Nintendo: Low app prices threaten industry

By Fred Dutton Published 4 February, 2011

Games worth more than $2, says Reggie.

Cheap, disposable smartphone games are one of the biggest problems facing the games industry today, according to Nintendo US chief Reggie Fils-Aime.

When asked by GameTrailers whether 3DS games priced between $35 and $45 present good value compared to $1 or $2 App Store downloads, Fils-Aime seized the opportunity to vent some spleen.

"I actually think that one of the biggest risks today in our industry are these inexpensive games that are candidly disposable from a consumer standpoint," he insisted.

Questioned as to whether he would consider mobile phenomenon Angry Birds "disposable", he replied that it was a rare diamond in the rough, adding that the low price points of mobile games are instilling unrealistic expectations in consumers' minds when it comes to more substantial portable titles.

"Angry Birds is a great piece of experience but that is one compared to thousands of other pieces of content that for one or two dollars I think actually create a mentality for the consumer that a piece of gaming content should only be two dollars.

"I actually thinks some of those games are overpriced at one or two dollars but that's a whole different story," he joked.

The 3DS goes on sale in Europe on 25th March priced at around £220. GAME is currently listing software at £34.99, while Amazon wants £29.91 per title.

Picture of Fred.

About Fred Dutton

Fred Dutton is Eurogamer's US news editor, based in Washington DC.

Read more articles from Fred by visiting the Fred Dutton archive page.

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Comments (134) Latest comment 1 year ago

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  • AliRay #1 1 year ago

    Green is NOT a good colour on you, Reggie!

    Some would argue that companies like Nintendo over-charging for digital downloads is killing the industry much more quickly, esp. as they lose the overheads for packaging/disks/cartridges/retailers too.

  • kongzi #2 1 year ago

    So basically he's admitting that expensive games rarely offer value over cheap app-games? Apparently the price point suits the developers and publishers of those cheaper games just fine... otherwise they'd sell them at higher prices wouldn't they?

  • crimsoneer #3 1 year ago

    All this competition...my heart bleeds.

  • Golgo #4 1 year ago

    while 3ds looked like a day 1 must have when announced, now it looks much less attractive than a smartfone. who is reggie to suggest angry birds is diamond in a sea of shovelware? has he seen wii, wiiware, dsi etc?

  • TheRealBadabing #5 1 year ago

    Sorry Reggie, but games are like any other luxury good and worth whatever people are willing to pay for them, not what you tell them they are worth.

    Fair point that there is a lot of dross on the app store but please don't try to tell us that every game released for Nintendo machines is a stone cold classic and thus deserving a premium price point. Unless you want to introduce some sort of metacritic rating-based pricing structure? Didn't think so.

  • smithdown #6 1 year ago

    " a great piece of experience " - where'd he come up with that prime bit of bollocks-speak?

    Face it Ninty, people are finally waking up to the fact that forking out loadsa money on something they will be playing between bus-stops doesn't provide much value. Give us high-quality, absorbing experiences at a reasonable price (say £19.99 RRP )and you'll find people far more open to trying them out.

  • hygraed #7 1 year ago

    This sounds just like record labels bitching about iTunes or book publishers bitching about the Kindle store. It's high time game publishers came to terms with the fact that the frankly exorbitant price points they've become accustomed to are starting to look less and less attractive to consumers.

  • Machetazo #8 1 year ago

    That's a pathetic comment of someone who knows they're about to start losing tread. Disposable? Yeah right! Some of my favourite games, I bought for pocket change! They're ones that offer the kind of value in content and quality I keep returning to play some more. Games are worth the amount of money an audience is happy to pay.

    ""I actually think that one of the biggest risks today in our industry are these inexpensive games that are candidly disposable from a consumer standpoint," he insisted."
    It's not a risk to the industry, just your business, Dinosaur.

  • Murton #9 1 year ago

    I don't think apps are threatening the industry at all, they're threatening some content creators certainly, but I think most gamers are smart enough to know the different between a small flash based app and a blockbuster console title.

    I can see why Nintendo is feeling a little scared though, the Nintendo DS has been doing a roaring trade on puzzle games the last couple of years, Prof Layton series especially, but these same puzzles are available in app form for less than a tenth of the price of the DS cartridge. Even if the user has to buy a couple of different puzzle game apps to get the same breadth of content, he's still making a massive saving over the DS game price.

    If Nintendo are feeling threatened by apps then they need to get away from them and concentrate on larger, deeper game experiences for which there is no substituting app, like Zelda.

  • Der_tolle_Emil #10 1 year ago

    I don't think they are a threat to the industry at all because it won't take too much time until prices of mobile games will rise quite a bit.

    I guess there is a small chance that developers lose more money than they are making and maybe people will stop buying games if developers raise the price to cover their cost because the potential buyers are already used to low prices and don't want to buy the games at the higher price. But I really don't see that happening.

  • Nithron #11 1 year ago

    His argument would stand up if the games released for nintendo's platforms really were demonstrably more substantial than the incredibly cheap ones on the iOS and and android platforms, which are often developed by one guy.

    The example that immediately springs to mind for me is Isotope on iOS, which I paid 99p for, compared to the £20 charged for Geometry Wars on DS - which was arguably a worse game.

  • Stepharneo #12 1 year ago

    I like this bit;
    "I actually thinks some of those games are overpriced at one or two dollars"

    Pot. Kettle. Black.

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #13 1 year ago

    "Cheap, disposable smartphone games are one of the biggest problems facing Nintendo today"

    Fixed.

  • Lexx87 #14 1 year ago

    Angry Birds being the "diamond in the rough" just shows he has no idea what he's on about, with all the excellent games out there for just 59p.

  • Incarta #15 1 year ago

    Confusing. Surely companies would increase the price of app games if it was "threatening" their survival?

    Perhaps what Reggie meant was "Low app prices are threatening Nintendo" ?

    On the other hand, maybe he has a point? If a developer isn't making enough from their big blockbuster games, they would be forced to create something cheap instead, which, as he rightly points out, 9 out of 10 times, is a pile of shit.

  • FutureDave #16 1 year ago

    I'm happy to pay £2 for a good little mobile game, and I'll happily fork out for a big budget home console experience. But the days of paying up to £40 for shovelware is over Nintendo.

  • Der_tolle_Emil #17 1 year ago

    It's high time game publishers came to terms with the fact that the frankly exorbitant price points they've become accustomed to are starting to look less and less attractive to consumers.

    The problem is though that many of the big budget titles have to come with such a high price tag to cover the costs. Look at some of the recent titles which "failed" commercially. Falling short of a million sales can mean serious trouble for developers and publishers - having high prices is the only thing that makes the risk worthwhile.

    If anything the big budget titles are the real threat. You get one shot (APB, Epic Mickey) and if you fail, you're out.

  • RawNinjaKid #18 1 year ago

    Proper games are meant for proper consoles.
    I rather spend £40 on a proper game with great quality than £2 worth of casual shit on a phone?!! Not that I don't welcome the competition or that Reggie should be complaining about it.

    Just work harder big N!!


  • Aradiel #19 1 year ago

    I paid £2 for Freespace 2 in a bargain bin.

    Best. Purchase. Ever.

  • Golgo #20 1 year ago

    Reading again, there's real arrogance here. Arrogance masking panic, I think. 3DS isn't getting the same unadulterated love as it did back in E3. Now it looks over-priced, lacking in key functions (not least region-free) with a poor and over-expensive launch software line-up. Wii is also nearly dead, let's be fair. Apart from one new game: Zelda.

