Fallout: New Vegas dev asks fans what game they would like it to Kickstart

By Wesley Yin-Poole Published 13 February, 2012

Planescape Torment designer "down" with call for old school isometric RPG.

Fallout: New Vegas developer Obsidian Entertainment has asked fans what game they would like to see it make if it called for funding through Kickstarter.

Obsidian creative director Chris Avellone asked for suggestions on the Obsidian forum and on his personal Twitter page.

Many fans have suggested Obsidian create an old school isometric role-playing game. Funny that - Avellone was lead developer on old school isometric RPG Planescape Torment.

Cult classic Planescape Torment was developed by Black Isle Studios and released in 1999 by Interplay Entertainment. It uses the Advanced Dungeons & Dragons (AD&D) fantasy campaign setting and a modified version of the Infinity Engine, the one used for BioWare's Baldur's Gate.

"The idea of player-supported funding is... well, it's proof certain genres aren't dead and sequels may have more legs than they seem," he said.

"And the idea of not having to argue that with a publisher is appealing."

Avellone's interest in Kickstarter was sparked by Psychonauts creator Tim Schafer's astonishing recent success in raising enough cash to fund development of a new old school adventure game.

Last week Schafer's Double Fine shocked the gaming world when it raised over $1 million in 24 hours for its publisher-free game. It obliterated its $400,000 target in a matter of hours, and smashed Kickstarter records.

"All of Double Fine's success from Kickstarter has been inspiring," Avellone said.

"I admit, I've got Kickstarter fever now. I feel like a bunch of doors suddenly appeared in game development."

Twisted Metal creator David Jaffe, set to leave developer Eat Sleep Play following the March release of his PlayStation 3 exclusive, has also expressed interest in crowd-sourced funding.

But he cautioned against getting too excited by the likes of Kickstarter.

"I think the real question, whether in the next month, if [Double Fine's campaign] hits $2 million or $8 million, does that signal a new way of funding games?" Jaffe asked in an interview with Gamasutra.

"Or is this kind of a one-off thing, because it was led by Tim Schafer? Is this actually moving the needle? That, we don't know.

"Now, with what's happened with Tim's Kickstarter, sure, I would consider [crowd-funding]. There's kind of the fear that this would suddenly become, you know, a dick-measuring contest. Schafer comes out and raises a million, and Jaffe only raises $200,000.

"But joking aside... I think I would be really nervous because suddenly now it's not just a publisher's money. Suddenly you have all these peoples' money, and you don't want to let them down."

Picture of Wesley.

About Wesley Yin-Poole

Wesley is Eurogamer's news editor. He likes news, interviews, and more news. He also likes Street Fighter more than anyone can get him to shut up about it.

Read more articles from Wesley by visiting the Wesley Yin-Poole archive page.

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Comments (49) Latest comment 3 months ago

Comments for this article are now closed, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • GordonJ #1 3 months ago

    Most people would fund a QA department

  • StolenGlory #2 3 months ago

    Can we use Kickstarter to fund the salaries of some QA folk? If so, then tell me where to donate.

  • bad09 #3 3 months ago

    We owe you nothing, think up your own game ;)

  • grayn #4 3 months ago

    Yeah, Obsidian have no chance with their reputation.

  • X201 #5 3 months ago

    "Fallout: New Vegas dev asks fans what game they would it to Kickstart "


    A missing word game? :)

  • arcam #6 3 months ago

    It does seem that this weekend's article about how "Devs Owe Fans Nothing" really was spectacularly mistimed.

  • Inmediasress #7 3 months ago

    Yes yes yes oldschool RPG please I'd give my money for that anytime if not else just because the genre is particularly dead.
    The whole RPG business moves away into the interactive movie making ala Bioware.

  • wobbly_Bob #8 3 months ago

    After fallout new vegas ( i loved fallout 3 ) make nothing at all.

  • TeaFiend #9 3 months ago

    Could developers please stop with suddenly thinking this is a great idea? It will work once. One of the important things about having a publisher is they make you do work, if you miss deadlines you do not get paid. Giving the developer the whole budget at the start means they can dick about if they want to.

    What happens if someone gets 8 million moneys and makes a game for 2 that is a 2/10? Going to cry to make their yacht a lake?

  • bf #10 3 months ago

    I'd pay upfront for a RPG with a Silent Storm / Jagged Alliance 2 feel and setting.

  • MisterFalseName #11 3 months ago

    Alpha Protocol 2, please.

