to infinity...and BEYOND!!!

  • IMO #687 4 years ago

    I think its only fair that we get an editorial to explain the score-change after the "REAL NEXT-GEN" debacle.

  • penhalion #688 4 years ago

    @deathgibbon

    the jokes over now mate let it die in peace.

  • PedroTheLion #689 4 years ago

    of course Jesus would give it a ten, he forgave humanity for our sins, that inclues Hideo Kojima's.

  • Aloominum_man #690 4 years ago

    @deathgibbon - I take it back, I just realised I have opera installed, so checked. Never use it for browsing, only tested in it a couple of times, and the score's still 8. Same goes for safari on an iphone over EDGE, so to avoid any possible ISP caching.

    The site's a wreck in Opera, can't even open the reviews/articles from the homepage and had to C&P the url from safari to check the score page

  • BanjoMan #691 4 years ago

    EUROGAYMER IS MOSLIM EVERYONE KNOEWS THAT

  • Calgon #692 4 years ago

    *cough* PhotoshopPhotoshoplolz*cough* ;)

  • PedroTheLion #693 4 years ago

    Well shit in my mouth and call me your sister! Someone can use Photoshop!

  • DAL9000 #694 4 years ago

    Alas! Faced by screencaps, I must recant my earlier statement. Eh, if it's a typo, fine. If they changed the score for other reasons, well... we'll never be able to prove it, so meh. Whatever.

  • baphomet777 #695 4 years ago

    When I came in here, I thought he was some dude that had his nose rammed up Bill Gates' backside who was trying to help 360 fan boys around the world unite to kill the Sony Playstation. So, after reading more of these comments from other gamers, I find out that I do need to apologize to the guy because it turns out that he's only this website's MMO editor and had only reviewed a few games in his lifetime and probably thought he was awarding MGS 4 a standing ovation and the highest accolade in all of gaming as he did with Mario Kart acknowledging that they are both classics. He's probably never really played anything other than WoW, EverQuest, Guild Wars, and FFXI, and wasn't prepared mentally to tackle a story like the one found in MGS 4. So, hey man, Oli Wells, for the reasons I say above, I'm sorry that I said you enjoy sniffing Bill Gates' crack. :)

    And yes, I do hold all the Playstation's classics dear. It is my favorite console of all time.


    Also, this review can be looked at differently than I think some people that are complaining are look at it. He starts off the review by saying that people are either going to love or hate this game. So, it seems as if there's a chance that he could either give it a zero or a 10 right there. Ya know, everybody is going to love it or hate it...however, what he discovers at the end of his experience is that it is an 8. Sure it has some flaws; however, he also finds that it is far more something to be loved than hated. In fact it is far more to be loved than only 20% percent of other games that have been released. So, in my estimation, sure we're going to be wiling to and should want to experience something that is to be loved more than only 20% of the other products on the market. Sure we'll be willing to buy and experience it unless as Billy Childish and Sexton Ming would say, "we're all a bunch of poor b*stards!" In this world where game scores are treated like cricket or basketball scores instead of what they really are which is percentages, then we lose sight of the ball as it is. But what this review tells us is that if we enjoy videogames and if we have the money, then there is no reason on earth not to run out and pick up a Playstation 3 console and this very lovely game and lovable game that was designed by Mr. Hideo Kojima San.



    "@baphomet777 said:
    "It is because after I have had my say, and I scroll down the page to look at what I've said, I notice all these people trying to personally attack me like the two or three I've responded to so I feel I have to take my part against them so as to not lose face and it turns into a big circular argument, you dig...I swear I do wish sometimes there were ways we fans could quit biting each other's a$$es like that. "

    Let me remind how you open your very first post on this site:
    "This Oli Welsh person must enjoy licking the sweat off of Bill Gates' bollocks."

    You stormed in here, insulting someone you don't know, over a review of a game you may or may not hold dear but haven't played yet, on the grounds that he underrated it (compared to what I wonder, since you can judge from personal experience) and you talk about personal attacks??? You've got a lot of nerve mister... "
    Edited by 8 at 30/05/08 @ 17:07

  • Maledictus010 #696 4 years ago

    one should probably not buy this, since a revised version will most likely be released with a year... it's been known to happen.

  • IMO #697 4 years ago

    @Aloominum_man:
    "I take it back, I just realised I have opera installed, so checked. Never use it for browsing, only tested in it a couple of times, and the score's still 8. Same goes for safari on an iphone over EDGE, so to avoid any possible ISP caching.

    The site's a wreck in Opera, can't even open the reviews/articles from the homepage and had to C&P the url from safari to check the score page"

    Sounds like a problem with your registry, might want to get it looked at.

  • penhalion #698 4 years ago

    Seriously did anyone still believe the 9/10 thing after a simply page refresh? Do so many people know so little about computers that they think a system reset will change what data comes over an internet connection?

    oh dear......

  • Aloominum_man #699 4 years ago

    @deathgibbon - are you being funny? I just can't tell in here at the moment. The URL of the page will be no different unless they've uploaded an entirely new review under a new address. Just to reiterate, I also navigated 'cleanly' to the site on an iphone, using an EDGE connection, not my office wi-fi, to double check and it's still an 8. I couldn't give two shits about the score, but I'm fascinated by what's going on with different people's view of the page (if that's really happening)

  • JediMasterMalik #700 4 years ago

    The review sounds fantastic for MGS fans, which let's face it, is the demographic the game is aimed towards. I'd personally have wanted the game to be reviewed by one of those people instead, but regardless, it was a good review. It really doesn't read like an 8 though, the majority of the review sounds incredibly positive, with few issues. The fact you said that the boss fights are excellent are reason alone to purchase this game, MGS has always had the most inventive bosses.

  • EuropeGamer #701 4 years ago

    Well, 9 is a fair score I think.

  • tnomad #702 4 years ago

    9/10 on my screen

  • Les #703 4 years ago

    "of course Jesus would give it a ten, he forgave humanity for our sins, that inclues Hideo Kojima's."

    But according to the fairy tales he wasn't a big fan of Sony (a.k.a. the source of all evil a.k.a. the devil).

  • Biggz #704 4 years ago

    Come on guys, job accomplished by Eurogamer. This review has 800+ comments compared to IGN 100+.

    What exactly did the guy even mention that he disliked despite the cut-scenes?

    And "dont come back Snake... old man" ??? I think its safe to say the guy is biased.

  • PedroTheLion #705 4 years ago

    Just in case someone is still onboard the stupidity train

    http://ti nypic.com/view.php?pic=2ev9czm&s=3
    Edited by 3 at 30/05/08 @ 16:36

  • Aloominum_man #706 4 years ago

    Are we trying to say that the score is adjusted for linux based browsers only? So that PS3 browser users see a different rating?

  • SchumiF1 #707 4 years ago

    Looks like the score is now 9/10. That sounds more like it.

  • smelly #708 4 years ago

    Just posting to tell you all i'm refusing to post here.

  • smelly #709 4 years ago

    ..
    ...

    ......

    DAMMIT!

  • Aloominum_man #710 4 years ago

    @deathgibbon - sounds implausible, since I've tested on a different connection too - EDGE, as provided by O2, not by my ISP responsible for the connection in my office.

  • samaran #711 4 years ago

    why is almost everyone into my hobby a total, total dick?

  • Les #712 4 years ago

    @Aloominum_man

    Put the clown on ignore and make this section a better place for all of us...

  • DanWhitehead #713 4 years ago

    Just to clarify, by "demonstrating the process" I simple meant constructing a cogent and (ostensibly) objectively reasoned argument. The impression should be of insightful fairness.

    Constructing the impression of objectivity for a subjective argument seems like a rather round-the-houses solution when the simplest way of dealing with it is to simply accept that reviews are subjective.

    Now here's where we differ: The purpose of a review should not be the tale of how the narrator overcame or reinforced his/her prejudices, it should be *about the game*.

    The purpose of a review should be to inform and entertain. You may prefer reviews that are written in a certain way, but that doesn't mean other reviews are wrong by default. Personally, I think a review should be about the author's experiences of the game, not just the game itself. If you're not interested in what the author has to say, why read their review in the first place?

    Its like hearing testimony from an unreliable witness, it might be interesting but how useful is it for forming a reasonable and accurate impression of events?

    But as I said, a games review is not a criminal trial. You're doing what I mentioned earlier - holding up game reviews as some sort of etched-in-stone final word on a subject. You're talking about hard facts, when a review is about subjective opinion. Criticism shouldn't be a "reasonable and accurate impression of events". I could describe in detail everything I did while playing GTA IV this morning, but what's the point of that? Did I enjoy it? And if so, why? That's what criticism is about.

  • LeD #714 4 years ago

    Proper clean-cut 9 here too.

  • InsoFox #715 4 years ago

    At least Arbiter is capable of constructing and partaking in argument, even if I fundamentally disagree. Step up from a lot of the folks here.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 16:41

  • Widge #716 4 years ago

    the pixels! the pixels!

  • Henni_playd #717 4 years ago

    I love the way the DITHERING reviewer is ignoring the score-change fiasco, pretending that it never happened.

    Shame on you sir. Yuo wont fool the people tho.

  • NickD7 #718 4 years ago

    Konami in review cover up scandal

    [link url=http://uk.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs .php?topic_id=26410275
    ]http://uk .gamespot.com/pages/forums/show...[/link]

    Basically they were telling gaming mags to hide negatives about the game such as loading times, cut scene length.

    No reviews can be trusted, only the 8/10 Eurogamer review...

  • Kostabi #719 4 years ago

    Nearly at a thousand! Keep that stomach bile pumping kids!

  • thedaveeyres #720 4 years ago

    MGS4 is a great game with great story telling, great design and great gameplay. No way is it supposedly on par with Eternal Sonata which also got an 8 from Microsoft, sorry.... Eurogamer. MGS4 is 20 times better.

    160/10

    Sounds fair.

  • hulkamaniac #721 4 years ago

    omfg! i can belief u gave MTG 8%?! i here this one has mox in it? were can i by cards pls?

  • tnomad #722 4 years ago

    @Confounder "MGS4 is a great game with great story telling, great design and great gameplay. No way is it supposedly on par with Eternal Sonata which also got an 8 from Microsoft, sorry.... Eurogamer. MGS4 is 20 times better."

    What with that advance copy of the game you've got you'd know.

  • Calgon #723 4 years ago

    I think the restarting and browser business was a bit of a giveaway but... theres always the thought of "why would they make that up?"... And sure enough it did change to a 9 a few minutes after I thought that to myself.

  • Widge #724 4 years ago

    I've just finished playing Metal Gear Solid 4 and it is easily the best game called Metal Gear Solid 4 this year

  • Apologie #725 4 years ago

    That's it... i'm done with Erogamer, no more comments.

  • Shinji #726 4 years ago

    pretending to be practicing serious and credible journalism when in fact they are nothing more than biased freeloaders (free copies of Windows with every good score on Xbox360) who are unable to tell you both sides of a story.

    Seriously, you wouldn't believe how many copies of Vista I have now. I've built a small house out of them for some immigrants who live in my garden.

    Unfortunately ever since I gave Blue Dragon a 5/10 they've all been crashing about once every half hour. Microsoft is a harsh mistress :(

  • LeD #727 4 years ago

    @Calgon

    WTF are you on about? The score displayed at bottom of the third review page is a 9, I've just checked this myself.

    Stop trolling dude, the comments thread is enough of a train wreck as it is.

  • InsoFox #728 4 years ago

    @evilfoxhound

    Been done.

  • tnomad #729 4 years ago

    I played the Metal Gear Online beta and since that comes with MGS4 I've got a pretty good idea what the game will be like. I think the 8/10 is spot on.

  • Shinji #730 4 years ago

    Apologie Wrote: That's it... i'm done with Erogamer, no more comments.

    YES! We won! We won, guys! You can all stop now!

    I told you it'd all be over by Christmas, and god dammit, we WON!

  • Mudo #731 4 years ago

    I've read the first and the last couple of pages here. This it the best comments thread on Eurogamer in weeks-- nay, months!

  • Aloominum_man #732 4 years ago

    'Erogamer' sounds interesting. Kind of 'adult', if you get my drift...

  • DAL9000 #733 4 years ago

    Apologie, this question is ABSOLUTELY VITAL: /can we hold you to that/?????

  • PedroTheLion #734 4 years ago

    Do I have to keep posting this every page?

    [link url=http://ti nypic.com/view.php?pic=2ev9czm&s=3
    ]http://ti nypic.com/view.php?pic=2ev9czm&...[/link]

    Give it up guys, that's not funny at all it's Dane Cook style humour

  • des #735 4 years ago

    "Apologie Wrote: That's it... i'm done with Erogamer, no more comments. "

    He will be back,they always come back.

  • tnomad #736 4 years ago

    @HybridR

    Yeah they changed the score but it will always be an 8 in my heart!

  • JonFE #737 4 years ago

    Apologie, shouldn't that be "ErrorGamer" by any chance?

    8-D

  • DanWhitehead #738 4 years ago

    Just got this email from the Eurogamer Overlords:

    To prevent this sort of thing happening again, Eurogamer reviews will no longer feature numerical scores but will instead rate games via the use of simple pictograms which represent the general feelings the game evoked while playing. Under this new system, Metal Gear Solid 4's revised score is: A SHABBY LOOKING EAGLE, A PAIR OF ESPADRILLES, A BAG FULL OF ACORNS and A NERVOUS YOGA TEACHER.

  • Fwing #739 4 years ago

    I'm still seeing 8
    /skeptic

  • Les #740 4 years ago

    "The purpose of a review should be to inform and entertain."

    Don't agree. All I want is info. If I want to be entertained, I'll pick up a book/watch a movie. Like if I want to experience a good story, I won't turn to a video game (except maybe the MGS series).

  • ps3owner #741 4 years ago

    you are all fucking nuts :)

    almost 900 posts and this is a PS3 exclusive game, not a comparison article of cross platform games.

    wow. ppl have to much time on their hands, but it is friday after all.

    I always though religion would be the cause of WW3, then I changed my mind... it will be natural resources! But now I am not so sure. Could be a war sparked by consoles ;)

  • tnomad #742 4 years ago

    "Under this new system, Metal Gear Solid 4's revised score is: A SHABBY LOOKING EAGLE, A PAIR OF ESPADRILLES, A BAG FULL OF ACORNS and A NERVOUS YOGA TEACHER."

    I think I just wet myself laughing!

  • Widge #743 4 years ago

    Blue Dragon should have easily been a 5.5/10, more discredit to the site

  • thedaveeyres #744 4 years ago

    Just got off the phone with Hideo Kojima...

    ...he thinks it should've got a 7.

  • mkreku #745 4 years ago

    Holy crap, I went out and slept in the sun for a while and when I come back a few hours later, you fanbois have mustered 600 new replies!!

    I AM IMPRESSED! :D

  • DAL9000 #746 4 years ago

    @Les: Can your blackened, /shriveled/ heart feel any of the emotions typically associated with entertainment, though? Be honest, dude.

  • Nikanoru #747 4 years ago

    Hahahahahahahaha


    that there are several minutes of install time to be endured, not just at the start, but before each act

    Really? Wow. Anything for 90 minute long pretentious cutscenes, huh.

    Let's face it kids, your brown games are old shit, your so called deep cinematic experiences. Movie game hybrids my ass.

  • Torrino #748 4 years ago

    Wow, just wow, this guy obviously has a grudge against the MGS series and starts off with a biased minded view of MGS4, seriously this is the most unprofessional shit i've ever read i mean wtf is with this stuff:

    "There's almost too much going on. With a see-sawing episodic rhythm that visits some starkly different locations "

    "a wealth of incidental and hidden detail, "

    "more gameplay mechanics than you can fully explore in a single playthrough "

    "We love you, Snake. Don't come back"

    HOW is that above in any way bad???? jesus seriously do you get gorillas to do your fucking reviews???

    This guy has no half idea of what the fuck he's talking about and is probably just a poor reviewer in search for fucking attention because his reviews alway suck, so he has to go to the biggest game coming out and and say it's shit for the most banal reasons that he has to pull out of his ass, this guy is unprofessional, biased, and most of his reasons are pure fucking bullshit.


    "There's almost too much going on"
    "Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating"

    if the reviewer is too stupid to understand the plot and is too shit at playing the fucking game because he's on WoW all day, doesn't mean it's bad. What a fucking retard.

  • mallocks #749 4 years ago

    So he saved the screencap in photoshop, so what?

  • miiiguel #750 4 years ago

    I picture Les as a gothic pre-adult guy, rumbling "we walk in line, we walk in line..." with a black iPod with a sticker saying "Fuck the Rich" on it.

  • RM2KMaster #751 4 years ago

    Torrino.
    Have you played the game?
    ...
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    You cunt.

  • Les #752 4 years ago

    "@Les: Can your blackened, /shriveled/ heart feel any of the emotions typically associated with entertainment, though? Be honest, dude."

    If I can manage to make my brain stop working, sure it can...

  • dr_faulk #753 4 years ago

    Wait, did they change the score at some point? Either way, this is serious Birdseye Potatoe ROFLZ. Let's hit the 1,000 comments mark!

  • Deoden #754 4 years ago

    " 9/10 PRAISE THE LORD!! \o/"

    The other 10% merely wish him well.

  • T4RG4 #755 4 years ago

    Torrino - Harsh.

    Dare I say you are an MGS loving type? i.e. Film buff.

  • thedaveeyres #756 4 years ago

    dr_faulk: The score has been changed 4 times. 8 - 9 - 10 - 8.

    HOW CAN WE TAKE EROGAMER SERIOSLEY ANYMORE?

  • tnomad #757 4 years ago

    @Shinji "Seriously, you wouldn't believe how many copies of Vista I have now. I've built a small house out of them for some immigrants who live in my garden. "

    IMMIGRANTS LIKE YOU PERHAPS!!!!

  • PedroTheLion #758 4 years ago

    if you guys check that entire gaf thread you'll see my pic where I show that that the 9 score is photoshopped....

    here its is again http://ti nypic.com/view.php?pic=2ev9czm&s=3

  • Shibuyakaremixx #759 4 years ago

    What a joke of a site and reviewer.

    Credibility is GONE, why'd you let this fanboy review?

  • DAL9000 #760 4 years ago

    Nah, seriously, Les. May I suggest -- in all honesty -- an exciting new relaxation technique? It's called /liking things/, and I really think y'oughta try it out.

    Really! What /do/ you like? So far, if I recall aright, you've mentioned hating:
    - GTA
    - BioShock
    - Oblivion
    - Reviews with any hint of color or entertainment to them.

    But what about the things that make your heart go pitter-patter in your chest? What are THOSE?

  • Shinji #761 4 years ago

    Shit, rumbled.

  • DAL9000 #762 4 years ago

    @Shinji: While we have you here, I have a followup to my question about growing a neck-beard to help me break into the games journalism industry. How many of your Eurogamer coworkers /are/ in fact disgustingly un-groomed? Give me a percentage figure, please, but don't name names. /I hear they're watching/.

  • Torrino #763 4 years ago

    RM2KMaster

    Sorry but how the fuck is, "Too many locations" fucking bad???

    it's like he's disliking the game for being to good, and in the past he has always reviewed MMO's so why the fuck is he on a console game now??


    so fuck you

  • ps3owner #764 4 years ago

    hahahha this thread is getting out of control!! HELL YEAH!

    new eurogamer scoring system.

    1/10 = 0-200 posts in thread
    2/10 = 201-300 posts in thread
    3/10 = 301-400 posts in thread
    4/10 = 401-500 posts in thread
    5/10 = 501-600 posts in thread
    6/10 = 601-700 posts in thread
    7/10 = 701-800 posts in thread
    8/10 = 801-900 posts in thread
    9/10 = 901-999 posts in thread
    10/10 = more than 1000 posts in thread

    you know it works :)

  • [maven] #765 4 years ago

    Wait till you guys find out what resolution this game is rendered at... :)

  • Mudo #766 4 years ago

    The game is shit anyway, and certainly doesn't deserve anything higher than 5.

  • RM2KMaster #767 4 years ago

    I think, considering Torrino know so much about the reviewing profession, that he shoudl review the game.
    He'll give it a brand spanking new 10. And we'll all love him for it.

  • InsoFox #768 4 years ago

    @Les

    If all you want is info then why does the reviewer need to even play the game? He can get all the INFO he needs just by asking people. What makes a review a review is that as well as giving information, it describes the reviewer's personal response to the game, and of course it's better that that is done in an entertaining way. Nobody wants to read someone's boring opinions of a game.

  • PedroTheLion #769 4 years ago

    Dude give it up really, what are you? 13 years old, check the screengrab for yourself if you want. you guys on the foruns seriously need some something to occupy your time.

  • Calgon #770 4 years ago

    F*** Neoguff... they dissing EG all over the place. *Makes new account on Neoguff and polishes capslock*

  • Aphexman #771 4 years ago

    eurogamer are a bunch of x360 fanboys, halo3 got 10?eurowankers

  • Torrino #772 4 years ago

    TARGA

    I don't see why a reviewer that is biased towards a game should review that game it's pathetic

    it's like getting someone that loves Gears and hates sony to review MGS4 or vice versa

    it's pathetic.

  • MasterNameless #773 4 years ago

    I wasn't going to join this train-wreck of a comments section... but now I have to.

    @Apologie

    Yay!! You were funny to begin with, but I think we're all bored of you by now. Please, please, please, hold true to your word! Or did you just copy and paste that?

    ------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------------------

    Nice one Oli! I for one think that is a well balanced review and tells me all I need to know. I still want a PS3 for this game, but only this game, so still not quite worth the purchase I don't think.

    An 8/10 can easily be seen as a 10/10 anyway if you're a fan of the series. As third-person action adventure games go, it isn't everyone's cup of tea. That's why it got an eight, surely?

    Not believing the 9/10 shit. Unlike many others it seems, I'm not that gullible. Nice try though guys. Make yourselves feel better?

  • Les #774 4 years ago

    "Nah, seriously, Les. May I suggest -- in all honesty -- an exciting new relaxation technique? It's called /liking things/, and I really think y'oughta try it out."

    There's plenty of stuff I like but why share it with the world?! What purpose would it serve? Complaining and bitching about as well as arguing with others is much more fun.

    But if you're really interested, I like:
    - Folklore
    - PYS5
    - MLB The Show 08
    - Lord of the Rings (the book)
    - hamburgers with ketchup, mustard, onions, a bit of lettuce, cheddar and bacon
    and that's about it...

  • RM2KMaster #775 4 years ago

    LOUD NOISES

  • dr_faulk #776 4 years ago

    @ thedaveeyres

    You can't be serious? I find this hard to believe. In all honesty, and sincerity, I usually have a good feeling about games, and MGS4 always appeared in my head as an 8 (like the way Haze always looked like a 4).

    But, I'm a bit of a jaded gamer, and an 8 seems a little blasse, and ignorant of the feelings and thoughts of the mainstream gamers.

  • SchumiF1 #777 4 years ago

    Was it a 9 or wasn't it a 9?

  • Torrino #778 4 years ago

    [maven] Halo 3 was at a shit resolution, but still it was a good game, if that's taken into consideration then the credibility goes down even more.

  • Henni_playd #779 4 years ago

    haha pedro nice try you 360 fanboy loser.

  • IMO #780 4 years ago

    Surely if Elements was the default image handler, then that's what the image would be saved in no?

  • RM2KMaster #781 4 years ago

    Aphexman:"eurogamer are a bunch of x360 fanboys, halo3 got 10?eurowankers"

    And the whole of europe collectively snaps it's head back with that concise insult there.

  • Torrino #782 4 years ago

    RM2KMaster

    I won't give it a fucking 10 you numbnuts no game deserves a 10 that's why i was shocked when IGN gave GTA4 a 10,

    only official game magz give a 10 because they want to sell the game, i'd give MGS4 a 9 though.

  • Aloominum_man #783 4 years ago

    HybridR - you're confusing me. Are you for real?

  • Andy247 #784 4 years ago

    I for one can't be arsed reading all of the comments in this thread and know that it's just going to be Xbox owners having a dig, and PS3 owners defending the game that's been brandished as a console shifter (along with Killzone 2).

    So all I want to say is.....

    I'm glad Asda are selling Opal Fruits again, they truly are made to make your mouth water. Starburst fans are sell outs, grab the Opal Fruits while you can!!!

  • PedroTheLion #785 4 years ago

    I have all 3 consoles and I'm still getting this gamne, I'm not worried, well I am worried about about all of you making shit up, are you like mesntruating or something? really if you dont have omthing constructive to say just the the hell up.

  • ronuds #786 4 years ago

    LOL, people are angry at EG and vowing never to return because a game you haven't even played was scored lower than you feel it should have been?

    Pretty sad, yet hilarious all at once.

  • ps3owner #787 4 years ago

    @Torrino

    GTA IV got 10/10 from Eurogamer



    10/10

  • PedroTheLion #788 4 years ago

    I am happy if it end your stupid escuse for a joke.

  • InsoFox #789 4 years ago

    @Torrino

    Oh, I don't believe we've even got the 'No game deserves a 10' brigade in here. Go and read the Eurogamer scoring policy which is linked at the bottom of every review.

    Read it, come back, tell us what you have learned.

  • Lexx87 #790 4 years ago

    lol at over 900 comments. EG must be loving the hits :)

  • Vitor #791 4 years ago

    To all the detractors bemoaning the 'low' score, read the review - I'm a self confessed MGS fanboy (see pic) and I found it fascinating, well written and it has a good point. If you're not an MGS fan, that's what the game is probably worth.

    Eurogamer never overrate: Gears: 8/10 NG2 7/10 and in my opinion, they're reviews hold up well a few months down the line whereas IGNs (Jade Empire: 9.9) tend not to.

    It's unbiased and a far more interesting take on the series than anything else I've read in a while. I play MGS for the settings, characters and story and accept all the baggage that goes with it. And as for the tone of the review, I think people are just misunderstanding what the reviewer said and looking at it from the wrong angle.

    'Originally Posted by Undertow
    Wow this review was dead on, didn't like one thing tho ("We love you, Snake. Don't come back.";) a little harsh but great review non the less. '

    He didn't mean it in a harsh way. He's just saying that games have moved on and as monumentally significant as the MGS series was, they pushed things forward more in a narrative sense than gameplaywise. Let's face it, from a gameplay perspective, Hideo has always been slightly behind the times (only now adding a 3d camera (minus MGS3 Subsistance re-release), over the shoulder shooting, more dynamic gameplay areas). He's still playing catch up with series like Splinter Cell which introduced all this years ago.

    That doesn't make MGS any less awesome, the gameplay any less gripping. But you can't argue against it. It's a flawed masterpiece, as every Kojima game tends to be, and if they weren't, they wouldn't be as stimulating or interesting as they are. He experiments, gets things wrong but keeps on trying. Most games are afraid too. I'd rather MGS try and fail than play it safe and boring.

    As much as I love MGS (1 being my fav. game of all time), they've always been rather dogmatic and archaic in their commitment to somewhat unintuitive game mechanics

    By saying goodbye to Snake, he's signalling what he hopes for is an end to this particular brand of 'uniqueness' which, as much as I loved it, has had its time. He's not saying good riddance to the death of Snake and Metal Gear. It's more a fond farewell.

  • PedroTheLion #792 4 years ago

    Good riddance.

  • EuropeGamer #793 4 years ago

    Goddamn liars! Where's the 9 now?!

  • InsoFox #794 4 years ago

    Oh, and while I'm talking about the scoring policy:

    "Eight is that tricky "almost brilliant" category, that for fans of the genre in most cases will still warrant serious recommendation to go out and buy, while even people into other genres will probably still draw plenty of enjoyment from. You should at the very least try and play the demo, borrow it or rent it first, but bear in mind that it's not necessarily going to appeal to every person who plays it.

    There may be stand out moments spoiled by badly judged difficulty spikes, or numerous other minor and niggly factors that gang up and chip off another mark. "

  • Laika #795 4 years ago

    "A particular brand of uniqueness"

    Grammarlol.

  • captain-future #796 4 years ago

    Finally not a 10/10 hype review... but... what the hell?

    Gear Solid remains Kojima's masterpiece, then this operatic monster is his magnum opus.
    This sentence has NO meaning?

  • tnomad #797 4 years ago

    I like burgers!

  • dr_faulk #798 4 years ago

    "Wait till you guys find out what resolution this game is rendered at... :) "

    rofl h4x!

  • George-Roper #799 4 years ago

    @Apologie

    "That's it... i'm done with Erogamer, no more comments."

    Well, fuck-a-duck, EGs review of this 8/10 (AKA, not bad but not great) 'quirky game that not many people will get' actually resulted in something spectacular!

    Apologie and his cut/paste comments jobs are finally packing their bags! Thank FUCK for that!

    Whoooo!!

  • miiiguel #800 4 years ago

    chill hot-heads PS3-only lovers:
    http://ww w.eurogamer.net/article.php?art...

  • Laika #801 4 years ago

    More comments than the GTA IV review! Yay!

  • Yossarian #802 4 years ago

    not as many as Halo 3/Gears of War if I remember rightly

  • Moz #803 4 years ago

    Anyone know what there current record is for most number of comment posts on EG?

  • EuropeGamer #804 4 years ago

    You liars! Where's the 9/10 now?!

  • T4RG4 #805 4 years ago

    MGS4 is rendered at 320x240 and upscaled to 321x241 etc.

    8/10 is a great score! If you love MGS you'll enjoy this huge game. 1000 posts approaching.

  • Aloominum_man #806 4 years ago

    ** apologie memorial post **

    Iis qui facit eorum claritatem Investigationes demonstraverunt lectores legere me lius quod ii legunt! Et quinta decima eodem modo typi qui nunc nobis videntur parum clari fiant sollemnes in. Eleifend option congue nihil imperdiet doming id quod mazim placerat facer? Usus legentis in saepius claritas est etiam processus dynamicus qui. Ut aliquip ex, ea commodo consequat duis autem. Zzril delenit augue duis dolore te feugait nulla. Odio dignissim qui blandit praesent luptatum facilisi nam liber tempor cum soluta nobis. Littera gothica quam nunc putamus parum claram anteposuerit litterarum formas, humanitatis per seacula quarta decima.

  • ps3owner #807 4 years ago

    what is the resolution of the game then? surely it must be 1080p... lol

  • Deoden #808 4 years ago

    I've always thought that these types of reviews must be a pain in the arse to write. How do you expand "If you liked/hated the previous ones, you'll like/hate this" into hundreds, sometimes thousands, of words?

  • dr_faulk #809 4 years ago

    WHAT'S THE SPECIAL PRIZE FOR OUR 1,000 POSTER!?!?!? *DING DING DING* YOU HAVE WON A BOAT!

  • baphomet777 #810 4 years ago

    HybridR,

    Please send me your copy.

  • InsoFox #811 4 years ago

    Not to diminish the rest of what you said, Roper, but:

    " EGs review of this 8/10 (AKA, not bad but not great)"

    I think you're underrating 8/10 there. 8 is 'almost brilliant', in EGspeak. That's still really, really good. Grood. Great and good. Just not *brilliant*

  • Stoatboy #812 4 years ago

    "Metal Gear Solid 4's revised score is: A SHABBY LOOKING EAGLE, A PAIR OF ESPADRILLES, A BAG FULL OF ACORNS and A NERVOUS YOGA TEACHER."

    Shabby looking? Nervous? EG just can't stop the Sony hate!

    You gave Halo3 combat boots and a bag of monkey nuts, and everyone knows that was shit!

  • awb83 #813 4 years ago

    The only persons opinion that matters is your own.

  • DanWhitehead #814 4 years ago

    Didn't BoomBlox get 9 the other week?

    Yes! And clearly MGS4 is a better puzzle game than...oh wait.

  • baphomet777 #815 4 years ago

    @Charm you're a wanker.

  • InsoFox #816 4 years ago

    I suppose it's true that the only score most people would have been happy with would have been a 9. High enough to placate the fanboys 'n' girls, low enough to placate the people whining about too many 10s.

    ... Lucky that the scoring system doesn't exist purely to placate people, then.

  • ps3owner #817 4 years ago

    this thread is still quite hot. should easly reach 1500 posts

  • ronuds #818 4 years ago

    You'd all rather hear a gushing lot of nonsense like every other site and magazine has spewed? That's why we are where we are with reviews today...because they're more about catering to hype than telling the true story.

    8 is NOT a bad score. Think about someone who's never played an MGS in their life and therefore has no clue what they're getting themselves into. They might not find a bunch of cutscenes and load times to be too fun, but fans of the series have come to expect such.

    I think, if anything, every other site has got it wrong and EG was the only one to be honest and not cater to everyone's expectations. Get over it! It's still a great game for those who enjoy the series and it's still going to sell a ton of copies and consoles.

  • dr_faulk #819 4 years ago

    On Bloombox getting 9/10:

    If it had 10 hours of cutscenes it probably would have gotten 8/10. MGS4 is a game, and for all that's in it, for all the effort and detail, if the core game mechanics aren't more than 8/10, the game won't score any higher. Come on, guys! You know at heart it's just another stealth action shooter!

  • LazyDan #820 4 years ago

    Good. I'm glad EG are treating all systems equal at least - Brawl and Mario Kart reviews both read like 9/10s but got 8s, Galaxy read like 10/10 but got 9 - looks like the same's happened here.

    Always hated Metal Gear games but always wanted to like them. Very frustrating.

  • Torrino #821 4 years ago

    @ LazyDan

    By looking at the review fair is the last thing i'd use to describe it.

  • ps3owner #822 4 years ago

    @charm

    you FAIL...

  • DAL9000 #823 4 years ago

    @ the Apologie memorial: "zzril," eh? Your lorem ipsum is showing.

  • dr_faulk #824 4 years ago

    Anyone know any good jokes?

  • drumbaby #825 4 years ago

    "You'd all rather hear a gushing lot of nonsense like every other site and magazine has spewed?"

    After Eurogamer's completely OTT HL2/ GTA4/ Halo 3 reviews I for one was hoping for it, yes. Neither of those games deserved that sick-making gush treatment, yet they all got it in spades. So then...Why not MGS4?

  • Syrette #826 4 years ago

    Ahem.

    PS3lol






    Sorry.

  • Monkey_Chops #827 4 years ago

    I'm going to get a PS3 to play this game, probably whenever the Dual Shock 3 is released. 8/10's good enough for me.

  • Snarky #828 4 years ago

    Egg monkeys from space with acid for slabberz1!!!11111

  • thepiedpiper #829 4 years ago

    I think that the people that were going to buy this game regardless of the score. Much like Fifa Street, Fifa and things like that. That being said, I don't understand the aggressive nature of some of the posters on here. It's one persons opinion of the game and the one's that are complaining are going to buy it anyway and the one's stirring their wooden spoons weren't ever going to buy it in the first place.

  • dr_faulk #830 4 years ago

    I think this guy just read the review!

  • mattigan #831 4 years ago

    This thread is amusing me no end

  • Aloominum_man #832 4 years ago

    @DAL9000 - Since apol 'used' to love C&Ping semi-legible garbage in here and Lorem Ipsum translates into some text about grief and pain, it seemed completely appropriate.

    Edit for typo and addition of name. Oh, and 9/10.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 17:33

  • InsoFox #833 4 years ago

    Mm. Hype is a problem. In a perfect world, reviewers would get their review copies much earlier to let the dust has settle, when the reviewers are past the 'having to get through it to do a review' phase and into a more natural way of playing the game. I know the first few days I played GTA4 it seemed like it could be a 10/10 game, but soon annoyances bubbled through.

  • tnomad #834 4 years ago

    I feel like thanks to all the wonderful comments I've already had more fun than this 9/10 game would ever hope to provide..

  • morriss #835 4 years ago

    It's just a game, innit.

  • subtlesnake #836 4 years ago

    "After Eurogamer's completely OTT HL2/ GTA4/ Halo 3 reviews I for one was hoping for it, yes. Neither of those games deserved that sick-making gush treatment, yet they all got it in spades. So then...Why not MGS4?"

    Multiplayer?

  • ArtOfLife #837 4 years ago

    Can't wait to get Metal Gear 4. I love MGS. Love Snake, love the ninja, love the cutscenes, love the 'complex to the point of ridiculousness' direction the plot goes in, love the endless hours of codec conversations. Since Metal Gear 4 has that, I'm sold. I'd actually be disappointed if any of those things were missing.

    So it turns out MGS4 got an 8 out of 10 on this website. Who cares? You know you're going to buy it anyway if you already were a fan. And if you weren't a fan previously, number four was hardly going to change your mind. I expected a 9 from Eurogamer, but they gave it an 8. What, am I going to cancel my order now, just because some guy I've never met told me it was worth one point less? And I mean no offence whatsoever towards the reviewer himself, as after all his opinion is that the game is worth 8 out of 10 and he's entitled fully to state that.
    My point is that every single reviewer is, at the end of the day, just some random person like you and me, who happens to be in the position to publish their opinion on games, whereas we are not. If I wrote for a games website or magazine and I reviewed Halo, I'd give it a 6. If I reviewed Shenmue I'd give it a 10. I'd probably give GTA4 a 7 or 8. But who cares what I think? I'm just some guy. If you were a Halo fan you'd buy Halo 3 anyway, and if you hated Halo then all the 10/10s in the world isn't going to change your mind.

    Never will I understand the rage that a number at the end of a games review can spark off (amongst admittedly a small minority of people).

  • MasterNameless #838 4 years ago

    @MattDamon

    Go read and leave your comments on IGN then. See ya. That goes for the rest of you whingers too. You haven't even played the bloody game!!

  • ronuds #839 4 years ago

    @ drumbaby

    Well, I didn't understand why EG gave those games 10's because I didn't think they deserved it either. They've earned my respect again by going against the norm because they were beginning to lose it.

  • Biggz #840 4 years ago

    @ Ronuds

    You really think that the site that gave GRID a 9, is the site that has got the score right out of the others??? Thats just plain disrespectful to all the painstaking work that has been put into this game, You hnestly think that GRID has more content, more variety, inginuity and creativity than this game? From what Ive seen and read in Eurogamers own previews, that is not the case.

    Come on mate you know its only to push the overal ratings of the game down but it wont matter. Some people just cant accept a PS3 Exclusive scoring higher than Gaylo and Gears, its sad.. and so is whining about cut-scenes that you can just skip, if all your little brain wants to do is go shoot people up. And then youre probably looking at the worng game and should stay on 360 with Gears, Halo, Gears2, Halo Wars blablabla.

    If this was multiplat ie on 360 GUARANTEED minimum a 9 from eurogamer

  • tnomad #841 4 years ago

    1000

  • captain-future #842 4 years ago

    hehe, almost @ evilfoxhound ;)

  • Kua #843 4 years ago

    yay for 1003 and shit posting

  • MasterNameless #844 4 years ago

    @Matt Damon

    No, of course I haven't, but neither am I slamming the reviewer for a game I haven't even played. You see where I was going with that comment now? There ya go.

  • Gradius #845 4 years ago

    The Drama!

    Listen, true MGS fans will love this game, that's all that matters, not a score. To a fan of the franchise it will feel like a 10/10 game. A review is just an opinion after all, and I know I certainly don't always agree with EG's views, Blue Dragon springs to mind. I loved that game, EG gave it a 5/10, in that instance, I'd have to say I strongly believed it deserved a far higher score, but who cares, I still got the game and had literally hundreds of hours of fun with it. What I'm trying to say is, Xbox crowd, stop with the silly gloating please, PS crowd, stop taking the bait, this game doesn't need defending, if you're a fan, you'll enjoy it whether EG gave it a 3/10 or a 10/10.

    Seriously, a lot of you people are straight loony! ;-)

  • Yossarian #846 4 years ago

    go thread go!

  • ronuds #847 4 years ago

    @ Bigzz

    I don't know about the whole "if this was a 360 game" comment, seeing as Gears of War got an 8 as well. This just seems a more honest review to me because no game is as great as some of these other reviewers are making it sound. I mean, some of these guys are having accidents in their pants because Snake can use camo...it's a little ridiculous. No game is all THAT great.

    But I agree that neither GTA IV or Halo 3 deserved 10's either. I couldn't say what GRID deserves as I've never played it. But production costs (as you argue what automatically makes MGS4 better) don't necessarily make a game more fun to play.

  • Yaz #848 4 years ago

    Agreed Gradius. :)

  • subtlesnake #849 4 years ago

    "You really think that the site that gave GRID a 9, is the site that has got the score right out of the others??? Thats just plain disrespectful to all the painstaking work that has been put into this game, You hnestly think that GRID has more content, more variety, inginuity and creativity than this game? From what Ive seen and read in Eurogamers own previews, that is not the case."

    The reviewer would probably agree with you: "It's a crying shame, given how many genuinely classic gaming moments there are here, given the countless exquisite creative touches,"

    But a game is more than just a collection of individually great moments, and the reviewers' job isn't to assess the amount of effort put into a game's production, but to determine whether that effort pays off: whether the game actually hangs together, as a whole. And that's the case, irrespective of the scale of the game: so yes, for example, Geometry Wars may have taken one hundredth of the effort to produce and have one hundredth of the content, but it doesn't make it any less deserving of its nine.

    "Come on mate you know its only to push the overal ratings of the game down but it wont matter. Some people just cant accept a PS3 Exclusive scoring higher than Gaylo and Gears, its sad.."

    Yeah, that's obviously why Eurogamer gave Drake's Fortune a 9. Oh wait….

  • Gradius #850 4 years ago

    "No game is all THAT great"

    Lost Odyssey is, FACT! :)

  • MasterNameless #851 4 years ago

    @Gradius

    +2! One for each of your last two comments!

  • Lexx87 #852 4 years ago

    Just lol at all the whinging cunts

  • HolyJebus #853 4 years ago

    This tread makes me embarrassed to be a gamer. EG should implement an "ignore all poster" button

  • Feanor #854 4 years ago

    It it had got a 9, would the thread be half as big?

  • Lexx87 #855 4 years ago

    Feanor it would have been the same unless it got a 15/10

  • MyPointIs #856 4 years ago

    100% game
    20% crap
    =
    80%

    Sounds about right to me.

  • IneptPercy #857 4 years ago

    Looks like I missed the party here...

    I fell out with metal gear on the last one, this confirms its not worth me buying a PS3 for.

  • Biggz #858 4 years ago

    @ subtlesnake

    "But a game is more than just a collection of individually great moments, and the reviewers' job isn't to assess the amount of effort put into a game's production, but to determine whether that effort pays off: whether the game actually hangs together, as a whole."

    This is ridiculous. they sat and decided, that overal a racing game, is a better experience than this. I dont know about you, and I love GT5 P, but its a game for when there aint much else to play. Like all racing games for me at least.

    And yes they may have done back then for uncharted, but PS3 was lagging far behind, and was prolly given as charity. Plus I think this is more about controversy: Ive never heard of this site. however this review has 1000+ comments compared to IGN 200+, I wonder why.

    Also the author states things which Kojima has come out and stated as not true, why did he even need to mention them at all?? Coulda just said very nice graphics, tour de force etc. It was unneccessary and false. Flame Bait==page hits


  • gohda #859 4 years ago

    SUCK ME YOU IDIOT FANBOYS

  • Liamario #860 4 years ago

    I like biscuits

  • yupyup #861 4 years ago

    This is trolling

  • HolyJebus #862 4 years ago

    LOL Liamario, you're such an idiot, how can you like biscuits. Biscuits are so shit. I've never tasted one but they are SHIT. Crisps are so much better then biscuits. You my friend, are an IDIOT. biscuitslol. etc etc.

  • PedroTheLion #863 4 years ago

    LOL, seems like today's let the loons out of the asylum day, Hurray for loons!

  • Widge #864 4 years ago

    100% game
    20% crap
    =
    80%



    in the land of bizarr-o-percentages

  • miiiguel #865 4 years ago

    I heard stupid things, but saying that a certain type of game can't reach more than 8 because it's a "lesser genre" is astounishing, not too mention uterly pedantic.


    I wonder if a comedy can receive an Oscar..., or if eating is worse than reading?
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 18:26

  • NickD7 #866 4 years ago

    People have been up Kojima's arse for to long, was sick of hearing how he could do no wrong. MGS as a series is fucking average, FACT. Only Eurogamer and Gamespot seem to understand this , they gave MGS3 8/10, and now MGS4 gets 8/10, I fail to see the problem. There are MANY better games out there that don't have fucked up stories, overy long dull cut scenes, average gameplay. I'm glad you MGS fans like the games, but ALOT of people think they are shit and Kojima is over rated,

    Deal with it.

  • Drpwnage #867 4 years ago

    "This is ridiculous. they sat and decided, that overal a racing game, is a better experience than this. I dont know about you, and I love GT5 P, but its a game for when there aint much else to play. Like all racing games for me at least."

    "LOL Liamario, you're such an idiot, how can you like biscuits. Biscuits are so shit. I've never tasted one but they are SHIT. Crisps are so much better then biscuits. You my friend, are an IDIOT. biscuitslol. etc etc."

    :D

  • PedroTheLion #868 4 years ago

    Juno is a comedy, at least I laughed all the way through, sometimes I laugh to mask my sadness.

  • morriss #869 4 years ago

    It's just a game.

  • des #870 4 years ago

    I like biscuits and crisps,beer also.
    So what am i?

  • PedroTheLion #871 4 years ago

    @des

    British?

  • HolyJebus #872 4 years ago

    "I like biscuits and crisps,beer also.
    So what am i?"

    ehhhh, a slut who takes backhanders from everyone.

  • #873 4 years ago

    Post 1215 sums up this site pretty well lol

    LINK

  • miiiguel #874 4 years ago

    fanboys change their mind pretty quick. IGN was the worse yesterday, today rocks.

  • Scythe #875 4 years ago

    This coming from the site that gave GTA4 (tons of bugs) and Halo 3 (same old same old just prettier ... and not even by that much) a 10?
    Well done Microgamer, you've certainly shown your true colours. How much are you being paid for those Ninja Gaiden 2 ad's by the way? You've become such a MS shill site it's not even a joke any more.

    I might have thought otherwise had you been as critical of the other 2 games you've given a 10 to but the double standards speak for themselves. MGS4 might not be deserving of a 10 but GTA4 and Halo3 sure as hell didn't either ... didn't stop you then. Oh wait ... sorry ... those games weren't PS3 exclusives. Oh well, I'll consider this an honorouary 9 then taking the customary "PS3 exclusive at least -1 point" deduction into account. Actually, because this is a huge PS3 exclusive, you probably upped that to 2 ... Uncharted wasn't as big of a release. So yeah, honourary 10 when discounting the automatic deduction that you must take from any PS3 exclusive.

  • Redeye #876 4 years ago

    I knew this was going to degenerate into a complete miasma of gibberish and comedy gold (waaaaay back in the early 100s somewhere), but damned if I realised it was going to be quite this insane. Mentals of all creeds and factions, I salute you. You mad wonderful fuckheads. :D





    And it should have been a 6.

    /runs like hell

  • monkie_king #877 4 years ago

    People on Internet = beyond satire.

    Also: What RedEye said.

    Also: Mehtal Gear.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 18:49

  • miiiguel #878 4 years ago

    I wonder what these insults to the reviwer try to achieve.

    PS3LOL!!!! (Not realy, but I get kicks outa ppl going mad...)
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 18:49

  • dr_faulk #879 4 years ago

    And yet no one has commented on Snake's death by Otacon's senseless bum-rape....
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 18:53

  • captainrentboy #880 4 years ago

    So just one mark higher than the 'massive failure' that is Ninja Gaiden 2 then? :)


    *Realises 8/10 is a good mark, don't go mental*

  • mattigan #881 4 years ago

    MGS games are crap anyway, what's all the fuss about? Just my opinion of course, everyone's entitled to their opinion, including the writer of this review, which I believe is the point of a review? To read someones retelling of their experience of a given entertainment medium and opinion on it, or is it just me....

  • subtlesnake #882 4 years ago

    "This is ridiculous. they sat and decided, that overal a racing game, is a better experience than this. I dont know about you, and I love GT5 P, but its a game for when there aint much else to play. Like all racing games for me at least. "

    They're different sorts of experiences. Are comedy films better than action films; are dramas better than documentaries? All the score tells you is that, GRID, within the context of its genre, does a better job (in the opinion of the respective reviewers). It doesn't represent some sort of 'meta-ranking' allowing you to place it against every other sort of entertainment experience; that depends on your genre preferences.

    Is Geometry Wars better than Gears? What does 'better' even mean in this context?

    Personally, I can't stand racing games, but I'm not going complain that one is given a 9, because I understand that others have different set of preferences and expectations, and the score only has meaning within that context.

    "And yes they may have done back then for uncharted, but PS3 was lagging far behind, and was prolly given as charity."

    So they swing from selfish corrupting greed, with general a bias against Sony, towards warm-hearted benevolence? And every so often they give 'AAA' 360 titles relatively low scores, just even things out I take it?

  • miiiguel #883 4 years ago

    "And yet no one has commented on Snake's death by Otacon's senseless bum-rape.... "
    Didn't you get it by now? The game is tottaly irrelevant... it's an esoteric thing of brands and exclusives and conspiracies and bias...

  • Dizzy #884 4 years ago

    "Post 1215 sums up this site pretty well lol

    LINK "

    ROLF.. and he links to NeoGaf. Best joke of the day.

  • bad09 #885 4 years ago

    Still going strong I see!

    The thing I find really funny (and quite sad) is the number of people who actually signed up just to comment on the score or slag the reviewer! I know we all probably spend way too much time talking, debating and arguing on the net but to sign up to a website you never use just so because you are angry at a review score is incredibly sad, and those of you who have done this really need to think about getting girlfriend or a hooker if you are incapable of getting one. You need to get laid pretty quick!

    More importantly how about EG please shedding just a little light on why there is no mention of MGO, if we have to wait fine, I'm still curious why there was no mention whatsoever in the review of this fairly important starter pack which is included with MGS4.

  • DUFFKING #886 4 years ago

    OH MY GOD HE GAVE THE GAME 8/10 AND BACKED UP HIS REASONS FOR DOING SO IN THE REVIEW!

    BURN HIM!

    And that neogaf post is incredibly ironic, since neogaf is the worst website on the internet.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 19:07

  • Les #887 4 years ago

    "@Les

    If all you want is info then why does the reviewer need to even play the game?"

    I read reviews because I want information to make a buy/no buy decision. Look at book, movie or cd reviews. Rarely the reviewer thinks her-/himself more important than the material she/he's reviewing.

  • miiiguel #888 4 years ago

    "So they swing from selfish corrupting greed, with general a bias against Sony, towards warm-hearted benevolence? And every so often they give 'AAA' 360 titles relatively low scores, just even things out I take it? "

    Fucking priceless! I mean, it covers all possibilities! Amazing!
    Case closed! This is it!
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 19:10

  • monkie_king #889 4 years ago

    Lester Bangs ring any bells?

  • Les #890 4 years ago

    "Multiplayer?"

    @ subtlesnake

    In HL2?

  • kentmonkey #891 4 years ago

    The income generated from the constant refreshing and posting in this comments section by everybody who has participated today must have covered all of EG's bills for the next month, minimum!

    I can see Rupert grinning from ear to ear. I can't obviously. That was just a metaphor. He's in Brighton. I'm not. But he's there, in my mind. Smiling. Throwing fifty pound notes into the air. Quaffing wine.

  • subtlesnake #892 4 years ago

    "In HL2?"

    Oh, I assumed he was referring to Orange Box (one of the recent spate of 10s), but maybe not.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 19:15

  • bruiser07 #893 4 years ago

    No one really appreciates reading a bad review on a highly anticipated game when the review comes from someone who didn't enjoy any of the previous versions of the game. Ending the review "We love you Snake. Don't come back" is just an attempt to piss off the fans. Thanks a lot.

  • Les #894 4 years ago

    "and those of you who have done this really need to think about getting girlfriend or a hooker if you are incapable of getting one."

    What makes you think all of them like women?!

    "Oh, I assumed he was referring to Orange Box"

    You assume too much... Though IMO (and therefore worthless to you all so please don't respond) HL2 is the one game in his list that actually deserved a 10/10.

  • Les #895 4 years ago

    "Ending the review "We love you Snake. Don't come back" is just an attempt to piss off the fans. Thanks a lot."

    But what's more sad: People getting worked up because someone that in the greater scheme of things is rather irrelevant (a.k.a. not you) makes this silly statement or the sad git actually writing it in the hope to get people worked up...

  • miiiguel #896 4 years ago

    It did end with a punch, though..., lol!

    And it kinda worked, as we can see.

  • VMerken #897 4 years ago

    I am going to love the opinion piece by Kieron Gillen ratifying this opinion piece as the gospel. Now let's all buy the game and a PS3 and discover our own opinion or wait for the inevitable multiplatform release.

    Oh, and my crystal ball predicts 8/10 for Resident Evil 5 on this site. It also notes 6/10 if it gets written by Dave McCarthy.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 19:30

  • Les #898 4 years ago

    "Oh, and my crystal ball predicts 8/10 for Resident Evil 5."

    A Resi that scores lower than Alone in the Dark?! What will this world come to...

  • bruiser07 #899 4 years ago

    Now let's all buy the game and a PS3 and discover our own opinion or wait for the inevitable multiplatform release.

    There won't be a multi-platform release unless it is on PC's with blu-ray players... the game maxs out the blu-ray disc as it is now. It would take 5 dvds to get all of MGS4 on an xbox360.