    The amount of poorly optimized ROMS I've bought via VC because they came via Nintendo is shameful! Few of them were cheaper than £5 of £8 pound for games 20 years old! My own stupid fault. Convenience and that. But I guess the customer can only take so much.

  • spongebob #21 1 year ago

    Ok, so the super cheap approach works great for developers who sell like crazy but what about small teams that put out products that just don't sell that much? When the prices are so ridiculously low it must be really hard out there for many companies. Not everyone can be Rovio.

  • WJF #22 1 year ago

    'I rather spend £40 on a proper game with great quality than £2 worth of casual shit on a phone?!! '

    More like there's a 'shit ton' of good games for under £2 on phones now.
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 17:56

  • rudderless #23 1 year ago

    For all that you could replace 'industry' in the header with '3DS', he's right in that certain companies will get squeezed out. Increasingly, it's going to be big-budget AAA titles on one side, and small downloadable titles on the other, with little in between for the kind of mid-range experimental fare that was so rife in the PS2 era.

    Granted, perhaps that will mean a price shake-up, but I still think a lot of casual gamers' attitudes towards price have irrevocably changed, and when you see titles like Vanquish struggling at retail - even despite early price cuts, then you do fear for innovation outside the mobile space.

    Perhaps XBLA and PSN are going to be the new middle ground. After all, the story about the top XBLA sellers yesterday showed that Limbo sold pretty well, though that did benefit from strong promotion, the kind of which few devs can rely upon.

  • benfresh76 #24 1 year ago

    "Angry Birds is a great piece of experience but that is one compared to thousands of other pieces of content that for one or two dollars I think actually create a mentality for the consumer that a piece of gaming content should only be two dollars"

    By that rationale, couldn't you argue that the almost unique quality and value of titles like Super Mario Galaxy or Spirit Tracks creats the impression that the overwhelming amount of shovelware on the Wii and NDS justifies the £30-£40 RRP price point merely by association?

    Personally, I'm happy to pay for quality, but that doesn't change the fact that even titles of first party Nintendo quality are too expensive, and low cost apps are only going to reinforce that perception, certainly in the eyes of the casual consumer.

  • Armoured_Gideon #25 1 year ago

    I'm too tired on a Friday evening to articulate a cleverly worded rebuttal, so I'll settle for this:

    Piss off, Reggie.

  • miiiguel #26 1 year ago

    I rather spend £40 on a proper game with great quality than £2 worth of casual shit on a phone?!!

    I rather spend £40 on a proper game to play on a home console and £2.79 on a proper mobile game to play on my favourite coffee esplanade. Then again "casual shit" sounds like something Dave would say.

  • rotsujin #27 1 year ago

    Sounds like he's afraid of losing his grip on the unwashed casual masses.
    Just make sure your games are worth 40 bucks, Reggie.

  • des #28 1 year ago

    handheld games should be cheap,sorry
    £40 handheld games=no buy

  • RawNinjaKid #29 1 year ago

    @WJF

    " More like there's a 'shit ton' of good games for under £2 on phones now. "

    But none of the games are like full PSP or DS titles! Maybe I would not spend £40 on any game title now (console or mobile), but £15-25 for a good quality handheld games is viable. I would not expect MGS Peace Walker, Silent Hill Origins/Shattered Memories or New Super Mario Bros for £2.

    BTW: I did buy Angry Birds for the PSP and I regret it!! So that's disposed right away!! Rather play a "full" good quality title that I can spend hours on.
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 18:08

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #30 1 year ago

    "Falling short of a million sales can mean serious trouble for developers and publishers - having high prices is the only thing that makes the risk worthwhile. "

    That assertion assumes that higher prices = higher revenue, a viewpoint which has been pretty comprehensively destroyed by every study into the subject ever conducted.

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #31 1 year ago

    "But none of the games are like full PSP or DS titles! "

    Allow me to translate that for the benefit of other readers:

    "I'm a twat who's seen three iPhone games in his life and doesn't have the first idea what he's talking about. Please ignore me, I'm utterly fucking clueless."

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #32 1 year ago

    "Ok, so the super cheap approach works great for developers who sell like crazy but what about small teams that put out products that just don't sell that much?"

    They should make better games that sell more.

  • Wyrm #33 1 year ago

    Except Reggie, you can get fully fledged games for a few quid on the app store too. It's not all 5-minute-wonders.

  • RawNinjaKid #34 1 year ago

    @"I'm a twat who's seen three iPhone games in his life and doesn't have the first idea what he's talking about. Please ignore me, I'm utterly fucking clueless."

    some of the same people here who want "cheap" Sony NGP games, I assume!? :))

  • spongebob #35 1 year ago

    @Rev. Stuart Campbell

    You sure it is that simple? I am not with Reggie on this one, but I do see that there are probably a lot of developers who are struggling because they have to make at least a semi-hit or otherwise they can't cover the expenses of the development.

  • MistaGav #36 1 year ago

    I would argue that the iphone games are one of the great things for this industry, at least in a creative sense. It gives a great start up for the small indie guy in his basement to work on games and get them to a large market for a cheap price and so more people will be happy to take a punt at a 59p game as oppossed to a £40 game.

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #37 1 year ago

    "You sure it is that simple? I am not with Reggie on this one, but I do see that there are probably a lot of developers who are struggling because they have to make at least a semi-hit or otherwise they can't cover the expenses of the development."

    Well, why should people be making a living if they can't produce even a semi-hit? The App Store is the easiest place in the gaming world for a good game to succeed, precisely because of its ultra-low impulse pricing. And the vast size of the audience means that if you get even a semi-hit, you'll make decent money.

    Obviously some games still slip through the net because of bad marketing or just bad luck, but you've got a much better chance of an innovative and original game being a hit and making you money at 59p than if you're asking £40 for it and competing with Call Of Duty. And if you're trying to compete in the App Store by charging £2.39 or something then you've only got yourself to blame.

  • Vin #38 1 year ago

    Nintendo gets snitchy over game prices! Amaze!

  • NimbusTLD #39 1 year ago

    When did Reggie start looking at Kotick as an example??

  • JetSetWilly #40 1 year ago

    "What this means is that at Nintendo we can no longer get away with charging 25 notes for some maths puzzles and a bit of Sudoku. The proliferation of inexpensive, quality, smartphone games has educated consumers and shown them what poor value our boxed content actually offers most of the time. Rather than trying to understand this change in market conditions and adapt we have decided that if we don't look at the monster it will go away." -- Reggie didn't say earlier.

  • Incarta #41 1 year ago

    Where's all this £40 handheld game shit coming from? I haven't seen them anywhere for more then £35, and a savvy shopper will find them for £29. That's not any higher then DS games were at launch. Only a fool or a casual would buy a DS OR 3DS game for £30+

    PSP games when that first launched, THOSE were £40. It didn't last. Chill out people, 3DS games will come down again after the initial heated rush
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 18:43

  • RawNinjaKid #42 1 year ago

    Point being with the Nintendo 3DS and NGP; there's still room in the market for the more big budget game or the "Higher App prices" that offer more in depth and specialized gaming experiences.

    Reggie is right, but he should not have said these things, it's not as if it's going to change anything. It's better to keep your mouth shut and concentrate on the unique gaming experiences that can only be achieved on its consoles.


  • Rack #43 1 year ago

    While the App store is undoubtedly the most democratic place to sell games I suspect it may be a terrifyingly random place to try and sell a title. There are over a hundred titles released today alone and for someone who can't explain their proposition in an icon a few words and if you're lucky 3 minutes of gameplay is going to be passed up without a second thought. It's not something I'd like to put any significant effort into without a marketing blitz as there's a chance no-one will even see so much as the icon.