    Intrigued to see whether this gets voted up or down - I am entirely serious, though.

  • Ternon #12 3 months ago

    Why on earth are people dissing Obsidian here?

    They did a fantastic job with Fallout New Vegas which is in every way superior to Fallout 3 and also did revolutionary combat with Dungeon Siege 3, which is now copied to Amalur.

    Have people forgotton how great Dungeon Siege 3 was(although a bit short)??

  • DrStrangelove #13 3 months ago

    "But joking aside... I think I would be really nervous because suddenly now it's not just a publisher's money. Suddenly you have all these peoples' money, and you don't want to let them down."
    I think most people who take part in this crowd-funding are nicer and more in love with games than your average publisher. I mean, if you're working for a publisher, you're going to be in big trouble if sales expectations aren't met. Expectations toward crowd-funded games are more about quality than quantity, I suppose.

  • Whitster #14 3 months ago

    I'd contribute to a kickstart project to get Jaffe to shut up about everything.

  • spudsbuckley #15 3 months ago

    People are going to feel rather silly if these kickstarted games turn out to be shite after they contribute money to them.

    That's probably what will destroy the whole concept as well. Some dev will basically take the money and run by putting out a bad/unfinished game.

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #16 3 months ago

    It does seem that this weekend's article about how "Devs Owe Fans Nothing" really was spectacularly mistimed.
    Well, this is kind of the flip side of that. It's devs with cult fanbases saying "Right, if you think we owe you, lets see the colour of your money up front".

    Of course, the problem with this is that said fans risk as much disappointment with a company's output as they did when they only had a deluded impression of their investment in them.

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #17 3 months ago

    Have people forgotton how great Dungeon Siege 3 was
    They made a game of that Jason Statham movie?

  • RoOhDaMite #18 3 months ago

    Some games really benefit from small teams and small budget. I'm glad devs now have more options to fund the games they really want to make.
    Edited by RoOhDaMite at 13/02/12 @ 10:19

  • Wempler #19 3 months ago

    I feared something like this would happen. Sub-par developers start getting ideas, and it'll start getting quite risky.
    Obsidian hasn't made anything worthwhile on their own - it has always been other's IP. And those IPs have always been a mixed success.

    A few "bad" developers and kickstarting developers could be shot down before it even gets off the ground, with the exception of some developers with very good reputation.


    If they want to do an isometric RPG like Baldur's Gate, Planescape or the like, they would be more than welcome - I'd probably post a bit of money in it as well. But I'm not getting my hope up with Obsidian.
    Then again, the thing that interested my about the "old school" RPGs were as much the universe in which they were set, as it was the gameplay. I'm a sucker for Forgotten Realms and Planescape.

  • lucky_jim #20 3 months ago

    @spudsbuckley

    I don't think it'll come to that. I reckon Double Fine have pulled this off because they're Double Fine.

    Tim Schafer's fans trust Double Fine, and rightly so: even the occasional mis-steps like Brutal Legend are better than most games. People wouldn't stump up the cash for a developer they didn't trust, and the project wouldn't get off the ground in the first place, so I can't really see your pessimistic scenario coming to pass.

    I love the fact that Tim Schafer can raise a million from the public by clicking his fingers. Is it too late for him to enter the US presidential race?

  • arcam #21 3 months ago

    @MENTAL1ST

    Really, you think that's the attitude being shown here? Who would want to give money to someone who talked like that? It's certainly not the impression I got from Schafer's campaign.

    To me it seems like the very definition of community. Gamers showing faith in their favourite developers, developers showing faith in their most loyal fans. It sounds like devs are finding the idea of dealing directly with fans and avoiding the straitjacket of publishers' demands very appealing.

    (If you hadn't guessed, I'm a big, big fan of this type of crowdsourced funding and development.)

  • WinterSnowblind #22 3 months ago

    Anyone who thinks Obsidian make bad games has no idea what they're talking about (or at least has very poor taste).

    They've been buggy, yes.. and in some cases completely unfinished, but you know what? That has little to do with them as developers and is more the fault of the publishers forcing them to release unfinished games, usually because they've been taken on board to develop quick sequels to big name franchises.

    New Vegas alone proves what they can do, it was far better written than 3, had much better mechanics and was much closer to actually feeling like Fallout.. Despite Alpha Protocol's shortcomings, it did the choice/consequence thing better than any other game so far, even having your actions during missions effect the story.

