Kinect hardware sales boost is "bollocks"

By Robert Purchese Published 22 July, 2010

Microsoft "missed the boat", says CHIPS.

Don McCabe, the outspoken manager of UK independent retailer CHIPS, firmly believes that Kinect won't boost hardware sales for Microsoft.

"In some ways Microsoft has missed the boat," he told GamesIndustry.biz. "Over the last two years the casual market has been declining rapidly."

"I don't think it's going to add any new hardware sales. I spotted in their last response to a survey, they said it would lift hardware sales by 5 to 15 percent.

"I think that's bollocks," he added. "You lift it by one or two per cent and you've had a result."

McCabe thinks the £130 asking price for Kinect is too high, particularly when compared with Wii - and he's not convinced anyone's that bothered about Microsoft's new device to begin with.

"The pricing is immature to a certain degree," he said. "Consumers see it as just a catch-up with the Wii, but they don't see it as much of an improvement.

"When you see a new hardware product or a new peripheral, you normally see quite a response from the public. We're not seeing that, they're completely underwhelmed by it, really."

McCabe's certain that Microsoft is testing the water for a future generation of consoles. If Kinect flies, great; if it doesn't, "we'll still intergrate it in the next machine".

Mr CHIPS is convinced that hardware for Microsoft is just a "means" of getting people subscribed to Xbox Live.

Still, if Kinect does fly, McCabe will be happy, because like a boomerang the device is coming straight back.

"From our point of view, the more Microsoft things that are out there the better, because it's one of those things that people will buy, play it for a short time then trade it back in. So I think we'll make a good trade-in market on it," predicted McCabe.

There is no UK release date yet for Kinect, but there are various ways to buy it.

Picture of Robert.

About Robert Purchese

Bertie is Eurogamer's Senior Staff Writer. When he's not hunting down news stories he's often found playing with his kids or gabbling about fantasy games and strange online worlds. @Clert on Twitter.

Read more articles from Robert by visiting the Robert Purchese archive page.

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Comments (87) Latest comment 2 years ago

Comments for this article are now closed, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Rack #1 2 years ago

    "various ways to buy it"

    Rob a bank? Sell a kidney? I'm struggling to think of any more.

  • LazyDan #2 2 years ago

    I think Mr Chips should stop being so controversial and get back on Catchphrase.

  • Scopeh #3 2 years ago

    @Rack. sell your soul

  • spiritsnake #4 2 years ago

    Ahahahahahahahahahah hahahahahhahah mwahahahahahahahah

  • Shinetop #5 2 years ago

    "I'm sure it won't sell well. But if it does sell well..."

    Thank you for saying nothing, Mr. Chips.

  • miiiguel #6 2 years ago

    Hey Mr. CHIPS, maybe you should take a look at this survey: [link url=http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/appeal-of-fps-genre-is-falling-survey
    ]http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/appeal...[/link]

    Omg, I'm getting so confused, everyone's saying diferent stuff all the time.

  • Luglug #7 2 years ago

    Really not interested in Kinect but some chilling words there: ‘I think we'll make a good trade-in market on it’. So blatant about what they’re doing.

    It again makes me question the morality of the second-hand market. I mean, what difference is there between the second-hand market and straightforward piracy? We've been told for years that piracy inflates the price of software because money doesn’t go to the creators yet the stores gobble up the profits on most new releases by offering second-hand copies for a couple of quid less. And still, PC games are usually about £10-15 cheaper than the console equivalents despite it being a market more prone to casual copyright theft.

    I'm certainly not condoning piracy but this second-hand business is as big a racket.

  • Bluetooth #8 2 years ago

    The biggest downer for me (next to the pricetag) is that the games associated with it are the same kiddy, casual ones you see mostly for the Wii - with Move (nicely priced at £50) you can play the core games with the new controller, whilst with Kinect you have to make do with Adventures and that child molesting tiger Skittles.

  • DirtyDubs #9 2 years ago

    Mr Chips just wants to make a vulgar statement to get free advertising for his stores. Cheap and cynical imo.

  • BAM! #10 2 years ago

    Just say what you see Mr CHIPS.

  • ZuluHero #11 2 years ago

    I thought for a minute that the chippy down the road from me suddenly formed an opinion about games...

  • SpaceMonkey77 #12 2 years ago

    Nice to see someone in retail on the ball. Kinect is nice, and I'd love one for Dance Central alone, but not at that £130 price point.

