What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?

By Richard Leadbetter Published 7 January, 2012

Digital Foundry investigates user feedback on the 'Metro' update.

Last month's Digital Foundry article on the shortcomings of the Xbox 360's new, so-called "Metro" dashboard highlighted a bug that saw video playback washed out, emphasising compression artifacts and lowering image quality compared to the previous, perfectly serviceable video player. We also revealed that Microsoft appeared to be ignoring the feedback of its beta testers to the point of deleting reports of the issue, causing dismay from those who put their time and effort into road-testing the new update.

For reasons we'll go into later, media is primed to be a new battleground for games consoles going forward and it's no mistake that "Metro" pushes video playback as a key element. The rise of Netflix in the US has helped to define games consoles as a convenient means to stream from a massive catalogue of TV shows and movies offered by a growing range of suppliers. Support (of sorts) for the Bing search engine and YouTube also illustrates how the future focuses on accessing the internet via the TV. In effect "Metro" is positioning the Xbox 360 as a competitor against the next generation of Smart TVs we can expect to see appear this year, and, via its new Video Marketplace apps, as a one-stop shop for video content on demand.

It is a shame that such an important update for Microsoft should prove to have some very serious issues - problems that go beyond the previously reported washed-out video. It's safe to say that our initial blog caused quite a reaction, not least from other beta testers who asked us to investigate a range of issues, such as borked colour levels in gameplay and the removal of 1080p playback from the dashboard. The good news is that - as far as we have been able to discern - gameplay is unaffected by the new update, despite many reports to the contrary. We ran the Modern Warfare 3 brightness calibration tool on 360 consoles running dashboards old and new and found that the RGB levels were essentially identical when running on the same settings.

Unfortunately, reports that the dashboard video player's 1080p mode has been nerfed appear to be on the money. Video calibration tools put together by the AVSForum demonstrate conclusively that, while the Xbox 360 has no problem whatsoever decoding 1080p video, it is no longer being rendered in native resolution. To illustrate the issues, here we see the same full HD video being run on an older NXE dash at 1080p, and the new Metro offering at both 720p and 1080p. As you can see when clicking on the thumbnails, just about all the detail is being resolved on the older front end, but the Metro dash's 720p and 1080p images are effectively identical in terms of core resolution.

'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot nxe-1080p
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot metro-1080p
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot ps3-1080p
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot metro720p

This test pattern demonstrates clearly that the old Xbox 360 video player could handle 1080p files at full resolution with ease - as can the PlayStation 3. However, the new 'Metro' dash seems to be downsampling to 720p.

The inclusion of PlayStation 3 provides an interesting reference. We set the XMB to full-range RGB and that's exactly what was delivered at both 720p and 1080p, but the same can't be said for the Xbox 360. A couple of points of interest arise here. Firstly, histogram analysis of the Metro renderings show that while 720p shows the basic 16-235 limited-range RGB playback, capture in 1080p shows that the colour range is different again - this time information does seem to be in the 0-16 range. This explains why the histograms from our Skyrim timelapse captures in our original article weren't the same limited-range RGB as the Need for Speed movie we created for testing. In short, the problem with colour reproduction isn't as simple as first thought - it's borked to varying degrees depending on the display mode chosen, and colour reproduction changes once again depending on how reference levels are set on your console (here we are using expanded, full-range RGB to match the capabilities of our capture technology).

Secondly, the fact that Xbox 360 owners can no longer play back their 1080p videos at native resolution via the dashboard player is bit of a blow, and is clearly a real problem for a console that is looking to beef up its media credentials. The issue appears to impact the dashboard player and all of the "apps" you can download to stream video, but the legacy code from the Media Center Extender still appears to work fine. Curiously the Extender has always operated in a standalone manner - 720p60 video playback was possible at launch, for example - but it took some time for the main dashboard player to catch up. The Media Center tool's photo viewer is also enormously improved over the dashboard's built-in effort, which adds a horrible blur to all photos and only supports JPEG.

Other services appear to be artificially limited in the new video marketplace apps. For example, streaming service Vudu offers 1080p24 movies via its "HDX" service but in its FAQ it mentions that "Xbox 360 is limited to HD only (720p)."

Once again, the 720p limitation was reported during the dashboard preview programme and in common with the video levels issue we have reports that Microsoft deleted threads that referenced it.

"I reported that 1080p scaling issue as a bug on the first day of the preview program and had a pretty good number of votes behind it before Microsoft deleted it without response," beta tester and AVSForum member Jeremy Anderson tells us. "I'm assuming they know and don't want to acknowledge it, much like the video level issue. Sure seems like if they're hyping the new dashboard's video apps, 1080p video would be a focus. It's a shame that there's no objective way to test whether their own Zune marketplace is playing honest-to-God 1080p video, since it would be pretty damning if their app is the only one that does."

Ah yes, Zune. The service offers 1080p streaming downloads - something that is emphasised in the front-end of the 113MB downloadable app - and does indeed appear to resolve full resolution, so as Jeremy Anderson says it does appear to be the only outlet offering full HD movie streaming. Here are a couple of shots from Rise of the Planet of the Apes, up against digital dumps from the Blu-ray version of the same movie acquired via a retail PlayStation 3. There is a quality difference of course - and clearly the washed-out video problem is pretty horrific in these examples - but we do seem to be seeing a full HD presentation, something Microsoft is denying users with their own movie files, and seemingly its video partners too.

'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot bd-1
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot zune-1
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot bd-2
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot zune-2

While 1080p resolution is seemingly lost on most of the video marketplace apps, it still appears to be present and correct on Zune HD rentals as these Rise of the Planet of the Apes shots demonstrate. However, the washed out video problem remains.

So, what's going on? The obvious conclusion is that the SDK Microsoft is believed to have supplied to third-party video partners is limited to 720p only, leaving Microsoft's host service with a clear quality advantage. The message we draw from this is that the platform holder wants to expand the take-up of the Xbox 360 as a media-streaming device, but very much on its own terms with its own content getting the best quality, and the user's "homebrew" media not being given much importance at all.

Incorrect video levels are obviously a bug, but blatantly downgrading resolution looks very much like part of a strategy. As it is, the new dashboard's preview programme ensured that the issues were brought to Microsoft's attention. Now we wait to see whether anything will actually be fixed.

"They marked the threads we had on this as fixed shortly before closing the Connect bug report site for the preview programme, though the problem is hardly fixed," Jeremy Anderson says. "I'm hoping that this means a fix is on the way, but considering they deleted or marked as fixed all of the threads on this without comment, I'm not holding my breath. Seems low on the priority list for them."

Microsoft has since acknowledged "the community's feedback" in a very short message on the website, suggesting somewhat obliquely that the points put forward will be taken under "consideration for future releases" - a somewhat half-hearted response bearing in mind that in some cases the quality of service is being significantly impacted by bugs and resolution downgrades.

While the support for more media outlets on the Xbox 360 can only be a good thing, the apparent downgrade for homegrown video is a disappointment. In this respect the PS3 is more utilitarian, allowing for AVCHD content from HD camcorders to be burned to DVD and run with no issue on the console - something Xbox 360 could readily emulate but doesn't.

'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot dash-1
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot dash-3
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot dash-2
'What Went Wrong With The 360 Dashboard?' Screenshot dash-4

The new dashboard clearly repositions the Xbox 360 as more than just a games machine - its new feature-set is akin to the kind of functionality we expect from next-gen Smart TVs. A set-top box with an excellent games library is a compelling proposition for extending the console's lifecycle.

However, the acknowledged standard for homebrew HD video - h.264 video in the MKV container - remains unsupported on both consoles, despite being embraced by Smart TVs, standalone media streamers and even USB-equipped Blu-ray players. Microsoft and Sony will doubtless not wish to support pirate TV and movie downloads, but the MKV container is used by official DivX HD media precisely because it is the most versatile file format for HD video, offering support for subtitles and multiple video/audio streams; its usage for legitimate video will only grow. Its omission suggests that Microsoft would prefer to see us more as consumers of media rather than creators, and obviously it has no range of HD cameras it needs to support.

The new dashboard demonstrates that Microsoft's focus is on delivering more video content for 360 owners (apparently iPlayer is incoming at some point for UK users), while at the same time positioning Kinect as a meaningful media interface for the living room. In effect, Microsoft's strategy appears to be in repositioning the Xbox 360 to directly compete with the new wave of incoming internet-ready Smart TVs, particularly the long-awaited Apple display, apparently based on iOS with voice control powered by Siri - Steve Jobs' last great endeavor for the company before passing away last year.

We wouldn't be at all surprised to see Android make the transition across to the living room either. Perhaps next week's Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas will throw some more light on this, but the recent announcement that Samsung's Smart TV SDK now supports USB controllers suggests an interesting contest lies ahead: games consoles vs. games-capable, internet-ready TVs; two different delivery mechanisms each with their own strengths and weaknesses. Despite the bugs and downgrades, this is clearly a key area of focus for Microsoft, and with current-gen console prices set to fall still further, the holy grail of the 10-year life cycle may yet come to pass with the Xbox 360 and PS3 eventually transforming into set-top boxes with phenomenal games libraries.

Picture of Richard.

About Richard Leadbetter

Rich has been a games journalist since the days of 16-bit and specialises in technical analysis. Commonly known around Eurogamer as the Blacksmith of the Future.

Read more articles from Richard by visiting the Richard Leadbetter archive page.

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Comments (226) Latest comment 3 weeks ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • DDevil #1 2 months ago

    Ah, that's why I haven't noticed anything - I just use the Media extender. It is pretty strange for Microsoft to take a relatively large step back like this though.

  • darkcult #2 2 months ago

    I only use my 360 to play games, so this doesn't affect me.

  • HornsDino #3 2 months ago

    Microsoft are like Spinal Tap with the 360 - "hope you like our change of direction" - meanwhile the old fans who just want to play games on the thing find themselves shunted off into a ghetto.

  • peterfll #4 2 months ago

    I think the RGB bug also affects the HD DVD player. I noticed how washed out the picture seemed when I played The Polar Express for my god daughter just before Xmas. Blacks seem to be mushy grey. I know it's not exactly a mainstream device, but I would like to have seen the 360s HD DVD player included in these tests so it could have been verified.

  • DanWhitehead #5 2 months ago

    @HornsDino I would totally buy Kinect Jazz Odyssey though.

  • nickthegun #6 2 months ago

    To be honest, the video issue is the least of its problems. Its an absolutely horrendous update that has destroyed all previous usability in a stroke.

    I genuinely never thought I would prefer to use the XMB but the metro update is such a piece of shit, I tend to look for demos and buy XBLA games on XBL.com rather than use the crappy interface on the 360.

    Ugh....... its just terrible.

  • AceCardJones #7 2 months ago

    @nickthegun Agreed, one of the best things for me about using a 360 after only having a PS3 for a few years was the Dashboard, great accessibility, friends, party, chat and a marketplace at the touch of a few buttons. Now you've ads pushed in your face at every turn and the marketplace has been destroyed and we're expected to shift through the pieces to attempt to find something we want.

    I don't have Kinect, and never will, but Microsoft won't let me forget it exists either. Ads and Kinect is all I see with this new update. I have been on Gold Membership since I started playing Xbox and the only advertisements I want to see are for games, and only on the marketplace tab. Clearly there is nothing Microsoft won't do for revenue and it's getting a little bit tedious now...