  • CaoSlayer #44 1 year ago

    No surprise, they charge 5€ for 26 years old games.

  • man.the.king #45 1 year ago

    Sony's two-pronged battle-plan with the NGP for the hardcore and PS Suite for casual Android-based games seems well thought out now.

    It may be a slight upgrade compared to the DS, but, from my perspective, the 3DS mostly seems to be trying to cash in on the popularity of the DS by adding a (imo mostly redundant for handhelds) gimmick, and the casual audience may not be able to justify spending the high price of entry for their new handheld.

    It seems Nintendo added 3D to the DS while just thinking of the casual-friendly audience as consumer and PSP as a competitor without really observing that the market had changed, and that a LOT of the cheap puzzle-type games offered on the DS could easily be made available on just-as-powerful hardware on iOS or Android phones, thus leaving Nintendo with just their first-party titles as a real, viable option for games.

  • KDR_11k #46 1 year ago

    The prices are not terribly healthy for developers though. There's a lot of games that couldn't exist if 1$ on the App Store was the only way they could sell.

  • joebount #47 1 year ago

    hum, guys, I know that games can be expensive, but THEY are not cheap to make. You pay less money, you will have fewer games (or loads of crappy ones).

  • gjgjg #48 1 year ago

    cheap games sell more and undermine piracy. having said that they give the producer deminished potential to minimise loss if unsucessful, and encourage cheaper quality output overall.

    ...the 3ds is too expensive though

  • SG #49 1 year ago

    Is that another reason for inflating the 3DS price? So that people 'take it seriously'? ;)

    Just look at cross-platform games, with GTA: CW coming in at literally a fraction of the price. Delivering a plastic box, some paper and a piece of plastic to someone isn't THAT expensive mate. Drop the 3DS and its games' prices, or fuck off Reggie.

    How does DSiware compare to I-Phone games?

    Golgo
    04/02/11 @ 17:54

    Reading again, there's real arrogance here. Arrogance masking panic, I think. 3DS isn't getting the same unadulterated love as it did back in E3.

    That's because they hadn't revealed then price - and then came out with it, SAYING that it was that much due to so much interest. Talk about greedy, arrogant cunts! I miss the Nintendo of SNES/early N64 days. :(
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 19:30

  • Peter_LIAR_Molyneux #50 1 year ago

    Is Reggie appealing to app creators to jack up their prices so that Nintendo will feel better about their 30 quid 3DS games? Really?

    Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft are in collusion to keep game prices artificially high so that they make huge amounts of money. Fair enough but to start complaining that developers on other systems who aren't price fixing games are threatening the industry is laughable. Worry about your own business Reggie and let others handle things their own way. Competition is the lifeblood of industry but the bane of businesses.
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 19:24

  • Der_tolle_Emil #51 1 year ago

    That assertion assumes that higher prices = higher revenue, a viewpoint which has been pretty comprehensively destroyed by every study into the subject ever conducted.

    @Rev. Stuart Campbell: That is of course true. I was commenting on the recent (?) trend of making everything bigger and better. It seems like in some cases the only way to improve a game is to throw money at it. That is if you want to compete on the same platform.

    That's the nice thing about mobile games: It's a fresh start for the industry. Games for smartphones are not necessarily competing with big blockbuster titles like Call of Duty. Those games don't need multi-million dollar budgets. It's like the earlier days where creativity is the deciding factor, not graphics. Gaming on phones is relatively new and technical limitations don't play such a big role like on home consoles.

    At the moment I think cheap games are a welcome trend to even everything out a bit. It gives developers an even playing field unlike home consoles where you have to invest tons of money just for licensing fees to even get started. Console development is risky - if you spend millions of dollars on a game you have to make sure it sells. This is why we see sequels since the chances of it selling well are much higher. Of course sequels have to be improved in some ways as well but I really only see bigger budgets to get better production values and presentation, not much more.

    Home consoles are simply too evolved and complex. Gamers are much more willing to open up to new ideas because mobile gaming is quite new and development costs are still low. I'm sure a cheap 360 game will get more people to buy it but in the end the game will get compared to big budget titles and ultimately be probably seen as an inferior game.

    Edit: Sorry for the long post :/
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 19:24

  • makeamazing #52 1 year ago

    The thing is the market has changed, but there is scope for different types of games... BUT...the amount of shovelware on the DS, is at risk of not selling because you can get cheaper alternatives on other platforms. Thats the problem.

    There is some crap on the iphone, but there are also alot of gems. Also from a developers point of view its alot easier to make stuff for iphone than it is for the DS.

  • drhappy #53 1 year ago

    guess nintendo's just gonna have to suck it up and lower their ridiculously expensive game prices! (WOOHOO!)

  • jellyBelly #54 1 year ago

    It could be tough times ahead for Nintendo. Sony once again rased the bar by ny creating a futureproof handheld (although potentially facing the same problems aswith the psp) while casual gaming has dramaticaly dropped in price via phones and tablets. Will.the Nintendo.brand and 3d be sufficent for them? This is going to be the most interesting battle on the mobile space.

  • coolbritannia #55 1 year ago

    Gamer, Nintendo is not your friend.

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #56 1 year ago

    "There are over a hundred titles released today alone and for someone who can't explain their proposition in an icon a few words and if you're lucky 3 minutes of gameplay is going to be passed up without a second thought."

    That's still 3 minutes more than you're going to get if you're a small developer putting out a quirky, original DS or PSP game, though.

  • rudderless #57 1 year ago

    I think it's a bit too easy to say that the AppStore's where the money is as a dev based on a few success stories. I imagine there are a number of app makers struggling just as much as larger devs to make ends meet. Granted, a lot of people are moving over simply because it's lower risk, but then it's arguably as much of a lottery there than elsewhere. You've certainly got more of a chance there than on, say, DSiWare/WiiWare, but that's only part of a more complicated argument here.

    And would that everything was as straightforward as "making better games that sell more". I think Platinum Games made a bloody stonking game in Vanquish, but I found out today it sold less than half the number of units Kane & Lynch 2: Dog Days shifted, which might be the most depressing gaming-related stat I've ever read.

  • RawNinjaKid #58 1 year ago

    Small developers don't make ..... well they don't even make Resident Evil 4 - iPad edition!! Crap version of RE4 that it still is!!

  • Jamiesan #59 1 year ago

    One thing to remember: when you sell a boxed game, you have to pay the devs, publisher, platform holder and retailer. Four companies all want a piece of the pie. A lot of these

  • weebl #60 1 year ago

    Charging me £7 for a game I already own could be construed as bad value for money, not to mention the numerous poor £40 games there are out ther

  • Flojomojo #61 1 year ago

    #49 SG: "How does DSiware compare to I-Phone games?"

    Unfavorably. The DSiWare store is slow, small, and expensive compared to the iOS App Store. Where there are equivalent titles (Dragon's Lair, Castle of Magic, Asphalt 4), the iPhone version is always cheaper and looks better because of the higher resolution on even the older iPhone or iPod Touch screen. Most DSiWare games are $5 or $8. Many iOS games are that price (usually "premium" console clones from Gameloft), but most indie efforts are $1 to $3.

    Sony's Playstation Network is somewhere in the middle. The "mini" lineup is similar to many iOS games, and are priced to match, but they typically don't include screenshots, reviews, or demos. What a strange way to sell something.

  • RawNinjaKid #62 1 year ago

    I would imagine Big N could easily revamp the DsiWare store for the 3DS and start selling Angry Birds! LOL!

    Just don't expect me personally to buy it, okay!