    Needing a 360 on top of Kinect is asking for trouble, as casual aren't as savvy as us hardcore gamers. Some might buy Kinect on its own, thinking it might work like that.

    Come on MS, can't you see the Cod7/MoH/Halo Reach invasion lurking on the horizon. Once that kicks off, Kinect will get buried til new year, unless enough of those casuals bite. While I'd praise that for the sake of the industry, on side of me chuckles at their naiveity.

  • mingster #13 2 years ago

    I approve of swear words in headlines.
    Please use more.

  • Nithron #14 2 years ago

    How did they manage to make that tiger so damn creepy without even noticing?

  • andijames #15 2 years ago

    I think we've found out what Mr Chips thinks of this :D

    It's good but it's not right

  • darleysam #16 2 years ago

    I've honestly never seen a branch of CHIPS.

  • CaptainQuint #17 2 years ago

    Whilst he may be right, I still ain't buying any games from his chain. Anyone seen their prices? When everywhere else prices a new Xbox 360 title at £34.99, you can be certain that Chips will be ripping off school kids by selling it at £39.99. Robbing bastards.
    Edited by CaptainQuint at 22/07/10 @ 13:33

  • Deckard1 #18 2 years ago

    I still think the microsoft advertising juggernaut can maybe stop kinect being a total fail. Thats a pretty big maybe though.

  • linea #19 2 years ago

    "we'll still intergrate [sic] it in the next machine"

    That's when I see this kind of stuff coming into its own. From what I've seen there's just not quite enough processing power this generation for this technology to be both fast enough to be worthwhile *and* affordable. Instead it's sort of fallen into an unsatisfactory middle ground.

    I do suspect it'll revolutionise a lot of gaming next gen though.

  • Hobo #20 2 years ago

    No seriously EG, fuck off with your advertising dressed up as news pieces.

  • andijames #21 2 years ago

    Do you think there's anyway of reducing the latency in the future with this kind of tech or is it pretty much at its limits regards response times? I.E will the introduction of possibly USB 3.0, more CPU power and, most likely, a dedicated on board processor for this improve it or will it always be stuck around the 125ms mark?

  • Psychotext #22 2 years ago

    Kinect pricing is a joke... but then so is the CHIPS manager, so I guess it all balances out.

  • coolbritannia #23 2 years ago

    I like this guy. He speaks the truth.

  • captainrentboy #24 2 years ago

    What the fuck is Chips? With an attitude like his, to possible progression in the industry and speaking out against one of the main players in this console generation, there's no doubt his indie stores are pretty much going to stay as they are.... Largely unheard of.
    We all have our views about Kinect, I too feel it's stupidly overpriced, but it's not something you shout about if you're in this guy's position. No doubt that general 'don't give a shit' attitude is leaked down to the staff in all of his stores, and if they don't give a fuck about the product why would any of the shoppers there express an interest either? They aren't exactly doing a good job drumming up some excitement for the thing are they?
    Edited by captainrentboy at 22/07/10 @ 13:48

  • theonlyix #25 2 years ago

    That guy is so friggin clueless....i feel sorry for him.... If Kinect isnt a massive success that will boost MS sales significantly, im gonna sell one of my 360s! THATS how sure i am!!! =)

    Guess those chips have other problems aswell......

  • FogHeart #26 2 years ago

    http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51...

  • CHAZBIGPOTATO #27 2 years ago

    Spot on, Captainrentboy!

  • Dizzy #28 2 years ago

    Guy in store says something he sells will not sell? Yeah I think I will go buy stuff in his store in the future.



    NOT!

  • Perfecto #29 2 years ago

    I don't care for the oppinion of a games retailer that has never had a single game in any of his stores that has been at a competitive enough price for me to even consider purchasing it. I think Don McCabe needs to sort his own prices out before commenting on Microsofts pricing strategy.

  • McBradders #30 2 years ago

    I don't understand the comment about how hardware is simply to drive more Live subscriptions. Does not compute.

  • McBradders #31 2 years ago

    I don't understand the comment about how hardware is simply to drive more Live subscriptions. Does not compute.

  • Britesparc Verified Creative, ITV #32 2 years ago

    I used to go to CHIPS back when it was pretty much the only games shop in Middlesbrough. Now, I only ever pop in when I see a branch out of nostalgic curiosity: a throwback to days of "IMB PC and compatibles" stickers on large cardboard boxes.