  • bad09 #900 4 years ago

    What makes you think all of them like women?!

    LOL very true Les forgive my heterosexual ignorance to the PS3s gay community :)

  • Les #901 4 years ago

    "LOL very true Les forgive my heterosexual ignorance to the PS3s gay community :)"

    Women that like men are gay nowadays as well!?

  • murphy245 #902 4 years ago

    Lies 10/10

  • Gradius #903 4 years ago

    I bet Apologie is singing that Sweeney Todd song "I will have vengence!" right now :D

    Anyway, the score hasn't put me off at all. I'm gonna love this game! I'm really excited about many of the titles coming within the next year or so, RE5 is another one I can't wait for and Gears2 is out a day before my birthday, so the biatch (my lovely Mrs) knows what to buy me :)

    I can't help but feel a bit sorry for certain people who are expressing such glee at a (possibly lower than expected) review score. I can get genuinely disheartened when a game of great expectations is not received as well as hoped (not because the score matters to me, rather that it's just nice to have someone confirm my high hopes and expectations before I actually purchase the game in question) but if they don't give a score I'm happy with then I go and play it for myself and form my own views, but seriously, I don't get some of you guys! Why are you happy that a game gets a lower score than perhaps predicted? WHY?

    I pose the exact same question to the people being numpties in the NG2 comments section. Is it just tit for tat, or what?

    /does not understand :(

  • smelly #904 4 years ago

    sheesh some of you guys need to get a life.

  • Tuffty #905 4 years ago

    I've always found EG's reviews to be much fairer and accurate in the long run than other certain reviews (IGN's 9.9 to Jade Empire for example). You have to laugh at the idea that an 8 is now a bad score. And the protests are coming from those who haven't even played it. The same type of people who probably will rush through the game once they get a copy and then later state on the forums once it's all over that an 8 was justified.

    I'm a MGS fan and the actual content of the review made me more excited for MGS4 than before I read it. Shame I don't have a PS3, although there's now a perfectly good reason to get one by the sounds of it. Though judging by certain people you'd think EG single-handedly brought about the end of days.

  • #906 4 years ago

    @Dizzy, see i mark this site a five, and the GAF only 1 point higher.. A six. Means it still shite but less so than here.

  • VMerken #907 4 years ago

    bruiser07, keep in mind that Bioshock also never was going to be released on PS3, or RE4 was never going to be released on any platform other than the Gamecube. And there are are plenty more system exclusives like that out there, remember Devil May Cry, Assassin's Creed, Resident Evil 5 and GTA IV, all PS3 exclusives (could go on there but well)?

    Movies can be compressed, workarounds/compromises are possible and I don't think people will have trouble coping with multiple Div9s, as most never had trouble coping with multiple CDs back in the day (Baldur's Gate 2, Torment et al. come to mind).

    Oh, almost forgot: let's all be glad it's an 8, otherwise noone here would have such an amusing comments uberthread to read :). Sensationalism and standing out is key to a site's survival after all.
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 19:40

  • smelly #908 4 years ago

    "Plus one. You could tell in the first two pars that the reviewer was not open minded about MGS4, that's pretty unprofessional in my opinion."


    LOL

    So if i go to see Indy 4 and dont like it.. is that because i'm not being open minded enough?

    Tell you what that means ALL games are 10/10 scores.. if you're open minded enough..

    Sigh..

    Seriously .. get a life..

    I'd rather a critical review and a lower score which gets me to research said game and decide that i'll like or dislike it.. Than an overly glowing 10/10 review telling me its the best thing since sliced bread.. so i rush out and buy it - and it's mediocre (coughhalo3cough).

  • Camorrista #909 4 years ago

    I suspect this thread is about man-ass in skin-tight camo, yes?

  • Scimarad #910 4 years ago

    I see the 8 = crap crowd are out in force today!

    I'm definitely sold after that review.

  • Psychotext #911 4 years ago

    You know what this comments section needs? More posts.

  • gamingqueen #912 4 years ago

    The review had a bashing tone all over it how's that professional? Next time when you review a game, try to hide your hate for the series a little by going straight to the point. You mentioned that the cut-scenes were long, well all metal gear games had long cut-scenes. Were metal gear solid 4 lengthy cut-scenes that surprising for you? DUH! Also, this is the last game in the franchise and previous metal gear games didn't put a closing for some issues neither had answers and those who want to play the game are waiting for those answers so it's granted that the game will have too much explanation going on! You said that you felt Kojima was rehashing metal gear games? I can't believe you said that! How's that when the guy was using the same gameplay engine so that anyone who plays it and have played previous games get used to it quick and another for shooting? This game allows you to play in a million different way unlike other current generation games which you only do one thing nine times! Your review is so misleading and unprofessional and it has "I wanna bash metal gear" tone written all over it and I think you should you take it down.

  • Scimarad #913 4 years ago

    Holy crap!! I've just seen how many post there are!

    er, sorry.

  • gamingqueen #914 4 years ago

    @smelly: Crtical my ass. That was bashing that wasn't a review.

  • chris_ace #915 4 years ago

    Post deleted at 11:55:13 13-12-2011

  • gamingqueen #916 4 years ago

    Tell me you wrote this review to attract users please.

  • gamingqueen #917 4 years ago

    Do the gods who write those review read the comments here?

  • GingerNathan #918 4 years ago

    OH NOES GAME X ON CONSOLE X HASN'T GOT THE SCORE i WANTED IT TO GET REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE ACTUAL REVIEWER THOUGHT, THAT'LL EFFECT ITS METECRTIC AND GAMERANKING SCORE THUS I WONT BEABLE TO POST ON GAMING FORUMS HOW MY CONSOLE OF CHOICE ROXXORS!!!!!!! WAWAWAWAWAWAWAWAWA
    Fuck off fanboys.

    Good review of a game I'm really looking forward to, can't wait to put it in my PS3 and play it.

  • nhojuhc #919 4 years ago

    Controversy and Hits is exactly what Eurogamer was looking for with this review. Looking at the number of comment posts, there have been more comments in one day than 2 months under Halo3. I personally find it sad that they've resorted to underhanded maneuvers like this to gain user registration, users, and readership. The game wasn't scored based of its merits, but simply for either personal or institutional gain. That and the increasingly obvious Asian developer bias that plagues so many Western Publications these days. This Japanese made title was perfectly suited for taking the controversial fall. But you won't ever see anyone admitting to this subliminal racism.

    Addendum: Complaining about MGS4 cutscenes is a poor excuse for deducting points. Unlike a technical flaw, which can't be bypassed, a simple press of X button suffices to skip a cutscene (something you can't even do for a movie). Don't like the convoluted long scene? Skip it.
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 20:20

  • Cheapshot #920 4 years ago

    Wasn't this review posted only today? This is a disgusting amount of comments. :o

    I can see why the game would get an 8 in some perspectives, but for MGS fans we all know this game is going to be bloody incredible.

  • mattigan #921 4 years ago

    Yes they read the comments, and they post too...

    Krudster
    Bertie
    Rauper
    Shinji (the reviewer I think)

    Amongst others, they seem to be a good bunch with a dry sense of humour (similar to mine) and over the long term have proved to be very acurate and trustworthy in their reviews.

  • scarabium #922 4 years ago

    Who cares if it's an 8 or a 10. MGS fanboys are commenting on a game that they haven't even played yet. That in itself tells you everything you need to know about their insecurities regarding the PS3.

    Personally, I find MGS games to be utterly dull. Hours of cliched cutscenes with the odd bit of gameplay.

    Makes me laugh when the PS3 Fanboys call people Fags when Solid Snake is essentially a guy in fag drag. Perhaps the appeal of playing a guy dressed like an ubergay is the real reason behind so many fanboys rants. Bottled up in that closet for so long must make you very angry :)

  • Les #923 4 years ago

    "Does everyone else see how riddled with contradiction this entire review is?"

    You actually read the full text!? 8|

    Game reviewers should stop with these endless sagas that are more about showing off how well they (think they) can write rather than informing the public about a game. Reviews around here (and on most other sites) could easily be cut to 1/6th of the total length without any loss of information.

  • Yossarian #924 4 years ago

    When you're posting threats to a game reviewer on an Internet messageboard because he only gave a game you haven't playe yet 8/10 you know it's time to reevaluate your life.

  • gamingqueen #925 4 years ago

    you're calling us ps3 fanboys and you say we're defending a game we haven't played?

  • Les #926 4 years ago

    School's out and immediately people insecure about their sexuality feel the need to demonstrate their masculinity...

  • belziah #927 4 years ago

    WOW

    just like

    Woweeeeee

  • gamingqueen #928 4 years ago

    I don't think Uncharted is better than metal gear solid 4 btw

  • gamingqueen #929 4 years ago

    @Les: This women don't play videogames is as old as dinosaurs so shut your hole.

  • Nikanoru #930 4 years ago

    This thread has the potential for 2k.

    You can do it! MGS4 rules/sucks!

  • GingerNathan #931 4 years ago

    "But the reality is the review is poop. None of his prejudice is backed with reason. "

    I don't see them as prejudices, they are criticisms of the games structure which hasn't really changed since the PlayStation original. This is fine for people like me who are big MGS fans, but from what I've read (from a few reviews) people who didn't like the formula before aren't going to like it in MGS4. That's why I accept the fact that someone has given it a good but not high score, MGS divides the gaming community more then just about every series out there. Reviews are written for everybody not just the portion of gamers who love the series.

  • Psychotext #932 4 years ago

    @chris_ace: You're forgetting the 8.5 from Jeux Video and you're also forgetting that EG are the first of the big reviewers to post their reviews...

  • gamingqueen #933 4 years ago

    Love it or hate it if you hate then why the heck did you review it?

    I can't review a horror movie when I hate horror genre movies can I?

  • VMerken #934 4 years ago

    > chris_ace: "inconsistent reviews suck"

    Yes, I agree. before writing an opinion piece, the opinion piece writer should consult all of his/her colleagues and reach a consensus on the score, then he/she will write his/her opinion piece and add the score which was agreed upon. Following this methodology, scoring becomes consistent all over the board, changing only slightly when new opinion piece writers are hired but ultimately always stabilising.

    It is a winning plan.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 20:25

  • nhojuhc #935 4 years ago

    Jeux Video gave it a 9 ... not an 8.5. Review your "fact"

  • gamingqueen #936 4 years ago

    @GingerNathan: Hey hey hey stop right there. This game has a new gameplay engine BESIDES the one in old games which allow you to shoot just as resident evil 4 and gears of war. This game has the new octocam system and tons of stealth tricks added now how's that "old stuff" in a new game? Metal gear games are the last games anyone would call "recycled"

  • GingerNathan #937 4 years ago

    "Love it or hate it if you hate then why the heck did you review it?
    "
    I think he said he has a love/hate relationship with it. I read that to understand that parts of it he loves, others he doesn't.
    Hands up any MGS Uber fans that can honestly say they loved the codec conversations in MGS2 between Raiden and Rose, or Octacon harping on about battlefield love in the original?

  • Daymare #938 4 years ago

    It's a shame such a great series is also beloved by such stupid, insecure and childish people:(

  • gamingqueen #939 4 years ago

    Next time you write a review, don't ruin the ending for readers please...just don't include any refrence to the ending... that if I was ever going to read a review from you again.

  • GingerNathan #940 4 years ago

    "This game has a new gameplay engine "
    I said structure not gameplay, many people hate the excessive use of cut scenes, codec conversations, and the fantastic characters in a supposedly serious environment.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 20:29

  • gamingqueen #941 4 years ago

    @GingerNathan: I'm a uber fan and I loved Raiden and Rose's phonecalls. I thought characters looked very expressive and deep and that's not something you find in many games.

  • VMerken #942 4 years ago

    >GingerNathan: Hands up any MGS Uber fans that can honestly say they loved the codec conversations in MGS2 between Raiden and Rose, or >Octacon harping on about battlefield love in the original?

    I loved the scene in Metal Gear Solid 1 where Snake enters the Metal Gear Rex hangar and Otacon has a ten minutes Codec conversation with him every five steps or so to report his progress on hacking into President Baker's personal files.

    That really kept the pace going.
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 20:30

  • gamingqueen #943 4 years ago

    @Nathan: If he hates it so much how can he review it? A review is suppoused to be neutral last time I checked and then his review wasn't informative at all.

  • GingerNathan #944 4 years ago

    "That really kept the pace going. "

    That was a personal favourite of mine too. :p

  • MouzerMalti #945 4 years ago

    I'm glad to see a non-biased OMG TIS GAME IS SO AWWWZOM!!!!11 review.

  • Cyhwuhx #946 4 years ago

    .::: My condolences to the EG crew. Hang in there guys, it's just a phase they're going through.

  • Ryze #947 4 years ago

    Oh well.

    The PS3 needs this regardless. My bruv will want this in 2010.

  • gamingqueen #948 4 years ago

    I think someone who doesn't like that type of games shouldn't review the game just as someone who can't sing shouldn't be in the music industry right? Welsh you shouldn't review metal gear solid 4.

  • scarabium #949 4 years ago

    MGS4 will be the PS3's Space Giraffe

  • nhojuhc #950 4 years ago

    If the reviewer is going to state in his preview:

    "And on this occasion, in a heroic effort to draw a line for once and all under Snake's story and give the Metal Gear Solid series the grand finale it deserves, Hideo Kojima and his team really have outdone themselves. 'Extravagant' doesn't cover it. Nor do 'dramatic', 'spectacular', 'sentimental', 'surprising', 'long-winded', 'final', 'painstaking' or 'polished'. Guns of the Patriots is Metal Gear Solid in excelsis." - Oli (same guy who reviewed the game)

    Then don't give the game an 8, because no game in the 8 category gets this kind of verbiage.

  • GingerNathan #951 4 years ago

    "@Nathan: If he hates it so much how can he review it? A review is suppoused to be neutral last time I checked and then his review wasn't informative at all. "

    Because he was asked to by the people that run Eurogamer? Besides I really don't think he hates the game, just looked at it with the balanced approach of someone who doesn't think Kojima is the living incarnation of God ;).
    Which to be honest has been needed around here for some while, there's been a lot of tens dished out at Eurogamer over the last year and apart from Orange Box and maybe Galaxy (haven't played Banga-O Spirits yet so I can't comment on that one) I think they've been very generous. I think you can label inconsistency towards Eurogamer, but certainly not bias (I haven't seen any obvious signs).

  • Max_Powers #952 4 years ago

    "This game has a new gameplay engine "

    Really? You should license that so-called "gameplay engine". You'll make tons of money.

    MGS is the most overrated series ever. MGS4 without the license? Probably a 6 or 7.

    No-one on this forum will put up with 90 minute cut-scenes if this game wasn't MGS.

  • gamingqueen #953 4 years ago

    @GingerNathan: I doubt you even played metal gear. You keep saying the things only a metal gear hater would say.

  • VMerken #954 4 years ago

    >>gamingqueen: @Nathan: If he hates it so much how can he review it? A review is suppoused to be neutral last time I checked and then his review wasn't informative at all.

    He also loves it, so it all pans out.

    The review is just an eloquently put, partially dramatised opinion from someone who played a review copy of the game. It's nothing less, and nothing more than that. Love it, hate it, it doesn't matter. Did you ever let someone else's opinion stop you from buying a game you are interested in unless the other opinion contained arguments you fundamentally care about?

    Must a AAA game have perfect scores on every site/mag by every opinion piece writer? Is some cosmic law broken when this happens?

    No.

    If this review was put forth as undisputed gospel, in other words, the absolute truth, then there'd be a problem and arguments would become necessary. It is not the case this time. Maybe the review contains blatant lies and/or inefficient control use beyond the knowledge of the author or not - we will only know when we take the controllers in our hands and play the game. For now, there can be no substantial arguing against this particular opinion piece.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 20:49

  • gamingqueen #955 4 years ago

    @Maxpower: Yes it does can't you look at over the head cam?

    He knew metal gear focuses heavily on story-telling more than gameplay so how the heck was he disappointed about soemthing he already knew about?

  • gamingqueen #956 4 years ago

    So the story which is the main focus of the game is the reason why he dropped the score to 8 and called it pretencious? But the thing is, metal gear games are about the story!

  • GingerNathan #957 4 years ago

    "@GingerNathan: I doubt you even played metal gear. You keep saying the things only a metal gear hater would say. "

    Yet I know details about conversations between Otacon and Snake about battlefield love to describe how he feels about Sniper Wolf, and that Raiden has a girlfriend in MGS2 called Rose; who actually isn't his girlfriend but a spy put their to play his girlfriend by the Patriots, and in the end credits he ends up holding her in the streets iof New York. Whatever.

  • VMerken #958 4 years ago

    > Demento41: I'm all for proper critical reviews, but I wish there was a bit more consistency on this site.

    Reiteration: Yes, I agree. before writing an opinion piece, the opinion piece writer should consult all of his/her colleagues and reach a consensus on the score, then he/she will write his/her opinion piece and add the score which was agreed upon. Following this methodology, scoring becomes consistent all over the board, changing only slightly when new opinion piece writers are hired but ultimately always stabilising.

    It is a winning plan.

  • seasidebaz #959 4 years ago

    OMFG AN 8?//???//???



    but back to reality, if i didn't like the previous games, will i like this one?

  • WJF #960 4 years ago

    @gamingqueen
    I knew someone who really loved 'Enter the Matrix'. He completed it a countless number of times. He'd have given that game a 10 (or at a pinch, a 9) if he were to score it out of 10. Do you agree? I mean, he loves that type of game ('3rd person action', just in case you thought I meant 'broken mess') so I guess he would be an ideal candidate to review it on a major games site.

    and anyway, this is irrelevant. Does this really sound like the reviewer hates this type of game:

    'Flawed, intractable, unspeakably tedious at times, and yet blessed with incredible production values, imaginative design, and a brilliant, brave willingness to think and do the unexpected and impossible. At times they're barely videogames at all, but they're capable of moments of pure videogame genius, joy and shock that few other series can match.'.

    HE HATES IT!

  • gamingqueen #961 4 years ago

    @GingerNathan: I love how you waste over a hunederd buck on games you don't like. Nice trip to gamefaqs btw...

  • seasidebaz #962 4 years ago

    oh, and:

    oh dear. the sony defence force are trying to justify this game as much as the xbots are trying to justify ninja gaiden 2.







    get over it hehe

  • gamingqueen #963 4 years ago

    @WJF: Totally agree. He could at least mention the reasons he thought the game was that bad and not leave us puzzled here.

  • DanWhitehead #964 4 years ago

    I'm still pee'd off by the GTA4 ten. And the Halo 3 one. MGS is certainly not without its flaws, but I've always thought the series has less flaws than GTA and Halo.

    There's the crux of the argument, right there. I don't think Halo 3 is a 10/10, but some people do. I definitely think that GTA IV warrants 10/10. I've yet to play a Metal Gear game that felt like a 10/10.

    Why, it's almost as if different people...have different opinions...about different games. What madness be this?

  • GingerNathan #965 4 years ago

    "@GingerNathan: I love how you waste over a hunederd buck on games you don't like. Nice trip to gamefaqs btw... "

    Wow I must be able to browse the Gamefaqs website with unparalled speed in order to get innocuous facts about two games I've never played. :/

  • VMerken #966 4 years ago

    > MattDamon: Ah the innocence. Nothing to do with generating page hits no?

    Ach, I don't like to dwell too much on strategical decisions by site maintainers (or game developers for that matter), specifically when they're suspicions which are hard to confirm or prove. Still, some subtle burns can slip in between the lines every now and then, I suppose :).

  • ManicDrunkMonk #967 4 years ago

    Why does this series attract more attention that any other series. Even GTA IV didn't get this many comments this quick! I think.

  • seasidebaz #968 4 years ago

    @vmerken:

    review writers ARE opinion piece creators. oh well. such is the way that money talks (and i would love to get paid to spout opinions...)




    the game is flawed. get over it. kojima got in to deep, hyped himself up too much, and proved that he can't make an amazing game. the previous mgs games were good, not amazing. this will probably be the same if i ever bother to watch it.

  • gamingqueen #969 4 years ago

    @GringerNathan: High speed connection+gamefaqs+indepth faq= you get what you want.

    And the "does love bloom on the battlefeild" line wasn't Kojima's fault it was mistranslated.

  • VMerken #970 4 years ago

    GingerNathan: you did spoil me there a little, since I am replaying MGS2 as we speak (milking it for every Codec conversation in it) and most of the parts towards and within the ending used to be vague and an exciting prospect until now :).

  • gamingqueen #971 4 years ago

    seasidebaz:Shut your hole.

  • seasidebaz #972 4 years ago

    And the "does love bloom on the battlefeild" line wasn't Kojima's fault it was mistranslated.

    yeah, it was initially a line about "bumlove" whatever that is...

  • seasidebaz #973 4 years ago

    @gamingqueen:

    oh noes haz i insultided youse boyfreidn??

    hehe

  • GingerNathan #974 4 years ago

    "GingerNathan: you did spoil me there a little, since I am replaying MGS2 as we speak (milking it for every Codec conversation in it) and most of the parts towards and within the ending used to be vague and an exciting prospect until now :).
    "
    Sorry dude. :) I've been replaying the series myself, I've finished with Twin Snakes and MGS2, and now part way through Snake Eater. I'm just getting to one of my favourite bosses in the series, The End!
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 21:07

  • gamingqueen #975 4 years ago

    Praising the gameplay in one part and calling it old in another... quite contradicted isn't it?

  • VMerken #976 4 years ago

    > review writers ARE opinion piece creators. oh well. such is the way that money talks (and i would love to get paid to spout opinions...)

    Of course, but the word "review" still makes a lot of people think that such a text is, in fact, a thorough analysis of the pros and cons of a product based on testing on a more or less objective bias as agreed upon by specialists. For example, a "review" of a light bulb made by company X in electronics magazine Y can really give you a detailed, informed, more or less objective view about it.

    Here, in video game land (or in any other land involving human expressions of creativity such as literary works, works of art), what would such an objective bias as agreed upon by specialists be? I haven't a clue.

    Using it in the video gaming context is therefore not the right thing to do because it brings up incorrect associations/assumptions, so I tend to coin the term "opinion piece". They may be fun to read or watch (Zero Punctuation) and may contain truths one may relate to and such, but objectivity is definitely not a part of video game "reviews".
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 21:08

  • Bigglesworth #977 4 years ago

    Like most of the other contributors to this thread, I have nothing worthwhile to say; I just wanted to be a part of the hilarity.

  • wingZero21 #978 4 years ago

    If this was XBOX 10/10? Gotta get paid right guys ;)

  • gamingqueen #979 4 years ago

    He didn't explain much about gameplay. Infact he said so little about gameplay and kept complaining about Konami wanting to control reviews!

  • gamingqueen #980 4 years ago

    No wingzero gears got an 8 here and uncharted got a 9. Gears has multi-player and unchared is only 8 hours long and this is coming from a ps3 fangirl. Thos people sure know how to review games!

  • VMerken #981 4 years ago

    GingerNathan: Great to read I'm not the only one replaying the series to prepare for the "new kid" :). At the side, I'm also working through the Acid!s on the PSP. They're pretty much fun, too.

    And yes, The End is awesome. I pretty much loved all of MGS3, including the fact that Snake has a 17-point analytic hardon for custom handguns ;).
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 21:14

  • Yossarian #982 4 years ago

    If this was XBOX 10/10? Gotta get paid right guys ;)
    That would definitely explain why Ninja Gaiden 2 received 7/10.

  • SchumiF1 #983 4 years ago

    Seriously, no 9? How can they consider it worse than MGS2?

  • gamingqueen #984 4 years ago

    Who will buy metal gear solid 4 despite of this flawed shit called review?

  • GingerNathan #985 4 years ago

    "I'm also working through the Acid!s on the PSP. They're pretty much fun, too. "
    Never played any of the PSP MGS games, simply because I don't have a PSP.They have grid based combat don't they?, being a fan of games like Fire Emblem and Final Fantasy Tactics If/when I do buy a PSP I'll certainly give them a look.

  • gamingqueen #986 4 years ago

    Yossarian: Ninja Gaiden is no longer a ninja game and the industry is filled with sci-fi crappy games nuff said.

  • Bumhug360 #987 4 years ago

    From the scoring policy

    "Eight is that tricky "almost brilliant" category, that for fans of the genre in most cases will still warrant serious recommendation to go out and buy, while even people into other genres will probably still draw plenty of enjoyment from. You should at the very least try and play the demo, borrow it or rent it first, but bear in mind that it's not necessarily going to appeal to every person who plays it. "

    Not necessarily going to appeal to every person who plays it... yup that sums up mgs in a nutshell. The mark is totaly justified in my opinion, people who loved the previous games are going to love this one and should buy it but people who havent played a mgs game before shouldnt expect the best game ever. For fans of the series its going to be a 10 for them, they arent wrong and neither is the reviewer

  • smelly #988 4 years ago

    @gamingqueen:

    "@smelly: Crtical my ass. That was bashing that wasn't a review."


    So you'd rather:

    My review:

    This game is the bestest thing in the world ever because i dont want to upset gaming queen.. 10/10

    ?

  • solidSnake04 #989 4 years ago

    Im getting it regardless...In fact getting the LE.
    This 8/10 almost made me cry. I can be almost 100% assured that as long as Kojima is working on it EG will never give it a 10 :p
    This gotta be better than MGS3 and MGS3 got an 8. Surely this deserves at least a 9

  • Daymare #990 4 years ago

    Who would have thought a "fangirl" could "outdo" some of the biggest and well-known fanboys around here:) This thread delivers.

  • wingZero21 #991 4 years ago

    Look it was only a little joke no need to go excessive. :)

    But the point is getting raised that Eurogamers Reviews just lately are getting really not right. seriously. I have been coming to this site a long time now and I like the community etc etc but the main thing I used to come for was to read a good review of the game, however lately its just getting stupid with the reviews recently, its like they just throw these curves in to get attention all the time.

    The Ninja Gaiden review again I dont agree with and should probably be worth of an 8, just because the reviewer found the game hard, they have played the previous game? This is the way its meant to be for that game, its frustrating with this review as well because it basically says MGS4 THIS GAME IS GREAT EXCELLENT, FANTASTIC AWESOME..then gets an 8 when from the review it sounds like it should get better.

    I stress though its not JUST THIS REVIEW its pretty much ALL THE REVIEWS just lately are really not making much sense when it comes to the end rating.. I feel they should start taking a bit more care with the reviews or people are just gonna start going elsewhere. I have been coming to this site for a long time for reviews and used to be able to trust the reviews however now I cant say that...

  • smelly #992 4 years ago

    HANG ON!!

    Just had a thought.. Why are the "it deserves 10/10" brigade even complaining?

    1. Its not out yet so you couldnt possibly know whether it does or not
    2. You're obviously going to be buying it anyhow - so why complain?


    Surely it's only "normal" to complain about a game getting a HIGHER score than you felt justified (especially if you went out and bought it?) for me two of those spring to mind (halo 3 and smash bros brawl).

    But I dont get why people are complaining about a game getting a LOWER score than they feel justified if they're just going to go out and buy it anyways (or worse havent even played it yet?)

    Seems a bit bloody weird/geeky to me... What's the complaint exactly?

  • Redeye #993 4 years ago

    No, it's a train wreck, a glorious, dribbling mess containing some of the best brainfarts I've ever read.

    Keep going, please.

    EDIT: That was aimed at Deagle, but that's this thread for you. No manners, some people...and get off my bloody lawn, you young layabouts.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 21:27

  • VMerken #994 4 years ago

    > GingerNathan: Never played any of the PSP MGS games, simply because I don't have a PSP.They have grid based combat don't they?, being a fan of games like Fire Emblem and Final Fantasy Tactics If/when I do buy a PSP I'll certainly give them a look.

    Basically you move along a grid, yes, and the "moves" you can make are decided at random from cards you pull from a "deck" (you can earn and buy more cards later on). There are more intricacies and from what I've seen so far, the game keeps you challenged (haven't begun breaking the game so you should take this with a grain of salt). Also, the story is fun (following a Castlevania-style template with twists and turns), and - very important - pressing START during cutscenes and Codec conversations instantly skips the lot (as in fade-out fade-in time for action). How it should be.

  • gamingqueen #995 4 years ago

    @Smelly:
    Gameplay is old+tons of additions don't belong in the same catgory.
    I'd rather he said why he thought the game was disappointing and not just stop at disappointing.
    Lengthy cut-scenes when he knows mgs games are more about storyline than gameplay.

  • ghearoid #996 4 years ago

    Wow, this shit's still goin' on? 1,160 posts and counting about a good review for a game that none of you have played. EG should start charging!

  • smelly #997 4 years ago

    @DramaQueen (sorry gamingqueen):

    But you still havent answered why you actually care? You're obviously going to buy it anyway regardless of what the reviewer said? Or are you one of those saddos who can only enjoy a game if everyone else has bought it too?

    I *REALLY* dont get your complaint..


    "Lengthy cut-scenes when he knows mgs games are more about storyline than gameplay. "

    Half life 2 has a good story.. But you dont have to stop playing to experience them... It's a GAME.. And INTERACTIVE experience.. Some people are put off by the idea of sitting passively watching some ego-stroking MGS fanboy masturbatory fodder... And as such - surely it's not a 9/10 (i.e. a game everyone should play)...

    AND I'LL REPEAT: IT'S NOT OUT YET!!! How could you POSSIBLY know what score it's worth, or whether his comments are right or wrong - to even make your discussion half valid?
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 21:34

  • VMerken #998 4 years ago

    > WingZero21: But the point is getting raised that Eurogamers Reviews just lately are getting really not right. seriously. I have been coming to this site a long time now and I like the community etc etc but the main thing I used to come for was to read a good review of the game, however lately its just getting stupid with the reviews recently, its like they just throw these curves in to get attention all the time.

    > gamingqueen: No wingzero gears got an 8 here and uncharted got a 9. Gears has multi-player and unchared is only 8 hours long and this is coming from a ps3 fangirl. Thos people sure know how to review games!
    ignore poster

    Memory is a fickle thing. Yes, I agree. before writing an opinion piece, the opinion piece writer should consult all of his/her colleagues and reach a consensus on the score, then he/she will write his/her opinion piece and add the score which was agreed upon. Following this methodology, scoring becomes consistent all over the board, changing only slightly when new opinion piece writers are hired but ultimately always stabilising.

    It is a winning plan and won't result in even more bizarre review/score combinations at all. In fact, to truly get everything consistent, it is perhaps even better that all the reviewers on the site re-read and edit the review so that it truly reflects the entire crew's thoughts. Very practical, too.

  • Les #999 4 years ago

    "@Les: This women don't play videogames is as old as dinosaurs so shut your hole."

    I think you're really misunderstanding what I'm typing... 8/

  • gamingqueen #1000 4 years ago

    I'm a fan of the game why are YOU posting here if you don't "get" my complaints?

  • Quak #1001 4 years ago

    I'd like to know the current record for comments on a review.

    As for the review itself, I really don't see the problem. If you enjoyed the previous games you're going to love this. If you hated the previous games you're going to hate this. If the previous games didn't really do it for you but you could still appreciate them on a certain level, this one won't really do anything for you but you will still appreciate it on a certain level.

    Now move on for fuck sake.

  • Apostle #1002 4 years ago

    Wow this is awesome. Less about games, more about one-up-manship.

  • smelly #1003 4 years ago

    @DramaQueen:

    >I'm a fan of the game

    WHICH ISNT EVEN FUCKING OUT YET!! Were you born mental? Or are you in general a fan of movies you havent seen or music you've never heard?


    > why are YOU posting here if you don't "get" my complaints?

    Trying to understand why on earth you're getting upset about a review of a game you havent played. Because it has a low score, when you're going to be buying it anyway?

    I'm ASKING you why you feel it makes such a difference to you? I'm GENUINELY interested in getting inside your head on this one.. I could write a book on it..

    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 21:38

  • Bigglesworth #1004 4 years ago

    @Smelly

    Seriously? Some people's egos are too fragile to withstand the barbs from fanboys using a result like this to talk smack about the 'enemy' console. Therefore they bitch and complain that the score should be higher. I'm guessing its those 'youngsters' to blame. Bloody youngsters.

  • gamingqueen #1005 4 years ago

    Ok and why do you have to understand why I'm complaing about a review here?

    He called it pretencious so he doesn't like it and if he thought metal gear wasn't good from the first place then why did he reviewed it?

  • smelly #1006 4 years ago

    "Some people's egos are too fragile to withstand the barbs from fanboys using a result like this to talk smack about the 'enemy' console"

    Oh come on? Seriously?

    You mean if I write:

    "The wii is crap for kids - and has no decent games"
    "The 360 is an unreliable pile of crap - all it's games are boring fps's and it's best game halo 3 was shit"
    "The ps3 is overexpensive crap with worse graphics than the 360 and no decent exclusives"


    I've just caused a load of kids to become suicidal?

  • gamingqueen #1007 4 years ago

    So a game with long cut-scenes should automatically get a low score because it will appeal to no one? CRAP!

  • ps3owner #1008 4 years ago

    so let me get this straight, this is the first official review on the net´? apart from the paper version in the official playstation magazin. there it got 10/10
    here it's an 8/10

    so it's a 9/10 on average :)

    sorted

  • Quak #1009 4 years ago

    I find it ironic that smelly of all people is getting frustrated with an obvious fanboy over his illogical dedication to something that he hasn't experienced yet.

    I seem to remember smelly claiming that the Wii was as powerful as the 360 and the PS3 waaaaay back before the specifications were even released, despite the fact that the price had been released and it was around half as much as the 360, and a third as much as the PS3.

    Nintendo was somehow going to obtain the same hardware as the other two, sell it for half as much, and make a profit on each unit sale where the other two were making a loss.

    Ironic indeed. :)

  • ronuds #1010 4 years ago

    "Or are you in general a fan of movies you havent seen or music you've never heard?"

    LOL! Aren't those usually the best kind?

  • espy #1011 4 years ago

    1172? You've got to be joking. It's Friday night, go out and do something fun instead of participating in this sad mess.

  • Les #1012 4 years ago

    "MGS is the most overrated series ever. MGS4 without the license? Probably a 6 or 7."

    Wrong. GTA and Halo are fighting for that award...

    "He speaks about loving snake but then doesn't want him to ever come back?!"

    What he means is that, in his view, the MGS series is way past its prime. This time it succeeds in barely scraping an 8 out of it, mainly because of high production values. But in the future, without 'innovation' (which game reviewers hate unless they can use it to put a game down that they don't like (though I'm not contesting the review score in this case, before people get any ideas)) this game series will go down the drain. Or maybe this game series should just stop anyhow.

    Which is a rather hilarious POV on a game site that has had no problem of giving high marks to all the non-innovative HD upgrades of the past year or two.

  • SchumiF1 #1013 4 years ago

    Just flame 'em. The score can still be changed to a 9/10!

  • gamingqueen #1014 4 years ago

    Even if the ending was disappointing mr. Welsh you shouldn't have ruined the game for us.

  • smelly #1015 4 years ago

    @Dramaqueen:

    "Ok and why do you have to understand why I'm complaing about a review here?"

    As i said:

    1. because you havent played it
    2. because you're upset it got an 8 rather than a 9 when you are going to buy it anyway so why does it matter?


    "He called it pretencious so he doesn't like it and if he thought metal gear wasn't good from the first place then why did he reviewed it?"


    So you'd rather a mgs fanboy reviewed it who thinks mgs cant do any wrong? You'd rather said person reviewed it and only wrote about the good bits and none of the negatives? You'd rather the review was just 1 line long saying "this game is ace - buy it 10/10"? Is that what you're saying?

    Surely it's good to get an OBJECTIVE opinion?

    Nerds like you are going to be buying it anyways (we've already established that) - so surely a review which points out the negatives is a GOOD thing? Might make you realise that maybe due to the flaws that you that you wouldn't actually enjoy it anyways and save you a fair wedge of coin to spend on something you would've liked?

  • Bigglesworth #1016 4 years ago

    @smelly
    Yep, that's exactly what I mean. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if you get bitchslapped three different ways for that very comment, because context is meaningless when it comes to righting fanboy wrongs =)

  • GamerG #1017 4 years ago

    Last reason for me to get a PS3 gone, I aint buying no £300 system for an 8/10 game FFS!

  • Drpwnage #1018 4 years ago

    I'm really bemused by the retarded fanboy comments in this thread, it seems many people have not even read Oli's text. He makes his feelings towards the MGS series very clear in the second paragraph. What is the problem?

  • smelly #1019 4 years ago

    @Mattdamon:

    "erm, isn't it even sadder on your part that you are getting mad about someone that is mad that game they've never played hasn't scored as highly as they expect?? Just a thought... "


    I'm not getting mad.. i'm sat at work waiting for my pc to do something.. So i'm STILL just trying to figure out why someone would moan a score is lower than they expected?

    I can TOTALLY understand someone getting upset if a review is glowing, pointing out no faults, and gets a perfect score.. Then they go and buy it and think it's shit and a waste of money... That makes sense to complain about.

    Complaining because a game got a LOWER score than the one you wanted it to get without playing it yourself? That's something i dont understand.


    I'm not getting "mad" i'm just confused as fuck.

  • nhojuhc #1020 4 years ago

    I'm sorry but even if no one has played this game before, it wouldn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what to expect at least out of this game. As long as Kojima stayed with a tried and true formula he would've gotten an 8 from every game review out there. This game even according to reviewer has so much more and yet its given an 8 like Rainbow Vegas2, which as repeated before makes no sense.

    And again I will quote his preview article that seems to be consistently ignored where Oli, the reviewer, says:

    "And on this occasion, in a heroic effort to draw a line for once and all under Snake's story and give the Metal Gear Solid series the grand finale it deserves, Hideo Kojima and his team really have outdone themselves. 'Extravagant' doesn't cover it. Nor do 'dramatic', 'spectacular', 'sentimental', 'surprising', 'long-winded', 'final', 'painstaking' or 'polished'. Guns of the Patriots is Metal Gear Solid in excelsis."

    Tell me there isn't something going on behind the scenes.

    Someone care to explain?

  • smelly #1021 4 years ago

    @bigglesworth:

    "Yep, that's exactly what I mean. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if you get bitchslapped three different ways for that very comment"



    Yeah.. but it's worth a larf innit?

  • ronuds #1022 4 years ago

    It seems the sentiment here is thatt games should be reviewed based on hype rather than reality? That's what I'm seeing because instead of holding this review in higher regard for its honesty, you trash it because the guy didn't love the game more than his own family.

    You don't get tired of reading 10/10 reviews for highly-anticipated games? Then we wonder why the reviewing system is so effed up...nobody cares about truth unless it helps feed their fanboy wishes and one-upmanship dreams. Please, for those of you complaining this wasn't given a 10, you can NEVER COMPLAIN AGAIN about any game receiving a 10 score.

    Unbiased reviews be damned! Give me fluff and a whole lot of it!

  • smelly #1023 4 years ago

    @nhojuhc: Notice the absence of the word "fun" in any of that.

  • gamingqueen #1024 4 years ago

    Why the name calling? Does it bother you this much that I'm angry at a review? The review is shit! LEt's see what you'll do.

    I can't review something I don't even like. Calling something pretencious has a negative connotation and not a positive one last time I checked so he obvious DOES NOT like the game and if youpaid attention to my comments you'd know that I said the reviewer needs to be neutral.

  • smelly #1025 4 years ago

    @evilfoxhound:

    "People who rely on review scores to ditermin what game they buy should be beaten to death with a sharpened shovel."


    Surely you missed out the word "dont" before the word "rely"?

  • seasidebaz #1026 4 years ago

    ok, after thorough investigation of the comments i don't want this game for 2 reasons:

    1. the fanboys are worse than xbox fanboys. makes the game look bad.

    2. the previous games were shite. oh well.



    and @vmerken: in my opinion, to kill a mocking bird, after research and an entire year of study, deserves 2/10. just for boo radley, who was ace. does my opinion count less than that of other literary icons? the fact i had to lend a year of my life to studying such drivel? the same for romeo and juliet. if shakespeare wanted to put rude words in, why not just FUCKING WRITE THEM?

    art is subjective. playstation fanboys are not. i see a contradiction. i also see about 10,000 new signups to eurogamer purely on the fact they have a SUBJECTIVE REVIEW on a game that ISN'T OUT and they say IT HAS FAULTS!!!!



    get a life for fucks sake.

  • wingZero21 #1027 4 years ago

    @nhojuhc
    "And on this occasion, in a heroic effort to draw a line for once and all under Snake's story and give the Metal Gear Solid series the grand finale it deserves, Hideo Kojima and his team really have outdone themselves. 'Extravagant' doesn't cover it. Nor do 'dramatic', 'spectacular', 'sentimental', 'surprising', 'long-winded', 'final', 'painstaking' or 'polished'. Guns of the Patriots is Metal Gear Solid in excelsis."

    Yeah thats one of the parts of the review that got me, they just dont make sense anymore? Can you really say all that and then go 8/10..maybe its just me :)

  • peteb #1028 4 years ago

    To those whinging about why the reviewer complained about cutscene length: hes probably very aware of the series' long cutscenes, but what if, you know, they are REALLY OTT long this time? Surely that's cause for complaint,especially for newcomers not used to lengthy cutscenes. Of course fans of the series will have no problem with them, but they will buy it anyway.

  • gamingqueen #1029 4 years ago

    The content wasn't good. He called it old and described it badly.

  • seasidebaz #1030 4 years ago

    and @gamingqueen:

    if you'd played any of the previous metal gear games, you would know THEY ARE FECKING PRETENTIOUS


    stop being a fangay.

  • PedroTheLion #1031 4 years ago

    It's like this, if you like the series you're gonna love this game, if you've never liked the other ones this one won't change your mind. There, that's the game reviewed. Now someone post this somewhere and pay me please.

  • Les #1032 4 years ago

    "I'm a fan of the game why are YOU posting here if you don't "get" my complaints?"

    No clue if this was really a response my post, but anyway: I really liked MGS and MGS2 (I really don't get the 'it stinks because I want to play Snake' mob. This was the only way to tell the quite amusing and at points rather clever (considering it's a video game) story). I finished MGS2 only a few months ago (I don't really like stealth games but picked up twin snakes a couple of years ago for very little to give it a try and was pleasantly surprised) and haven't been able to get my hands on MGS3 Subsistence anymore. Need to play that game before I move on to part 4, so I'll probably won't play it the next year or two.

    Kojima is a great story teller. I put him above Miyamoto. Kojima is the highly skilled artist, Miyamoto the highly skilled engineer.

  • seasidebaz #1033 4 years ago

    @pedro:

    +10p.

  • VMerken #1034 4 years ago

    >Bigglesworth: Seriously? Some people's egos are too fragile to withstand the barbs from fanboys using a result like this to talk smack about the 'enemy' console. Therefore they bitch and complain that the score should be higher. I'm guessing its those 'youngsters' to blame. Bloody youngsters.

    Another tactic from the opposition would be the strawman, where people say "what are you all talking about, 8 is not too bad a score" for a potential AAA title on the "enemy" console, which leads the attention away from the fact that this means that the "friendly" console ends up with more 9 and 10 titles and thus may appear to be the favourable console to the respective console market. And also incites cries such as "See? PS3lol".

  • Les #1035 4 years ago

    why is everyone around here obsessed about homosexuals? Freud would have a field day...

  • loopy #1036 4 years ago

    This comments column is very entertaining, if somewhat long...

  • seasidebaz #1037 4 years ago

    @les:

    you tell me. you only need the beans.

  • ps3owner #1038 4 years ago

    a quick question to the ppl who've played all 3 previous versions of MGS.

    would it make sense for a new comer like me to play MGS 4?

    reading the review it doesn't

  • Daymare #1039 4 years ago

    "...so he obvious DOES NOT like the game and if youpaid attention to my comments you'd know that I said the reviewer needs to be neutral."

    You're not neutral. So your review of a review is meaningless:)

  • Les #1040 4 years ago

    "There, that's the game reviewed."

    No, that's the review summarized...

  • smelly #1041 4 years ago

    @DramaQueen:

    "Why the name calling? Does it bother you this much that I'm angry at a review?"

    It bothers me the state of intelligence of the human population.. And it bothers me that by getting so upset you're behaving like the sad geeky stereotype the tabloid press seems to want to label gamers as..


    "The review is shit!"

    And again - you have NOTHING to back up that claim because you've not actually played it yourself..


    "I can't review something I don't even like."

    But yet you think you can review something you've not even played?

    If you think reviewers should only review games they like then you're quite clearly mad. Mind you, i'd imagine Ellie would thank you from saving you from all the shite Wii games she has to review on here.

    Besides - he DOES like it.. he gave it 8/10?
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:01

  • gamingqueen #1042 4 years ago

    @Les: that was for smelly actually

  • VMerken #1043 4 years ago

    > seasidebaz: and @vmerken: in my opinion, to kill a mocking bird, after research and an entire year of study, deserves 2/10. just for boo radley, who was ace. does my opinion count less than that of other literary icons? the fact i had to lend a year of my life to studying such drivel? the same for romeo and juliet. if shakespeare wanted to put rude words in, why not just FUCKING WRITE THEM? art is subjective. playstation fanboys are not. i see a contradiction. i also see about 10,000 new signups to eurogamer purely on the fact they have a SUBJECTIVE REVIEW on a game that ISN'T OUT and they say IT HAS FAULTS!!!!

    I was talking about the game "review" solely (particularly, the review being more an opinion piece in video game land rather than the type of document I'd call a review), not the fanboys. Although my previous post indulges in some pondering about them.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:05

  • nhojuhc #1044 4 years ago

    @ smelly
    Good one lol. but that's horribly wrong.

  • darkphoenix #1045 4 years ago

    Sony fanboys, cry me a river!

    Most of you have never played MGS anyway...
    You're just sooo frustrated because your great exclusive is not deserving of a perfect score, except on official fanboy sites and IGN sellouts...

  • gamingqueen #1046 4 years ago

    Daymare: I didn't like mgs3 and didn't give it as much as the previous games. I don't think metal gear 4 was just as this guy said.

  • peteb #1047 4 years ago

    Its not what he said, it was the way he said it! :D
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:05

  • PedroTheLion #1048 4 years ago

    @ps3owner Yes it's well worth the buy, if you don't like it you can return it. also if you find that you are liking it immensely stop playing immediately and go play the other 3 first.

  • bilbot #1049 4 years ago

    I am proud of you Eurogamer you win the prize.
    [link url=http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/4293/billdoix6.jpg ]http://im g374.imageshack.us/img374/4293/...[/link]

  • smelly #1050 4 years ago

    @Vmerkin:

    "Another tactic from the opposition would be the strawman, where people say "what are you all talking about, 8 is not too bad a score" for a potential AAA title on the "enemy" console, which leads the attention away from the fact that this means that the "friendly" console ends up with more 9 and 10 titles and thus may appear to be the favourable console to the respective console market."


    Common.. Are you Serious? Surely you have better things to be worried about in your life? Have you gotten laid yet? I presume not.. maybe you should focus your energies on that :-)

    (oooh, ok, this thread is bringing out my nasty side.. But seriously!)

  • subtlesnake #1051 4 years ago

    I agree that the reviewer doesn't properly sum up his experiences of the game, but he does indicate what is lacking, throughout the review:

    "Even keen students of Metal Gear lore are going to struggle to follow this tangled tale. Laden with sentimental sermons and metaphors for the evils of war, struggling under the weight of the resolving the plots of four previous games and the personal destinies of characters as diverse as Raiden, Meryl, Naomi, Vamp and Eva, it is in all honesty a mess. Motivation and consistency fall by the wayside and by the end it's totally unclear who is on which side, or what's at stake. Maybe that's deliberate, but it doesn't work, and the hours of talking-head exposition involved are too steep a price to pay for this muddled closure."

    "Design-wise, MGS4 is mostly a refinement of what's gone before."

    "Metal Gear Solid has always been either too easy or too hard, and too possible to get through by sloppy cheating or simple attrition, and that hasn't changed."

    "The relatively weak second act is more of the same in a much less compelling setting - a rather unconvincing, blandly designed South American backwater - and ennui starts to set in."

    "A good thing, certainly, but it lays the decade-old gameplay systems bare, with only modest improvements in AI to make up for it."

    "(Take note, however, that there are several minutes of install time to be endured, not just at the start, but before each act - albeit graced with a fantastic animated graphic of Snake smoking next to some health warnings.)"

    "If only MGS4 did end there. An unbelievably lengthy and self-indulgent epilogue - you can't call it a cut-scene, it's an entire film in its own right, and a deeply boring one too - is how Solid Snake's career comes to a close."

    "Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it."

  • Daymare #1052 4 years ago

    "If MGS4 doesn't warrant a 9 I'd really like to know why. But the reviewer failed to explain it."

    Why don't you rather explain to us why does it warrant a 9;)

  • PedroTheLion #1053 4 years ago

    "Why don't you rather explain to us why does it warrant a 9;)"

    I'm quite interested in this too

  • VMerken #1054 4 years ago

    Not yet tonight, Smelly. I just wanted to point out one possible strategy to even out the playing field a little. I'm also not sure if I posted as many posts as you in this thread yet, so I might have enough energy left to focus later on :).
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:09

  • ronuds #1055 4 years ago

    @ MattDamon

    I don't know if I've ever seen a reviewer explain why he's NOT giving a game a better or worse score. It seems a tactic like that would undermine the score that WAS given to the game, no?

    Explanations like that normally end up looking like silly excuses for why you can't justify your original decision, and totally discredits the decision to begin with. I think his explanation was in the review itself.

  • SchumiF1 #1056 4 years ago

    Remove the review completely or at the very least heigten the score!

  • smelly #1057 4 years ago

    @VMerken: Good boy.. i'm only posting because i'm bored at work :)

  • VMerken #1058 4 years ago

    Upping the post count on this thread can be an ulterior motive, too :). It will, or will not, be to the complete satisfaction of the site maintainers when they log in tomorrow after a refreshing night's sleep.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:16

  • PedroTheLion #1059 4 years ago

    so...anyone knows who the final Cylon is?

  • nomadloh #1060 4 years ago

    Nice review from Eurogaymer. And Oli Welsh nice too ^^

  • VMerken #1061 4 years ago

    > PedroTheLion: so...anyone knows who the final Cylon is?

    No thread hijacking, sir! (internettian for "I don't know, old or new series?";)
    Edited by 2 at 30/05/08 @ 22:18

  • mallocks #1062 4 years ago

    @SchumiF1

    Why on earth would anyone want to do either of these things?

  • karaokequeen3 #1063 4 years ago

    At least 2 cutscenes approaching 90 minutes?

    [link url=http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=19 0042
    ]http://ww w.computerandvideogames.com/art...[/link]

    Gawd forbid...

  • Shephard #1064 4 years ago

    I can obviously not comment on the review score itself (as I have not played MGS4 yet), but I would like to respond to some comments about subjectivity and objectivity.

    I guess it is already clear by reading many of the comments that reviews will always be subjective. I have read that some believe that one should strive to be as objective as possible. Where I stand on that argument is not really that interesting.

    What I do find interesting however is that people are demanding the review to be more objective, whilst at the same time complaining about the statements made by the reviewer regarding his feelings towards the Metal Gear Solid franchise. That does not make the review more subjective, it makes the review more OBJECTIVE. This also happens in academia. 'Data' or facts can be interpreted in many ways, and the emphasis can be put on many issues. A real scientist will always indicate what he studies, why he studies it, what he expects and how he derived his interpretation of the results. The same basically happened with the review. By stating that he both loved and hated the game, he clearly outlined his stance and where he is coming from when reviewing the game. As such, the review is much easier to place in context than a review in which such information is omitted.

    The review is subjective. As it should be, and as all reviews are. Some feel that is should try and be as objective as possible. Fair enough, that is your opinion. Yet if that is the case, do not bemoan the fact that the reviewer clearly indicated his stance towards the game. That seems to be a bit contradictory. But what do I know, I am just a simple Dutchman. My apologies for possible spelling and grammatical errors. Cheers!

    p.s And please carry on, the thread is very amusing!

  • PedroTheLion #1065 4 years ago

    New series of course I love starbuck with tities :D

  • peteb #1066 4 years ago

    Page hits are one thing, but when the users are busy frothing over their keyboards defending/attacking the game and not paying any attention to anything else, like the advertisements, then I suppose they don't matter quite as much.

    "Damn this review is so unfair, oh? Is that an ad for ninja gaiden 2? Looks good, I think I will put aside my rage whilst I click on this link"
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:23

  • bruiser07 #1067 4 years ago

    if you read eurogamer's guide to scoring, a "10" is

    " A score of ten reflects a game that, within the reviewer's estimation, is something you must buy: this is the message we're trying to convey. On a basic level it's almost certainly the best quality game ever seen within the context of its genre, and that's why Eurogamer doesn't dish them out very often. A score of 10 usually applies to less than a trio of games in any given year.

    But all 10s are not born equal. For starters, you might consider that a ten in the RPG genre still isn't as appealing as an FPS that we scored an eight, or be mystified how we could score a football management game a nine when we only gave that survival-horror game you loved an eight. The best rule is to simply rate like with like, and use your own personal taste barometer to gauge whether the genre is of interest to you. Even so, if you're new to a particular genre then something scoring a ten is a very safe bet indeed. As a starting point, the message is you can't get a better game of this type.

