Gary McKinnon not being extradited to US Page 8

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  • Khanivor 31 Jul 2009 21:47:14 40,758 posts
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    dangerpuss wrote:
    Why are you so focused on him having Asperger's if you think it's a fictitious disorder? His Asperger's has so far had no effect whatsoever on getting him any leniency so apart from a media campaign which is irrelevant, why does it matter if he's been diagnosed?

    Obviously he thought it would be good for his defence if he was formally diagnosed but it hasn't made any difference as far as I can see.

    Yeah, it's made no difference to him other than it stopped him from being extradited for another year while he made a new appeal based solely on that diagnosis. Seeing as it was the court's rejection of that appeal which caused the thread bump I think the diagnosis is a wee bit relevant to the discussion.
  • Deleted user 31 July 2009 21:51:26
    Khanivor wrote:
    dangerpuss wrote:
    Why are you so focused on him having Asperger's if you think it's a fictitious disorder? His Asperger's has so far had no effect whatsoever on getting him any leniency so apart from a media campaign which is irrelevant, why does it matter if he's been diagnosed?

    Obviously he thought it would be good for his defence if he was formally diagnosed but it hasn't made any difference as far as I can see.

    Yeah, it's made no difference to him other than it stopped him from being extradited for another year while he made a new appeal based solely on that diagnosis. Seeing as it was the court's rejection of that appeal which caused the thread bump I think the diagnosis is a wee bit relevant to the discussion.

    Not really. If it's been discounted by the courts, it has no relevance as to whether he should be extradited or not.

    You appear angry that his extradition was delayed a year because of this diagnosis, yet it really hasn't had any substantial effect on his case. He will still be extradited.

    You still haven't satisfactorily explained how you could possibly know that the diagnosis is a fake unless you have a belief that Asperger's Syndrome doesn't exist.
  • Khanivor 31 Jul 2009 21:55:39 40,758 posts
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    dangerpuss wrote:
    Not really. If it's been discounted by the courts, it has no relevance as to whether he should be extradited or not.

    You appear angry that his extradition was delayed a year because of this diagnosis, yet it really hasn't had any substantial effect on his case. He will still be extradited.

    So if the court had upheld his appeal would you still insist the diagnosis had no substantial effect on his case? The diagnosis had the very significant effect of keeping him in the UK for a year, and will continue to have an effect as he takes the mental defence to the Lords and then the EU court next. Would his ma be appealing to Obama directly if he wasn't diagnosed? Come on man, it's pretty obvious the timely diagnosis has had a massive effect on his case. It IS his case right now.
  • Deleted user 31 July 2009 21:59:05
    Khanivor wrote:
    dangerpuss wrote:
    Not really. If it's been discounted by the courts, it has no relevance as to whether he should be extradited or not.

    You appear angry that his extradition was delayed a year because of this diagnosis, yet it really hasn't had any substantial effect on his case. He will still be extradited.

    So if the court had upheld his appeal would you still insist the diagnosis had no substantial effect on his case? The diagnosis had the very significant effect of keeping him in the UK for a year, and will continue to have an effect as he takes the mental defence to the Lords and then the EU court next. Would his ma be appealing to Obama directly if he wasn't diagnosed? Come on man, it's pretty obvious the timely diagnosis has had a massive effect on his case. It IS his case right now.

    You still haven't satisfactorily explained how you could possibly know that the diagnosis is a fake unless you have a belief that Asperger's Syndrome doesn't exist.

    If he does have Asperger's, I don't see anything wrong with him using it in his defence.

    So you are left with two options, Baron-Cohen is a fake or Asperger's Syndrome is fake.
    Do you have any evidence for either of these conclusions?

    I really don't give a shit about this case, I do however take issue with the casual dismissal of an expert for no reason.
  • xandoodle 31 Jul 2009 22:09:07 458 posts
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    This thread really is quite eye opening in that it made me realize how naive people can be about the state, government and the law. Eye opening really.

    Also, more fool anybody if they believe he is as big as a n00b as he portrays himself. You do not not stumble across government networks, and dig into them.
  • Khanivor 31 Jul 2009 22:10:08 40,758 posts
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    Did I say I knew it was fake? Again, no. I did say I am suspicious of the diagnosis but do I know for certain anything about it, other than what I have mentioned? No.

    There are numerous other options, such as the possibility the professor made a weak diagnosis for personal reasons or to bring the condition further publicity. It's also possible that McKinnon lied his ass off, which, considering there is no medical test for the condition, makes it a handy thing to discover you have at a very opportune moment.