  • 43n1m4 #8 2 months ago

    I use the Xbox360 as a gaming device, and will probably not use it for media playback as the console - at best - work as a noisy extender (noisy compared to the dedicated media center PC I've connected to the LCD screen in the living room)
    If Microsoft want me to use the Xbox360 for more than games, it would be nice to see some proper support for my country, recording of TV directly to a dedicated HDD (possibly over USB) and more.
    At the moment I have the nagging suspicion that those very issues are the ones MS is working to rectify in the coming month(s) and rolling out the Metro update was just to lay the groundwork. We'll see.

    Edit: On an unrelated note, after the Metro update, Batman Arkham City (installed to harddrive) sometimes fails to launch correctly. I just get a blank screen, and have to manually power off the console, and launch the game again... Very odd - an no, its not my drive failing, as games that runs directly from drive have no problems whatsover. There is no disputing that the last GUI update is the most buggy to date. Hopefully MS will sort it out later.
    Edited by 2 at 07/01/12 @ 13:28

  • Subdominator #9 2 months ago

    It's amazing how we're all denying the digital only future of consoles for at least the next gen when Microsoft is pretty much already there. They gave us our first fixes with XBLA, now they offer almost every retail game and movie you could possibly want. If they wanted to they could just transition to digital only in a matter of days. I wonder if they will test how far they can go with an early release of Halo 4 on Xbox Live Games on Demand (three days early or something like that). Remember, Microsoft was an early adopter for HD as well, the original Xbox was already capable of 720p (but only the NTSC models). There is of course the fact that half of all Xbox 360 ever sold have never been online. So a real digital only console would be pushing it. But what about two models? We have had the Arcade model and the Premium/Pro. They could try to release Xbox Loop (with a disk drive) for 399 and a digital version for 299.

  • nickthegun #10 2 months ago

    I dont necessarily mind adverts on the dash, its just when it cripples functionality. From the tab placement to the layout, its just unusable gash.

  • DDevil #11 2 months ago

    @AceCardJones What's the matter? Not a Spinal Tap fan?

  • Pinky_Floyd #12 2 months ago

    Borked! I'm not sure if that word says more about the writer or the target audience :)
    Edited by 1 at 07/01/12 @ 10:05

  • AceCardJones #13 2 months ago

    @Subdominator I can't see anyone choosing to back themselves into a corner by buying a digital only console. No renting, lending from/to friends, no second hand option. A lot of places, especially in my country, have piss poor broadband speeds. And as you mentioned a lot of the consoels sold have never been online. Nobody is debating a digital future is in the works, we just don't think it's as soon as the other side of the room think. And it doesn't mean we have to like it either.

    Microsoft are definitely at the helm where digital is concerned but their pricing is dismal. I'll never get a Games on Demand game as I can pick it up in a shop or online for 20-30euro cheaper.

  • lucky_jim #14 2 months ago

    I used to use my 360 for video playback quite a bit. I use it for that purpose less often since I got a PS3, but it's still annoying that they've made my console less well-featured than it was before the update. My main use for it was for video files that were over the FAT32 file limit, which as you can probably imagine, meant high-quality video: I have a 32gb USB key formatted in HFS+ specifically for this purpose.

    In fact, it reminds me a bit of the Sony "other OS" thingy (even though I was never likely to use that, unlike the 360's video playback). What other features do platform holders think they can take away from machines we've bought with them included?

  • StooMonster #15 2 months ago

    The good news is that - as far as we have been able to discern - gameplay is unaffected by the new update, despite many reports to the contrary.

    Interesting. Have you tried all the different colourspace combinations?

  • Bullet_Tunnel #16 2 months ago

    The problem with the dashboard update, in reality, is that it was designed with the logic that only marketing people can understand. lots of money is spent on creating something that we apparently want, when in truth its shoved on us and we are TOLD its what we want, how many times in interviews with pr dickheads do you hear, "what he consumer wants.. blah..., we realy listen to see what the consumer needs.. blah..", translation.. "we have an idea we want to use, we are going to tell you what you want in order for our ideas to be realised" end result is an xbox dashboard that may as well be a fucking billboard at a bus stop, because in a desperate attempt to syphon more of our slavey/soul tokens out of our pockets, they want to emulate wii's success with grannys and bored housewives. screw the video playback issue, i want a videogame system that plays games, i didnt buy a pc because i dont like instaling, component tweaking and im tech-lexic (?!? lol), i didnt get a ps3 because when at a mates we had to wait half an hour to install mgs4, f.u.c.k.t.h.a.t.r.i.g.h.t.o.f.f... luckily i play games enough not to stare at the dashboard, so ive not rushed out and got kinect yet like a mindless zombie, unaware that a couple of million pounds of pschoanylists and marketing dolars helped make my decision. baaahhh... mooo....

  • Windypops #17 2 months ago

    A decent editor should take a cattle prod to any writer who uses the term "going forward".

  • suicida #18 2 months ago

    @nickthegun: totally agree, the new dashboard is a massive step backwards. I haven't bought a single piece of content since it came out because browsing the market is now such a chore.

    All that wasted space around the edge of the screen makes me cringe, and what space is used is full of ads now. What a mess.

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #19 2 months ago

    We wouldn't be at all surprised to see Android make the transition across to the living room either.

    Don't be ridiculous, such a thing will never happen.

  • Daddy-Doom-Bar #20 2 months ago

    I was frickin annoyed they deleted my threads/feedback which stated this, glad somebody is listening. Its galling that they gave us the preview in order to test stuff out and find bugs and problems, but refuse to listen when we pick them up on attempting to bork what we want to do with the machine. Sony started a massive war with people by taking the support for other OS's out of the PS3. Now MS is trying to do the same sort of thing. The problems Sony had should be a warning to MS not to mess with homebrew.

  • TheReverendSlim #21 2 months ago

    @43n1m4 Batman: Arkham City failing to launch was reported during the preview program. Microsoft marked it as External, meaning they think Rocksteady Games is the one who has to fix that problem. Funny... It didn't happen under the old dash.

  • cloudskipa #22 2 months ago

    Good thing I use my 360 for games then isn't it.

  • Pacmaninov #23 2 months ago

    @43n1m4
    That Arkham City bug is the one I get as well, seriously annoying!

    The new dash suxorz, I miss the clunky original dash

  • djm99 #24 2 months ago

    Only use my 360 to play games also, but i do have a problem finding games add-ons and demos now, it's a complete mess.

  • cloudskipa #25 2 months ago

    @djm99 You have a problem with that seriously?

    I'm guessing you have problems with other things too such as reading and cognitive learning?

  • Freakachuu #26 2 months ago

    I have migrated from the 360 back to PC now. Got fed up with adverts pushed in my face constantly and as a "core" gamer (whatever the fuck that means) being put on the sidelines. For me the Xbox when it first started out was great. There was a real emphasis on building a community with the people that bought the games. Now I feel like every single add on or update is taking Microsoft away from the very people that they courted in the first place.

    I certainly know that my feelings on early adoption of the next wave of consoles have been dampened significantly. I was itching for their release a year or two back but now quite honestly, having seen the direction console gaming is heading, I have lost a lot of my interest. Instead I spend money that would be going towards a new console on increasing my steam collection.

    I think I've had my fill with being dictated to on a closed platform where a company can change the software specs of a machine seemingly at will. No thanks to that.

  • mossychops001 #27 2 months ago

    looking forward to windows 8 Xbots? its just as crap.

  • metallicorphan #28 2 months ago



    found this on the net,and i can see why people are upset from the adverts,i myself just avoid it all and just go straight to my game most times

  • djm99 #29 2 months ago

    @cloudskipa and you have issues with people that do?

  • cloudskipa #30 2 months ago

    @Freakachuu So all that crap, the very things you hate, mean more than the games themselves? How does any of what you just moaned about there affect the actual games being released?

    Seriously some people take this shit too serious. Just because of a few ads the size of a thumbnail is no reason to go back to the PC for gaming, especially when the PC by it's very nature is the biggest multimedia/social networking tool out of all machines.

    I do agree though that the multimedia/social networking thing is being pushed hard but then there is Nintendo, you forgot to mention them. They seem to be the only console manufacturer concerned with games, but hey everyone jumped ship years ago because the Wii didn't offer HD gfx or crappy "hardcore" gunkill games. Funny how these things turn out isn't it!!...

    Nintendo fans are laughing mate.

  • ubergine #31 2 months ago

    Please keep up the deserved bad publicity for M$ over this. They actually acted on the hacking thing (a bit) after every newssite picked up the story. They shouldnt be allowed to walk away from this very deliberate and unnecessary downgrade for all xboxes.

  • cloudskipa #32 2 months ago

    @metallicorphan What a horribly skewed comparison of both dashboards. I see that the 'NXE' picture has already scrolled past the ad-infested home tabs and conveniently onto the games tab, yet with the 'Metro' picture it is sitting on the home page.

    NXE had plenty of ads too let's not forget. Besides the actual ads are tiny and easy avoided, the other stuff is actual dashboard content, you know... things like letting us all know what new content is available, that is an "ad" in the loosest sense of the word yet people moan about them too! If they weren't there people would also moan that the new dash is horrible because there's no way of finding out what's new!

    MS cannot win sometimes, far too many grumpy old farts ready to pick holes in everything.

  • RoOhDaMite #33 2 months ago

    Another problem I want them to fix concerning their zune player:

    When you log in with a new account for the first time you are able to test your connection for 1080p streaming support, however once you did that there is no way to test it again ahead of renting a movie.
    Edited by 2 at 07/01/12 @ 12:38

  • TheReverendSlim #34 2 months ago

    User msgohan over at AVSForum has done some good work with histograms of a pre-rendered video that shows how white is actually being compressed more than black levels under the new dashboard. It also shows that none of the reference level settings are correct. Check them out here. Definitely confirms what Digital Foundry's original article showed.

  • Azazel #35 2 months ago

    Good article, however -1 bingo point for use of the phrase "going forward".

  • Zerobob #36 2 months ago

    So let me get this straight, to make my 360 a more credible "media hub" Microsoft saw fit to break the colour levels, block 1080p output for all but their own video content, make the user interface harder to use and bloat it with unwanted adverts.

    Who the hell do you have working for you Microsoft? Why did the dashboard need any updates at all over the last few years?! This is fucking beyond belief.

  • SylarsStubble #37 2 months ago

    "... leaving Microsoft's host service with a clear quality advantage."

    Apparently Microsoft is still fond of its own anti-competitive tactics, if this turns out to be true.

  • Subdominator #38 2 months ago

    @metallicorphan Nice picture, however totally wrong. With the NXE dashboard we didn't boot to the My Xbox tab with the game stuff. We booted to the "Spotlight" tab, a tab that showed nothing but ads and we had to move one tab up to actually be able to boot the game. So in that case Metro is actually an improvement.

  • Syrette #39 2 months ago

    @Subdominator

    Exactly. Not sure why he's chosen to ignore that rather significant fact.

    I don't have a problem with the new dash for what it's worth. I've always only used the Xbox Guide anyway. I don't know why those who complain about the new dash don't just do the same.

