Sledgehammer: Modern Warfare 3 isn't camper-friendly

By Fred Dutton Published 8 November, 2011

Condrey takes a pot shot at Battlefield 3.

Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3's multiplayer is designed to make life hard on campers, according to co-developer Sledgehammer Games.

Speaking in an interview with Official Xbox Magazine, Sledgehammer boss Michael Condrey explained that MW3 offers hasn't completely hobbled the sniper, but silent assassins should find life more difficult this time around.

"I think that the person who plays the sniper on a team can have a ton of fun, but one of the biggest criticisms you always hear is about campers, right? We don't want to emphasise that dynamic so much that the other people in that engagement aren't having fun," he said.

"We have less verticality in our maps, there are less camping points. And so the challenge for snipers is to hang back on the perimeter or the periphery and pick people off - the maps aren't set up to really capitalise on that, by intention.

"There are weapon proficiencies for snipers, like there are weapon proficiencies for every class, that can allow you to do cool things - there's Focus, for example, which gives you less sway. So there are ways to improve as a sniper, but I think it's more tuned and more balanced than it's ever been before."

Condrey then proceeded to take a pot shot at the rather more sniper-friendly Battlefield 3.

"Unlike other games, where you're going to be sniped from across the map by a guy you can't even see, and then respawn and you've got to run for five minutes to get back to the battle, right? That's not the Modern Warfare 3 method. This is about getting you in the action, you're pulling the trigger fast, you know what I mean? That's the essence of it."

The latest entry in the Call of Duty series arrived in stores this morning, picking up a solid 8/10 in Eurogamer's Modern Warfare 3 review.

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About Fred Dutton

Fred Dutton is Eurogamer's US news editor, based in Washington DC.

Read more articles from Fred by visiting the Fred Dutton archive page.

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Comments (68) Latest comment 7 months ago

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  • filipo #1 7 months ago

    For someone who hates snipers, he doesn't seem to mind taking a few long distance pot-shots at the opposition.

  • Adamical #2 7 months ago

    What a cunt.

  • rojjer #3 7 months ago

    Meh. He's got a point, but there's a place for both I think. Played both BF3 (PC) and MW3 (360) now and its a totally different experience - Multiplayer on MW3 is streets ahead of Blackops, nicely refined imo.
    Edited by rojjer at 08/11/11 @ 17:56

  • randompanda #4 7 months ago

    The whole "dogtag" collection aspect has certainly made camping trickier in its respective gametype. The rest of it is still quite the campfest at times though.

    Survival's wonderful though. The attention to co-operative play in this should be an example to other developers.

  • fletch7100 #5 7 months ago

    less verticality in mp map design isnt such a great thing. Smaller maps for Close quarters which COD excels needs different heights of threats to make the game more interesting. Checking rooftops, upper floors. Same as Battlefield, if there was no different varying heights in the map and level area, it be snipers paradise. Just massive empty playing area and one bush, 24 wookies trying to hide in it

    Otherwise might as get a Doom level and throw everyone in that. Damn there was steps in some Doom levels, cant use that.

  • Claudiov1.0 #6 7 months ago

    I usually play as a sniper..so... yeah good to hear i hated BO because the crappy hit\detection and because if you are a sniper a guy can take you out with an smg... thats why i love KZ3 instead of putting snipers into a disadvantage they create a way to counter attack snipers... thats what they should have done in BO!!

    I Hope MW3 is way better...

  • fletch7100 #7 7 months ago

    also snipers have been nerfed in BF3 with their giant torch shining out of their high powered scopes. So if you see that, run across open area without using cover and get killed, then you deserve to die. In fact may I just revive you, then kill you again to prove the point.

  • asphaltcowboy #8 7 months ago

    It's pretty difficult to be a decent sniper in BF3 and "sitting on the periphery taking potshots" doesn't confer that many points either, so to say they incentivise it is completely inaccurate. Also, running for 5 minutes to get back into the action is nonsense (squad spawning, medics, spawn beacons anyone?) and only serves to highlight that MW3 must be chuffin' tiny (with a lack of verticality)!

