GDC: Games for Windows attacks piracy News

"The anti-piracy measures specifically target zero-day cracks, which make games available for download before retail launch. Microsoft will punch this in the face by requiring authentication for online play."

"Finally, the Roaming saves ties your progress to your Games for Windows - Live account, which you can sign into wherever you can find a PC with an internet connection."

Sounds like Steam/Steamcloud by any other name....

They tried something similar with GTA4, it was cracked within a couple of days
I am sure this will aswell

by tipping point do they mean on the verge of being scrapped as its still miles behind Steam in terms of quality features and content?

As much as GFWLive gets knocked, I'm all for it I think. It will take time to get close to the functionality of services like Steam, but I can stick with it until then. It gets my vote :)

A simple online authentication with little impact on user is always the best route and I m all for it as well. Those bleating on about DRM or other protection need to remember no protection would just encourage more people to opts for piracy.

The tempation is always too great!

WH40K: DOWII was the worst case scenario for this kind of thing. You have to have both Games for Windows and Steam to play the bloody thing!

I don't mind robust anti-piracy measures, high-budget PC games will need them if they're to survive, but that was silly.

1. Microsoft sees successful competitor.

2. Microsoft imitates successful competitor.

3. Microsoft attempts to crush successful competitor.

Hopefully this will go the way of Zune and Google rather than the way of Netscape, Apple Mac and Playstation.

Microsoft is missing the point. Again.

what is the point their missing

I like global game saves, even if I'm still waiting for anyone to get their finger out and actually deliver the promise.

I like global game saves, even if I'm still waiting for anyone to get their finger out and actually deliver the promise.

Yeah, we heard about this from Steam ages ago. Anyone know when they might actually implement it? I'm no engineer, but it doesn't seem like it'd be that hard to do, you just need the server space.

I'll try and be objective :)

1. Seems like MS have looked at Steam and thought "Ooh, good idea. I'd like some of those benjamins". Thought to be honest, if it makes the inclusion of DRM less intrusive for the legit user then it sounds like a good idea.

DRM is only an issue for the publisher if it doesn't work, and DRM is only an issue for the user if it is visible and annoying. If this makes it less visible and annoying then we as gamers should be pleased, EVEN IF it doesn't actually make it work more effectively for the publisher (which we as gamers shouldn't really be concerned about either way).

2. The online saves system sounds like a good idea, with one caveat... what happens if my internet connection is down? Can I still access offline copies of my saves? ***

3. An online store is also good news, though again it smacks of MS trying to milk Steam's cow instead of getting their own cow (except this is sort of their own cow... but you get what I mean).


*** This is part of a crucial greater question I think, which is...

If my internet connection is down, can I still play my games as normal?

That is really the 100billion dollar question for me. Most if the time the internet just works, but when it doesn't, what will be the fallout for this system?

This is all bullshit and I'm sure Mr Pessner sits on his fat arse smiling broadly while nobody can play their shitty games.

"Yeah, we heard about this from Steam ages ago. Anyone know when they might actually implement it? I'm no engineer, but it doesn't seem like it'd be that hard to do, you just need the server space."

I think it's already active on Left 4 Dead, I may be wrong though.

[edit]

http://kotaku.com/5075150/steam-cloud-la...

http://store.steampowered.com/news/1968/

"This is all bullshit"

Sage words indeed, but would you care to expand a little, just for the sake or argument and discussion? ;)

@skillian

"but it doesn't seem like it'd be that hard to do, you just need the server space."

I'm not a coder either, but I get the impression that network code can be pretty involved, especially when it comes to testing. Imagine what would happen if one day you logged in to find somebody else's save getting loaded up?

I think its not so much down to how much work is required to build these things, but rather the boilerplate and testing that is needed to ensure safe operation. as the consequences of an online cockup in a connected world are far greater than those of an offline one.

@Kangarootoo:

Whenever I read "brand new", "Microsoft" and "for games" in the same sentence I smell bullshit. It's also a fact that every new addition they do to any software is bug ridden or just plainly doesn't work.

In this case it doesn't even exist, other than fancy words and promises from a man that would lie his mum to the gallow so he could taste the apples.

I wish more PC games had GFWL, I like achievements and since most of my friends have switched to the 360, I can at least see what they are doing :)

Can i turn the Cloud saves feature off? Hope so, or that i at least control when the saves and the cloud synchronize.

DoWII is a mess regarding GFWLive and Steam. I wouldn't really mind the excessive need to use both but as usual MS screw it up. I can't sign in to Live from within the game even though i can sign in fine in the desktop app. If that's the shape of the future they can keep it, it smells.
New DRM from MS? I daren't think about how annoying this is likely to be ;__;

@BuckoA51
Can't you just ask them? :)

And about forcing online components into offline games, here's my five cents: couple of days ago my internet went down due to ip screw ups. Now, I felt like playing a steam game, half life episode 2. Did I ended up playing it? No, I didn't. Why? Because it wanted steam. When I told it I got no internet it suggested going into offline mode, after which it proclaimed, with smug smile, some sort of error...and advised me to visit a website for more info.
At that point I did find out why that service is called steam: because that's what was literally coming out of my ears. So, here's my thoughts about online authentications and similar phenomena: Bollocks to that.

I don't care about crybaby devs. If you don't like piracy to the point of allowing me to use my legitimately purchased games only at gun point and under whatever ridiculous conditions you can come up with, you should find a new job.

I'm with BuckoA51, for the very same reasons. I wish more games came with GFW Live capabilities.