  • BAM! #33 2 years ago

    Microsoft Defence Force, assemble!

  • altitude2k #34 2 years ago

    @Rack

    You could get a second job. I hear that's a well-advised way of obtaining electronic gaming hardware.

  • Vordred #35 2 years ago

    the thing with kinect for me is that they are targeting the 'causual market'. but really any of those casual gamers usually are not that bothered, they just want something cheap and fun, (like the wii) so i cant see many of them forking out £250 on a xbox and kinect. and the hardcore lot dont seem all that bothered by it.

    when they were talking about doing it for £50 i was well up for it, even if i didn't by any games for it, just for the novalty of using it to navigate the dashboard and so on. but im not paying £130 for something like that.

    and really from the perspective of the user it's nothing more than a novalty controller (i know it's not), so £130 is just way to much for that, it's like the wii for me, flailing about with the remote is fun for a bit, but then i get bored of it after awhile.

  • agparrot #36 2 years ago

    Isn't the Kinect now the number one pre-order videogames hardware thingy on Amazon or something.

    Ergo, isn't this article bollocks?

  • Jackface #37 2 years ago

    Hobo
    22/07/10 @ 13:39
    ignore poster | #23
    0
    No seriously EG, fuck off with your advertising dressed up as news pieces.


    What the fuck does this mean? EG have comments from someone in retail slagging off the Kinect. That's a story. How is it advertising? Because it's about a product? How is news about a product therefore advertising?

  • des #38 2 years ago

    Please preorder Kinect at CHIPS,thanks in advance.

    CHIPS

  • Acrid #39 2 years ago

    @EarlBassett
    "What in the fuck is CHIPS?
    I've never even fucking heard of them.

    Is this a northern GAME or something?"

    Watch it you southern puff

  • RexRunti #40 2 years ago

    I personally would prefer Kinect to be a bit cheaper. However at £250 (that's the figure Microsoft care about) it's not priced out of the casual market, yes it's too expensive for some but it still has the possibility of being the next big thing. Kinect isn't a huge step up from the Wii but then Google wasn't a huge step up from Webcrawler and the iPod wasn't a huge step up from Archos or Creative mp3 players.

    I personally think Sony have a harder job marketing Move as the seem to be aiming it more at the hardcore and it's pretty clear the hardcore don't give a crap about motion controls.

  • Hobo #41 2 years ago

    "What the fuck does this mean? EG have comments from someone in retail slagging off the Kinect. That's a story. How is it advertising? Because it's about a product? How is news about a product therefore advertising? "

    Not the sharpest knife in the draw are you?

    Read through the comments, and count up how many people have been made aware of this retailer's existence.

    You could almost say said retailer has been advertised!

  • HiredMan #42 2 years ago

    Yep, he's right. Kinect wont boost sales at all. Wont sell a single console.


    Err, yeah. lol

  • Machiavellian #43 2 years ago

    Personally I will keep my opinion of how well Kinect will do in the casual market. From what I have seen, people have no clue how that market moves and what moves that market besides Nintendo. I have noticed that the majority of people totally miss what can become big in the casual market and they totally forget how advertising can make or break a product and make it the next best thing.

    If you look at the games MS has created not to mention the ones coming out on release, they are totally geared to shine in that market and it's up to MS to sell kinect as the next best consumer toy.

  • jebus #44 2 years ago

    @agparrot "Isn't the Kinect now the number one pre-order videogames hardware thingy on Amazon or something.

    Ergo, isn't this article bollocks?"

    Pre-orders aren't sales though.

  • captainrentboy #45 2 years ago

    ''Read through the comments, and count up how many people have been made aware of this retailer's existence.''

    If the story was some form of company advertising, it was a really really terrible effort.
    Yes I'm now aware of them and will avoid their store should I ever see one, as it sounds like the company's run by a total twat :)

  • Stop-gap #46 2 years ago

    "Read through the comments, and count up how many people have been made aware of this retailer's existence.

    You could almost say said retailer has been advertised!"

    "Yes I'm now aware of them and will avoid their store should I ever see one, as it sounds like the company's run by a total twat :)"

    Beaten to it a bit, but yeah- unless you believe that no publicity is bad publicity, all that's happened is I've learnt of a new store chain and also that I shouldn't bother going near it.