    All in all, good job!
    Edited by asphaltcowboy at 08/11/11 @ 18:12

  • darleysam #9 7 months ago

    So we hate the fighting between our two publishers, except when it's our own publisher doing it? 'kay guys.

  • Kyledanutmeg #10 7 months ago

    This guy is an idiot. Hey so like in all COD games people don't camp because they run around with a 50 cal sniper as if it's an SMG. So saying shit about an actually more balanced and more realistic game is a big understatement.

  • Bailzebub #11 7 months ago

    Aye bear in mind the decent recon on your team has dropped a spawn point next to another flag so you're not spawning back at your base in the first place.

    Oh and he's just made a load of red dots appear on your mini-map by pressing <select> instead of having to get a few kills in a row. Cheers for the assist lar!

  • kirankara #12 7 months ago

    camping isnt exclusive to Snipers , as its people in cod games who stay in a room and, surround themselves with ckaymores, or using heartbeat sensor, who I count as campers, and far more annoying than snipers. At least snipers are meant to sit in a place, as thats their role.

  • Collymilad #13 7 months ago

    Whatever dickhead

    A) Battlefield 3 isn't snipe or camp happy at all (at least not in conquest)and

    B) It and DICE piss all over your sorry excuse for a game.

    Away to fuck.

  • cheeky_BILLY #14 7 months ago

    ' ..and you've got to run for five minutes to get back to the battle, right?'

    run, RUN? One doe's not RUN in BF3 . One simply rides with ones squad chums in a big fuck off tank.

  • Cobalt_Jackal #15 7 months ago

    Oh no he didn't!
    Edited by Cobalt_Jackal at 08/11/11 @ 18:34

  • DUFFKING #16 7 months ago

    I dunno - if he's talking about rush he might be right but then it's probably what's called 'defending'. Other modes it's not a problem.

  • asho #17 7 months ago

    Im afraid he is 100% right, I came across more campers and snipers in BF3 and Yes you cant see them so fucking annoying. I wasn't impressed overall with BF3 and went back to Black ops.

  • UnblestCarpet #18 7 months ago

    Oooh burn! Instead there are just many ways to get cheap kills such as kill streaks.

  • superted1974 #19 7 months ago

    Long shot?

    More of a cheap shot!

  • inutaihanyou #20 7 months ago

    Did he even reference BF3? Or did someone assume they were talking about BF3 in order to gin up controversy?

  • shinybonce #21 7 months ago

    Quick scoping is soooooooo realistic ! What a twat !

  • Dizzy #22 7 months ago

    Well TBH he has a point. Snipers have been the curse of FPS games for ages.

  • CaptainQuint #23 7 months ago

    Funny, CoD games have the worst camping I've ever seen. Indoor camping is an epidemic. Wanna get shot in the back? Enter any building in CoD.

  • Raiten #24 7 months ago

    Camping in BF3? talking about rush here? by default the whole job of defending side is to camp, so the whole argument is pointless.
    Unless we count defending objectives in conquest as camping too, but that'd be pointless also, considering you'd be a terribard player if you couldn't perform a simple task of defending an objective.

    Besides, like anyone who has played BF3 would know, if you die from sniper and never saw them, you're either staring at the ground or admiring the dogfights going above the sky. You'd have to be utterly blind not to see the glowy torch like lens from a sniping recon. Not to mention, it is highly unlikely to even be sniped across the map in BF3, heck you'd have to at best pull a over 1000m headshot on a moving target, so far anyone who has done such an achievement did it on a target that wasn't moving at all.

    Let's tackle the point of not getting to the fight soon enough, eh? you're most likely allways in a squad, you can spawn on captured objectives, spawn beacon or your squad mate, so getting in the fight is only matter of waiting to spawn, unless you do not have any captured points of squad at the field, the fight is anyway at your base, so you're gona be spawning right in to the fight again.
    Not to mention, there's allways the vehicles there to take you fast where you want to go.

    So erh, if this was supposed to be a pot shot at bf3, it realy is an utterly failed attempt.

