Wii U Page 677

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  • zoolophage 18 May 2013 10:25:52 1,680 posts
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    JinTypeNoir wrote:
    zoolophage wrote:Miyamoto is a legend but there comes a time when even the most talented need to step back to allow the next generation to prosper.
    Miyamoto oversees a lot of projects, and its a little unclear how much input he has in each one, but his two babies, Mario and Zelda, have been successfully transitioned into new directors, Koizumi, for 3D Mario, Tezuka for 2D Mario (who himself trained a new team to make New Super Mario Bros. 2) and Aonuma for Zelda. Neither Mario Kart nor Pikmin is even directed by him any more. His training of these new teams was essentially complete during the Gamecube generation. Only two of Nintendo's five breakthrough hits during the DS/Wii generation were Miyamoto darlings (Wii Fit and Nintendogs). Brain Training, Animal Crossing's rise from niche to worldbeater franchise and Wii Sports were all primarily orchestrated by other people. They've also got another legendary designer (Sakamoto) there who is releasing hits at a decent clip (Wario Ware, Rhythm Heaven, Tomodachi Collection) but for some reason, whose name is not as well-known.

    From the man's own words in recent interviews, it seems like he might be working on some downloadable games recently, instead of package releases.
    I didn't know any of that, although I can't say I pay a lot of attention to such things. I think it always appears that Miyamoto is hugely involved in everything. Maybe they need to spend more time talking about all of these other designers and games so that people are more aware of it and so that we appreciate that Nintendo do have a lot of up and coming talent. Perhaps we just don't hear so much about these things outside of Japan.

    3DS: 2019-9957-3472

  • JinTypeNoir 18 May 2013 10:36:45 4,377 posts
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    zoolophage wrote:
    I didn't know any of that, although I can't say I pay a lot of attention to such things. I think it always appears that Miyamoto is hugely involved in everything. Maybe they need to spend more time talking about all of these other designers and games so that people are more aware of it and so that we appreciate that Nintendo do have a lot of up and coming talent. Perhaps we just don't hear so much about these things outside of Japan.
    Iwata realized this was a problem early in the Wii days and thus started a column called Iwata Asks, where he goes around asking the development team how they made the games and to provide a lot more info about how they develop titles. You can read the interviews here. He also started doing more PR in place of Miyamoto so Miyamoto could focus on helping the development teams achieve independence. The interviews are pretty candid and you can see a theme throughout for the struggle between Miyamoto letting the new teams find their voice and guide them to make solid games. I really recommend the Zelda ones in particular, or the ones with the rather niche games. You'd be surprised how much Nintendo lets out of the story of the development of their games.

    I have a feeling this column was one part of how Nintendo wanted to try to bridge the perception gap overseas. We get dozens upon dozens of interviews with developers every week here. Its a much larger part of the Japanese gaming press because, obviously, its much easier to interview people when you don't have to fly all over the world and they all tend to speak one language and live in a small country the size of California.

    They've also let some of their smaller and lesser known developers host roundtables on Miiverse and I bet they continue to do it.

    If you want more info on Nintendo's new development structures, look at my first reply on the last page for info on how they are expanding. I think you and I were typing our posts at the same time, so we missed each other.

    Edited by JinTypeNoir at 10:39:04 18-05-2013
  • zoolophage 18 May 2013 10:44:16 1,680 posts
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    @JinTypeNoir

    Very interesting. I think you're really on to something about the perception gap of Nintendo's publicity in Japan v overseas and it's good to read more what they're doing. And, yes, looks like we were both replying at the same time.

    3DS: 2019-9957-3472

  • JinTypeNoir 18 May 2013 10:51:20 4,377 posts
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    In addition to the new building and all that I mentioned on the last page, they do stuff like this (taken from the Iwata Asks on Harmoknight, a Game Freak-developed downloadable game for the 3DS whose original idea was started by a foreigner who works for Game Freak):

    Masuda: GAME FREAK had come up with original titles such as Drill Dozer2, but we had experienced quite a few problems in the past with getting new projects up and running.

    Iwata: Well, you have the weight of expectations of all the Pokémon fans out there who want you to focus on making great titles for that series.

    Masuda: Yes, and we are absolutely committed to meeting our fans’ expectations. We can’t exactly leave Pokémon to one side while we work on other games! (laughs)

    Iwata: (laughs)

    Masuda: This is why we decided to change the internal structure of the company so that we could initiate new projects while still being able to give our all on Pokémon titles. We have structured things so that if you come up with an idea for a game, you can write a proposal for it;if you can then get two other people to support it, you will be given three months to make it.

    Iwata: I see. So you have made specific rules, along the lines of Google’s ‘20 percent time’3 concept. Is any member of your staff free to work on coming up with a game?
    3. ’20 percent time’: Google allow their development staff to devote 20 percent of their working hours to their own pet projects.

