Home Cinema advice Page 29

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  • quadfather 13 Feb 2018 10:26:49 30,380 posts
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    Also, just to add more spanners, you also need to ask yourself exactly what type of surround you want. Is it just going to be 5.1? If so, there are plenty of options available.

    But if you think you might want to expand further down the line to something like 7.1, or even DTS:X or Dolby Atmos, it's a different ballgame. Admittedly, the majority of DTS:X / Atmos is limited and normally only available on 4k films, but it's still something to factor in, because that will also dictate what type of receiver to get in the first place, along with whatever player you're going to decide on - Blu Ray, UHD player, etc etc.

    I suppose the question is, what is it that you're after? Both short term and long term?
  • Dougs 13 Feb 2018 13:13:58 84,533 posts
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    Yeah, I ended up spending a bit more on a receiver to give me the option of Atmos/X in the future, plus all the latest standards etc. The speakers are more than acceptable to my ears, although I do want to upgrade the Centre speaker soon.

    (I assume the all in one's referred to is about the kits you can pick up for £150 or whatever, with a Blu Ray player attached etc?)
  • Psychotext 13 Feb 2018 13:29:41 62,449 posts
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    Thanks for the info. I genuinely don't have a clue what I want. All I really know is that I'm buying a 4K blu-ray player, a 4K TV and I've always kind of fancied a surround sound system.

    So I guess the first step is a receiver that works with that sort of thing?

    I had a quick look at Atmos and the prices were eye watering. So maybe not on that.

    Edit - Is this Yamaha MusicCast RX-V483 the sort of thing I should be looking at? https://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/rx-v483/index.html

    Edited by Psychotext at 13:46:35 13-02-2018
  • ozthegweat 13 Feb 2018 14:16:22 1,723 posts
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    @Psychotext Yes, that'll do fine. There's an even cheaper one, the 383.
  • THFourteen 13 Feb 2018 14:22:12 47,300 posts
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    Bought a set of Jamo 5.1s back in the day which were fantastic for the money.

    Sadly i just had a google and they can't be bought anymore.

    I still use them in my man cave with a Sony STR-DG910 reciever that does what i need it to do.
  • Psychotext 13 Feb 2018 14:32:52 62,449 posts
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    ozthegweat wrote:
    @Psychotext Yes, that'll do fine. There's an even cheaper one, the 383.
    Cheers. I'll have a look around for that sort of thing then.
  • quadfather 13 Feb 2018 14:39:53 30,380 posts
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    One thing - if you're already set on getting a 4k blu ray player and a 4k tv, I would strongly recommend getting an amp that can do DTS:X and Atmos - they really go hand in hand with what requirements you've mentioned.

    You can get them for £250-£300 nowadays.

    Edit - or to put it another way, do you fancy upgrading your amp in 6 months time to get the features once you've heard them? (And you will want them once you hear them)

    Edited by quadfather at 14:40:32 13-02-2018
  • THFourteen 13 Feb 2018 14:46:43 47,300 posts
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    Edit - or to put it another way do you want to spend thousands of pounds on features that are undiscernible to the average human ear

    :-)

    Edited by THFourteen at 14:46:55 13-02-2018
  • Psychotext 13 Feb 2018 14:46:47 62,449 posts
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    Not entirely sure how I'd hear them... without an amp that allows me to hear them. :p

    Thankfully I'm not the sort of person that buys things for the sake of buying them. So I don't need to worry about feeling like I'm doing without!

    (Besides, fuck messing around with the speaker requirements for atmos)
  • quadfather 13 Feb 2018 14:52:12 30,380 posts
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    Fair do's - just don't say I didn't warn you!

    Also @THFourteen - trust me, you can fucking hear atmos - the speakers are above your head man! :)
  • Razz 13 Feb 2018 15:39:27 63,403 posts
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    Anybody know about Subwoofers? I'm currently looking at a KEF C4. It's going in a relatively average room; about 8 X 10m. Looking to really get a nice thump out of it rather than just a background rumble. Is this one alright?

    https://www.whathifi.com/kef/c4/overview
  • phAge 13 Feb 2018 16:01:48 25,402 posts
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    @Razz

    8" is a bit small (...) for a room that size. I'd consider at least 10" and ideally 12". Also, think about finding something used - way more bang for your buck that way.

    If you want new, I very much recommend XTZ's range of subs.

    https://www.xtzsound.eu/product/subwoofer-overview

    Edited by phAge at 16:02:15 13-02-2018
  • Razz 13 Feb 2018 16:18:15 63,403 posts
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    @phAge See! cheers, that's good advice mate. Were should I look, eBay?
  • phAge 13 Feb 2018 16:29:20 25,402 posts
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    Razz wrote:
    @phAge See! cheers, that's good advice mate. Were should I look, eBay?
    Dunno - round these parts we have a few different websites for used stuff, including hi-fi gear, which allow you to filter by location.