  • madjim #63 1 year ago

    And from when it's wrong for a developer to sell a game with a price they want to? If one wants to sell at 079 Euros, then it's their decision. Games like the excellent Cut The Rope cost that much in AppStore, it's big, it's well programmed and it sells like hell! Imagine how this one should cost if it was a Nintendo online store game? Yes, plenty more.

  • WJF #64 1 year ago

    'Home consoles are simply too evolved and complex'

    Indeed. It kind of reminds me of the late 80s, where the Arcades - where you'd go for the cutting-edge graphical games - were dominated by the few who'd bought/destroyed the competition, while the home computers were worse technically, but packed with small teams making interesting new games (and in some cases, genres).

    Now it feels a little like the home consoles have ironically taken up the Arcade mantle - ruled by a few powerful publishers - whereas the mobile and PC markets are slowly creating the perfect storm of innovation: low barriers to entry, strong competition, and potentially vast riches should your game become a hit.

    As an observer, it's certainly the most exciting time for the industry in the past decade, that's for sure.

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #65 1 year ago

    'And would that everything was as straightforward as "making better games that sell more". I think Platinum Games made a bloody stonking game in Vanquish, but I found out today it sold less than half the number of units Kane & Lynch 2: Dog Days shifted, which might be the most depressing gaming-related stat I've ever read."

    That's in the £40 big-boy console market, though, which is totally different. That's kinda the point.

  • rudderless #66 1 year ago

    It's different, but the point here isn't simply 'developers are making money on iOS'. Sure, Reggie's oversimplified the argument, and it's one that's arguably more pertinent to Nintendo than to any other format holder at present but I think the rise of the AppStore *does* potentially harm sectors of the videogame market. If the exodus to mobile devices continues, there's going to be no £40 big-boy console market outside the sure-fire AAA hits. You're not going to get anything new or risky in that space at all.

    Hence my point earlier about XBLA and PSN hopefully becoming a breeding ground for fuller-fat titles that dare to be a little different.

    The rise of iOS and, to a lesser extent, Android as gaming platforms is almost an echo of what's happened in the Japanese market, but over there the focus has shifted to PSP and DS rather than mobile phones. And yes, you get the occasional hit on Wii or PS3, but again they're all sure things from the moment they're announced. People say the Japanese charts are increasingly safe - it'll soon be the same over here. And that's something that will worry a lot of developers, a lot of publishers and a lot of gamers.

  • Rack #67 1 year ago

    "That's still 3 minutes more than you're going to get if you're a small developer putting out a quirky, original DS or PSP game, though. "

    True enough, but it's not to say the App store is a meritocracy. Without doubt there are talented developers on there producing great games that are simply crushed under the weight of titles released. Saying they should make better titles that sell more is not unlike telling people to just win the lottery if they want money.

  • Geordiemp #68 1 year ago

    The problem for Big N is that there titles lie inbetween the cheap apps and the AAA big titles we get on 360 / PS3, yet they want pricing the same as a COD or a Creed...

    Optimistic maybe..

    The way I see it, good games get insta buy

    360 and PS3 games not AAA but good get the £ 17 shopto bucket after a few months...

    Theres apps for everything else...

    Where does that leave N

  • Apaar #69 1 year ago

    I do agree with Reggie. It is a concern of mine as well.

  • secombe #70 1 year ago

    In my opinion the App store is fantastic for the industry. Small talented teams making unique games that theoretically have just as much chance of selling as an EA title. Sure, the big publishers muscle in, but considering the main complaint with Apple is the closed nature of their platforms it's interesting to note that unlike 'proper' retail games, the good stuff often overthrows the generic rubbish, and pretty much anybody can release a title.

    It's heartening to see the Games Chart on the iPhone/iPad, the highly visible scoring system quickly pushes big name titles down the charts, it's simply not enough for EA to release a shoddy port (as their ever expanding attempts at Sim City prove), a well developed concept from one guy can and does outperform the corporate giants.

    For the first time in many years we have a mainstream gaming platform where a bedroom coder can reasonably easily get content out to the masses, what's not to like?
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 21:28

  • BlinkeredAxis #71 1 year ago

    I play cheap horrible phone games on the train. They make me hunger even more for my proper console and PC. Great fun though Bubble Town is, it will never quite replace Halo:reach or Dead Space.

    Never!

  • BlinkeredAxis #72 1 year ago

    I hope the UK/US market doesn't follow Japan. As all EG fans know, a tiny screen in your lap is no substitute for a fuck-off powerful Console and a 32 inch screen, with real triggers to pull. And digital surround headphones. And beer.

  • RawNinjaKid #73 1 year ago

    I think the threat is more for the Handheld gaming console; rather than the powerful stationary kind!

  • des #74 1 year ago

    "I hope the UK/US market doesn't follow Japan."

    It won't,that's just a pipe dream that some people push for various reasons.Nobody in the West is going to throw away their expensive hdtv,sound system,etc and just play games on some tiny device,phones will dominate in the public as usual.Let's face it, who here will play 3DS,NGP in the public,lol

    Nothing beats beer and big screen,nothing.

  • Yuroko #75 1 year ago

    Repeating what's been said already, it's just a threat to handhelds. From mine and my girlfriends experience we stopped playing our Ds's once we got iPhones. I asked if she wanted a 3DS for her birthday but she said no as she doesn't want to start paying 30-40 quid on games again when she can still have fun on her phone for 60p. I pretty much feel the same way.

    It's costs me enough feeding my xbox and ps3 every month without having to buy handheld games at the same price. My phone keeps me busy in work then I play games on the telly when I get home. Providing the geek in me can stop me from buying them, I'll probably skip the next handheld generation due to my smartphone. The geek in me really does want to play ocarina again though. The geek is also liking the NGP...

  • Katanax #76 1 year ago

    This to me is all about Nintendo not as a Developer, but as a Publisher.

    Distributing a game for a couple of quid and getting 3-4 million sales across both iOS and Android powered devices is fantastic for the industry and developers as a whole. The studios see the vast majority of the revenue and can plug that back into additional content, refinements and developing new IP.

    The big N distribute via hard copy media and digital downloads - charging high fees to developers for the privilege, and maintaining those high prices because of a lack of competition, especially across their online networks. Retail will always have a high price point mainly due to the number of links in the chain (developers, publishers, manufacturers, retailers etc), but for downloads, the big N are being outdone by the Apps marketplace, which will soon be delivering games to consumers on devices much more powerful than the 3DS as the smartphone market continues to evolve and develop.

    *This* is why Sony's move into mobile distribution and partnering with it's developers to release its back catalogue is such a bloody smart idea. No reason why they cant do the same with PS2 and PS3 games when the hardware reaches the required level of processing. Until then, there's the NGP...

    It's all beginning to make sense now...

  • Freelancepolice #77 1 year ago

    You can't use GTA:CW as any sort of example as in this case, the development was essentially complete. All that was needed was a short amount of time to port the psp version across. Same with lego harry potter, they've had the benefit of the sales from the handheld versions, then they port the same game to the iphone and can afford to sell it cheaply. It's a great strategy as they can then rerelease a former handheld release with big production values for a smaller price.

    Any sales are then nearly all profit.

  • menschenfracht #78 1 year ago

    You can't use GTA:CW as any sort of example as in this case, the development was essentially complete. All that was needed was a short amount of time to port the psp version across.
    Yes we can. Because you can't promise that the next Rockstar title for NGP or 3DS won't be ported to iPhone.

  • Acrid #79 1 year ago

    Angry Birds is fucking shit. I'm yet to play a game on iPhone or Android that I would actually pay $2 for.
    However, I am about to try the lite version of Game Dev Story so my mind could be about to change.