    Masuda: Yes, that’s right. Anyone can work on developing a game, as long as you can find two other people prepared to come on board with the project. Then, after three months, we will check on the game’s progress.
    So yeah, can they do more to get this news out there? They might be able to, but I'm not sure there's a ton of better ways then this. It doesn't seem like they could create press releases for all the tiny bits of restructuring like this that they do.
  • YenRug 18 May 2013 13:29:49 2,124 posts
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    One thing that I think would help Nintendo, once more, is seeking out more second-party developers again; whilst they probably feel that they eventually got their fingers burnt, with the likes of Silicon Knights and Rare, in their heydays the output of these development teams is what helped build Nintendo's reputation in the West. They need to bring some diversity into their product line-up, so a multi-pronged approach would help: pick up some indie teams to make some "quickly" developed downloadable titles, and then do bundles of games on physical disc every so often; meanwhile, search out growing developers with some different ideas/approaches, get them to commit to doing something more significant with 12-18 month deadlines and nurture them through 2 or 3 games developed purely for Nintendo. Instil in them some of Nintendo's ethos and ideals, but don't get them doing "Nintendo games" as that what your first parties are for; at the same time, don't lock them in, let them move on after they've created the games you committed them to, but make sure you've recruited their replacements beforehand.

    Essentially, mix up your output, but also spread your message.

    Edited by YenRug at 13:32:06 18-05-2013
  • Daryoon 18 May 2013 13:36:55 4,617 posts
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    One often gets the feeling that parts of the Western media wish to pursue a narrative agenda of "Nintendo's Fall from Grace" as it "succumbs to the overbearing might of the indie/tablet/smartphone scene".

    That's why the Wii is always pushed aside as "that gimmick console that only appealed to casuals for a few months", despite hosting a number of platform-exclusives that put out CoD-busting numbers.

    Maybe I'm wrong, but the image presented by the gaming press never gels with what I see in reality. See aforementioned "nobody likes Sonic these days" assertion. It's bollocks.

    Edited by Daryoon at 14:13:17 18-05-2013
  • Bremenacht 18 May 2013 13:50:33 17,810 posts
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    Daryoon wrote:
    One often gets the feeling that parts of the Western media wishes to pursue a narrative agenda of "Nintendo's Fall from Grace" as it "succumbs to the overbearing might of the indie/tablet/smartphone scene".
    I think that's entirely true. I'd say that narrative has been sitting waiting since the Wii as first announced.

    Having said that, these narratives are always there, waiting to become true. Sony is fucked. Nintendo are Doomed. Microsoft Windows is a disaster. etc etc.
  • Deleted user 18 May 2013 13:55:56
    Yeah i slightly agree with that as well. I was going to quote the whole casual ditching the wii after 6 months thing that gets branded about all the time. I'm not sure where that come from other from ancedotal evidence that has stuck. Its certainly not 'true'.

    This is not new for nintendo. They been doomed since ...well forever.

    Its getting to the point where i wonder why i actually post on forums, can't go into a console brand thread without there being a pavala over something. Always has to be an issue!
  • YenRug 18 May 2013 14:02:28 2,124 posts
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    @joelstinton *pssst* palaver...
  • Sid-Nice 18 May 2013 14:04:22 15,852 posts
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    thegofp wrote:
    Sid-Nice wrote:
    Since the NES the bestselling Nintendo franchises are…

    2D Mario
    3D Mario
    Mario Kart
    Smash Bros
    Zelda
    The lowest selling first "version" of a Pokemon series is Ruby & Sapphire with 13 million sold. Did you mean bestselling console Nintendo franchises?
    Pokémon isn't a big seller on the home consoles and I was referring to console as we are discussing the Wii U. Pokémon Stadium did sell just under 4 million on the N64; I still think a remake of Pokémon Snap would be perfect for the Gamepad.

    NNID Sid-Nice

  • Syrette 18 May 2013 14:32:02 43,325 posts
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    scoobysi wrote:
    Psychotext wrote:
    I see they've just confirmed that it wont be getting FIFA 14. Crazy times.
    They're disappointed with the poor sales of FIFA 12.5 that they misleadingly badged FIFA 13 apparently.
    I said this in the comments - what you've said is right, but it's not common knowledge. The masses/casuals (those of us who don't go on sites such as this often) weren't aware of this. So I don't think that can be blamed for the poor sales figures - although it will have had a small effect I'm sure.

  • Sid-Nice 18 May 2013 15:24:11 15,852 posts
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    Daryoon wrote:
    One often gets the feeling that parts of the Western media wish to pursue a narrative agenda of "Nintendo's Fall from Grace" as it "succumbs to the overbearing might of the indie/tablet/smartphone scene".

    That's why the Wii is always pushed aside as "that gimmick console that only appealed to casuals for a few months", despite hosting a number of platform-exclusives that put out CoD-busting numbers.

