NAS Drives - Help me EG you're my only hope!

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  • stephenb 13 Dec 2012 13:19:19 2,677 posts
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    I'm in a right pickle here. I'd like to buy a NAS drive to hook up to my router. However I don't have enough knowledge about such things and customer reviews seem to be polar opposites for the same product.

    It's primary function will be streaming movies to a couple of PS3's and a desktop PC.
    I'd like it to come with some storage capacity, 1tb or more, rather than just an empty caddy and my budget is 200 to 250 quid. Any help would be much appreciated. :)

    PSN : v--WEDGE--v

  • Deleted user 13 December 2012 13:22:16
    I can't tell you what to buy, but I can tell you what not to buy.

    Don't buy a NetGear Stora. Mine's the most unreliable piece of shit I've ever had the misfortune to use.
  • stephenb 13 Dec 2012 13:26:27 2,677 posts
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    This is exactly the scenario I would like to avoid! If I'm buying one I'd like to think it's the right one.

    PSN : v--WEDGE--v

  • nickthegun 13 Dec 2012 13:26:38 55,848 posts
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    Get a synology. They rock the shit and the OS on them can do an absolutely insane amount of things.

    ---------------------------------------------------------
    He totally called it

  • Deleted user 13 December 2012 13:40:17
    @stephenb

    NAS isn't all it cracked up to be. If you want a fast solution, connecting a dedicated HDD to your computer or laptop via usb3/SATA will likely yield superior results when trying to transfer films onto the storage for streaming.

    NAS systems typically use software raid with a RaspberryPI type pcb running a small version of linux, and tend to massively inadequate for large file network transfers even when they are gigabit ethernet equipped.

    Pound for pound, a DF specification PC with two extra HDDs setup with RAID (0 or RAID1 using the motherboard hardware RAID controller) will be better than any £400 2 drive NAS.
  • IJ 13 Dec 2012 13:42:37 741 posts
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    HairyArse wrote:
    I can't tell you what to buy, but I can tell you what not to buy.

    Don't buy a NetGear Stora. Mine's the most unreliable piece of shit I've ever had the misfortune to use.
    I have a Stora, it's complete sh.t. It does work as a TimeMachine....after days of searching the internet and hours of work setting it up. Spend a bit more and get something better.
  • elstoof 13 Dec 2012 13:43:07 6,138 posts
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    Get 2 and RAID5 them, it's how the pro's do it.
  • mikew1985 13 Dec 2012 13:45:36 12,043 posts
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    HairyArse wrote:
    I can't tell you what to buy, but I can tell you what not to buy.

    Don't buy a NetGear Stora. Mine's the most unreliable piece of shit I've ever had the misfortune to use.
    Just to add the usual polar opposite opinion, I've had one for over a year and it works flawlessly for me for everything I wanted.

    Helps that I got a 1TB one for a cut price. The HDD was worth more than I paid.

    Edited by mikew1985 at 13:49:09 13-12-2012
  • elstoof 13 Dec 2012 13:50:02 6,138 posts
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    mikew1985 wrote:
    I've had one for over a ear and it works flawlessly
    That is quite an impressive range.
  • nickthegun 13 Dec 2012 13:50:19 55,848 posts
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    "I am not a technical person. I want to stream things across my network. My budget is £250"

    vizzini says:

    Plug in a USB disk

    Spend £400 on an entirely new PC and RAID the disks yourself

    ---------------------------------------------------------
    He totally called it

  • elstoof 13 Dec 2012 13:56:30 6,138 posts
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    We don't know if the 2 PS3's and the PC are all on the same desk though.
  • stephenb 13 Dec 2012 14:01:12 2,677 posts
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    Lol new this would be a minefield! The two PlayStations and pc are in three rooms and if joined via straight lines in a plan view would create an isoceles triangle.

    PSN : v--WEDGE--v

  • wobbler147 13 Dec 2012 14:02:37 5,123 posts
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    http://www.ebuyer.com/290545-netgear-v2-readynas-duo-2-bay-no-disks-nas-enclosure-rnd2000-200eus

    Used one of these for a while now, easy to set up just add a drive or 2 and away you go.
  • TheSaint 13 Dec 2012 14:03:34 13,629 posts
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    Synology all the way. DS212J is the current model I think.
  • Deleted user 13 December 2012 14:04:10
    @nickthegun

    You advised him on a £400 2 disk NAS that will take ages to copy files onto it. I was just telling him how that wasn't a good way to spend £400.