  • Syrette #40 2 months ago

    @Freakachuu

    Don't use the dash then!

    I can't empathise with you at all on that one. It's a dashboard. Do you spend most of your time on your PC playing around with your desktop? No? Then why do you care so much about the dash?

    I'm not saying criticisms of the dash aren't justified but to quit a console because you don't like some of the changes they've made to an area of the console you're not supposed to spend any real time on anyway?

    They haven't taken anything away from the console, aside from perhaps this 1080p issue. They've added plenty to it.

  • Syrette #41 2 months ago

    Honestly the hysteria the new dash has created reminds me a little of the hysteria that followed this site's redesign.

    The content is still there, they're still very much usable, and you'll likely get used to it in little time.

    I don't understand why people take these things so seriously, but to each their own.

  • rotmm #42 2 months ago

    Great article and as always it's good to see Leadbetter going the extra mile when issues like these are highlighted.

    TBH I never noticed the 720p downscaling as I don't use the 360 for streaming personal videos, but the washed-out look of online content via outlets such as Lovefilm, YT, etc. is all too apparent and needs to be fixed.

    Hopefully pieces like this will force MS to stop sticking their fingers in their ears going "la la la".

    Well done!

  • Sunyavadin #43 2 months ago

    An easier question is "What went RIGHT with it?"

  • cloudskipa #44 2 months ago

    @rotmm LoveFilm isn't even HD so there's nothing that needs to be addressed there. FTR I've found the 1080p upscaling on SD content from LoveFilm to be fantastic.

  • TooOldToGame #45 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 10:45:50 22-02-2012

  • Sunyavadin #46 2 months ago

    Although, I may be getting used to it. I keep getting stuck trying to find the "Dancing girl in a green hoodie" button when I'm bowsing steam for new games. It's *soooooooooooo* confusing having to click on a button labelled "Genre"

    </sarcasm>

  • The-Jack-Burton #47 2 months ago

    All the new dashboard did was drive me back to my PS3. And I also made sure my gold membership won't auto renew. It's like a giant, stinky, wet blanket got thrown on my 360.

    Hopefully the WiiU will be a sufficient replacement.

  • Darksjeik #48 2 months ago

    If only more people would realize how accesible PC gaming is these days

  • JayKwon #49 2 months ago

    I do NOT like the new dashboard at all. Just wanted to say that here again. The console should be about games, not al this other bullshit crap.

  • Badassbab #50 2 months ago

    The Metro interface has some other problems too besides the borked video playback. Eveything just seems to be slower and more buggy. Just trying to certain things is a pain and watching an already downloaded game video takes about 5 minutes now. At least the issues sound easy enough to sort out.

  • FluffyTucker #51 2 months ago

    Comparing the 360 vs my gen3 WDTV as a media center is an absolute joke, I won't begin to type out the reasons the 360 is useless for video playback as it would take up half of the comments thread.

  • Seabeast #52 2 months ago

    It's terrible. The update should'a been optional for people that have kinect. They already get a ton of money from us for using the service yet now I have to put up with 5 adverts per screen?

    I've actually found myself playing my PS3 more lately, at least I don't have to deal with what feels like pop up window spam when trying to play on my console.

  • Keivz #53 2 months ago

    I just got a 360 recently and never used the old dash. I will say I will never get xbox live gold (for multiplayer/netflix etc) because the PS3 & PC offer that stuff for free. And make no mistake, the video player on the 360 is absolute trash with its extremely limited format playback and choppy/poor video quality. Also, why is it so hard to put media on the 360 hdd? I really don't see the point of having a sizeable HDD if you can't use it for media.

    I'll stick with my PS3 for media related stuff thank you.
    Edited by 1 at 08/01/12 @ 07:34

  • Atolm #54 2 months ago

    @cloudskipa Seriously, dude, weren't you breast fed as a child? You ignorant fuck! You cannot dispute with evidence nor dismiss the issues at hand here.

    The black reference issue is widespread on all consoles with this Metro Dashboard.

    While it doesn't matter to you it does matter to everyone else who cares enough to be concerned over this. Why? Well you shitfuck, it wasn't broken before, so why should it be broken in this new Dashboard?

    So show them so respect, no? And shut your pie hole or go and suck something befitting it because you're not making a compelling case with your desperate attempts of being overly defensive and an elitist for a corporation that cares fuck all about you.

    Shit head!

  • Syrette #55 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 15:07:04 07-01-2012

  • Atolm #56 2 months ago

    @TheReverendSlim: that's some awesome work there by that chap on the AVS Forums.

    I hope to hell and back that this article is more widespread this time around that even the freeloader sites such as Joystiq -- who receive more than their share of Microsoft incentives -- will have to publish a link to it.

  • Freakachuu #57 2 months ago

    @cloudskipa Actually it's more that I find the games have stagnated as the focus moves onto social media, casual gaming and other marketing buzzwords of the moment. There wasn't a single full price Xbox release (other than Dark Souls, which was multiplatform anyway) last year that I can think of that I was interested in, that I couldn't run better on my PC. But not only that, I can't see anything in the Xbox exclusive line up that really makes me interested.

    The focus has drifted away from people like me I feel and while that certainly is Microsofts perogative, it's people like me that tend to be early adopters of new tech, with the word of mouth that comes with it.

    Not only that but to try to make your console the focal point of the living room, only to (knowingly it would seem) cripple anything other than your own stores media are not the kind of practices that I will knowingly support. It's underhand and the removing of features that were in the console when it was bought is a very shady practice in my opinion.

  • lucky_jim #58 2 months ago

    @Syrette
    I've found myself using the 360 less since the update, simply because the vast majority of my 360 games catalogue consists of download titles and these are a pain in the arse to access now. The other main use for my 360 was for hi-def video, and they've buggered that too. In third place, for me, comes boxed retail games.

    Overall Atolm's right, although I wouldn't put it in that tone myself. I bought a product which worked fine for my purposes, Microsoft have made it work less well than it used to, just so they can pump more ads at me. I think people have a right to be angry about that.

  • Atolm #59 2 months ago

    @Syrette: Dude, let me level it with you. Asking that is like asking why you're so quick to being such a dick on this subject.

    If you keep saying, to each and their own, why not just let it be, dick?

  • Bogie19th #60 2 months ago

    Microsoft has already posted that they are addressing this in an update. Not a big deal.
    Edited by 1 at 07/01/12 @ 15:02

  • Syrette #61 2 months ago

    @Atolm

    It's called questioning someone whilst still appreciating their right to their opinion. Apologies if that offends you.

  • levitate #62 2 months ago

    I think Microsoft took their direction towards Nintendo Wii's atrocious GUI a step too far...

  • RedRain #63 2 months ago

    While this is annoying i find that being a paying gold member and seeing adverts all over the dash alot more annoying

  • Syrette #64 2 months ago

    @lucky_jim

    All fair enough, in my opinion. I don't argue that it's flawed. You shouldn't have to "get used to something" if it's possible to make it easy to understand (and access things easily) immediately. Took me a while to work out where stuff is, too.

  • Syrette #65 2 months ago

    @RedRain

    A problem that has been there in one form or another since day one to be fair.

    NXE forced the Spotlight channel on you as he first thing you saw, so Metro has improved on that.

  • StooMonster #66 2 months ago

    @Bogie19th Microsoft has already posted that they are addressing this in an update.

    Have you got a link?

  • Atolm #67 2 months ago

    @Syrette: Dude, you can coat that all you like, but your many questions are asked so you can be on the contrary.

  • TheReverendSlim #68 2 months ago

    @Bogie19th No, they haven't. Not once. The closest we got to acknowledgement was: "[W]e definitely saw the community’s feedback and we will take both into consideration for future releases." And that was just for the video level issue, not the downscaling (which may well be by design).

    The problem here is that they had over 20 threads on these issues and did NOT respond that it will be fixed in a future update. Not once. And they deleted all the threads about it to boot.

  • threemoh #69 2 months ago

    When they've done all this, could they work on fixing all the video apps being slow and unresponsive?

  • BritishBlue1 #70 2 months ago

    Why are people having a go at Richard about his use of Going and Forward? At least they're actual words.

    I find his journalistic use of Borked and Nerfed far more irritating... :)

  • Amistat #71 2 months ago

    All the people saying it does't effect them, they only use their games console for gaming, well surprise! Games have colours washed out too... Feel free to get off your high horses and start paying attention. Yes I use my console for gaming too but that doesn't mean I can't be disgusted at what's going on.

    This isn't a bunch of idiots simply moaning for the sake of it on the internet, these complaints are fully justified and unless there is some sport of public outcry nothing will change. So if you want your games to look decent again I suggest you stop just trying to be "cool" and apathetic and actually read some of these articles to see just how you're getting screwed like the rest of us...

  • GTFRoundsdown #72 2 months ago

    Well done MS, the advertising really pee's me off would rather pay a fiver more to gold than have it in my games console face!Use the blades as much as poss rather than metro, all that time and money and this is the best you came up with? If the situation does not improve MAY consider PS3. That would be a sad day. :rolleyes:

  • FuzzyDuck #73 2 months ago

    Don't own a 360 myself, but used to play a good bit on a mate's console way back when. Could they not have just stuck with the Blades?

    They were colourful, intuitive and worked a treat.

  • cowell #74 2 months ago

    Perhaps I have no appreciation of this kind of thing but Sky Player and 4OD video quality seems more than decent enough to me

  • dr_faulk #75 2 months ago

    I - quite literally - have not bothered moving the stick left or right of 'Play Skyrim' since the upgrade.

    Zero interest in using the Xbox as a media centre; PS3 far out-classes it in that sense.

  • Atolm #76 2 months ago

    @Amistat Well said, my friend. I guess fanboyism goes much deeper than I thought.

    Being on the contrary is what gets them off, yet at the same time their total disregard to this issue and ignorance is both bewildering and amusing.

  • TazerFan #77 2 months ago

    I haven't played any videos on my 360, ever (I use the PS3 because it looks and behaves more like a DVD player when I have girls or friends over, and, obviously, Blu-Ray capability).

    So I actually quite like the update. I still think the rabble over "all the adverts" is complete insanity as I have yet to even notice an ad.

    Edit- Negs, huh? Curious as to why.
    Edited by 1 at 07/01/12 @ 17:56

  • thes #78 2 months ago

    I have broadband which is so rubbish I can't stream content, and my TV is only 720p, anyway - so a lot of this doesn't affect me. My biggest problem here is that we have paid for a device, AND for a service (Gold membership), and Microsoft seem happy to really mess with the quality of the product at any time they want.

    I'm sure we've all signed away our rights somewhere down in the T&Cs, but it really just isn't right. I mean, if they just _removed_ all media playback capabilities tomorrow, would we have any grounds to complain?

  • IvorB #79 2 months ago

    Well sorry, 360 gamers. Looks like the honeymoon with Microsoft is over. They've got their numbers now and their true colours are slowly being revealed. Amid all talk of this I struggle to find news of the great new exclusive games they have coming out. What do they have lined up for their gamer audience to play?