    Let us make absolutely clear that a 10 is not and probably never will be "the perfect game". There's always something criticisable about a game, however small.

    A 10 will inspire the reviewer because it gets so many things correct. It will be something truly groundbreaking and aesthetically successful, be consistently enjoyable, get the balance right in difficulty terms, be technically very impressive, and be polished to a shine. It will leave the player in no doubt that they're playing something special right from the word go and will continue to inspire and amaze throughout. As we've said, this doesn't mean it's perfect, and we'll be sure to say where it goes wrong too, but maybe those niggles are just so minor that you can let it off. Look at anything under a microscope for long enough and you'll see the flaws. But would you kick a supermodel out of bed for farting? "

    By their own standards, how can MGS4 not deserve a 10? Just watching game play videos and trailers you can sense that this game is something "special", that it is polished, and that it is beyond "technically impressive." I do expect there to be long "movie like" cut scenes as well as a challenging plot to follow. All metal gear games have been that way so far... why would MGS4 be any different?

    I think the reviewer gives a much higher score than would be inferred by reading his words alone. He continually bashes the game (and the previous games) again and again but then slaps an 8 on at the end. If I were just to read the review I'd think 5 or 6, but somehow it ends up an 8. The reviewer seems to be someone who does not enjoy MGS in general, but still found the game enjoyable enough to give it a decent score, but then decided to just nag on every flaw he could possibly think of and leave very little room for praise outside of a few things like "the guns are good" or the "technology is good." A poor choice on Eurogamer's editors part to let such a review make it to the site... at least put up a counter-opinion because I seriously doubt everyone at Eurogamer thought MGS4 sucked.

  • PedroTheLion #1068 4 years ago

    @ Mattdamon, the game got an 8, its almost the highest score possible, would the game live up to your expectations if it got one or two more points on a scale dtermined by someone that is not you and that hasn't got the same taste/expectations/experiences as you?

    Maybe you didnt only have expectations maybe you already had a score in your head, predetermined. Regardless, It's like i said before if you're a fan of this series you'l love this game, that much is clear if you read the review.

    Does it really matter if someone you don't know thinks the game is not as good as you think its?(taking into consideration you haven't played it yet)

    Really? I think you should take your opinion in higher regard man, seriously

  • Daymare #1069 4 years ago

    @mattdamon

    Pretty much everything I needed to know about MGS4 was in the text. I loved MGS3 therefore I will (would) probably, more or less, love MGS4 - that's what I got from that review. Trying to "match" the final score to the text of the review of a game you haven't played yet (but you are a big fan of the series, ergo biased), is rather pointless, don't you think?

  • Raspinudo #1070 4 years ago

    I love how all of you people cant decide for yourselves. Of course, this man obviously is not a fan of the metal gear series, cinematic experience is one of the staples of the MGS franchise. So knocking this game for things the fans want it to do. Also, to the people who say, uh oh or "last good reason to buy a ps3 gone". Thats so rediculous, the meta score is 9.5 with almost everyone giving it 9,9.5 and 10's. The obvious outlier is Eurogamer, there went all of my respect for eurogamer.

  • eleven63 #1071 4 years ago

    Beer anyone...

  • smelly #1072 4 years ago

    @Raspinudo:

    So you think a review should only say the exact same as every other site?

    Why dont you set up a games review site, and just average the score which other reviewers have given games and give that as your review score?

  • VMerken #1073 4 years ago

    > Shephard: That does not make the review more subjective, it makes the review more OBJECTIVE.

    I can't really agree. Adding clarifications changes nothing about the object's subjectivity/objectivity. It only influences the chance that others may "find themselves" in the arguments presented in the clarifications (i.e. they sound reasonable within their mindset) and thus tend to "agree" with the one offering the clarifications. It changes nothing about the state of the object itself. It simply exists (like your observations), ready to be observed (by me, for example). And the more it is observed, the more "popular" it becomes, the more will be said about it and the greater the chance of arguments (as is the case now), especially when there is no real foothold as to what makes a game AAA and what not (or when there's no real foothold on what objectivity truly is :).

  • smelly #1074 4 years ago

    FFS - Look at all the flaws which "subtlesnake" just pulled out the article.. then tell me it Still deserves a better score?

    For me the long install times alone can suck my balls.

  • PedroTheLion #1075 4 years ago

    @Mattdamon

    But arent you "playing dirty" as well since you are outraged about a score for something that you haven't tested yourself?

  • HoriZon #1076 4 years ago

    God its only a game.

  • smelly #1077 4 years ago

    This is interesting:

    [link url=http://kotaku.com/5011929/rumor- reviewers-cant-talk-about-mgs4-cutscenes-install
    ]http://ko taku.com/5011929/rumor-reviewer...[/link]

  • PedroTheLion #1078 4 years ago

    Well it's kotaku so I would take that witah an enormous grain of salt....

  • VMerken #1079 4 years ago

    >Smelly: This is interesting:

    As long as it's skippable with a single push of the button, it's a non-issue and those who want movie content out of their MGS, got it. 4.6Go is no drama.

    HoriZon: Succinct, to the point, and +1 from my PoV. Yet this thread needs to break records.

  • Daymare #1080 4 years ago

    "Same goes for you buddy. Isn't it a bit pointless trying to defend the score of a game you haven't played yet?"

    It's not that simple, buddy:) Where did I "defend" the score? I'm merely defending the review (content, form and its validity) since so many of you are complaining over it for all the wrong reasons. You just *can't* reasonably complain over a review if you haven't played the game, simple as, unless it's not informative enough or something like that - I did found it informative enough, hence my complaining over your complaining:)

  • muzzer77 #1081 4 years ago

    Come on people , Eurogamer have always been hit and miss with their reviews, you should never trust them (i learn t that some time ago) What you want are the reviews were the reviewer has been through it on more than one level, i mean thats their job, plus this reviewer was not really a fan to start with. Should of had a second opinion, maybe by someone who likes the series. Take note, this is lowest of any of the reviews by far, says it all.

  • PedroTheLion #1082 4 years ago

    Again, I dont see the point of comparing reviews on different games, in different generes, by different people...but hey maybe i'm just crazy. I'll wait till the 12th to form an opinion.

  • Yossarian #1083 4 years ago

    Well, I think it's official: MGS fans are the bitterest, whiniest fans of all.

  • CitizenGeek #1084 4 years ago

    Whoa, this already has more comments than GTA IV! :o

  • Ace_McCloud #1085 4 years ago

    +1 to Yossarian. and holy fucking shit, you'd think the PS3 just got delayed until April or something... in fact I think this has beaten the length of that thread. If only we all knew then what we know now, that news would've gotten a mighty big 'Meh'.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:55

  • VMerken #1086 4 years ago

    > All I'm saying is this reviewer didn't do enough to convince me, and that's further tainted my regard for EG on the back of the GTA4 and Halo 3 scores.

    I know where that comes from. My regard was tainted ever since Dave McCarthy's RE4 Wii piece, or the Bioshock: a Defence piece. Or pieces on games well before their release in Europe (and where are the Europe release dates in those cases?), which gives everything here an increasingly un-Europey, IGN-ian feel.

    At least we're not in "click to skip this ad" or "doubly-underlined words" or "movie follows ad" territory yet, although that may be partially due to the above - and more. Sign of the times.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 22:59

  • Raspinudo #1087 4 years ago

    Im not saying that meta is always right Im simply alluding that I doubt that this is the one "Honest review". Especially when games like GTA IV, which by the way I own and love, gets perfect 10's when it has many glitches and flaws of its own. Im actually fine with reviewers saying "This game is amazing, not perfect, but it still deserves a 10 because the minor flaws can be overlooked." But if thats the standard they abide by, it should hold true for all games. Metal Gear shouldnt recieve extra scrutiny.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 23:02

  • PedroTheLion #1088 4 years ago

    And what genre is that again? cinematic stealth action? Interactive action movie? Because I don't think I know another game like the MGS series?

  • smelly #1089 4 years ago

    @Mattdamon.. That wasnt my post..

  • VMerken #1090 4 years ago

    I believe Splinter Cell is often compared to it. In the old days, there was Syphon Filter, I think.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 23:01

  • smelly #1091 4 years ago

    @PedroTheLion:

    "And what genre is that again? cinematic stealth action? Interactive action movie? Because I don't think I know another game like the MGS series?"


    From the sounds of things.. this is the genre : "Watching a bad b-movie and pressing a button to interact with it every so often" genre.

    To me it sounds like watching a very long 30 hour long Uwe Bole movie and occasionally pressing the fast forward button on the remote control as a means of "gameplay".

    But i could be wrong (I've only ever played the first mgs)

    EDIT : Actually - Doesnt that put MGS4 in the same genre as dragons lair?


    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 23:03

  • Daymare #1092 4 years ago

    @mattdamon

    Well, fair enough, if you feel that way. There were lots of positive and negative points raised in the review of a person that has clearly expressed his love/hate relationship with MGS series (and is therefore exactly the right person to review a game of such a special and unigue series - although I agree that's not always the case with EG reviews), so I wasn't in any way shocked by the final score.

  • Shephard #1093 4 years ago

    > VMerken "I can't really agree. Adding clarifications changes nothing about the object's subjectivity/objectivity."

    I am a little bit confused by your reply (my fault, English is not my native language). Are you referring to the game itself as the object, or the review? I guess you must be talking about the review, as the game itself can't be subjective or objective, but simply is.

    I will try to explain why I believe the comments at the start of the review enhance objectivity. A lot of research (almost everything not related to exact sciences to be exact) claims to be objective. They are scientists after all. Yet as you are probably aware, almost all the research is subjective. Results are influenced by simple things as problem definition to larger issues such as scientific paradigms. As such, a researcher can enhance the objectivity of his results by stating his beliefs, and his or her reasons for focusing on certain issues while not paying much attention to other aspects.

    I also believe this happens in the review. He states from the outset what he likes and dislikes about the game, which gave me a good idea about how to rate his comments. He gave me the tools to put his review in context, and thereby leaving room to draw my own conclusions. So, yes, the object (I am still assuming you referred to the review, my apologies if I am mistaken) remains the same, although with a guide if you will. A guide telling me on what the review is based.

    Of course, reviews can be influential to some. And you are (at least, that seems to be logical) correct that the more a review is read, the greater the chance becomes that a certain viewpoint will become popular. However, this is in a sense unrelated to the degree of subjectiveness or objectiveness of the game. A review without background information of the reviewer could also be very influential if it is read by many. This review at least gave me some information as to how the reviewer reached his conclusions. For me that is more objective than a review without such comments.

    Yet you are right, perhaps objectivity is the wrong word. A better way of stating what I mean is that I believe the reviewer is very aware that the review is simply his opinion, as every review is just an opinion and therefore subjective. However, I do think he should be applauded for providing the background information, as it creates a context which allows for a much better processing of the review. For example, what if he had not included any information, but in real life he loved the previous three to death? That would have been much more damaging for MGS4 (and the review would lose strength, as much of the impact would not be known). Now I can clearly see where he is coming from, what he likes and dislikes, and how that has affected his overall opinion regarding the game. As such, I think it is a good inclusion in the review, and certainly not something that makes the review more subjective. I hope I was clearer now (although I can imagine you might still disagree :-). Best we can do is just play the game itself right. I am still intrigued by the game changer... Cheers!


    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 23:05

  • PedroTheLion #1094 4 years ago

    I dont think Splinter cell and MGS are similar in the least. At least I play them for very diffferent reasons. I play MGS for the narrative, characters, japanese quirkyness and overall feel of the series, while splinter cell i play mainly for the stealth action gameplay wich is, in my opinion, better than MGS's. At least untill chaos theory, i've never played another one after that. I do belive MGS stands on a class of it's own, I'd feel better comparing it to a Shenmue in the sense that it's a cohesive and structured adventure.

  • Ace_McCloud #1095 4 years ago

    RE4 reminded a bit of MGS in some ways. Only more fun... to join in this debate.

  • PedroTheLion #1096 4 years ago

    I can't handle horror games. I'm a wuss.

  • Stoatboy #1097 4 years ago

    @bruiser07

    re: "if you read eurogamer's guide to scoring, a "10" is... ...quotes EG's scoring policy...

    ...By their own standards, how can MGS4 not deserve a 10?"



    OK - here are a few reasons, quoting the scoring guide:

    "A score of ten reflects a game that, within the reviewer's estimation, is something you must buy."

    and

    "Even so, if you're new to a particular genre then something scoring a ten is a very safe bet indeed."

    I know loads of people who either don't like or positively detest MGS because of the numerous sermonising cutscenes (amongst plenty of other reasons). It's not for them. It's certainly not a very safe bet, and by no means a must buy. If I were to recommend a gaming newcomer a videogame there's no way I'd choose an MGS title.

    "A 10 will inspire the reviewer because it gets so many things correct. It will be something truly groundbreaking and aesthetically successful, be consistently enjoyable, get the balance right in difficulty terms, be technically very impressive, and be polished to a shine"

    It didn't get everything correct - the story was muddled and confused, too many cutscenes etc. The reviewer also points out it doesn't get the balance of difficulty right, and isn't consistently enjoyable.

    "Look at anything under a microscope for long enough and you'll see the flaws."

    It doesn't sound like you need a microscope here.
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 23:12

  • nhojuhc #1098 4 years ago

    Only 19 more posts to beat the Halo3 record of 1293 posts!!! It took Halo3 2 months to get the number of responses that this MGS4 has gotten in 1 day. Congratulations Eurogamer. /sarcasm

  • GitSomE_UK #1099 4 years ago

    Jeez.... I don't know why you guys are getting so het up by the score. So what if some guy isn't that impressed, many people aren't impressed at all by Kojimas style.

    If you are a fan just buy it, take some time out and prepare to be absorbed into a great gaming experience.

    It's the Marmite effect, you either love it or hate it... personally I can't wait.

  • WillyWanka #1100 4 years ago

    wholly christ +1000 in a day

  • wingZero21 #1101 4 years ago

    google MGS4: 8.0 + Halo3:10.0 = Xbot fanboy

    its late and I am bored :)

  • Xerx3s #1102 4 years ago

    "Last PS3 great white hope blown out. What's left now to PS3 fanboys? FFXIII?

    The minute MS announces some kind of Blu-Ray playback facility for the 360, I'm selling my -largely unused- PS3. "


    So when the fuck did 8/10 become anything less than extremely good?

  • Jamaicangmr #1103 4 years ago

    Why am i not surprised? This guys clearly has bias towards the title why was he even allowed to review it anyway? It's just as bad as giving the review to a MGS fanboy. This is just eurogamer showing their bias towards the PS3 AGAIN.

  • PedroTheLion #1104 4 years ago

    "Why am i not surprised? This guys clearly has bias towards the title why was he even allowed to review it anyway? It's just as bad as giving the review to a MGS fanboy. This is just eurogamer showing their bias towards the PS3 AGAIN."

    Either my irony detector is borked or you just owned yourself.

  • Xerx3s #1105 4 years ago

    "this is officially the last review i have read from eurogamer.

    RSS feed gone as is the respect. "

    And this kind of behaviour is exactly why reviewers are under pressure to not judge games by their worth but by what people expect. Tell me, did you play this? No? FO then. At some level I can understand people that stop reading reviews because they played the game and disagree completely. But to do so after an 8/10 (!!!!) while you haven't played it yet is beyond sad.

  • JonFE #1106 4 years ago

    Xerx3s, you've got to be kidding me. Out of 1280+ comments you pick LeD's #4 to argue? Where have you been hiding since noon?
    8-)

    BTW, you do have a point, but it will probably drop on deaf ears...
    Edited by 1 at 30/05/08 @ 23:44

  • The_Inquisitor #1107 4 years ago

    MGS 3: Snake Eater was also given a score of 8/10 by Eurogamer. It has more to do with (as was pointed out) the love or hate mechanics and long story than it being a poor title. In all honesty, parts of MGS3 were poor, but if you had enough heart, you could forgive them and enjoy it for its positives (many of them).

    I'm sure it'll be the same this time round, I can't wait.

  • Stoatboy #1108 4 years ago

    @MattDamon

    Haha - you've started with the "son" nonsense. That always gains a poster credibility. Well done.

    Yes. I don't agree with the GTA IV score either, but that's neither here nor there.

    I haven't a clue if MGS4 is a 0, an 8 or a 10. Like everyone else I haven't played it yet.

    My entire post - and anyone who can comprehend basic English would be able to recognise this - pointed out that using the EG scoring policy there are several valid reasons why MGS4 might not be given a 10.

  • wingZero21 #1109 4 years ago

    this is officially the last review i have read from eurogamer.

    ditto

  • JonFE #1110 4 years ago

    Just noticed the difference between the comments counter on the home page and their actual (viewable) number. 40-odd comments are missing. Are those only "oliwelshsmom's" deleted ones or do we have others of those insulting types as well?

  • AphoticCosmos #1111 4 years ago

    "Shut up you long streaks of paralysed piss!"

    Please, where is the love? It's just a game rating on one review site! Get over yourselves!

  • VMerken #1112 4 years ago

    > Shephard: I am a little bit confused by your reply (my fault, English is not my native language). Are you referring to the game itself as the object, or the review? I guess you must be talking about the review, as the game itself can't be subjective or objective, but simply is.

    Yes, I was hinting at the review. And don't worry, I'm from Belgium so English isn't the mother tongue either.

    >I will try to explain why I believe the comments at the start of the review enhance objectivity. A lot of research (almost everything not related to exact sciences to be exact) claims to be objective. They are scientists after all. Yet as you are probably aware, almost all the research is subjective. Results are influenced by simple things as problem definition to larger issues such as scientific paradigms. As such, a researcher can enhance the objectivity of his results by stating his beliefs, and his or her reasons for focusing on certain issues while not paying much attention to other aspects.

    With "enhancing objectivity", you are assuming that objectivity is a well-defined quantity that can be decreased or increased. Truth is, "objectivity" isn't well-defined - it's a philopsophy, a state of the mind if you will. Guided by paradigms, as you correctly noted. We all have a notion about it, but what is it, really? I wouldn't know.

    Because of this, I don't think it's wise to use the term "enhances objectivity", but rather make a note that the author attempted to "justify" his reasoning within his/her own paradigm, added clarifications, and either accept or reject them.

    > I also believe this happens in the review. He states from the outset what he likes and dislikes about the game, which gave me a good idea about how to rate his comments. He gave me the tools to put his review in context, and thereby leaving room to draw my own conclusions. So, yes, the object (I am still assuming you referred to the review, my apologies if I am mistaken) remains the same, although with a guide if you will. A guide telling me on what the review is based.

    Yes, but it does not, however, change the core of the article, which is about the game itself. That is untouched, much like a painting is untouched by the viewers' perceptions - it's interpretation is yours and yours alone, independent of what others think or what even the painter him/herself tells about it.

    >Of course, reviews can be influential to some. And you are (at least, that seems to be logical) correct that the more a review is read, the greater the chance becomes that a certain viewpoint will become popular. However, this is in a sense unrelated to the degree of subjectiveness or objectiveness of the game. A review without background information of the reviewer could also be very influential if it is read by many. This review at least gave me some information as to how the reviewer reached his conclusions. For me that is more objective than a review without such comments.

    Of course, in your personal subjective (or should I say relative) paradigm, the objectivity (which appears to depend on the presence of clarifications) you quantified increased. I judged it to not be a part of the game review and as such my subjective quantification of the objectivity of the game review remains the same.

    > Yet you are right, perhaps objectivity is the wrong word. A better way of stating what I mean is that I believe the reviewer is very aware that the review is simply his opinion, as every review is just an opinion and therefore subjective. However, I do think he should be applauded for providing the background information, as it creates a context which allows for a much better processing of the review.

    This makes more sense to me. Personally however, I don't care whether they're there or not. I'm here to read the game review, not whatever reasonings the author went through to write the thing.

    > For example, what if he had not included any information, but in real life he loved the previous three to death? That would have been much more damaging for MGS4 (and the review would lose strength, as much of the impact would not be known). Now I can clearly see where he is coming from, what he likes and dislikes, and how that has affected his overall opinion regarding the game.

    Unfortunately, it's hard to test this, unless you choose to accept a tentative definition of objectivity, and then perform a statistical analysis on the perception of the objectivity of the article (with and without clarifications) on the gaming community. It would be the same as testing whether or not explanations from Kojima about MGS4's cutscenes and Codec conversations make them more enjoyable/acceptable to watch.

    > I hope I was clearer now (although I can imagine you might still disagree :-). Best we can do is just play the game itself right. I am still intrigued by the game changer... Cheers!

    Amen. Instead of the above, let's just dig into the game and form our own opinion, which at the end of the day is most important :).
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 00:10

  • monkie_king #1113 4 years ago

    more posts please. i am enjoying everyone's contributions to the site.

  • VMerken #1114 4 years ago

    > TheInquisitor: MGS 3: Snake Eater was also given a score of 8/10 by Eurogamer. It has more to do with (as was pointed out) the love or hate mechanics and long story than it being a poor title.

    Well, if you like long stories then it's there for you, and if you don't, there's always the START button or something similar to get back into action. Even RE4 had such a magical button. There isn't really a losing position here. I hope the reviewers realised this.

    > I'm sure it'll be the same this time round, I can't wait.

    According to Oli, it is. In excelsis, no less :). We'll find out in about 12 days.

    > JonFE: Just noticed the difference between the comments counter on the home page and their actual (viewable) number. 40-odd comments are missing. Are those only "oliwelshsmom's" deleted ones or do we have others of those insulting types as well?

    The Edits also count in that count, I believe.

    PS: one more post and the Halo3 thread is history :)
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 00:08

  • JonFE #1115 4 years ago

    @VMerken:
    "The Edits also count in that count, I believe."

    I'd love that to be true; the prospect of having lots of insulting/threatening comments over a game review it's really saddening...

  • nhojuhc #1116 4 years ago

    Whooo hooo. This comment thread has officially surpassed Halo3's comment thread in ONLY ONE DAY, proving once again that Eurogamer's review score of MGS4 was the perfect choice for getting viewer hits!

    Seriously though, this game's hype is obviously bigger than all the preceding titles that have come before. Wow.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 00:16

  • Rash' #1117 4 years ago

    Fucking hell! Left this thread for half a day and it's blown out of proportion! It doesn't matter what the reviews say, this is the conclusion to Solid Snake's saga. To many, that's the end of MGS. Many here underestimate the importance of this series. This game is more important than ppl are prepared to except. It isn't important in terms of shifting gaming trends, rather as the end of an era.

  • Weezer #1118 4 years ago

    Holy shit... over 1300 comments!

  • shido #1119 4 years ago

    hehe i looked to see how many comments there were for this hilarious review...

    And low and behold it was EXACTLY 1337 when i looked. Thats awesome.

  • VMerken #1120 4 years ago

    This thread is actually more entertaining than the review now :)
    Edited by 2 at 31/05/08 @ 00:32

  • JonFE #1121 4 years ago

    Why can't we all agree that this game will be loved by MGS fans, defended by PS3 fans (regardless of whether they like it or not) and scorned by x360 fans, at least until Kojima/Konami decide to release it on the x360 as well (if at all)???
    /The Bioshock example should be fresh in our memory.

    However *if* those rumoured 90-minutes cut-scenes are true, skipable or not, they can pose a problem to anyone caring for the story but not enough to devote an entire film's duration to a cut-scene. At the very least, they should be pauseable; sometimes nature calls and you must obey :)
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 00:29

  • VMerken #1122 4 years ago

    Have no fear, knowing Kojima, you will also be able to rotate/switch cameras during those cutscenes, and whatnot.

    Nite nite.

  • JonFE #1123 4 years ago

    Seriously Rash', at the end of the day it's *just* a game. By definition, it cannot be much more important than that...
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 00:33

  • asphaltcowboy #1124 4 years ago

    Charm, I missed out about 1000 of the posts in this thread, but I have absolutely no doubt that you have won! gg! :D

  • Dizzy #1125 4 years ago

    This thread is almost as long as a MGS cutscene now! ;)

    /coat

  • Beek4257 #1126 4 years ago

    Bottom line: if a review doesn't tell people what they want to hear, they get angry.
    People suck. F#ck people.

    Thanks EG and baby Jesus, keep up the good work.

  • elredeyegrande #1127 4 years ago

    Imagine if all the energy in this thread was used for something good. C'mon people.. We can go to the moon... Together.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 00:47

  • GuiltySpark #1128 4 years ago

    You're all missing the point here to be honest.

    The PS3 just sucks, look, it made MGS get an 8! What the fuck? Well done PlayStation 3 for ruining one of the best game series' ever. I bet if it was on the 360 then this wouldn't have happened.

    Even the Wii could have done it justice. I blame Lol-Ray as well, for having extra space for this piece of Sony crap to fill.

  • yagisencho #1129 4 years ago

    Why doesn't Kojima-san just make films instead of these $60 interactive cutscenes? Wait...I've answered my own question.

    (No, not a fan.)

  • subtlesnake #1130 4 years ago

    "Fantastic well-reasoned post. "

    You're saying there isn't enough criticism in the review so it looks like the score was deliberately downgraded. He's saying there's too much criticism so the review reads like the score should be lower.

    The divergence of opinion hinders, not helps, your case.

    And his 'well reasoned' argument is simply that the *trailers* show the game is 10. Obviously, a few minutes of hand picked developer footage is perfect for assessing a 30 hour gameplay experience, right? In fact why bother with reviews at all? Sony fanboys already know how good a game will be, before it's released - because if it's been hyped up as the saviour of the platform it has to be amazing, right?

    "Asked earlier on, is there another game in this genre which performs so well. Surely not - so 8? Why?"

    Hard to say without, you know, playing the game.

    "GTA4, that dissimilar to GTA3 (2001)? Halo 3, that different from Halo (2001)? Mario Galaxy, same design mechanics as Mario 64 (1996). It's not a justifiable complaint in that context."

    What context? Answer: the context of the reviewer actually playing the game, and seeing whether the existing gameplay mechanics still work for him. They don't, therefore it's a valid criticism. Yes, GTA's open world mission structure still makes sense today, yes Halo's shield system still makes sense today - but you can't use that to claim that this is the case for *every* game mechanic. Sometimes things get dated. It's the reviewers' job to point that out.

  • elredeyegrande #1131 4 years ago

    "(No, not a fan.)"

    No fucking shit.

  • JediMasterMalik #1132 4 years ago

    I don't agree with the score in the context of the review as an MGS fan, but this thread is absolutely ridiculous.

  • GuiltySpark #1133 4 years ago

    I thought noodles was just a Chinese thing. Hmm, this thread is full of knowledge! Who knew, eh?

  • elredeyegrande #1134 4 years ago

    How are you Charm-san?

  • GuiltySpark #1135 4 years ago

    I agree with the score, as it is sort of an "average" when you think about it. Many high points, many low points, so it's only fitting that it should get an 8.

  • GuiltySpark #1136 4 years ago

    Charm-sensei, creator of the loltastic P8riots.

  • elredeyegrande #1137 4 years ago

    It's only 1283 posts here.. Must be a few ignores.

  • GuiltySpark #1138 4 years ago

    Whilst we're all nice and cosy here, I may as well ask, "elredeyegrande", how the hell do you say that?

  • elredeyegrande #1139 4 years ago

    It's el red eye grande. Maybe I should've put spaces in it.. But they're for the weak.

  • GuiltySpark #1140 4 years ago

    Well it's better than the Elrede Yegrande that I thought it was anyway.

  • elredeyegrande #1141 4 years ago

    Lol.

    Drunk, or what? :D

  • MightyMouse #1142 4 years ago

    I think the score's a bit random personally, as someone who's never played an MGS game. If it is indeed a marmite (or hence westerns) game, then Oli's opinion would presumably be either a 10 or a 6 depending. If this is not his opinion but an attempt at an 'average' opinion, then we know from calling it a marmite game that no one will agree that the game's an 8. My point is that by scoring it an 8 he's making sure that the score is true for the least number of people reading the review, which just seems odd.

    Anyway! I'm sure I'll agree with him that the gameplay's old and could do with a rest when I get round to buying this, just as it needs to go in halo, cod, dmc, ng... Sorry in all honesty I'm not exactly disagreeing with him, but I do wonder whether this is just saying that sequels are bad, mmkay?

  • typhoonf6 #1143 4 years ago

    most of you people saying " it got an 8!!, not worth buying the ps3 now! " , LMAOOOO , it just got 9.9/10 on IGN UK, this game is for real action fans, lol @ the comparisions to halo, halo is a great FIRST PERSON SHOOTER, its in a dif catergory to metal gear solid, I own a ps3 and xbox360 and 100% this game will make sure my 360 doesn't get a play again, if you live off some game site and can't make up your mind, thats just sad.

    and 8/10 is a low score for a game at this quality , the reviewer seems to be one of the people who " hate " the series, realism at its finest , the reviewer probbably had the nintendo wii on their bias mind when reviewing this, if you cant appreciate quality in games, smh lol, Eurogamer = shocking at reviews . Most of the negative comments comes from angry xbox360 fans coz their not getting this game LOLL!

    Metal Gear Solid 4 will be a serious contender for greatest game of all time, nuff said

  • Bigska #1144 4 years ago

    You seem to be quite upset that you had to play this game. Why did you review it? What's the point of having someone review a game or series that they don't like. You seem to lack a sense of respect for not only the MGS community but the gaming community aswell. When you go read a review for a game you think will be good it's one thing to see a bad score and reasons why, but it's another to see a decent score and then some stupid blithering about how the series in general doesn't turn your crank.

    My advice in conclusion: Eat your corn flakes, hit yourself with a shovel and ask one of your less narrow minded colleagues to review this "Magnum Opus" as it deserves.

  • niteninja #1145 4 years ago

    Whats the matter eurogamer?
    Sony not paying you enough for reviews.
    Yes its got a lot of cutscenes but no game comes close to the atistic brilliance of this game.
    After the dubious mario kart review on the wii its clear that EG is in bed with Microsoft.

  • NewbieZilla #1146 4 years ago

    "Yes its got a lot of cutscenes but no game comes close to the atistic brilliance of this game."

    If I cared to get this game, I would be curious how you got to play it.

  • Carrybagma #1147 4 years ago

    Anyone actually read through all the comments? If so, please copy and paste all the funny bits into a separate post. Ta!

  • niteninja #1148 4 years ago

    I got to play the first level two weeks ago at a retailers show,you jump out of the back of a truck and all hell breaks lose.
    Its leagues beyond any game released this year,When you play the game yourself you will see what a travesty this review score really is.
    Put it this way its a hell of a lot better than halo 3.
    This game isnt as fictitious as you think,Governments are already beginning to privatize the military.
    Hideo Kojimas message is modern warfare is all about corporate profits and hes dead on.
    If nanotechnology is pure fiction how come the pentagon and darpa has spent over 40 billion dollars researching it over the last decade backed up by almost total media blackout.
    Edited by 2 at 31/05/08 @ 02:49

  • Stoatboy #1149 4 years ago

    "• Tune out the details, and Guns of the Patriots is a properly gripping yarn, full of thrills, spectacle, laughs, and even tenderness and pathos. You won't understand, but you will care.

    • The new gadgets are superb, the weapons are expertly realised and much easier to get hold of, and there are always plenty of options, even if stealth is still usually the best of them. Hand-to-hand combat feels more natural. The environments are more complex, but nothing like as large or open as you might expect, and this is still a linear game.

    • Despite Kojima's downbeat sentiments on the PS3, he has produced a technical and presentational tour-de-force. The visuals do have rough edges but the art, especially the character art, is flawless, somehow maintaining extravagance and understated cool simultaneously. Harry Gregson Williams' music, whether providing scripted excitement or dynamic accompaniment, hits all the right cues, and musters a memorable, delicate theme. And the surround soundtrack is clearly a labour of love and extreme dedication, probably the best in gaming to date...

    • In Guns of the Patriots' incredible, cathartic, climactic scenes, the lines are blurred so much that you can barely tell whether you're playing a videogame or watching a film. To some that might sound like an insult, but to Kojima and his fans, it's nirvana, something for which the series has been striving for ten years, and it could not be a more appropriate note to end on.

    • You could not ask for a funnier, cleverer, more ambitious or inspired or over-the-top conclusion to the Metal Gear Solid series, but it's definitely time to move on."

    Yeah - that's an assassination job right there. What right has the reviewer to call the game a technical and presentational tour-de-force, the art practically flawless, and the soundtrack probably the best in gaming to date? Furthermore, calling it nirvana to its fans is clearly a MS-sponsored attack. Saying that I couldn't ask for a funnier, cleverer, more ambitious, inspired or over-the-top conclusion to the series is the final insult, and absolute definite proof that the reviewer absolutely hates MGS and wants to see Sony dead and buried.

    English comprehension is in scant supply it seems...
    Edited by 2 at 31/05/08 @ 02:43

  • timberwolf #1150 4 years ago

    how great games and films should be made never compromise your integrity. this series will go down in history. plus i am a lesser fan and the score is perfect if bioshock hadn't got 10.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 02:54

  • markgreyam #1151 4 years ago

    The mind boggles.

    The problem with these threads are that game fanboys are exactly like hardcore religious nuts; it's actually completely impossible to tell what is the real deal and what is the parody because the real deal can be so incredibly retarded, outlandishly ridiculous and just completely insane that no parody can ever make it so it's completely obvious that it is only taking the piss and isn't actually an honest comment. The fanboys can say exactly the same thing yet be deadly serious.

    Reading some of these leaves you with simply no way of telling if they are just having a laugh or are actually for real.

    Stuff like typhoonf6 and niteninja can't possibly be serious, and yet they just seem too incredibly well crafted for parody.

    Must ... stop ... reading, yet can't look away.

  • Dodgymat #1152 4 years ago

    Wow. When I started reading it was 1378 comments on the main page but only 1054 showing for me (I do love a good ignore y'know)

    Now, at time of posting it's still on 1378. So I've read the whole thing in under 30 mins and the count now stands at 739 for me.

    Thankyou so much EG for giving me such a healthy feast of ignore fodder. Where did they all come from ? Any chance of sharing the number of new user signups from time of the review going up until midnight ?

    I'm off down the Lewes Rd BP now - they sell snacks that are easily 10/10 !

  • timberwolf #1153 4 years ago

    lol im a fan and reckon the review is spot on. personally i hate 10/10 games they try to tick all the boxes and have no character, this game will be perfect for some... but the review is fine... from fan XP ps. some comments are silly, you can't make people think a certain way with a comment paragraph, that's free will. we fought real wars over that.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 04:30

  • bonker #1154 4 years ago

    OK, I understand the controversy, at a superficial level at least but how come so many comments in this thread??

    Lotsa Euro-types posting?? (PS3 'big' in europe)

    Lotsa Yanks posting?? ('retarded', 'moron', 'insane' etc word count appears higher than normal)

    Lotsa kiddies posting?? (school's out!)

    ??

  • quantumsheep #1155 4 years ago

    About 1,000 posts ago, roquito wrote:

    "Miguel, I'm too old for this. I am a gamer of the spectrum era, and I know when a review is wrong, and even why ."

    This absolutely astounds me. Seriously. You're in your ate 20s/30s and you're acting like a fucking kid over a review score. You're a GROWN MAN for god's sake. Fucking act like one.

    The UN should pass a resolution commanding you to never reproduce.

    Though in fairness, you're not the only one that acts like this. A lot of fanboys of all consoles/games are old enough to know better really.

    As to the review itself, sounds interesting. As a fan of the series, I'm looking forward to playing it. Glad that there seems to be a lot of variety in it (locations, weapons etc).

  • warbo #1156 4 years ago

    Some PS3 console warriors are outraged that this (and every other exclusive PS3 title) did not receive perfect scores allround?
    Some other console warriors think that despite a glowing review, the 8/10 score means MGS4 must be an awful game?

  • JonFE #1157 4 years ago

    Dodgymat wrote:
    "Any chance of sharing the number of new user signups from time of the review going up until midnight ?"

    I asked for something similar 700 posts ago with no luck :|

  • Davemanz #1158 4 years ago

    I can't be arsed to read this whole thread, but am I the only one who thinks that EG should just do away with numerically rating games? Oh wait, that would probably be bad for their hit counter.

    The game sounds fantastic. I'll get the bundle and play this over and over again, just like I did with the others. Kojima is a master - and the fact that he's able to make replayable linear sneaking games is a testament to the fun of the series. I can't wait to get it.

  • ElArabDeMagnifico #1159 4 years ago

    This review confused me more than the story itself - did he like it or hate it?

  • Escape #1160 4 years ago

    This thread is a clear case for the removal of scores. I'm sure the writers here agree; having them attracts more readers, sadly.

  • Dizzy #1161 4 years ago

    This thread should be turned into a MGS game. It makes about as much sense as one and never really ends.

  • Isere #1162 4 years ago

    ''Review by Oli Welsh'' did raise my eyebrow before I read the review tbh. Being controversial is all well and good (and pulls in the crowd) but the reviewer lacked the subtelty to pull it off:(

    The review is a convoluted mess with enough ups and downs to be a worthy competitor to Kojima's own work... ''if there's one thing Metal Gear Solid 4 isn't, it's compromising...Features that would be a tent-pole selling-point for other games are frittered away as Easter eggs and one-shot surprises...Design-wise, MGS4 is mostly a refinement of what's gone before...the first of these is such a precise and enthralling distillation of stealth gaming that it's a shame more people won't see it,etc,etc.:)

    EG got lots of site hits between NG2 and MGS4. Now lets see exactly how thin Eurogamer can manage to stretch its repution.

  • SchumiF1 #1163 4 years ago

    I mean the reviewer only critizised the game but failed to provide any reasons why he hates everything so much.

    "Snake don't come back" WTF?!

    Hey, we'll be reaching 1500 posts soon enough!

  • lmaao #1164 4 years ago

    Oh dear, looks like the 360 fanboys are coming out of their holes.

    I guess judgement will come when the "real" critics review this, ( I think i'll trust IGN's USA review ) but seriously an 8/10? No onder i've never heard of this site before lol.

  • arbok #1165 4 years ago

    I'm really surprised by some of the comments especially in regards to the Eurogamer review. I just wanted to analyse some of the things that people have been saying because they just flat out don't make any valid points.

    "MGS 4 is a AAA game – it should be higher than an 8."

    Firstly every site is going to give have different standards for review, every person who reviews games will also have different tastes, in fact there are RULES at times and NO RULES sometimes. This may frustrate some of you but that's just how the media play. If you don't like it, don't READ IT.

    For example – IGN like to review their games 'objectively' 80% of the time. A lot of factors that go into their score are for content like whether it has multiplayer, whether the graphics are great artiscially or technically, whether the sound is up to scratch and also how they feel about the game is also PART of their score. A technically well rounded game can do very well – like Burnout Paradise or Ratchet and Clank. Their review philosophy is that while opinions CAN differ, 80% of the time different reviewers will arrive at the same score (or near enough to it say within 1.0). That is just the way it is over there in America because its accessible to the lowest common demographic.

    They also like to give it to the person in the office who either 1) has the most perceived trust of the readership (ie Matt Casamasina or Hillary Goldstein) or the person who is the biggest fan of the series (ie most knowledge). This is because IGN is a business first and foremost and they care about the clicks to the website. Having someone on the review that displays either of these two qualities instills a level of 'perceived trust' with readers. Also being a fan of the series, the good points tend to outweight the bad points most of the time and hence a favourable score – THAT IS WHY YOU SEE more often then not favourable scores at IGN. With favourable scores comes increased readership – because the fans get clouded in their judgement and see what they want to see ESPECIALLY when they haven't even played the game yet. IGN can still write good reviews but they are always loaded with every possible chance for it to be favourable if possible. There are games like Haze which flat out suck and they have no problem calling it as they see it.

    Now Eurogamer is a site that reviews DIFFERENTLY – it is an EVERYMAN site – its philosophy is that anyone can pick up a game and review it from that perspective. It TACKS on a score at the end based on how that person is FEELING at the time. There's no criteria aside from how fun it is to play for that particular person. They will at times put someone on who wants to play the game but usually it will just go to whoever is available at the time. Eurogamer isn't about adding up the different aspects of graphics and sound and big production values. If the game has 40 minute cut scenes and it pisses the reviewer off it will say so no matter how much time money and effort the developers spent on it. Similarly if the reviewer LOVED the cut scenes it will say that too. The fact of the matter is there were moments where he loved it and moments where Hideo Kojima just becamse too self indulgent and lambasted him for it. Anyone that has played any of the MGS series will know that Hideo is a long winded audio novel and it is more than likely this hasn't changed.

    "MGS 4 got an 8 and GRID got a 9..."

    Who cares honestly? You can't compare them. And its too bad if MGS 4 got lower. Fanboys just need to stop worrying about how the score will affect sales and consequently whether they will get any more MGS games and whether it will get the recognition it deserves. Just go play the game and then tell me if it should get the recognition. More than likely the difference between MGS 4 getting an 8 and a 9 is the difference between all the executives at Konami driving Porsches instead of Ferraris – do you really care?

    "MGS 4 got an 8 – that's a good score."

    Stop thinking the scores are everything! Its not the be all and end all. If people read the review they will know that there were really annoying parts in MGS4 and also totally awesome parts. Fans of the past will know what to expect. Just because he felt the game was an 8 does not mean you will feel the game also warrants an 8 by the time you finished the game.

    Finally honestly in my opinion people should just be checking reviews to see if the game includes things they like. So what if the game gets an 8 or a 9 or 7. As long as its not below a 5 or a 6 and if you really like the game go for it providing you have the money. If you don't get it, is it the end of the world? Can you not play some other game? When it comes to complaining about a score that you want it to get or complaining about the guy reviewing the game saying he doesn't get it, that is just plain stupid – its just one guys opinion which is far less important than your own. People who rely on reviews to make decisions on which games to buy – ok whatever, but why bag on the review when you're going to buy the game anyway. Most of the time it IS people who are going to BUY the game who hates on the review. RIDICULOUS.

  • Gradius #1166 4 years ago

    First! \o/

  • Redeye #1167 4 years ago

    Definitely not last! \o/

    And oi, elredeyegrande, this rouge-lensed old fart was here first. :p

    (Not in this thread, but...oh, I give up.)

    /falls asleep on keyboard after yet another pixel-pushing all-nighter

  • Dizzy #1168 4 years ago

    "I guess judgement will come when the "real" critics review this, ( I think i'll trust IGN's USA review ) but seriously an 8/10? No onder i've never heard of this site before lol. "

    ROFL.. yet you are here happily trolling away. For an unknown website quite an honor from an important guy like you.

    BTW WTF am I even still here ;) I am quite enjoying the influx of new trolls. This thread is a classic!!!

  • Scimarad #1169 4 years ago

    "First! \o/"

    Post of the day award goes to Gradius!

  • drumbaby #1170 4 years ago

    It's the difference between a fanboy review (everyone loved Half Life, Halo and GTA because they were so commercially accessible...hence 10/10's for their latest sequels) and a bona fide gaming site review.

    Certain games (see above) inspire the fanboy in the reviewer...they tick enough boxes to get them all excited for their fave franchise, and the gushing starts...sometimes despite a whole gamut of flaws that they've spotted but simply don't care about like they normally would. But a Marmite game like MGS4 comes along, maybe not so warmly embraced as a series due to its niche appeal, and no matter how good it is it's never going to tickle the fanboy in the reviewer.

    Judging by alot of remarks in the review, the reviewer was never really that enamoured with MGS anyway. Fans of the game should add at least another 1 to the score.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 08:51

  • Les #1171 4 years ago

    "After the dubious mario kart review on the wii its clear that EG is in bed with Microsoft."

    I wouldn't say they're in bed with them. They just have a bad taste when it comes to games...

  • beastmaster #1172 4 years ago

    MGS? Who gives a shit? I mean, really? A Blu-Ray full of sleep inducing cut scenes with bits of boring gameplay to break up the 'action'. If it were cinema it would be directed by Boll and star Tom Welling from Smallville as Snake, Elizabeth Berkley as Lancalot (or whatever the fuck the dudes names is) and the main baddy would be The HOFF. The SFX would be done by NITB (Nerds In Their Bedrooms) and have a budget of $10 - sucky fucky.

    To sum up. It would be shit. Although if Berkley were to show off her talents as she did in Showgirls, it might be worth a download. Funny thing is if had a $100 million budget, directed by Woo at his peak and star Tom Cruise (or whoever) it would be much like this game is now. Probably great to look but about as much fun as being force fed Johnny Vegas's testicles.

    As for those people out there who are dissing EG for not giving it a 10 - all I can say it "Vegas get your nads out. Some morons need feeding!".

    (Apologies to Mr Vegas - You seem like a top dude)


  • EmiliasHorse #1173 4 years ago

    I cannot be arsed to plow through all the comments. Can someone sum up the general feel of the thread?



  • Les #1174 4 years ago

    "Fans of the game should add at least another 1 to the score."

    No, fans of the series should just buy the game and enjoy themselves... ;)

    But EG is clearly a bit confused: Good Wii games get low scores, despite their mass appeal, because the reviewers just don't like/can't work with motion controls. Uninspired dros like GTA4 get 10/10s, because of their mass appeal, despite the fact that they contain no innovation what so ever and come with bucketloads of technical problems and gameplay imperfections. And well produced games like MGS get downgraded again because despite the fact that they are technical and artistic gems, they won't appeal to the masses.

  • patchbox360 #1175 4 years ago


    if your a mgs fan the game is a must,if your a fanboy arguing about crap is a must

  • w00t #1176 4 years ago

    I find it interesting that so many people have an opinion on how good a game is before THEY'VE ACTUALLY PLAYED IT.

    You guys should harness your psychic abilities for more useful purposes. Or, y'know, just fuck off.

  • ChrisTop #1177 4 years ago

    Whoops, GTA4 comments record broken in less than 24 hours. That was something!

  • TONYgr #1178 4 years ago

    i dont believe it.1400 coomments on a game that is not out yet.i ve read the review but not the comments.anyway i will play the game AND AFTER I WILL POST MY THOUGHTS.CALM DOWN GUYS!

  • Xerx3s #1179 4 years ago

    "Xerx3s, you've got to be kidding me. Out of 1280+ comments you pick LeD's #4 to argue? Where have you been hiding since noon?
    8-)

    BTW, you do have a point, but it will probably drop on deaf ears... "

    Sorry, life got in the way of my internet addiction. Basically I read the first page but it pretty soon dawned on me that this was going to be far worse than H3. Where H3 brings out all the hater idiots, mgs4 seems to bring out all the defender idiots.

  • StratoCazzer #1180 4 years ago


    The reviewer and 'an incompetent ..
    The review and 'subjective and he does not like the mgs! Incompetent not even know what the 'art.
    Mgs4 score: 9.7/10

  • ChrisTop #1181 4 years ago

    It's American VS Japanese Products all over again. And I'm getting tired btw.

  • Xerx3s #1182 4 years ago

    "Also, I am the 1337th commenter ... FURTHER PROVING MY POINT THAT EUROTRASHGAMER IS RETARDED. "

    The irony in the posts of these MGS defenders is just absurd.

  • DanMW #1183 4 years ago

    Edge gives MGS4 an 8 too on their latest issue #190 July 2008

  • Widge #1184 4 years ago

    Did someone say on this page they'd trust IGN's USA review? The one that is a UK review? That is done by a heavy Eurogamer contributer?

    Imagine that, different people with different opinions. Who'd have thought.

  • the_sas_man #1185 4 years ago

    my word - I've been using this site many years and never have I seen an explosion of comments in such a short time over a poxy score.

    It only goes to prove that MGS fanboys are by far the whingiest, most bitter and downright immature gamers in the industry!

    They even pip the Halo fanboys which I thought was impossible.

  • Gradius #1186 4 years ago

    The real question is, could the amount of posts in this thread fit on a Blu-ray?

    AMIRITE? :D

  • RedPanda #1187 4 years ago

    Post deleted at 14:31:59 28-01-2012

  • EmiliasHorse #1188 4 years ago

    Lots of angry people desperate to accuse EG of using low scores to gain reputation.

    I read both this and NG2 reviews and feel they are fair and unbiased.

  • Katsumoto #1189 4 years ago

    the mind boggles. I guess chavs must have learnt how to use the internet or something

  • Codger81 #1190 4 years ago

    Can't spare the cash for a PS3, but this seems like a worthy title if someone's planning on a PS3. Back in the day Hidden-and-Dangerous was the exact same brilliantly flawed game, never stopped me loving it one bit despite it.

  • Codger81 #1191 4 years ago

    @Les

    "But EG is clearly a bit confused: Good Wii games get low scores, despite their mass appeal, because the reviewers just don't like/can't work with motion controls. Uninspired dros like GTA4 get 10/10s, because of their mass appeal, despite the fact that they contain no innovation what so ever and come with bucketloads of technical problems and gameplay imperfections. And well produced games like MGS get downgraded again because despite the fact that they are technical and artistic gems, they won't appeal to the masses."

    Whilst I agree with the sentiment, a game score is as much about execution as innovation and creativity. Very often the most ground breaking titles suffer from terrible implementation, and their derivative spawn take that potential and perfect it. Swings and roundabouts really.

  • TheNinkyNonk #1192 4 years ago

    This thread is as long and boring as a MGS cutscene

  • Wyrm #1193 4 years ago

    Have any of you played it?

  • TheNinkyNonk #1194 4 years ago

    But as far as the review goes: I've not played the game, but given that whenever I've played MGS in the past I've groaned every time a cutscene or radio comms conversation starts due to their utter cheese, length and regularity, the 8 and the supporting comments seems fair IMHO. I would like to have a go at some point though for curiosity's sake.

    MGS is this gens Space Ace if you ask me.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 10:21

  • krudster #1195 4 years ago

    Eep. You wake up and find another 300 comments. How ever many is this going to reach once the game actually hits the shelves?
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 10:32

  • ps3owner #1196 4 years ago

    right. I've finally got it. (slept over it)

    for MGS fans this is a 10/10 game.
    for PS3/XBOT fanboys it's an 8/10 (keeps the punters happy)
    and for everyone else who just doesn't get the game at all it's a 6/10

    and I was right (can't remember when I said it, post 1000 ish) it will reach 1500. easy

    have a great saturday

  • BartonFink #1197 4 years ago

    wow epic thread - some of the crap in here even rivals that WWE Raw thread from a few years ago.

  • BillGaitas #1198 4 years ago

    By the review it seems that MGS4 is what i was expecting it to be. Good, but flawed.

    I wouldnt recommend it to someone who has never played a MGS before, and, as i see it, i should be able to that with 9 or 10-10 game.

    Since i love MGS, i'll buy it anyway.

    and btw ....
    lol at the 1300 plus comments
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 10:54

  • Les #1199 4 years ago

    "Have any of you played it?"

    No. Stupid question. People here (except some (OK lots of) idiots) are commenting about the poor quality of the review. A bit like reviewing the review. You don't need to play the game for that.

  • gamingqueen #1200 4 years ago

    where are the comments?

  • Mudo #1201 4 years ago

    In conclusion, the game is shit. Now lets move on! What's being published today?

  • gamingqueen #1202 4 years ago

    Ok so metal gear deserves an 8 and deserves being described old and rehashed and pretencious when no other game has deep enough storyline to make people buy the gam's sequels? I refuse to think metal gear is an average game because it's not. That score and review was for an average game.

  • gamingqueen #1203 4 years ago

    Metal gear may not deserve a perfect score and review but it deserves a better review than that.

  • BartonFink #1204 4 years ago

    The review definitely reads like 'one for the fans' a muddled epic with seemingly endless codec and cutscenes where you rarely get to play the actual game, again. Ah well bye bye Snake.

  • mcmonkeyplc #1205 4 years ago

    I'm so glad Halo 3 got 10.

  • WinterSnowblind #1206 4 years ago

    I'm not really sure why so many are kicking up such a fuss about this, like an 8 of 10 is a bad score. Like has been said, I think it's a pretty justifable score, and I don't think it could really have ever deserved anymore. After all, it's a game really for the fanboys, especially this entry, as they seem to be going out of their way to bring back every (surviving) character. People who haven't played the previous games, probably won't really get it. And people who didn't enjoy the other games, probably won't enjoy this either. It's been hyped up as the game for the PS3 by almost every PS3 owner, but a good deal of them seem to have ignored the fact, that they themselves probably won't enjoy a game like this.

    As always, there's very little substance. If you enjoy the characters and story, then great. But if you were looking for an action game, or the sorts, you may want to try else where. I've been saying this for some time now, but despite what the PS3 fanboys have been wanting to believe, this is a game that only the fans are going to enjoy, as was the case with all the previous ones.

    Personally, I love the series and MGS4, for me is still the reason to own a PS3. But I've fully been expecting thousands of people complaining upon the games release. "OMG, when do i get to PLAY the game, it's all cut scenes!!!1"

  • DjFlex52 #1207 4 years ago

    "This thread is a clear case for the removal of scores. I'm sure the writers here agree; having them attracts more readers, sadly."

    @Escape

    Really it's a clear case that fanboys are imbeciles and they should be removed. For all the people that thinks Oli gave MGS4 an 8 for more hits on EG, they are imbeciles too.

    "No. Stupid question. People here (except some (OK lots of) idiots) are commenting about the poor quality of the review. A bit like reviewing the review. You don't need to play the game for that."

    @Les

    So reviewing a review of a game that noone has played but the reviewer makes sense to you, Les? You're an imbecile too.