    Might be worth having a look at dedicated hi-fi forums online as well - most of those have sections dedicated to buying and selling gear and, with geeks being geeks, oftentimes you can get near-mint stuff for a lot less than MSRP.

    Just make sure you can get to audition whatever you buy before actually handing over any money.

    What's yer budget - and are you looking at a setup for mainly music or movies?
  • gamingdave 14 Feb 2018 13:46:01 4,693 posts
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    Razz wrote:
    Anybody know about Subwoofers? I'm currently looking at a KEF C4. It's going in a relatively average room; about 8 X 10m. Looking to really get a nice thump out of it rather than just a background rumble. Is this one alright?

    https://www.whathifi.com/kef/c4/overview
    Depends on budget, but the SVS subs are well regarded.

    But I don't think you can do better value wise than BKElec, I have a Monoloith+ and it is seriously impressive. Competitors offer similar punch out of smaller units, but at vastly greater prices. If you have the space, they are amazing: https://www.bkelec.com/HiFi/Sub_Woofers.htm
  • Technoishmatt 14 Feb 2018 15:56:14 2,326 posts
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    I love my KEF setup.

    Assuming those room dimensions are in feet, surely that subwoofer would be more than enough?

    I have their E2 (within an E305 setup), which is also a 200m / 8incher (downfiring), and it provides great bass for my surround setup. My tv etc is in the left hand half of a well sized room (probably like 12x20x10, so it is 12x10x10). I also tried a second subwoofer of the same model behind the sofa, but it really didn't add anything. I actually have another E305 setup.. using the subwoofer and 2 speakers in the dining room / kitchen for music.

    Also - fuk spending the extra cash on Atmos if it your first time purchase. I don't think it is worth the future proofing at all. When I was looking 2.5 years ago, the receivers were quite a bit more expensive. Unless you think you are going to upgrade within a year or two, or that you just can't afford the extra two speakers yet, then I think you shoudl just get the setup you are happy with right now and plan for it to last you 3-5 years. If you want to upgrade after 3-5 years, you can sell pieces from your existing set-up, and the new stuff will be shiny. The thing I don't like about most separate receivers is their massive size. (This is what I would get if was going into Atmos right now).
  • quadfather 14 Feb 2018 16:05:28 30,380 posts
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    Don't listen to him! Get Atmos!
  • Derblington 14 Feb 2018 16:10:22 30,387 posts
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    That Marantz is really nice. I have a big ugly separate receiver and I'm ok with it - it's not like it demands to be looked at - but if I switch up in the future I'll go for something slim like that.

    I have the KEF T305 set-up so the receiver is by far the biggest part of it.
  • Technoishmatt 14 Feb 2018 16:27:43 2,326 posts
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    Very jelly for those T305s!!

    Also, don't get me wrong - I agree that atmos is awesome. But it is quite an extra chunk of cash. I actually think for a first time buyer, getting a Home Cinema in the Box is not a bad idea, as long as you don't go for the nastiest offering and find one that has good reviews. It is WAY cheaper.

    I think when I move back to UK/London in a year, I will first upgrade to the latest marantz slim line (assuming space in my London hovel is at a premium) atmos receiver (I think I will have to get a new one anyway due to the different voltage), and use my existing E305 speakers. Then when we've bought a house (which is the plan), I will look into getting those T305s!

    On the receiver, it probably does depend whether you have space to tuck things away out of sight or not. And the slimline marantz' with 50w per channel, while more than fine for film/tv and generally playing music, you won't get very loud party music from it (although you can of course use multichannel to get 4 speakers instead of 2). There are always trade-offs.
  • Technoishmatt 14 Feb 2018 16:30:00 2,326 posts
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    @Derblington the T305 has all large speakers right? Did you listen to the difference between the large and small options before buying?
  • quadfather 14 Feb 2018 16:35:04 30,380 posts
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    @Technoishmatt

    I know what you're saying but you can get a Atmos/DTS:X receiver now for £250-£300
  • Derblington 14 Feb 2018 16:38:53 30,387 posts
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    Yeah, it's all the large speakers.

    I didn't have any experience of it before buying. I wanted something that looked nice in the room, which led me to the T series. I just read a lot of reviews. I was actually going to buy the 205 but the gf questioned why I wasn't getting all large. I didn't have a good reason other than I figured she'd prefer the rears to look as unobtrusive as possible, and as she didn't care I went for the 305.

    It's my first surround set. It was always something I wanted but couldn't justify properly while renting apartments. We bought a place so I bought them immediately.
    I don't have experience of big floor speakers but I really like what I have: works great for movies and gaming and I like that they don't overpower the room visually.
  • gamingdave 14 Feb 2018 17:20:59 4,693 posts
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    Personally I wouldn't go for Atmos if limiting to 5.1.2, I would want a receiver capable of going more, even if that meant adding additional amplification latter.