  • Acrid #80 1 year ago

    Angry Birds is fucking shit. I'm yet to play a game on iPhone or Android that I would actually pay $2 for.
    However, I am about to try the lite version of Game Dev Story so my mind could be about to change.

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #81 1 year ago

    Sony's Playstation Network is somewhere in the middle. The "mini" lineup is similar to many iOS games, and are priced to match, but they typically don't include screenshots, reviews, or demos. What a strange way to sell something.

    It's not just Minis, to be fair. A staggering number of games on PSN don't have screenshots or videos, let alone demos. And where there are screenshots or vids they're often at laughably poor sub-YouTube resolution. Having been spoiled with XBLA's mandatory playable demos even of Indie games, I was genuinely stunned when I saw how abysmal the PS Store was recently.

  • GreyBeard #82 1 year ago

    99c/59p games are like lottery tickets. A few win every year but everyone else loses.

    Hey, its great for hobbyists, and for people doing it for the love. Don't get me wrong. But for people, companies, trying to make a living from it... not so good.

    Honestly, if you consider the number of man-hours sunk into developing a really good iOS game you'd be surprised how labour intensive it is.

    And here's the thing -and this I'd like to hear your thoughts on this too, Rev. Campbell- What is the work worth? Minimum wage or what? This is not a philosophical question, I'm talking about how 20-25 years ago Mastertronic games at £1.99 were a pretty sweet deal... now on iPhone you need to be pretty fucking AAA to get away with charging more than 59p.

    Some balance. Please.
    Edited by 1 at 04/02/11 @ 23:16

  • dagas #83 1 year ago

    There is still room for expensive games. Mass Effect, Uncharted etc can't be made with a iphone app budget and people realize that and pay the price for a deep and polished game. I think there is room for the super cheap games as well as the traditional AAA-titles (I hate that term, but can't come up with anything better).

  • Freelancepolice #84 1 year ago

    It was a comment aimed at SG really. Criticising the price of GTA:CW when it arrived on DS/PSP isn't comparable because it's ignoring the cost of the carts and the 2 odd years of development. It's not just the "manual and box". The iphone costs are so low because the development was in this case, more or less done. Not trying to back Reggie up here but I don't think that's a fair comparison to make.

    Now if the next GTA portable was to appear on all the platforms but was a fraction of the price, well then it's a pretty difficult sale and you can see why Reggie and Co. are visibly worried about the supposed devaluation of games.

  • SpaceMonkey77 #85 1 year ago

    Typical of Nintendo to act this way, when in truth, its all sour grapes to them, because they know they have mountains to climb against the competition. They also know that they can't match iOS game prices, and thus bitch out. Oh no, the sky is falling.

    This once again proves, that Nintendo might have something that will entice the casuals with 3DS, but games will be the true test. If Nintendo push for other games to include railroaded 3D in them, for the sake of it, they'll have a problem. Game price is their biggest hurdle, and judging by their history, they'll fail miserably, before that light zapper has nailed any ducks.

    Nintendo's online imcompetance, will play nicely into Sony's hands, who have been wise to learn from their mistakes, and MS and Apple. PSP2 has more x factor, to myself, than 3DS does. I just hope that Sony can do it for a 3DS beating price. Until then, I intend to bag an iPhone/touch for my portable game love, especially with Nintendo region locking 3DS, over the summer.

    Serve's you right, Nintendo. You made your bed, stop griping at its bugs.

  • rudderless #86 1 year ago

    While people claim there's still a big market for those games you can only really play on a big HDTV with surround sound and beer and whatnot, crucially, it's not a *growth* market. iOS is appealing because it's relatively low cost and the rewards are potentially great, but your big-budget titles are only going to get more expensive as we move forward into new console generations. Those games are selling to a core audience that will always be there, but most companies, meanwhile, will be chasing the expanded audience. Everyone has a mobile phone, and now most of them are sufficiently advanced to play decent quality games (albeit none of them has an ideal control setup for a huge number of traditional genres), which is why Nintendo is shifting its attentions towards the gadget-lover and the core gamer with 3DS. Iwata's savvy enough to know his company isn't in a position to compete directly with Apple - the worrying thing now for Nintendo is whether it still carries enough weight with the enthusiast crowd for them to pay £30/40 for quality handheld games in 3D.

    This is why I said some time ago that the lack of an eShop on day one is a potentially disastrous mistake, and why I think Sony's tactic to embrace Android while maintaining a strong retail presence with a hugely powerful (and potentially very expensive) bit of kit - a strategy which involves no small amount of bet-hedging - could yet pay off in the long run. Digital distribution is only going to grow more important as the years go by. Retail isn't going anywhere just yet, but it *is* in decline, which is why I think Nintendo has really dropped the ball.

    What is pretty radical for Nintendo is allowing third-parties such a huge slice of the pie at launch by holding back a lot of titles that by several accounts are already finished. But it's not just about building relationships with third-parties (and Nintendo has quite a bit of fence-mending to do there). Iwata is aware that core gamers are greedy and want a regular flow of new quality releases, which is partly why first-party development on Wii has all but dried up - the company needs to focus on 3DS so that it can launch games when schedules are looking quiet enough to force grumbles from forum dwellers.

    3DS needs to be quick out of the gates to encourage more developers and publishers to jump on board, and it needs to win over core gamers so that developing for the format - likely a much more expensive process than for DS - is financially viable. It certainly has a real fight on its hands, even if it will almost certainly get off to a strong start, simply because it's the first genuinely mass-market glasses-free 3D device. It's got that USP which will help it in the short run; the longer term is much harder to call.

    The other reason it needs to get a good start is NGP, and Sony's stronger relationships with third-parties - as well as the console's technical superiority (let's face it, if you're a developer, you ideally want to be working on cutting-edge tech) - is going to be an important factor in the handheld war. The other bonus for NGP developers is that early rumblings suggest cross-platform development is going to be simple - so making an NGP version of a game originally destined for just Xbox 360, PS3 and PC won't cost much more. Those making 3DS SKUs won't have that luxury, which is another potential problem for Nintendo.

    Sony seems to be playing the longer game here: the console will likely be expensive to start with, winning over a small number of early adopters, before the hardware gets cheaper over time. The thing is, will the early sales put off developers from working on the console, particularly on format exclusives? If that is the case, Sony still has the app card to play, and the Android support could sustain it for a while until sales pick up - if indeed they do so.

    Meanwhile, iOS is accessible and cheap with a huge ready-made userbase, but the AppStore is so crammed that it's difficult for a lot of games to get noticed. As far as the complaints about deeper experiences go, I genuinely don't think enough people see that as an issue. There is undoubtedly a section of enthusiast gamers who like playing the kind of lengthy RPGs, story-led adventures and such like that are currently more prevalent on DS and PSP, but that's a small slice of the pie; most people want fairly disposable, pick-up-and-play experiences for their portable gaming.

    The wisest thing for Nintendo to do would be to price its software aggressively, at around £25 RRP, with most places selling titles for £20, or less for older titles. It won't happen, but it probably needs to, otherwise you're going to be left with a situation where Apple's slice of the pie grows larger, and longer, deeper, more traditional gaming experiences - certainly outside the most popular franchises which are guaranteed sellers whatever the price - are fewer and further between. I think that's an understandable worry for some people, and while saying it's "threatening the industry" is too simplistic (as most will move in one of the two very different directions that gaming is seemingly pulling in) I do believe certain games, certain developers, and certain publishers are going to get squeezed out.

    My hope is that XBLA and PSN can continue to thrive, and that games like Limbo, Costume Quest, ilomilo, Stacking and so on find a big enough market so that these inventive concepts with mid-range budgets keep on coming.