    If he has a PC/laptop with fast Ethernet already, for £60 he could be better sorted, with quick PC ~20-30Mbytes/sec disk to disk writes, full network speed reads. A NAS is lucky if it will write consistently at 10Mbytes.
  • stephenb 13 Dec 2012 14:11:14 2,677 posts
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    @vizzini

    The desktop pc isn't up to much in all honesty. It's more for the PlayStations to have access to our movie library.

    PSN : v--WEDGE--v

  • Fake_Blood 13 Dec 2012 14:16:18 3,821 posts
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    Get a Synology, I've got one.
    Don't listen to vizzini, his solution to everything is get a server.

    I want to play games - Get a server with a quadro gpu
    I want to stream some video - Get a server
  • Deleted user 13 December 2012 14:17:37
    mikew1985 wrote:
    HairyArse wrote:
    I can't tell you what to buy, but I can tell you what not to buy.

    Don't buy a NetGear Stora. Mine's the most unreliable piece of shit I've ever had the misfortune to use.
    Just to add the usual polar opposite opinion, I've had one for over a year and it works flawlessly for me for everything I wanted.

    Helps that I got a 1TB one for a cut price. The HDD was worth more than I paid.
    Interesting. Mine is slow as shit, very often crashes and needs rebooting, and when it does have to be rebooted, seems to take an age to re-index all of its files and isn't accessible by my 360 for hours.
  • Mr_Sleep 13 Dec 2012 14:20:06 16,236 posts
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    I have a WD Live Hub, it's a media streamer, not a nas but it can fulfill your needs. Pretty reasonable in price. It does have some issues, the GUI interface is a bit pants, you can't switch tracks without putting on the telly but for your purposes it'd be reasonably useful.

    I haven't actually streamed very much but music from it but it's pretty flawless with that. I may try some video later to see how it goes.

    You are a factory of sadness.

  • Deleted user 13 December 2012 14:56:10
    @stephenb

    Well you'll know best on that front.

    It is just a suggestion, as almost any modern PC configured correctly will have 10 times the spare idle computing power than these domestic NAS solutions, with faster network throughput and disk throughput.

    The deal breaker for me with NAS was the inability to efficiently copy from the NAS to backup stuff to optical media. In the end I had to remove one of the 1TB drives, install it in my system and get linux to read it using the software RAID driver, then backup. At that point I gave away my NAS unit, and just reused the 1TB drives in RAID1 as drive D: on the PC.
  • Fake_Blood 13 Dec 2012 15:00:56 3,821 posts
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    Uhu, and what about power consumption?
    You're going to want to keep this thing on 24/7.
    A nas consumes <50 watt, how much does a nas pc consume?
    300-400 maybe even 500 watts?
    And then we're not even talking about the fan noise.
  • nickthegun 13 Dec 2012 15:02:35 55,848 posts
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    Surely a technologist such as yourself knows the dangers of DISK ROT, rendering backing up to optical media (such as CDs, DVDs) a waste of time?

    In CDs, the reflective layer is immediately beneath a thin protective layer of lacquer, and is also exposed at the edge of the disc. The lacquer protecting the edge of an optical disc can usually be seen without magnification. It is rarely uniformly thick; thickness variations are usually visible. The reflective layer is typically aluminum, which reacts easily with several commonly encountered chemicals such as oxygen, sulphur, and certain ions carried by condensed water. In ordinary use a surface layer of aluminum oxide is formed very quickly when an aluminum surface is exposed to the atmosphere; it serves as passivation for the bulk aluminum with regard to many but not all contaminants. CD reflective layers are so thin that this passivation is less effective. In the case of CD-R and CD-RW media, the materials used in the reflecting layer are more complex than a simple aluminum layer, but also can present problems if contaminated. The thin 10-20 thousandths of an inch layer of protective lacquer is equivalent.