    Maybe I'm wrong, but the image presented by the gaming press never gels with what I see in reality. See aforementioned "nobody likes Sonic these days" assertion. It's bollocks.
    I totally agree this same attitude from the gaming press is adopted by fans of other consoles. The gaming press are like a bunch of trolls where the Wii U is concerned; negative Nintendo news gets hits and positive Nintendo news doesn’t.

    EA stated earlier this week that “There are no Wii U games in development at the moment” yet Eurogamer created an article “Madden NFL 25 the latest EA game to skip Wii U - what now for FIFA 14?” “UPDATE: EA has confirmed to Eurogamer that FIFA 14 will not release on Wii U.” I believe the “There are no Wii U games in development at the moment” statement already confirmed that there wouldn’t be a Fifa or Madden coming to the Wii U.

    And while you are dishing the dirt why not add “Of course, EA isn't the only publisher to snub the Wii U. Sega cancelled the Wii U version of Gearbox Software's controversial shooter Aliens: Colonial Marines after Randy Pitchford said it would be the best-looking version.” Was the game cancelled because it was the best looking version? The cancelation of Alien Colonial Marines should be positive news.

    NNID Sid-Nice

  • Deleted user 18 May 2013 15:45:56
    When a console only has 3 games after being out for this long the cancelation of any game is a bad thing.
  • Syrette 18 May 2013 15:52:15 43,325 posts
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    Sid Nice is defending Nintendo to the hilt shocker.

  • Sid-Nice 18 May 2013 15:52:19 15,852 posts
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    Syrette wrote:
    scoobysi wrote:
    Psychotext wrote:
    I see they've just confirmed that it wont be getting FIFA 14. Crazy times.
    They're disappointed with the poor sales of FIFA 12.5 that they misleadingly badged FIFA 13 apparently.
    I said this in the comments - what you've said is right, but it's not common knowledge. The masses/casuals (those of us who don't go on sites such as this often) weren't aware of this. So I don't think that can be blamed for the poor sales figures - although it will have had a small effect I'm sure.
    Do you honestly think that the masses/casuals actually bought a Wii U? The tit promoting the game in a Man City top was enough to put me off; I opted for the PS3 version, with the intention of buying Fifa 14 on the Wii U if contained the updated engine.

    NNID Sid-Nice

  • Sid-Nice 18 May 2013 16:08:37 15,852 posts
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    Syrette wrote:
    Sid Nice is defending Nintendo to the hilt shocker.
    I'm not defending Nintendo; I'm referring to the fact that Eurogamer and other gaming sites are creating negative Nintendo articles to generate hits. With the low Wii U install base and the negativity surrounding Aliens Colonial Marines; the decision to cancel the game was in everyone’s best interest.

    NNID Sid-Nice

  • Deleted user 18 May 2013 16:15:20
    I wouldn't say thats entirely true, in general bad news is good news for outlets. Micosoft had a pretty bad few months on the back of the ps4 reveal.

    It would be nice to have a few more editorials highlighting the good parts of the wii u - miiverse for example. Game reviews have been great for the wii u, esepcially from eurogamer.

    To be honest the wii u has a lot going for it, a lot of stuff needs ironing out but i think that despite low sale figures, nintendo will be confident of turning it around.

    I understand where you coming from, the negative news onslaught is getting tiring, especially when a lot of is opinion writing. The direct yesterday, was clear in it'ss annoucement that it be just the spring summer games from nintendo, yet the usual suspect acted shocked when every i.p under the sun wasn't announced.
  • Fake_Blood 18 May 2013 16:18:11 4,169 posts
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    Well there's always nintendolife if you want to sit in a bubble and pretend that losing EA is actually a good thing.
  • ecureuil 18 May 2013 16:19:26 76,729 posts
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    Sid-Nice wrote:negative Nintendo news gets hits and positive Nintendo news doesn’t.
    This is the same with everything. People were wetting themselves over the prospect of PS3 bombing, they loved it. The gaming press went mental and couldn't wait to pronounce it dead. A fall from grace is entertaining for everyone.
  • Deleted user 18 May 2013 16:19:42
    No one was shocked, why they think it's a good idea to not give some hope to those how have any interest that there might be something else for them to play in the next year is very strange though.
  • Deleted user 18 May 2013 16:25:47
    For those that have been watching directs before yesterday, aside from the last two from early in the year (zelda 3ds, Zelda ww one's), it was pretty typical of other ones. Often 20 Minutes long and detailing the game - gameplay elements, new stuff - and announcing releases dates for games in the immeadiate future - next couple of months.