  • chrisjm #47 2 years ago

    they'll be celebrating with a bottle of vintage ketchup after this free publicity.

  • Bibbo #48 2 years ago

    The CHIPS in Norwich (if it is still there) was utter pants. Love to rip you off, and sell for stupid prices. Someone needs to go kick him twice in the balls.



  • FuzzyDuck #49 2 years ago

    Here's the "second-hand games are as bad as pirates" brigade again. Ever been on Ebay/lent/borrowed/rented/swapped your games? You can get off your self righteous pearch.

    Second-hand sales are what's keeping some retailers afloat. As i've said elsewhere, if i've paid the full asking price of the game i'll do with it what i want. It's also bizarre that folks don't realise that a lot of people offload their older titles to help finance the purchase of new releases.
    Edited by FuzzyDuck at 22/07/10 @ 17:04

  • chrisjm #50 2 years ago

    is the chips in norwich near the mustard shop? :)

  • Moribundman #51 2 years ago

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/appeal...

  • kangarootoo #52 2 years ago

    Whenever this guy pipes up predicting the future of game sales, I think "aren't you the guy whose core business is flagging because you missed the boat on online sales replacing high street shops?". After which I take his predictions with a pinch of salt.

  • Derblington #53 2 years ago

    "No-one's interested in Kinect, it won't sell well and MS missed the ball. But we'll make a killing in 2nd hand sales."

    Something there doesn't add up....

  • Xboxfanuk #54 2 years ago

    "Mr CHIPS is convinced that hardware for Microsoft is just a "means" of getting people subscribed to Xbox Live."

    I think Mr Chips is right. Microsoft is a software company and if you look what drives their sales it's software. Microsoft always stumbles with hardware. I believe Microsoft's decision to scrap the Halo MMO in favour of a Kinect solution was the wrong move. And come this Christmas I think they will see that too.

    However Microsoft can bring something for casual players in an Avatar 3D town that features micro transactions and MMO type play (like Free Realms and PS Home).

  • Half-assed #55 2 years ago

    Microsoft needs to get porn industry on board. That's a whole segment Sony and Nintendo are missing.

  • pomegran #56 2 years ago

    "with Move (nicely priced at £50)"

    Well, it's actually £75 with the subcontroller, so it ain't THAT far away ...

  • paulf #57 2 years ago

    intergrate ?

  • IkariW #58 2 years ago

    Jumping the gun slightly isn't he? its not even out yet!

    Just another retail idiot thinking he is in the 'Games Industry'... no mate, your in the retail industry, live with it.

    ;)
    Ikari

  • ronuds #59 2 years ago

    So from what I'm hearing, it sounds like he could be right about the lack of excitement over Kinect.

    Mainly because there's nobody in their stores to be excited?

  • kangarootoo #60 2 years ago

    "Mr CHIPS is convinced that hardware for Microsoft is just a "means" of getting people subscribed to Xbox Live"

    Err, I agree with him on that one actually. Thought I'll take it a step further.

    The entire XBox platform exists because MS wants people subscribed to XBLive (which is back-ended by a Windows Live account, which MS wants everyone signed up to). MS isn't in the console business to make money from games sales, they are in the console business to make money from online identities and the data such identities provide.

  • Jackface #61 2 years ago

    "Not the sharpest knife in the draw are you?

    Read through the comments, and count up how many people have been made aware of this retailer's existence. "

    I hate to piss on your chips but I actually couldn't tell you the name of his shop and I've read all the comments. I saw a lot of references to a Mr Chips but I was assuming that was the name of the person they were speaking to as I hadn't really taken that bit in, I was more interested in what he had to say, having established he was the owner of a games shop.

    I still don't see your point. It's everyone else that's been playing with the name of the shop. It's mentioned just twice in the article, once to establish the credentials of the gentleman in question, and once later as an alternative jokey reference to the speaker again.

    Honestly, get over it.

  • Miths #62 2 years ago

    ""with Move (nicely priced at £50)"

    Well, it's actually £75 with the subcontroller, so it ain't THAT far away ..."

    And more if you don't already have a PS Eye - and I imagine most PS3 owners probably don't?
    My pre-order last week of a PS Move Starter Pack (including one Move, PS Eye plus a disc with... something?) + Navigation Controller came to a grand total of 828 DKK ~ €111.