  • ToytownMafia #1208 4 years ago

    Edge Magazine also gave this 8/10.

  • mcmonkeyplc #1209 4 years ago

    This thread should be archived and protected by the English Heritage people. 10/10

  • Camorrista #1210 4 years ago

    Les:

    Yes, but the general point of criticism is "The review is bad because the game is sooo good that it deserves a 10/10."
    And when you say that, you better have played the game or you sound like an idiot.

    (Edit: typo)
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 11:14

  • Infinitefire #1211 4 years ago

    That was the worst, most contradicting review I've read in a very long time (and I regularly read IGN's reviews so that's saying something!).

    To be able to review this game you truly have to understand what Kojima was intending and has created here. This is not a game that can be likened to most other action games that deliver small cut scenes followed by game play alternately. It's a total blend of the two, a combination of game and movie produced so well it truly deserves far more respect than this half assed review has given it.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 11:16

  • Xerx3s #1212 4 years ago

    "Eep. You wake up and find another 300 comments. How ever many is this going to reach once the game actually hits the shelves?"

    /watches krudster count advert money

    Here, I'll help you a bit.

    HALO 3 IS BETTER THAN MGS4, FACT!

  • Les #1213 4 years ago

    "Whilst I agree with the sentiment, a game score is as much about execution as innovation and creativity. Very often the most ground breaking titles suffer from terrible implementation, and their derivative spawn take that potential and perfect it. Swings and roundabouts really."

    True, but there's no innovation in GTA4, Halo3 or Bioshock and their execution wasn't exactly flawless but that didn't stop EG from handing them 10/10s. That's why I say review scores are utterly pointless. The only thing the score says is how much the reviewer personally likes the game, nothing about its qualities.

  • BartonFink #1214 4 years ago

    "Jumping from an enthusiastic "incredible, cathartic, climactic" stance to a dismissal of the SAME thing as "frustrating and fractured" in the course of a mere two paragraphs is imo not really a very trustworthy (and neither professional) way of reviewing a game (or anything for that matter)."

    Of course you can something can be all of these things yet also be frustrating and fractured.

  • byron_hinson #1215 4 years ago

    If it makes any difference - EDGE today gave it 8/10 as well.

  • Ihya #1216 4 years ago

    Eurogamer just trolled the entire internet!! That takes some hard work!

  • IronGiant #1217 4 years ago

    An 8/10 from Edge usually means a 9 or above from EG.. not so this time. More reviews are coming in, the more glowing reviews it gets the less notice i take of the EG review. I take no notice whatsoever of the Edge reviews as they've consistently their heads up their own backside :)


    100Playstation Official Magazine UK
    Guns of the Patriots is almost intimidating in the consistent quality of its ideas, invention, and execution...Even by the series' stratospheric standards, MGS4 is a remarkable high point. [June 2008]

    100GamePro
    The Playstation 3 finally gets its "savior", Kojima gets his masterpiece, and gamers get one of the best games of all time. [July 2008, p.72]

    99IGN UK
    If you've ever loved any one of the Metal Gear games, or any moments from the series, there will come a moment when MGS 4 will send your spirits soaring. If you've loved them all, well then there'll be many, many more. It’s a masterpiece.

    97Games Master UK
    Despite its flaws it's a largely successful of marriage and plot and play, a towering achievement and one of the finest action games ever made.

    80EuroGamer
    Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it.

  • subtlesnake #1218 4 years ago

    "True, but there's no innovation in GTA4, Halo3 or Bioshock and their execution wasn't exactly flawless but that didn't stop EG from handing them 10/10s. That's why I say review scores are utterly pointless. The only thing the score says is how much the reviewer personally likes the game, nothing about its qualities."

    What about the use of relationships in GTA 4, endorphin, the in-game internet, the integration of the phone, the multiplayer modes? What about the Theater mode, Forge, campaign scoring with skulls, the party system, Bungie.net integration, in Halo 3?

    I would agree there aren't many 'bullet point' innovations in Bioshock, but its main innovation was in its plot, and the way it pulled the rug from under the player in the Ryan cutscene, bringing the players own limitations to light, as part of the story itself.

  • Marshall2008 #1219 4 years ago

    This is so fucking funny. All of the Xbots laughing and all of the PS3fanbois screaming that Eurogamer are idiots. To be honest I was put off by the play through that went up on PSN when the main focus was on cock grabbing statues and feeling some dude up. That and the snake stealth 'thong' suit.

    Get over it, its a mediocre franchise coming to a mediocre close. There are far better games on the horizon like little big planet (still looks simply amazing), resistance 2 (its starting to look good, much better than the dull first game) and a glimmer of hope from Killzone 2 (hey, no way it can be as bad as the first abomination was).

    Also

    100Playstation Official Magazine UK - Sony Official mag - fucking duh, guaranteed 100
    Guns of the Patriots is almost intimidating in the consistent quality of its ideas, invention, and execution...Even by the series' stratospheric standards, MGS4 is a remarkable high point. [June 2008]

    100GamePro - Have you read the reviews? Sony fanboys
    The Playstation 3 finally gets its "savior", Kojima gets his masterpiece, and gamers get one of the best games of all time. [July 2008, p.72]

    99IGN UK - Again, sony fanboys
    If you've ever loved any one of the Metal Gear games, or any moments from the series, there will come a moment when MGS 4 will send your spirits soaring. If you've loved them all, well then there'll be many, many more. It’s a masterpiece.

    97Games Master UK - Always have been Sony fanboys
    Despite its flaws it's a largely successful of marriage and plot and play, a towering achievement and one of the finest action games ever made.

    80EuroGamer - Variable reviews, but normally on the money.
    Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it.

    The rule of thumb is:

    If you love MGS you will love this and give it 100% and defend it to the death (kinda like Muslim extremists)

    If you don't love MGS then your milage will vary.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 12:07

  • morriss #1220 4 years ago

    lol. How on earth can Resistance ever begin to compare with MGS? It's like comparing a plastic IKEA kids chair with an Arne Jacobsen.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 12:08

  • Retroid #1221 4 years ago

    This thread:

    /<a href=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v443/R etroid/Blank-Picard_Facepalm.jpg>Facepalm</a>

  • 4thVariety #1222 4 years ago

    Some franchises simply brought some people into gaming or altered their perception about gaming. These franchises will then be defended till kingdom come. It does not make them better, though. MGS has always been a franchise which forced the gamer to endure weird stuff every ten minutes. The weird stuff remains and the redeeming qualities get old, personally the replay value of most MGS games has suffered from this heavily.

  • Unknown27 #1223 4 years ago

    @Infinitefire

    "To be able to review this game you truly have to understand what Kojima was intending and has created here. This is not a game that can be likened to most other action games that deliver small cut scenes followed by game play alternately. It's a total blend of the two, a combination of game and movie produced so well it truly deserves far more respect than this half assed review has given it."

    More specifically:

    "To be able to review this game you truly have to understand what Kojima was intending and has created here."

    So if I read this right in order for anyone to have a valid opinion on this game or indeed enjoy it whatsoever they must have a deep understanding of the developers intentions.

    I loved Hitman: Blood Money and would have loved it to get 10/10 but it didn't and one of the reasons why is that it was only really good if you "knew" how to play it properly, which was a very valid criticism as if you didn't "know" and just treated it like any old third person shooter it wasn't that great.

    The same can be said here, for anyone who doesn't "know" to expect that half the time you'll be watching a film but that was the intention, it could get a bit boring and not many people will sit through them all unless they "know"

    A 10/10 game shouldn't require an explanation as to how to enjoy it or take it for it to be great. Having said all that I've no doubt that this will be a great game and one that is fondly remembered by anyone who sees it through. And maybe once everyone has played it to death they can come back and re-read the review and then see how they feel.

  • Yossarian #1224 4 years ago

    I see the lunatics are still at work in this thread
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 12:31

  • agparrot #1225 4 years ago

    So, is this the kind of comments thread where the reviewer posts something to answer any of the points raised?

    Interesting review - I can't see it stopping me playing it when I get a PS3, but it isn't going to make me rush out and get a PS3, I guess.

    Perhaps the reviewer just didn't 'get it', and somebody could write an article called "MGS4: A Defence"?

    I am not being completely serious.

  • gohda #1226 4 years ago

    lol

  • DjFlex52 #1227 4 years ago

    I know one thing for sure, evilfoxhound...if H3, Bioshock and GOW had half of their games filled with cutscenes they wouldn't have gotten 10/10/8, respectively :)

    ohh...and +1 to Bloodkult

  • Ace_McCloud #1228 4 years ago

    Who said most 360 owners are teenagers? What about Bioshock Mr My-PS3-has-so-many-more-mature-adult-themed-games-than-you-i mmature-360-owners?

  • Infinitefire #1229 4 years ago

    @ evilfoxhound

    I couldnt agree more!

  • Les #1230 4 years ago

    "Who said most 360 owners are teenagers?"

    Just read the average post... 60% of the demographic consists of 12 year old gun loving Americans. Plus some Brits that love guns as well... ;)

  • kufurbaz #1231 4 years ago

    Sizin verceğiniz puanın ta amına koyim.Sizn gibi gerizekalılar ne zamandan beri inceleme yapar oldu.O puanı alınfda götünüze sokup sokup çıkarın.Orosbu çocukları.Snake siksin sizi...Götveren fahişe takımı eourogamer...

  • DjFlex52 #1232 4 years ago

    Just read the average post... 60% of the demographic consists of 12 year old gun loving Americans. Plus some Brits that love guns as well... ;)

    @Les

    You must have too many people on ignore, Les...60% of the posts are ranting PS3 lunatics. And there are no 12 year olds here, only adults who act like 12 year olds.
    Why do you post so much condescending bullshit, Les?

    edit: Uhh, I forgot Les put me on ignore because I used to call him out on his elitist bullshit posts. Habits are hard to break :)
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 13:31

  • oerhoert #1233 4 years ago

    Excellent review. Please ignore the critics, EG.

    What the gaming world needs is a more adult form of criticism, and this one wasn't bad at all. :)

  • Xerx3s #1234 4 years ago

    Evilfoxhound: "I like the MGS series because it has a emo stories desperately trying to be deep but failing utterly, like most japanese games. Action games made by Americans (GOW, Halo3) are all about killing as many as you can "ooh-rah!", fun, yes, but at least good in what they are. But the MGS games always have some emo spiky hair/weiro feeling which, as an someone who never grew up, I can appreciate. They are action games with emo's, which is why a lot of normal gamers (Odly, mostly 360 owners) do not enjoy them. All they want to do is be a big muscley men and kill wave after wave of enemies. I find that boring, give me a game with more emo in it any day."

    Fixed.

  • mainaman #1235 4 years ago


    "True, but there's no innovation in GTA4, Halo3 or Bioshock and their execution wasn't exactly flawless but that didn't stop EG from handing them 10/10s. That's why I say review scores are utterly pointless. The only thing the score says is how much the reviewer personally likes the game, nothing about its qualities."

    What about the use of relationships in GTA 4, endorphin, the in-game internet, the integration of the phone, the multiplayer modes? What about the Theater mode, Forge, campaign scoring with skulls, the party system, Bungie.net integration, in Halo 3?

    I would agree there aren't many 'bullet point' innovations in Bioshock, but its main innovation was in its plot, and the way it pulled the rug from under the player in the Ryan cutscene, bringing the players own limitations to light, as part of the story itself.




    So wrong,GTA 4 and Halo 3 lacked innovation and were just more polished and expanded recycled sequels that borrowed from other games as well,while Bioshock,admittedly built on System Shock's foundations,was more innovative than both,not just the plot,but gameplay-wise.

    ALL the aforementioned ''innovations'' in GTA4 and Halo 3 were either nothing new or just slightly or totally superfluous,except maybe the phone integration and the Theater Mode.

    MGS 4 will probably continue to trail Splinter's Cell's advanced gameplay mechanics,but the indefinitively more interesting story,dialogue,characterisation,settings,art design and so on have always been MGS's pull.And the controls look expanded AND simplified.

    The review sounds like nirvana for MGS's fans or any intelligent adult gamer and movie-lover.After the reviews of Mass Effect,Ninja Gaiden 2 and MGS 4,i still can't understand how Eurogamer score the games.This trio was heavily marked down just for nothing,some cheapness(artificial difficulty,although the reviewer might be wrong-i will know in week's time) and long cutscenes respectively.While Bioschock,Halo 3 and GTA4 were awarded 10/10s for having more serious faults than the previous trio.

  • monkie_king #1236 4 years ago

    Do MGS fans tend to be the kind of people who like FF games/Jap RPGs generally?

  • DjFlex52 #1237 4 years ago

    Do MGS fans tend to be the kind of people who like FF games/Jap RPGs generally?

    probably not...there are no 90 minute cutscenes in FF/Jap RPGs games ;)

  • miufs #1238 4 years ago

    Honestly... Why do people even bother about reviews?

    Isnt our personal opinion that REALLY matters?
    I remember NBA JAM EXTREME being knocked down by all critics and yet was one of the most addicting games i´ve ever played and still play!

    I´m sure i´ll love MGS4 to death, may the reviews be 1 or 10. And thats the bottom line...

    F*CK reviews, F*CK system wars. Just PLAY your damn games!

  • dahsif #1239 4 years ago

    I want to be a part of ths thread too.

    Also, regardless of the score (which may or may not be jutified, and since I haven't played the game, I'll just STFU for now) the inconsistent and incoherent wording of the review makes it rather...untrustworthy.

  • Drpwnage #1240 4 years ago

    Steady Mainaman,

    "The review sounds like nirvana for MGS's fans": YES absolutely.

    "or any intelligent adult gamer and movie-lover": NO I classify myself in this bracket, having read the various reviews of MGS 4, all the aspects that I never liked about the original MGS remain and are amplified further. Attraction to MGS4 will not change for non-fans it is still a marmite game!

  • mgillespie #1241 4 years ago

    Hmm, looks like Eurogamer have a hidden agenda going on here. Did they get their biggest Xbot to review this game? I think they did...

    http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...

  • mgillespie #1242 4 years ago

    Hmm, looks like Eurogamer have a hidden agenda going on here. Did they get their biggest Xbot to review this game? I think they did...

    http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...

  • mgillespie #1243 4 years ago

    Hmm, looks like Eurogamer have a hidden agenda going on here. Did they get their biggest Xb0t to review this game? I think they did...

    http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...

  • mgillespie #1244 4 years ago

    Hmm, looks like Eurogamer have a hidden agenda going on here. Did they get their biggest Xb0t to review this game? I think they did...

    http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...

  • mgillespie #1245 4 years ago

    Hmm, looks like Eurogamer have a hidden agenda going on here. Did they get their biggest Xb0t to review this game? I think they did...

    http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...

  • mgillespie #1246 4 years ago

    Hmm, looks like Eurogamer have a hidden agenda going on here. Did they get their biggest Xb0t to review this game? I think they did...

    http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...

  • antony_williams #1247 4 years ago

    This is the game I will buy a PS3 for, couldn't really give a shit about the score :)

  • Duke_Red #1248 4 years ago

    From what I have heared there is 90 minutes in TOTAL of cutscenes. Not 90 mintue cutscenes....

    I do agree it does feel restrictive have so much cutscenes, you just want to play the damn game. But the story is a big part of metal gear.

    What will remain good is the interaction with the enemy soldiers and boss battles, so I know it will be good.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 13:57

  • JonFE #1249 4 years ago

    Snake... SNAKE... EEEEEEIIIIIIIIIGHT!!!!!!
    /credit: kelly's_h

    @Xerx3s:
    Love that fix :) Have you ever considered a job as an editor?

    EDIT:
    Edge magazine awarded MGS4 an 8 too???
    Great minds think alike and all that, I guess...
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 14:13

  • DjFlex52 #1250 4 years ago

    yep, MGS fans are really mature gamers...yikes!
    I didn't see this much "filler" in the H3 and GTA IV threads combined.

    sorry, Duke_Red, Edge says there are 2 cutscenes that are almost 90 minutes EACH.

  • dynarama #1251 4 years ago

    So is this thread longer than the cutscenes or not?

  • goon-uk #1252 4 years ago

    I don't really see what's surprising about this. The reviewer obviously isn't a MGS fanboy. He's just a normal gamer, and a large part of the gaming public don't like to sit through long cut scenes, just like there are gamers who hate the way Final fantasy does the same.

    Games like MGS and FF are bridging the gap between movies and games. I like the approach and enjoy it a hell of a lot. Some people don't. For me the game will be a 10/10 because I know I will like it but for some they hate it? Are they wrong? no, just their opinion but generally MGS4 will get a mixed bag, you will get the IGN, Gamesmaster etc etc reviews written by the fans of the series and the 8/10 ones like this written by the neutral.

  • davisorle #1253 4 years ago

    @Les
    To any of you and whatever. Simply cause most parents know and trust by name and only Sony all kids have a PS console. Im enough of an adult and all the ppl i know my age do have an xbox and no kids or none of their kids either have an Xbox 360. To buy an xbox you need to be able to have an opinion on gaming and consoles. Kids go Sony cause they were born with a PS or a Nintendo. Not an Xbox so they can trust that easily.

    Like i had said before the same way that GTA 4 was dead and knew already Id be bored with it I knew they'd say about MGS. I havent and aparently wopnt even play the game but just according to the article it's what i thought so. Though ofc reviews arent always right so im just talking according to what we all have so far. The review. So dont start bitching to me about being a funboy. Its pathetic already. So really if this game is also not that good... How is Sony going to feel? I mean they got like only 4 games in total as good ( for them ) exclusives they keep bragging about befiore even the console comes out. So what's left for them? Anyways. For once more i feel bad for those who bought it first. Pity to the money. Even if you had it left overs you'd rather spend them to buy some chicks some drinks extra and have a nice wake up in bed with a chick u dont even remember than just for a PS3. Really.

  • Yossarian #1254 4 years ago

    They are bridging the gap between games and bad movies, I agree.

  • MightyMouse #1255 4 years ago

    A 10/10 game shouldn't require an explanation as to how to enjoy it or take it for it to be great. Having said all that I've no doubt that this will be a great game and one that is fondly remembered by anyone who sees it through. And maybe once everyone has played it to death they can come back and re-read the review and then see how they feel.
    Every game requires you to know how to play it, just most of them follow genre conventions to such an extent that it feels natural because you've played similar games so many times before.

    I don't mean to sounds arsey but the idea that art can be properly appreciated without any knowledge of the context of its production is just ridiculous. If you didn't know anything about an artist's methods and intentions then all you could say about a piece is "i like it" or "i don't like it" based upon the most shallow and cursory considerations. This is why reviews by professional videogames critics are generally more worth reading than those by some guy in the street, they have greater knowledge and appreciation of what's important in the game.

  • Widge #1256 4 years ago

    Bloody hell, the ign thread was at 18 pages when I looked yesterday, now up to 48!

    EDIT, for a summary its:

    "This deserved a 10"
    "This deserved MUCH lower, game X is much better than this"
    "something something 360"
    "something something PS3"

    and repeat over 950 posts.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 14:49

  • Kostabi #1257 4 years ago

    /premature
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 14:51

  • Kostabi #1258 4 years ago

    1500!

  • Widge #1259 4 years ago

    nope!

  • EVERYGAMER #1260 4 years ago

    The number we typically receive at the end of reviews is an average of the play experience, and then we average the average with a bunch of other averages from other people using radically different standards and imagine we've discerned some incontrovertible science of truth, and then the people who made the thing are punished or rewarded based on the mercurial output of that calculation. One wonders why any person would willingly subject themselves to these empty, unaccountable mechanisms.

    "Tycho Brahe". Penny Arcade

  • InsoFox #1261 4 years ago

    I think there's a place for games being cinematic. However, I don't necessarily think it's an admirable goal, I think it's much more admirable for games to become better at using their own particular strengths to convey narrative (cf Portal, Bioshock). I that's why Ill never be a huge fan of MGS games.

    But.

    I still like them.

    I think some of the MGS fans need to get some perspective here and realise that not everyone thinks that this approach to making games is the best thing ever.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 15:00

  • Royal Fool #1262 4 years ago

    How do Halo 3 and GTA IV get straight 10s when they're guilty of doing the same thing MGS4 supposedly does: "More of the same", "polishing an already tried-and-true formula," next-gen graphics with last-gen substance"?

    And yet MGS4 only manages an 8. It just feels weird.

    I'm buying it on day one though, I'm not going to have a fit over an arbitrary number someone attached to the end of their review. But this all seems really, really strange. Did EG let the hype/PR pressure get the better of them for the other two games... one wonders.

    At the very least, I'll be a bit more vary of EG's future reviews, especially ones from this Oli Welsh fellow.You're one of my most trusted sources for spot-on criticism, but lately that trust seems to be slowly dissolving.

  • dirigiblebill #1263 4 years ago

    1500 posts. Jesus.

    Does gaming qualify as a religion yet?

  • Duke_Red #1264 4 years ago

    if there are 90 minute cutscenes Dj flex, there are two words for that... fu***ng ridiculous

    Are you sure tht edge wasn't just summising that they were round about that, that sounds extrememly silly

  • NewbieZilla #1265 4 years ago

    "Does gaming qualify as a religion yet?"

    Religion, no. Philosophy, perhaps.

  • BeersOfWar #1266 4 years ago

    Metal Gear Solid 8: The Thread War

  • TheNinkyNonk #1267 4 years ago

    "They are bridging the gap between games and bad movies"

    Nail, head.

    The dialogue is pants, the plot is pure chese and the pacing is dire.

  • Yaz #1268 4 years ago

    Just got my EDGE magazine delivered this morning, they did indeed award this game 8/10.

    However, what caught my eye was the lengthy cutscenes (I know this has been mentioned already, but I'm not sure if this has been quoted here);

    "Nor is it one that seeks to appease the critics, specially those who lost consciousness during hour two of MGS2's finale. The cutscenes here are sure to involke that thousand-yard stare, two in particular coming perilously close to the 90-minute mark. But that's the price of admission - they can be paused and skipped now, but at the cost of half the experience - which for fans will seem more like a gift."

    So it appears the rumours of 90-minute cutscenes were correct. :|

  • captainrentboy #1269 4 years ago

    90 minutes!! Holy Shit, nowadays I only ever get about an hour to play games on any given day, that's crazy.
    Why doesn't ole Kojima just direct a frikkin movie, it's clearly where his passion lies.
    And it's strange, for all the insults 360 fans get for being immature, I don't remember them going on and on and on and on about how wrong EG were for giving Ninja Gaiden 2 a Seven.
    This comments thread pretty much sums up why gamers are still regarded as a bit of a joke. Fucking sad.
    I frequently visit fat Harry's AICN website, a site renowned for having the bitchiest movie geeks in the world leaving comments, and I can't remember any of those basement dwellers going on like this. :) They take some beating.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 16:24

  • NewbieZilla #1270 4 years ago

    It seems the minority here are those of us without time machines.

  • Razz #1271 4 years ago

    Wow. Epic comment thread.

  • NickDude #1272 4 years ago

    Just ordered my uk copy of MGS4 for £30.54 inc delivery. Niiiiiiiice

  • kungphu #1273 4 years ago

    I've not been bothered to check well over 1500 posts but it seems that MGS 4 has had more comments than halo 3,

  • stoic #1274 4 years ago

    I object to eurogamers review. How could 3 pages of text ever do justice to Hideo Kojimas masterpiece? It should be at least 1000 pages long...

  • Lionheart #1275 4 years ago

    1520 COMMENTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! haha


    Controversy at its best!

  • SchumiF1 #1276 4 years ago

    For crying out loud! They should change the score!

  • DAL9000 #1277 4 years ago

    @Nickdude: "Just ordered my uk copy of MGS4 for £30.54 inc delivery. Niiiiiiiice"

    Yes, but where'd you buy it FROM? You can't just say that and then wander off leaving the rest of the world to hunt the price down on their own.

    Well, you CAN, but it's unconscionably cruel. So spill already.

  • captainrentboy #1278 4 years ago

    Arbiter, where did I say that I wasn't including myself in that generic stereotyping of gamers? :/
    I'm just saying that this comments section in particular helps to reinforce the negative image of us gaming folk that some 'outsiders' might have.
    No need for the smarmy reply..
    Although saying that, I do feel I can elevate myself, mentally, above SOME of the folk that have posted on here, silly internet name or not, I don't sit around going absolutely crazy, throwing wild and crazy accuations around, just because a game I'm looking forward to doesn't get what I feel it deserves. (Even though I've yet to play it myself)
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 17:18

  • NickDude #1279 4 years ago

    @Nickdude: "Just ordered my uk copy of MGS4 for £30.54 inc delivery. Niiiiiiiice"

    Yes, but where'd you buy it FROM? You can't just say that and then wander off leaving the rest of the world to hunt the price down on their own.

    Well, you CAN, but it's unconscionably cruel. So spill already

    I ordered it from Currys Entertianment (£35) but because I work there as well i get an additional 15% off so it came to £30.34 inc delivery.

  • DAL9000 #1280 4 years ago

    So, this is waaaaaaay off-topic, but a few pages back someone was wondering why Mass Effect only got 8/10 -- said it was dinged "for nothing." Check out the Mass Effect PC review that came out a few days ago for a rebuttal, or just lemme copy-paste the relevant part:

    "Kristan got quite a few Mass Effect fans' backs up by reviewing it primarily as a shooter... but after going through the game, I can see his point."

    And, yes, when you combine the handful of silly design decisions (identikit bases; the Mako was crap; the inventory management was irritating) wiiiiiith the game's pedestrian and uninspiring shooter experience, you can see why a reviewer might ding the game a point or two instead of keeping it a 10/10.

    It's still an awesome game, of course, and I'm EXTREMELY happy with my decision to buy it -- it's just that a sub-10 score is perfectly reasonable and justifiable. But I'm sure that has zero relevance to MGS4 and /its/ score, eh?

  • LightSleeper #1281 4 years ago

    **BREAKING NEWS** There's a rumour that plans for David Blaine's next endurance stunt - 'Sleep Deprivation' - have been altered, and may indeed incorporate an extra element of risk, namely to sit through ALL of the cut-scenes in the videogame Metal Gear Solid 4 without skipping, and subsequently attempt to read through ALL of the comments in the Eurogamer website MGS4 review thread without passing out.

    When questioned, he told reporters "I don't comment on rumours or speculation", but later on a statement released by his press office said that "David has always tried to push the limits of human endeavour, and any new challenge that presents itself will obviously be taken into account." A doctor from Harvard Medical School, who did not want to be named, was quoted to have said "while I applaud his previous feats of magic and endurance, the physiological effects of such deliberate inducement of lack of sleep, combined with the effects on the (brain's) temporal lobe that the cut scenes will cause, may well take their toll and prove irredeemably harmful."

  • DAL9000 #1282 4 years ago

    @Arbiter: "It's all very well blowing off the idea of 90 minute cut-scenes, but thats a fuckload of work!"

    You know what else was a fuckload of work to make? Daikatana. Does that mean we should've liked it?

    EDIT: No, I'm not saying MGS4 will be as bad as Daikatana. But I /am/ saying that I don't really give a flying fuck how much hard work was put in to a game. I care about whether I personally find the end result enjoyable. In the case of MGS4, skippable cutscenes (hooray!) mean that I'll probably buy the game when I pick up a PS3... but if the cutscenes /weren't/ skippable I would've avoided it like the plague.

    So, uh, what I'm gettin' at here is this: I personally tend to think the MGS games would be better off with more gameplay and fewer cutscenes. If Kojima worked /less/ hard, by producing /fewer/ hideously long cutscenes, I'd actually be happier with the final product.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 17:38

  • Daymare #1283 4 years ago

    "They are bridging the gap between games and bad movies"

    I think it's rather unfair to look, judge and/or compare MGS cutscenes as/with (bad) movies, since they're most certainly *not* a movie - we are yet to see how the movie would (will?) turn out to be.

    MGS is what it is: a rather unique series od digital entertainment with such a wild and expansive story/stories (not that I'm an expert; I played only the 2 and the 3rd part), that they can't express it any other way then with a more "traditional" (filmic) narrative. But that doesn't mean it's bad just because it's a mutation/combination of two forms ( I think film will always in a way cast a shadow over games, as a medium) and that it should lean completely to the gaming side and/or become a movie. Some people appreciate what it is, some people don't; end of story. I, for one, love the combination and have no problem sitting through 90 minutes cutscenes, if they (and the bosses!) are on the same level of awsomness as they were in MGS3:)

  • defdaz #1284 4 years ago

    As good as Gears then?

  • Psychotext #1285 4 years ago

    Arbiter: You do know that there's 6 official playstation magazine scores given in your list right?

    Other than that... you've been in here since the start. What's the point? Stop defending the game and replay one of the old MGS games while you wait rather than arguing with people on here to no effect.

  • kangarootoo #1286 4 years ago

    Surely the longest thread I've ever seen on EG, except I can't see it, 'cos something in the site has buggered up. I hope you are all behaving yourselves in there.

    All I have to contribute is... "you can't call it a cut-scene, it's an entire film in its own right, and a deeply boring one too". Hehe, hits the MGS nail squarely on the head. With that bit of flame baiting cheek, I shall exit. I'm sure this game will sell a few PS3s, which can only benefit anyone who already owns one (including me). So I'm happy to see this game out there, even if I myself likely won't play it any time soon.

  • miiiguel #1287 4 years ago

    Funny the EDGE review, the one that matters and shit.

    Anyway, the so called urbanism and maturity from PS-fanatics (yes you all prooved to be loony fanatics!), is clearly visible in this thread!

    example: " MGS is not all that, ok..., ok..., but 360 is for fats, and, and, americans, and oh god! shit!, small people, oh my god! why oh why!??"

    Good job!

    /claps slowly and in utter shame.../
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 18:39

  • DAL9000 #1288 4 years ago

    Miiguel: honestly, dude, if you're going to try to antagonize the PS3 fanboys, do it on a Spanish-language site. Your English is too clunky and awkward for you to be effective here. It's sad but true.

  • DAL9000 #1289 4 years ago

    But all I'm saying, Arbiter, is that /I don't care/ how much work the team put in to make the game. I care whether I enjoy it. If the team worked hard to make a game that's not for me, I probably /won't/ consider it "a wonderful achievement" -- because it's failed to entertain me. (Or, in the case of MGS games, because it wastes so much time on boring crap when it could be using that time TO entertain me. DEAR HIDEO KOJIMA: MORE GAMEPLAY PLS, AND FEWER CUTSCENES. THX.)

    But what's interesting to me is that you're willing to say, "Eh, diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks. Your opinions are just as valid as mine." to /me/, but you're not willing to apply that logic to the review. Why?

  • Daymare #1290 4 years ago

    "Bottom line is this: Sometimes you need to accept a thing on its own merits, not on what YOU hoped it was going to be."

    Bottom line is this: Sometimes you need to accept a score of a review of a game you haven't played yet and not whine and bitch two days in a row just because it's not what YOU hoped it was going to be.

  • des #1291 4 years ago

    From Playstation.com forums:

    "WOW if MGS2 & MGS3 got a 8 WHY does MGS4 have a 8 ??? all websites should just rescore GTAIV that's why there giving MGS4 a low score this is BS think god i don't have so c4 or i would kill everyone that gave MGS4 a low score & GarbageTrashAsswipeIV watered down GTA SA a 10 is just me are is money being paid out ??? GTAIV got like 25 TEN'S people are freaking stupid & are blinded by money & knowing 10 million 10 year old kids would buy GTAIV & half a million adults would so lets give it a 10 BS man i want to blow up there company HQ wish C4"

    He is pretty mad,don't you think?

  • DAN.E.B #1292 4 years ago

    SDF

    LOL!!!!!!!!!

  • The-Bodybuilder #1293 4 years ago

    So......
    What ya'll think of the MGS 4 review?

  • Duke_Red #1294 4 years ago

    I think we just have to accept that there will be lengthy cut scenes, and this eems to be the case with them since the PS1 (excluding the MSX etc) and enjoy them for whaT THEY ARE

  • Sevens #1295 4 years ago

    "Even keen students of Metal Gear lore are going to struggle to follow this tangled tale. Laden with sentimental sermons and metaphors for the evils of war, struggling under the weight of the resolving the plots of four previous games and the personal destinies of characters as diverse as Raiden, Meryl, Naomi, Vamp and Eva, it is in all honesty a mess. Motivation and consistency fall by the wayside and by the end it's totally unclear who is on which side, or what's at stake. Maybe that's deliberate, but it doesn't work, and the hours of talking-head exposition involved are too steep a price to pay for this muddled closure."

    "You're sorry to see Snake go. But should you be? Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it. It just burrows deeper into what fans love and detractors hate than ever before, and it will make few converts. It's a crying shame, given how many genuinely classic gaming moments there are here, given the countless exquisite creative touches, but Metal Gear Solid 4 is its own worst enemy. You could not ask for a funnier, cleverer, more ambitious or inspired or over-the-top conclusion to the Metal Gear Solid series, but it's definitely time to move on.

    We love you, Snake. Don't come back."

    That should explain why 2 points went MIA. Mr. Welsh has a short attention span. Fortunately some people do actually pay attention: http://ww w.metacritics.com/games/platfor...
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 19:47

  • The-Bodybuilder #1296 4 years ago

    Some of you lot are pathetic, none more so than arbiter (who is an abomination to gaming).

  • #1297 4 years ago

    Seems its doing well in reviews on other sites.. Metacritic scores it 97.

  • Stoatboy #1298 4 years ago

    @swam: The great console war? Ha ha ha! That's priceless. Where does it fit in the scheme of things - is it worse than the first world war? How about the Mongol hordes? World War 2 perhaps? Utterly ludicrous.

    There is no war - it's just a few companies selling competing products. This is one review of many, for one game out of hundreds, for one of those products. It matters so little in the scheme of things as to be inconsequential. Even the major Sony shareholders - the only people who stand to gain if Sony "win" this "war" - care less about this review score than you do.

    Thanks for the laugh though. Great console war indeed...

  • squarepusher #1299 4 years ago

    fucking hell fire...

  • SchumiF1 #1300 4 years ago

    Well, it's obvious this review stirred up a lot of s*it! It's almost as if EuroGamer is trying to get attention by giving reviews that create massive arguments.

  • rob230 #1301 4 years ago

    Arguing about computer games on teh internetz \o/

    love it
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 20:59

  • dahsif #1302 4 years ago

    This is great:
    The lower the score=>The lower the expectations=>the more chances I'll get blown away.

    One post closer to 2000.

  • monkie_king #1303 4 years ago

    Did anyone see that it got an 8 in Edge? Also in this month's issue, 8s for Lost Winds and Boom Blox, 5 for Haze, and a 9 for GRID.
    Edited by 1 at 31/05/08 @ 21:47

  • bad09 #1304 4 years ago

    Come on PS3 fanboys keep the great comedy coming some of this stuff is priceless even good old swam is back for a go, besides we have to break 2000!! I'll help....

    Splinter Cell is better than MGS.......

  • macksed #1305 4 years ago

    mmm, i like splinter cell... i've never really tried MGS. shame splinter cell is a 360 exclusive this gen... we could do with a good stealth action game :(

  • BartonFink #1306 4 years ago

    \o/ swam is back to add a bit of comedy to the fray.

  • tonynibbles #1307 4 years ago

    Jesus titty fucking christ.

    The GTA IV review notched up 930 odd comments in just over a month.

    Halo 3 got a review and managed to rack up 1200 comments in 9 months.

    The MGS4 review hits Eurogamer and clocks up over 1500 comments in less than 38 hours.

  • macksed #1308 4 years ago

    ...and counting

  • monkie_king #1309 4 years ago

    They've really been coming out of the woodwork. It's almost as if certain individuals' self-worth is tied to the review score of a game they've never played.

  • macksed #1310 4 years ago

    i've only had my ps3 8 days, surely i should feel dissapointed or something? - but im feeling a bit indifferent ... ah well i have GTA IV, and just got assassins creed on a weeks rent, and lots of demos... actually - i'm happy :D

  • Pho-Zoon #1311 4 years ago

    Wow. 1500 comments because of The Eight.

    Humans are awesome.

  • bad09 #1312 4 years ago

    @ macksed

    You shouldn't be disappointed with an 8 I'm sure it's still an awesome game for a MGS fan. I watched the new trailer on PSN yesterday and it looks awesome can't wait even if it is a nine. If you are new to PS3 you should try Uncharted, great game!

  • JonFE #1313 4 years ago

    Bloodkult
    Picard to the rescue...

    /shamelessly copied from Retroid's comment a couple of pages back

  • Les #1314 4 years ago

    "At least he's striving to do something different and challenging."

    And that's exactly what some people (and EG in particular) hate. Just remake yesterday's games indefinetely with prettier graphics. That's more than enough to keep them happy...

  • Negotiator #1315 4 years ago

    The biggest release exclusive for PS3 this year and it only gets an 8, if I had a PS3 and I don't but if I did I'd be pissed. All PS3 arse heads are saying an 8 is a good score, it is but not for this game. This is the big PS3 exclusive game and it comes up short, sorry arse heads but this must be hard times, first Haze and now this, oh dear.

  • Xerx3s #1316 4 years ago

    w00t! Swam is back! I missed his deluded small minded posts. They just make my petty life feel a bit better.

  • TRACTORBOY1971 #1317 4 years ago

    HELP HELP HELP!!!!! - this is not really about MGS 4, it is about playing MGS 3 Snake eater on my PS3.

    I have read about 1 & 2 so I thought I would play 3, (saw it in blockbuster for £3.99). But I cannot get it to work, everytime I select new game, it takes me back to the start menu.......I have the 60GB launch console, so please someone help me!!!!!!! please!!!!! please

  • Chufty #1318 4 years ago

    Make console love not console war

  • chris_ace #1319 4 years ago

    Post deleted at 11:55:13 13-12-2011

  • Stoatboy #1320 4 years ago

    "At least he's striving to do something different and challenging.

    And that's exactly what some people (and EG in particular) hate. Just remake yesterday's games indefinetely with prettier graphics. That's more than enough to keep them happy..."


    Doing something different and challenging is only worthwhile if, at the end of the day, it's also GOOD.

    Having said that, almost all the problems the review points out are things MGS has always been guilty of. The new stuff IIRC is lauded in the review. The boring, stuck-in-its-way baggage is what it generally got marked down for.

  • LightSleeper #1321 4 years ago

    Ryuichi Sakamoto, Takeshi Kitano, Akira Kurosawa, Kimiko Date, Takuma Sato, Sailor Moon, Emperor Hirohito, Sonny Chiba, Pikachu, Mr Miyagi, Yoko Ono, Can you hear me? Your game took one hell of a beating!

  • Sevens #1322 4 years ago

    "The biggest release exclusive for PS3 this year and it only gets an 8, if I had a PS3 and I don't but if I did I'd be pissed. All PS3 arse heads are saying an 8 is a good score, it is but not for this game. This is the big PS3 exclusive game and it comes up short, sorry arse heads but this must be hard times, first Haze and now this, oh dear."

    Oh, it came up short? By whose standards? Yours? Apparently you barely know what you are talking about. And if you base your 'opinion' on one review you are pretty ignorant, or worse. Check metacritics now and in a couple of weeks. That aside, the best thing would be if you came up short. An "arse head" short. If you knew what you were talking about, and you don't, but if you did, you wouldn't post such nonsense.

    The reason people 'come out of the woods' is that MGS games are an exceptional kind. Deeper and more complex than the average blockbuster and with fans as loyal as those of old school rpgs, however greater in numbers. It's not necessarily the score but passages of the review that appear to be highly controversial, intentionally so, probably. But then again when GTA scores a perfect 10 one has to - preliminary - wonder about an 8 for GoP.

    edit:

    spelling
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 00:23

  • Chupakun #1323 4 years ago

    Okay, perhaps I'm not exactly literati, but I'm quite sure that magnum opus means that it's the best work for this particular auteur. Yeah, about that.

    With most other reviews proclaiming it as one of the best ever, I think it's good to have someone level-headed talk about the things that many gloss over. With that said, looking past some of the more vitriolic comments by the reviewer, it's possible to see that this game is an achievement unlike any other. Whether or not I'll agree with him will be decided when I actually play the game, but there is no doubt that MGS4 will be a game for the ages.

    If there is any contention I have with the score is that it doesn't reflect the tone of the review. I am not the one judging the game, but I was expecting a 9. A 10 would mean perfection and that is, being fair and unbiased by hype, impossible. MGS will forever contain those polarising kinks and often the difference in scores is attributed to it by those who love these quirks and those who are loth of them.

    I consider Eurogamer offering a 10 as a sign of giving into hype and being inundated with the fetish one normally associates with fanboys. As such, this was a respectable score and an enlightening review for a game that is impossible to apply convention to.



  • monkie_king #1324 4 years ago

    Let us make absolutely clear that a 10 is not and probably never will be "the perfect game". There's always something criticisable about a game, however small.

    Eight is that tricky "almost brilliant" category, that for fans of the genre in most cases will still warrant serious recommendation to go out and buy ... There may be stand out moments spoiled by badly judged difficulty spikes, or numerous other minor and niggly factors that gang up and chip off another mark.

  • grayn #1325 4 years ago

    @TRACTORBOY1971 - er, are you pressing X to start a new game? You need to press O...

    (You also need to save often, as I found it would irretrievably freeze up all the time on my PS3)

  • gohda #1326 4 years ago

    In A.D. 2101 war was beginning

  • smelly #1327 4 years ago

    @Swam:

    Are you fucking retarded?

    Would you rather the review just said all the good things about the game and gave it 10/10 so you could wank yourself into a coma about how much better your choice in console purchase is over another one?

    Wouldnt you PREFER a REVIEW (you know it's SUPPOSED to highlight good AND bad things), of a game told you the bad points as well as the good?

    Wouldn't you RATHER knowing that it has problems (such as install times, lengthy boring cut scenes, etc) than be told it's the best thing ever?

    Especially if that means you save your money not buying it? Not that you would save your money because you'd rush out and buy it like a good little sony fanboy even if it was a 6 hour long movie which occasionally said "please press the X button to continue"

  • smelly #1328 4 years ago

    @Negotiator:

    FFS.. If it isnt sad fucks on one side of the fence.. its sad fucks like you on the other.

    This thread is depressing me.. It's a reminder that all gamers seem to be sad fucks.

  • JonFE #1329 4 years ago

    Bloodkult, you're welcome... and I agree...

  • bilbot #1330 4 years ago

    Reviews have changed. They're no longer about reasonable views, or objectivity. They're not even about independent thoughts, justification, or consistency. They're an endless series of pissing contests, fought by ignorant and egotistical journalists.

    Reviews, and their vast consumption of human intellect, have become an irrational, depleted source of reliability.

    Reviews have changed. ID-tagged journalists carry ID-tagged websites, use ID-tagged review scores. Illogical opinions inside their minds enhance and regulate their actions.

    Hype control... Information control... Opinion control... Message board control. Everything is monitored, and kept under control.

    Reviews have changed. The age of journalism reliance is now the age of control, averting catastrophe from reasonable review scores. And he who controls the message boards, controls history.

    Reviews have changed. When the message boards are under total control, mandatory criticism becomes routine.


    http://ww w.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php...
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 01:19

  • GamesConnoisseur #1331 4 years ago

    I have foolishly started from the first page of the comments at 10 30 pm tonight and have given over almost 3 hours of my life reading through each page of the posts!

    Why did I do that? I thought this is a landmark moment as a EG reader and a gamer when it concerns an important title such as MSG4 (whether I or others have PS3 console or not). The numbers of the posts just alone in a few days is a proof of that, is also the same for majority of the posters who participated!

    There was a lot of highs and lows in the past three hours, guffawed at the attempts to fool people into refresh their cache to see if score indeed been adjusted up to 9! Raptures at the EG membership card being ripped off by Apologie (suspect he/she/it will be back under a new name). The heartbreakings of the 'oh the humanity' at the numbers of posts from the rabid loons!

    There were a lot of sensible posts but still the same streams of tired old comments being thrown around by different people. 99 percent of people who posted havent actually played the game right? And yet over 1500 comments?

    I know I will buy and enjoy the game irrespectively of having spent up to 3 hours reading the comments. Subjective and Objective will continue to be topic of the arguments years down the road, just keep your own head with something that is only meant to entertains you! At the end of the day its still just a game!! Would we have the same utterances of the blind loyalty and hates for say either Warner Bros versus New Line Cinema regarding the quality of a film against another film? Even when people havent yet seen them?!
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 01:36

  • Stoatboy #1332 4 years ago

    Re: "Reviews have changed... blah blah rhubarb bollocks..."

    Utter fuckwitted gobshite is still utter fuckwitted gobshite though, thankfully. What the fucking fuck had that stream of disjointed, illogical, badly-worded, nonsensical, gibberish have to do with anything? If there was a prize for least-coherent drivel on the internet that would be in with a bloody good shout, and that's saying something all things considered.

    Please post more, I'm easily amused. :)

  • smelly #1333 4 years ago

    And yet again GamesConnoisseur makes me want to marry him

  • DjFlex52 #1334 4 years ago

    And yet again GamesConnoisseur makes me want to marry him


    I don't know if I'd go that far, smelly, but he gets a +1 from me :)

  • bilbot #1335 4 years ago

    @ stoatboy don't blow a gasket mate.
    http://im g267.imageshack.us/img267/4674/...

  • Nillsens #1336 4 years ago

    @ Stoatboy

    Might want to review one of the MGS4 trailers again, it'll shed some light ;)

  • GamesConnoisseur #1337 4 years ago

    Smelly...sorry I am already married!

    Yeah this game is important to us gamers whether we have PS3 or not, just see the delights of X360 owners! IS it that important in the overall content of life?!!

    /Pondering how many hours of my life I have 'wasted' on the games and would that makes me a hypocrite for belittling our hobby?!

  • brutal #1338 4 years ago

    1558th.

    like, wtf?

  • InsoFox #1339 4 years ago

    @Arbiter

    Perhaps it's not that basic competence is more important than 'extraordinaryness' (however you define that). Maybe it's that lots of the latter doesn't necessarily excuse a lack of the former.

    Let me put it this way. I think this is a thing about japanese game design philosophy in general. There are people who absolutely love the way the japanese do game design. There are people who really can't get past some issues with it. And then there are people like me who love just -enough- about japanese gaming to forgive some recurring design issues.

    I guess the design issues I'm talking about (and some of these may or not refer to MGS because my experience of the games is limited) are things that seem to be holdovers from bygone ages which make me wish that they would stop putting them in just because it's always been that way.

    Stuff like save points in games that would be better without them. Ditto for random battles in some RPGs. And - yes - massive, great periods of non-interactivity in the form of story exposition/cut scenes. Even in the days of the graphic adventure, Lucasarts never had cutscenes as long as many japanese games I've played, and some people might love that - but many don't.

    There are other holdovers too, but those are some things I can think of off the top of my head. When I played Metroid Prime 3, it was my first Metroid game. Even without playing the others, or the 2D ones, I could tell that it had tried to grow up as a series, and it wanted to be taken more seriously than previous games. So when I was gleefully walking around a friendly base, with doors that required you to SHOOT them open, I instantly knew that this was just something that had been in Metroid games for years, and they've just kept going with. A few days later, Super Metroid confirmed this. I'm going somewhere with this, honestly.

    I'm not saying that it's a bad thing that you had to shoot the doors to open them. I'm just saying that for someone who had been a Metroid fan since day 1, the door shooting thing probably didn't even register as odd to them when playing the latest in the series. It would have been more strange to them to see doors opened in a more conventional way. They're used to all the quirks, and so don't have the same perspective as someone who isn't a big fan, or who might have this as their first Metroid game.

    And so it may be with MGS4. Perhaps someone who is not a mega-mgs fan is better placed to notice lapses that the big fans will either not care about through getting used to them or even find quite comforting because they've been present since the very beginning. But just because they're used to them, or don't care about them, doesn't mean they're not there. And a reviewer is perfectly entitled to take issue with them, no matter how extraordinary the rest of the experience is.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 02:52

  • DjFlex52 #1340 4 years ago

    /Pondering how many hours of my life I have 'wasted' on the games and would that makes me a hypocrite for belittling our hobby?!

    @GamesConnoisseur

    If you get enjoyment out of playing games, then it's not wasted time, GC.
    Nah, I don't think you're belittling the hobby as much as you are pointing out the immaturity of too many adult gamers nowadays.

    edit: @InsoFox +1
    wow, 2 insightful posts on 1 page...it may be a record on this thread ;)
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 02:58

  • tnomad #1341 4 years ago

    hmm

  • Stoatboy #1342 4 years ago

    @bilbot, Nillsens: Hehe - I'm guessing my lack of MGS4 knowledge has done for me here. I've only been popping in to this thread to point at wrong-headed fuckwits posting drivel, so there's a good chance I've misjudged that one.

    Apologies if that's the case (and keep up the good work). :)

    My comment probably still mostly applies to the dialogue in MGS instead though... ;)

  • Isere #1343 4 years ago

    Please leave Eurogamer alone people.

    They're just trying to get the page hits they would otherwise have got from a 360VsPS3 faceoff for the game. Its not about being loyal to the readers or somesuch. Its just not good business you see.

    Those looking for a credible review, please look elsewhere.
    Edited by 2 at 01/06/08 @ 17:48

  • Toonster #1344 4 years ago

    Little children are dying in Ethiopia and ice caps are going to be responsible for your grandchildren's trouble and strife, and all you people can do is shit your pants over how this should have gotten one measly point added to the score. May you never have children, for their sake.

  • Cataferal #1345 4 years ago

    I cant be bothered to read the last 1500 posts. Can someone fill me in?

  • DAL9000 #1346 4 years ago

    @InsoFox: If you want a Japanese game that cuts down on random battles, enormous huge great cutscenes, and all that jazz, may I recommend Persona 3 for your PS2? I'm playing it right now, and it's /superbly/ polished and enjoyable -- plus I'm about 14 hours in and, outside of the introduction, I've only seen one actual cutscene -- which lasted for about three minutes, tops.

    It's a JRPG with most of the fat trimmed off, and it's a solid 9 for me. The only thing that stops it short of being a 10 is that it does have SOME archaic elements (a save-point system would be one of them) aaaaaaaaaand I'm not really a huge fan of the anime-heavy visual style. Plus some plot threads, as near as I can tell thus far, don't actually GO anywhere, which makes me sad on the inside.

    But those really are minor niggles -- the actual gameplay experience is /superb/, and I can recommend it without the slightest hesitation. It actually reminds me in an odd way of Dead Rising, in that... uh... in... that... I think it would be best if I just end this post right here before it turns into a 25-page essay.

  • DAL9000 #1347 4 years ago

    @Cataferal:

    Apologie stormed off, swearing he was leaving EG forever. Everybody else threw a small but heartfelt party when they heard the news. One dude posted some copypasta in memoriam, which was quite entertaining.

    Other than that, you didn't miss much. The SDF was out in force, though, much to the amusement of the sane people.

  • MyPointIs #1348 4 years ago

    I remember when MGS4 was given an 8/10.

    Those were the days.

  • MyPointIs #1349 4 years ago

    Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it. It just burrows deeper into what fans love and detractors hate than ever before, and it will make few converts. It's a crying shame. Snake, don't come back.

    9/10

    /fixed

  • MGG #1350 4 years ago

    @Isere - aww, whats wrong? Did the fanboyz fav game get an average review? Aww diddums, oh you've dropped your dummy.....


    Prat. Grow up and get a life. Its one persons opinion - if you don't like it, what does it really matter? You sound like you are going to buy the game anyway, so why slag off the reviewer and allege underhand reasons? Maybe, just maybe, MGS is the most over-rated game since Halo? Possible, eh?

  • zerotm #1351 4 years ago

    Love it or hate it huh?

    So basically this review is a biased piece of crap.

    8/10? Bullshit.

  • DanWhitehead #1352 4 years ago

    @Arbiter

    Bottom line is this: Sometimes you need to accept a thing on its own merits, not on what YOU hoped it was going to be. This is at the heart of what I was saying to danwhitehead about critics putting themselves ahead of the games they review.

    Trouble is, as soon as you start accepting a thing on its own merits, you pretty much remove all room for serious criticism. A thing only has value when measured against similar things and against your own expectations and opinions. That's the very basis of criticism. What you're arguing for is the absence of critical thought.

    By this logic, every half-baked movie adaptation ever made should score highly because all it needs to do is give people the chance to move their favourite characters around on the screen. All those shovelware sequels should be immune from criticism because they're just giving people what they want.

    You can rationalise anything by using your argument. It has nothing to do with "critics putting themselves ahead of the games they review". It sounds like you really have no interest in actual criticism of a game, and just want to be told what happens when you play it - something that you can easily discover for yourself.

    Why even read a review if not to find out what the reviewer thought?

    @DAL9000

    But what's interesting to me is that you're willing to say, "Eh, diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks. Your opinions are just as valid as mine." to /me/, but you're not willing to apply that logic to the review. Why?

    Exactly.

  • GregorV #1353 4 years ago

    Any review is biased by definition, it is an opinion.

  • ta1snake #1354 4 years ago

    Bullshit review.

  • Enzeru #1355 4 years ago

    is the game as confusing as this review? '_.

  • macksed #1356 4 years ago

    1579th!!!
    .
    ... and this is one of the more sensible/intelligent comments on this review.
    Poor mankind :(
    /pats mankind on head

  • Daymare #1357 4 years ago

    Arbiter's rants about objectivity are one of the most ironic things to come out od this thread, really. He constantly fails to grasp the obvious fact that his complains (and, mostly, his reasons for complaining) are so far removed from this elusive concept of objectivity he's banging on about, that everything he says is instantly devalued.