    I am planning 7.2.4 very soon, but have been running 5.1 for nearly 20 years (still rocking the original Acoustic Energy AE100 series). It'a a balance of budget but I would say your better having less speakers driven well by a competent amp, than lot's of lesser quality speakers being driven poorly. When I get my new amp (for Atmos) one of my older AV receivers will act as additional amplification as to not drive too much from the one integrated amp.

    In a perfect world, you would get quality power amps for your speakers, and upgrade just the processor when new formats come a long. But that is both expensive to start with, and also not exactly space saving. And of course, new things come along all the time. Todays topline kit may not accept tomorrows new formats.

    So I would say, either stick to 5.1, or buy kit capable of going 7.x.2/5.x.4.

    If the budget is upto £1500, the SVS Prime 5.1 coupled with the Yamaha will be fantastic.

    Half the budget, and you could do worse than look at Q-Acoustics

    Not to rule out soundbars, they still don't match a proper surround setup, but have come a long way.

    Edited by gamingdave at 17:21:51 14-02-2018
  • phAge 14 Feb 2018 17:31:17 25,402 posts
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    FWIW I absolutely love my 5.2 setup. The additional sub makes a world of difference in bass response.
  • Technoishmatt 14 Feb 2018 17:55:25 2,326 posts
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    @gamingdave just spent / wasted 20 minutes trying to figure out how to get to 7.2.4 without spending big bucks. Limitation seems to be that having the extra couple amplifiers costs a lot more (quite a lot more than doubling cost of a 7.2/5.2.2 receiver).

    I then read that you can get receivers with fewer amplifiers but the ability to split the channels and send to external amp. I have a couple small factor stereo amps lying around so this seems attractive! Still struggling a bit to find the right main receiver though.
  • Armoured_Bear 14 Feb 2018 18:00:08 21,208 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    Not entirely sure how I'd hear them... without an amp that allows me to hear them. :p

    Thankfully I'm not the sort of person that buys things for the sake of buying them. So I don't need to worry about feeling like I'm doing without!

    (Besides, fuck messing around with the speaker requirements for atmos)
    Listen to quaddy, don't do the "save 50 quid and fuck yourself later" thing.
  • quadfather 14 Feb 2018 18:09:28 30,380 posts
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    gamingdave wrote:
    Personally I wouldn't go for Atmos if limiting to 5.1.2, I would want a receiver capable of going more, even if that meant adding additional amplification latter.

    I am planning 7.2.4 very soon, but have been running 5.1 for nearly 20 years (still rocking the original Acoustic Energy AE100 series). It'a a balance of budget but I would say your better having less speakers driven well by a competent amp, than lot's of lesser quality speakers being driven poorly. When I get my new amp (for Atmos) one of my older AV receivers will act as additional amplification as to not drive too much from the one integrated amp.

    In a perfect world, you would get quality power amps for your speakers, and upgrade just the processor when new formats come a long. But that is both expensive to start with, and also not exactly space saving. And of course, new things come along all the time. Todays topline kit may not accept tomorrows new formats.

    So I would say, either stick to 5.1, or buy kit capable of going 7.x.2/5.x.4.

    If the budget is upto £1500, the SVS Prime 5.1 coupled with the Yamaha will be fantastic.

    Half the budget, and you could do worse than look at Q-Acoustics

    Not to rule out soundbars, they still don't match a proper surround setup, but have come a long way.
    Whilst I'd love that 7.x.x setup, I think it does also matter what the room is like too. I know you'd get more from that setup than 5.1.2, but my room appears to be perfect for 5.1.2. I absolutely love listening to films on it now and the 2 ceiling speakers really make a very noticeable difference. it'd be a waste of money if I upgraded it anymore purely because of the room.

    Hm, so I guess what I'm saying (to myself) is that I need a bigger room ;)
  • Technoishmatt 14 Feb 2018 18:15:35 2,326 posts
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    Ok, so another 5 min “spent” researching.

    If I wanted to do it now, I should get a Denon 4300 (available for $900 herr in USA), which has 9 channels, but 11 processors, and use a separate 2 channel amplifier, which seems like a reasonable cost premium to get to 11 channels.

    The 4300 is last year’s model, the 4400 is at $1600.

    Going this route also means I could upgrade at later date and do 5.1.4 in mean time, or 7.1.2, especially as I already have 9 identical speakers.

    Anyway, something to look forward to next year :p
  • Psychotext 14 Feb 2018 18:16:37 62,449 posts
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    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    Listen to quaddy, don't do the "save 50 quid and fuck yourself later" thing.
    As has been said here, in a couple of years, receivers that can do everything that's top end today will cost fuck all. If I want it then, I can buy it then. You're talking to someone that only has TV speakers.

    Don't get me wrong, if I see two receivers for around the same price (with similar reviews) and one has it... then sure, but I'm not spending more for the fuck of MAYBE upgrading one day.

    Besides that, as I said, I'm not cutting holes in my ceiling, and I'm not fucking around buying upward firing speakers either.
  • mrpon 14 Feb 2018 18:19:53 34,087 posts
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    Hasn't your budget gone Psycho? ;)
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