    Interesting reading this article that starts out as pretty firm criticism of MS metro screw up but seems to lose heart halfway through. Goes into general discussion of MKV format which handily allows a criticism of PS3 in there. Then, unbelievably, ends on an uplifting piece on the future of media consumption in the living room and MS new "positioning" along with a rush of positives. So never mind some of the horrible things that are the subject of this article; isn't it wonderful what MS has planned for our living rooms? Nevermind that we've just told you it's all broken. Ha ha! Laughably transparent, guess subtlety is not Richard's strong suit. Keep flying the MS flag, bro.

  • Atolm #80 2 months ago

    @IvorB: Regardless of Richard's subtlety or not, you have to give him credit where it's due.

    He not only brought this to the public's attention, but he's now done that twice.

    No other site has tested the scenarios that plague this issue in the slightest. However, in saying all that though, this really needs to be brought to the attention of the higher ups at Microsoft, and perhaps Richard has more sway in that field than a mob of outcries lamenting their disgust with this problem.

    In saying the above, I would have loved it if he wrote a formal letter to Microsoft regarding this issue, instead of just reporting it.

    Still, and nevertheless, I really dig what he's done, and for that I am thankful.

    Much appreciated, Richard, I know your hands are tied, buddy. ;)

  • Atolm #81 2 months ago

    @Bogie19th: Oh boy. Dude, you must really love being on your knees as soon as those fat executives from Microsoft come unzipping, hey?

    Well, suck on, suck on.

  • RodHull #82 2 months ago

    I only tend to use the MCE on my 360 so haven't noticed any video issues as yet, but the quality of DVD playback on the 360 has always been rather poor, regardless of dashboard version. Back when the 360 was released I thought there was a problem with the fancy new HD telly I'd bought until I hooked up the original Xbox (which had superb DVD quality) and realised it was my "next gen" console that was the issue.

    If they've borked the Zune video up then this is a crying sha,e as the 1080p streaming playback used to be excellent. Silly Microsoft!

  • Inmediasress #83 2 months ago

    I'm guessign making it an advertising board was the greatest failure.

  • riseer #84 2 months ago

    @Subdominator Theirs no way digital download is ready.Not everyone can have a fast connection,right now it's their for people to choose it if they wish.Their are alot of people that want to buy physical media their are so many things that have to catch up with DD.Nextgen console's will have physical media, as every past console's had to use.

  • andywilkie35 #85 2 months ago

    Wish the update was optional, because it's fucking dreadful.

  • dsmx #86 2 months ago

    Part of me sees why they are doing this but the xbox is known as a games console and most people up till now have bought it primarily for this reason. Which should mean that any update it gets should focus entirely on making the process of finding and playing games an easier, faster and more pleasant experience. Any other feature it gets should be a secondary consideration and treated as such in the interface design.

    This update fails on that count in almost every way imaginable and people are very right to complain about this, Microsoft have gone about this update in totally the wrong way with a total lack of communication on why this update was needed, why things were being changed and to top it all off the beta was totally pointless as they appear of ignored everything that the beta testers complained about.


    I'm struggling to see why Microsoft appear to be doing their best to alienate all the people who've bought the xbox up till now, but what do I know, I'm not in marketing.

  • riseer #87 2 months ago

    @metallicorphan Lol yea avoid the marketplace and it's fine.

  • asho #88 2 months ago

    iv said it before, Microsoft are wankers!

  • TheRealBadabing #89 2 months ago

    My Kinect Box in the living room has become almost useless after this update.

    Before, I could confidently let the missus set up any of the Kinect Fun Labs stuff for our daughter yet now it is not only buried beneath a ton of menus but also not recognised as installed until we try to download it again. That's Kinect Fun Labs. For Kinect. Which MS are trying to whore out with the new dashboard.

    Nothing ever shows up under quick play either so what was once a simple, family fun experience is now preceded by daddy swearing at the TV for 5 minutes before we can start.

    That XBox is also used as a media player to stream content over our network. Great.

  • TheReverendSlim #90 2 months ago

    @RodHull MCE actually has some minor high-frequency banding issues that were introduced with the new dashboard. If you play the test pattern that Richard used above (search for "AVS 709" to find links to download it in M4V format and for your Blu-ray player) in MCE, you can see it in the single-pixel checkerboard portion. That same package also has fullscreen single and double-pixel checkerboards to test resolution, and MCE does some very bizarre off-colored banding with those tests now, whereas they didn't in NXE. You really have to wonder what went so wrong with video output on the new dashboard for it to have issues across every playback option.

  • Syrette #91 2 months ago

    @TheRealBadabing

    No, you don't have to download it every time. You need to go to My Apps or something along those lines. Or it should be be Latest Downloads if you're looking for it via Quickplay. All my apps are accessible easily there.

    MS need to sort this out and put some code in that can tell whether you have the app already downloaded or not, and open it for you if you click on the icon. If I see Sky on the Video channel then I should be able to just click it and watch instead of going through another sub-menu or using Quickplay.

    Basically they're all Marketplace hotlinks as it were, and don't specify this.

  • mr_pink #92 2 months ago

    You used the words 'going forward' and I had to stop reading I'm afraid.

  • Syrette #93 2 months ago

    @IvorB

    You're really accusing him of 360 bias? Wow. Just... wow.

  • hahayou #94 2 months ago

    Wow. Scandalous.

    I wonder if it means the next Xbox is sooner than we think - Microsoft could be going the EA route of breaking the old version to push the new one. Locking the 360 to 720p when the next box will undoubtedly be promoted as a 1080p machine sounds like a plausible marketing strategy (i.e. unethical and manipulative).

  • TheRealBadabing #95 2 months ago

    @Syrette Nope, doesn't appear in My Apps even after forcing another download and quickplay won't work either. I have to go to marketplace, find Fun Labs, hit download and only then does the "Play" button appear. Not a one off, this has been happening since the update and still has not fixed itself in any way.

    In fact, none of the games recently played or downloaded appear under quickplay.

  • IvorB #96 2 months ago

    @Atolm
    Fair enough. Certainly I have not read about this anywhere else. So good job, Richard.

  • DaemonSpawn #97 2 months ago

    After this update I've stopped visiting xbl marketplace at all - it's the same convoluted crap as playstation store now, except for it's not free.

    Crippled hd video playback is the least of my problems - new dashboard is simply difficult to navigate, even with kinect (which I have, sadly).

    The only things that make me turn on my xbox 360 now are its wireless controller and Halo Reach. Judging by the speed with which Microsoft eliminated its other advantages over Sony (like dashboard and xbl marketplace), xbox gamepad may as well become the next victim:D
    And Bungie are with Activsion, Epic making something not MS-exclusive too, so all hail multiplatform! Specifically, PS4-or-something platform, as that's going to be my next console.

  • IvorB #98 2 months ago

    @Syrette
    I believe that's what I wrote. But I see my powers of textual analysis have amazed you. Just breathe... :-)

  • TooOldToGame #99 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 10:45:50 22-02-2012

  • norsende #100 2 months ago

    Worst UI ever. I could honestly pay a new Xbox's worth of money to get one with the original blades UI.

  • Amistat #101 2 months ago

    What's also sad is that microsoft have actually been doing well in regards to gaining gamer support, sure there've been a few stumbling blocks but I've been happy with the service up until now. Considering the next generation is apparently imminent this will likely be the last dashboard we get and this the one that will sick.

    As much business sense as it makes to pump out pages and pages of adverts for the cash, in this case I think they would have been better to take the hit and go out on a bang; make something that will be remembered as being great, as it stands the xbox is going to leave a nasty taste in gamers mouths.

    How long after the next box comes out are the xbox 360 advert servers going to be turned off? Who's going to pay for advert space on a dead console? This means the cash gained from the metro crap is going to be very short term, however the bad press and gamer disgust will live on far longer.

    They're trying to push these two versions of the next xbox apparently, one for gamers and one for casuals. Can't anyone at microsoft see what a bloody stupid idea this is? If it has the word xbox in its name it will be associated with geeks and no house wife or 70 year old is going to go anywhere near it.
    Leave the xbox to the gamers microsoft, we're your user base and always will be, get over it and stop treating us like crap.

  • AnotherIdiot #102 2 months ago

    They were looking for bug reports from beta testers, not feature suggestions or what you think of the design, they have their own highly paid designers and testing process and design philosophy, not be undermined by a few whining teenagers who cry at the first feel of unfamiliarity. Otherwise they may aswell stop designing anything and just open it all to the public as democractic process, i can tell you the result of that would be a piece of shit 10 times worse than anyone can imagine.

  • TooOldToGame #103 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 10:45:50 22-02-2012

  • jefranklin18 #104 2 months ago

    @AnotherIdiot Actually typical modus-operandi for Microsoft development projects is to gain user feedback around prospective UI designs. The MS offices outside Reading would often host such events for invited participants.

  • AnotherIdiot #105 2 months ago

    @TooOldToGame You didn't buy a product with this dashbaord, you bought the old design (which they got rid of). The people who purchased a new Xbox at christmase, they voted with their wallet for the new dashboard, that means it is good.

  • dsmx #106 2 months ago

    In the end what went wrong with this update is Microsoft didn't listen to it's existing users.

    They had a beta, users provided feedback and Microsoft chose to ignore it. Which can only mean this dash update wasn't for it's existing userbase, what conclusions you draw from that I leave up to you.

  • Oskool #107 2 months ago

    I used to love watching MSNBC news on the old dashboard. I tried watching it on the new dashboard and was bombarded with 30 second commercials after every news video.
    .
    Press play... 30 second commercial
    Press fast forward... 30 second commercial
    Press stop... 30 second commercial
    .
    I don't watch MSNBC anymore. Or anything else on Xbox Live for that matter.
    .
    Pretty soon we'll have to watch a 30 second commercial before we can launch our games.

  • TooOldToGame #108 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 10:45:50 22-02-2012

  • bliprunner #109 2 months ago

    I have a feeling that the next xbox might be the 'Windows xBox 3, Tanking Like Our Phone Edition'.

  • moggsy #110 2 months ago

    The new dash is a mess.

    Can anyone tell me why MS insist on regularly chucking whole designs in the bin and starting from scratch all the time? They do it with there OS too with very mixed results. Every other OS release is a disaster and they seem to have now decided to do this with the 360 dash.

    There seems to be a cycle of rewrite - sort out the mess - rewrite - sort out the mess etc. Windows XP was great - Vista shite - Windows 7 decent - Windows 8 looking like a steaming turd (although I've yet to experience it).

    No other company I can recall does this. Apple's OS, for example, always builds on the previous release rather than starting from scratch for no good reason.

    Sort it out MS!

  • Quixz #111 2 months ago

    I don't see limiting the competition to 720p as a problem, but the washed out colours are a BIG problem! I use TVersity with the Dashboard player.

  • Retroid #112 2 months ago

    The new dash is too busy trying to sell you things they want you to buy rather than letting you get to the things you actually want to buy / already own.

    It's maddening. It stinks of the money men sticking their oar in to the whole design.

    Why can't each section have quick access to what you already own & a Marketplace link?

    I know how to get to things like demos and videos but they're not intuitive to casual browsing - which I thought was touted as one of the major advantages to this redesign.

  • SpaceMonkey77 #113 2 months ago

    Problem I find is that MS, upon the success of 360 and Live, feel the need to tweak their box at every turn, mostly with the dashboard, when in truth the last version was fine, IMO.