    DVDs have a different structure from CDs, using a plastic disc over the reflecting layer. This means that a scratch on either surface of a DVD is not as likely to reach the reflective layer and expose it to environmental contamination and perhaps to cause corrosion, perhaps progressive corrosion. Each type of optical disc thus has different susceptibility to contamination and corrosion of its reflecting layer; furthermore, the writeable and re-writable versions of each optical disc type are somewhat different as well. Finally, discs made with gold as the reflecting layer are considerably less vulnerable to corrosion problems, though no less susceptible to physical damage to that layer. Because they are less expensive, the industry has adopted aluminum reflecting layers as the standard for factory pressed optical discs.

    ---------------------------------------------------------
    He totally called it

  • stephenb 13 Dec 2012 15:22:10 2,677 posts
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    Thanks everybody as expected lot's of different views on what would be my best option. As it's low level use and just streaming original MPEG2 rips I think I'm going to give the Synology a try.
    I'll let you know how I get on.

    PSN : v--WEDGE--v

  • Deleted user 13 December 2012 15:32:57
    @nickthegun

    They are consider good enough for 3-5years, and as I will have done more full backups since then, and keep them store in opaque cases and have the files mirrored anyway, they are perfectly good for my needs.

    @Fake_Blood

    Power consumption is one NAS advantage compared to a desktop, not so much a laptop But they are rarely silent in RAID1, and certainly not quiet enough to be left on 24/7. They can be silent when power saving is used, but then they are even more unreliable and slow.
  • MMMarmite 13 Dec 2012 15:50:49 910 posts
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    Synology, Qnap, Thecus or Drobo are all pretty even when it comes to price/performance for the NAS you're after.

    I think vizzini is focusing on the crap 2-4 disk drive bays with a network port that are slower than the dedicated NAS boxes.
  • Widge Moderator 13 Dec 2012 16:00:19 12,595 posts
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    I'm not sure what to do. I am downsizing my PC and making a Steambox, but will have a load of left over HDDs as a result. Was thinking of getting a NAS to put them in, but could just as well get an external HDD and sell the lot on.

    The grand plan was to have an always on, quiet, small thing that sits and serves files. TV/Films to the Steambox/PS3's and music to the laptop that I will do music stuff on.

    Although I could just get a nice 2TB and slap that in the Steambox to act as a TV/Film archive (and stream to the PS3's if necessary or copy to memory stick), and then a big external HDD for all my music stuff. That leaves all my old drives redundant, but I can just sell them on. Probably more cost effective.

    _ _ _

    www.unpaused.co.uk - electronic noise adjective salad

  • Sponz 13 Dec 2012 16:08:40 515 posts
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    Get a Synology. the DSM OS is awesome. Oh, and with gigabit ethernet, transfer times are awesome.


    Just to note, a NAS is also, not a backup. Keep your important stuff in the cloud.

    And I dont know what youve been smoking vizzini, but I get 80MB/s transfer rates across my Gigabit LAN from PC to NAS to PC.

    Edited by Sponz at 16:12:21 13-12-2012
  • Gambit1977 13 Dec 2012 16:09:26 9,543 posts
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    Got a Buffalo linkstation, 2gb. Excellent, small and very quiet.
  • Dirtbox 13 Dec 2012 16:33:54 76,329 posts
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    Yeah, Buffalo are the bees knees. And I'm no scientician, but vizzini seems like he hasn't got the first idea of what he's doing.

    Just get this

    http://www.ebuyer.com/291389-buffalo-linkstation-live-v2-1tb-1x-1tb-nas-drive-ls-x1-0tl-eu

    or this and be done with it.

    http://www.ebuyer.com/189995-buffalo-linkstation-duo-2tb-2x-1tb-nas-drive-ls-wx2-0tl-r1-eu

    Edited by Dirtbox at 16:36:42 13-12-2012

    +1 / Like / Tweet this post

  • Deleted user 13 December 2012 17:29:34
    @Sponz

    If you get those as average “write” speeds, in a 2 disk NAS, then you've clearly got amazing disks in that NAS, and the Synology is worth getting.

    Sadly with Hitachi Desktstars in RAID1 in the gigabit Ethernet NAS I previously owned, average write speeds were good when they hit 15Mbytes/sec and regularly fell to 8Mbytes/sec. Read speeds were equally half what they should be.

    Same drives internal to my system +30Mbyte/sec write speed. Maybe it was just a crappy NAS, but unless the Synology uses h/w RAID, or a decent hostboard for s/w RAID it will have the same issues I suspect.

    Edited by vizzini at 17:31:05 13-12-2012
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