    Objectivity/subjectivity subject (problem, more like) is really not that simple as he appears to believe or wants to believe to suit his own, very subjective needs and views. I would really love to read his own "objective review" of MGS4 (you know, when the game actually comes out and he has played it): I'd either die of boredom while reading it or laugh at his utter failing to be objective, I'm sure.

    Informed, clearly stated and literary expressed opinion is what I'm after in a review. I can get "objectivity" by reading a feature list on the back of the box.

  • timberwolf #1358 4 years ago

    this thread is fun plus big boss is still alive... er or ocelot is a big boss clone or you actually play another of big boss' clones not snake... or snake is the last boss of the game following an epic rex vs ray battle in outer heaven or mg arsenal. can't wait... to be fantastically confused. LOVE IT!

  • knocker #1359 4 years ago

    In an alterntaive reality

    "Metal Gear Solid is a complete waste of time. The cut scenes end up being the main event - and aren't a game in any case. A load of rubbish, pretentious overblown and badly written. More fun watching Eastenders."

    10/10

    Currently 7 comments on this article
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 08:35

  • GordonJ #1360 4 years ago

    Edge 190: 8/10
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 08:42

  • Captain Jax #1361 4 years ago

    Well done EG and EDGE for not giving in to the hype on this one.

    It's an 8/10 (barely) and when the PS3 fanboys are sitting through another interminable cut scene, deep down, they'll know it too.

  • I_AM_THE_DOCTOR #1362 4 years ago

    WTF is wrong with you people???? who cares what EG gave it? You all know that this is going to be one of the greatest games on the market. Other sites will give it 9s and 10s, and don't tell me that you judge a game by reading just one review???? If Halo 3 was given an 8 or even a 7, people wouldn't care, and will still buy and play it till their thumbs get sore, same thing will happen with this game. you all know it. So stop talking shit about this game because you all know deep down inside that this game will be great and will sell like hot cakes.

  • muftak #1363 4 years ago

    "Well done EG and EDGE for not giving in to the hype on this one. "

    but why didn't they with this one ?

    halo 3 didn't deserve a 10 , gta 4 didn't deserve a 10 , bioshock didn't deserve a 10 just a few of over hyped titles that didnt deserve a perfect ten , this brings me to what ive said before EG should have a score out of 100 .

  • Widge #1364 4 years ago

    and I think this from page 2 needs re-iterating:

    Shinji:

    "Okay, ladies, shall we open a book on who's going to be the most excruciatingly annoying by the end of this thread - rabid PS3 fanboys screaming about how a game they've never played should be a 10/10, or vile, childish Xbox 360 fanboys coming along to gloat at a game getting, er, one of the highest scores we can award?

    My money's on the latter - at least the PS3 kids are entertaining."

    who also said that MGS4 is

    "Whoever summed it up as "flawed genius" sounds like they're right on the money. It sounds like the kind of game that can't justify more than 8/10, but which will still - perversely - be one of my favourite games of the year, if not ever.

    A bit like the rest of the Metal Gear series, actually. I can see the flaws that make some people want to hate the entire franchise - but none of them stop it from being - to my mind - some of the best gaming experiences I've ever had. This sounds like more of the same, so roll on June 12th :)"

    So bang on the money really!

  • bad09 #1365 4 years ago

    "halo 3 didn't deserve a 10 , gta 4 didn't deserve a 10 , bioshock didn't deserve a 10 just a few of over hyped titles that didnt deserve a perfect ten , this brings me to what ive said before EG should have a score out of 100 ."

    Still so many fools crying this rubbish this on this comedy thread!

    YOU feel they didn't deserve that score THE REVIEWER (and many people including me!) did and I'm sure MANY will agree, when it's actually out and all the cry babies will ACTUALLY PLAY IT, with MGS4's 8 (even me a MGS fan), just because YOU don't agree with a review doesn't make it wrong, besides a review can't really be right or wrong as it's just one opinion.

    Grow up people for the love of God!
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 10:36

  • des #1366 4 years ago

    I give MGS4.... 7/10

  • Widge #1367 4 years ago

    Jesus christ, people still swanning about with "I didn't think game x got a 10, and this one didn't and I did!" CHRIST.

    In this guys opinion, he gives the game an 8. IN HIS OPINION. By the same stretch, in your opinion, other games don't deserve a 10. By the same stretch, the bod who reviewed on IGN UK (who contributes to this site before you jip in with "WELL THATS NOT A RELIABLE SOURCE" balls) decided it was a 9.9. There is going to be some people out there who think this is just more of the same old balls, to them its a 5. This is the world of opinion!

    Anyone looking to wave this around as a weapon in the "your system is shit/great" war is having a futile time. We're almost at 1600 pages of futility here. You all know if you're going to love this or not, roll on the 12th so we can all enjoy it!

    And what is this EG doesn't like MGS rubbish? They love it!

  • Widge #1368 4 years ago

    When is the next big game on either system out? I'm going to code an auto-comment macro so people can spend their time thinking about clouds and kittens instead.

  • bad09 #1369 4 years ago

    @ Widge

    The next biggie will be GOW2. PLEASE EG, PLEASE give it a 10 even if it doesn't deserve it the SDF will explode if gears get more than MGS4

    / kneels and prays for 10/10

  • Xerx3s #1370 4 years ago

    Anyway, I - and that goes for 99% of you lot as well - don't know if this game is 8/10, 10/10 or 1/10. I haven't played it so I'm really in no position to judge. It's something every person should make up for themselves. The reviewer thought it was 8/10, which in my book is a very good, must buy score.

    Wtf are we all moaning about? If you have a ps3, buy the fucking game and be happy.

  • BremXJones #1371 4 years ago

    This is amazing.

    KG

  • Wash #1372 4 years ago

    I find it amusing that the word bias is being thrown around by a bunch of folks who havent even played the game, yet are willing to blindly say its a 10/10.

    In summary, i can't believe a word of what they say - so MGS4 must be dog shit, for they are the bias ones.

    I also wanted to add to this thread.

  • Retroid #1373 4 years ago

    Sweet Zombie Jayzus.... this is just *made* for one of Shawn Elliot's 'Heroes of the Web'; all that's missing is someone getting outraged that Sonic kissed a human girl :)

    8/10 is a good score

    Reviews are just opinions when it comes down to it and I've disagreed with many in my time, but it's always more interesting to read about what someone perceives as flaws in a game which most other publications (a good number of them with a vested interest as single-format, don't forget) are hailing as pretty much perfect.

    Hell, we all know it's easy to get caught up in the hype for something, to love it, and only later on think "well..... that bit wasn't as good as it should've been, and this other thing...".

    I'd rarely trust a single reviewer's opinion, it's about reading what others think of the games too.

  • Wash #1374 4 years ago

    Konami dictating reviews?

    [link url=http://multiplayerblog.mtv.com/2008/05/30/ possible-mgs4-review-limits/
    ]http://mu ltiplayerblog.mtv.com/2008/05/3...[/link]

  • MightyMouse #1375 4 years ago

    @bad09

    The point about halo3 et al being given 10's is that a few months later the reviewers themselves realised that they'd just given in to the hype and that the games weren't that good...

  • bad09 #1376 4 years ago

    Wash I think the reason is more the installs than long cut scenes, fans love the long scenes but the chapter installs will put people off. I just watched Plyr on Bravo and they had some cheeky shots of this install screen and the install do take about 20 min that could become very annoying. I must admit I'm not looking forward to getting into the game only to go do something else while I have to wait 20 mins for the game to continue. This slow BR drive for gaming is really a bad thing, I don't mind an install (although it is annoying on a console) but installing throughout the game is taking it too far.

    I wonder how many chapters installs there are. To be honest this alone make MGS4 8/10 for me before any gameplay/cutscenes come into consideration.

  • bad09 #1377 4 years ago

    @ MightyMouse

    BUT WHO CARES????? Halo3 was easily a 10/10 for me sure but wouldn't cry if it didn't get 10 or if reviewers later thought they were too generous. why do reviewers score matter to you so much. You didn't think Halo3 was a 10 big deal go play anyway it's still an amazing game no matter what some reviewers say and if it's not your thing play something YOU like.

  • Xerx3s #1378 4 years ago

    "The point about halo3 et al being given 10's is that a few months later the reviewers themselves realised that they'd just given in to the hype and that the games weren't that good..."

    Errr? lol? Funny how you can say that about all those reviewers. Is that fact? have you spoken to all of them? Or is that just wishful thinking?

    And speaking of hype...

  • bad09 #1379 4 years ago

    "The point about MGS4 et al being given 10's is that a few months later the reviewers themselves realised that they'd just given in to the hype and that the games weren't that good...ALL EXCEPT EG & EDGE"

    fixed :)

  • des #1380 4 years ago

    Eurogamer is probably swimming in hate e-mails by now,lol

  • bad09 #1381 4 years ago

    hate e-mails?

    des this is the SDF Oli has pissed off, I'd be more careful starting my car if I were him! I can see him waking up next to the severed HDD of his 360!

  • Progguitarist #1382 4 years ago

    LOL...9.9 review on IGN. Why take away .1? Silly review scores.

  • PlugMonkey #1383 4 years ago

    But the idea that reviewers should form no opinion whatsoever is ludicrous.

    But you can form an objective opinion, based purely on the software before you, or you can form a subjective opinion, based on your preconceived ideas and prejudice. You certainly shouldn't approach a review deciding whether you're going to review the game as a lover or a hater. You should be trying pretty hard not to do either. (I know the author's dilemma here was somewhat tongue in cheek, but so was my reply)

    Obviously remaining utterly objective would not be humanly possible, and so ultimately I read reviews of reviewers whose opinions I value, but the more subjective you get the less useful you're being in trying to inform me. First and foremost I want to know what the game is like. The reviewers personal tastes are of considerably less interest to me.

    As far as people who haven't even played the game yet revising the score given, I agree that that is pretty pathetic.

  • Xerx3s #1384 4 years ago

    "LOL...9.9 review on IGN. Why take away .1? Silly review scores. "

    Isn't that obvious from the comments in this thread?

  • InsoFox #1385 4 years ago

    @Dal9000

    "If you want a Japanese game that cuts down on random battles, enormous huge great cutscenes, and all that jazz, may I recommend Persona 3 for your PS2? I'm playing it right now, and it's /superbly/ polished and enjoyable -- plus I'm about 14 hours in and, outside of the introduction, I've only seen one actual cutscene -- which lasted for about three minutes, tops."

    I love Persona 3. I even like some games that use random battles. FFX springs to mind.

    "But those really are minor niggles -- the actual gameplay experience is /superb/, and I can recommend it without the slightest hesitation. It actually reminds me in an odd way of Dead Rising, in that... uh... in... that... I think it would be best if I just end this post right here before it turns into a 25-page essay."

    Hmm, how so? I can sort of see it in the inevitable passage of time... but it doesn't quite work in the same way. But apart from that I'm not sure how they're similar at all. Anyway, back on topic I think.

  • Azazel #1386 4 years ago

    I knew I sensed a great disturbance in the Force...

  • bad09 #1387 4 years ago

    Isn't it a review a bit like a trial?

    Bloody hell MattDamon I hope you are kidding if not why do you place so much importance on one persons opinion! A Review is a review plain and simple - one persons OPINION.

    How many book/film/album and indeed game reviews do you disagree with!

  • Wyrm #1388 4 years ago

    Until I have PLAYED THE FUCKING THING I can't comment on whether this guy is right or not and neither can any of you lot.

  • InsoFox #1389 4 years ago

    @PlugMonkey

    You're another person who doesn't see the difference between being subjective and being biased:

    Objective: Giving views that can be agreed upon by everyone, since they are factual.
    Subjective: Giving views that are opinion-based, and that other people might disagree with.
    Biased: Giving pre-conceived views, with little to no regard to what is actually in front of you.

    Objective: MGS is a game that contains stealth elements.
    Subjective: The cutscenes are too long and detract from the experience.
    Biased: Well, I hated the previous games and so I knew this was going to be awful before I played it OR the other way around.

    See the difference? The reviewer here isn't being biased. He talks about the previous games, because of COURSE you have to put this one into the context of the rest of the series, but he doesn't let it unduly colour his opinions of what's in MGS4.

    We don't want him to be objective, because that would just be giving a list of facts, which as I've pointed out before, you can do without even playing a game.

    So the only way to get a review going is to be subjective. To be accurate, you give objective facts about the game to give the reader an idea of what it is, and then most of the time should be spent giving your subjective opinions about how well the game elements work.

    You say you want to know what a game is 'like'. Do you mean that you want to know what happens when you play it? In which case, why not just stick to previews and the game website where it's not being written by someone actively setting out to evaluate it? But if you mean you want to know how it is to play, then the only think you're EVER going to get from someone is their subjective opinions on it - and as you pointed out, some reviewers will tally more closely to your own views than others. That's why people have favourite gaming websites.

    And even then (I've said this before, too), you're entitled to disagree... if the reviewer dislikes long cutscenes, say, and you love them, then you know that's one issue he had with the game that won't be bothering you. And vice versa - if there's something he likes that you really don't, you can turn that pro into a con right before your eyes.

    The review isn't there as some definitive guide to how good the game is. It's someone's opinions - which should be unbiased - laid down, so you can make your own decision whether to buy or not.

  • DAL9000 #1390 4 years ago

    @InsoFox: The passage of time is a pretty big part of what linked Persona and Dead Rising in my mind, yes. Both games also have a sense that, by choosing to do X during the limited time available, you're forfeiting the opportunity to do Y -- it's as if they're the only two video games in creation that understand, or have even ever /heard/, the phrase "opportunity cost."

    And another similarity between the two is that they take an almost comically innocuous setting by /day/ and plunge it into a hideous nightmare wasteland by /night/. Or, y'know, by zombie infestation.

    Plus, the plots in both are faintly ridiculous -- in Dead Rising's case, the zombie infestation was touched off by research aimed at making UNDEAD COWS. ZOMBIE FUCKING COWS FOR FUCK'S SAKE. /ZOMBIE/. /COWS/. , while in Persona's case, you're supposed to save the world... but not until you've finished studying for your midterms. I find that highly entertaining, though I'm not certain I could give you a coherent explanation of just /why/ I find it funny.

    Oh, and one last note about Persona 3: when it turned out Bebe was a /guy/, I had to ask myself some deep, unpleasant questions 'bout my sexuality. =( DAMN YOU, JAPAN!

  • DAL9000 #1391 4 years ago

    @MattDamon: "And it helps their good buddies Microsoft..."

    Dear sir,

    Your tin-foil hat is charming in a slightly antiquated way -- like "Dirty Dancing" or the BeeGees -- and I'd like to have one of my own. So where exactly did you buy it?

    Please inform me at your earliest convenience.

    Yours sincerely,
    DAL
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 14:00

  • IronGiant #1392 4 years ago

    So... is this coming out on the 360?

    /stands well back :)

  • DanWhitehead #1393 4 years ago

    I'm going to go out on a limb and say that if MGS4 had scored 10/10, with the exact same text, all the people banging on about "objective reviews" probably wouldn't have got their knickers in a twist. This is really all because Oli had the temerity to say that Metal Gear Solid is a love it or hate it game.

    Guess what? It is! It's the Matrix Reloaded of videogames, and for every person who revels in Kojima's heady brew of philosophy, post-modern mischief and lengthy melodrama there are people who find those elements a turn off. Just as there are people who feel that the control system is stuck in 1997, while others think it's perfect and doesn't need to change.

    Admitting there are elements of the series that inspire both love and hate (though those words were clearly hyperbolic in their use) in the reviewer is not biased. It's honesty.

  • Rodney #1394 4 years ago

    Much like a MGS cut scene, I cant be bothered to go through all these posts. Could somebody give me a brief overview?

    I read on the previous page that Apologie got a bit pissed off, could somebody direct me to what page/pages this all went down?

    It'll give me something to read tomorrow at work :)

  • Dizzy #1395 4 years ago

    "I knew I sensed a great disturbance in the Force... "

    As if millions of MGS fanboys cried out in despair.

  • Zaelsius #1396 4 years ago

    So MGS4 is finally out?

    I'm actually more insterested on how much it sellls than on how good it's doing on the reviews… we'll see.

    lol @1600 comments

  • subtlesnake #1397 4 years ago

    "Isn't it a review a bit like a trial? "

    No, because your preferences and preconceptions are what you use to assess the game in the first place. If you're not personally involved in the experience then what metric do you have to assess its emotional impact?

    Reviewing games isn't a science, nor should it be.

    "What exactly do you mean by that? The score is representative of what the site thinks of this game, not just one man. Unless the site is that amateurish."

    How do aggregate 5 or 10 different perspectives into a single score?

    "I totally agree with this. But aren't you the least bit suspicious with this particular review? Do we really believe EuroGamer didn't foresee the reaction an 8 would get. It was a golden opportunity for page hits. "

    Even if that is the case, that still doesn't mean Oli thought the game game was worth more than an 8.

  • Ota #1398 4 years ago

    Mr. welsh is quite solo with his opinion atm.

    [link url=http://w ww.gamestats.com/objects/714/714044/
    ]http://ww w.gamestats.com/objects/714/714...[/link]

    Like in science, when a series of measurings are done, you usually drop the ones that are out of a tolerable range.

  • bad09 #1399 4 years ago

    @ mattDaemon

    "What exactly do you mean by that? The score is representative of what the site thinks of this game, not just one man. Unless the site is that amateurish."

    Rubbish the review is one persons writing on their experience, therefore one view. Besides, I don't need a group of reviewers discussing a review/score between them as the review is pretty useless for my purchase decision anyaway (if you need a game site review to tell you it's OK to buy something you should worry). An example I gave earlier in this great thread was AC 6/10 was the score and the review wasn't great. If I'd listened to that review I would have missed one of my fav games of last year!

    I just wanna here someones thoughts on the game that's all, that's all any sane person wants from a review not some validation that your fav game is the best. I may agree I may disagree with that one persons view but either way my feelings are not hurt. If you think the site is amateurish for one person reviewing a game go elsewhere.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 15:03

  • peterv #1400 4 years ago

    Scoring a game like MGS is pointless,Eurogamer could of asked somebdy who loves the series to do it and it would of got a 10.
    They could of asked somebody who hates it and it would have got a 2.Instead they asked someone who loves and hates the series.
    As long as Eurogamer take this approach with all other long running series,then i can't see a problem.

    Some games come with a lot of baggage as do different genres.All that matters is a consistency of approach.

  • Widge #1401 4 years ago

    DanWhitehead:

    go check out the ign thread if you want the other side of the coin. It IS pretty much the same content!

  • wingZero21 #1402 4 years ago

    EG 0/10 BYE!

  • GregorV #1403 4 years ago

    "Like in science, when a series of measurings are done, you usually drop the ones that are out of a tolerable range."

    Not if you're trying to do good, objective science

  • Yossarian #1404 4 years ago

    ...and this isn't science, it's a review of a popular videogame.

  • DAL9000 #1405 4 years ago

    @GregorV:

    You... you mean I can't just ignore any experimental results that suggest something might be wrong with my hypothesis? That makes me sad on the inside, where sadness grows. =( =( =( =( =( =( =( =( =( and also, =(

  • MightyMouse #1406 4 years ago

    @bad09

    BUT WHO CARES????? Halo3 was easily a 10/10 for me sure but wouldn't cry if it didn't get 10 or if reviewers later thought they were too generous. why do reviewers score matter to you so much.

    I think a lot of this strident 'objectivity' is getting just as ridiculous as the fanboism. If you don't want to consider the arguments the fair enough, but don't pretend that you are in any way 'protecting rationality'. Personally I thought the score was a bit odd, but hey, it's just a review. As to the apparent conundrum of why I'm posting now (a valid problem), well:

    [link url=http://xkcd.com/386/
    ]http://xkcd.com/386/
    [/link]

  • MrsPacMan #1407 4 years ago

    First!!

  • MrsPacMan #1408 4 years ago

    DJFlex once said:

    Let's do a sweepstake on when a PS3 game will receive a 9 or better on EG.... I bag Jan 09. No wait I bag never.

    @MrsPacMan

    Sorry, MGS4 will definitely get a 9 or better and probably so will Ratchet and LBP...all before '09

  • dahsif #1409 4 years ago

    COME ON GUYS! We MUSTget this thread to the 2000 mark.

    Also, EG: stop trying to be the new EDGE.
    Edited for spelling.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 16:40

  • captainrentboy #1410 4 years ago

    For the psychotic folk out there accusing EG of being bias, can I just direct you here?...
    [link url=htt p://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages4/928234.asp
    ]http://ww w.gamerankings.com/htmlpages4/9...[/link]
    Have a look, no not up the top, scroll down, keep scrolling, yep keep going, ohhh what's that down there at the bottom?...
    To sum up, the moaners on here are fucking mental.
    So I guess my conclusive evidence points to EG infact being bed partners with Nintendo, huh? :)

  • InsoFox #1411 4 years ago

    Scoring, scoring.

    Yes, of course a games journalist should be able to get across how much they liked a game without having to stick a number on it, but maybe the number is useful in other ways.

    The relationship someone has with a game is complicated. Even the best written review is going to end up with a whole mess of things that the reviewer liked or disliked about it, and it can be rather difficult to see whether say, one con is forgiven by another pro, or how much one gameplay element figures in the reviewer's final assesment.

    What a score does is condenses all that mess and says: 'Well, given everything I've said, I'd say it's about an 8/10'. The contents of the review help to put that score in context. If it's that high despite the reviewer having some major issues, that probably means that other elements of the game more than make up for it, and so on.

    Of course, the thing is, the reviewer might put significant weight in things that you don't care much about at all, and vice versa, so more than any other part of a review, the score is a very personal thing, and it's perfectly understandable to mentally add or take away one or two points.

    In other words, what a score says is: 'If you think you'll like all the things I liked, and dislike all the things I disliked about the game, then the score is 8. If your opinions differ, add or subtract points to taste.'

    So, no. Scores are not utterly pointless, but they are not set in stone, either.

  • Mudo #1412 4 years ago

    I cannot believe this is still going with almost identical comments to the first one hundred.

    It is brilliant.
    You are all fantastic. Absolutely fantastic.

    Give yourselves a big pat on the back, you deserve it.

    Fantastic.

  • Bangaioh #1413 4 years ago

    I think EG can give Oli a bonus after all these comments. Nice one guys!

  • des #1414 4 years ago

    We are not going to reach 2000 posts like that,here is something new:

    Edge(8/10 MGS4) thoughts about Killzone 2:

    "The gameplay seems mediocre. Gunplay seems off. The graphics and the gameplay have nothing new to offer."

  • mattigan #1415 4 years ago

    Now if KZ2 gets 6/10 then that WILL be a shitstorm of epic proportions, but even as a dyed in the wool anti Sony, 360 owner I have to say that KZ2 is actually looking quite good.

  • Widge #1416 4 years ago

    looks good, but needs to play as well as it looks

  • Dezm0nd #1417 4 years ago

    I think this game would get a 9 if it was on the xbox 360. PS3 clearly aint up for it.

  • Negotiator #1418 4 years ago

    Oh what a beautiful morning oh what a beautiful day, oh what a beautiful morning MGS4 only got 8. Everybody sing Oh.....

  • Kluff #1419 4 years ago

    "I totally agree with this. But aren't you the least bit suspicious with this particular review? Do we really believe EuroGamer didn't foresee the reaction an 8 would get. It was a golden opportunity for page hits.

    And it helps their good buddies Microsoft.... "

    Game gets a good/great score: The publisher gave the reviewer a big fat check.
    Game gets a (relatively, in the eyes of fanboys) bad score: A business rival (in this case Microsoft) gave the reviewer a big fat check.
    Opportunity for page hits.

    It should be clear that you can always argue in any direction, without any proof.
    The most likely explanation would be that it's the honest opinion of the reviewer or maybe they gave in the hype.
    Whatever, the rest is just your conspiracy loving mind spinning!

    I should also mention that Eurogamer got many pagehits for the 10/10 of GTAIV and, I think (not sure), "Game of the Year" Psychonauts.......

    It's either out of interest or because it's so unusual. I mean, if you don't want that Eurogamer gets pagehits then don't hit Eurogamer.

    But all you zealots are the ones who (supposedly, in your opinion) give them what they want.

    You make no sene. Not surprisingly......
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 18:35

  • Widge #1420 4 years ago

    http://fo tos.hondaclub.com.ar/data/501/l...

  • quantumsheep #1421 4 years ago

    On the objective/subjective review thingy. My personal thoughts:

    Faults should be objectively written. This goes along the lines of saying 'The camera often obscures the view of the action, leading to much confusion when trying to navigate the world' as opposed to 'I don't like the camera' for example.

    See the difference? One explains the issue in an objective way and cannot be argued with. If you play the game, no matter your own opinion, the camera will block your view.

    Saying 'I don't like the camera' can be torn apart by anyone!


    Just my $.02 keeping this beast alive! :)

  • Kluff #1422 4 years ago

    Actually, it's still subjective (in my understandling, at least), but it explains what's good and bad in the personal opinion instead of just saying "This is great!/This sucks!".

  • smelly #1423 4 years ago

    @MattDamon.. I used to think you were one of the "normal" people on here...

  • Isere #1424 4 years ago

    @MGG

    What made you think using gibberish there would help achieve the mature look you were going for? Strange choice of words, ironic even.

    I'm not a forum elitist with an obsessive compulsion to stand guard for and defend a website when I don't like the way things are being handled. I wouldn't mind a 6 or 7 for this game but EG should have the balls to stick a Krudster or Bramwell under the reviewer name when they want to be critical to a big title (and the text IS very critical).

    Instead, what you have is a review with text leaning for the majority towards a 6 or a 7, marked upto 8, written by someone whose profile shows them only having done three-and-a-half reviews for the site prior to this. What part of that doesn't seem like a copout?





    Edited by 3 at 01/06/08 @ 20:23

  • smelly #1425 4 years ago

    GARGAAGHAAGAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

    The more i read the more i get fustrated... I'm going to not come back after i've written this for fear of just getting so depressed at the state of gaming and gamers..


    .. A SCORE IS JUST A FUCKING METHOD OF QUICKLY SUMARISING A REVIEW SO YOU CAN DECIDE WHETHER OR FUCKING NOT TO FUCKING BUY THE FUCKING THING...

    Some of you sad bastards have already decided to buy it regardless of the score, so i dont see the complaints..

    Now shut the fuck up with your crying you sad fucks.

  • Hypercube #1426 4 years ago

    Posting in legendary thread!

  • GamesConnoisseur #1427 4 years ago

    The steam is now tapering off in this thread, and its too obvious that people are just chipping in to keep it going unnatually, purely to break the 2000 posts record!

    Shame on you all!

    But know it is record in a big way as the GAME is NOT out yet until 12th June! So even if its do slow down, be assured that come 12th June there will be more posts, probably add another 600 or so of 'I told you so' from the both side!

    Observation, what does it say about the level of mental health/rabidness when Gear of War for X360 got an 8 and most reviewers give it a 10 and got total of 700 posts in Krudster's review but with the MSG4 we get over 1600 posts?

    I think sociologist will have a field day examining the comments and the apparent state of the minds of the entrenched opposing factions!!

    I will keep my eye on this thread to see how far it ll go! !-D

  • Rash' #1428 4 years ago

    JonFE, I terms of a gaming event I'd say it's pretty important.

  • patchbox360 #1429 4 years ago

    Snake, Snaake, Snaaaaaaaake!!!

  • Isere #1430 4 years ago

    Everything should be open to scrunity, nothing wrong with that.

    The problem with this thread and most gaming forums in general are the posters who attack other posters with the ''i'm-so-above-you-all attitude'' without anything to back that up.

    /I'm out.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 20:21

  • alimokrane #1431 4 years ago

    This has officially become the MOST COMMENTED ARTICLE on eurogamer and for what ? a review score ?

    What has the world come to!!!!!

  • Cheapshot #1432 4 years ago

    METAL GEAR!?!?!?

  • mainaman #1433 4 years ago

    DAL9000:

    So, this is waaaaaaay off-topic, but a few pages back someone was wondering why Mass Effect only got 8/10 -- said it was dinged "for nothing." Check out the Mass Effect PC review that came out a few days ago for a rebuttal, or just lemme copy-paste the relevant part:

    "Kristan got quite a few Mass Effect fans' backs up by reviewing it primarily as a shooter... but after going through the game, I can see his point."

    And, yes, when you combine the handful of silly design decisions (identikit bases; the Mako was crap; the inventory management was irritating) wiiiiiith the game's pedestrian and uninspiring shooter experience, you can see why a reviewer might ding the game a point or two instead of keeping it a 10/10.

    It's still an awesome game, of course, and I'm EXTREMELY happy with my decision to buy it -- it's just that a sub-10 score is perfectly reasonable and justifiable. But I'm sure that has zero relevance to MGS4 and /its/ score, eh?


    I have never claimed that Mass Effect was flawless,but people keep having a go at it for the pedestrian shooting,the Mako handling,the repetitive side missions, the awful inventory management,the pop-up and the slowdown.

    Ok,the inventory and the side missions are really valid knock-down points,but if Eurogamer punished Mass Effect because of them,why was GTA 4 awarded 10/10.

    Some faults of GTA4,shared with Mass Effect:
    -pedestrian shooting
    -slowdown
    -pop-up
    -repetitive missions
    -more

    And GTA4 had inferior story,dialogue,charactersation,art design,graphics,etc.The character interaction and the relatively open world with few limits in lifestyle,personal freedom and social and consequences' logic ensured its landmark place in gaming,but a flawless game it ain't.

    MGS 4 has hours of cut-scenes and the final nearly 90 minutes one was claimed to be boring by the reviewer.Some gamers say MGS series are weird hybrids of some stealth gameplay and ponderous dramaction sci-fi conspiracy movies with dead-serious pontification AND smirky self-deprecation.All gamers agree that MGS games are unique and there hasn't been and never would be made again such phenomenon.

    How do you score an uniqueness after you give 10/10s for polished sequels of run-of-the mill(as a reader put it correctly) games?

    Uniqueness means 8/10,even with the improved gameplay and the numerous jaw-dropping moments that reviewers can't speak of.Kojima's vision of artistic medim is as worthy as Dynasty Warriors 6.

  • frombrosis #1434 4 years ago

    @ mainaman

    Good points, and it's good to compare Mass Effect PC and GTA IV as they were reveiwed relatively recently. Basically, I think there's a HUGE difference between EG giving a 10/10 and an 8/10. I read the Mass Effect PC review and it seemed to be that there was a definite FLAW in the shooter mechanic of the game that detracted from the experience enough to not grant it a "perfect" 10/10.

    I also read (and have extensively played) GTA IV and I think that while the game is quite wonderful it isn't worthy of the 10/10 score. I think there's a number of issues with the game, not major, but cumulatively, can detract from the experience. So honestly I don't think review scores are being taken seriously by EG anymore.

  • MyPointIs #1435 4 years ago

    I find it amusing that people invest the energy to write a long rant after nearly 17 hundred comments.

    Let's face it, there are no new points to make. At least until we can play for ourselves and decide.

  • Widge #1436 4 years ago

    11 fooking days!

  • gohda #1437 4 years ago

    Only a comment every 20 mins or so now, what's going on!?

  • DaftVice #1438 4 years ago

    Its just not a well written review. I don't mind the 8 though, its the only thing this could have got through this confused review. 8 is a good score anyway, just like Assassin's Creed which I really loved even though most people didn't.

    Staked my place in epic thread: Done.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 21:56

  • Cider-X #1439 4 years ago

    posting to get 2000 posts

  • Viktor #1440 4 years ago

    Maybe the reviewer could throw in a few more baits for the fish? We are not going to reach 2000 if the comments stall like this.

    I already read the NeoGAF thread about the Edge 8/10 and it was hilarious. "90 minutes cutscenes is the way for gaming to rival movies" and all that jazz.

    Come on, it's a great Metal Gear but you can't really disagree with the review's perspective if you are not a hardcore fan.

  • patchbox360 #1441 4 years ago

    eieieieieieieieieieieieieieeeeieeieeeieeieeeieeeieeieieieiie ieieieeeieeieieieieight

  • JonFE #1442 4 years ago

    Rash', in the grand scheme of life, it's just a game, one that will sell the same regardless of this score. Some people will enjoy it enormously (no doubt about it), others will not, some will remain indifferent, but I dare assume that it won't be a life-changing experience for anyone. Sometimes keeping things into perspective is essential.

    EDIT: I'd also argue that Kojima's next game -out of the MGS universe- would really be *important* :)
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/08 @ 23:18

  • DjFlex52 #1443 4 years ago

    Observation, what does it say about the level of mental health/rabidness when Gear of War for X360 got an 8 and most reviewers give it a 10 and got total of 700 posts in Krudster's review but with the MSG4 we get over 1600 posts?

    @GamesConnoisseur

    It says that 360 owners are just hardcore gamers who bought a new game console (and probably all owned a PS2) and alot of PS3 owners are unconsciously loyal & rabid in their devotion to a company...not a game machine.

    I owned a PS1 & PS2 and I never bought an Xbox but I bought a 360 just for the good games, not for the good of MS or to be "disloyal" to Sony.

  • krudster #1444 4 years ago

    Gears wasn't an established brand at the time of the review. MG is. Plus, since then, EG's traffic has grown quite substantially.

    I'm not at all surprised we're in crazy land meltdown over an 8. It's what happens - though, weirdly, this time we've been able to publish a review waaay before release and at the same time as our Interweb contemporaries, which is highly unusual.

    Hence, crazyland.

  • Yossarian #1445 4 years ago

    Don't say you're not happy with the results. This thread is doing Iron Man numbers.

  • Bangaioh #1446 4 years ago

    he he

  • Bangaioh #1447 4 years ago

    oh my dear

  • local_celebrity #1448 4 years ago

    I think there was a lot more riding on this review than some people make out.

    I'm a complete Xbox fanboy, but I've also been secretly hoping for a killer PS3 exclusive that would make me throw the towel in and buy their console, too. Something of the calibre of Bioshock, for instance.

    MGS4 had the best chance of being "the one", but, looking at this review, I guess it wasn't meant to be.

    I despise cutscenes.
    Edited by 2 at 02/06/08 @ 00:27

  • Bangaioh #1449 4 years ago

    More weather on the bbc.com website

  • Bangaioh #1450 4 years ago

    I kind of agree with local celebrity... I'm not a fanboy but I was waiting for a convincing occasion to buy a PS3, I like the platform, just can't find a reason for buying one (and no, Blueray isn't a good enough reason)...
    And yes, MGS4, with those tedious and sometimes simply stupid sentimental plot twists, simply isn't going to make it...

  • Stoatboy #1451 4 years ago

    @local_celebrity & Bangaioh:

    Wipeout HD was my main reason.

    MGS = meh!, Wipeout = Woot!
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 00:45

  • quantumsheep #1452 4 years ago

    I particularly liked this gif from the SDF:

    http://ww w.sonydefenseforce.com/wp-conte...

    You have to wait a while for it to 'change'.

    Comedy gold... *cough*

  • J.C #1453 4 years ago

    Its not just the constant codec cutscenes etc, that let the game down. visually its quite fucking bland. i predict a better looking version for the 360, in the not so distant future.

  • MGG #1454 4 years ago

    @Isere: What gibberish was that then? Is English not your first language? If not, I apologise, but if it is your first language you want to look "sarcasm" or "irony" up in a dictionairy.

    I like the way you have actually fleshed out your points in the reply - why not put those points in the first message? Because otherwise it just sounded like you were coming across as a complete fanboy who couldn't handle seeing his most wanted game get a less than stellar review.

    Now, I know of some reviews that were beyond suspicous, indeed I know of some reviews that were indeed "bought", as I personally know the person doing the "buying" (no, not me and no, not Eurogamer). But to allege underhand dealings as you did on your first post (first that I read anyway, 1700+ posts about one game is taking the p*ss), only to then call it a "copout" in reply is a bit much, without any actual evidence.

    Especially as Oli Welsh is an editor here, is he not? And someone who writes for other publications?

    But anyway, back to the humour of this thread/train crash.....

  • Number1Laing #1455 4 years ago

    @local_celebrity: wait, so you despise cutscenes yet you were hoping MGS4 would be right up your alley and make you want a PS3?

    Why? Have you never played a Metal Gear Solid before? Have you never heard a single thing about the series before? Your post is bizarre.

  • Charlie_Miso #1456 4 years ago

    needs more comments

  • Sarge #1457 4 years ago

    I'd just like to say, monkeytennis.

    No reason other than I like saying it.

    Keep up the goodwork fckers.

  • Strac #1458 4 years ago

    I actually like the gameplay of Halo 3 co-op a lot more than GTA IV single player. It's all subjective anyway, if watching cutscenes is your thing, great for you. But to me it's a throwback to Dragon Lair (or what was that game called?)

  • Isere #1459 4 years ago

    to allege underhand dealings as you did on your first post

    @MGG

    1. I said nothing of the sort, not even a hidden subtext. See MY posts.

    2. English is not my first language but that doesn't seem to the problem here.

    3. None of my posts, ever, were meant to indulge any one person in particular. I don't need the validation.

    4. Forums are a waste of time and energy that could be better spent elsewhere so I'm out.





  • MyPointIs #1460 4 years ago

    I was staring at the 8 for hours.

    Until I became one with nature.

    And I could only see love around me.

  • MyPointIs #1461 4 years ago

      888888
    88        88
    88        88
      888888
    88        88
    88        88
      888888

  • DjFlex52 #1462 4 years ago

    Please leave Eurogamer alone people.
    They're just trying to get the page hits they would otherwise have got from a 360VsPS3 faceoff for the game. Its not about being loyal to the readers or somesuch. Its just not good business you see.
    Those looking for a credible review, please look elsewhere.

    Later... 1. I said nothing of the sort, not even a hidden subtext. See MY posts.

    @Isere

    Well, the first 4 lines on top are from your post, Isere. And it surely implies that Eurogamer/Oli gave MGS4 an 8 so they can get page hits...which is seemingly a premeditated underhanded dealing.

    Maybe you don't understand your own comment...lol
    You're out because you know you're talking bullshit.

  • Widge #1463 4 years ago

    10 days.
    Having checked my bank account, I reckon it will be EMPTIED on that day thanks to this! Will leave me about £10 to get through 16 days with! Worth it though.

  • apan #1464 4 years ago

    Better than the Estonian contribution to Eurovision song contest then?

  • Les #1465 4 years ago

    "MGS4 had the best chance of being "the one", but, looking at this review, I guess it wasn't meant to be.

    I despise cutscenes."

    You despise cut scenes and yet you were looking at MGS4 as the game to make you get a PS3?! I could have told you 10 years ago that if there ever were to be a MGS4 it would feature a lot of lengthy cut scenes...

    It's really amazing how many people claim to be/were waiting for MGS4 as the game to get a PS3 for and now that the game gets an 8, basically for being a MGS game, don't want it anymore... What were you expecting?!

  • muscleblade #1466 4 years ago

    @Les

    Very true. MGS has always been for fans of the genre. I wouldnt even buy it if it came out for the 360.
    Ninja Gaiden 2 is also for the fans. As a huge NG fan i would have bought it no matter the score.

  • ccfb #1467 4 years ago

    Is this review based on the trip to Konami's hollowed-out volcano base in the Japanese bush?

  • DFawkes #1468 4 years ago

    Is this the longest comments thread ever? I'm sure there will have been longer, but can't remember them.

    Anyway, not long now for us MGS fans. Almost cancelled my pre-order(not because of the review, had a sudden need for a Wii. Thanks to overdrafts I'm having both), but now I'm buzzing for it. Just over a week until the greatest MGS game this year is released - and that's a FACT. Unless you prefer the other MGS release of this year MGS:pO+, in which case it's opinion, obviously.

  • Zander #1469 4 years ago

    monkey nuts

  • bitesize #1470 4 years ago


    still going? wow. good weekend everyone?

  • Wyrm #1471 4 years ago

    LOL at EGM refusing to give it a review score because of the restrictions imposed. One big massive FUCK YOU to Konami right there.

  • bad09 #1472 4 years ago

    "LOL at EGM refusing to give it a review score because of the restrictions imposed. One big massive FUCK YOU to Konami right there."

    Brilliant stuff! If only they all did it to stick two fingers up to Konami, I'm highly suspicious of these restrictions and won't be buying MGS4 until it's out a while and I can get the whole truth on what they are hiding.

  • Widge #1473 4 years ago

    Great weekend Bitesize, I managed to split my time 50/50 between rabid foaming and mixing. All in all a perfect weekend.

  • bitesize #1474 4 years ago


    i don't get nearly enough rabid foaming time in these days...

  • magikdodo #1475 4 years ago

    hey..does anyone on here know if game stores in the uk
    will be selling mgs 4 bundles...
    hope to get a good deal especially if it comes with a dual shock 3

    thanks for the information if any..LOL

  • bad09 #1476 4 years ago

    @ magikdodo

    There will be a bundle but it's not the great one everyone else gets, it's the non b/c 40gb and sixaxis

  • mossychops001 #1477 4 years ago

    PS3 game with a 8/10 score from EG. it must be good.

  • imaballa #1478 4 years ago

    This site is bullshit!
    You guys give Resistance FOM an 7/10
    God of War 8/10
    and
    MGS4 8/10

    And yet give Halo 3 a perfect 10/10?? That bullshit, you guys are biased you know that ugly looking game didn't deserve 10/10 you just felt the presure to do so because of the immense hype Microsoft built up for that game.

    Disappointed at your site, everything I see anything related to EUROGAMER I will think you are as credible as Microsoft Defense Force.

  • Cheapshot #1479 4 years ago

    8/10lol

  • DjFlex52 #1480 4 years ago

    This site is bullshit!
    You guys give Resistance FOM an 7/10
    God of War 8/10
    and
    MGS4 8/10

    @imaballa

    Are you really as dumb as you sound?
    EG gave Resistance a 6/10 and God of War 1 & 2 both received 9/10
    You are bullshit!

  • Apostle #1481 4 years ago

    Last!1

    ;)

  • rotmm #1482 4 years ago

    @magikdodo,

    I don't know of any retailers yet who have a MGS4 bundle, but SCEE has promised one. It won't come with DualShock though, as there is currently no EU release date for that piece of hardware.

    http://ww w.eurogamer.net/article.php?art...

  • Widge #1483 4 years ago

    Buy it from Yesasia, you can find money off coupons round the net, and going by Quidco gives you even more cash off.
    I've got a black dualshock 3, cost me a few quid under £25.

    Which was nice.

  • Les #1484 4 years ago

    "Brilliant stuff! If only they all did it to stick two fingers up to Konami, I'm highly suspicious of these restrictions and won't be buying MGS4 until it's out a while and I can get the whole truth on what they are hiding."

    If there's any truth in the rumours Konami are really stupid (and wrong). But EGM aren't exactly the most trustworthy party around....

  • bad09 #1485 4 years ago

    "If there's any truth in the rumours Konami are really stupid (and wrong). But EGM aren't exactly the most trustworthy party around.... "

    I would trust EGM either Les! :) If it is true Komani had restrictions on the reviews (which is looking likely) kudos to EGM, and the other "un-named" sources who blew the whistle on this shameful behavior from Konami in the first place.

  • Zaelsius #1486 4 years ago

    MGS4 will score 9/10 on EG… when it comes out for the X360 in early 2009.

  • Widge #1487 4 years ago

    The beginning of the IGN review says:

    "In return for letting us play Metal Gear Solid 4 before its release, Konami issued us with a list of things that we're not allowed to discuss. This list of prohibited topics is pretty long, and even extends as far as several facts that the company itself has already made public."

  • bad09 #1488 4 years ago

    "This list of prohibited topics is pretty long"

    Very suss! Thanks Widge!

  • magikdodo #1489 4 years ago

    @rotmm, bad09: thanks for the info guys.. i hope they change their minds
    about the dual shock 3..
    when i saw the 2 sixaxis controllers combo for 35 pounds on play.com, i thought sony
    are trying to phase it out in time before the launch of dual shock 3 with mgs 4..
    oh well..

    maybe i should just preorder the game and console myself with the current gta 4 bundle..hmm
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 12:26

  • Les #1490 4 years ago

    @ Widge

    Hmm, that doesn't make Konami look good. Would be interesting to know what kind of points were restricted. Might be that some stuff was still work in progress and shouldn't be negatively mentioned because it would be fixed? Or did they want to prevent the buyers from making a sound buy-decision by keeping vital (and potentially damaging) information from them?

    But what does this mean for the EG review? Does that mean they didn't receive the official review copy? And if they did, why didn't restrictions apply to them? Strange...

  • deaner #1491 4 years ago

    I always laugh when reviews harp on about an MGS games' over-lengthy cut-scenes, daftly over-complicated plot or the zany boss character designs.

    It's like reviewing a racing game and complaining that it's all about cars, that you can't get on motorbikes or that you can't add bodykits or neon lights to your 'ride'.

    But that because the game has been developed with a different objective. The creative decision was made not to hand you yet another title you can dip into for half an hour, then put back down without knowing or caring what you spent your life-years on. It wants to involve you. It wants you to invest you, make you scratch your head and occasionally show you something you've never seen before.

    Where a racing game sans-motor-bicycles might aspire to showcase the wonders of modern automotive engineering to the non-millionairre set - Metal Gear just wants to spin you a yarn, and for anyone that's ever read a book - you know that means you haveto sit in your chair for more than an hour or two.

    After seven games and nine extra titles - across about five platforms... you'd hope you'd know whether you liked Metal Gear by now.

    Review the title on it's real counterparts. Titles that are hybrids of gameplay, of movie, within a story of Divine Comedy proportion.
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 12:31

  • bad09 #1492 4 years ago

    "After seven games and nine extra titles - across about five platforms... you'd hope you'd know whether you liked Metal Gear by now."

    Not everyone is a long term gamer you know. For many (as with every gen) PS3/360/Wii may be their first console.

  • Rizzle #1493 4 years ago

    Since my text alert is currently "*Codec bleep* *Codec open swipe* Snake", I have no right to comment about this game until I've played it.

    On the other hand, Eurogamer remains a place where reviewers can give me a good indication of whether I'd enjoy a game - once I've got used to the particular editor's style - or else entertain me. That's enough, thank you.

  • Daymare #1494 4 years ago

    @arbiter

    "If Oli in his review detailed specific failings I wouldn't have complained as I haven't played the damn game yet!"

    It's a three page review, not a walkthrough. You can't possibly expect him to cover everything there is to cover in MGS4 (and let us not forget what seems to be a long list of rules/restrictions reviewers had to follow). And between all the gushing over the game, Oli *did* point out a lot of stuff (and has explicitly stated his love/hate relationship to MGS at the beggining, which puts his review in proper context and explains why it comes across so... dichotomized) that justified his 8. I'm not going to bother with copy/pasting it here.

    I just can't shake the feeling you're complaining over a review as a big MGS fan, not as an objective observer. As all the other complainers, really.

  • bad09 #1495 4 years ago

    "More foaming fanbots trying to tell us why they dont want a PS3 they never wanted anyway.... "

    Rich coming from you swam, you're the biggest foaming fanbot on EG! :)

    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 13:27

  • antony_williams #1496 4 years ago

    Soooo... does this game come with Metal Gear Online still or not? No mention in the review :(

  • Yaz #1497 4 years ago

    "Rich coming from you swam, you're the biggest foaming fanbot on EG! :)"

    True. :)

    Anyway, 1737 posts now! I wonder what the record is for EG?

  • Widge #1498 4 years ago

    Yes, still comes with MGO.

    Which I suppose, if you want to run around shooting stuff using the MGS engine, without all the cinematics, must be quite the godsend.

    I quite liked what I played of it, needs a headset for sure. Can't wait to see what its like with some more maps on the go.

  • 3william56 #1499 4 years ago

    Bathe in the irony of a review criticizing a game for having excessively long and indulgent cutscenes having an excessively long and indulgent thread section. It's like the game, just 40 quid less.

    True review score is:
    Score for MGS fans: 10/10
    Score for MGS Haters/Xbots etc. 6/10.
    Ergo 8/10 average for everyone.

    Shame to see something like distinct style and artistic vision (which anyone who picks up MGS will expect, nay demand) getting such short shrift in the review, when IMHO it should be applauded. EG is finally coming down hard on generic sf-a-thons (see Haze, Fracture articles) and WWII, but still not able to reward risk taking.

    Hold on. HOW many f**king comments???

  • Cheapshot #1500 4 years ago

    "Colonel, we've managed to avoid DROWNING!".

  • Quint2020 #1501 4 years ago

    I've been shot in the hand but i'm ok!

  • muscleblade #1502 4 years ago

    If the game got a 6/10 the number of comments would have made sense. Was 8/10 that unexpected? Really?

  • DjFlex52 #1503 4 years ago

    Love it or loathe it, MGS as a franchise has sold millions of copies (MGS3 only did 4million units in its initial release!) while remaining remarkably consistent in both style and mechanics. Evidently millions of people don't have the problems that Oli has with the Kojima's cut-scene heavy structuring.

    @Arbiter

    Evidently, many more millions (96 million PS2 owners) didn't gush over MGS3 as you did, Arbiter, and they did have a problem with the cut-scene heavy structuring. MGS was never a system seller and it's still not one. In comparison, Gears Of War sold 4 million games with 90 million less 360 owners.

    @3william56

    Same long cutscenes as in past MGS games is not risk taking..artistic or not :)

  • Trigga_Tybalt #1504 4 years ago

    most. comments. ever.

  • bad09 #1505 4 years ago

    "That's the most ridiculous logic on here and that's really saying something.

    So basically, if you have 96 million people who have never tried orange juice, you can safely assume those 96 million people don't and won't like orange juice can you?"

    Well they didn't buy it, did they?
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 15:10

  • DjFlex52 #1506 4 years ago

    So basically, if you have 96 million people who have never tried orange juice, you can safely assume those 96 million people don't and won't like orange juice can you?

    @MattDamon

    And you say my logic is ridiculous?!?!1
    You're always try to dispute me, MD, and you always come out looking dumb and dumber...lolz.
    To compare trying orange juice to buying a niche stealth video game is not even worth a retort.
    I was right on, MD ;)
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 15:19

  • DjFlex52 #1507 4 years ago

    @bad09

    I've never bought an Aston Martin, doesn't mean I don't like them.

    @MattDamon

    The point is...if you buy an Aston Martin, you're gonna drive it, right?
    If I buy a game, I'm going to play it (sooner or later).
    Arbiter brought up the point of 4 miilion people, who own a PS2, bought the game. All I did was remind him of the people (96 million) who didn't buy the game which means they aren't rabid MGS fans as you 2 are.

  • DjFlex52 #1508 4 years ago

    You honestly think that the reason every owner didn't buy it was because they didn't like it? That's specifically what you are saying yeah? Because you are making a complete phud of yourself if you are.

    @MattDamon

    Hey, it's not that they didn't like it, it's that they didn't WANT it.
    If they did want it they would have bought it ;)

  • magikdodo #1509 4 years ago

    just called konami europe on 020 8987 5730, and they confirmed
    that they had no plans for a mgs 4 bundle..darn shame really..

    *sulking in a corner*

  • dr_faulk #1510 4 years ago

    Jeez, this thread is still running? Amazing. aNd n0tHing h4s cHanged 3H g4me iZ sTill kRaPz0rz

  • Les #1511 4 years ago

    "My opinion is that while its cool for reviewers to have issues with the MGS'ness of MGS4, and to clearly state there are divisive aspects to the design, they shouldn't mark it down for remaining true to itself."

    Like I mentioned in an earlier post, this is a difficult one and I don't feel EG is really consistent in this regard. You can review a game with the general public in mind. But in case of Wii games EG clearly doesn't stick to that concept. To apply it arbitrarily is bound to result in discussions over review scores. Best remedy is to abolish the scores all together.

  • DFawkes #1512 4 years ago

    You know, I bet there's a sweepstake on how many comments the score generated - it was a 10 until Oli said "I bet I could get more than 2000 comments just by scoring it 8/10 and reviewing it in a questionable manor." So everyone took a pages worth and bet. We'll be the laughing stock of Oli when he makes hundreds off of our posting. And now I'm helping.

  • Widge #1513 4 years ago

    The IGN thread is ahead of this in comments now though

    FAIL

    Although the intellect quotient here is a bit mightier!

  • DFawkes #1514 4 years ago

    Arbiter +1

    I agree effort should be applauded, even if it doesn't always hit the mark.

  • ps3owner #1515 4 years ago

    IGN has 1832 comments. what's happening here! Get a move on, we are losing the battle (which site is better, IGN or Eurogamer).

    so, from console war to site review thread number war thing

  • Widge #1516 4 years ago

    erm
    how can we keep it going?

    "Better than the not-HD Ninja Gaiden"

  • Xerx3s #1517 4 years ago

    imaballa: Halo 3 > MGS4. Fact. NAHNAHNAHNAH!

  • ps3owner #1518 4 years ago

    not sure, maybe we can pick on IGN or something? or pick up a quote from there and "discuss" it on here ;)

  • des #1519 4 years ago

    "Better than the not-HD Ninja Gaiden"

    MGS4 is also not- HD

    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 16:51

  • Widge #1520 4 years ago

    LIES! HIDEO TOLD ME SO!