  • UnblestCarpet #25 7 months ago

    @Dizzy so were dual wielding shotguns... Where's my AWM?

  • fletch7100 #26 7 months ago

    Have hardly had any problems with Snipers/campers in BF3. Can see snipers via that scope glint because people whined about not being able to see snipers, can even see it through smoke. Seeing giant doritos above peoples head when you spot them, able to see tracer fire, high powered rounds being fired across the map, kill cam.

    People moan about defenders camping in Rush mode, well they are in defensive position that we attackers have to overrun. What you expect them to do? jump around in the open for you. Think people mistake camping and objective defending. Conquest different game altogether, mini battles flowing all round the map as flags are taken/retaken so the action is flowing round the map instead of being funnelled into a certain area.

  • kirankara #27 7 months ago

    The other aspect of this is in cod., people have no reason to come out their camper hole, as building is impervious, and only bothered about k/d ratio.at least in.bf3 you have objectives to be concerned with, and bring people out of camping holes , and the same building can't be used indefinitely

  • marmaduke #28 7 months ago

    To be fair, Battlefield 3 does seem like a hiking simulator at times.

  • dsmx #29 7 months ago

    I don't get why there's so much hate for campers. If your stupid enough to killed by the same person, in the same place with the same gun multiple times perhaps you should be taking a look at yourself rather than the person whose camping.

  • anaxerxes #30 7 months ago

    There are fewer camping points, you illiterate twat.

  • FeralYouth #31 7 months ago

    No just quick scoping friendly. Which is just as bad, if not worse. Because you really would have people running around with Snipers doing that sort of thing wouldn't you in a War like situation.

  • spudsbuckley #32 7 months ago

    Try sniper-camping in Conquest in BF3 and enjoy coming last on your team constantly.

    MW3 is probably great but it and BF3 couldn't be more different.

  • kirankara #33 7 months ago

    @dsmx

    Nothing more annoying than some cheap.twat who literally doesnt move out of a room, and when killed comes straight back. It is however hilarious walking in a bit of a circle, knowing they will come back, and killing them again. Four times is my record for that trick. How thick can one person be lol ?

  • AnotherIdiot #34 7 months ago

    They said they were going down this road a long time ago. They are making a game for all the wankers who only want to play maps like nuketown, dome, killhouse, etc. It shows they don't understand their userbase, or what makes a good game.

  • kirankara #35 7 months ago

    @AnotherIdiot

    yeah most people loved nuketown, and i absolutely hated it. much preferred the more expansive maps

  • Shikasama #36 7 months ago

    If BF3 is anything like BFBC2, the game is fucking ruined by snipers.

    Not because they kill you from massive distances, but because it is your entire fucking team and noone does the objectives.

  • Tokamak #37 7 months ago

    So now the gaming press are trying to push people into 2 camps huh?
    How about you just stay neutral Mr Dutton instead of inflaming and therefore perpetuating this ridiculous BF3 vs MW3 farce.

    MW3 will sell far more than BF3 that'd a given. MW3 is a good game. So far the single player campaign is much better than BF3's but the multiplayer in BF3 is a different beast to MW3's altogether its all about teamwork and all the better for it too.

    I'd like to see the storey telling and set pieces from MW3 in BF3's Frostbite 2 engine. That would totally rock.

  • Wyrm #38 7 months ago

    Five minutes? Jesus...

  • Errol #39 7 months ago

    This guy hasn't played BF before. I'll bet he never player 1942, BF2 or 2142 before.

    Complete fool.

  • tankboi #40 7 months ago

    What a crock of shit. Camping is fine, it creates a good challenge. In BF2 there were many times my squad battled our way to a sniper. It felt very rewarding when we finally flanked him as another squad were suppressing. That was the kind of fun where you have to use your brain instead of your twitchy 2-second spawn/die cycle luckometer of Modern Wankfare.

    Sorry but 'camping' is not some universal slur that you can throw at any game. All games are different believe it or not, and some of those games can have campers without losing any of the fun.