    €40 less than Kinect from the same store, but hardly cheap - although I could have opted to exclude the Nav Controller of course, but I'm pretty sure I would quickly become fed up with trying to keep the DS3 still on my left leg or in one hand.

  • VandelayIndustries #63 2 years ago

    @trebell "'I don't understand the comment about how hardware is simply to drive more Live subscriptions. Does not compute.'

    --


    that just sounded like a bloody fanboy ranting to me. very odd from a store owner."

    Kinect is pretty much a living room device and the 360 is being pushed as an entertainment center. These new owners will get the one month free gold account and all the services included - Facebook, Last FM, ESPN and SKY etc. Once they get used to the features the 30 day freebie will be over, what are they going to do? - Pretty sure that's what he's getting at.

  • smelly #64 2 years ago

    Somethign tells me microsoft will lower the price by 20 quid just before launch - gamers will cheer at the new cheaper price and rush out and buy it...

    Mark my words - i'm almost definitly wrong :D

  • BeersOfWar #65 2 years ago

    I just had really big wank over Aletta Ocean. Seriously guys, check her out. She's Hungarian Cameron Diaz with massive tits...

  • SilentNinja92 #66 2 years ago

    He has a point

    Since when were the best selling ames casual anymore? Top of the charts has been things like red dead redemption, Uncharted 2, Call of duty, battlefied BC2 and other games which arnt really party ttles for social play.

    The bulk of the market wants more gears like games, more COD, more core games with online play. Kinect works with none of these titles and they may find that those lookign for a causal experience will go straight for a wii which is cheaper and has more casual games.

    in a way sony has tried to keep the attacion accross the range with support for socom and KZ3 with move. Right now though no one will want a £130 camera to play kinectamals with and couldnt be bothered with such tech.

  • mrboshingles #67 2 years ago

    Just say what you see. 5 seconds here we go.....

  • scottycam #68 2 years ago

    I think I realised this guy doesn't have a clue what he's talking about when he said casual games have been in decline for the last 2 years.

    Being the head of a company and stating that one of your biggest suppliers products is gonna flop in the media isn't clever either.

  • xenoss #69 2 years ago

    Kinect fails; this guy has little to add to what everyone already knows; this is a No Shit Sherlock situation.

    There is just no defeating Wii in its own market. Not by making Wii-like games that had already been out for years, and certainly not at this price point. 360 fanboys need to remember there are other systems out there beyond their little shell.

    Sony will likewise fail. They might be a bit less screwed if Move actually works well for shooters. But that'd only make them less screwed, not successful.

    And that's only for a little while. Even if Move is brilliant for shooters, it will not be supported for long. Why? Because if it works, it'll allow Move users to own controller users, in similar but less dramatic ways a mouse allows PC to own consoles. Then people will whine until Move users can only play other Move users, which would split the player base. Move's being a much smaller base, will of course result in longer wait time and worse ping. Soon, there will be no one left. Thus, other games will not bother to support it, that goes double for 3rd party games. In the end, Sony is just as screwed.

    And thats IF it works. While I remain hopeful, it could very well turn out to be unresponsive in practice. And it is still a very expensive control scheme, and still not going to be as boss as Mouse.

    But Kinect? That thing will surely fail hard and early. Though to be honest, Dance Central looks good and I want to learn to dance with that. But at that price point, there is no way.

  • jjadi #70 2 years ago

    Yes, people may trade it in, but if they do and you buy it from Chips you'll be guaranteed it will smell of fags.
    Don McCabe does not know what he is talking about, his company didn't pay any tax to the government and now they are in a CVA debt agreement, only a matter of time before they go the way of the dodo.......and 2nd hand games will stop smelling of fags.

  • Machiavellian #71 2 years ago

    There is just no defeating Wii in its own market. Not by making Wii-like games that had already been out for years, and certainly not at this price point. 360 fanboys need to remember there are other systems out there beyond their little shell.

    Why do Move or Kinect have to defeat the Wii. Instead both Sony and MS want some of that nice pie. You do not have to be the one eating the whole thing, a decent slice will be enough. Also Kinect will be something MS will be putting into more than a console so I do not believe they are thinking that this will be something exclusive to the 360.