  • Widge #1521 4 years ago

    Take that back or I'll inchworm you into next week

  • bad09 #1522 4 years ago

    one more for the EG vs IGN MGS thread war come on lads!

    / stands on a hill in front of EG users

    "I am bad09 and I see a whole army of my consolemen,
    here in defiance of IGN! You have come to fight as EG men. And
    EG man you are! What will you do without EG? Will you fight?"

    "Yes fight and you may loose to IGN. Run and you
    will live at least awhile on Gamespot. And dying in your bed many years from now,
    would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that for
    one chance, just one chance, to come back here as young men and tell
    IGN that they may take our fanboys but they will never take
    our EG MGS thread!"

    / gets coat for sad braveheart copy and paste :)

  • Widge #1523 4 years ago

    I just posted this:

    "OH MI GOD YU GUISE, DID YU SEE TH EIGT THAT EUROGAMMER GAVE IT?!"

  • DjFlex52 #1524 4 years ago

    PS. Thanks to the numerous Xbox fans for turning this into ground-zero for the mother of all console-warz battles, the more exposure MGS4 gets, the better. Especially as the info about the multiple installs makes it seem increasingly unlikely that the 360 will get a port...

    @Arbiter

    You mean....thanks to the numerous rabid and bitter PS3 fans including some who actually joined EG just to vent their grief ;)

    BTW, Arbiter, I didn't read any comments by you or your denizens rewarding the effort, dedication and ambition put forth by the developers of Halo3, Bioshock and GTA IV. They put just as much (maybe more) into their games as Kojima did with MGS4. You want to look back at your comments about those games? Why does MGS4 get this from you? Simply because you're a PS3 fanboy and MGS fan :)

  • Les #1525 4 years ago

    "The IGN thread is ahead of this in comments now though."

    You'd think there'd be less to bitch about with a 9.9 score... ;) But then, there's probably gloating PS3 fanboys vs. Xbots that feel the score isn't deserved...

    Don't you all agree the world would be a better place without review scores?

  • DjFlex52 #1526 4 years ago

    Don't you all agree the world would be a better place without review scores?

    @Les

    No, No aaaaaaand NO!!!1

  • bitesize #1527 4 years ago

    Arbiter: Thanks to the numerous Xbox fans for turning this into ground-zero for the mother of all console-warz battles

    really? all i see is pages and pages of bitter MGS fans, crying cos their game didn't get as high a score as they think it should, despite the fact that they haven't played it yet...

  • captainrentboy #1528 4 years ago

    After reading through the vast majority of these comments, (I'm bloody bored, okay?) I've come to the conclusion that Arbiter is basically another Swam or Apologie, suuuure he likes to use bigger words, and has better sentence structure than those two spastics, but he's still babbling on about exactly the same sort of shit all whilst putting up the good fight for Sony.
    Why does any sane grown man feel the need to get this defensive over a computer game? It's fooking mental.

  • anonim1979 #1529 4 years ago

    [link url= http://www.videogaming247.com/2008/06/02/uk-mgs4-reviews-wer e-written-from-code-supplied-at-two-day-paris-event/
    ]http://ww w.videogaming247.com/2008/06/02...[/link]

    "
    Following speculation this morning that Britain’s Metal Gear Solid 4 reviews were written from incomplete code, videogaming247 has learnt that UK press reviewed the game at a two-day event in Paris at the end of April.
    “Eurogamer reviewed from the same code as IGN UK and the official PS3 magazines,” Eurogamer editor Tom Bramwell told us this afternoon.
    Konami UK confirmed the game’s reviewing conditions, the rep telling us he couldn’t see any difference between the code played in Paris and the game in the boxed copy he had on his desk.
    “The Paris event was specifically engineered by Kojima Productions to allow key press to see the game and coincide their reviews with its launch,” the spokesperson added.
    Eurogamer’s review attracted much attention after the site gave MGS4 8/10, the piece going live on the same day as IGN UK’s 9.9/10.
    British magazine Edge also gave the game 8/10, the review being written from the same event as IGN and Eurogamer’s.
    Both American and British Official PlayStation Magazines have awarded the game 10/10.
    "

  • Cheapshot #1530 4 years ago

    ".45, huh? Incredible! The feeding ramp is polished to a mirror sheen, the slide's been reinforced, and the interlock with the frame is tightened for added precision. The thumb safety is extended to make it easier on the finger. A long-type trigger with non-slip grooves... a ring hammer. The base of the trigger guard's been filed down for a higher grip... and not only that... nearly every part of this gun has been expertly crafted and customized."

  • Widge #1531 4 years ago

    Les:

    Most of the griping is about the 9.5 for lasting appeal! It should be teh ten!

  • CouldntResist #1532 4 years ago

    "I agree effort should be applauded, even if it doesn't always hit the mark."

    "The difficulty of the endeavor and the ambition and effort of the creator(s) should be recognized."

    Recognised maybe; rewarded absolutely not. I'm not going to pay an incompetant just because he happens to work really hard.

    Btw i'm not saying anything about the game here, as i have not played it (i doubt 95% of the rabid adolescents in this thread have). I'm just saying the review score should be based on results rather than effort.

  • Knot #1533 4 years ago

    I didn't expect this EG score.

    I too had problems with MGS2's story direction, yet I replayed that game many times.

    MGS3 showed many (gameplay) improvements ; i refound my love for MGS, plus the tongue in cheek
    60's espionage storyline made it way more easy to digest.

    Of course, I haven't played MGS4 yet, but other previews & preview material show such a work of
    love, with special considerations for flashbacks & Weternized/modernized flow of gameplay.

    I don't think this Swansong should get less than 9.0

    Especially in a world where uniquely styled
    singleplayer games with an actual message to the public, are a dying breed (for example, Harrison saying
    this genre is at it's end..)

    Now THIS is a great review : http://ww w.gamesradar.com/ps3/metal-gear...
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 20:52

  • Les #1534 4 years ago

    "really? all i see is pages and pages of bitter MGS fans, crying cos their game didn't get as high a score as they think it should, despite the fact that they haven't played it yet..."

    There's various kinds of blinkeredness...

  • DjFlex52 #1535 4 years ago

    Now THIS is a great review....

    @Knot

    It's a great review because he wrote what you wanted to hear.
    It's full of so much hyperbole like... "The most anticipated game in history isn't perfect. It isn't even as good as we hoped. But..."

    Huh? Who decided MGS4 was the most anticpated game in history? This particular reviewer did. So was he being subjective and objective in his review? How come he's allowed to express his "subjective" opinions but Oli can't?
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:05

  • Knot #1536 4 years ago

    ^ The difference is - if you mind to read Gamesradar's review thoroughly - is that EG's stomps down any possible openmindedness a new player would have. The Gamesradar MGS4 review lays down the facts, don't worry, but it commends giving the game a true chance ; like giving good wine some proper testing.

    You get distracted by some review hyperbole, so every next game review using hyperbole will mean the game at hand is crap ?

    EG's review is too quick spitting it out, basically killing off chances that players will appreciate this game on 2nd , 3rd playthrough, alot more. Again... Gamesradar 's MGS4 review is everything EG's review is, but more thought out, including hyperbole, but not dishonest.
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:10

  • DjFlex52 #1537 4 years ago

    @Knot

    You got to be kidding me? MGS4 was not made for new players...just ask Kojima. He made the game for MGS fans. He's said as much.
    A new gamer is not going to figure out the mumbo jumbo that is the MGS storyline for the 3 prior games.
    Why would you play MGS4 without playing at least 2 of the other MGS games?

    edit: You never heard me say the game was crap. An 8/10 is a very good game score. But your saying that the MGS swansong shouldnt be less than a 9 while you haven't played the game just shows why you are on the defense. You don't know what the game plays like until you play it.
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:15

  • Les #1538 4 years ago

    "I don't think this Swansong should get less than 9.0 "

    Imagine a world without pointless review scores. A world in which an xbot (or any other fanboy) couldn't come into a comments section with silly (though factually correct) statements like "Halo3 got a 10, MGS only an 8. PS3 suckzlol"

    If said bot had only had "Better than either of its predecessors, Halo 3 still can't quite escape the category of flawed masterpiece" while for MGS4 they could only come up with "You could not ask for a funnier, cleverer, more ambitious or inspired or over-the-top conclusion to the Metal Gear Solid series, but it's definitely time to move on." there would be a whole lot less abuse on the internet...

    Once again, review scores are there for idiots. People without an opinion on their own, that can't think and that get off on owning and playing games that the common denominator tells them they should think are best. Review scores are opium for the gaming people...

  • Knot #1539 4 years ago

    @ DJflex ; Quoting "not going to figure out mumbo jumbo"

    See, that's where openmindedness ends.

    Given, if you had any.

    @ Les ; that's exactly where EG & GR differ on this MGS4 game ; GR is as honest to state the hardships, but encourages players, old & new to give it a proper chance.

    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:18

  • DjFlex52 #1540 4 years ago

    Imagine a world without pointless review scores. A world in which an xbot (or any other fanboy) couldn't come into a comments section with silly (though factually correct) statements like "Halo3 got a 10, MGS only an 8. PS3 suckzlol"

    @Les

    The truth is that no xbots came in here gloating about that. Show me these posts, please. It was just the opposite. Sony fanboys are the ones who mentioned H3 and Bioshock and GTA IV in their whining posts.

  • DjFlex52 #1541 4 years ago

    ^ Quoting "not going to figure out mumbo jumbo"

    @Knot

    Now I can't have my own opinion either unless it suits your agenda. I played MGS 1 & 2. I loved the first and didn't love the second. And yes...it was mumbo jumbo ;)
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:20

  • Knot #1542 4 years ago

    ^ DJflex.

    " It was mumbo juimbo"

    See, that's where you need to see you're stating your opinion as fact. You're slamming down everyone who doesn't agree with your opinion.

    Besides, "my agenda" is to be openminded and the plan to give the game a chance ; planning to play it multiple times, then come to my conclusions.
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:24

  • DjFlex52 #1543 4 years ago

    See, that's where you need to see you're stating your opinion as fact. You're slamming down everyone who doesn't agree with your opinion.

    @Knot

    Me saying that my opinion of MGS is mumbo jumbo means it's a now fact. huh? are you nuts?
    It's my fucking opinion...you can disagree!
    No, you're slamming down EG for giving their review which you don't agree with.
    I have never slammed any review in EG or any other site....check my posts. I slam stupid people who try to impose their opinion on others....like Les. He's a prima donna at that.

  • Knot #1544 4 years ago

    DJ flex ^ I am actually not slamming down the EG review itself, moreso the possible effect ; as in, people canceling their pre order because reviews like this which taste so sour, without giving enough incentive to give it a chance (Gamesradar)

    You're using the word " F*ing " .. whoa.. easy there boy... that's hyperbole to the xth degree hehe..
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:35

  • DjFlex52 #1545 4 years ago

    DJ flex ^ I am actually not slamming down the EG review itself, moreso the possible effect ; as in, people canceling their pre order because reviews like this which taste so sour, without giving enough incentive to give it a chance (Gamesradar)

    @Knot

    Be realistic. If anybody cancels their preorder because EG gave MGS4 an 8....Ermmm, i'm speechless (rare occasion)

    EG gave Assassin's Creed a 7 and Mass Effect an 8. I still bought them, played them and enjoyed them. And I didn't bitch because EG's scores were lower than my own.

    ps...no more profanity, ok, Knot :)

    btw, a game review is not an advertisement or promotion for the game...it's the reviewer's explantion and opinion of the game.
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 21:53

  • Knot #1546 4 years ago

    ^ DJflex : i'm just saying the review has a potential Scarecrow effect ; like MGS2's reputation scared off many people from MGS3... which was a shame because #3 is very accessible and good alround fun. As featured on Metacritic, review recaps read like punchlines ; as in such, the EG review punchline ( " Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game " ) might scare off people unnecessary.

    Thanks for promising me you won't use profanities anymore ;)

  • bad09 #1547 4 years ago

    "I am actually not slamming down the EG review itself, moreso the possible effect ; as in, people canceling their pre order because reviews like this which taste so sour, without giving enough incentive to give it a chance"

    Knot, if you walked into a game shop and some bloke you don't know said don't buy Metal Gear it's not that good would you decide not to buy it? No of course not and someone basing their purchases on reviews (someone's opinion) is just as stupid. People have the brains to buy what THEY like (I hope!).

  • Knot #1548 4 years ago

    ^ I'm talking about the more casual gamer or the gamer tight on cash.

    Besides, games review sites have a different status from ' just some guy you see in the store '

  • bad09 #1549 4 years ago

    Knot for a start you and I both know casual gamers WILL NOT like Metal Gear, we ALL know it's an acquired taste which some love some hate with a few "meh" thrown in (just like every single game ever!)

    Second most people don't let reviews decide what they buy (the poorly received Haze springs to mind as a recent example which still went in quite high in the charts). How many times have you said to someone "I wouldn't get that the reviews are crap" only for the person to reply "Ah, I don't care I like the look of it anyway".

    Reviews are two things only - informative opinion on a game and fanboy console "war" willy waving, and the latter is why everyone is so upset here :)

  • Knot #1550 4 years ago

    ^ hmmmm... maybe i have a slightly more hopefull view of casual gamers...I mean... when MGS started on MSX in 1987 ( I was 9 y o at the time ) I thought it was very boring and prefered to go play outside with my buddies.

    Imo, it's nicer to see honest critiques with honest notes of the positive sides, so to give people incentive to it a shot. Especially since #4's the Solid saga's ending.
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/08 @ 22:54

  • Daymare #1551 4 years ago

    @Knot

    "Of course, I haven't played MGS4 yet, but..."
    "I don't think this Swansong should get less than 9.0 "

    Do you consider yourself a rational person? ;)

  • DjFlex52 #1552 4 years ago

    @bad09

    You're saying what I said to Knot and hopefully he'll understand the point we're making.
    I guess I got out of hand, in frustration, after1800 posts...with so many making the same argument as Knot.
    Hopefully EG will give Resistance, LBP or Killzone 2 a 10 (deservedly) so the Sony contingent will stop saying EG is MS biased or getting paid off.

    good luck, bad09 :)

  • Falbala #1553 4 years ago

    After reading the review I was expecting a lower score... 6, 7 tops. I think 8 is pretty good. Gears of War got an 8 and it was brilliant.
    I don't care really because I never finished MGS3 and ended up selling it, it was obsolete. I'm off this series but it does seem a good score for an important PS3-only title.

  • Falbala #1554 4 years ago

    "Hopefully EG will give Resistance, LBP or Killzone 2 a 10 (deservedly) so the Sony contingent will stop saying EG is MS biased or getting paid off. "

    No, this is not the way to rate games. Halo 3 didn't deserve a 10 but you can't start giving 10s to PS3 games just to compensate for the overhyped Halo 3.

    I played both original Resistance and Killzone and unless they come with some new amazing stuff those games were just ok.

    I hope either MS or Sony go bankrupt so we stop this stupid console war.

  • Isere #1555 4 years ago

    @DjFlex52

    If you can't understand the difference between getting more hits and selling reviews , thats not my problem.

    Quoting your work from the last four pages:

    ''360 owners are just hardcore gamers...''
    ''PS3 owners are unconsciously loyal & rabid in their devotion to a company...''
    ''Maybe you don't understand your own comment...lol''
    ''you're talking bullshit''
    ''Are you really as dumb as you sound?''
    ''You are bullshit!''
    ''you always come out looking dumb and dumber...lolz.''
    ''you are making a complete phud of yourself''
    ''are you nuts?''
    ''I slam stupid people who try to impose their opinion on others....''


    Yeah, you're not any better than anyone else here.



  • rotmm #1556 4 years ago

    Funny post Isere :D

  • DFawkes #1557 4 years ago

    @Falbala

    It's hardly likely that either massive, rich company will go bankrupt, and with both consoles enjoying enough success to make them viable options, they won't just give up - companies tend to be stubborn having sunk millions into their respective systems.

    I agree with you that they can't bump up future scores just to balance things out (although LittleBigPlanet better be a 10 :p ), but it seems strange they buy into the hype for most games, except this. At least it would be an objective opinion, if the review successfully explained the reviewers opinion and poiint-of-view, which I don't believe it does.

    Anyway, lets keep this comments thread going forever! My descendants can come back to see the Great Thread of 2008.

  • Les #1558 4 years ago

    Finally found an online store that still has MGS3 Subsistence in stock and ordered my copy right away! :) Maybe I'll get part 4 this calendar year after all... ;)

  • Knot #1559 4 years ago

    @ Daymare ;

    based on many playthroughs ;

    I rated MGS1 a 9, MGS2 a 8.5, MGS3 a 9.... Seeing, everything from MGS3 is brought to higher levels in
    MGS4 (factuals from previews) and then some, I can't imagine MGS4 would get less from me than MGS3.

    Besides, I don't get EG's Halo 3 10 out of 10 score either.

  • Les #1560 4 years ago

    "Yeah, you're not any better than anyone else here."

    But definitely worse than some... Put the muppet on 'ignore' and maybe threads like these will turn out into discussions instead of bashing and dick waving...

  • DjFlex52 #1561 4 years ago

    Yeah, you're not any better than anyone else here.

    @Isere

    Never said I was better. Of course I'm not better...but I'm smarter than Les ;)
    He's a elitist muppet who doesn't know others have him on ignore too...lolz
    He thinks everyone should listen to his Yoda ramblings.

    It would be nice if you had added why I said those lines in context of my posts like I did to your "full" comment, Isere, but it's the internet...oh well.

  • Sammojo1 #1562 4 years ago

    Metacritic (ie. Critic Average) Score - 97/100 (after being dragged down by the 80/100)

    Eurogamer Score - 80/100

    You don't have to have played this game to see that this Eurogamer review was rubbish. Stop trying to justify this poor review. 8/10 is NOT a good score for MGS4, and never will be.

    Don't judge the game by this dreadful review.

  • rotmm #1563 4 years ago

    @Sammojo1 "Metacritic (ie. Critic Average) Score - 97/100 (after being dragged down by the 80/100)"

    That's a fair point to make later on when there are more than 6 reviews posted there (especially as 2 of those are from official PS magazines). But as of now, using the Metacritic average isn't justifyable.
    Edited by 1 at 03/06/08 @ 10:58

  • aliv101 #1564 4 years ago

    Dont compare it to the halo review because its in a different genre. Maybe he was comparing to previous metal gears? 8/10 is still very good

  • Amon_Amarth #1565 4 years ago

    *8 is good but the real reviews have no score at the end, besides i don't even read reviews to buy a game

  • Roos-V #1566 4 years ago

    10/10 for Halo 3 - Money in EG's back pocket

    10/10 for GTAIV - More money in EG's back pocket (probably through MS's marketing)

    8/10 for MGS4 - Meaning this is "about" the same as Gears of War, watching all the fanboys get upset at what is still a GOOD score for a game - Priceless

    There are some things money cant buy. For everything else there's Microsoft

    /Runs away with fingers in ears, just wanted to contribute towards the 2000

  • MyPointIs #1567 4 years ago

    I think we should look at games like a japanese garden; The garden isn't finished until there's nothing else you can take out without breaking the core concept and values

    And MGS is a big fat garden full of unnecessary fluff.
    Edited by 1 at 03/06/08 @ 13:43

  • Sammojo1 #1568 4 years ago

    @rotmm:

    PS magazine have given bad reviews to PS3 exclusives in the past, so don't act as thought their reviews are overly biased. IGN is a very reliable review source, and they gave this game a 9.9/10. Gamepro are also reliable, 10/10. Compared to 6 other reviews, this website is out by a lot. Six other data points is all you need to identify and outlier, and sorry Eurogamer, but you are lying way out.

  • Roos-V #1569 4 years ago

    @Diamond Ice

    Not really paranoia - I dont even own a PS3! I've got the 360 and my flatmate has the PS3. Just both waiting on this to come out as we're both massive MGS fans. I'd just took the time to read through the entire comments and that was the 1st thing that came to mind from reading them!

    But in all seriousness, 8 isn't a bad score, and for me it sums up MGS's marmite tendencies. I know I'll love it because I love the others, and to expect Kojima to try to pander to a new audience in the 4th installment of his work is like expecting football matches to put rugby on at half time...or something like that

    EDIT- Speeling
    Edited by 1 at 03/06/08 @ 12:55

  • DFawkes #1570 4 years ago

    On metacritic, the summary from EG is "Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it. "

    Compared to the others:
    POM UK - "Guns of the Patriots is almost intimidating in the consistent quality of its ideas, invention, and execution...Even by the series' stratospheric standards, MGS4 is a remarkable high point."

    GamePro - "The Playstation 3 finally gets its "savior", Kojima gets his masterpiece, and gamers get one of the best games of all time."

    POM US - "If you come to the game with no prior MGS knowledge, you'll still uncover one of the most absorbing stories ever told."

    IGN - "If you've ever loved any one of the Metal Gear games, or any moments from the series, there will come a moment when MGS 4 will send your spirits soaring. If you've loved them all, well then there'll be many, many more. It’s a masterpiece.
    "
    Gamesmaster - "Despite its flaws it's a largely successful of marriage and plot and play, a towering achievement and one of the finest action games ever made. "

    Draw your own conclusions, but I think it's obvious the CAKE IS A LIE.

  • rob230 #1571 4 years ago

    Dear god children!

  • mallocks #1572 4 years ago

    "Metacritic (ie. Critic Average) Score - 97/100 (after being dragged down by the 80/100)

    "You don't have to have played this game to see that this Eurogamer review was rubbish. Stop trying to justify this poor review. 8/10 is NOT a good score for MGS4, and never will be."

    That really is a fantastically bad argument you've constructed there. Possibly the worst of the entire thread, so in a slightly peverse way I think you deserve kudos for that.

  • goon-uk #1573 4 years ago

    The games radar review is certainly the best so far. A fan of the series writes it yet keeps level headed enough to see it's flaws.

    You may agree that it's right getting a guy who clearly isn't a MGS fan to write a review, to give a neutrals perspective but that's like letting the PC brigade review GTA4? letting a gamer who doesn't like console shooters review Halo 3 or getting a Hardcore PC FPS gamer review Mario Galaxy. Games Radar got it spot on..... Eurogamer tends to have missed the point.

  • DFawkes #1574 4 years ago

    I can't wait for the Zero Punctuation review of this (assuming he's doing one). He could give it a 1/10, but at least I'd understand why, with his well constructed reasoning mixed with just the right amount of humour and sarcasm.

  • shogo10 #1575 4 years ago

    'The games radar review is certainly the best so far. A fan of the series writes it yet keeps level headed enough to see it's flaws.

    You may agree that it's right getting a guy who clearly isn't a MGS fan to write a review, to give a neutrals perspective but that's like letting the PC brigade review GTA4? letting a gamer who doesn't like console shooters review Halo 3 or getting a Hardcore PC FPS gamer review Mario Galaxy. Games Radar got it spot on..... Eurogamer tends to have missed the point.'

    I agree with you there, there is no point in letting someone to review a game who's been a non-fan. In most instances I would imagine that they already have their mind made up and that would influence their review and experience. Imagine EG letting Kieron Gillen review FFXIII, wouldn't make a whole lot of sense considering his stance on that series?

  • Rash' #1576 4 years ago

    JonFE, Don't you think you're being a bit pedantic? That's true of any game... My point is simple: in the culture of gaming Solid Snake's final outing in MGS is pretty damn important. That doesn't stop me from having a realistic perspective on life, which I sense you're pointlessly implying.

  • MyPointIs #1577 4 years ago

    Snake: Huh?

    Guy: No, you ...

    Snake: I can't believe this

    Guy: Snake!

    Snake: Wait

    Guy: What?

    Snake: I'm fine

    Guy: Help me

    Snake: That's good to hear

    Guy: Sure

  • goon-uk #1578 4 years ago

    @ shogo10

    Exactly, The EG review would have been well suited for a second opinion, not a full blown review for a game of this size.

  • Les #1579 4 years ago

    "I agree with you there, there is no point in letting someone to review a game who's been a non-fan."

    One of the difficulties with a POV like that is defining the "fan" concept. How much of a fan should one be? Should you be a MGS fan to review a MGS game or is being an action game fan enough? And how about new franchises? Or completely new genres? Or what if the block puzzle game fan on your staff quits and a new block puzzle game arrives? Can the sudoku game fan review it? Etc., etc.

    Personally, I think a reviewer should be able to review any game and not let his personal prejudices interfere too much. It's a difficult balance to strike as one can never be 100% objective but a reviewer should try his best at achieving the unachievable. Keeps the job interesting I guess...

  • anomagnus #1580 4 years ago

    if you were going to buy this game, you would have bought it no matter what the review score was.

    if you weren't going to buy this game, you wouldn't have bought it no matter what the review score was.

    but i do have to say

    ps3lolz

  • goon-uk #1581 4 years ago

    @Les

    I know what your saying, But having a professional job as a reviewer you should be able to put aside any "fanboism" aside.
    For most games, you let a FPS guy review FPS's, Platformer, review platform games. But MGS isn't really definable, it's Metal gear, There's nothing else like it. Nothing that comes close and the only thing that does are the final fantasy games because of their lengthy cut scenes.

    Metal gear isn't just about the gameplay, A big part of metal gear has always been the daft story and the cutscenes. So by dismissing the cutscenes and it's complexity just voids the entire review before you have started. It's like reviewing gears of war and saying you don't like shooting people.

  • Rash' #1582 4 years ago

    On the subject of reviews, I don't agree with personal reviews because they are the opinion of one individual. I prefer a system where the appreciation of a game is governed by a collective of differing views. I think a review panel should all play and collectively represent the view of the organisation irrespective of their personal opinions.
    Edited by 1 at 03/06/08 @ 17:30

  • MyPointIs #1583 4 years ago

    For that you have metarankings.

  • Rash' #1584 4 years ago

    Metacritic is about a collective score rather than a view.

  • goon-uk #1585 4 years ago

    ....from the games radar review

    "we've had five separate 30-minute discussions about MGS4's merits and failings"


  • Rash' #1586 4 years ago

    Deagle, They all have different opinions on a game but through discussion (i.e. appreciating, defending and compromising on each others views) they collectively form an opinion rather than represent their own personal views as that of the organisation. Make better sense???
    Edited by 1 at 03/06/08 @ 18:31

  • Krelle #1587 4 years ago

    Lets play a game:

    How many comments Can you read in this thread? Ive got 1772 out of 1887 as of now. (Ignored members.)

  • MasterNameless #1588 4 years ago

    I have 1793 out of 1889, haven't ignored anyone for a while now. Although there is lots that I should ignore on this thread, but as Deagle says, I can't bring myself to do it as it's just pure comedy! If only they knew that themselves...

    Edit: Good idea for a game btw!! ^_^
    Edited by 2 at 03/06/08 @ 19:07

  • VMerken #1589 4 years ago

    This hasn't hit 2000 yet? Come on! =)

  • Les #1590 4 years ago

    1556

    I've grown quite fond of my ignore list... ;)

  • thenastypasty #1591 4 years ago

    has anyone seen my cheese butty?

  • smelly #1592 4 years ago

    I'm missing over 100 posts.. So i presume the usual 360 fangirls are out in force somewhere in here (kryon, etc)

  • mike_mgoblue #1593 4 years ago

    Eurogamer isn't the only place to rate MGS4 with a score of 8, and some have rated it lower! Edge Rated MGS4 with a score of an 8 out of 10, and they specifically listed reasons why. Here is what Edge had to say:

    MGS4 is not the game it could have been; nor is it the game it would have been had the series grown with the benefit of hindsight; nor is it the game it should have been if you believed that early trailer.Kojima has, of course, admitted to the game’s failings.

    The greatest is the failings is the size of its maps, each venue split between several zones, themselves divided by loading screens. So your objective, rather than something tangible and relevant, often becomes just a marker on the HUD which doubles as a reset point for enemies, making escapes unduly easy. And it creates a sense of restlessness, allowing you all the time you want to explore but giving the levels little space to explore themselves.

    Technology aside, the problem is that MGS4’s agenda, unlike that of its predecessor, is not its own. Not content to just rekindle memories of Metal Gear, the game insists on physically revisiting them, veering this way and that, back and forth in time, the fates of its characters wrenched in improbable directions. An entire game could (and someday might) plug the gap in Raiden’s backstory, the Patriots’ one-time pet project returning as a Frank Jaeger-style cyborg ninja. And while few would begrudge the return of Metal Gear Solid’s classic bosses in the animalized form of The Beauty And Beast Unit, the shadow of MGS3’s Cobra Unit looms large.

    That game felt like a dialogue between Kojima and the player, a determined blend of action, cinema and podcast. In contrast, MGS4 feels more like a genie struggling to find enough goodies in the lamp, slave to the demands of everyone but itself.

  • mike_mgoblue #1594 4 years ago

    There is no doubt about it; Metal Gear Solid 4 for the Playstation 3 is a big disappointment in terms of both graphics and gameplay.

    The unbiased websites such as Edge tell the truth, and they are really ripping on Metal Gear Solid 4 because of several factors:

    * Disappointing graphics (low-resolution textures and graphic aliasing problems),

    * Poor gameplay (easy, open areas with nothing to do)

    * Boring storyline (poorly written cinema scenes that last over 90 minutes in some spots)

    All of the unbiased reviews agree that MGS4 falls far short of MGS1 and MGS2; however, everyone agrees that it is better than MGS3...although that isn't impressive, because MGS3 was a very disappointing game.

    The only places MGS4 gets good reviews is from the biased PS3 editors on Playstation websites and Playstation magazines. The unbiased websites and magazines are rating MGS4 with disappointing scores, pointing out flaws with graphics and gameplay, and telling the truth.

    I'm definitely going to rent MGS4 before I consider wasting $60 of hard earned money on a game that Kojima himself admits is a disappointment. I agree with the people who say that there is virtually no reason to buy a Playstation 3...the system has no killer apps. This was a game people were waiting for, and it was yet another disappointment, just like Devil May Cry 4.

    In my opinion, and the opinions of several professional reviewers, Metal Gear Solid 4 is the biggest disappointment of the Year.

  • Kalinin #1595 4 years ago

    mike_mgoblue:

    Selective editting, weasel words and over exaggeration are a great way to make your case, which ultimately boils down to: You don't like the game.

    Fair enough!

    Having actually read the Edge review in full, I don't think I've found a more balanced, and probably correct, opinion. The collective gamer egomass doesn't have to uniformly consume every game equally, I think most of us already (should) know where we stand with Metal Gear, everything else is just platform politics.

    Personally the longer this goes on the more interesting I'm finding it - the ambiguous reviews that express affection and disappointment are far more engaging than stuff like IGN's poorly edited love letter.

  • goon-uk #1596 4 years ago

    MGS2 better than MGS3? Laughable.
    Poor graphics? Hilarious
    Unbiased like edge? Edge deliberately rate games lower to attract attention, they have done it for years.
    "The unbiased websites and magazines are rating MGS4 with disappointing scores" A whole two? All the rest that like it are biased.

  • duncan36 #1597 4 years ago

    The same type of comments have been spread about MGS for years. Its really shoddy journalism to start your article with 'i dont like this type of game'.
    What an absolute cop out. I dont like soccer games, but if I was a paid professional I could sit down and learn the ins and outs of it and determine if it was a good soccer game or a not so good soccer game.
    If this reviewer had a professional bone in their body they would have been able to review the game without injecting their own biases into the equation.

    Unfortunately there is a pattern on Eurogamer of giving poor reviews to Ps3 excluisves and this will be my last time on this site. I have no time for sites with obvious bias. If they are taking money piss on them.

  • Widge #1598 4 years ago

    That famous website Edge....

  • Widge #1599 4 years ago

    and MGS4 is blates killer
    numnuts

  • Widge #1600 4 years ago

    The score is a bit balanced out by EGs own Shinji saying that he can't wait to get his hands on the game and it's probably going to be his game of the year/ever. Viva l'opinion!

    We've all got something to say. I reckon this is going to be my GOTY, even in advance of GTA4.

  • quantumsheep #1601 4 years ago

    Wow. Still going...

  • Widge #1602 4 years ago

    I object to bloody QUAKE WARS trying to take over my screen

  • rotmm #1603 4 years ago

    @duncan36,

    While I wholeheartedly respect your decision to never again return to this site, can I just take this moment to thank you for the weeks, months and years of deep and influential involvement in the Eurogamer community. It's people like you, shining diamonds in the proverbial dung-heap, that make sites such as this a wonderfully rewarding place to visit.

    I don't say this about everybody, but you will be sorely missed by me and (I'm sure) many others. It's going to be a long time before we can find someone to replace you, who is suitably engaging and can elucidate with such poetic prose that it warms the very soul.

    For the service that you have given to this site, I can only thank you.

  • TRUTH #1604 4 years ago

    The MGS4 graphics are a major disappointment. The games does not seem to push ahead from previous MGS games. Personally i thought MGS 2 was crap and 3 was just good - nothing special.

  • JonFE #1605 4 years ago

    Rash' I understood your point and you know what? I think it's rather irrelevant.

    The importance of MGS (or MGS4 in particular) to you and the rest of its fans is secure. No one is going to take it away, no review can break it, no words can spoil it.

    Oli Welsh didn't like it enough to award it top marks, so what? His loss, your gain. Why do you all get so defensive? Why all the "the end of an era" hyperbole? There's no need to get so worked up over some review; leave it be and once the 12th of June comes along, fire up your PS3, load MGS4 and enjoy MGS' swan song.

    I'm done with this thread...

    Edited by 1 at 03/06/08 @ 23:25

  • Rash' #1606 4 years ago

    JonFE, In that case why didn't you just say you don't agree? Why go this long winded rant about all sorts of other crap I didn't associate myself with? Instead of offering something substancial, you just threw a rant about a moral high ground in a bid leverage your opinion as if it's superior. Well done. You've made your fair share of contribution to the thread you're now done with. Talk about wasting your time and mine in the process. *sigh*
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/08 @ 01:46

  • Sammojo1 #1607 4 years ago

    Dfawkes: "On metacritic, the summary from EG is "Guns of the Patriots is a frustrating, fractured game that turns Metal Gear Solid's world upside down several times over, but never changes it. "

    Compared to the others:
    POM UK - "Guns of the Patriots is almost intimidating in the consistent quality of its ideas, invention, and execution...Even by the series' stratospheric standards, MGS4 is a remarkable high point."

    GamePro - "The Playstation 3 finally gets its "savior", Kojima gets his masterpiece, and gamers get one of the best games of all time."

    POM US - "If you come to the game with no prior MGS knowledge, you'll still uncover one of the most absorbing stories ever told."

    IGN - "If you've ever loved any one of the Metal Gear games, or any moments from the series, there will come a moment when MGS 4 will send your spirits soaring. If you've loved them all, well then there'll be many, many more. It’s a masterpiece.
    "
    Gamesmaster - "Despite its flaws it's a largely successful of marriage and plot and play, a towering achievement and one of the finest action games ever made. "

    Draw your own conclusions, but I think it's obvious the CAKE IS A LIE."


    Exactly my point. Let us remember the 10 which Eurogamer gave to Halo 3, the wonderful piece of art which that was. Not.

    And in regards to Edge. Balanced? Unbiased? No, not really. That was the shortest and vaguest review of MGS4 so far. Edge is far from credible.
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/08 @ 02:27

  • Les #1608 4 years ago

    " mike_mgoblue:

    Selective editting, weasel words and over exaggeration are a great way to make your case, which ultimately boils down to: You don't like the game."

    Mike doesn't like anything that's not on his company's 360. He's been exposed as a MS employee and a pathetic wikipedia vandalist. He's also supposed to be on my ignore list but for some reason I see his wretched posts again :(

    /fixed

  • DjFlex52 #1609 4 years ago

    As to the rest of it, the 3 games you cite got 10/10 here, so theres precious little to complain about in terms of appreciation gained. For fuck's sake I've used Halo3 repeatedly in my argument to show that although it LEAVES ME COLD AS A FRANCHISE, I'm not going to say anything negative about it because evidently a lot of people really dig it.

    Christ, the only negative thing I think I've ever said about Halo3 is that in the end (despite the hype) it was overshadowed both critically and comercially by CoD4. And that again, is an unarguable fact.

    @Arbiter

    Points taken, Arbiter...feud over ;)

    edit...ugh, snobby Les. now he's one who thinks he's better than others!!
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/08 @ 06:48

  • DAL9000 #1610 4 years ago

    @Mike_mgoblue: So... I read your posts carefully, and this is what I came away with: all reviews that /liked/ the game were "biased" because... because... because... oh, now I get it! 'cause you /said/ so. Well, gee golly gosh, that clears it aaaaaall up now.

    Seriously, it's incredibly annoying when the MGS fanboys whine about how their game is LIEK SUPAR AWESOME and ANYONE WHO DOESN'T GET IT IS DUMB (and if you don't like it you're clearly being paid by Microsoft), especially since none of them have played the game. But neither have YOU, so how can you pontificate about its failures?

    Seriously, how? On what basis are you doing this? How, without playing the game, do you KNOW which reviews you agree with and which you don't? I mean, you raise some awfully specific critiques of the gameplay, dude -- largely-empty levels and so forth -- but how can you be sure those things will actually bother you until you give the game a try?

    I'd be interested to see an answer that does Mgoblue credit. It's a fine blog, even if it DID get butthurt and whiny last year instead of just admitting that Harbaugh was right about Michigan's academics.

    Oh, and while we're on the subject of Michigan-Stanford relations and MGS4, I heard that in the 90-minute closing cinematic, you learn that Scott Shafer is Liquid Snake in a cunning disguise. No, really! Give Liquid Snake a haircut and a much less emo outfit and /the resemblance can no longer be denied/.

    P.S. No, seriously, I wanna see an answer. /Answer/, troll. I dare you.

  • Knot #1611 4 years ago

    Famitsu perfect score : http://ko taku.com/5012898/famitsu-gives-...

  • Jheronimus #1612 4 years ago

    Damn... this thread continues to consume my time... Even missing like 70 posts, while having a pretty small ignore list :)

    Why is it so hard for somebody to accept that someone who actually played the frikkin' game doesn't like it as much as other people who played the game and scored it better in you perception?

    For me personally, Edge and EG are my prime sources of reviews, since their opinion on games is more or less in line with my personal opinion. If you've got more confidence in the score given to MGS4 or any other game by IGN, GamesRadar or OPM, suits you! But that isn't an excuse to come here, crying like a baby and complaining that there isn't a way that MGS can get an 8 or that MS must have paid EG, or that the game is the second coming of Zombie Jesus... This because you haven't played the game! Wait for the 12th of June, play it and form your own biased, unbiased, but most of all, PERSONAL opinion!

  • DFawkes #1613 4 years ago

    We're complaining because this review isn't very well written, failing to state clearly why he felt that was a fair score, as well as leaving out many of the main features of the game. Edge could've given it 5 and I'd respect that, as their reviews are consistently well written, even if a little pretentious at times.

    This isn't a bad review because of the score, it's a bad review because of the review itself. Describing the series as "Flawed, intractable, unspeakably tedious at times" before even mentioning the latest game shows you have the problem of a preconceived opinion going in. Ideally, it should've been a series newbie.

  • slivir #1614 4 years ago

    MGS1 > MGS3 > MGS2

    Where does MGS4 fit I wonder?

  • Jheronimus #1615 4 years ago

    @ DFawkes

    But that's your opinion about someone's opinion. I thought that the review was pretty well written, but some comments that Oli made out of respect (from my point of view) for Solid Snake and the fact that MGS4 isn't the Holy Grail of Gaming somehow inflamed rabid MGS-fanboys.

    If you don't like the way the review(s) are written, don't read them! Hell, you can write the most biased nonesense as a review, since it's a way of publishing YOUR opinion about a game. If you don't like it for some reasons, then, well, you don't like it. The amount of effort or pretentiousness in a game shouldn't give it higher marks.

    The people who need perfect 10's on their console of choice and start whining when someone thinks their games don't live up to their expectations are looking for a substitute for their need of a live.

    Mass Effect got 8, loved it! My GotY for 2007. But I don't start pillaging the boards and looting the forums because the reviewer didn't think of it as God's gift to gamers...

  • JonFE #1616 4 years ago

    Rash', my original response to you was that MGS "at the end of the day it's *just* a game. By definition, it cannot be much more important than that..." as opposed to your "This game is more important than ppl are prepared to except. It isn't important in terms of shifting gaming trends, rather as the end of an era." comment.

    It's pretty safe to assume that my disagreement was pretty much obvious from the beginning. You *chose* to waste your time by responding, reaffirming me of the importance of this title as if I somehow missed it. You can't blame me for backing up my stance and continuing the argument.

    I don't know if I contributed anything *substantial* to this thread (it depends on your definition of "substantial";), but I sure didn't fall for the hype, hyperbole and blind fanboyism a lot of others did.

    As for your "pedantic", "long winded rant", "moral high ground" and "superior opinion" remarks, these are just your comprehension of what I said. But, hey, if winning an internet argument makes you feel better (especially after your opponent has stated that he's backing out), by all means feel free to use them...

  • DFawkes #1617 4 years ago

    @Jheronimus
    The problem is I don't know Olis opinion. That's why I read the review, and I came away wondering why he felt the way he did. I disagree with reviews all the time (even one I wrote myself once!), but this is literally the only review I've ever read where I don't see what the reviewer felt. I apologise for saying it's a poor review - what I mean is it feels unfinished, it needs a couple of extra paragraphs for clarification.

    If Oli does the same as happened with Bioshock: A Defence and clarifies everything, I'll eat my words with some peas and onions (foods I hate) :p

    Why is this only comment 1881 that I can see? I don't ignore anyone, it should be 1922... Not that anyone cares. I give my post here 1/10 now.

    Edited by 1 at 04/06/08 @ 10:38

  • Jheronimus #1618 4 years ago

    @ DFawkes

    Now that I can understand, thanks for clearing it up. No more biggie then ;)

    I don't understand either, I cleared my ignorelist to see if I'm missing out on more fanboy-gold, but aparently the comment-counter on EG is just 4/10 ;)

  • Les #1619 4 years ago

    "I apologise for saying it's a poor review - what I mean is it feels unfinished, it needs a couple of extra paragraphs for clarification."

    Well, I do feel it's a poor review but not because of the score. I'm against scoring games per se and against writing reviews that aspire to be entertainment themselves. A reviewer should understand that people read their stuff because they're interested in their subjectmatter. A reviewer should never try to steal the spotlight from the game he/she is reviewing.

  • Knot #1620 4 years ago

    ^ Well, that's basically ridiculing everyone who disagrees with the review, tagging them "fanboys" .

    The "faults" of MGS as a series are still a subjective opinion too, and they might just as well be considered
    "great qualities" instead, by newcomers.

  • DFawkes #1621 4 years ago

    Scoring things can be a bit abstract - quantifying how good a game, movie or anything is can, at extremes, make no sense.

    "So sir how was your meal?"
    "Oh, it was 8."
    "8. What, ate or the number?"
    "The number. It was 8."
    "How can it be 8?"
    "I could describe how the meal was, how the main course was fantastic but let down by the dessert a little, but I'll just summarise it as 8."
    "WHAT? How can you summarise it as a number?"
    "It was an 8."
    "But you said the dessert wasn't good, that's a big chunk? Shouldn't it be a 6 or 7..."
    "I'm not going to explain myself, that's why I'll use a number. The. Meal. Was. Eight. Okay?"
    "But how could we have improved the dessert?"
    "Let me just say this - 8. That's my summary all rolled up to one number."
    "But that's not a critisism! It's a numerical value!"
    "No, it's a fair and just conclusion to my thoughts on the meal. 8."
    "Get out sir."
    "8."
    "Is there something wrong with you?"
    "8."
    "Ah, I see."
    "I guess that 8 means this restaurant is awful and useless now then. Good day. 8."

    I'm fairly sure I took that too far. No matter, I'm posting it anyway. Basically I agree we could do without numbers on reviews in general.

  • mallocks #1622 4 years ago

    "Edge is far from credible."

    Because, once again, they disagree with the score that you'd give a game you haven't played yet.

  • ChrisTop #1623 4 years ago

    Hit 2000 plz.

  • Jheronimus #1624 4 years ago

    @ Les

    Well, I do feel it's a poor review but not because of the score. I'm against scoring games per se and against writing reviews that aspire to be entertainment themselves. A reviewer should understand that people read their stuff because they're interested in their subjectmatter. A reviewer should never try to steal the spotlight from the game he/she is reviewing.

    So the review wasn't entertaining 'cause the score that was given (even though you don't like scores) for and the analyses of the subject matter doesn't match your perception. Even more, you blame the reviewer for doing this to steal the spotlight over the game? Tell me, how where you able to sleep the last nights?

  • Jheronimus #1625 4 years ago

    @ Knot

    I can't prevent myself from thinking that even if Sony sent in Haze with a MGS-skin, you'ld still be defending it like it was your own child. Get a grip, it's just someone's opinion!

  • Knot #1626 4 years ago

    @ Deagle, if it' s really as much as a pure fan game as you think, it'll be reflected in it's sales numbers.

    As such, MGS2 & 3 can be categorized as mere fangames too ; still see their sales #....

    Anyway, i disgress... MGS2 was the epitome of being the anti-fan game. It misled the "pure MGS fanboys" in every way possible,
    thinking they'd play Snake all throughout the game with a fairly straightforward espionage story like MGS1... guess what happened ?

    Either way, many newcomers to MGS started with MSG2 and love the series since... There's even a big percentage of those year 2001 newcomers who played MGS1 after having played MGS2 ; yet still prefer MGS2 for it's plot & direction.

    As many previews stated : MGS4 is there to tie up loose ends and to come to full circle. It's win-win, instead of lose - lose.

    @ Jheronimus,

    You're insinuating I'm a Sony clown... very weak to play it on my person... Besides.... I don't give a rats ass about Haze, even though I still respect some of it's developers for Golden Eye 64.
    Edited by 2 at 04/06/08 @ 12:55

  • Jheronimus #1627 4 years ago

    @ Knot

    Excuse me for the Sony-part, I was insinuating you're a MGS-clown, my kind sir :) And I don't play anything on you personally (heck, I don't even know you), but on the frantic support you're showing here for the MGS-brand.

  • Knot #1628 4 years ago

    Anyway, a fanbase ... it's not something static... it can both shrink & grow. My MGS2 example intends to show that, despite it's hurdles for both newcomers & rabbid MGS1 fans ; eventually it grew the MGS fanbase.

    Myself... I still need to buy a PS3 actually ( + HD screen )... i will do so, because i feel MGS4 might be a very good reason, even if I did own a 360 in the past, which i sold in December 2007 for abroad study reasons.

    MGS4 might have similar workings for new PS3 players ; growing the fanbase for whoever wants to try to give it a chance.

  • tonynibbles #1629 4 years ago

    1937 comments?! Is this a record?!

    Combined with the score, Count from Seseme Street would have a field day...

  • DFawkes #1630 4 years ago

    We can't slow down, so close to the 2000! Must keep it going, I feel duty bound to.

    Regardless of this review, this game will most likely sell PS3s to MGS fans and be their favourite game ever, although the same could be said for any big release - I'm sure Halo 3 shifted a few consoles, and I'm sure the PS3 exclusive Haze must've ramped up PS3 sales by at least 40,000%.

  • Les #1631 4 years ago

    "So the review wasn't entertaining 'cause the score that was given (even though you don't like scores) for and the analyses of the subject matter doesn't match your perception. Even more, you blame the reviewer for doing this to steal the spotlight over the game? Tell me, how where you able to sleep the last nights?"

    Wow, that's a lot of bad conclusions in a single post.

    - I don't 'like' reviews at all. They shouldn't be entertaining but informative. Like a news story
    - I don't like scores at all because they're useless (as I've explained elsewhere in this thread)
    - I don't have problems with the 8, think it's fair. I do have problems with EG's inconsistency in scoring and the best solution would be to remove scores
    - The review doesn't match my perception in that it tries to be funny while it should be informative
    - Yes I blame the reviewer (and not just this one, it's a shortcoming of practically any game review; there's a lot to improve before they're on the level of movie/book/album reviews)

    I don't take gaming too seriously so I'm sleeping fine, thank you! :)

  • DFawkes #1632 4 years ago

    I like my reviews entertaining. That's why I like Zero Punctuation, which coincidentally releases a new one today, although I'm at work so can't really sit watching a video.

  • miiiguel #1633 4 years ago

    er..., reviews of a ludic item without beeing entertaining? odd..., anyway, our superior fellow doesn't like reviews at all, nor games that much, also don't like the "average net user"..., so all i's coherent

  • FlamingCarrot #1634 4 years ago

    So as someone who loves his games but has only flirted with the MGS series..is it worth getting just for the experience?

  • DFawkes #1635 4 years ago

    @FlamingCarrot

    Don't ask us! We've not played it, and MGS fans will automatically say yes. I say go out and get MGS1/Twin Snakes or MGS2 and play that. it'll be cheaper and I know I enjoyed them. MGS1 is best imo.

  • JonFE #1636 4 years ago

    FlamingCarrot, after 1900-odd comments on this thread one would assume that the answer to your question is not exactly black & white (!) but a new gaming experience every now and then didn't hurt anybody, so go ahead and try it :)

  • FlamingCarrot #1637 4 years ago

    I know its supposed to be a masterpiece but after the lengthy exposition in MGS2 i was rather put off.
    I'll give it a go and make up my own mind.

  • dloob #1638 4 years ago

    Jesus I saw the score of 8 and thought, ohh not bad then, I may have to reconsider my dislike of the series since suffering through the second half of MGS2 after the brilliance of MGS1.
    I even though the fans the will be happy with the good score.
    Little did I know that a holy war had broken out in the comments which seem to be 80% "Whaaaa you gave the game I haven't played 8 when it deserves a 10 just because I say it does"

  • smoothpete #1639 4 years ago

    Come on you spackers, nearly at 2000! You can do it!

  • DjFlex52 #1640 4 years ago

    40/40 in Famitsu. (7th ever granted)

    :D

    @Arbiter

    ....and 2 of those 7 40/40 were Nintendogs and FFXII.

    Famitsu is far from credible, sometimes :D

  • DFawkes #1641 4 years ago

    Must say something contovertial... ah, "Oh course this game would be impossible on 360, as the discs lack the capacity, and the machine itself is far inferior in every way. The PS3 is famous for it's ability to outperform the 360 on all multi-platform games, especially the orange Box which used an external team to ensure it was done to a higher spec."

    I don't actually believe that, I'm just hoping someone quotes that bit and argues for the 50-odd posts to reach 2000. If you do quote that, you're a big silly billy.

  • Zander #1642 4 years ago

    I don't think Eurogamers can handle this many comments! It won't let me see the latest in this historic battle of the geeks!

    Edit: Oh it does but the comment count on the main page is wrong or something??
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/08 @ 16:57

  • iancognito #1643 4 years ago

    If it gets to 2000 posts do they move the score up to 9/10?

  • Zander #1644 4 years ago

    Nope, it just proves how sad we are...

  • DjFlex52 #1645 4 years ago

    And Nintendogs ummm.... errr...

    Alright then lol.

    @Arbiter

    whew...if you had made a defense for Nintendogs being a 10, I would have lost ALL faith in you :D

    /chants "2000 posts"... "2000 posts"

  • Les #1646 4 years ago

    "Edge is a bit of a joke"

    Yep, they are. As is gamesTM. Their Patapon review clearly showed their incompetence (they complained about an essential feature missing which wasn't missing at all and marked the game down for it as it made their play experience a bit too much of a hassle).

    It's a bit of a shame that the coverage of video games in general isn't up to the level of that of other media. Especially as more and more 'gamers' are interested in other forms of media as well and notice the disparity.

  • dloob #1647 4 years ago

    Man I can't believe it's Otacon who kills Snake in the end.
    I always knew he was working for the other side

  • TONYgr #1648 4 years ago

    DLOOB YOU ARE KIDDING RIGHT?RIGHT?

  • DFawkes #1649 4 years ago

    I couldn't believe when I found out Snake has actually been under Psycho Mantis' control since MGS1, and was actually making everything a whole lot worse, then massacred everyone so all of the series regulars are dead.

    Okay, it didn't happen.

  • Olemak #1650 4 years ago

    I am going to add this here comment merely in order to contribute to push this thread, of which I've hadly read anything, closer to the 2000 mark. I bet we can make it. Will that be a first, by the way?

  • goon-uk #1651 4 years ago

    "I couldn't believe when I found out Snake has actually been under Psycho Mantis' control since MGS1, and was actually making everything a whole lot worse, then massacred everyone so all of the series regulars are dead.

    Okay, it didn't happen."

    The bosses from the first game will never be beaten. So cool....

  • dloob #1652 4 years ago

    @TONYgr
    Don't tell anyone but I made it up.
    I was hoping for more outrage to help it to the 2000 I've failed

    Otacon was Snake and Meryl's son too, shocking

  • barrylyndon #1653 4 years ago

    mgs3= stop, start, so so gameplay. bursting to go the toilet during another pompous cutscene then just totally losing interest after it happens about seven times. getting irritated by snakes so butch its gay voice. couldnt be bothered finishing it though i loved the first and even second mgs.
    the ps3 version=graphics not brilliant from the trailers. gameplay looks pretty much the same although you play it mainly for the story. but the fact is there is too much story, having to wade through the greatest ever amount of cutscenes in a game,
    after finishing it being rewarded by a 90 minute film when i would probably be sick to death of the bastard things.
    not too bothered about this game

  • Zaelsius #1654 4 years ago

    We're almost there… only 33 posts left to hit 2000!