    Anyone that moans about campers clearly only plays twitch-reaction games in tiny badly designed maps. not my cup of tea thanks.

  • Stratix #41 7 months ago

    Run 5 minutes, or, a BF 3 player has the option to pick a more intellegent spawn point like a squad mate instead of being dumped god knows where.

  • kirankara #42 7 months ago

    @Shikasama

    Never had this issue tbh

  • watu #43 7 months ago

    People who bitch about camping enemies are so naive.

  • watu #44 7 months ago

    @kirankara nuketown was fun in small doses but playing it felt like the equivalent of Homer Simpson repeatedly reaching for the electrified doughnut.

  • slow2run #45 7 months ago

    @tankboi
    "Camping is fine, it creates a good challenge"
    Bollox.
    Camping and campers are neither fine or challenging. No one likes a camper, cheap and lazy game play and don't give me any tactical reasoning for it. I love to melee campers, always very fun. Fuckin trollin campers!

  • slow2run #46 7 months ago

    @myms1ps3
    I don't have MW3 or BF3 its full of campers!

  • svenjl #47 7 months ago

    @Collymilad
    Yourself?

  • svenjl #48 7 months ago

    I snipe in BF3. Sniping is not camping, it's a skill. I've had awesome sniper battles across hillsides while the masses crawl around like ants below.

  • tankboi #49 7 months ago

    @slow2run

    Surely moaning about camping just means you can't kill them? Sorry but it is war in these games. Men constantly running about without stopping is so fucking stupid it hurts my brain. It also means that every match is the same and gets boring. Campers create emergent gameplay by creating artificial chokepoints. Stop whining about being killed by someone who is stationary because it just sounds like your throwing your toys out the pram.

    Say it out loud, 'I can't stant being killed by someone who is not mmoving'...it sounds ridiculous doesn't it. whats the difference between being killed by some who is moving or stationary? Really!?

  • AnotherIdiot #50 7 months ago

    It's true the other CODs were not about sniping or camping either, However in previous CODs you could play tactically if you tried really hard, and it was fun to do so, though it was not the way to play if you really wanted to finish on top.

    The game was already heavily biased to run-around-like-a-6-year-old-at-playtime-with-fire-held-down-and-scream-like-a-brat-if-anyone-playing-differently-stops-you. Atleast the previous developers gave some leeway for people to play a bit differently some of the time, but even that was too much for the cry babies Sledgehammer have chosen to pander to.
    Edited by AnotherIdiot at 09/11/11 @ 10:16

  • username84 #51 7 months ago

    I'm not really that against campers. It makes for a more tactical game figuring out where they are and the best way to flush the out / kill them. Especially with a few mates. Much more satisfying than seeing who can pull the trigger first after you bumble into someone in a dark corridor.

  • zegerman1942 #52 7 months ago

    So essentially you create a sniper, because you know people want to play it, but then you cripple that class but still claim they can have a "ton of fun". That's fair enough really - in my opinion CoD has never been about sniping/camping. It's running, jumping and killing.

    He also should play some BF3 because i rarely have to run several minutes to get back into the fight. I tend to spawn on my team mates or a spawn beacon, or (listen to this CoD) i jump into one of the many vehicles available.

    I don't have a problem with CoD MP at all. But comparing it with BF3 MP is like comparing apples and oranges. BF3 is larger scale and leaning slightly more towards war simulation (thankfully without going all the way), and part of that experience is sniper cover, LMG support positions etc. In BF3 that works because for every trick the enemy has there is a counter measure.

  • WJF #53 7 months ago

    To everyone saying you 'never' have to run 5 minutes - how many games of BF3 have you played?

    There's been plenty of times where my squad have been killed, only to find all the bloody boats gone - long swim to shore.

    Or even better - spawning in Caspian Border to find all the tanks and jeeps gone. That's one hell of a boring run.

    I don't think BF3 is half as bad for snipers as BFBC2 (the man's talking BS basically), but you're more likely to spawn-die or spawn-run for 5 mins to the battle then you lot are making out.