I actually like Games For Windows! Sure, it's not perfect by any means, but I can clearly see the potential. I mean, this feature about globalized saves is an excellent idea and only really made possible by the fact that every gamer uses Windows.

I also like the idea of online authentication for online play as the only piracy measure. It won't intrude on law abiding citizens and it won't be possible to crack it. Sure, you can crack the single player component, but unless you start up your own game servers, you still need the original to play online.

I'm at least interested in seeing where they are going with this.

"I also like the idea of online authentication for online play as the only piracy measure. It won't intrude on law abiding citizens and it won't be possible to crack it."

Clueless.

The warez groups ALWAYS crack it. Ever hear of Himachi?

Things that GfWL should do/does that I actually want and would use it for:

- In game instant messaging regardless of what game you are playing.
- Ability to see what game all of my friends are playing (or not if they opt out of it being displayed for certain titles).
- Ability to reach my friends regardless of their activity in what is essentially a gaming MSN.
- Award systems and other bonus systems would be nice but I care little about them really.
- Make sure I can play the game without logging into GfWL if I want to (make GfWL so good and unintrusive that I WANT to log in to it all the time).

Things that make GfWL a current failure:

- Forcing you to use it when you might not be able to (no internet), even for single player.
- Online matchmaking system which is a pile of junk and whilst it could be good as an extra option to find a quick match it's just annoying, unreliable and extremely slow.
- DLC, charging you for non-transferable DRM'd content paid for by often unpurchasable denominations of MS Points instead of real money.
- The Xboxiness of it, I have a PC, I don't want it to turn into an Xbox thanks.

Finally, the main reason this fails and the main reason Steam would fail (if it didn't happen to be a games store as well) is the fact that they aren't associated with/involved with every possible game available.

If I was to use a system like this (and I would love to use one for the good reasons I posted) then it would have to work with every game I ever chose to play in an uninstrusive and respectable manner.

Before you start shoving DLC, stupid copyright protection methods and other activation related nonsense down PC gamers throats why don't you look at what your system can offer us PC Gamers that actually benefits us, features we'd actually like to use and enjoy using? Once you achieve saturation of the market and have GfWL as a true beneficial part of PC Gaming (and still optional) then you can start making your money from DLC and other crap that most of us wont buy. However, the moment you cross the line and start interfering with our gaming we will stop bothering with it.

GfWL could have really been excellent for PC Gaming and fantastic for Microsoft too, however I think it's almost too far gone to recover it now.

Not sure when MS are going to learn that PC gamers don't trust or like them. They delay PC games, riddle them with intrusive DRM, wonder why PC gamers won't buy crap DLC that we've historically gotten for free and generally treat us like second-class market.

This isn't the way forward, MS :/

Well Valve did say Microsoft should take charge of PC games business, so this is what there doing - can't stand Steam quite frankly they overcharged me for a game, paypal stepped in sorted it out. After 8 weeks they finally refunded me the game that I had was taken off my account, and valves shitty steam deceided that I needed to pay for this game I no longer own in order to buy extra games.

I'm going to say new people to PC gaming will go with Games for Windows.

End of.

Grandiose. Games with GFW will be cracked on the first day anyway, and buyers will have to go through yet another POS API that will make playing even more difficult.

Thanks for yet another fuckup, Microsoft.

Windsong: Clueless.

Yes, I am pretty much clueless when it comes to piracy and the applications needed to make it work. Is that something to be embarrassed about? I mean, there's only one reason YOU would know what "Hamachi" is, right? I'm guessing it isn't for research purposes.

>Sounds like Steam/Steamcloud by any other name....

Steam and GfW will become one in the not so far future.

>And about forcing online components into offline games, here's my five cents: couple of days ago my internet went down due to ip screw ups. Now, I felt like playing a steam game, half life episode 2. Did I ended up playing it? No

True.. but there are also good things about this. I just got a new laptop and just logged into steam and it downloaded all my steam games and installed them ;) There certainly is a case for "always connected" gaming and seriously, how many times does your Internet connection go down? Maybe a new ISP? ;)

>Games with GFW will be cracked on the first day anyway

They will be cracked but will NOT be playable online in the matchmaking of GfW (or Steam). So pirates will still be able to play in their own little (or big) world but they won't have the chance to play in the ranked matchmaking.

>DoWII is a mess regarding GFWLive and Steam

It is not.. it works perfectly. The only annoying thing is that both Steam and GfW steal processor power.

@levitate

Hey, thanks for responding to my sarcasm in a constructive way :)


"It is not.. it works perfectly. The only annoying thing is that both Steam and GfW steal processor power."

Surely if it worked perfectly, it wouldn't steal processor power, or in any other way be annoying? ;)

It is not.. it works perfectly. The only annoying thing is that both Steam and GfW steal processor power.

They work, but it's just weird. You have two logins, two chat windows, two friends lists, two ways to invite players. It doesn't directly affect your enjoyment but it's hardly a professional end product.

Why didn't they just pick one or the other? What does Steam actually add to the game?

I love all the bitching about how Microsoft are rubbish and we all hate them for fucking up PC games, but you're all shouting that while playing on your PC with Microsoft Windows on Microsoft DirectX.

If you hate them that much go buy an iMac and see how far you get.

If you hate them that much go buy an iMac and see how far you get.

If you hate cars, why don't you walk and see how far you'll get. If you hate politicans, try and run a country yourself and see how far you'll get and so on... That argument is flawed and worthless in this discussion. You can have opinions about something you use, ESPECIALLY if you're actually using it. Which we all are in one way or another.