    I guess being 3 weeks before E3 (yay) Nintendo were running the risk of getting peoples hopes up, but i think it partially down to the success of the directs when they do reveal big news - 3ds xl, those zeldas, x yoshi yarns etc)
  • Sid-Nice 18 May 2013 16:25:48 15,852 posts
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    It won’t be plain sailing for the next generation consoles either; many of the multimedia application that were once (USP) are now available through Smart TV. The big bomb at E3 this year will be when Microsoft and EA come on stage and announce “Our games will be exclusive to the Xbox brand and PC only; we will continue to support the PS3 but not the PS4 and Vita.”

    Bad news for FAN; leaked documentation from Sega states “Shenmue 1 & 2 HD remake exclusive to the Wii U.”

    NNID Sid-Nice

  • Sid-Nice 18 May 2013 16:32:11 15,852 posts
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    Fake_Blood wrote:
    Well there's always nintendolife if you want to sit in a bubble and pretend that losing EA is actually a good thing.
    Even if EA continued to support Nintendo hardware; the amount of titles released would have been minimal. The same old “Not the right demographic user base” would have been the reason.

    NNID Sid-Nice

  • beastmaster 18 May 2013 17:19:12 11,330 posts
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    Sid-Nice wrote:
    It won’t be plain sailing for the next generation consoles either
    No, but they will have their big, well known titles available on launch as well as a few more multi-plats. No idea what MS exclusives will be but i'm guessing at something like Foza, a new Rare game which will look the bollocks, another Fable(?) and perhaps the new Respawn game. Not to mention the likes of Watch Dogs and Destiny. The PS4 stuff we know about already.

    This is what Nintendo failed to do. Launch with their big, well known titles. I don't think they've got much time. As soon as GTA is launched on 360 and PS3, I doubt anyone who owns these machines is going to give a flying fuck about the Wii U.

    Edited by beastmaster at 17:20:40 18-05-2013

    The Resident Evil films. I'm one of the reasons they keep making them.

  • ecureuil 18 May 2013 17:26:23 76,729 posts
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    I think Battlefield 4 will sell a lot of PS4's/new Xbox's. EA are timing this just right.
  • Daryoon 18 May 2013 18:28:29 4,617 posts
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    ecureuil wrote:
    Sid-Nice wrote:negative Nintendo news gets hits and positive Nintendo news doesn’t.
    This is the same with everything. People were wetting themselves over the prospect of PS3 bombing, they loved it. The gaming press went mental and couldn't wait to pronounce it dead. A fall from grace is entertaining for everyone.
    Especially for the English media. It says a lot about our cultural identity that we derive so much pleasure from watching others fall (it's called the "tall poppy syndrome").

    Just look at the general reaction among the gaming press to the Wii. "Gathering dust" "no games" "gimmick!" etcetera. This, despite there being games, and despite it being a success. You'd almost think there was an air of nerdish resentment at Nintendo for daring to drag gaming away from the adolescent male crowd...

    This is what Nintendo failed to do. Launch with their big, well known titles. I don't think they've got much time. As soon as GTA is launched on 360 and PS3, I doubt anyone who owns these machines is going to give a flying fuck about the Wii U.
    Why should it matter when GTAV is launched? Does every gamer ever care for it? I couldn't give a crap myself (but I've still got a backlog of Ps2 games...) You could argue Pokemon - just as big a franchise - is launching a month later, and is undeniably going to bring with it a surge in 3DS sales.

    And this is where we get confirmation bias: games site/community/demographic gets hyped over one thing, then presume everyone else ever must agree with them.
  • beastmaster 18 May 2013 18:51:06 11,330 posts
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    Hmm...let me rephrase.

    Okay, speaking personally, there's currently nothing on the Wii U that really takes my interest. Wonderful 101 and Xenoblade look amazing though. If there were a few other titles out then I think I'd be seriously tempted to get one. I don't care for Pokemon.

    However, when GTA gets launched, I'll be too busy/distracted to justify buying one. Then the new consiles come out.

    So in effect, it's missing out on sales by not having the 'right' titles (Mario, Zelda, Metroid etc.) ready from the off. Just to play them in HD is enough for me.

    I also through Nintendo was trying to target more 'serious' gamers.

    The Resident Evil films. I'm one of the reasons they keep making them.

  • Sid-Nice 18 May 2013 19:08:11 15,852 posts
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    beastmaster wrote:


    I also through Nintendo was trying to target more 'serious' gamers.
    They have attracted more "Serious" gamers; serious in the sense that they are as miserable as fuck with their purchase. :)

    NNID Sid-Nice

  • Raiko101 19 May 2013 00:12:08 6,219 posts
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    6 months later and i'm still addicted to Miiverse. Now the VC is up i'm spending hours just going through the communities for my childhood games. It's almost as much fun as playing the games themselves.

    3DS: 4210 4002 8289 (Dave)
    Wii U: Raiko87
    Xbox Live: Raiko87

  • Psychotext 19 May 2013 00:21:30 53,967 posts
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    I wish I had that sort of spare time. :(
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