    Sure, none of us Live Gold suscribers asked for this update, but MS in their infinite wisdom had already ventured forth elsewhere, lured by the twinkle of gold in tv companies pockets, and frankly, this update is them selling out. Live is more about tv/movie content now, because those companies will sell their mother to get in front of us gamers, who have hargely abandoned the bullshit that is most tv these days. Little do they know that we might check out their tv stuff, if they stopped making bullshit tv, and let us cherry pick our channels, instead of the package crap.

    Our games command our attention, but MS need to check themselves, when I can't find XBLA games that have come out, or a dose of machinima. For if MS are to be bought like this, its a real slap in the face of our good will and money we pay.

    Why couldn't those cubes all be the same size? Because media monkeys paid top dollar to have bigger cube exposure, I guess. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against extra content on Live, but when it seem to take the crown from a games service, its really insulting.

    For the future, I want MS to do some freaking research of its users. ASK US, FF SAKE? How about some prompts. 'THIS UPDATE WILL DO THE FOLLOWING TO YOUR 360, IF YOU WISH TO UPDATE, CLICK YES, OR IF YOU WISH TO OPT OUT OF IT, PLEASE CLICK NO AND CONTINUE'. This would have done and meant the world to us, but it seems we don't matter anymore.

    As for that Zune video colour problem, perhaps that's a result of their meddling too much.

  • BlinkeredAxis #114 2 months ago

    The excellent clarity of the old dash was a selling point for MS. The PS3 was the poor relation with its tiny-font, hard to traverse messiness. MS shouldn't have used that as a thing to emulate! Next thing to fuck up is to introduce mandatory 30-minute installs for games, and allow patches to do the same. You end up with the disadvantages of PS3, with none of the advantages.

    Crazy.

  • kentmonkey #115 2 months ago

    Was the 360 update done by the same devs as the EG one?

  • TheReverendSlim #116 2 months ago

    @AnotherIdiot The bug reports we're talking about here are not suggestions or things that people don't like about the new UI. I, for one, actually quite like the new dashboard itself, and I think it's the best compromise they could come up with for both controller and Kinect functionality without them being separate experiences. It's just an interface and ultimately, so long as I can still get to my content and it works correctly, I'm good.

    However, the improper video levels and downscaling are bugs, plain and simple. They should not have released the dashboard without fixing these two problems. Now, I could even cut them some slack if they fixed the downscaling issue later... but the video levels are glaringly obvious and make all video played on the system look washed out. Considering that video range conversion is basically done by math in the codec (something MS is very familiar with, considering they do it in Windows Media Player in all their operating systems), this can't be that damn hard for them to fix. And since it affects video from all of their new app partners, you would think it would be a priority.

  • cloudskipa #117 2 months ago

    Wow some of you guys sure love sucking on Sony's cock eh? :lol:

  • TooOldToGame #118 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 10:45:50 22-02-2012

  • dsmx #119 2 months ago

    The weird people that like this update for whatever reason I ask this simple question: How has this update made playing games, finding new games and gaming generally on the xbox any better than it was before?
    Edited by 1 at 08/01/12 @ 00:53

  • Syrette #120 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 01:30:28 08-01-2012

  • legalaffairs #121 2 months ago

    @nickthegun so true... It's a trainwreck of an interface. I'd have preferred to go back to the tabbed interface rather than this one. I used to really enjoy using the XBL interface, but this ones just feels messy.

  • Dangher #122 2 months ago

    Oh. My. God. People with no life complaining about the platform of their no-life. Aaaaand in other news... Don't give a shait, since DLNA is the way.

    P.S. Neg all you like. Metro is the best thing to happen to interfaces (although, I admit, they should have introduced that in the next box)

  • Dangher #123 2 months ago

    @Oskool That is what TVs are for. Actually. I thought Xbox is a GAME console, not an STB.

  • Sar #124 2 months ago

    I hate hate hate the new interface. A lot of junk, adverts and needless shite getting in the way of doing the one thing the console was actually BOUGHT for: Games.

    If MS think I'm going to buy their next console they have another thing coming, certainly not if they continue trying so cringingly hard to be a "mainstream living room family media centre".

  • Atolm #125 2 months ago

    @Dangher: You fucking twat, try telling that to Microsoft because they clearly do not see the Xbox as just a gaming console.

    The thing is, this issue was never broken on the old dashboard, so it stands to reason that it should NOT be broken on this Metro dash, right? But fact is, it is broken.

    You being dismissive of this doesn't change the facts from black and white to grey.

    This is a bug that should not have made it into the dash, and if it did, it should have been fixed by now, but it hasn't, hence this article.

    The notion of morons like you using it as a gaming console is void, seeing as how Microsoft -- the very teats you sucklings are so desperate to side with -- are seeing it as something far more than just a GAMING console.

    You sound like an ignorant fuck the way you carry on, moron. So stop it, and show a little respect to those the issue affects and concerns, like the very good folks who actually paid for Netflix and other video services which this bug affects, by crippling their viewing experience.

    Get that through your thick head, you fucking twat!

  • ShiroBen #126 2 months ago

    It's got far worse problems than poor video playback. Far worse.

  • MrBeast #127 2 months ago

    The ads don't bother me that much, the thing I dislike about Metro is that everything seems to be buried. Pretty much anything I use it for takes more button presses than it used to - streaming video, accessing the Friends List (apart from three people, for no apparent reason), and trying to find anything on the Marketplace. The marketplace is ruined - I used to spend quite a bit of cash on Xbox Live, but I can't see that happening any more.

  • richyroo #128 2 months ago

    My Live subscription ran out on the 27th December, and I havent renewed purely because of this appauling update and the general direction MS are heading.

    I have been a loyal xbox fan for 7 years, but like Nintendo and the Wii, they have now lost my custom. It only seems that Sony at present care about the games and gamers.

  • TooOldToGame #129 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 10:45:50 22-02-2012

  • arty #130 2 months ago

    Who cares about video quality. The real issue is that they've crammed a UI for a TOUCH SCREEN DEVICE onto a JOYPAD and IT DOES NOT WORK!

  • Syrette #131 2 months ago

    @MrBeast

    Why would it stop you from using the Marketplace? Surely if you know what you want then you can just find it (which is easy if you know where to look)? Or do you buy on impulse when looking on the Marketplace?

    Just wondering.

  • dr_faulk #132 2 months ago

    @IvorB Actually, I think he wrote about the Xbox being set as a set-top box exactly to highlight the severity of the issue, and giving the article a greater context.

  • Atolm #133 2 months ago

    @TooOldToGame: You tell it like it is, my friend.

    The angry lesbian in me is tired of these hapless individuals who care so much about a corporation that cares very little about them in return.

    Yet, these individuals are so willing to defend a corporation such as Microsoft with their ill-sought ignorance that it hurts me to think and wonder how they manage to go about their everyday life without falling or sitting on the right end.

  • northlondon01 #134 2 months ago

    I like the actual movement of the new design, it's not as laggy as NXE for me, but what they have put in the actual tiles of it is just crazy - pushing games back further and further, and the only layout improvement I can see is being able to play the game straight away from the first 'page' of the dash. I do find myself using the Xbox button to navigate more now...

    None of this surprises me though. I did a testing thing for a certain prominent MS owned VOIP service (NDA be damned!!) and it was exactly the same. Everything that I thought was missing from their potentially new homepage existed on their current homepage, and was totally buried on the design I was testing. And when I asked the person why they are looking to change it, they said "To make it more tablet like". But this wasn't an app for a tablet, it was their main PC homepage!

    I don't have a clue what MS's strategy is though. They don't do media as well as the PS3, accessible stuff as well as Nintendo or games as well as either of them, at least not any more.

  • Syrette #135 2 months ago

    @Atolm

    Have a cup of tea and relax. It's the internet, people are going to say things you don't agree with.

  • Atolm #136 2 months ago

    @Syrette: Relaxed I am, tolerant of this I am not. Ignorance, I cannot, and will NOT tolerate. So the same principal applies here.

    It is also because of ignorance that we have to deal with racism, sexism and all the other ugly crap on a global scale.

    Not recognizing that there is an inherent problem in this blessed Metro dashboard is an ignoramus being blatantly ignorant. Even if it doesn't concern those tossers lamenting how they only use the Xbox to game, when clearly, that is NOT the road Microsoft is headed.

  • cloudskipa #137 2 months ago

    @Syrette I all I read from Altom was "you fucking twat" " You fucking moron" You fucking dick" "weren't you breast fed as a child? "You ignorant fuck!" "You fucking ignorant twat!" "You fucking fucking fuck" and "angry lesbian"

    I think that says it all. It's funny how I made relevant and constructive points like how I and many others pointed out how wrong the picture comparison in this thread was between NXE and Metro, that that doesn't stop it getting 50+ rating and everyone who points this glaring fact out negative ratings and called a fanboy. I guess this is all MS hatersand Sony fans alike want to hear, never mind the truth eh?

    This place is spoiled by children like Atolm and fanboys in general. Once again, unbelievably in this very topic I have read...that Richard is biased to the 360. You guys need to grow up a bit or if you don't like RL articles then go elsewhere.

    I also never said 1080p shoudln't be fixed, I just said for LoveFilm there's no problem with the picture it outputs, in fact it's great but then I'm a gamer and not a movie buff.

    I made one "smartarse" comment to a person who said he was having problems finding demo's and games, maybe I shouldn't of done that but I honestly can't understand how anyone can have problems with that? They are easy to find and if not at first then a few weeks later it certainly should be, almost like second nature as it is for me now.

    I have no qualms with the dash, it loads my games list a hell of a lot quicker and that's mostly what I care about.

  • Atolm #138 2 months ago

    @TheReverendSlim: I just realized you made this article possible, as I jumped from forum to forum catching up on this whole dilemma.

    So you have a massive thanks from me, my friend, and an extended appreciation on the research too!

    Kudos to all that!

  • Porcupine_I #139 2 months ago

    @djm99 you are not supposed to find anything! you are supposed to buy what they tell you to!

  • TheReverendSlim #140 2 months ago

    @Atolm Oh, it wasn't just me, but thanks. There were a bunch of people who noticed the problem and tested/verified it. Big credit to Richard and Digital Foundry for actually listening and objectively showing the video problems with the new dashboard. I don't know that Microsoft will actually listen... but it damn sure won't be for lack of trying on our parts.

  • Atolm #141 2 months ago

    @cloudskipa: Listen you twonk! I'm not about to go easy and be super nice to an arrogant ignoramus such as you.

    BTW, didn't you say this site was overrun by old farts? Why the sudden flip of a coin in your comment this time around?

    No... you didn't, you forgot your cap so you sat on the wrong end of your head? Silly bugger, you.

    Fanboys? I don't have a PS3, you fucking twat. Get used to that calling, because I'll be calling you that from now on, you fucking twat.

  • Purist #142 2 months ago

    I've bought only one item from Market place since the upgrade. I just cannot be arsed trying to find what I want. Must be the same with a lot of other people to.

  • Collymilad #143 2 months ago

    Here's my article:

    What went wrong with the 360 dash?

    They were thinking about advertising and not usability when they created it.

    The End.