    So, to prevent this from descending into yet another groovemeister aspie thread, I'll just reiterate that I am highly dubious about the entire diagnosis. I think anyone should be, considering the circumstances. And that's it, not much more to discuss on that front. Let's wait and see what his legal team's next move is.
  • Deleted user 1 August 2009 13:58:09
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/01/gary-mckinnon-extradition-nightmare

    I've met him sporadically during these years and can vouch that he's a chainsmoking, terrified shell.

    "I'm walking down the road and I find I can't control my own legs," he has told me. "And I'm sitting up all night thinking about jail. About male rape. An American jail. I'm only a little nerd My life is like walking through a world you know is probably going to end."

    Poor Gary.
  • StarchildHypocrethes 1 Aug 2009 14:03:15 25,854 posts
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    I lie in bed thinking about that every night too.
  • Khanivor 1 Aug 2009 17:22:15 40,758 posts
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    What a piss-poor article. Saying that, it is interesting that he claims he threatened the US government in an effort to hammer out a deal. If so, he's really not that clever, is he?
  • Deleted user 1 August 2009 17:34:43
    The problem is that the court hearings, as they were, dont have a lot to do with establishing his guilt or the supposed severity of the crime. All they have to establish is that he is a British citizen, that he's being extradited for criminal not political reasons, and that the Americans want to extradite him.

    The extradition agreement Labour have signed is that one sided. The yanks could extradite any of us on any pretence and theres nothing we could do about it.
  • strangely.brown 1 Aug 2009 19:28:19 18 posts
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    dangerpuss wrote:
    Khanivor wrote:
    And the whole Aspergers thing is just a joke; gaining a diagnosis a week after you lose an appeal in the European court - that's timing. Then there's the professor who gave him the diagnosis, who refers to this 43 year old as a poor, young man, (he's not the only one with a very flexible definition of the word young) and states that he would be unable to live with other people, ignoring the fact he committed his offences while living in the aunt of his ex-girlfriend's flat. I think it's a highly cynical and pathetic attempt to repackage the case. It's obviously worked, what with all the celebrities and MPs jumping into the limelight.


    This guy knows more about Asperger's Syndrome than you do, you arrogant fool. Maybe you should think before you post such opinionated nonsense.

    Why on earth would anyone think that they can more accurately diagnose someone than an expert who's actually spoken with McKinnon? That's colossal arrogance or ignorance.

    I don't give a fuck about McKinnon either.

    He's a fucking yank , what did you expect !These cunts think they know everthing about everything. Just treat them with the contempt they deserve. I wouldn't extradite Bin Laden to the US. Fucking nation of arrogant stupidly moronic arseholes. I long for the day to turn on my TV and hear that someone has nuked the bastards.
  • RedSparrows 1 Aug 2009 19:30:42 22,680 posts
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    Oh dear. OH DEAR.
  • Deleted user 1 August 2009 19:31:01
    Nah, Khani just wishes he was American. There's a difference.
  • funkyd 1 Aug 2009 19:31:45 7,522 posts
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    Thread delivers
  • Retroid Moderator 1 Aug 2009 19:37:24 44,733 posts
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    strangely.brown wrote:
    He's a fucking yank , what did you expect !These cunts think they know everthing about everything. Just treat them with the contempt they deserve. I wouldn't extradite Bin Laden to the US. Fucking nation of arrogant stupidly moronic arseholes. I long for the day to turn on my TV and hear that someone has nuked the bastards.
    /Joey
  • M83J01P97 1 Aug 2009 20:59:36 6,654 posts
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    The BBC seem to be sticking fairly neutral to it all. In fact Newsnight seemed to be creeping more into the whole "He's done wrong, he should face the consequences" stance last night and the weekly news review thing they do on News 24 presented both sides of the argument and then left it at that.

  • Deleted user 1 August 2009 21:08:07
    Like they are meant to? ;)
  • Deleted user 1 August 2009 21:09:02
    He doesnt deserve whats going to happen to him when he gets to prison over there. People like him end up killing themselves in those places.
  • Khanivor 1 Aug 2009 22:11:27 40,758 posts
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    strangely.brown wrote:
    He's a fucking yank , what did you expect !These cunts think they know everthing about everything. Just treat them with the contempt they deserve. I wouldn't extradite Bin Laden to the US. Fucking nation of arrogant stupidly moronic arseholes. I long for the day to turn on my TV and hear that someone has nuked the bastards.