    Oh yes, sorry: ps3lol

  • Knot #1655 4 years ago

    When I will finish this game, I will donate my professional Reader Reeeeeview ! ;)

    seriously

  • Rash' #1656 4 years ago

    JonFE, I guess, ultimately, I don't understand how a poster that spends his time on a site dedicated to gaming enthusiasts, can fail to acknowledge the importance of a gaming franchise, that has proven it's influence to the development of the creative industry he obviously has an interest in. Of course it's just a game. All games are all just games. Does that mean we withdraw our vested interest in them and stop acknowledging the milestones in their development? I just don't understand how you can make such an statement, which is why I don't feel you've offered anything substantial because you've not bothered to explain your original remarks. All I'm trying to "win" is a coherent understanding of your argument, which at the moment remains rooted in "it's just a game". They are all just games. Films are just films. Books are just books. Music is just music. How can you offer such an impassionate response and expect me to have respect for what you are bringing to the table??? My argument is rooted in the importance of the game to the culture of gaming and you continue to offer me "it's just a game". If it's just a game what are you doing here???
    Edited by 2 at 05/06/08 @ 11:16

  • MyPointIs #1657 4 years ago

    Well, at least we can all agree on something. That Metal Gear Solid is a silly name for a game :)

  • MyPointIs #1658 4 years ago

    1971! That's my birth year

  • dysonlu #1659 4 years ago

    Not everyone is able to appreciate fine cuisine or haute couture either. Enough said.

  • mallocks #1660 4 years ago

    Not everyone is able to enjoy shit in a can; so?
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/08 @ 09:02

  • DFawkes #1661 4 years ago

    Only a week to go until I can return to this thread with an accurate and well informed opinion on the game itself, then rubbish the review again just for the fun of it.

    I'd still like to see a "Bioshock: A Defence" style article, regardless of good or bad any MGS4 article is welcome to me :)

  • Widge #1662 4 years ago

    ONE WEEK LEFT

  • ps3owner #1663 4 years ago

    sp MGS is a bit like eastender then?

  • Widge #1664 4 years ago

    9.5 from AU IGN

    Bit strange that people seem to be keeping MGO as a separate entity from MGS though?

  • rotmm #1665 4 years ago

    @Widge,

    Well, one can only assume that the reviewers haven't yet been given any access to it.

  • DFawkes #1666 4 years ago

    Indeed, I'd imagine the servers aren't up yet. It'd be nice to see the line "MGS4 also comes with MGO, although we didn't have access to it at the time of writing."
    Not that it matters as big MGS fans will have played the beta, which I read has most of the content of the MGO Starter Pack anyway.

  • Widge #1667 4 years ago

    yes, I didn't think about that. You can't review what isn't up and running.

  • Yaz #1668 4 years ago

    "Not everyone is able to appreciate fine cuisine or haute couture either..."

    Or Pot Noodles.

  • DFawkes #1669 4 years ago

    I've been looking <a href="http://www.konam i.jp/mgo/en/how.html">here, </a href> and apparently the Starter pack will pretty much be the beta plus 2 maps, which is nice, plus dlc in the future. 5 maps is reasonable enough, I was half expecting 1 map and the rest downloads.

  • Grayvern #1670 4 years ago

    Psychonauts got many 8 out of 10 scores but it was still the second coming of Jesus.

  • JonFE #1671 4 years ago

    Rash', I don't expect you to do anything. We can agree to disagree and leave it at that. Obviously you feel strongly about MGS and I don't share that. Maybe that's why I came across as "impassionate", does that invalidate my opinion? I think not. Funny thing about opinions is that they can't be wrong or right, they are subjective. Of course I'm passionate about the games *I* like and the same goes for the music, books or films I like too, however I don't go preaching their *importance* to everyone. I prefer people to have a mind of their own and choose for themselves. Is that so bad?

    MGS is a gaming franchise of acquired taste. Some people love it, some hate it and some stay indifferent to it, like I've already said. I enjoyed the 1st when it was ported to the PC, played through the 2nd on the Xbox, have Twin Snakes on the GameCube and Portable Ops on the PSP, but haven't got the time to play them yet. I don't own a PS2 nor a PS3 (yet) so for the time being I won't get a chance to play the 3rd and 4th outing although I want to. However, I just don't see it as a milestone of gaming, simple as. For me milestones can be found into evolutionary advances, like when text adventures turned into graphic ones which themselves evolved into point 'n' click ones or when 2D gaming turned into 3D, things like that. To each his own, I guess.

    The way I see it, MGS main characteristics can be divided into two: its gaming and its story-telling elements. Some of its gaming elements have been copied since their introduction, even improved upon/surpassed, others have not. On the other hand, its story-telling mechanics can be difficult to relate to. I mean, lengthy codec conversations and 90-minute cut scenes are not everyone's taste. I respect Kojima's vision, but can't help feeling that a different approach to story-telling would be more beneficial to both the game flow and its time-deprived fans.

    Well, that concludes my opinion (and my contribution to this thread, for real this time), yours may well be different. Whether it's passionate or substantial enough to "respect" it is up to you...
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/08 @ 13:22

  • Rash' #1672 4 years ago

    JonFE, Thank you. That's a more considered and understandable response than "it's just a game". I agree that a different approach to story-telling would be more beneficial to the flow of the game.;o)

  • Mavole #1673 4 years ago

    This game, does not deserve a perfect score. Don't bash the critic for being honest. Also, can someone explain to me as to why fanboys are so immature and annoying?

  • syphaa #1674 4 years ago

    Must make it to 2000 comments...don't know why...but why not! :]

  • JonFE #1675 4 years ago

    Rash' You are welcome. Apparently the things that unite us can be more than those that divide us! Thank you for listening :o)

  • DFawkes #1676 4 years ago

    @Mavole
    The games not out yet, you don't know if it's a 10. You can, however, make a reasonable guess due to it's similarities with the existing series, much the same as series fans will.

    I don't think it's unreasonable to assume fans will like it, non-fans won't. It may be unreasonable to judge others as immature and annoying just for expressing their opinions too, especially as saying such is an opinion in itself.

    More to the point, this late into the thread this is a far too serious post, with no smiley faces, sarcasm or implied irony, or even a quote from another game such as "the cake is a lie" or a more topical Metal Gear one like "huh? Just a box!" My request is admittedly immature, but that's my right! The cake IS a lie. 2000 comments must be reached!
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/08 @ 13:51

  • Les #1677 4 years ago

    "This game, does not deserve a perfect score. Don't bash the critic for being honest. Also, can someone explain to me as to why fanboys are so immature and annoying?"

    Lol, you're trolling here as well? Always gotta laugh when immature annoying fanboys start to accuse other immature annoying fanboys... But keep it up, makes it easy to identify you and shut you up by putting you on ignore... :)

  • dr_faulk #1678 4 years ago

    Anyone managed to buy those "off the truck" MGS4 copies floating around on eBay? As reported by Kotaku?

  • Mavole #1679 4 years ago

    @Les

    How am i trolling? You're obviously retarded. I did not say this game sucked. There is no game in existance worth a perfect 10. Now, if you're going to constantly follow me around we can have an arguement of our own. Although i don't like to argue with people of YOUR calibur. Obviously i'm a fanboy because i disagree with something what a stupid and retarded assumption.

    But, hey, sure. Put me on ignore. Because obviously, i give a damn.

    What an imbecile, seriously.

    You also seem to be a very kind person. Seeing as i joined today with no attempts to even troll and i randomly get some idiot like you trying to bash me. What the hell is wrong with you? Stop inciting.
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/08 @ 14:18

  • smoothpete #1680 4 years ago

    Nearly there now... come on 2000

  • patchbox360 #1681 4 years ago

    man o live

  • patchbox360 #1682 4 years ago

    gears

  • patchbox360 #1683 4 years ago

    of

  • patchbox360 #1684 4 years ago

    war

  • patchbox360 #1685 4 years ago

    2

  • patchbox360 #1686 4 years ago

    will

  • patchbox360 #1687 4 years ago

    rock

  • DFawkes #1688 4 years ago

    According to the front page, we've made it to the 2000! Although those last few posts were a bit much, but functional.

    I've always believed a 10 isn't perfection, as that can't exist, obviously. Even attempting to quantify how good something is with a number, 10 isn't "perfect". It just means it's as refined as possible, enjoyable to play, and requires almost no change to be as good as it can ever get. The example of a 10 I always think of is Tetris on Game Boy - you literally couldn't make it better, and there have been many who have tried.

  • GamesConnoisseur #1689 4 years ago

    For me 2000 equate to only 1963 even though I have added no one to my to be ignored list. So offically the record is broken and that BEFORE the game is released!

    ....

    ....

    Where's the fanfare? Where's the party?

    ....

    Oh well I ll go back to the real world!

  • MasterNameless #1690 4 years ago

    The disceprancy with the number of comments on the front page is down to the incredibly offensive posts being deleted, made by some of the die-hard MGS fans/whingers.
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/08 @ 14:56

  • dr_faulk #1691 4 years ago

    Resident Evil 4 is a perfect 10, and anyone who disagrees is either a fool or a communist.

  • Zaelsius #1692 4 years ago

    2000! \o/

  • systems #1693 4 years ago

    @dr_faulk - is that the GC, PS2 or Wii version of RE4 you're talking about? Or are they all "perfect 10"?

    Edit - forgot the PC version.
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/08 @ 15:12

  • Jheronimus #1694 4 years ago

    @ dr_faulk

    Or a foolish communist?

  • Widge #1695 4 years ago

    The actual list is shorter because the front page doesn't reflect posts deleted by SPAM MONSTERS

  • PlugMonkey #1696 4 years ago

    These two holier than thou scores on the MGS4 metacritic page are really not so much flying with the angels anymore, but rather sliding on the slime of their bellies to get along.

    Sez you, on the basis of what exactly?

  • MasterNameless #1697 4 years ago

    A certain person's mom had their posts deleted too. Hopefully EG could figure out their proper login name from their IP address, and delete that account too!
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/08 @ 15:39

  • DFawkes #1698 4 years ago

    If there were Spam Monsters, wouldn't they feed on it and get bigger?

    Anyway, the line from Edge "nor is it the game it would have been had the series grown with the benefit of hindsight". What does that even mean? Most reviews for the last games said they were really good, use hindsight and you'll end up making more of the same. Which, apparently, they did. And I'm sure, when the developers look back after release, they'll be perfectly happy with the famitsu, OPM, and all the other good scores, and will probably manage to forget Edge on their Christmas Card list :)

  • MasterNameless #1699 4 years ago

    I'm likely to believe that the EG and Edge reviews are the only ones that aren't blinkered by their total adoration for the series. As I've known and trusted the reviews from both for many years and they're far more likely to be on the money. Of course, I don't always agree - after I've actually played the game of course, unlike so many others - but I believe that's what the definition of opinion is...

  • GamesConnoisseur #1700 4 years ago

    Even after the hullaboo with several big titles, I still find Edge and EG to be pretty good reviewers and where I do agree on good numbers of them. Heck, wake up to the fact that you cannot always agree with anyone on all things at all the time! Nevermind EG or IGN, who on the majority always overrate games so much that their averages is moved up to 7.5 or higher and not 5.0!

  • Widge #1701 4 years ago

    The thing is, Shinji pointed out that the IGN UK reviewer was a pretty heavy EG contributer so perhaps that would give a bit more gravity to their opinion. Heck even Shinji said it was most likely going to be his game of the year/ever. So it all goes down to the individual really.

  • Les #1702 4 years ago

    "So it all goes down to the individual really."

    So again the only valid conclusion is that review scores have no bigger meaning and are rather useless. A short, concise description of the game, its features, etc. is more than enough for a review. Make it 3/4 paragraphs max, a bit in the style of the round-ups for the handheld/network games.

  • Widge #1703 4 years ago

    I don't mind review scores, or personal slants on games... but I do if one is picked out as "the definative opinion"... because inevitably someone will cry out "thats not what I think!".

  • Widge #1704 4 years ago

    and websites like this would all be rather boring without personal slants too. Plus you'd only need one website ever.

  • Les #1705 4 years ago

    "and websites like this would all be rather boring without personal slants too. Plus you'd only need one website ever."

    True, but is that necessarily a bad thing? It would free up more time for other entertainment. ;)

  • rotmm #1706 4 years ago

    @DFawkes, "Anyway, the line from Edge "nor is it the game it would have been had the series grown with the benefit of hindsight". What does that even mean?"

    I think what Edge were trying to get at is the fact that the MGS story, and the story of Snake, has got ever more convuluted as the games have gone on, as each game was a story in it's own right. However, rather than take Snake on a different path, the MGS team have continually attempted to revisit situations, stories and characters from past games and shoehorn them into the next one.

    So the "hindsight" comment is probably related to the fact that, had Kojima properly planned for sequels, there would be the chance to create a more coherent and streamlined experience in the following release.

    That's how I read it anyway.

  • Widge #1707 4 years ago

    and he certainly didn't plan ahead, because he himself said he wouldn't have so heavily gone down the clone route.

  • DFawkes #1708 4 years ago

    @rotmm

    Cheers, it makes sense when you put it like that. I could see how they've been painting themselves into corners storywise, and how this can't be ideal for MGS4. Still, I don't mind a little confusioin from my stories, but I could see how others would hate the story for this one, which I'm guessing will be extra twisty to wrap things up. Only a guess, but one supported by the reviews, even the glowing ones.

  • The-Bodybuilder #1709 4 years ago

    over 2000 posts? Seriously? SERIOUSLY?

  • bad09 #1710 4 years ago

    so did we beat the IGN thread in the end?

  • Rizzle #1711 4 years ago

    Well done Eurogamers. Have a cookie.

  • Les #1712 4 years ago

    Received MGS3 Subsistence through mail the other day but haven't been able to play it yet. Maybe during the weekend. I'm wondering whether we'll see a MGS4 re-release a year from now and whether or not to wait for it. I've got plenty of stuff yet unfinished to easily last me through year... Must be strong... ;)

  • MGG #1713 4 years ago

    A review score, like the review itself, is purely opinion and totaly subjective. We all know (largely) what type of games we like or hate; surely all we use reviews for is for vindication that our pre-release thoughts on a certain game were not totally miles away from the finished item. After all, if we are really looking forward to a particluar game and it "only" scores an 8, is that really going to put us off from buying it? Maybe a 6 or 7 makes us think twice, but an 8 would really never make me think much about my potential purchase.

    Other than that and for picking up on excellent games from other genres/locations that we would otherwise have never looked at (Slitherlink or Portal for example), review scores are for generating discussion and in the modern world, page hits/magazine purchases. They are not the Truth of the game.

    But for the sake of Eurogamers page hit based advertising, please lets all continue acting like 14-year-olds.

    Thank You.

    [edit for lack of keyboard skill]
    Edited by 1 at 06/06/08 @ 08:04

  • Jheronimus #1714 4 years ago

    It has taken us about a week, but we've reached 2000!!!

    When is the next record breaking review? I put my money on Killzone 2!

  • Widge #1715 4 years ago

    I say Little Big Planet

  • bad09 #1716 4 years ago

    Gears 2 will be the next battle I'd say

  • DFawkes #1717 4 years ago

    Only 6 days. Almost urinating with excitement. Yes, you can expect daily reminders of time to release.

    Still don't like the review, and this time for a totally valid reason (valid for the spoilerphobic at least) - spolier image, first one in the review? Of course, it could be a flashback, but now I not only expect but demand the return of that machine (won't spoil it more for those who didn't notice).
    Plus there's the other image of another return, which would imply to me a dual that would kick ass a whole lot.

    I don't blame EG totally for this though, why would Konami, having been so stringent in not allowing the release of spoilers in reviews, give those images out as promo images for use in reviews? I was happy with the usual dreary brown urban combat with Snake peaking around a corner. Bad Konami PR people! EG could still just not put it on the review though.
    Edited by 1 at 06/06/08 @ 11:54

  • SeesThroughAll #1718 4 years ago

    Why hasn't mike_mgoblue been banned yet?

  • Widge #1719 4 years ago

    "that machine" was in the last video I downloaded off PSN!

  • DFawkes #1720 4 years ago

    @Widge

    WHAT! Thanks for the heads up, I was going to watch that tonight, but I don't want spoilers. I can't believe Konami would release it on the video though - this schizophrenic "Do not put spoilers in your reviews but have them in our advertisment media!" attitude confuses me.

  • MyPointIs #1721 4 years ago

    THE END

  • Widge #1722 4 years ago

    There isn't anything blatantly spoilerific to my eyes in it, a lot of contextless action shots, a scene with Meryl's bunch vs The Frogs using SOP while Snake watches on, but one of the action shots is of Rex as shown there.

    BUT if they are being so tight lipped as we know, then I can't imagine too much is spoilt by it being shown.

  • DFawkes #1723 4 years ago

    Wrong game, The End was in MGS3, don't think he'll return as he'll be long dead by MGS4, especially if you use the ingenious outside-the-box method of defeating him :)

    Even disregarding spam, this should be over post 2000, but we'll see if it stays as such. On topic again, I've been avoiding spoilers so much I only just seen the pcture of Ninja Raiden, and would no longer opject to him being the series frontman. Although I'd probably say the same for any ninja.
    Edited by 1 at 06/06/08 @ 15:06

  • Futaba #1724 4 years ago

    Know it doesn't make much of a difference, but it read like a 9 :p

  • Widge #1725 4 years ago

    And a new page for us all

  • VMerken #1726 4 years ago

    FISSION NOT MAILED

    Thank you all, have a nice weekend

  • mike_mgoblue #1727 4 years ago

    My local newspaper rated Metal Gear Solid 4 with a rating of only 6 out of 10. They pointed out that even Hideo Kojima expressed his disappointment with the game. Kojima literally said that the game was only 10% as good as he had hoped for, and he listed reasons why. He said the game has low-resolution textures, has open environments with nothing to do, and has storylines that ended up being boring and poorly written--not making sense because there wasn't enough space on the Blu-ray.

  • mailedfission19 #1728 4 years ago

    This review is the most pathetically ridiculous crap I have ever laid my eyes upon. From a media reviewer that gives generic, overrated garbage like HALO 3 a 10/10 I find this an insult to gamers everywhere. MGS is one of the few gaming series to ever cross the line into creating indulging storylines and giving the player a more-than-expected emotional connection with its characters though cinematic-like cut scenes, dialogues and ultra-realistic gameplay coupled with an imaginable future of weapon technology. how could a game like HALO which fails on almost every level of innovation and is more generic and bland as the next first person shooter out there, with its characters of no facial identity and weak emotional interaction, ever get a 10/10? Eurogamer, I suggest you wake up and get your head out of your a**hole before you review games. Perhaps at that point you will be able to tell the difference between directed cinematic art and another run-of-the-mill futuristic, lets kill all the aliens before they kill the human race category of game. At best you do a fine job of getting the attention you want, in the negative that is.

  • Widge #1729 4 years ago

    5ish more days to THE BIG EVENT people.

    I will secretly murder Game (in my brain) if its not delivered in the game.

  • DFawkes #1730 4 years ago

    @MattDamon

    Agreed, the box art is pretty poor. I certainly wouldn't rate it all to high, and as you say the US one is only a bit better. I'm still hoping the Special Edition will be better, but I expect not. Worst cover ever, 0/10

    Kojima didn't say he was dissappointed, he put it down to bad translation. What he said was he'd loved to have done more, like if you were to build your own house and run out of money, not able to build a conservatory. You'd probably be happy with the house, but the conservatory would've made it better. Now I better shut up before I descend furthur into bad metaphor mode.

  • Amoebalove #1731 4 years ago

    mailedfission19 is yet another one the 'you didn't like my favourite game series as much as I do so I’m going cry about it' brigade! Just do us all a favour and shut up. You may think that the MGS games are the greatest games ever made, but here’s the news for you, OTHER PEOPLE DON’T HAVE TO AGREE WITH YOU. If this review upsets you that much then go elsewhere but I assure you the day will come when your new favourite website, you know, the one that gave MGS4 10/10, will upset you with a review just as much as eurogamer has! Welcome to the real world!

  • bad09 #1732 4 years ago

    I'm trying to leave this thread alone but I have to point and laugh at mailedfission19 :)

    "I find this an insult to gamers everywhere. MGS is one of the few gaming series to ever cross the line into creating indulging storylines and giving the player a more-than-expected emotional connection with its characters though cinematic-like cut scenes, dialogues and ultra-realistic gameplay coupled with an imaginable future of weapon technology."

    An insult to gamers everywhere, are you a moron or do you work for Konami???? Gamers everywhere certainly do not like MGS games. MGS while a popular series, is hardly popular culture like GTA or Mario.
    Ultra-realistic gameplay? Are you sure you've even played a MGS game before?


    "how could a game like HALO which fails on almost every level of innovation and is more generic and bland as the next first person shooter out there, with its characters of no facial identity and weak emotional interaction, ever get a 10/10?"

    Because it's one of the best FPS's out there in terms of story, gameplay and multiplayer. CAN ALL PS FANBOYS PLEASE SHUT UP ABOUT HALO NOW, IT'S A BRILLIANT GAME, GET OVER IT FFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


    "Eurogamer, I suggest you wake up and get your head out of your a**hole before you review games. Perhaps at that point you will be able to tell the difference between directed cinematic art and another run-of-the-mill futuristic, lets kill all the aliens before they kill the human race category of game. At best you do a fine job of getting the attention you want, in the negative that is."

    Cinematic art?? It's a stealth/shoot'em up with confusing stories, LONG cutscenes and over the top characters nothing more, (coming from a fan of the games). I thought "wow that was cheesy" or "When will this cutscene end?" but one thing I've never thought when playing MGS games is "that's art right there".

    Jesus some people are really up their own fanboy arses :)

  • Sevens #1733 4 years ago

    "My local newspaper rated Metal Gear Solid 4 with a rating of only 6 out of 10. They pointed out that even Hideo Kojima expressed his disappointment with the game. Kojima literally said that the game was only 10% as good as he had hoped for, and he listed reasons why. He said the game has low-resolution textures, has open environments with nothing to do, and has storylines that ended up being boring and poorly written--not making sense because there wasn't enough space on the Blu-ray."

    Most of that is entirely incorrect. But then again, it is your local newspaper. Does it come on 50 GB Blu-Ray dics as well?

  • dysonlu #1734 4 years ago

    LOL. Are those 'tards serious comparing Hollow... euh Halo, to MGS? Oh yeah never mind, I forgot, 'tards love mindless shooting games. MGS is too complex and too difficult of a game for those mentally-challenged dorks. Give them two "sequels" of the same mindless shooting game, consisting essentially of more maps and a bit of touch-up in the graphics and those lowly lemmings will praise you like a God.

  • mailedfission19 #1735 4 years ago

    Bad09,if you think you are a representative of "regular gamers" you are just another moron who believes garbage titles like GTA and HALO are the pinnacle of gaming. I suggest you stay away from games like MGS, because clearly the storyline is to complex for your underdeveloped brain to comprehend. It turns out the people who passed a high school English class with a mark that atleast shows intelligence have no problem understanding what you deem "confusing stories". I'm assuming you have trouble understanding anything that has any kind of plot capacity to it. I think the problem is the majority of gamers are 11 year old kids who can never appreciate good quality entertainment if it bit them in the ass, I'd have to assume you would fall into that category as another HALO fan boy. Go and continue to play your garbage, generic games. I'm not a PS fanboy or even an MGS one. I could care less if I play Xbox or PS or whatever system there is, along as it has games or good quality. Which unfortunately, are extremely rare. But I do know what great entertainments is, and honestly I think the average person with a desire for something different, creative and innovative would be pleased with a game like MGS. Instead of the repetitive crap companies keep pumping out these days. I honestly dont give a shit if you agree with me or not, I am like you, expressing my opinion on this review. And in MY OPINION, it is absolute trash. So in the future if you don't like someone else's comment, keep it to yourself and refrain from being an asshole :)

  • DAL9000 #1736 4 years ago

    @Mike_mgoblue: Discuss the following proposition: neither Lloyd Carr nor Rich Rodriguez is worthy of holding Jim Tressel's jock. Do you agree or disagree, good sir?

  • DAL9000 #1737 4 years ago

    @mailedfission19: Have you ever heard of paragraphs? Supposedly, they're the hot new miracle cure for Wall of Text Disease. I'm telling you this because you seem to be afflicted with a near-fatal case of WTD.

  • Amoebalove #1738 4 years ago

    @mailedfission19:
    So in the future if you don't like someone else's comment, keep it to yourself and refrain from being an asshole :)

    Oh the irony!!

  • bad09 #1739 4 years ago

    @ mailedfission19

    LOL man you are really pretentious is it dark so far up you arse? :)

    Look when you come on a review and say things like "this review is a insult to gamers everywhere" you look like a twat and people will laugh at you no need to get even more insulting :)

    You say your not a fan after coming out with crap like MGS is cinematic art? OK sure. MGS IS NOT FOR EVERYONE deal with it, it's not pick up and play. I do think GTA is the pinnacle of SANDBOX gaming but unlike all you MGS fanboys on here I understand it's not for everyone (but certainly more accessible than ANY MGS game could ever dream to be).

    I have an underdeveloped brain because MGS is confusing and long-winded? OK sure if you want, but I think you'll find that to a majority of gamers (inlcuding many of it's fans) that is the case and always has been, it's part of what makes MGS. Sure there are some that thrive on the story just like some love the stupid and confusing stories of many manga films/series, but it's not for everyone that doesn't mean they have less intelligence than you, who obviously loves the long winded guff of MGS .

    Get over yourself, go play metal on Friday and forget what reviewers think and take your head out before you suffocate :)
    Edited by 1 at 08/06/08 @ 12:53

  • DFawkes #1740 4 years ago

    Only 4 days now, just a reminder to those not easily put off by the opinions of others :p

    I always found GTA as a series to be quite accessible and always regarded it as a very casual series - driving about and generally just doing whatever is easy for the casual gamer. The depth is in playing through the story and missions, which is the only option in MGS4, so I guess I could understand it being a bit hard to get to grips with. In fact, I despised MGS1 for the first 10 minutes as it was so different to anything I'd played, until it clicked and I was having fun snapping necks and hiding in boxes.

  • bad09 #1741 4 years ago

    See I found exactly the opposite with GTA MattDamon. I've seen many non gamers enjoy driving around and causing mayhem on PS2/PSP GTAs and I sure the same is happening with 360/PS3 (I've not tried 4 on a non gamer yet). Sure they won't get 100% but they have a laugh.

    MGS is DEFINITELY not that type of pick up and play game, especially for casual/non gamers.

  • Sammojo1 #1742 4 years ago

    bad09 - "CAN ALL PS FANBOYS PLEASE SHUT UP ABOUT HALO NOW, IT'S A BRILLIANT GAME, GET OVER IT FFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

    It's good, but I wouldn't follow it off a cliff. (humorous reference to lemmings)

    Halo 1 was excellent, then it went downhill. The Metal Gear Series, however, has stayed strong, as we see in every other review site (except Edge of course). Everywhere else has reviewed it as high, if not higher than Halo 3 (e.g. IGN).

    Since when is Mario "popular culture" and what does popular culture have to do with gaming? Andy Warhol?

  • DFawkes #1743 4 years ago

    Mario has been pop culture ever since the ever popular, near mythical survey where they found more children knew of Mario than Mickey Mouse. Although I have a feeling that it might have been more to do with Disneys awful current state than Marios inherant awesomeness. I have no idea how that's relevnat at all though, but I feel I have to keep this thread alive.

    Anyway, for those that have lost count it's 3 days until it's out. Saw the review on Playr, which was of course a 10/10, but the score isn't relevant, what was awesome was they showed the battle with Laughing Octopus. I'll say no more for fear of spoiling, but needless to say I know this game will be something special for that battle at least.

  • Widge #1744 4 years ago

    Confirmation from Game... hoping that I'll get it before Thursday. Seriously tempted for some time off work to enjoy this.

  • Les #1745 4 years ago

    Weather was too good to be gaming at all this weekend, so haven't started MGS3 yet. Hope MGS4 will not sell out, plan on ordering it within a month or 3. Though I might just as well end up waiting for the director's cut... Still have to start/finish FF XII, MGS3 as already mentioned, SMT Lucifer's Call (or something), Shadow of the Colossus and GoW2 to name a few...

  • monkie_king #1746 4 years ago

    Looks like another score MGS4 review score is in:
    GamesTM Review Scores.

  • DFawkes #1747 4 years ago

    I'm still surprised at 8s, not because I assume it's all 10s, but because I thought you'd either get MGS, or not - I thought it'd be a polar split between 9-10s and maybe 5-7s. It always seems those that hate it can't bring themselves to punish it properly, and even the biggest MGS fanbot has to admit there is plenty to despise if you're not into it.

    Still, nothing below an 8 yet means we're still in for a treat :)

  • LeD #1748 4 years ago

    Wow, is this the mother of all comments threads? Still going on I see!

  • DFawkes #1749 4 years ago

    If anyones lost count, 2 days. Oh yes.

    And I know for a fact I'll love MGO at least, so it's almost guarenteed not to disappoint, unless they've changed MGO considerably, which I doubt. I still reckon EG will do a seperate review and rip it to shreads because like most they'll try to play it like COD4, which I did at first. The first kill you make after having leapt out of box is so sweet though!

  • SeesThroughAll #1750 4 years ago

    "My local newspaper rated Metal Gear Solid 4 with a rating of only 6 out of 10. They pointed out that even Hideo Kojima expressed his disappointment with the game. Kojima literally said that the game was only 10% as good as he had hoped for, and he listed reasons why. He said the game has low-resolution textures, has open environments with nothing to do, and has storylines that ended up being boring and poorly written--not making sense because there wasn't enough space on the Blu-ray."

    Is your local newspaper american?

  • Widge #1751 4 years ago

    NOT HAPPY, this is someone from another forum I'm on:

    http://im g408.imageshack.us/img408/4353/...

  • Widge #1752 4 years ago

    I've been after that bread for weeks now

  • DFawkes #1753 4 years ago

    That image is a hoax, look at the disc. Closely. See it? The emblem, where it says DVD? Nice try though.

    I hope you didn't actually go back and look at the image, it's the real deal really. I'm just jealous :p He has it, I don't.

    EDIT: What happened? EG killed most of the thread! Even the image I had referenced in this post? I wasn't even a spam cull, some good stuff went. I salute the fallen posts.
    Edited by 1 at 10/06/08 @ 14:10

  • VMerken #1754 4 years ago

    I didn't expect the censor-hammer to be wielded by Eurogamer. Anyway, two more days until we can play the game and back up our own opinions with cold, hard facts in reader opinion pieces and thus metacritic the heck out of Oli's 8/10. Or not?

  • 7creature #1755 4 years ago

    LOL, 2030 posts EVEN before the game come out? Funny. So the #1 game on Eurogamer then? :-)

  • SAH1977 #1756 4 years ago

    Halo 3 10/10 lol, they must be embarassed about that score now.

    As for Edge, it was a breath of fresh air when it first came out, but they soon began believeing their own hype.
    Edited by 2 at 10/06/08 @ 23:26

  • local_celebrity #1757 4 years ago

    Just for the record.

    I love the Xbox 360, but Halo 3 was a piece of shit.

    As was Assassin's Creed.

    That is all.

  • Widge #1758 4 years ago

    Really hoping this turns up today

  • DFawkes #1759 4 years ago

    Tomorrow it's out. I've been watching the retrospectives on gametrailers.com and I'm realy, really looking forward to it.

    I also loved my 360 and wasn't fussy about Halo 3, never bothered with it. I'm sure many PS3 owners will go without this, as I could see how it's cutscene filled structure could put many off. But not me, I'll be watching and loving every second :)

  • spookyzombie #1760 4 years ago

    Played this for a couple of hours last night. I'm pretty much of the same opinion as I was with the PS2 versions. I can see a good game there, but I personally just don't get it. So I'm pretty sure that if you aren't a fan of the MGS titles that this one won't really change your mind much.

  • mattigan #1761 4 years ago

    This thread is still going?!?!?!?

  • Widge #1762 4 years ago

    Oh yeah, know its out tomorrow... its just the first ever game I've stuck on pre-order from anywhere, and you can get lucky a day early so I'm told!

  • Widge #1763 4 years ago

    No IGN US review until some time after the game has gone live:

    [link url=http://uk.ps3.ign.com/arti cles/880/880842p1.html?RSSwhen2008-06-10_223300&RSSid=880842
    ]http://uk .ps3.ign.com/articles/880/88084...[/link]

    reasoning is that MGO is an integral part of the package and although they have played the game through a few times, they won't submit a review unless it is for the entire package.

  • GamesConnoisseur #1764 4 years ago

    Eurogamer 8
    Edge 8
    GamesTM Magazine 8

    Three of the reviewers I regularly read up give MSG4 a 8!

    Mmmm, need I say more?!

    Still nothing gonna stop me get MSG4 on Thursday

  • Widge #1765 4 years ago

    ...ahem, although the EG reviewer who did IGN UK's gave it a 9.9

    And a local newspaper gave it a 6.

  • DFawkes #1766 4 years ago

    "Three of the reviewers I regularly read up give MSG4 a 8!

    Mmmm, need I say more?! "

    Yes, you do need to say more! Mainly whether you agree with those reviews or not. I read plenty of reviews, a good mix of those I agree and disagree with, but none have ever swayed my view. The POM UK review of Dynasty Warriors 6 was the worst I've ever seen - it was a tiny bit with about 30 words that some moronic review obviously done on his lunch hour without having played it. But I digress, I'm sure you read those reviews as the reviewers opinions usually line up with yours. Still never had less than an 8 so it's going to be good.

    The reviews for this I've read fall into 2 basic camps:
    Oh there's too many cutscene! Some aspects of the gameplay are too stuck in the past. The plot - WTF? Super inaccesible 8/10

    Cinematic cutscenes that you can skip, classic gameplay with a twist, plot that stands repeat viewings, for the fans 10/10

    None seem to despise the core gameplay though, and I think most will love it if they think they will before playing it. Anyway, hope to see some people sneak online tomorrow!

  • RhymeBomb #1767 4 years ago

    I'm not familiar with this reviewer's biases (everyone has one), but I couldn't help but get a "Halo 3 was better" vibe throughout the review. I'll spare you my thoughts on what the Xbox is doing to video gaming and how Xbots couldn't tell a good game from their butthole, but it struck me as odd that the few reviewers that gave MGS4 8/10 also gave Halo 3 either 9 or 10/10. Odd...but expected. The casuals and xbots have infected journalism. We already know this. It's just sad to see the proof.

  • dk_rare #1768 4 years ago

    Most epic thread ever, I actually thought it said 244 posts at first, because it couldn't possibly say 2044, right!?!

    Anyway, apparently this game is just a giant Sony advertisement with 90 minute cutscenes and 5 separate installations which take on average 3 minutes each to complete and over 5 minutes for the first one. FIVE separate installations!?! If Blu Ray on PS3 has to do five lengthy installations, doesn't that sort of make it even more cumbersome and more annoying than having to "insert disc" 4 times!?! It takes me about 5 seconds to change a disc, but it takes the PS3 5 minutes to install each "chapter"!?!

    After all this hoopla I would honestly not be surprised if MGS4 featured giant battling crabs with weak points you hit for massive damage :S

  • Ace_McCloud #1769 4 years ago

    @RhymeBomb

    You're wierd. How did you get a Halo 3 was better vibe throughout the review? I got a distinct "I prefer playing Guitar Hero vibe" from the review... and from your post there is definately a 'the apprentice is better than Big Brother' vibe...

    WTF are you talking about you massive dick? He doesn't say anything about Xbox or Halo, the comparisson would be a stupid one to make.

  • Widge #1770 4 years ago

    yeah, but its still going to be 'kin ace, eh DK?

  • dk_rare #1771 4 years ago

    No more or less ace than the other games were though, which means if you are a little tired of the other ones then probably less ace. And that includes MGS2, I liked that one. Eye candy such as Raiden should always be welcome in modern gaming ^_^

  • RhymeBomb #1772 4 years ago

    I meant that this site (along with the two other reviewers that gave MGS4 8/10) is notorious for being Xbot casual-friendly. Look at the review that gave Failo 3. These idiots know nothing about real video games.

  • etyk #1773 4 years ago

    do you get paid for this?

    c'mon 8???

    a bad review that doesn't make justice to the brilliance of the saga. between shallow remarks you almost did a job there.

    If I was your boss I would sack you on the spot. like in "the apprentice".

  • Wildsleven #1774 4 years ago

    really want this game, might save some money for a ps3 just to buy this game >_<
    and i realy hope it stays only on ps3, have an xbox myself but i have to admit MGS is a playstation game :)

    regardless of the critics it doesnt change the fact MGS 4 will and is the best game around ^_^ not a fan boy or maybe i am but hey i dont see anyone hating MGS, if u do hate this game... i hope you piss blades lol...

  • Gradius #1775 4 years ago

    OK, been playing for about 3 hours now (I picked it up from Tesco's at about 5am this morning, it was under £40 too,which was nice), and I can assure you that (so far) this game is indeed ace! :D

  • Amoebalove #1776 4 years ago

    @RhymeBomb

    wow you really are a cock!!!

  • Raziel #1777 4 years ago

    Don't mind me...

    Just wanna post in a +2000 comment section...

  • bad09 #1778 4 years ago

    Looking forward to this thread doubling in size now the game is actually out and everyone gives their opinion :)

    / gets comfy chair, sits back and waits.....
    Edited by 1 at 12/06/08 @ 10:28

  • andywilkie35 #1779 4 years ago

    i actually thought the story lines in the last few games were brilliant, i like the fact they're complex and I like playing through them again to see more and more revealed everytime. this game sounds like its layered perfectly

    now to fake illness so i can leave work and play

  • Prodigy_BE #1780 4 years ago

    Bought it last night (shopkeeper is a friend of mine), and played a good 7hours now.

    Maybe this goes horribly wrong later on, but up until now, MGS4 hovers is as good as many other 10/10 games.

    I own all consoles, I play games on all of them, but EG's 8/10 just seems wrong at this point.

  • Widge #1781 4 years ago

    ITS ON MY DESK!

    The outer cardboard sleeve is a touch loose, I rate that 8/10.
    Edited by 1 at 12/06/08 @ 11:13

  • menage #1782 4 years ago

    4 hours in and I'm amazingly impressed by it. I was kinda on the fence with this cause I hated 3 (the original, not Substinence), but the switched viewpoint adds so much this feels like a totally different game.

    It looks fucking ace, it sounds fucking ace and plays fucking ace. Now if it would only let save during cutscenes.!. The devil is in the details, this game has buckets of it.
    Edited by 2 at 12/06/08 @ 11:27

  • Jimpanse #1783 4 years ago

    Omg, 2000+ posts oO

    dont like MGS, still waiting for other games ^^

  • Zerimski #1784 4 years ago

    @Widge

    An 8 for the cardboard outter is quite frankly, ridiculous. The whole review was a complete sham, and only goes to show your bias against cardboard products. I shall never be reading any more of your reviews, ever ever ever so there.

  • Widge #1785 4 years ago

    You have to take into account that appreciators of cardboard outers are strictly a niche demographic, for MGS4 to win over the non-outer inclined, a more stable outer should have been designed. The co-ordinationally challenged among us will be dropping their bluray case WILLY NILLY, this is hardly the best footing to set off winning over the non-believers. However, Kojima's design flair does compensate for this somewhat as the outer does display what is known as "shiny goodness" as it reflects the retina burning office lighting around me in a pleasing fashion.

  • danathjo #1786 4 years ago

    first!

    what...to late?

  • DFawkes #1787 4 years ago

    @widge

    Shouldn't it then loose a point for burning your retinas, making furthur appreciation of the cardboard outer more difficult? I'm fed up of your obvious sleeve fanboyism, and demand you rescore it to 7. Otherwise you'll be the laughing stock of us members of the United Kingdom Disc Sleeve Appreciation Society, who gave it a sound trashing in our review. Not as much as the Devil May Cry 4 Collectors edition, which got a 4/10 for it's inadequete case holdage abilities, easily scratchable ink, and damage caused to contained tin. Poor.

  • DFawkes #1788 4 years ago

    @widge

    Shouldn't it then loose a point for burning your retinas, making furthur appreciation of the cardboard outer more difficult? I'm fed up of your obvious sleeve fanboyism, and demand you rescore it to 7. Otherwise you'll be the laughing stock of us members of the United Kingdom Disc Sleeve Appreciation Society, who gave it a sound trashing in our review. Not as much as the Devil May Cry 4 Collectors edition, which got a 4/10 for it's inadequete case holdage abilities, easily scratchable ink, and damage caused to contained tin. Poor.

  • Prodigy_BE #1789 4 years ago

    Played even more now.

    Still don't see why EG gave this an 8.

    This is much better than Rainbox Six Vegas, Mass Effect, Twikight Princess, Viva Pinata, The Darkness, MotorStorm and tons of other games EG scored an 8/10

    Seriously, why.

  • Prodigy_BE #1790 4 years ago

    Played even more now.

    Still don't see why EG gave this an 8.

    This is much better than Rainbox Six Vegas, Mass Effect, Twikight Princess, Viva Pinata, The Darkness, MotorStorm and tons of other games EG scored an 8/10

    Seriously, why.

  • Widge #1791 4 years ago

    Played even more now.

    Still don't see why EG gave this an 8.

    This is much better than Rainbox Six Vegas, Mass Effect, Twikight Princess, Viva Pinata, The Darkness, MotorStorm and tons of other games EG scored an 8/10

    Seriously, why.

  • Prodigy_BE #1792 4 years ago

    2000+ posts make EG tech go nuts.

    That'll teach them to give MGS4 an 8.

    /goes back to playing MGS4

  • 7creature #1793 4 years ago

    Er, my guess - Oli probably didn't like the game as much as you do? .-) How bold!

    Those haughty reviewers today - in our days, score such low surely would have been unimaginable.

  • TRACTORBOY1971 #1794 4 years ago

    have not played it yet ( kids want to watch TV) what is the install like. I hope it aint too long......I do hate these long installs I don't get them on my xbox, so why on the playstation. Hopefully someone will tell me it is only 30 seconds.

  • TRACTORBOY1971 #1795 4 years ago

    have not played it yet ( kids want to watch TV) what is the install like. I hope it aint too long......I do hate these long installs I don't get them on my xbox, so why on the playstation. Hopefully someone will tell me it is only 30 seconds.

  • Zerimski #1796 4 years ago

    8 minutes, give or take. For the initial one anyway.

  • etyk #1797 4 years ago

    "Still don't see why EG gave this an 8.

    This is much better than Rainbox Six Vegas, Mass Effect, Twikight Princess, Viva Pinata, The Darkness, MotorStorm and tons of other games EG scored an 8/10

    Seriously, why."

  • daedaloz #1798 4 years ago

    IGN just gave it a 10/10

    "Is it possible to give a game an 11? If so, this would be the game that would merit that score. Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots is a title that exceeds all of the hype that was attached to the title. Regardless of whether you've seen every trailer and screenshot, read every preview and heard every interview, you won't get a full sense of how phenomenal this title is unless you sit down and experience it for yourself".

    [link url=http:// ps3.ign.com/articles/881/881472p1.html
    ]http://ps 3.ign.com/articles/881/881472p1...[/link]

    Speaks for itself I guess.. :)

  • Nikanoru #1799 4 years ago

    Haha, OVER TWO THOUSAAAAND!~!~!


    Hopefully someone will tell me it is only 30 seconds.

    Actually I think it's more like 10 minutes.


    This is much better than Rainbox Six Vegas, Mass Effect, Twikight Princess, Viva Pinata, The Darkness, MotorStorm and tons of other games EG scored an 8/10


    Dunno about some of those other games, but Twilight Princess got a 9.

    Face it, just because MGS4 has EPIC CUTSCENES doesn't mean it's special. It just makes some people think it is, while others (like Edge) can see through the nonsense and 3 hour codec conversations and judge the GAME for what it is. Namely, just another game.

  • aj178 #1800 4 years ago

    rofl euro gamer .. pro evolution 2008 9/10? .. i played PES 2008 and it doesn't deserve a 6/10 .. this is shows me how are some
    reviews here are not really worth reading

  • Widge #1801 4 years ago

    Played it last night. Every bit as wonderful as you could hope for!
    Now is the time to cast off all the reviews and scores you have read to date, and validate your own opinion in your mind. Thats the one that counts.

  • aj178 #1802 4 years ago

    rofl euro gamer .. i was checking euro gamer's reviews to see how worthy is euro gamer i found out that pro evolution 2008 9/10? lol.. i played PES 2008 and it doesn't deserve a 5/10 and metal gear 4 got an 8/10. this is shows me how are some reviews here are not really worth reading

  • Widge #1803 4 years ago

    Interesting comment from the IGN review:

    "In fact, the longest cutscene within the game clocks in around 45 minutes, which can be rather daunting by the numbers. However, the scenes themselves are engaging enough that most players won't pay attention to the clock, although you can pause the cutscenes if you need a break or life interrupts, which is an excellent addition for this title."

  • Widge #1804 4 years ago

    Plenty in there to play too.
    If you want to run around and shoot stuff using the MGS4 engine, just play MGO then.

  • amcd28 #1805 4 years ago

    @ Arbiter

    Check this: [link url=http://en.wikipedia .org/wiki/Game
    ]http://en.wikipedia .org/wiki/Game
    [/link]

    Clearly says that a key component of games is interactivity.

    http://www.thef reedictionary.com/game - refer to sections 1, 2a and 6a - nowhere does it say that you have to watch a 45 minute cutscene for this to be enjoyment...

    Re: DiamondIce's comment regarding MGS4. This is of course, someone's personal opinion of: you guessed it, a game!

    Because some people don't want to watch huge cutscenes does not make them ADD afflicted chimps. I know I wouldn't and I spend all day in my job dealing with complex issues that require minute attention to detail.

    We're allowed to have an opinion. Just because it ain't yours doesn't make it wrong, or someone stupid/retarded or plain blinkered.

    I know that Halo 3 was NOT a 10/10. It was a 7.5 at best and I put it down for 3 months to play other games, but others won't agree with me.

    That's an opinion. Does it frighten you?????????????????????????????????????

  • amcd28 #1806 4 years ago

    Oh go on, you know you want to conform to a dictionary definition x-)

    Kidding. Whilst I understand that it's an acquired taste for most, I do think that this might put off those who have an interest in joining the series at this late stage.

    In no way is it anything but a fabulous bit of entertainment, but all I say is that plot complexities/confusion/long cutscenes may alienate some.

    Halo 3 just disappointed me. Some great bits but just not enough to finish a series in style...

    Inflammatory or not, it did make me chuckle.

    Oh yes, I must thank you for not being Swam. :¬)

  • Prodigy_BE #1807 4 years ago

    @MattDamon

    Are you really Matt Damon?

  • Barkotron #1808 4 years ago

    Seriously FORTY-FIVE MINUTES?

    A fucking FORTY-FIVE MINUTE CUTSCENE?

    I despair.

  • Snooz #1809 4 years ago

    Chraist, this thread is long as a MGS cut-sc.....bah, I can't even bother to read the first 150 ones.

    Could someone write me a summray of the viewpoints of this thread? keep it down to a million words please.

  • DFawkes #1810 4 years ago

    @Snooz

    80% "I disagree, this game is very good"

    15% "I agree, cutscenes bore me and the gamee hasn't changed enough"

    2% XBox fanboys "Ha ha! What you going to do now PS3 fanboys! It sucks!"

    2% People from the first group "It's very good, shut up!"

    5% Spam Filler (Mmm... Spam Filler...)

    0.05% DFawkes Wrong Maths

  • bad09 #1811 4 years ago

    Was naughty and got it today :)

    Only played 1 hr 40 but a lot of that was watching! Sure it is fantastic yes and the gameplay itself is great and fantastic looking but straight away I see why 8/10 is reasonable and fair. I think maybe the 8 on EG was based purely on MGS4 and did not consider MGO in any way (maybe they should have said that). Yes the engine is bloody amazing and I can't wait to get online but man already the scenes are too long, cool yes, even breathtaking, but too much.

    Sure I've got a way to go but based on what I've seen of SP it deserves 9/10 tops, 8 maybe a little too harsh for me but I'm a fan. Yet to play final "starter pack" but judging on the beta of MGO I would say 10/10 for the whole package. But 8 seems fair in a everyman sense though. The guy at my local game shop and my cousin both said it's not for them, I'm gonna try it on my mate later see what he thinks, but to fans it's definitely a 10.

    Anyway I'm certain fans will be arguing this for a while, whats the guess, 4,000 posts? 5,000?

  • Barkotron #1812 4 years ago

    @DFawkes: you missed

    30-40% - "What the hell are you complaining about? 8/10 is a perfectly good score"

    and

    5% - "I am a pompous halfwit and I disagree with the opinions in this review therefore the review is poorly written."

    So altogether, I reckon we've covered about 150% of the thread, which seems about right...

  • L42yB #1813 4 years ago

    Wow...

    Just wow

  • bitesize #1814 4 years ago


    where's all the reader reviews then? i half-expected to see a bunch of gushing 10/10 reviews posted up by lunchtime yesterday to "prove" that EG got it wrong...

    get to it MGS-ers!

  • Knot #1815 4 years ago

    ^ We need time to digest the fine wine :D

  • Kryon #1816 4 years ago

    8/10 is spot on imo. Everything about the game is great except there seems to be very little 'actual' game in there. It's an interactive CG movie basically. I'm all for flashy cut scenes but it's just too much in this game. You come out of one 40 minute cut scene and regain control, walk three steps forward and BANG, another 40 minute cut scene. I know the MGS games are well known for these long cut scenes but MGS4 just takes it that little bit too far. I wasn't too happy about the forced install either and I could hardly believe that the game has to install every time you complete/watch a level.
    Edited by 1 at 13/06/08 @ 18:46

  • foamy #1817 4 years ago

    aj178, you managed to repeat the same error 3 times.

    "this is shows me" - I actually laughed at this.

  • Knot #1818 4 years ago

    Gamespot ranks MGS4 10 out of 10 ! http://ww w.gamespot.com/ps3/adventure/me...

  • AJUK #1819 4 years ago

    I'm a few hours in now, still finding it incredibly tough to get excited about the game. MGS is a huge dissapointment for me so far. The length of some of these cut scenes is a joke! Seriously, this isn't cinematic, there are few films that would spend this amount of time on soap-opera style dialogue scenes.

    And don't get me started on the inability of Snake to climb over or destroy a simple pile of wooden crates, if we have to have artificially blocked routes, must the be blocked with items that would be easily climbable in real life? I though I'd seen the last of the sort of thing in Code Veronica! :(

    I don't think this is even an 8/10 for me, more like a 6. I wish I'd got Grid instead.

  • Sammojo1 #1820 4 years ago

    Maybe it would be an 8 in an imaginary world where the cut scenes were actually 90 minutes long, but in the real world, Metacritic says 95/100. Sorry Eurogamer, but you were off by quite a bit...

  • Isere #1821 4 years ago


    this game is so awesome

    THIS GAME IS SOOO... AWESOME

    THIS GAME IS SOOOOO...... AWESOME:)

  • Isere #1822 4 years ago

    Oh and I see the MS folks are still in denial, getting all green and lying through their teeth about having played it.

    A MOMENT OF SILENCE FOR YOU :(

    Edited by 1 at 14/06/08 @ 05:39

  • Widge #1823 4 years ago

    Unless you're someone who is sitting through, playing it and loving it, then it is.

    Conversely if you're sitting through wanting to tear your eyes out, its not.

    I'm currently wanting to BOOT "the woman" off the TV so I can have a go! Sat and watched the Act 1 briefing while brewing up and really liked the interactivity you have with the brief. A long way off the old days of MGS1 where it was a static sepia shot and a couple of camera angles!

  • Widge #1824 4 years ago

    interesting... the comment I replied to VANISHES

  • Raptornas #1825 4 years ago

    Heh I love the ability of the internet to confuse opinion with fact.

    Morons.

  • IneptPercy #1826 4 years ago

    Still not played it, still can't justify £300+ to play it... back to my DS I go....

  • MrDurandPierre #1827 4 years ago

    I'm about 6 hours into the game and really liking it a lot. I've always felt the Metal Gear games were unneccesarily long-winded and had rather boring narratives, but I'm astounded to find myself really enjoying a vast majority of the cutscenes this time around. They're not all great. Occasionally characters will go into exposition mode where they merely explain something to you in a long, drawn-out monologue while you're treated to what amounts to little more than a power-point presentation on the subject (this is most noticeable during the mission briefings and the scenes with Drebin), but otherwise the cutscenes are rather involving. It's the first time in a Metal Gear game where I've gone for probably more than 20 minutes watching something without once looking at my watch, and that's new. The gameplay is better than it's ever been before too, which is quite an impressive feat given how great Subsistence was. I had high expectations for the game, but also a few reservations (I basically expected a high-res Subsistence), and I'm happy to report that the game has surpassed my expectations in just about every concievable way. Can't wait to play more.
    Edited by 1 at 14/06/08 @ 20:27

  • MiY4MOTO #1828 4 years ago

    I vowed I wouldn't add my voice to this thread... but, why not eh?