    I'd just like to add though, er... are the people who can't find stuff morons? It's ad heavy but it's really not as complicated to find stuff as some people seem to be making out. Not at all.
    Edited by 1 at 08/01/12 @ 14:45

  • Atolm #144 2 months ago

    @TheReverendSlim: Still, a big vote of thanks to those involved, as well. :)

    A few girlfriends and I saw this problem when the dashboard came out on the 6th, but our boyfriends didn't really take note until we showed it to them, right in front of their eyes with one of our Xboxes still with the NXE dash.

    So glad this article is bringing this to them masses. So I do hope it makes ground too.

  • cloudskipa #145 2 months ago

    @Atolm I didn't say this site was overrun by old farts, I said there are far too many old farts complaining about minor little things and I stand by that. Too much negativity, doom mongering and all that jazz.

    Let us not forget this is a gaming site primarily and 360 has a great line up of games next year, people like you and others suggest that "MS don't care about games anymore" but the 360 is looking great for me, XBLA exclusives in particular and those lovely Cave shmups mmm. They must be doing something right.

    I don't care if you own a PS3 or whatever as I'm not taking your comments on board, it's the other users here and plenty of them are PS3 owners or Sony fanboys who don't have any real reason to contribute to this article other than to stir up shit. If you're blind to that then I think it's a bit rich (and ironic) you jumping on every single person in here who has expressed the tiniest amount of contentment or positivity toward 360 or the Metro dash and dismissing them all as ignorant fuckers.

  • beastmaster #146 2 months ago

    I wanted to see what full 360 games are on my 360. Can I do that? Not as far as I can see.

  • server-1 #147 2 months ago

    The new update is awesome to me. No problems with it. At least its secure...lol

  • MrBeast #148 2 months ago

    @Syrette: I quite often buy on impulse. I do - or did - enjoy a good browse of the marketplace, downloading trials and videos of titles I might have missed. The new one just feels like a step backwards - especially as the 'New Release' section seems to be filled with Yoostar and Rock Band stuff these days. When there was something I specifically wanted - the Batman DLC springs to mind - I had to go in to the A-Z section to find it.

    When I said that I couldn't see myself spending much cash on there, I didn't mean it as a point of principle. I meant that I probably won't be making any impulse purchases from browsing any more. If I know that there's something out which I want, I'll still pick it up. It just seems odd that the re-design seems to discourage people from spending their points.

  • 43n1m4 #149 2 months ago

    @cloudskipa

    I didn't say this site was overrun by old farts, I said there are far too many old farts complaining about minor little things and I stand by that. Too much negativity, doom mongering and all that jazz.

    I actually agree with that. There is a great deal of negativity on the gaming forums in general, which annoys me immensely. However, there are factual issues with the new dashboard update, and IMO the layout of the 'tiles' are a far cry from the intuitive interface of my windows phone (using a better version of the Metro UI), and seems to downplay some of the more important functions in favor of 'noise'. It's hardly as problematic as some make it to be, but far from an improvement from the previous dashboard in terms of functionality imo.

    But looking at the direction Microsoft is heading atm with all their products, and the way everything seems to blend, I'm actually looking forward to their future revisions. Windows 8, Windows Phone and (probably) the future revision of the Xbox GUI will unify and simplify both the functional aspects of their software, and make life easier for developers.
    But right here and now, and especially on the Xbox360, they have a long way to go yet.
    On the other hand I think the GUI update is a necessary step, looking forward, but the execution could've been better.
    Edited by 1 at 08/01/12 @ 16:35

  • RoOhDaMite #150 2 months ago

    Honestly I think MS screwed up even bigger than Sony did last year with that PSN-Hack.

  • Machetazo #151 2 months ago

    That's bad and disappointing to see Microsoft offering their consumers a poorer quality video experience than they could, and using betas simply as marketing tools.
    I only really liked the early Xbox 360 dashboard. It wasn't always the most straightforward, but it was sharpened up and improved and I could always find all that I wanted from the menus. I greatly dislike the subsequent evolutions.

  • Syrette #152 2 months ago

    @RoOhDaMite

    How are the 2 things in any way comparable?

    Unless you're posting in the wrong article (your comment would look more at home in the Xbox Live fraud article).

  • RoOhDaMite #153 2 months ago

    @Syrette
    Sony screwed up because they didn't know what to do back then.
    MS screwed up although they knew what to do.

    It both relates to customer relationship and trust in the brand. So this is what makes it comparable to me.
    Edited by 1 at 08/01/12 @ 17:10

  • Atolm #154 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 17:34:54 08-01-2012

  • DAN.E.B #155 2 months ago

    people have always moaned about the updates
    Ive never really had a problem with them until now this update is terrible and putting all these adds on when im paying for a subscription is a piss take
    I do like the You Tube app tho

  • Astro-Creature #156 2 months ago

    Give them another two years to change it.

  • Atolm #157 2 months ago

    @cloudskipa: Keep on suckling on those Microsoft teats, and while you're at it keep your head buried too, since you're so ignorant of anything else that's supposedly "not" affecting you.

    You're saying I shit on anyone showing even the slightest bit of praise for the Metro dash. Yet, here you are showing resentment, just to be on the contrary, toward those who show their slightest disappointment with the Metro dash. Oh, the hypocrisy.

    I have no idea where you got the notion that I hate the Metro dash, I have no qualms with it, apart from this video bug.

    Oh, and by the way, if you're not taking what I say on board, then why bother replying?

  • TheReverendSlim #158 2 months ago

    @DAN.E.B You're always going to have a contingent of people who hate a new interface, and that's true of anything. Personally, I have no problem with the Metro interface, though I understand the criticisms that people have made. Many of those same issues were brought up as suggestions during the preview program as well. Personally, the new interface is okay with me.

    That said, this article and the previous one aren't dealing with the aesthetics or usability of the UI itself. They point out a bug that reduces the quality of video played back on the system and causes the 360 to be non-compliant with existing video output standards for consumer electronic devices. That's the rub here, and people shouldn't lose focus. Even if you're not using your 360 for video, it should upset everyone that the new dashboard broke something that worked perfectly fine before, and that Microsoft has ignored it.

  • SegaSen #159 2 months ago

    I never complained with a dashboard update before. But I think this one is terrible. The only think I like is the better Kinect integration. Otherwise, terrible navigation and an advertising overload!

  • riceNpea #160 2 months ago

    @TheReverendSlim

    Completely agree and nicely put. I am not particularly inconvenienced but it certainly smacks of contempt towards the consumer.

    Whilst i have nothing new to say on this discussion other then adding my displeasure at Microsoft's practices may i say that it's a shame that others have allowed the topic to degenerate.

    Ignorance and intolerance are two sides of the same coin, and crudity has no justification.

  • chrisola #161 2 months ago

    such as borked
    I almost stopped reading there.

    Anyway, maybe the full 1080p hd problem really hits the pirates (sorry, HOMEBREW 1080p video makers) hardest - why else would anyone want to watch full HD on a 360? Because it's pirated and their PC isn't in their lounge \ connected to their big tv.

    Don't tell me people rip their own legal blu rays, encode them, then load them on their 360 to play because i don't buy it - its because they downloaded it off the internet.

    If official content is the only way to get the best viewing experience then i'm all for it to be honest - as long as the content IS what its sold as.
    Edited by 1 at 08/01/12 @ 19:29

  • Retro_ #162 2 months ago

    Why do I suspect M$ of slowly borking the 360 in preparation for the 720 or whatever it'll be called.

  • riceNpea #163 2 months ago

    @chrisola

    If you own an 360 then you should ignore your spurious antipathy and read on. The article is commendable to say the least.


    EDIT: to qualify my post i must record that chrisola's original comment was simply, "I stopped reading there."
    Edited by 1 at 08/01/12 @ 19:38

  • Machiavellian #164 2 months ago

    Well as a games console, I have no problem with the dash. When I turn on the 360 I only have to hit the A button and my game loads. If I put a game in the console it loads automatically. If I played a game a lot it's right under the quick games tab. As far as a playing the games I want to play, the 360 does this better than my PS3.

    I do have to laugh at all the crying about not being able to find anything within the games section on the 360. When I updated my 360, I did not tell my 5 year old son how to get to his favorite game Pac Man DX. I will say it took him a good 5 mins but once he figured it out he appears to get his game up and going about the same speed and much faster once he figured out the quick play.

    There are a lot of improvements MS can make to the dash that I would love for them to do but I do especially the video playback issue but besides from that, it's not that bad of an update.

  • Bonkers_Billy #165 2 months ago

    Still don't like the Metro dash. Can we not have a choice of dash or at least options to personalize / configure it?

  • 32768Colours #166 2 months ago

    Some good posts here, and don't have much to add at this stage in the thread, but I will say that I still absolutely hate the new dash, and I think its for one very simple reason. When I bought the 360, I bought it thinking I was buying a games console.

    The new dash completely repositions the console as media box that just happens to play 360 games and that's not what I bought the 360 for. Its primary function is now side-lined, and I think the only reason the "play disc" option is right up front is just in case someone pops in a DVD.

    Basically, Microsoft are really going to have to come up with a good GAMES console next gen for me to buy another of their consoles. If my gaming is going to be shunted of to one side its certainly going to put a black mark against their system for me.

    Poor show Microsoft, poor show.

  • Machiavellian #167 2 months ago

    Some good posts here, and don't have much to add at this stage in the thread, but I will say that I still absolutely hate the new dash, and I think its for one very simple reason. When I bought the 360, I bought it thinking I was buying a games console.

    What exactly has changed now than the previous dash from the 360 being a games console. This part I do not understand the reason. On the first page that loads, you have the option to play the game you have in the disk right away. You put in a disk and it plays automatically. If you want to play the games you play the most you have the quick play option. As a games console, how is that hampering you from getting to the games you want. You are still able to easily hook up with your friends to play games and now you can broadcast to all of your friends what game you are in the mood to play.

    Personally I would have loved for MS to provide clans like you can do with Steam.

    The only thing I can see where you have dig a little deeper is when going to the marketplace.

  • riceNpea #168 2 months ago

    @Machiavellian


    you misunderstand 32768Colours' post. As i read it, he doesn't mean he finds it difficult to actually play games, he is lamenting on Microsoft's decision to refocus the Xbox as a multimedia hub rather then a dedicated games machine.

  • chrisola #169 2 months ago

    @riceNpea

    Yeah - i did read on! Was worth reading too in the end - although i don't use my 360 for anything but games - never have.

  • heynow #170 2 months ago

    Does anyone actually use this extra xbox crap? Cos I dunno one person that does. Who the hell is paying for netflix when you can just rapidshare?? Same goes for 'hulu'. And why do you wanna watch youtube or go on facebook from your fkn xbox?

  • alcides #171 2 months ago

    Who bought an Xbox anyway?

    Oh...

  • moggsy #172 2 months ago

    @Machiavellian

    I'm glad you can laugh at people trying to find things on the new dash as all I can do is cry.

    The new dash is just not as intuitive as the previous design. I downloaded a demo and it took me 5 whole minutes to find how to play it (yes I now know it's in Quickplay so it should be easier to find a download next time).

    However I still haven't found out how to check download progress - how do I see what I'm currently downloading? There's no indication within the main interface that I'm actually downloading anything at all!