  • stuarty_2003 #87 1 year ago

    Does he not mean "threats" to our industry? And when he says "our", does he mean Ninty, MS, and Sony?

    Apple have, intentionally or otherwise, introduced a firework to the arseholes of the big 3: it's called Indie.

    Ninty: it's not a risk or a threat....it's an opportunity. You know what to do. Fight fire with fire. It's time for cheap dev kits and your 30% cut.





  • Geowolf #88 1 year ago

    Speaking of the 3DS. Is there actually any word from Nintendo of the UK launch day titles yet?

  • Bartacus #89 1 year ago

    Reggie is a money grabbing twat, DS Games are a rip off.

  • vizzini #90 1 year ago

    In some ways I'd prefer if Reggie's comment was coming from Sega, who have seen both sides of the pricing model and are now just a publisher/developer that have been in difficulty.

    With Sega recently doing a port of VF2 for iPhone; no not the real 3D arcade/Saturn version (all of Virtuafighter.com would want) for a phone or PSP; but the sloppy 2D Megadrive shocker for iPhone that no-one likes and is already in the PSP/PS2 Megadrive collection.

    Why did Sega not do a proper version? I wouldn't be surprised if the decision was made because of the $1.99 price tag on Apple's store.

    In fairness, a while back Sega did get a Swedish company(Southend games) to do a great port of the original Virtua Fighter to smartphones(using Java ME on Symbian) selling at £5; but seemingly forgot to advertise it, probably because at £5 you can't afford to spend money on adverts.

    I equally dislike when Nintendo/publishers charge high prices for portable games, but given the choice between the likes of Sega releasing a quality (3D)Virtua Fighter on PSP/smartphone at a heft price, or them continuing to re-release crap at £1; as a gamer, I'm always going to want quality gaming regardless of price and Apple are potentially damaging that imo.

  • Lusterpurge #91 1 year ago

    The message that this comments section broadcasts is "I'd rather pay less for a quick, smaller game than full price for more immersive and in-depth experience". Just don't cry when your favorite developers stop making games for consoles or the PC.

  • JamesBrophy #92 1 year ago

    This from a company that sold 307,775 copies of a 1993 super Nintendo cart for the wii in the first week of it's release alone.

    Starting to wonder if they are getting scared of the wii detach rate finally.

  • Les #93 1 year ago

    ""I actually think that one of the biggest risks today in our industry are these inexpensive games that are candidly disposable from a consumer standpoint," he insisted."

    It's the biggest hope for the gaming industry as a whole. For the current platform holders that haven't adjusted to the new reality though, it's definitely the biggest risk.

  • Caimbeul #94 1 year ago

    90% of DS games are really bad value for money. Period Reggie.

  • DrStrangelove #95 1 year ago

    instilling unrealistic expectations in consumers' minds when it comes to more substantial portable titles.

    Like being any good, in most cases.

    Also, I think it's fair that you actually pay a waste price for a waste app. If you buy the same garbage for the DS, it costs 10-20 times as much. And if you can buy an app for less than one quid which is much better than the 10-quid DS junk from the media stores' rummage tables, then Apple's system is just a lot more consumer-friendly, and others will have to think of ways how to counter that instead of complaining.
    Edited by 1 at 05/02/11 @ 09:00

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #96 1 year ago

    "the sloppy 2D Megadrive shocker for iPhone that no-one likes and is already in the PSP/PS2 Megadrive collection"

    Er, what does that have to do with porting it to the iPhone?

  • Windypops #97 1 year ago

    What everybody else said plus one.

    Eat poverty Nintendo twat!

  • makeamazing #98 1 year ago

    I think the iphone is great, and you know what it harks back to the days of the Spectrum when true bedroom programmers were able to make and sell games. I remember those days as a kid and they were great, the only downside was distribution (good old tape :).

    I've done a bit of dev on the iPhone (more games coming soon), and you know what, its great that i have the chance of making games and seeing them on the platform. My games are not DS level, they are fun short stint based games, but if you think about the cost and skills required to get stuff on the DS, thats part of the problem for indi devs like myself.

    So yes its difficult to sell alot on the iphone with all the competition, but by ensuring the dev costs are low, I can continue to make games (albeit maybe at a small loss for the time being)...and at one point hopefully make it a success. Making a game for a DS would cost me tens or hundreds of thousands of pounds, and has just as much chance of failing... so no thanks!

    But overall i think reggie isnt worried about people like me (which is another problem), he is more worried that the big games companies will release games that are just as good as the DS games for a fraction of the price.

  • alcides #99 1 year ago

    There is not one single game I'm interested in that's been announced for 3DS. More of the same is what you will get - in 3D. I don't believe that it is really headache inducing, but should that be the case, I'd be more than happy to merge phone, mp3 and shitty gaming machine with no games and a whole lot of shovelware. Not mentionning the fact that the iPhone will probably be more powerful by the time I have to change my phone, and about cheaper in every respect.

    Show us value, tendo! Nintendogs 2 and Wii Sports and yet another Zelda Ocarina remake or anything that looks déjà vu (or crap) simply won't do.

  • redcrayon #100 1 year ago

    @Des
    Nobody in the West is going to throw away their expensive hdtv,sound system,etc and just play games on some tiny device,phones will dominate in the public as usual.Let's face it, who here will play 3DS,NGP in the public,lol

    Nothing beats beer and big screen,nothing.

    For you, maybe.

    I spend 90% of my gaming time on handhelds, as the commute is the main time I get to play. On the train, I regularly see people playing games on iPads, smartphones, PSPs, DS. To people who aren't interested in gaming, they all just look like generic gadgets. If you're a teenager, then yeah, you probably don't want to sit down in the town centre for a game. When you're an adult, the need to give a shit what other people think or bother them about what they are doing disappears, as well as the fact that everyone else has their nose in a book or a paper and just want to get home/to work.

    It's hard to go wrong in gaming by making something that anyone can continue to play anywhere, as opposed to requiring a big HD telly etc. That's why Sony is pushing it's 'cloud' game save idea so hard.

  • redcrayon #101 1 year ago

    Also, online competition between retailers is much fiercer than when the DS was launched- much like the home console games now, I can see 3DS games getting discounted very quickly as there is obviously room to make cuts and still profit.

    Someone said that DS games are a rip-off. I think that's true, the majority are overpriced and don't have the same level of polish as the first party stuff. At least Ninty have gone out of their way to get Capcom and co. on board from the start this time around.

    What I'm worried about is that after the launch period, and the main Nintendo franchises start to come out, that it will have the same problem again of third parties struggling to compete with Nintendo's own stuff.

  • Grayvern #102 1 year ago

    In perspective; as long as there are enough people to buy and sustain bigger budget games and developers who want to make them they will continue to exist, being a dominant market force isn't what matters. That's how EVE works in the face of WOW.

    Or to put it another way less than 5% of the developed world has to buy only a few games a year to create a market for big budget games.
    Edited by 1 at 05/02/11 @ 11:56

  • redcrayon #103 1 year ago

    Exactly. Fortunately real world economics don't work on a gaming forum's scale of 'it's not the best, don't even bother.'

    If you're massively profitable but sitting in second (or third, or fifth or twentieth) place, then it's still worth being in business.
    Edited by 1 at 05/02/11 @ 12:03

  • vizzini #104 1 year ago

    Rev.Stuart: "Me: the sloppy 2D Megadrive shocker for iPhone that no-one likes and is already in the PSP/PS2 Megadrive collection"

    Er, what does that have to do with porting it to the iPhone?