    Aww, yer cute. Real cute. Purdy too.
  • Khanivor 1 Aug 2009 22:16:18 40,758 posts
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    ruggedtoast wrote:
    He doesnt deserve whats going to happen to him when he gets to prison over there. People like him end up killing themselves in those places.

    He should have thought of that over the years he spent hacking into US military sites. Maybe threatening them after he was caught wasn't none too smart neither.

    Lots and lots of people wind up in prison who are not hardened individuals. This does not change the fact that, unless there was a miscarriage of justice, they deserve to be there and got themselves there entirely on their own.

    I'd probably not last years in a federal prison. However, if I committed some crimes which put me there, I wouldn't whine that I couldn't handle it. Because I am an adult and am responsible for my actions. Just like McKinnon.
  • HoriZon 1 Aug 2009 22:26:49 13,544 posts
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    Wont he just get a job for the US gov and how better they can protect their systems? or he could flee to China i am sure they will welcome him! :)

    I used to be a gamer like you, then I took an arrow in the knee.

  • Khanivor 1 Aug 2009 22:34:27 40,758 posts
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    Well if all he did was as he claims I don't think the US will be in a hurry to hire a middle-aged script kiddie.

    A part of me wants this to go to trial so we can hear some evidence from someone other than the defendant. I struggle to believe that someone who messed around with hacking for about seven years would still be at the level he claims he was at. Then again, maybe he is just as moronic as he comes across.
  • Paperghost 1 Aug 2009 23:08:06 1,702 posts
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    Khanivor wrote:
    Well if all he did was as he claims I don't think the US will be in a hurry to hire a middle-aged script kiddie.

    A part of me wants this to go to trial so we can hear some evidence from someone other than the defendant. I struggle to believe that someone who messed around with hacking for about seven years would still be at the level he claims he was at. Then again, maybe he is just as moronic as he comes across.

    to be honest, he sounds like the majority of script kiddies floating around - i've seen absolutely talentless losers who have still managed to get into .gov systems, or deface their webpages, or insert redirects, or etc etc etc.

    plus if he follows the standard M.O. of script kiddies, he probably did a little bit on his own, then got stuck & visited a bunch of forums, worked out what he had to do next, then rinse and repeat till he reaches his final destination. i'd be amazed if he worked out the bulk of what he did himself, he probably saw someone posting a step-by-step of how they owned one particular .Gov setup, and he thought "I wonder if this works with NASA and a bunch of oth - oh wow, it does! yay me!"

    HoriZon wrote:
    Wont he just get a job for the US gov and how better they can protect their systems? or he could flee to China i am sure they will welcome him! :)

    if he skiddied his way in, he probably can't tell you how to secure whatever he gained access to - just how to get into it in a drone-like fashion. i know quite a few pro hacking groups in China going back some years, and its fair to say they could wipe the floor (and probably the ceiling too) with McKinnon.
  • FWB 2 Aug 2009 22:54:25 44,575 posts
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    Fuck the US and its one-sided extradition treaties. No way they'd reciprocate if the roles were reversed. Yes he's committed a crime and yes he needs to be punished but until the US provides an equal agreement, he can do the time here.
  • Paperghost 4 Aug 2009 15:34:02 1,702 posts
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    you might be violently ill after listening to this song.

    http://www.wikio.co.uk/video/1488837

    good god.
  • Deleted user 9 October 2009 13:39:42
    Gary moves a step closer to imprisonment in the US. it'll probably be fine, like when in My Name is Earl, and Earl had to go to prison but it was all pretty good natured and he ended up making friends with everyone.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/oct/09/hacker-gary-mckinnon-supreme-court-extradition
  • Khanivor 9 Oct 2009 17:59:23 40,758 posts
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    Props to the Guardian for making it halfway through the piece before mentioning Asperger's.

    Props taken away for having 'Images of Guantanamo' residing in the related information frame.
  • Deleted user 17 October 2009 21:14:21
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8312134.stm

    Austistic alien obsessed computer nerd Gary McKinnon's extradition put on hold, as more pschiatric evidence is evaluated.

    In this story the EG forum blatantly no longer gives a toss about.

    Which is odd considering how closely he fits the profile of an EG forumite.
  • Chopsen 17 Oct 2009 21:17:57 15,983 posts
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    Since he's had the world scrutinising his every move, I haven't seen niteninja on the web for a while.

    Just saying....
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