    Also the Quickplay section only shows you a handful of games. I have download games which I have paid for but not played for a while - how do I access them? The only way I've found is to:

    1. Go to the Games 'tab'.

    2. Choose 'My Games'.

    3. Scroll through a list of every game/demo that I have ever played on my Xbox since 2005 (it's a big number)

    or

    Choose 'Show' then try to narrow it down by various unhelpful categories because there is no simple 'Purchased Games' option.

    It's a nightmare of an interface clearly designed by someone who doesn't like people.

  • moggsy #173 2 months ago

    Look how simple finding my paid for games used to be. Select 'My Xbox', then 'Games Library' and you were presented with this rather pleasant interface:



    Far simpler/nicer/less anger inducing.

  • Lolbay #174 2 months ago

    I'm from belgium, we still don't got Youtube ... Will their ever come Youtube on my Xbox360 ?

  • ant72 #175 2 months ago

    I am a reasonably intelligent person, but really struggling with the new dash :( not sure if I can be bothered. Where the fuckinnect are the indie games?

  • Retroid #176 2 months ago

    @heynow Hulu & Netflix - people who want to be legit & not pirate, I'm guessing.

    I wouldn't touch Twitter, FB or Youtube on my 360 or PS3. Simple as that.

  • TheReverendSlim #177 2 months ago

    @Eurocensor And how do you know it will play 1080p content at full resolution? How have you tested to come to this conclusion?

  • Biker_Bob_1971 #178 2 months ago

    Post deleted at 16:59:10 06-02-2012

  • arachnophilia #179 2 months ago

    @chrisola it's not so much the "homebrew" stuff that concerns me. but it's kind of, well, lame that MS would limit legitimate, not-pirated content like netflix and hulu to only 720p, while their zune service runs 1080p.

    of course, i'll get over that. at the end of the day, i don't really need netflix to be 1080p. but i'd be nice if it didn't look like completely gray, washed out crap. that needs to be fixed like last month.

    @32768Colours i'm fine with repositioning the 360 as a media device that also happens to play games. this honestly reflects my usage of it lately. i spend more time on media than i do on games. partly because MS just can't keep up with the PC market. but mostly because it's a really convenient way to get media like netflix.

    what makes no fucking sense to me is to try and position the 360 as a media device, and then totally screw up its media abilities.

    @heynow i use the "extra xbox crap". i pay for hulu and netflix, even though rapidshare is free. i pay because the service is BETTER than that the pirates can offer. faster access (streaming), centralized content (don't have to go looking for it), and zero risk of viruses. also, it's not illegal.

  • arachnophilia #180 2 months ago

    @TheReverendSlim try throwing a video like this http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=eGKWS6_187s into your youtube favourites or watch later queue. mine sure doesn't look like it's running anything close to 1080p. of course, some of the actual videos i've watched looked pretty decent, other than the contrast issues.

  • Okamiwolf #181 1 month ago

    I have a lot of video game trailers saved on my Xbox hard drive that are always nice to revisit. However, now they're all downgraded in quality by this update. This is ridiculous that they've actually reduced the quality of their system with an update, just as bad as Sony removing Other OS. Now I wish I'd saved all my trailers on PS3 instead.

    I hate this dashboard update, and the Xbox in general seems to be going down the toilet lately - it's lucky it has such a great back catalog of games available, because first party releases have all but dried up (it's sad when Forza is billed as a top Xbox release this winter, when it's just another car game). I think 2012 will be a terrible year for Xbox users and many will jump ship to PC.
    Edited by 1 at 09/01/12 @ 07:18

  • WMain00 #182 1 month ago

    I think what I find hilarious about the Xbox at the moment is that it's attempting to promote itself as a media entertainment centre. Yet, when I access the TV section of its so called media entertainment, it can only offer me Sky Go, a pay package system tied to Sky that requires previous subscriptions. BBC iPlayer and other streaming packages such as C4 On Demand are nowhere to be seen. Supposedly we will get to see BBC iPlayer "sometime in 2012."

    Turn toward the Playstation 3 however and not only am I able to access BBC iPlayer, but a whole host of other TV based streaming systems that fully work without me needing to subscribe or pay for anything whatsoever.

    And before prospective fanboys jump on the bandwagon and attempt to set me on fire, this is the truth of the matter. The Playstation 3 has been offering this sort of media entertainment choices for the better part of the year, without any complaint, fuss or even general promotion. It just exists, without the need to compromise the UI layout or the ability to use it.

    I find Metro a laughable attempt at once again trying to revitalise the Xbox system, but by doing so it has created more harm than good. If Microsoft are so insistent on making their console a centre for entertainment, they should be concentrating on doing exactly not, and not painting pretty pictures onto the screen while attempting to hide how empty their media options are.

  • GiarcYekrub #183 1 month ago

    @WMain00 Yeah thats because for some Dumb idea 4oD and 5OnDemand don't count as TV, possibly because they don't carry live feeds off the channels they represent

  • StooMonster #184 1 month ago

    @43n1m4 There is a great deal of negativity on the gaming forums in general

    I think that you'll find it's all forums, everywhere, on every subject ... not just gaming ones!

  • the-bilal-show #185 1 month ago

    I turned my 360 on this weekend after three months to play MW3 and decided to poke around the Metro dash while getting my Live accounts in order.

    Putting aside the ads and the dodgy video playback(I've found the 360's DVD playback to be very nice with TV programmes - much better than PowerDVD and XBMC on my PC), what really got me was the category order:

    Home
    Social
    TV
    Video
    Games

    Fifth down the list! Don't get me wrong, I understand where they're headed - the all-encompassing home media hub - and I'm not expecting MS to cater for my specific gaming needs if more money's coming in from the people who simply MUST post their latest achievement to my FB news feed or watch Sky, but that QuickPlay square made me giggle. It has this "oh yeah, the games!" feel about it, like it was added last-minute once the hubbub of all the other cool features and LoveFilm/Sky/YouTube deals had died down.

    What I'd like is if things were just a little bit more customisable, then I wouldn't mind; some kind of Advanced mode. They could even bury it deep within the settings section and have the console set to Easy mode by default so Grandma won't turn it on by accident and lose Kinectimals forever.

    I find it shocking that the layouts of these interfaces are set in stone in a we-know-what's-best manner in this age of almost limitless personalisation, how every online experience wants to tailor itself to fit my perceived individuality, how such-and-such software is so clever it can figure out what programme I'd want to watch at 8pm when I get home from work on a Tuesday based on my past viewings and yet it has NO IDEA the primary use for my 360 recently has been playing Daytona and SSF4.

    Either that or it simply doesn't want to know, because knowing would just make it upset :(
    Edited by 1 at 09/01/12 @ 14:34

  • 32768Colours #186 1 month ago

    @riceNpea

    You're spot on.

    Like the article says, its no mistake that the Games tab doesn't take centre stage. MS are essentially changing the focus of the 360; the 360 most of us probably bought as a games console.

    Its not that playing (or even finding) games is especially difficult, its just frustrating that to play a gmae I paid for I now have to scroll past ads for everything from Rihanna's music videos to Sky TV.

    Also, I have over 90 installed games on my 360 (from full retail to indie) so even when I do get to my games library, the new sorting process involves far more messing about. Scrolling also, is laborious to say the least. For example, why is there no way to scroll left from "A" to get straight to "Z"? To play Zuma for example, unless I'd played it recently, I have to scroll right through all my games just to reach it, something made even slower by the awful new Kinet-friendly page-by-page scrolling.

    So yeah, not overly impressed to be honest but then our opinions are hardly going to change anything. I'm just not sure I'm going to pay for another console if 80% of its functionality isn't targeted at gaming.

  • arachnophilia #187 1 month ago

    @Okamiwolf "I think 2012 will be a terrible year for Xbox users and many will jump ship to PC."

    i honestly already have. it's really, really hard to compete with steam. i've been using the xbox lately like a media streaming box. most of my usage is netflix and hulu. while i can obviously get both of those services on PC, it's not quite the same kind of use. it's harder to operate from the couch, or from bed.

    this effectively makes my xbox a worthless brick of plastic.

    @WMain00 "I think what I find hilarious about the Xbox at the moment is that it's attempting to promote itself as a media entertainment centre. Yet, when I access the TV section of its so called media entertainment, it can only offer me Sky Go..."

    i find it frustrating that the microsoft is trying to promote the xbox as a media device, and then totally fucks up media playback.

  • darc #188 1 month ago

    What went wrong with the Eurogamer redesign? I can't find anything!

    Sorry, wrong thread. :)

  • Liquidoodle #189 1 month ago

    @arachnophilia @Okamiwolf "I think 2012 will be a terrible year for Xbox users and many will jump ship to PC."

    "i honestly already have. it's really, really hard to compete with steam"

    Me too, XBox for me is for any games where I play co-op now and PC for single player :p

  • Djimm #190 1 month ago

    Constant dashboard revamps indicate to me that M$ simply can't get it right. Unlike the PS3 XMB which is a stroke of GUI genius, the Dashboard has gone from nasty to OK and now back to nasty.

    Also, someone should tell them anti-aliased black text on a white background never looks any good, on any screen - any web designer could have told them that.

  • CatWeazle #191 1 month ago

    Its pretty likely that Microsoft is hobbling the dashboard video playback in order to promote its on-demand streaming at 1080. Perhaps this was a prerequisite for LoveFilm/NetFlix licensing - or perhaps they're just being assholes again.

  • the-bilal-show #192 1 month ago

    @Djimm

    Totally agree.

    My ideal would be the look/feel of the XMB and the features of the Xbox dashboard combined. Things like opening someone's message if the Guide button is pressed while the notification is on-screen and the general context-sensitivity are great.

    I still don't get why the Xbox dash is so slow.

    Pressing Guide mid-game is painful. I'm sure all these open/close animations are very lovely but sometimes I just want to open the guide, send a message to a friend and get back into the game without wading through treacle.

    I originally thought the XMB was a bit bare but it's nothing if not clean and fast.

  • arachnophilia #193 1 month ago

    @the-bilal-show the slowdown happened back in NXE. blades was FAST. start adding layers of graphics, it gets heavier. my HDD is also probably horribly fragmented -- it takes forever just to read what games i have on it.

  • moggsy #194 1 month ago

    @ Eurocensor

    'Again, it's in the exact same place as it was before. Press the guide button, Marketplace tab - Active Downloads.'

    Well I've never had to use the guide button before (for anything) so they must have removed the function from the main interface.

    So is that MS's idea then - to move people away from the main interface into the guide? Strange way to 'improve' the interface if you ask me.

  • man.the.king #195 1 month ago

    ...but blatantly downgrading resolution looks very much like part of a strategy

    So I guess that would be the "Extinguish" bit of the three "E"s - with the difference that the competitors are no longer squash-ably small.

  • man.the.king #196 1 month ago

    cloudskipa

    Good thing I use my 360 for games then isn't it.