    If they want money to fund their own project, without publishers breathing down their necks, I'm all for it.

  • DanForinton #23 3 months ago

    Well, if the comments here are anything to go by, Obsidian will have a hard time raising a substantial amount of money for anything else other than the Planescape sequel (or its spiritual equivalent, since I doubt they'd get the license).

  • Rogueywon #24 3 months ago

    I don't mind whether it's a sequel, a reboot or a "spiritual successor", but I'd quite like a return to something like Icewind Dale. I think Dragon Age actually, despite its flaws, did a good job of being the Baldur's Gate successor. But I'd quite like something more tightly focussed. Shift the emphasis away from complicated plots and character work and give me a well-made old-school tactical dungeon crawl.

    My requirements for this would be:

    1) Full party control (preferably 6+ members), with a camera viewpoint that facilitates rather than hindering this.
    2) Fully "designed" maps. No procedural content. Random generation is no substitute for the mind of a clever designer.
    3) A decent, single-player focussed rule base under-pinning things. Don't worry about "balance" (which is only relevant for hardcore multiplayer), but keep things interesting.
    4) A good mix of tactics-heavy battles and complicated (preferably multi-location in some cases) puzzles, with relatively little hand-holding.

    Modern RPGs seem to have split between the "full, complicated virtual worlds" and "clicky clicky action RPG". I'd love a return to something intelligent but narrowly focussed, like the old games based on AD&D modules.

  • hiddenranbir #25 3 months ago

    Old school isometric massive Total-war sized sandbox MnB style rpg. NOW.

  • RedSparrows #26 3 months ago

    I'd love an isometric RPG set in Fifth Element land. That'd be right fun.

  • Srift #27 3 months ago

    How about kickstarting a whole brand new engine to run the Fallout games...if there will be more.

  • CaptainKid #28 3 months ago

    Fallout 4 off course!
    But that wouldn't be realistic; it would cost to much to make.

  • Stranded87 #29 3 months ago

    Please please please make a deep isometric RPG with a strong story and role playing. If it's in the Planescape universe even better (note: I don't want a sequel to Planescape Torment, leave that well alone, but the universe is incredibly rich and could easily support more games).

    Failing that Alpha Protocol 2 would be nice.

  • Phantom_Dynamite #30 3 months ago

    Alpha Protocol 2

    With a much updated engine
    Edited by Phantom_Dynamite at 13/02/12 @ 11:22

  • SpaceMidget75 Verified Senior Software Developer, Minerva Computer Services #31 3 months ago

    I'd just like to say a big "Oh fuck off" to this one I think.

    Double Fine aside, (for being 1st) I'm not sure I like established studios getting in on the act and thinking they've got easy funding from the general public in return for a few signed photos and a fucking T-Shirt.

    Kickstarter should be for the devs who don't get work from the likes of Bethesda, but as always the big companies have seen something of worth and are going to bloody well take advantage of it.

    At the very least if they should be offering a financial return on investment.

    Anyway, good luck to all those bedroom devs who's fantastic tech demo was going to be turned into a game via Kickstarter; the big money is about to put a nice tarnish on the whole thing.

    Edit: Just want to point out that I have nothing against Obsidian, it's just that the timing of Double Fine getting over a million and then this popping up leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
    Edited by SpaceMidget75 at 13/02/12 @ 11:31

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #32 3 months ago

    @arcam "Really, you think that's the attitude being shown here?"

    The only difference between your way and mine of describing it is that you have used optimistic, and I have used cynical spin.

    I'm sure that many of these projects will turn out well, but some are going to crash and burn, maybe never even come out at all, and that's going to cause a backlash. Give a games developer a load of cash up front, and there's a fair chance they'll piss it up against a wall - see Ion Storm, Realtime Worlds...

  • evarofzentral #33 3 months ago

    Dystopian police state RPG!

  • Stranded87 #34 3 months ago

    @SpaceMidget75

    I agree that this might hurt the little devs that actually need kickstarter and that would be a shame. But if it's being used to finance games that publishers wont risk financing (eg in double fines case maybe a point and click or in obsidians case an isometric rpg) then i'm all for it.

    These frankly brilliant genres are all but dead and these guys are the best of the best when it comes to making games in them. If this leads Obsidian to make something half as good as Planescape Torment then I'm all for it, and I almost don't care how many indie, big budget or any other type of games it affects.