  • Kerome #72 2 years ago

    Meh. I think people miss the fact that there is a lot of synergy between casual and hardcore. Want to play Halo 3 and also do the occasional bit of whitewater rafting with the visiting nieces and nephews? Kinect may be the ticket...

    Who the heck is this CHIPS anyway? Collected Hacks Interpreting Pillorious Statements?

  • finexi #73 2 years ago

    what the hell? why don't all of these guys stop "pachting" and wait for it to be released? at least 1 thing MS has done well so far: made everyone talk about kinect...
    Edited by finexi at 22/07/10 @ 23:12

  • BillyBrush #74 2 years ago

    Igor Chipolata busy?

  • SEVQA #75 2 years ago

    Tomato Ketchup sales boost is "bollocks" says CHIPS.

  • Sunyavadin #76 2 years ago

    What in the fuck is CHIPS?
    I've never even fucking heard of them.
    Is this a northern GAME or something?

    Get a real retailer to comment, not someone at a Durham boot sale

    No, that would be Grainger Games, who basically own the market from Middlesborough upwards.
    I assumed they were some southern chain.

    Seriously, I think they're really a front for EG that they made up to fabricate articles.

  • 3william56 #77 2 years ago

    Coming up: single use Kinect Kodes, so that you have to pay M$ fifty quid to access the higher Kinect functions when it's plugged into a second 360. You heard it here first...

  • redcrayon #78 2 years ago

    Xenoss, It's not about beating the Will in it's own market, it's about establishing market share to improve on a few years down the line.

    MS are hoping the whole Kinect/facebook/X-box live package will snowball the way Facebook did about 4 years back, bringing social networking in front of the TV but giving them a healthy advantage for doing it first AND having it paid for rather than running at a loss like FB did for years.

    What's scary is that it might (might!) even work.

    Actually, If I was MS, I'd be bigging up the idea that as a parent you can keep an eye on who your kids are talking to by keeping gaming in the living room.
    Edited by redcrayon at 23/07/10 @ 08:28

  • tomjoadsghost #79 2 years ago

    The news for me here is that chips are still going, the branch we had in Norwich died unloved and unmissed 2or 3 years ago and i supposed the chain had suffered the same fate.

    Not that i disagree with him or anything.

    In all honesty i'd be more interested, if you have to interview retailers, to find out what the buyers for the supermarket chains are thinking about natal and move, after all everyone knows that casuals live in supermarkets not little psuedo indie boutiques.

    Edited by tomjoadsghost at 23/07/10 @ 09:21

  • 00.00.01 #80 2 years ago

    @BeersOfWar
    Ghehe, checked her out via Gagle Images...unfortunately at work...and no 'safe' filter on my search results....so massive pics of a bukake. Or is it snot?

  • sjmlondon #81 2 years ago

    I like a nice piece of haddock with my Chips, especially on a Friday. Salt and vinegar on both please.

  • Zomeguy #82 2 years ago

    I recently asked a couple of casuals (the target market) about Kinect and got a big HUH? as answer. So yes, it is going to be a big success for sure... /sarcasm

  • Sylos #83 2 years ago

    There's a CHIPS store in middlesbrough (the only one I've ever seen).
    At least there was when I last checked...it's probably been demolished by chavs by now : (

  • rocketdog #84 2 years ago

    When I think that I paid over £130 last year for the Rock band package and those peripherals can only be used on certain games, Kinect doesn't look too costly to me.
    And when you consider that the one Kinect system allows four players to play at once it seems even better value, for Move or even the Wii how much would the cost be to buy 4 controllers and sub-controllers! more than £130 I would think, plus all the other rubbish that they sell like steering wheels and guns to stick your controller in!
    Also my 4 year son who has never been interested in the 360, he's more of a Wii man, now wants the Animal game so he can stroke a tiger! This is the part that worries me more, losing my xbox to my child, time to buy another one!

  • tomjoadsghost #85 2 years ago

    The thing is when you payed £130 for rock band equipment you *knew* how much entertainment you'd be getting from the game, at the moment is the £130 for kinnect really offering anything more than your four year olds ability to pretend to stroke a tiger? (yeah, i know how compelling a reason that can sound, i've got two kids myself, but four year olds are fickle little machines)

  • hiddenranbir #86 2 years ago

    I think he's miffed that less and less people are coming to CHIPS.

  • BillyBrush #87 2 years ago

    ^ http://www.mcvuk.com/news/40157/CHIPS-is...