    Yes - That you use your 360 for gaming is certainly a good thing for everybody affected by this issue. :rolleyes:

  • arachnophilia #197 1 month ago

    @man.the.king i use my PC for gaming. i'm trying to retain some functionality for this antiquated white plastic box. this might just be good reason to cancel my xbox live subscription, and go with some company that doesn't bugger up media.

    anyways. i THINK i've made some progress with customer support. i may have actually convinced them the issue is not,

    a) that i'm an idiot and can't set the xbox settings,
    b) that i'm an idiot and can't set my monitor, or
    c) going to be fixed by sending my console back for $100.

    i've refered them to this link, as well as the original article, as well as a thread on the xbox official forums documenting the issue. they have now finally replied,

    "We appreciate your feedback. Customer satisfaction is our main goal. Therefore, I will forward your comments/issue to the Product Team for the development/documentation of our products and services."

    and

    "I am sorry to inform you that our Product Team has no phone number. They do not take in calls. But don't worry they will take our customers comments and suggestions very seriously and will look forward for the possible resolution for our customers issues and post their resolution on the forums for public awareness. You may also post your issue in our Xbox forums for some possible resolution as well. Our Xbox forums is also manage and answered by our Xbox moderators and customers who has experiences on technical issues and resolved issues with their own researches. Our Xbox moderators are responsible in researching for resolution on our customers issues."

    though it's certainly possible that they've just given up politely fighting my insistence that their dashboard is broken.

  • Atolm #198 1 month ago

    @arachnophilia: Sure looks that way, but I just wanted to thank you for your troubles.

    I even tried notifying the one who manages the Ambassadors about this but all to no avail, no reply or such...

  • NiolK #199 1 month ago

    I'm willing to give this Metro sh!te a little time to improve. It's still better than the odious XMB if you ask me.

    One issue I've noticed though is that it often doesn't shut down properly when using the controller to do so. The screen goes dark as if it's turning off but the 360 stays on until I hit the off button on the console itself.

  • samk #200 1 month ago

    Another here who really doesn't like the new dashboard whatsoever, in fact given its UI design principles this dashboard has also persuaded me to avoid Metro on my next phone upgrade, or 'upgrading' to Windows 8 on my desktop. And this from a long-time Xbox fan way back to the original Xbox1 release. Good job, team!

    The stuff I use is now buried under yet more menus, taking a backseat to adverts. Plus some of the functionality is just plain broken. For instance 'Quickplay' is anything but quick - more often than not it doesn't populate the list with anything whatsoever, and when it does it seems to display a random list of games I've played in the last year. It's so rubbish I've given up using that, and have to resort to scrolling through pages of games. Godawful UI right there.

  • NiolK #201 1 month ago

    @TazerFan At a guess I'd say you're getting negged for having "when I have girls over" in your comment.

  • NiolK #202 1 month ago

    @moggsy When you turn on your 360 now all you need to do is click on the "Quickplay" tile and there are you paid for games.

    Just as easy.

  • 32768Colours #203 1 month ago

    @NiolK

    Its funny that the only defense I've read of the "metro" dash update so far is the addition of the quickplay icon.

    That's fine if you only ever play one or two games and your HDD is reletively empty. As I mentioned previously, I have about 90+ games on my HDD; about 100gb's worth of games. Sorting through that lot is now far more sluggish than before. God only knows what it'd be like if I used another 100gb!

    Also the quickplay list includes anything you've accessed, including apps. That's a decent idea, but it wrongly presumes that users only want quick access to stuff they've only just used. There should at least be some filters available to quickly access older content.

    As for the Bing search, well don't even get me started!

    The fact of the matter is, if the 360 becomes even more focused on multimedia, its going to need far better ways of managing the "content" (ugh!) people own or use. For people with a lot of stuff on their system, the process is currently laborious at best.

  • NiolK #204 1 month ago

    @32768Colours Well, I agree regarding Bing. I don't use that POS on my PC and don't plan on doing so on my 360.

    I haven't found Metro all that hard to navigate to be honest. I can see why some people wouldn't like it and I'm not using "Quickplay" as a justification for the changes. Just pointing out that it's relatively handy. Regarding advertising it doesn't seem that much worse to me and certainly no worse than what you get on PSN.

  • jabberwocky #205 1 month ago

    Never used my xbox for playing video so i've never noticed any glitches through that.
    But i find the new dash very easy to use, its the same with every overhaul. How many people didn't like it when Eurogamer redesigned the website, how many complained? Its just the same with this, once we all get used to it it'll be great.

  • the-bilal-show #206 1 month ago

    @arachnophilia

    Oh yeah, Blades themselves were very fast, definitely. I miss them :)

    Were the blades that would appear when you press Guide also fast to move around?

    I suppose that, since moving to NXE, they took the entire Blades concept and used that for the current Guide menu which is why it's a bit slower. Back in the blades days, I think the Guide just had basic stuff like the Friends list, but I can't remember.

    Bringing up the Guide mid-game has always been slow, though, and is even slower to appear if the game is taxing the processor at the time(e.g. if you press Guide instead of pausing first).

  • the-bilal-show #207 1 month ago

    @TazerFan

    The negs are probably because you don't absolutely despise Metro or because you've got the ABSOLUTE GALL to point out that you use your 360 for games on a site called Eurogamer.

    I'm not at all discounting the problem at hand because I personally think they're quite serious, but I don't see the issue with people being blasé about it if they don't use it for video playback. I'd argue that "I don't watch videos so I don't care" posts could be trolling of sorts but yours isn't even like that.

    On a side note, I was reporting that jenny spammer just now and the drop-down list has 'Xbox fanboyism' and 'Sony bias' on it. I had a bit of a chuckle at that. Seems Sony bias is on a par with out-and-out Xbox fanboyism.

  • arachnophilia #208 1 month ago

    @the-bilal-show i don't totally hate the new dash either. it's okay, but could have stood some more usability testing. as far as the ad angle, i just don't understand. NXE was filled with ads too, and even the blades had prominently placed ads.

    i don't actually remember what the guide did in blades, but i know it was a lot less than in NXE. NXE's guide is basically the entire blades OS, so it's no wonder it's slower.

  • arachnophilia #209 1 month ago

    @32768Colours "As for the Bing search, well don't even get me started!"

    i'll say this for it. it works better than bing.com.

  • SlackMaster #210 1 month ago

    I've not noticed any issues. The main problem with for me was that they have made it a lot harder to find stuff on the XBL marketplace. I used to check every wednesday for new releases and add-ons but now I don't bother.

  • Dr.Buckles #211 1 month ago

    The new dashboard is a pain in the arse to find anything, the old system wasn't really any better though, one thing the PS3 almost does better, but thats rubbish too.

  • CHAZBIGPOTATO #212 1 month ago

    At least Elliott Ness had the decency to wear spats

  • Amistat #213 1 month ago

    In regards to finding stuff on the marketplace, my main gripe is not with it being buried as ultimately I can still find it, but has anyone noticed that the "newest" bit of dlc has been that same saints row thing for about a month now? While actual new stuff lines up behind it...

    Anyone else getthe impression developers can pay for priority market position now? Give MS some extra cash and your item will sit at the top of the list for a while? It's speculation of course but seems plausible, also otherwise why the hell is the marketplace messed up since the new dash?

  • StooMonster #214 1 month ago

    With Netflix installed — which is actually better than I thought it would be, when fixed at highest quality and on my 100Mb Virgin Media — one can really see the shagged video levels.

    Any news on Microsoft fixing this obvious screw up?

  • omniscient #215 1 month ago

    With all these Ads I must ask why the heck are we paying for XBL, it should be free in the first place.
    Edited by 2 at 19/01/12 @ 18:21

  • TooOldToGame #216 1 month ago

    Post deleted at 10:45:50 22-02-2012

  • TheReverendSlim #217 1 month ago

    About damn time...
    https://twitter.com/#!/majornelson/status/1601501259 67196161
    http://www.engadget.com/2012/01/19/microsoft-xbox-360- color-space-1080-hdcp-fix/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twi tter
    http://kotak u.com/5877759/the-xbox-360s-video-playback-issue-acknowledge d-microsoft-working-on-a-fix

    Hope they learn in the future to actually acknowledge the bug reports instead of trying to brush them under the rug.

  • drSchiwago #218 1 month ago

    @SpaceMonkey77 I understand your approach regarding upgrading dashboards, etc., but from the standpoint of system development & maintenance, it's much easier to focus on only one active os & dashboard and let old ones "die".

  • Sildur #219 4 weeks ago

    There are a few bugs and that's pretty crap. But whenever any major website changes its layout, there's always an outcry by the public who miss the old system they know and love.

  • Bogie19th #220 4 weeks ago

    @Atolm fail comment is fail Atolm. Nice work.

  • Bogie19th #221 4 weeks ago

    @StooMonster Yup.

    "We’re aware of the colorspace issue w/ some Xbox video apps & are working on a fix. No ETA yet but we hope to have an update soon." http://twitter.com/maj ornelson which they also told us back when it was released. Bam.

  • Bogie19th #222 4 weeks ago

    @TheReverendSlim Yes, they have, and more than once. Unfortunately for, you are must not be in every community forum (some are private) and didn't see their commments. Major Nelson even posted the same thing recently that we were told awhile ago. He posted this on his twitter:

    "http://twitter.com/maj ornelson"

    "We’re aware of the colorspace issue w/ some Xbox video apps & are working on a fix. No ETA yet but we hope to have an update soon."

    Maybe next time you shouldn't open your mouth quite so fast and embarrass yourself?

  • henhowc #223 4 weeks ago

    @Bogie19th If you're going to call someone out, where's your proof? What super special secret private community forum might you be referring to? And how does that help the general Xbox user if this information is not publicly available?

    Nowhere has any representative from Xbox explicitly stated that there is a problem until Major Nelson tweeted last week. This includes the MS beta dashboard feedback forums that many of us actively participated in.

  • IronCladChicken #224 4 weeks ago

    @NiolK
    'One issue I've noticed though is that it often doesn't shut down properly when using the controller to do so. The screen goes dark as if it's turning off but the 360 stays on until I hit the off button on the console itself.'

    I think that's a result of having 'Cloud Saved Games' turned on - If you turn it off in the settings the XBox should shut-down normally

  • henhowc #225 4 weeks ago

    @IronCladChicken It does this for the cloud saving and also if you have anything in your download queue. This is normal. It goes into a low-power state and should automatically shut off once its finished.

  • TheReverendSlim #226 3 weeks ago

    @Bogie19th No, they didn't. I was in the private forum for the preview program and on the Connect bug report site (both of which are now closed). They NEVER acknowledged it until Major Nelson did on Twitter, and this bug was reported ON THE FIRST DAY of the preview program BY ME, including pictures showing the resolution and video level issues (not color space as people keep calling it - it exists in all color space settings). Were you in the preview program? If so, you would have seen the HUNDREDS of people who voted on these bug complaints and had them deleted or marked as resolved without a single acknowledgement from Microsoft. After my initial bug report got over 80 votes, it was marked as resolved with no comment. Then several other bug reports went in by others that topped 100+ votes. There was also a thread in the Xbox.com private forums for the preview program that was fairly lengthy, again with no comment from MS.

    Major Nelson acknowledged it on January 19th on Twitter after people kept spamming him with links to the two Digital Foundry stories. We first reported it on NOVEMBER 10th, well before the update went live on December 8th. Maybe next time you should get your facts straight before you call someone out. This bug shouldn't have made it to the public release, as it was one of the top ten reported bugs in the preview program... with no acknowledgment whatsoever until 6 weeks after Microsoft unleashed it upon everyone's systems and over two months from the first report of the bug. NOT OKAY.