  • Sodding_Gamer #54 7 months ago

    I have no problem with campers. Considering that is what a "sniper" actually does. Fair enough to try and eliminate it in your game but to take a "pot-shot" at bf3 is rather harsh. Given you can "spot" the snipers let alone gameplay is completely different.

  • Vedfolner #55 7 months ago

    I'm one happy camper and I really don't get this. If you hate campers why do you put snipers in your game in the first place? Sniping is a game in itself and staying in the periphery of things ... well that's camping isn't it? If you get too close to the action - which isn't my preferred style anyway - as as sniper you end up dead in no time.

  • username84 #56 7 months ago

    @WJF Yeah but if all the vehicles are gone don't run off. Wait for thirty seconds and more will re-spawn. Obviously it takes longer to get into the thick of it than COD but that's because it's a game of varying distance. It's not close range combat, it's about planning a route and method of attack. Running directly into the fray loan wolf style from spawn is something most Battlefield Players don't do. It's only when COD players play Battlefield like a COD game they get frustrated. I'm not COD bashing, I loved MW2 and played it a lot. You just cant play one game like the other.

  • norsende #57 7 months ago

    "This is about getting you in the action, you're pulling the trigger fast, you know what I mean?"

    Yes, you mean the game is catered for ADHD casuals.

  • anthonypappa #58 7 months ago

    camping happens in real life, that's like what snipers do. what's the problem?

    would rather have balanced maps - open spaces, bottle necks, hiding places etc. rather than some mindless kill house.

  • rashes #59 7 months ago

    Totally not relevant to this thread but I really miss the customized logo things on the player-cards in MW3.

  • rudedudejude #60 7 months ago

    There's no camping because it's Quake 3 Arena with re-skinned weps and maps.

  • Uncompetative #61 7 months ago

    Thing is... you never pull the trigger of a Sniper Rifle fast.

    You gently squeeze it.

    What an idiot.

  • tankboi #62 7 months ago

    @WJF

    You can be revived in the BF series. Its called teamwork, and the threat of a long walk should encourage this. Unfortunately in BF3 its pretty broken...the respawn times are way too quick so everyone just respawns instead of being revived. BF2 nailed it but DICE have totally lost the plot this time around.

    EDIT: sorry that wasn't actually meant to sound so patronising :S
    Edited by tankboi at 09/11/11 @ 14:24

  • TenderChicken #63 7 months ago

    If you get a kill from 'half way' across the map on BF3, you deserve it. The game takes skill to master.

  • Bassett #64 7 months ago

    Very different games, both have great multiplayer for very different reasons

  • scuffpuppies #65 7 months ago

    I don't actually see 'snipers' as camping. That's part of the design. Although I never use the 'sniper' class, I respect the skill and danger a great 'sniper' can inflict on a match.

    "Camping" to me, is someone who sits on spawn points claiming cheap kills, or hides within a poor design layout taking kills from opposing players who can't avoid such broken areas. That to me is true "camping", and I'm sure those gamers are finding available MW3 camp sites as we speak.

    Perhaps Mr Condrey doesn't play as many games as he'd like people to believe.

  • pbz #66 7 months ago

    ...so it's a dumbed down shooter for the console tard generation?

    Give me BF3 on my beast of a PC anyday of the week!

  • OJSlaughter #67 7 months ago

    Battlefield 3 is an, mostly, objective based team based shooter: if you didn't have the ability to 'camp' it would ruin gameplay. The fact is, Call of Duty is never team based and the objective games always boil down to killing the opposing team. The two would never compare...

  • AnotherIdiot #68 7 months ago

    The problem with narrowing the gameplay options to suit only one customer is that this type of customer will still not be satisfied. I guarantee there will still be moaning about it, but you've made it so that the gameplay can never be widened again without aggravating this even more, and you set the multiplayer on course to be ever more dumbed down.

    This is all opposite to having balanced maps that accommodate different tactics and player types, that are intelligently designed enough so that everyone can have fun most of the time, the other cods were more like that and they sold millions, the course taken by sledgehammer was not necessary, and is not an improvement, and is detrimental to the game and player satisfaction longterm.