    That said I wont give them any money without a clear idea of what they'll use it for, and if the project doesn't sound amazing I wont give them any money anyway, same as the indie guys.
    Edited by Stranded87 at 13/02/12 @ 11:52

  • arcam #35 3 months ago

    @MENTAL1ST Of course, we are taking the risk instead of publishers. But I have faith in people to choose the right developers to give their money to. It worked for Schafer because he is a fucking cool guy and has built up a great relationship with his fans.

    Other devs willing to do that will also find people willing to hand over cash for nothing more than a promise. If any devs really are saying "we owe the fans nothing", their requests for up-front funding will likely go unheard.

    Anyway, this is all very early days. There's a long way before we can say it really works. I hope it does though.

  • MattEdWithCheese #36 3 months ago

    @X201 A hidden object game?

  • FireMonkey #37 3 months ago

    Kickstarter is great for 'some' devs, but only those who already have the respect of the fans.

    I doubt a new start-up with a great idea for a game or a company with no experience in that type of game would get anywhere near enough money to fund their game via Kickstarter.

    For all the hate publishers seem to get, they do take a huge financial risk on some games / developers and that can be the making of a new great studio.

  • Rack #38 3 months ago

    What worries me most is that Obsidian are pretty much infamous for overestimating their abilities to deliver games on a small budget. Kotor 2 was far too ambitious for the time allowed, ditto Alpha Protocol. If they did this I'd like to see something with either twice the budget they allowed for or half as ambitious as they think they can manage. But if it means they actually get a finished game then colour me excited.

  • Vixremento #39 3 months ago

    An interesting concept this kick-starter thing...if I could choose anything I'd take an original Syndicate remake. Also I'd expect my 'kickstart' contribution to get deducted from the purchase price of the game.

    I'd happily give $100 for an offline version of Diablo III...since they seem so snotty I gave even less than that for something else (with change to pick and and play something else too!). It's not that I dislike online that much - it's just that if I have to experience any lag, disconnects, constant forced updates, having the RMAH pushed in my face, being forced to create a social account of some sort (battletag?) then really I just couldn't care (and I don't buy into their "magic bullet lag-free play crap" - I've heard from fellow buddies that managed to somehow screw the dog of a dog of a dog that belongs to a friend of a relative of a blizz employee's friend that knows the employees auntie to get beta access and they think the lag sux even prior to their 'US 100k invite') then I just don't want to even bother (I don't want to live with it and as many many Blizz fanboys have suggested I'll play something else!).

    Phew - okay what was the topic again?

  • KanePaws #40 3 months ago

    Create an old school isometric role-playing game!
    Create an old school isometric role-playing game!

  • kassmageant #41 3 months ago

    make rpg about indie developers fighting evil publishers.

  • juliankennedy23 #42 3 months ago

    Another vote for Alpha Protocol 2

  • agparrot #43 3 months ago

    Even though I would theoretically ++ an Alpha Protocol 2, I suspect that the actual budget required for that sort of thing would exceed even Mr Schafer's recent accomplishments.

    @GordonJ really made me laugh though,
    Most people would fund a QA department
    Bravo, sir.

  • misinformed #44 3 months ago

    @Ternon Apart from the graphics were inferior to the origional Fallout 3, and it took me a dozen mods to get the game into a good shape both graphically and gameplay wise.

  • Rens11 #45 3 months ago

    Ill all for kick starter if the gamers like us support the talented but small studios to produce more games I just hope that idiots with more money than sense fund developers who dont care about games but only about the profit

  • AOFanboi #46 3 months ago

    Rare should do a Kickstarter project to fund a re-implementation of Speccy classic Knight Lore.

    The updated 3D monstrosity of Sabre Wulf I ignore.

  • Zaiz #47 3 months ago

    I'd like to see Obsidian develop another game. Fallout: NV was a fantastic game. Much better than FO3. Obsidian took Bethesda's FO3 and turned it into something that was distinctly theirs. Brilliant job really. Too bad the game was buggy, but it ended up more stable than Oblivion.

    I really never understand the glitchy games hate tbh. There were a lot of games with terrible, terrible glitches that are remembered as "classics" even though the glitches are worse than a day 1 bethesda game. I expect people nowadays whine because it can be fixed, and back then they'd just reload their save.

  • GuyNoir #48 3 months ago

    Making NW2 playable out of the box might be a good start. (yep I know there have been patches, but still).

  • Rambostyrer #49 3 months ago

    I would back it.....