    My point was, that Sega re-released a poor 2D version of the game on iPhone (like a piece of shovelware) because of devalued market price of games and because it required little work/expense; as they already have a mega drive emulator.

    If Sega could command £15-£25 for games(like 3D Virtua Fighter 2) on iPhone then they could have built a Saturn/Dreamcast emulator like Sony's PSOne or the Neo Geo emulator and ultimately been able to sell game versions consumers really want to play and value.

    Or has it now became acceptable to publish anything on iPhone at $2 for little expense, and not expect any gamer at all to want to play, or enjoy it? Is that really the future game development model we want?

  • redcrayon #105 1 year ago

    @Vizzini

    But surely if no-one wants that $2 game, they won't buy it? If you're worried that lots of people will buy it, thus taking money away from the development of HD versions of similar stuff, then that's obviously what the majority of consumers want, cheap, bite-size shoot- 'em ups.

    I'm not sure I can argue with that- I paid £40 for UN Squadron in the early nineties, but wouldn't pay that for it or anything similar now.

  • RawNinjaKid #106 1 year ago

    I actually think that the 3DS is not a gimmick, and if is is one, it's a very good one!

    A gimmick is not when other companies start emulating it, which I can see a lot of handheld 3D devices in the future.

    And no, handheld consoles will not replace stationary consoles in the short term, but they are bound to peak in system performance sometime and there's cloud-gaming in the very distant future to level up the playing completely. So interesting times ahead.

    But I see a lot of remastered gamecube/N64 games on the 3ds and lots of ps2 emulated games on the NGP, I am afraid.
    Edited by 2 at 05/02/11 @ 12:36

  • Geordiemp #107 1 year ago

    Which way will the market go is the question...

    The big $$ sales seem to be at the high triple AAA end (like COD) or the low cheap fun end like angry birds.....

    The people who struggle are the ones in between, not AAA big budget but have a AAA price tag...

    Thats what Reggy is worried about, charging high price for middle of road 'older' games that most of us have already paid.

    Guess what Reggy, you should be...

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #108 1 year ago

    "My point was, that Sega re-released a poor 2D version of the game on iPhone (like a piece of shovelware) because of devalued market price of games and because it required little work/expense"

    The second of those is unquestionably true. There is no evidence whatsoever for the former. It hasn't stopped them, for example, making Monkey Ball games, or porting Chu Chu Rocket, or developing a premium-priced (£6.99) version of Football Manager.

    Sega put out cheap, lazy retro releases because they know nostalgia chumps will buy them and it's easy free money, simple as that.

  • Gastrian #109 1 year ago

    I think Reggie has a point, a very very small point but a point none the less. The price point for a lot of downloadable games has caused some games to be 'undervalued'. I'm not defending the 3DS software pricepoint but it has affected a lot of other downloadable market. Its only on the latest mobile roundup that Eurogamer conceded that while WP7 games are more expensive than the same game on the iPhone but at their price they are still very good games and more than worth their price point. Imilio for example seems a rip-off for £3 compared to Android and iPhone titles but anyone who's played it would agree £5 for a game of that quality is an absolute bargain.

    The price for the 3DS games are far too expensive, they cost more than average RRP for a new PC game and some of the lineup are just 3D versions of old games. Compare that to Kilzone 3, a brand new game that includes 3D at no extra cost over non 3D games.

  • redcrayon #110 1 year ago

    @Geordiemp

    That's not strictly true- no matter what your opinion on their quality or originality, Ninty's modern full-price releases hang around in the charts for years.

    I think Reggie is worried that cheap smartphone games are devalueing the back catalogue that they rely on through the VC, repackaging All-stars etc, and it's effect on their plans for the 3DS VC.

    They are probably looking at what they plan to charge for Super Mario Land and thinking.... 'this just isn't going to fly, is it?' :-)
    Edited by 1 at 05/02/11 @ 13:05

  • vizzini #111 1 year ago

    @Rev. Stuart Campbell

    I pretty sure all the games you listed have all freeload from development work done elsewhere (at full price) on PSP or ARM processors like the GBA/DS.

    Without PSP/GBA/DS ports previously existing, I doubt Sega would have been able to afford to make the iOS versions even at the premium price(when you factor in heavy piracy on iPhone/smartphones aswell).

  • superbeast2010 #112 1 year ago

    Post deleted at 10:57:39 01-02-2012

  • waynenot #113 1 year ago

    basically, Nintendo is having to share what has traditionally been its lunch and it's having a little tantrum - ahhh!

    What he's saying is that this section of the market is probably pissing on their plans to charge you ten quid for original GameBoy games. Good. Get with the fucking times you money-grubbing shitehawks.

  • Kerome #114 1 year ago

    That might even be the first official acknowledgement from ninty that their business is hurting from phones and tablets eating market share. Go Reggie. I suggest he go find a solution, rather than yammering about the "threat".

    Eventually the market will sort it out. Either quality titles can or cannot compete, to the extent that they're economical to make. If they can't, it means the publishers have enforced a pricing cartel for way too long a time. But, marketplaces do desperately need a better discovery mechanism, finding quality titles is hard, and bad titles clutter the landscape for too long.

  • TheNinkyNonk #115 1 year ago

    The only part of the industry that they're threatening is that which charges the price of a AAA HD blockbuster for a low res handheld rehash of a tired old franchise.

    We've woken up and smelt the coffe, Reg, why don't you?

  • Ryze #116 1 year ago

    Those game prices will become reasonable within a year or so.

    The PREOWNED market will take care of that.

  • Rev.StuartCampbell #117 1 year ago

    "(when you factor in heavy piracy on iPhone/smartphones aswell)"

    Sigh.

  • spammage #118 1 year ago

    Basic market economics suggests that products are only worth as much as people are prepared to pay for them. Cry more Reggie because your casual gamer gravy train is moving on. It's time for a reality check.

  • FenderMaster #119 1 year ago

    £2 for Angry Birds is a damn sight better value for money than a Super Mario All Stars rom on a disc that doesn't even include Super Mario World.

    As for paying £35 high street prices for N64 ports, he can go suck a fuck.

    The 3DS is a desirable, if gimmicky looking piece of kit, but Nintendo are greedy and complacent, good new IP's please Reggie...

  • Subquest #120 1 year ago

    Nintendo need to come to their senses and realise that app store has rewritten the rules - they need to at least compromise with the consumer and reduce prices to the £20 region. I just don't see a large scale audience for £35 and up mobile games any more. Sure they will sell to their loyal long term customers, but Nintendo have succeeded by appealing to the masses. 3D and the Nintendo name are not enough when people can get decent enough gaming experiences on their phones for less that a 10th of the price.

  • RawNinjaKid #121 1 year ago

    @FenderMaster: "£2 for Angry Birds is a damn sight better value for money than a Super Mario All Stars rom on a disc that doesn't even include Super Mario World."

    LOL! Even though Super Mario All Stars on Wii is just a overpriced ROM , no doubt about it; what you said above is like saying the Blair Witch Project is worth more than Star Wars!

    I would say that there's difference between emulation and remastering. I would pay a reasonable price for remastered classics, whether on handheld 3D or 3D/HDTV. Sony are remastering their PS2 classics in HD/3D for the PS3, the big N will just put theirs on the 3DS.

    As powerful as the NGPs (3DS and Sony's one!) might be, if people aren't willing to pay for whatever a full price NGP game may be, it will just be wasted specs, kinda like the PS one classics and Minis that dominate the PSP online store right now!





    Edited by 4 at 05/02/11 @ 17:10

  • TheNinkyNonk #122 1 year ago

    I guess the real shit kicker for Nintendo will be when Apple release an iDevice with a 3D screen AND the apps for it are 59p!