    I've played the game thru to completion. Sat thru every cutscene, and for me Eurogamer's review stands true. Personally I'd probably only give it a 7.

    Now before everyone starts raining on me for not being a fan of the series, talking out of my arse etc. I first came across Metal Gear Solid on a grey import Japanese demo which blew me away. I then forked out for a Japanese copy of MGS in it's first week of release and played the game to death. Completing it more than a few times entirely in Japanese. As soon as an English language version showed up I picked it up again and played through it. I bought it again when MGS: Integral was released, got ZoE for my PS2 just for the demo of MGS2, played thru MGS2 a couple of times. I never liked MGS3 tho, and I confess I couldn't be bothered with MGS3:Subsistance. However I was quite looking forward to playing as Solid Snake again after so long, and the rumours of a return to Shadow Moses island had me intrigued.

    I found the first couple of Acts rather average, with the gameplay kinda dull. It's not changed much since MGS2, the level designs were uninspiring and the enemy characters very simplistic, with some terrible AI. The environments were pretty lifeless for a war torn city. I couldn't help but compare it to Splinter Cell: Double Agent's Congo level which had so much more drama and life to it, than the oh so grey and brown levels of Act1 & 2. Before you start, no I'm NOT saying that SC:DA > MGS4.... They are 2 very different takes on the same genre, but I felt that MGS4 could have benefited from some livelier, more interactive & less rigid level design. The first 2 Acts however are closed with a fantastic cutscene in which an old character makes a nice return.

    The camouflage is a nice trick, but pointless for the most part, and redundant after the first 2 acts. Again, no where near as functional or integrated as SC's visibility features. Visually more impressive, but it just felt tacked on and superfluous to me.

    Act3, without giving anything away, is for me MGS4's finest sections. The gameplay here is varied, the visual style (although very brown again) has a very different feel and was a breath of fresh air to this otherwise backward looking MGS title. The now obligatory vehicle section (hell we can't have an action game without one these days) works well. It has some very tedious cutscenes, it was from here on in that I found they REALLY began to grate, with cutscenes frequently over the 20 min mark, spaced out with a few mins game play at best. The closing cutscene is arguably the best in the game, but it weighs in at over 30mins easy, and then is immediately followed with mission briefing, which is then followed with an intro to Act4, which is followed with a codec conversation etc.

    Acts 4 & 5 the cutscenes / conversations get longer, the gameplay segments get shorter. Lots and lots of loading screens. (Why do you have to press start nearly every time it loads?) and by the time the game reaches it's climax it almost turns in to Dragons Lair where its a simple case of hammering triangle, or pressing R1.

    The cutscenes are stunning they really are, but by the end of the game I was tired of them, too many, too long and some of the dialogue was up there with Matrix Revolutions as some of the worst delivered. The boss fights are nice, and manage to capture the feel of MGS1's tho I felt they got weaker as the game progressed. The climactic fight was a let down for me. It looked great, but the sections where you actually controlled the action were so dull to play. A complete contrast to the epic visuals at that moment.

    If I was reviewing the cinematics then hell it's a 10 all the way. But we're not, it's a game... and there's not that much of one in amongst on the cutscenes, exposition & codec conversations, and it's not really progressed much despite a large visual makeover. If only the game had been pushed half as far as the visuals we'd have had one hell of a treat.

    ...and for the people commenting that there are no 90min cutscenes. From the moment you defeat the end of game boss you get a cutscene around 20mins or so, immediately followed up with 70min epilogue. Make sure you sit thru the credits if you wanna see it all. 20+70 = 90mins of none gameplay. Pressing start between sections does not count as gameplay.

    Oh, and the bit were Otacon has a jibe about "not having to put disc 2 in" FFS.

    I'd rather insert a disc than do a 2-4min install between each Act. It gets particularly annoying if you want to show someone an earlier Act, cos to go from Act4 to Act2 you have to reinstall Act2 to show them, and then reinstall Act4 when you want to carry on your game.

    And you'd have thought that installing from BluRay might have eliminated loading, maybe at least between sections of the same level.... No. Lots of loading screens, brief for the most part, but when the gameplay is as interrupted by cutscenes as it is, it becomes particularly annoying when it has to load again after a couple of minutes of gameplay.

    It has some great moments, and some superb visuals, but be prepared to wallow through a lot waiting to get to them.

    I am aware that the Sony fanboys will think I'm crazy, but I refuse to get swept up in the hype of a game. GTA4 should never have been a 10, but it is a better game than this. MGS might be among the most beautifully presented game of recent times but presentation alone does not justify a 10.
    Edited by 2 at 14/06/08 @ 19:25

  • 7creature #1829 4 years ago

    MiY4MOTO: In other words, current generation of consoles cannot rival the combination of visuals and performance available on PCs :-(

    If the loading and installation times were not an issue (full installation on fast hdd for example), would you rate the game higher?

  • MiY4MOTO #1830 4 years ago

    @ 7creature

    No, my personal score for it was based on the content of the game alone.

    I did find the installs & frequent loading annoying, but they don't really contribute to my score, I was trying to review the game, not the technology or implementation of it. It was the game's reference to the fact that "hey we don't have to swap disc's now" I found particularly galling.

    It would have been better doing a bigger install and simply using the BluRay for access after an initial install, it almost seems ridiculous to me to install an Act at a time, and then reinstall if you go back a level. It almost feels like the technology is flawed. A PC type install would definitely have been the way to go here.

    Personally however I feel that the need to install games on a console is wrong. Why do it? Without wanting to go into a 360 vs PS3 argument, if the 360 can run the same multi-platform games at least as well as the PS3 without the need for an install or even a hard-disk, then there has to be an issue. If BluRay can hold that much more data... Why install at all?

    The answer is simple, access times. We all know that. But if you're gonna do an install, for the love of God do it once, and only once, when you first put the game in.

    As for the PC vs Console question, I must confess I am an ex PC gamer. I can see the benefits of PC gaming, mouse / keyboard, faster HDD, superior hardware, upgradability etc. I for one simply can't justify the price difference.

    You can pick up Assassins Creed and a 360 for under £200, and you will have one of the best looking games around. To get a PC to deliver that kind of experience you would have to shell out a hell of a lot more, and then continuously invest in it if you want to stay up to date.

    Simply put, the very best PCs will always deliver a better audio / visual experience than the best Console of the time But it always comes at with a price tag. For me Console gaming always offers better value for money... That & I'd rather play games on my 46" HDDTV, from the sofa in DTS on a wireless pad, rather than hunched over my keyboard & mouse and believe me, there was a time when I would have never thought it possible that I would prefer Consoles to PCs.

    Like anything, it comes down to personal preference, and right now I feel that the Console gaming "experience", for me at least, is a better & more viable one.
    Edited by 2 at 14/06/08 @ 20:49

  • dloob #1831 4 years ago

    @MiY4MOTO

    You should stick that in a reader review, it's an interesting read

  • TRUTH #1832 4 years ago

    The gameplay graphics are a bit of a let down as is the animation also fairly liner...The cut scenes do start to grate, I honestly can't be bothered with the story. MGS - The 1st Playstation was good, but 2, 3 & 4 are just getting more silly and depends to much on cut scenes.

  • assache #1833 4 years ago

    Metal Gear 4 will be an experience every true gamer should want to taste. I own a 360, but, the fact is, as a gamer, I want to play landmark games. However you view the Metal Gear series, it still remains one of the legends of console gaming.

    Fanboy or not, why would you not want to own a part of, what will one day be, gaming folklore.

    Pay day comes....... PS3 arrives...... MGS4 loads up.................... History is upon me!

  • tonynibbles #1834 4 years ago

    I'm half way through and I can not see, in any way, how this game is an 8. A 9 at the least, but for me a 10.

    With Metal Gear Online such a wholesome experience, it essentially makes this a 2 in 1 package available for just £34.99 in some places - This is great value gaming and whole heartedly deserves top marks for the huge attention to detail and finish througout.

    Nothing short of beautiful or genius.

  • Gradius #1835 4 years ago

    @MiY4MOTO

    Good post. I'm on my second play through at the moment and I agree with practically everything you've said.

  • GamesConnoisseur #1836 4 years ago

    I also second lots of Miyamoto's fair but cutting comments that lance the issues at heart of the vaunted flagship of PS3 gaming. I have played through the whole game and now going thru it again at higher difficulty.

    Be not mistaken that I actually loved the game, and indeed the biggest motivation in my splashing out on the PS3 early last summer, and since then it was pretty much clear that it was the same for many other gamers, that MSG4 is the one title that they are holding out for up to now.

    There is now no room for any suppositions, as we have it in our hands, warts and all.

    The biggest issue for me is the astounding need for reinstallations 3-4 minutes each time you move over to another act or going back to older one. I would have preferred to choose full install option as have larger HDD capacity and very horrified if MSG4 is the future of PS3 gaming then we would see more? This is the white elephant not many PS3 gamers are wanting to talk about?

    Its now in the room and I am frankly simply disturbed. Hope that Konami will include full install option in future patch, or I ll have to put up with lots of cuppa teas in the meantime. As I want to replay everything again with weapons unlocked to beat higher difficulties and trying things out differently.

    So that for me is enough to drag down the score from 'perfect 10', and where PS3 owners need to honestly ask themselves if they want this sort of things in future games.

    I would have given game a 9 a point higher simply down to MGO but SP game itself IMO cannot deserve a 10, absolutely not and only rose specced fans would say so! Remember I am talking about the GAME and not the movie/story/plot medium which MSG4 is not. 8 would be fairer but again only an abstract number and different meaning for each person. For me 8 indicate a very good game with some flaws/faults.

    Still whatever arguments, this game is meant to be enjoyed and you should do so to the fullest but why some of us are standing up is because we felt that we need for balanced views.
    Edited by 2 at 15/06/08 @ 19:43

  • TRUTH #1837 4 years ago

    I am disappointed with the graphics - I was expecting alot more as this is a AAA title...The cut scenes do start to drag and feel sometimes like a set of mini games then continuous play...I gonna stick with it, but at the moment this is not the AAA I was hoping. At the moment there seems to be more cut scenes then actual gameplay!

  • Gradius #1838 4 years ago

    I don't really see how anyone could be 'disappointed' with the graphics of this game. The one thing I will say though is that I don't think any of the Metal Gear games have had the same wow factor as MGS1 did back on the PS1. That really did seem way ahead of its time, so in that respect I can see that MGS4 doesn't impress in the same way because we have quite a few amazing looking games out now to compare it to. It certainly isn't what I'd call disappointing though..

  • paulsaz #1839 4 years ago

    The only MGS I played was half of 2 on the xbox, the mgo beta got about half an hour before being consigned to history by gta 4.

    Just finished MGS4 and it was by a country mile the best game I've played this year. Given some of the 10's given out lately for this to get an 8 is a little silly. This is so much more accesible than I remember 2 being. Hell you don't even have to play it as a stealth game.

    Does it have OTT self indulgent mammoth cut scenes - yes.

    Does it stop it going to the top of my GOTY list so far - no. Wonderfully bonkers and brilliant throughout.

    11/10 from me.

  • TRUTH #1840 4 years ago

    I'll give it 7 out of 10 - better then 2 on equal as 3, just hasn't pushed forward enough (not inc cut scenes!)...The problem is the movement of Snake is not improved, most gadgets are just gimmiks - you don't actually really need to use as often as they give. AI is still old school of stealth. Graphics are good enough but not what Sony made them to be. I still find the cut scenes a drag and to often. I suppose this a game your either love or hate it - I just expected more major improvements but got what 2 & 3 have already done.
    Edited by 1 at 15/06/08 @ 20:19

  • MiY4MOTO #1841 4 years ago

    Thanks all for your comments regarding my earlier post, far from the scathing backlash I feared.

    I have actually started to go thru it again on the hardest difficulty setting (my first play thru was on the Normal Outside Japan setting) and I'm now skipping the majority of the cutscenes, trying to savour the game, rather than uncover the plot. I doubt I'll shift my opinion, but it does at least shift my focus slightly.... if that makes any sense.

    I must also state that my 7 score was purely for the single player game, since this is why I purchased MGS4 & have yet to play MGS Online.

    I've yet to be converted to playing online on my PS3... I own Warhawk & have had a couple of good matches. But for online games I do tend to drift back to my 360... Primarily because I have a bigger friends list on Live, I own more 360 games, & the ability to privately chat to friends while we play (whether the same game or not) just seems fundamental to me.

    That aside I will make a point of at least trying MGS Online, although I confess none of the trailers made me want to play it tbh.

    What's the general consensus regarding MGS Online? I've not come across many reviews / comments regarding it.
    Edited by 3 at 15/06/08 @ 21:03

  • TONYgr #1842 4 years ago

    @MiY4MOTO

    the best review that i have read in EG.i completely agree with you.but i ve got to say myself i,too find the whole install/reinstal the acts ridiculus.i think its the first time something like this has happened in gaming history.one of the worst game desighning choices ever made.anyway im gonna play it again like you on a higher difficulty.also i want to say that mgs3 subsistence is the best in the series after the first one in ps-one.you should see it.
    Edited by 1 at 15/06/08 @ 22:51

  • ravengear4 #1843 4 years ago

    This site is horrible dont get me wrong i dont blieve mgs4 is 10/10 because there is no perfect game. I do however what the shitty game review who review both Halo1,2,and 3 and MGS4 to tell me how they are better because ive played them and there are way better games then halo that deserve more praise than it. That pisses me off ill never come to this site again MGS4 deserved better and even Time magazine gave Hideo Kojima one of the ten most influencal men in technology.

  • ravengear4 #1844 4 years ago

    This site is horrible dont get me wrong i dont blieve mgs4 is 10/10 because there is no perfect game. I do however what the shitty game review who review both Halo1,2,and 3 and MGS4 to tell me how they are better because ive played them and there are way better games then halo that deserve more praise than it. That pisses me off ill never come to this site again MGS4 deserved better and even Time magazine gave Hideo Kojima one of the ten most influencal men in technology.

  • ravengear4 #1845 4 years ago

    This site is horrible dont get me wrong i dont blieve mgs4 is 10/10 because there is no perfect game. I do however what the shitty game review who review both Halo1,2,and 3 and MGS4 to tell me how they are better because ive played them and there are way better games then halo that deserve more praise than it. That pisses me off ill never come to this site again MGS4 deserved better and even Time magazine gave Hideo Kojima one of the ten most influencal men in technology.

  • Amoebalove #1846 4 years ago

    @ravengear4

    oh on! please don't go i miss you already!

  • fcpthebest #1847 4 years ago

    8?????????????????????????
    u got to be kidding me
    never played the 1, 2 or 3 entirely
    (only demos)
    This game deserves a 10/10
    I didnt like stealth
    after this im another person
    the beasts are strange
    how to get past them without killing the girls?
    if this gets a 8
    then halo deserves a 6
    i dont understand halo its not that good
    only played the online for 20 min
    BORING BORING BORING BORING
    Edited by 1 at 16/06/08 @ 12:22

  • GamesConnoisseur #1848 4 years ago

    10/10 means different thing to everyone that is pretty clear, so whilst in EG useful to recap what 10 means;

    [link url=http://ww w.eurogamer.net/scoring_policy.php
    ]http://ww w.eurogamer.net/scoring_policy....[/link]

    - Ten is never going to be perfect but certainly have to be groundbreaking, consistently enjoyable and all round beautiful game. Top of it genre perhaps.

    - Nine is a must buy but still perhaps similar to other in its stable, not ground breaking enough.

    - Eight is the almost briliant but nine score pulled down to Eight due to some kind of flaws or game hurting features.

    Now above is my interpretation and why I would not give 10 out of 10 for my own take of MSG4. Can see why EG gives an 8 but I do consider the whole pack a 9 would be fair for MSG4 inc MGO. RE-Installations DO get on my wick, as if you replay the game 3 times then you will sit through no less than FIFTEEN installs and take up GOOD 45 to 50 MINUTES of your time!!

    It is only with MSG4 that the issues with Blu Ray access time and installations GOT thrown to the fore and this will generate more discussions as it should.
    Edited by 1 at 16/06/08 @ 13:40

  • Aloominum_man #1849 4 years ago

    No one's picked up on the use of sound in this game (probably because no one cares) but, having played lots of titles in the last 6 months that have brilliant, immersive surround sound effects, MGS4 really disappoints. Don't get me wrong, it's not bad but, again, I was expecting something better from such a lauded title. Highly repetitive quotes from NPCs and ridiculous bullet/impact sound effects in the surround mix that don't correspond to anything that's really happening near you - just a cheap attempt at creating a feeling of a dynamic battle. Same goes for some of the visual effects - bullet impacts / dust billowing even though I'm around the corner from a fight - it seems that they are triggered as you enter a certain area and continue until that event is finished, even if you retreat back out of sight...

    Don't get me started on the fire effects.

  • MiY4MOTO #1850 4 years ago

    *sigh*

    I do wish people would refrain from dragging Halo in to this thread. The discussion here should be about MGS4 really. I do tire of posts which read like "how dare he give halo123 a 10 and only an 8 for MGS4. Eurogamer is teh sux0r! n00bs!"

    If you don't agree with the fact that a site dared not to give MGS4 a 10 then lets discuss why it should be a 10. What for you makes it a 10? If you can't justify why for you at least it deserves a 10 then I dare say you haven't played it.

    I've nearly gone thru it a second time now, skipping cutscenes as I go this time and I stand by my earlier post. It truly has moments of greatness, but for me at least they are too few and the gameplay doesn't really grab me. I've found that on my second time thru, now I know the plot & what's coming I have no real driving force to get thru it. I simply don't find the gameplay exciting. Even on the hardest skill I find the AI terrible and some of the gameplay decisions just bewildering.

    The ability to buy ammo at any point in the game is one example. For me, personally, MGS for me should be about stealth & this simple gameplay change effectively removes it. You never find yourself with your back to a wall, hiding behind a crate, out gunned, with less than a clip of ammo and a room full of guards hunting you down. THAT for me was the essence of the MGS experience! But by putting in Drebin, and his Drebin Points it's true that it may make the game more accessible for a lot of gamers, a lot of design decisions are about trade-offs. Indeed you can't please all of the people all of the time.

    However, my definition of a great MGS game may well be different to yours, particularly if this is your first experience of MGS, that way you don't have the baggage of expectations and comparisons that I have. (Tho I pity what a hard time you would have with the plot if you had no previous MGS experience.)

    The thing a lot of people seem to be forgetting here is that reviews are subjective. Games like books, movies, music & art mean different things to different people. Comparing Halo to MGS is akin to comparing Led Zeppelin to The Beatles. Personally I can't stand The Beatles, but that doesn't make them any less great or their contribution to music any less. I can appreciate their greatness, they just leave me cold.

    Scoring MGS4 lower than you believe it should have simply means that it didn't mean the same thing to Oli Welsh (or to myself) that it did to you.

    You don't agree? Great, lets discuss it! You think it should be higher than an 8? Why?
    Edited by 2 at 16/06/08 @ 14:28

  • Widge #1851 4 years ago

    THE BEASTS ARE STRANGE!

  • Aloominum_man #1852 4 years ago

    @deagle

    Yes, if developers feel that a load of cack-handed, non-interactive storytelling is really necessary to give a game its next-gen 'wings'.

  • des #1853 4 years ago

    Well according to this post:
    [link url=http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1175421&p ostcount=610
    ]http://fo rum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p...[/link]

    MGS4 is about 30gb when loaded into windows,46.6gb is iso size(probably because of padding).

  • GamesConnoisseur #1854 4 years ago

    Vanmunt:

    "To be honest mate I don't think it is a blu-ray problem, it is poor programming... all that loading in the chase sceens is a bit annoying, yet on Drakes (with simular graphical display) little loading, no install. Got to take your hat off to Naughty Dog, but then, hey it is Konami!!"

    If we apparently do not make any issues of the multiple reinstallations, then other programmers could say 'hey why are we sweating our asses trying to make streaming off slow access of BR to work, when we can just cut corners like Hideo did with MSG4? After all it got crates of GOTY awards and the installations didnt stop them!'? Can you say that 'lazy' programming would not happen again?!

  • GamesConnoisseur #1855 4 years ago

    As I m typing this, I m on my eighth install process, I would challenge anyone who say they are not bothered one iota by this however numerous they go had to sit through it?

    Also for you to get 4 million Drebin points necessary to unlock one of the two most expensive items, which mean you practically had to go through the game a good few times to collect it right?!

    Arbiter you seem to think that this is a good deal for install to be used in a such way? Why would this be better than either large one install which I prefer or as in Naughty Dog's Drake where they managed no visible installations?

    I am damn interested to know from Konami themselves how they justify this and why this particular way and not other options. I am NOT saying that the game is now worth less, as I still consider it a worthy 9 with MGO, but come on dont say you accept this would any questions or even giving an expression of a mild annoyance?!!

    I know from wading through comments in other website, that this issue also do occasionaly come up. No need for us to be defensive about it, but it is strange though.

    Ah the second rerun of Act 3 install now completed, off I go!
    Edited by 2 at 17/06/08 @ 00:04

  • GitSomE_UK #1856 4 years ago

    MGS4 > *

    That is all.

  • Knot #1857 4 years ago

    I'm at act 3 now. The game picked up really well midway act 2 imo. I'm sincerely enjoying the subtleties in the cutscenes.
    Are people really rushing/running & gunning through this game already ?!

    Act installations make great breaks to goto toilet or get snack/drink. Not obtrusive at all.
    Edited by 1 at 16/06/08 @ 23:52

  • johlee991 #1858 4 years ago

    I don't understand how people can sit through almost 90 minutes of cutscenes. I think Kojima isn't making anymore MGSs to go concentrate on what he does best. Make anime. I watched my cousin play this for 3 hours and it was pretty much like this:

    - Play game for 10 minutes. Great graphics, by the -way.

    -------- 13 minute cutscene --------

    - Play game for 10 minutes

    -------- 10 minute cutscene --------

    I thought he was watching a movie. Man, I see why the blue-ray was needed. For the gawd damn movies!!!!! Where's the videogame? He spent $60 bones on a nice animated movie!!! He's selling it to our neighbor now. He can't sit through the cutscenes. Plus, he's only 15. The cutscenes are very convoluted and require a PH.D to fully understand all the political allegories and symbolism that Kojima inserted which makes me think of that one anime, Akira or Ghost In The Shell.
    Edited by 1 at 17/06/08 @ 05:50

  • Widge #1859 4 years ago

    ???

    The cutscenes aren't any more complex than MGS1's expositions on the illegal nuclear materials and weapons black market. Otacon talking about mech anime's etc. Hell, I had no problem with any of the previous games. Do I have a PhD? No. Still praise be for not dumbing games down, treating us like fleshy pink mounds who just need to be repeatedly spoonfed a hamfisted mess of a "you're a government agent, you must kill the terrorists that threaten the world" that punctuates far too much.

    The above reads like a generalisation based upon the hearsay critique of others. Have you played the game? Have you sat down and actually gone through the entire thing yourself? Have you tried out Metal Gear Online?

    Otherwise what you say feels like you've asked the MS Paperclip to "auto-bash" Metal Gear Solid.

  • DFawkes #1860 4 years ago

    I can't believe this thread is still going! That's one controvertial review.

    I still can't see why those who hate cutscenes watch them. Skip them, and if you skipped something important call otacon, he'll catch you up on the need-to-know stuff. Sure, you'll miss most of the game, but you can't go on and on about cutscene length if there's an option not to watch them. Of, course, you could then complain the game feels disjointed, so I guess it's unavoidable.

    I still love it, all my favourite TV shows are between seasons right now, so I needed something to watch :)

  • goon-uk #1861 4 years ago

    I personally think a 9 is fair. I can understand how people can find faults with it ( it has it's fare amount ) but by just finding faults and picking it apart because of them your completely disregarding the brilliance of it. No game comes close to it's epic scale, Story telling and even gameplay ( yes again it has it's faults but also a hell of a lot of positives ).

    Gameplay, sure it could be better but where else do you get a game that allows you to do the things you can do in Metal gear? Stealth, Action, FPS, RPG, Humour, Chases, Vehicles (Metal gear?). You can find games that may do things better in certain areas but you won't find a game that does everything this Metal gear does. Simply because there isn't one. It has it's faults there is no denying that and it could have been better but then so could a Bugatti Veyron? Doesn't mean it's bad though does it?

    From a personal point of view I thought the graphics overall where stunning, you get low res textures here and there but you also get great facial animations, models, effects and lighting as well with a MASSIVE variety in locations, characters and weather. It's no Crysis, but then IMO it's a better looking game overall than Gears of war, Uncharted etc because it offers you more Desert, Snow, Urban, City, Futuristic, Jungle etc?

    The cutscenes can be debated. Whether you like them or not they are part of the game but I do agree some go on for far to long without any gameplay. Unnecessary story lines, cutscenes and codec moments fragment the story, I didn't like how it ended and althought I didn't mind the boss battles ( although being very easy ) they didn't compare to that of MGS, You didn't care about them, they where boring and I found myself nearly skipping through the explanations by drebin after. What I did like was the Frogs ( some of their AI, ie jumping on walls etc was very entertaining) and the Gekko's although a bit stupid at times.

    I think it's a case of balancing to give it a respectful score, and a "solid" 9 is a respectful score for what the game has done as you simply won't find another game like it, it's unique in almost every way and baring the Final fantasy series, can you say that about another game? If you judge the game simply on it's own, no against any other games but it's own entity then I would give it a 7 BUT we are judging it against games and as a result anything lower than a 9 considering what other games get is barmy imo.

    MGS is the best piece of entertainment to hit the this generation of consoles to date but Kojima genius is clouded by his faults and as a result MGS4 has left itself open for deserved criticism but it shouldn't IMO anyway deflect from what is one of the best pieces of entertainment I have played/seen to date.

  • goon-uk #1862 4 years ago

    @ Deagle

    GTA4 got a 10, It got that because of the variety of the things you can do, how you do and the sheer amount of detail in the game. It didn't get it because the shooting is the best in it's class, It didn't get it because the driving is the best in it's catagory either. It got it as a result of the game bringing all different aspects together and applying them in a solid game. Whether it deserved 10 or not doesn't matter but what rockstar did deserved praise because applying many different things to one game is far harder to do than making just a shooter for example.

    MGS4 attributes are very good compared to that of other games, The shooting, Stealth, Variety all hold their own against other games with some of the features used surpassing many and the things it does wrong don't justify it been given any lower than a 9 when being compared to other games.

    The 7/10 is my personal opinion on being over critical and judging it from the hype I had for it and what it could have been based on the story more than anything else. The game itself I loved. Think as that comment as a separate goon meter.

    It's one of those games that got so hyped up that people are being to critical about it and suffering from the over the top GTA review syndrome.

  • Nikanoru #1863 4 years ago

    By your standards, a game only worth a 7 based on its own qualities is automatically bumped up to a 9 simply by comparing its uniqueness to that of other games. Sorry, but that ship ain't gonna float.

    Us living beings like new, fresh stuff. It's how we all work. If there's something unique in an otherwise fairly unremarkable game that makes us go "hey this is new, neat", and it makes the game more enjoyable despite not hitting all the marks on some dumb checklist that it logically should, why noy bump up the score? Isn't gaming about fun?


    That said, the guy who thought MGS4 was "unique in almost every way and barring the Final fantasy series, can you say that about another game", is a funny person, to say the least. Seriously, WTF. He must have seriously low, LOW standards in that regard. Vary your games library for a bit beyond the regular old brown FPS maybe?

  • captain-future #1864 4 years ago

    After finishing the game in 18+ hours this afternoon I've to agree on the score 8/10 although completely other reasons than mentioned in the review.

    Somehow I feel stuck in the past, the ideas are all well meant but sometimes poorly executed - e.g. the whole flashback things aren't very interactive or interssing. Also MGS4 borrows too much from previous games of the series, which I don't like that much - normally I've a very sharp memory and don't need constant reminders what happened 10 years ago on the PSX.

    Gameplay-wise it's MGS, nothing more, nothing less. The controls feel less "clanky" and "old" but still aren't what I'd call "fluid" and "intuitive". Try grabbing an enemy and do stuff to him... not easy nor entertaining. What I don't like is that you have to press a button to wall-hug... ok, my opinion only maybe.

    Cutscenes are GREAT, graphics are most of the time STELLAR, but there are a lot of load screens also between action sequences that break the pacing of the story and the flow of gameplay.

    Codec conversations are completly OPTIONAL, which is more than a little disappointing - may I didn't find all people to talk to, but Otacon is boring and does nothing to help you in certain situations where a tip might come in handy.

    Drebin is the biggest news of the game because he and his shop influence gameplay a lot (no more shortage of ammunition... for better or worse...) and a fascinating character, that ultimately does nothing to improve the story, but has his moments.

    So overall did I like it? I enjoyed the first half of the game enormously with the biggest issues in the act before the last which was just mind-numbling boring to me. On the positive side, Act 3 showed what cool things are possible within the MGS universe. Some cutscenes were FANTASTIC and brought me to smiles and tears alike.

    Not liking MGS4 is like not liking the film Blade Runner because you don't get the story the first time through... so I like it a lot... only I loved the previous games (still my all-time favourite: MGS1 on PSX) more.

  • goon-uk #1865 4 years ago

    @Nikanoru

    Please find me a game thats like MGS4.

    @Deagle

    I'm no scholar so how my words read might be different to how I would say them or mean, but I just feel games that push something new, try to be bigger than they would otherwise be should be praised for it because if you don't you end up with the same games over and over. All games have technical faults and glitches with botched mechanics if you look too far into them, If like I said before I where to look through every great game in history like some seem to be doing with MGS4 included myself you find faults.

    MGS4 has faults no one is denying and I think like the games-radar review it isn't a perfect game but it is pure genius at times and in a sense it's in a league of its own. Giving it a 9 seems cheating it because of what is does right and when you compare it to other games because of the sheer amount of quality compared to that of a game like Ratchet & Clank: TOD that I would personally give a 9 as well. But their different 9's for many different reasons .... Like the game itself you get confused discussing it and all that it really does is highlight how flawed rating games is when something like MGS4 comes along.

  • danz8508 #1866 4 years ago

    to rate this game a 8 is ridiculous how much did xbox 360 pay you to give mgs 4 a bad review and to give that piece of shit halo a 10 another fps shooter that sucks has no story how dare you critize metal gear that has the greatest story in a game i have ever seen graphics that xbox360 wishes they could produce and gameplay that is so engaging i lose track of time hey im master chief let me hop in a jeep and shoot aliens really wow lets give it a 10 FUCKIN BULLSHIT!

  • bitesize #1867 4 years ago

    how dare you critize metal gear

    in a thread full of comedy gold, this is my favourite so far. a reviewer, criticising a game!! how dare he?!?

    come back mr danz, and let us in on more of your wisdom!

  • LayerCake #1868 4 years ago

    The good thing about some of the 8/10's from Edge, Eurogamer and GamesTM is that it lowered my expectations for this. After completing it. the game is such an incredible achievement that it's almost insulting it to compare it to other games on a scale of 1-10. If there was a single title that you'd pick to show off what the gaming medium is capable of,this would be it - the choice is that simple. It's so easy to criticise this game (long cut scenes etc) that you can miss how brilliant it is overall - the stunning game design in each and every scene. The best game this generation so far. It also shows what is capable when someone is given complete control (akin to some of the best independent film directors) to achieve their uncompromised vision. Kojima could have shortened the cutscenes, could have made what would be a more digestible and mass market product. But he stuck to his guns. Wouldn't it be boring if everyone agreed on what a 10/10 product should be.....Games like GTA or Halo get thrown 10's because it's impossible to take off points when the game contains everything that is expected of them. They have fewer flaws, but are never able to obtain great heights because they take no risks. If games can end up dividing poeple like this one, it is a sign that the gaming medium may have reached a form of maturity where it becomes comparable to some of the other artforms.
    Edited by 1 at 18/06/08 @ 15:23

  • oldergamer #1869 4 years ago

    LayerCake - spot on.

  • GamesConnoisseur #1870 4 years ago

    Re: Layercake

    Very well argued comment, which doesnt take anything away from GTA4 and Halo 3, unlike numbers of PS3 critics who only took the stance of being offended that MSG4 is 'two points less than that CRAP Halo 3 and thus I hate EG for being in pocket of MS' etc.

    Yes I fully agree that aside from the perceived flaws (as seen by certain number of gamers and reviewers but not necessarily by everyone it seem!), or where some may not exactly take to heart how the cut scenes were done (overdone or not enough interactions etc) that MSG4 do have great moments, such as the corridor near the end or Vamp and Raiden on top of Rex and Snake holding off Gekko and other similar filmic but great gaming moments. The great heights reached by MSG4 have never really been done elsewhere. Or in such a way as in MSG series.

    I am content at having played through MSG4 twice and now starting a third go for the special items (going to do no alerts or kills!), but yes have flaws but not to such extend where MSG4 enjoyment is diluted by anything much.

  • reddevil93 #1871 4 years ago

    Finished this last night. Easily my favorite game this gen and in my top five favorite games of all time. Epic.

  • Xerx3s #1872 4 years ago

    "to rate this game a 8 is ridiculous how much did xbox 360 pay you to give mgs 4 a bad review and to give that piece of shit halo a 10 another fps shooter that sucks has no story how dare you critize metal gear that has the greatest story in a game i have ever seen graphics that xbox360 wishes they could produce and gameplay that is so engaging i lose track of time hey im master chief let me hop in a jeep and shoot aliens really wow lets give it a 10 FUCKIN BULLSHIT!"

    Halo 3=10/10

    Oh those bitter tears, keep the comedy gold coming! \0/

  • Gradius #1873 4 years ago

    This thread is full of gh3yness™

  • Vorbeck #1874 4 years ago

    I've played this game and beat it. Amazing, critisize the cutscenes? Skip them. I personally enjoyed them i found myself bored only for about a minute and a half during one cutscene during the entire game. It's obvious that this reviewer began the game with the intent to be a critic rather than to be a gamer and really enjoy the game. I understand some of you may think the game is complicated and confusing, it's really not if you have common sense and some intelligence. That is one of the reason's the game is rated Mature because Konami isnt obligated to make Children understand technology, politics, etc. and they're not suppose to. In short I agree with Gamespot saying "Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots is the most technically stunning video game ever made." and I thought they were biased against PS3 but I was ultimately impressed with the review. The game's story takes many unexpected twists and turns unlike other games where you can guess the end of the story before you're there. The graphics are beautiful, stealth is great, track your enemies, boss fights I enjoyed the most though since in 90% of games the boss fight is just shoot it till it dies but in MGS4 you have to use your skills to take it down or figure out a way to exploit a weakness. I personally think that if the critic of this review had sat down to enjoy the game rather than analyze the pros and cons he might have fell in love with the story. This is my first Metal Gear game save playing some of Metal Gear Solid 1 but sadly I was too young to understand alot of it which is the problem of many of the posters of comments. No I'm not 30, just in college I'd have gave this game a 10/10 because this is the best PS3 game out, and the best Next-Generation game out in my opinion, but it is my opinion.

  • CunningLinguist #1875 4 years ago

    The author of this review is a cock-nosed knob-head, so what do you expect?

  • Xerx3s #1876 4 years ago

    "The author of this review is a cock-nosed knob-head, so what do you expect?"

    And what does that make you?

  • SpaceMidget75 Verified Senior Software Developer, Minerva Computer Services #1877 4 years ago

    In short I agree with Gamespot saying "Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots is the most technically stunning video game ever made."

    Can you tell me what part of it this is attributed to?

    Is it the best control system ever? Or the most amazing graphics?
    ...Or is it the multiple installs? ;)

    This may sound like I'm nit picking, but I'm trying to show that other reviewers are spouting comments that are clearly not true and yet you guys agree with it. From what I've played, it doesn't have the best graphics ever or the ultimate in control systems. What other TECHNICAL parts of the game is he talking about?

    Is that any different to Eurogamer giving it an 8 and you disagreeing?

    Now for my take on this whole shabang. As far as I can see this is like the Shenmue series. I, and many others, loved them. If a Shenmue 3 ever appears and isn't completely fucked up, then myself and it's many fans will think it's a 10/10 game. For everyone else it will be an 8. (8 based on the possibility that it's more of the same with slight improvements and that you'll need to have played the others to appreciate the story.)

    Finally, with regards to the cutscenes, they're too long for your everyman gamer. You need to be objective about it. The fact is the cutscenes could be as good as the Godfather part 2 but that's not what a want to be doing when I load up for an hour of gaming. You COULD skip them, but then gamers prefer to know what's going on when they're playing a game so it's double edged sword.

    If you can't see that a game should be marked down for that and you can't appreciate that many of you might be biased due to your love of the franchise (see Shemue), then you are indeed Fanboys and are everything I hate about gaming.


  • enzima #1878 4 years ago

    I've played the game for almost 4 days now, so here's my opinion: the game (what an experience!) is far from perfect, but the real issues to me are mainly two. The first being the clunky controls, something that should have been much better than MGS3, but they were not improved at all IMO. Technical issues is the other main problem, as sometimes I've experienced some problem (I dunno how is it called when there is a line on the screen and the upper part of the screen is not synchronized with the lower part).
    IMO MGS3 was Kojima's masterpiece (i put it on par with MGS1), but with that being said, I still think its a great game! The cut-scenes are totally enjoyable (with genuine LOL moments) even though VERY long and frequent. The installation is a big pain, but totally acceptable in this case.
    In the end, with all the flaws it has, i think it still deserves a full 9, because lets admit it: it is a masterpiece. The details, the convoluted story (though enjoyable), great characters (though i've got to repeat it: MGS3 was very classy in every aspects, even better IMO). If technically to me Uncharted was superior (very fluid game) to this title, as an overall value MGS4 in surely not an inferior product, so it's a full 9 nine to me!!!!!

  • Vorbeck #1879 4 years ago

    This isnt a simple shoot-em up game and if it didn't have in-depth cut scenes i would be disapointed. As far as installation goes its neccesary why would you give a game bad remarks because you had to install it? That's illogical and multiple installs are nice since you dont have to wait 20 minutes at the start its just an 8 minute start with 2 minutes between each 4~ hour act, perfect for snacks, bathroom, or whatever else. Controls aren't the best but there are a ton of games like that, those that have gotten 10's. I'm not a fanboy, the only game series I could ever be considered a fanboy of is the SOCOM series and I wasn't happy at all with SOCOM 3 that game should have gotten a 5/10. If you rate some games that are only mediocre high, then be overly critical for other games that is unfair for the person that wants to by this game but sees that the other game scored better, 2 points better, so instead of thinking "Hey an 8 is pretty good" they think "Well if this game got a 10 but this one got an 8 then I don't think i really want it."

  • bbr13 #1880 4 years ago

    No offense Eurogamer,but I think you did a bad job doing this review.I know its your guys opinion and all;but how in the world does Halo 3 get a better review than this.Halo is good and nothing that special if it weren't for the multiplayer.Halo is the same as every other shooter;you see the enemy,shoot and you kill;nothing in shooters ever change.But MGS has something many games don't and that's storyline.I've passed MGS4 three times already.Solid Normal,Big Boss Hard,and The Boss Extreme.You guys critize MGS4 for its boss battles,and what of Halo 3?That boss batlle with the Oracle suck balls,MGS4's last battle with Liquid is mesmerizing and cool because its hand-to hand,similar to their battle in the first MGS.Snake not dying is an ok ending.He still gonna in a couple of months thanks to Foxdie and the acclerated aging.One last thing,the thing that MGS does better than anygame is connect players with its characters.Master Chief hardly ever talks,and has really low sentimental value if he dies.Snake on the other hand,brings a lot of sentimental value and struggle.MGS4 in my opinion deserves a 10/10.I know MGS4 will fall short to GTA IV because a lot people won't bother wasting money getting a PS3 just to buy this game.And you guys over exaggerated when you said that the cutscenes take up half the game.Each installation before each act takes three minutes.Except for Act 4 and 5 which only take 2 minutes.Every mission briefing takes 35 to 45 minutes and the epilouge takes 75 minutes.And supringly Raiden steals the show in the game,sacrificing his life for Snake three times or so,and his 2 fights his Vamp are some of the best battles in gaming history,the cutscene fight in South America and their in-game fight in Shadow Moses a top of Metal Gear Rex.A lot of characters die in the game,like Naomi,Vamp(finally),Liquid Ocelot,Zero,Eva,Metal Gear Ray,Beauty and The Beast Corps,and Big Boss.Not to mention suprise appearences by Psycho Mantis and Big Boss.That's all I have to say,peace.

  • WJF #1881 4 years ago

    @bbr13 - "...Every mission briefing takes 35-45 mins..." (there are some spoilers in that post, too, so watch out all ye of little faith)

    That's a good thing??
    Edited by 1 at 19/06/08 @ 19:15

  • VMerken #1882 4 years ago

    Vorbeck: In short I agree with Gamespot saying "Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots is the most technically stunning video game ever made."

    You raise valid points in your post, but how can you agree with the above statement knowing full well about the multi-install pauses in this game? "Most technically stunning" would certainly entail "no multi-install hassle" in my book along with a huge tick box next to it. If the MGS4 game consisted of one smooth transition from one locale to the next with interspersed cutscenes, then I'd certainly begin to think about "technically stunning".

    Mind you, multi-install hassles do not influence my opinion about the game itself, but it does affect the way I think about MGS4 technically. Personally, I hope Konami will release some sort of "single install option patch" in the future. I'm not too optimistic about the appearance of such a patch, though, since Konami certainly had a lot of time to figure out the optimal way to stream the game.

    Vorbeck: That's illogical and multiple installs are nice since you dont have to wait 20 minutes at the start its just an 8 minute start with 2 minutes between each 4~ hour act, perfect for snacks, bathroom, or whatever else.

    From what I understand, the whole multi-install repeats itself when replaying the game because every install overwrites the previous one (if I'm wrong about this, disregard the remainder of this paragraph). This compares unfavourably to, for example, Devil May Cry 4, where you have just one 20-minute install after which you can play the game with fast room-switching whenever you want.

    Also, snacks, bathroom, etc can be done quite comfortably while cranking up the audio and listening to the game characters during typically long codec conversations. In the case of MGS4, partial installs are somewhat overkill when it comes to this kind of purpose.

    By the way, I'd like to add that MGS4 is just about the best Eurogamer 8 I've ever played. It lifts the status of 8 to an entirely new level, a level reserved only for MGS4 for probably a very long time. Through careful measuring, I can determine that this special 8 level hovers somewhere between the regular Eurogamer 9 and 10 levels.

    Just thought I'd add a banana after all those apples and pears.
    Edited by 2 at 19/06/08 @ 22:03

  • Widge #1883 4 years ago

    @WJF

    Yep, the beginning of act briefings are long. I quite like them, also like the interactivity by moving the MG2 about, picking up items..., as far as content goes, much like the briefing you got on MGS1 if you selected it from the menu item. As such, MGS4 actually prompts you that you can skip the briefing and go back and view it at any time.

    So I say its a good thing. Its there if you want it (which I do) and not if you don't.

    Also plus marks for codec conversations about basic information happening in real game time without cutting away from the action.

    I felt that MGS3 had the most in the way of actual "action" in the realms of having large arenas to explore and sneak around. Where MGS4 does kick up the cinematics, it also retains these large sprawling arenas. Act 2 is especially remeniscent of MGS4 with its setting. Certainly a lot of variety put into this game, plus plenty of freedom about how you decide to approach and move through the game. This play through, I'm actively helping the militia. Next time, its a pure sneak mission for me.

  • pibout #1884 4 years ago

    I came to this site after hearing about the joke review of this game. 8/10? You must be kidding. Are you aware that this site is getting a bit of a 'kiddie' reputation?

    How did the reviewer of this game come to an 8/10 conclusion? Does he/she hate PS3 that much? Is he/she an adult?

    I suppose it gives the XBots one last place to gasp their dying 'XBot is best', groans; before they vanish in to obscurity.

    Hell, even the notoriously XBox leaning Gamespot gave this game 10/10.

    You could perhaps have gotten away with a 9/10 score but make no mistake: 8 gives outsiders no doubt that there are more sinister reasons for downgrading this game. On the other hand perhaps you're just stupid.

    I'll leave this site now and join the grown-ups elsewhere.

    Feel free to comment... as I won't be reading any of it. :)



  • amcd28 #1885 4 years ago

    @pibout

    Wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

    Sinister reasons for downgrading the score?

    Bollocks.

    Grow up. It's someone's opinion and it just doesn't happen to be yours.

    Do everyone a favour. Go to your front door, open it up, go outside and experience real life. Then come back in, sit down, take a deep breath, start up MGS4 and stop whinging.

    One last thing: people have been banging on about the 'cinematic experience'. When was the last time you had to stop every time a new scene started to install the film again?

    /Gets coat

  • Nill #1886 4 years ago

    It may be an eight, but it's a Metal Gear Solid-eight at that!

    Very much looking forward to playing this someday.

  • bad09 #1887 4 years ago

    "I'll leave this site now and join the grown-ups elsewhere. "

    Ha ha I love the "grown-up" statements like this from the MGS fanboys :)

    Anyway, just finished the bloody thing and earlier in this huge thread i said I'd give 10/10 for the wholes package (incl. MGSO) but now i have to say (shock horror) MGS4 is disappointing, great yes but there is a lot wrong with it.

    I was loving it until act 5. Act 5 is dull, boring and completely unexciting end to it all and kind of ruined the experience and the ending cutscenes are poor and pointless truth be told. It's a shame as act 4 was an awesome build up and I couldn't wait to get to the finale, but by the time Raiden (there really was no need to have Raiden in the game IMO) shows up armless and with a sword between his teeth I lost the will to live!

    The stupid balls with hands completely ruined things as well, who thought they were are good idea to put in?

    All boss battles are dull city (expect for the Metal Gear battle) which don't have the same wow as previous MGS games.

    Drebin takes away any worry of ammo and weapons away. Running low? Just pause the game buy stuff and magically in the middle of battle you are fully stocked. Ruined the experience for me.

    Many cutscenes are REALLY pointless and add nothing to the games this time around and MGS4 would do really better without them (mainly any Raiden stuff though, it's like really bad Manga, terrible!)

    Lots right and lots wrong with MGS4 coming out the other side, which makes me trust EG's 8 more than the other sites with their glowing 10s. This is in no way a 10/10 game to say so is just lip service. In fact, even as a fan of MGS, take away MGSO and I might even say MGS4 is a 7/10. A good 7/10 though.

    I'm gonna play again as I did love much of the first 4 acts but I just thank god the next play through I can now skip all the useless and pointless cutscenes!
    Edited by 1 at 21/06/08 @ 12:09

  • Widge #1888 4 years ago

    whereas I'll be going through and loving them all again!

  • bad09 #1889 4 years ago

    "whereas I'll be going through and loving them all again!"

    You're a braver man than me mate (especially act 5!) Come on admit it Widge, I bet you're a manga otaku at heart, that's why you're loving the cutscenes! :)

  • borude89 #1890 4 years ago

    this guy had to be high when he was writing this review

    "So how do you review a new Metal Gear Solid? Do you assess it on its own terms, ones that its legion of fans will understand? Do you play the sceptic, and take Hideo Kojma and his team to task for their stubborn refusal to catch up with what the rest of the world expects of a videogame? Or do you walk the path of compromise, down the middle?"

    wtf does that mean every other gaming mag or show in the world gave this game a 9.5 or better.am pretty sure kojima knows what ppl want in a video game.
    Edited by 1 at 22/06/08 @ 04:28

  • Widge #1891 4 years ago

    Pretty much every gaming rag I came across gave KOTOR a "9" or higher. I thought it was awful. If I reviewed it, I would have marked it as such... but because everyone else gave it high marks, I should too? The logic is flawed in the above.

    If someone gives this an 8 in their opinion, more power to them! I personally rate higher myself, being a different individual and all, but won't moan on for someone giving an opinion.

  • DasFx #1892 4 years ago

    MGS4 is a game which involves a lot of stealth....
    But it makes it pretty damn hard if i cant even look normally around every corner.
    Or am i doing something wrong ?



  • bad09 #1893 4 years ago

    @ MattDamon

    Sorry for having my own view I will try better next time to conform :)

    If you actually read what I wrote you will see I said it was a great game I was loving up until act 5 so much so that I will replay. I have already said the engine was amazing etc in a previous post. The reason I listed what I didn't like is because at the end of the game the things I listed had hampered my enjoyment and ultimately made MGS4 disappointing FOR ME.

    Besides it was more about telling people the review was probably right for a lot of gamers out there and countering the foaming fanboy Hideo loving nonsense from people like yourself. You think it is a game that must be experienced by everyone that's fine but the truth is many gamers couldn't give a toss about the experience and just want to play a game on their games console. Personally now I've played it I don't really think it is a game everyone needs to experience, doesn't make me wrong or right, just my opinion.

    Why do people keep talking of the storyline in MGS anyway, you think it's absolutely brilliant (as do many) but to many, myself included, it's always been the weakest part of the experience that you put up with for the outstanding game that comes with it. Only geeks and manga/anime otaku love the story, to everyone else it's cheesy, confusing, long-winded, sometimes boring and sometimes just plain ridiculous. I know many people who won't touch a MGS game just because of the cutscenes and story, and personally the story side of things lost me after MGS2 but then I'm all about games not 50% game and 50% self-indulgent cutscenes, which MGS4 is.

    Just because you enjoyed the story side doesn't mean everyone else should or would.....




  • bad09 #1894 4 years ago

    @ kelly's_h

    Absolutely the gameplay itself cannot be faulted (except for boss battles). It's a shame that someone didn't pull hideo to one side and say "you're overdoing the exposition and should concentrate on the game a bit more"

    Konami themselves obviously had concerns over the huge amount of exposition in the game as cut scene length was one of the taboo subjects for reviews.

  • borude89 #1895 4 years ago

    @ widge

    am not saying he should gave the game a high score cause everyone else is.when he say kojima is stubborn and doesnt realize what everyone wants in a game.who is he referring to here your first time mgs player who might get lost playing the game or every other gaming mag and show who thought the game was great.

  • shadowsblaze #1896 4 years ago

    Personally, having played through the single player game and read the review, I think the review was pretty much spot on.

    I have to admit, I was reluctant to buy this game to begin with as MGS2 left a bad taste in my mouth. However, I have to say I really enjoyed MGS4, a hell of a lot more than I thought I would. Is it worth a 10 in my opinion? Hell no. As enjoyable as I found the game (probably one of my favourite games to have been released this year), the controls can tend to be overly complicated (a training level would have helpped considerably), the final fight was quite frankly crap, the plot ridiculously over complex and complicated and the epilogue was frankly boring compared to all the other cutscenes. The game should have ended where Snake put the gun in his mouth and you heard the gun go off. There was no real need to add Big Boss and the new Fox Die eliminating Snake's old Fox Die sub-plot. I get the feeling they left Snake alive just to please western audiences. In the end it just caused disappointment.. However, despite these problems the majority of the game was fantastic fun to play and most of the cutscenes enjoyable to watch.

    However, after posting this, I'm sure I'll get you're typical nutjobs complaining about my opinion criticizing their 'Holy Grail', how I should change my opinion and follow their religious crusade to make people believe this is the best game ever made. They'll be even a few who'll say that if you skip the cut scenes and ignore the plot you'll see why the game should be declared a so called masterpiece. However, if you must judge a game, it should be judged on the whole experience and that includes the plot, cut scenes and gameplay. Which is why I feel MGS4 deserves a well deserved 8/10.

  • KREEPYKRAWLLY #1897 4 years ago

    *SIGHS*....Ellie Gibson needs to Castrate more "bullish journalists".

  • Widge #1898 4 years ago

    Shadowsblaze... there is a training arena, you have a faff about in there to get used to the controls!
    The problem with training levels is that you feel that they are just that, and a bit soulless as a result. Like the way Zero Punctuation points out that the opening missions of GTA4 are literally hand holds of how to drive, how to meet a friend, how to fight, how to cover etc... would really put a dent in the old replayability value as you'd just want it skipped when you came to it again.

  • dloob #1899 4 years ago

    Well I'm a bit into act 1 now.
    So far so meh.
    Some stealty stuff and some really bad third person shooter stuff.
    If it doesn't pick up soon the 8/10 is looking very generous to me.

    It is very pretty though.
    Maybe I should try out the training as I'm finding the combat to be very fiddly.
    Edited by 1 at 23/06/08 @ 01:01

  • juuken #1900 4 years ago

    This score is full of shit. MGS4 deserved a 9 or a 10. You assholes kNOW it.

  • mossychops001 #1901 4 years ago

    10/10

  • Widge #1902 4 years ago

    I think the MGObeta really helped me dive into this game. I was already up to speed with the controls for hitting Act 1!

  • Azazel #1903 4 years ago

    This thread breaks humanity.

  • DFawkes #1904 4 years ago

    This thread is still going, and I brand that an EPIC WIN!

    I've played quite a bit now, and have to say I wholeheartedly disagree with most of the issues brought up in the review. But mostly, it's still never been made clear why they got someone who mainly deals with MMOs to review this. Was it not worth wasting someone else on it? I'm still wondering, and I think I will be forever. I do know that usually for a review to be published there is usually some consensus in the office though, so I'm sure another reviewer would have said similar things.

    That bit at the start of Act 4 was the best thing ever. Ever. Instant 1 bill