  • layleeloo #123 1 year ago

    I agree I'm afraid. I had all iphones from the start, and recently I read in various professions tech blogs that 26% of all apps are only opened once! Therefore the statistic of how many times an app is downloaded is not a benchmark of how good it is, if it is only opened once.

    Of that statistic, personally it wouldn't surprise me if 25% of those were games. I subscribe to various youtube channels like app spy, app vee etc to get to see all the games which you would no way find otherwise, and to be honest I wouldn't waste my money on them anymore. Bar the odd title, phone gaming isnt all its cracked up to be. It is TOO casual, and for the hardcore games on it which are ports from consoles simply dont work well without the relevant control methods. There have been some decent attempts like mirrors edge etc, but the price of the majority of apps now is entirely relevant to it decency. The percentage of decent free games that you play more than once is so minuscule its laughable, and the 59p and 1.19 games are pretty similar too bar the odd ones like AB. Then you move up into the £3 category which is where you console ports start, so they arnt worth bothering with most of the time either.

    Personally I have thought that the iphone and the likes destroyed the mobile gaming industry a long time with is casual nonsense and console ported pap.

    It is a shame that the DS' and PSP's have to have this battle with platforms which bar the rare exception, are far inferior to dedicated mobile gaming platforms.

  • dunbain #124 1 year ago

    The majority of commenters seem to be reacting to this as Nintendo's cluelessness/arrogance, etc.

    I think it's important to remember that Nintendo is the one that pulled the industry out of the Atari crash; and I think they're seeing the signs of history repeating itself, in that the standards of what a game is are lowering so drastically and quickly, that the "casual crowd" is solidifying their concept gaming. As in, "it's only this good, for this price, this is all I expect".

    Of course Nintendo is concerned over profits, an understandable business need. But what if Nintendo's innovation can't survive in a climate -- because of a standardized concept of insanely low prices, and the potentially devaluation of games as a medium. Basically, while Nintendo would like to 'nurture' the casual gaming business (while raking in significant profits) other companies that are capitalizing on it without standards are stripping away much the value in innovation and creativity.

    At least, that's how I think this argument, or divide can be summarized. This is not to say that casual gaming isn't creative -- the titles which succeed are exceedingly creative. It's just that the ratio of profits to creativity to number of titles totals a very derivative market. Meaning, if another crash were to come, it would be because people generally don't give a shit about gaming as a whole, because they've done it all.

    Hopefully Zynga and all those companies can keep the public engaged WOW-style. But I think a drop-off point in public interest is going to render many of these companies and game formats defunct. Casual gamers don't have bad taste in games, so much as having 10,000 other things that better spend their time. The wave of success is that this market is a novelty still, with its most profitable model based on in-app purchases, milking a gamer as long they'll put up with it.

    If the app-gaming market peaks in several years, the damage done to the industry-model could be significant. Just sayin', I don't think a sound-byte from an interview constitutes as much arrogance and lack of insight as commenters appear to project.

  • TonyHarrison #125 1 year ago

    A lot of hate for Reggie here, but he's got a point. Gamers like to give Nintendo stick for the shovelware ratio on the Wii and DS, but the iOS devices and the app store beat that shovelware ratio into a bloody pulp. There's masses and masses of crap on the app store.

    And you know why that is? It's because people will buy any old crap if it's only 59p or whatever. In that sense, it is a threat. Why make a big budget game when you can make an app that does something basic that can sell millions...

    Yes, I know that there are plenty of good things available on the app store, but I'm spot on about the ocean of shovelware that's there as well.

  • Collymilad #126 1 year ago

    I don't know if he's right but the App store is a pile of shit.

    It has a few good games but the rest are cheap crap that only someone who doesn't actually like games would bother with. Most games on the App store are the X-factor contestants of the game world. And they sell to the same people who like the X-factor. That should tell you enough :p

  • Butr0sButr0s #127 1 year ago

    The argument he made isn't about the amount of shovelware on either system, it's about what the pricing should be. "Crapware" is on all systems, you need to sort through it whether its $2 or $50, and regardless about 80-90% of it simply not good.

    The problem is when Reggie tries to put blame on cheap games for his own companies failures and pricing structure. It may be a small part of it but honestly, even Nintendo has been failing to innovate lately. The game industry is following the same trend as the film industry - play it safe and cash in on sequels/nostalgia. It hasn't worked too well for the film industry lately either...

    Why is it that I can download super mario X for free on PC and find more fun or innovation there than any game nintendo has put out in the past 4-5 years? They need to get aggressive - make fun games, take a few risks, and make your prices lower to hurt your competition. Stop making comments about how the gaming industry is hurt, make good games, and let your products speak for themselves.

  • barnard666 #128 1 year ago

    they are risky in the fact that there is so much out there, for every one success there are many more financial failures than in other more expensive formats. Its hard to be heard above the chatter...at which point marketing comes in again and we begin to lose the originality that makes the format cool. Small start ups / young kids with nothing to lose can afford to take the risk, or rather you never hear of the failings...while the bigger companies are clearly taking more risk.

    All that aside, yes the 3DS / NGP are for dinosaurs.

  • SikoSoft #129 1 year ago

    Cheap games aren't threatening the industry - they are threatening those in the industry who have taken the industry for granted.

    One of the primary principles of an open-market system is the concept of competition. If you're competitor is finding ways to produce similar content at fractions of your cost, then you need to re-evaluate your strategy.

    As some of you who said - you find rubbish games at $1, $2, $10, $50 and ... well whatever they are going to try and get away with charging us on the next generation of platforms.

    If the price some other small development studios are charging is scaring them: GOOD! Maybe the industry won't be about the people controlling it anymore, and more about the people it was once about (gamers who like to game).

  • barnard666 #130 1 year ago

    it just becomes harder to take risks, if you want to make a cool game with some polish and sell it at 99 cents, then you need to sell a crazy amount of copies to make back that money...and let's face it most iPhone games are niche, it's just some take off, when the competition get's tougher and the dev-costs become higher we will see a shift in people not buying cheap software I guess, so it will balance out...right now it's in a weird place, I can go home and have a good go at making a game that is competitive on iPhone, and if it fails, it doesn't matter as I still have a job...I obviously can't compete with Gears of War or Mario on my own, and before too long we will be seeing more and more games of that level coming out on the iOS devices...so it isn't such a big deal.

  • geox30 #131 1 year ago

    No portable game is worth 50€,even if it's called Zelda.We should pass them this message with our wallets..

  • drumbaby #132 1 year ago

    The Wii and DS offer over-priced often shallow casual games. The odd game is good. So, what's different other than the over-priced bit?

  • eviroboy #133 1 year ago

    Unsurprisingly, hardly anyone has anything constructive to say, just yet more baiting and fanboy bashing.

    At the end of the day pretty much all the games I've purchased on my iPhone are just gathering virtual dust on one of the screens somewhere after a few plays. Put simply they ARE just cheap 'throwaway' games that last about as long as a bar of chocolate in front of a fire.

  • drumbaby #134 1 year ago

    I don't think the negative comments are a mere knee-jerk, based on any irrational Nintendo hatred. I think it is only natural that Nintendo's decision to go primarily casual inspire severe back-lash as soon as they start moaning about their competition.

    Perhaps they should now try competing on the playing field that they pioneered, dropping the price of some of their lighter offerings, while extolling the virtues of their deeper games...perhaps even differentiating the two styles of gaming to make it easier to justify charging higher prices? Sony do this with Minis and bigger PSN/ disc based games. Nintendo could try this with some of their Wii and DS titles.