Banjo-Kazooie Review

By Kristan Reed Published 25 November, 2008

Bearly up to it.

Version tested: Xbox 360

Released to capitalise on the recent release of Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts & Bolts, the Xbox Live Arcade version of this 1998 Nintendo 64 favourite serves as a timely reminder of how far gaming has come over the past decade. At the time, Rare's star had never been brighter, flush as it was from the phenomenal success of GoldenEye. Gamers were desperate for what was seen as the Britsoft studio's answer to Super Mario 64, and blanket acclaim followed, with spectacular worldwide sales. But like so many early 3D games of the late 1990s, time hasn't been particularly kind to this colourful platform romp.

Presented with characteristic flair, it's a chirpy rescue tale featuring Banjo the bear and an intolerant bird named Kazooie who rides on his back. Structured almost identically to Super Mario 64, you wander around a varied hub-like environment known as Spiral Mountain on the hunt for the evil witch Gruntilda, who has captured Banjo's sister Tooty for basically being pretty.

During your travels through Gruntilda's lair, you'll explore various worlds on the hunt for the requisite number of jiggies - little jigsaw pieces that reside within each level. As with virtually all platform romps, you spend most of your time hoovering up anything not nailed down, and solving mini-challenges to mine each level for booty. In Banjo-Kazooie's case, each of the eight worlds houses 100 musical notes, 10 jiggies, honeycomb pieces, Jinjos to rescue, and Mumbo Jumbos. These little blue skulls prove doubly useful, as they can be traded in with a shaman to transform Banjo into various creatures, including termite, bee and crocodile.

Much of the early part of the game is pleasant enough, as you get to grips with the wide variety of jumps, rolls and attack moves via the ever-helpful Bottles the mole. As you progress, you learn that special pads will enable Banjo to fly, or jump extra high, or provide special boots to wade through otherwise-hazardous environments. But as undoubtedly innovative all of this extra functionality was at the time, much of the game's innocent charm is undone by a finicky camera system which rarely gives you the freedom you need.

'Banjo-Kazooie' Screenshot 1

Nuts & Bolts fans checking this out might take a while to adjust. There's no driving, kids.

4J Studios has made a decent fist of retooling the controls for the 360 pad, with the standard two-stick movement/camera system we're all comfortable with, but it can only do so much. Rare was no doubt hamstrung by a combination of game engine limitations, a relative lack of 3D game experience and, of course, the hardware, and it's a game that ten years on you feel you're fighting against a lot of the time. You struggle to look in the direction you want, or get lumbered with an unhelpful angle that's flush against a wall.

Clunkiness is never far away. Swimming, for instance, Banjo feels as though he's plunged into Golden Syrup as you painfully wrestle him in a suitable direction and try to get the silly bear to haul his furry frame forwards. The more you pick through the often painfully garish environments, the more it becomes apparent just how irritating most of the mechanics are.

Learning to fly is almost as painful, with a ruinous inability to land on any surface without physically being about a centimetre away from it, causing you to constantly overshoot. Precise jumping is something of a dark art as well, thanks to a lack of, well, precision, a restless camera, and an ever-present inertia always threatening to send you too far.

None of it's completely broken as such, but nor is it a feel you'll be inclined to tolerate for any length of time in a modern context. As ever with these games, the key is persistence. As long as your reservoir of patience is well-stocked, there's a modicum of fun to be eked out by gradually collecting every damned item - but it's more likely the fun will be based on your association with the game's original release, and the blind nostalgia of reliving something you did through the eyes of innocent youth. Even hardened retro heroes might find it hard to defend some of the basic design flaws on show.

The other important thing to note is how the game stacks up technically in the harsh light of 2008. With 3D gaming still very much in its infancy a decade ago, angular awkwardness came with the territory, with everything from the level geometry to the characters themselves designed around the limitations of the hardware. And while there's a wistfulness about those liberating days when the possibilities of 3D were being explored, objectively this is a prime example of a retro style that hasn't aged well, with garish colour schemes and primitive attempts at texturing only adding to its dated look.

To give Rare its dues, artistically it did its best with the tools available, and evidently invested greatly into creating a vivid cartoon cast - something that was still an enormous novelty at the time. Some cute touches still allow elements of the game to shine - the in-engine cut scenes in particular provide occasional highlights, and provide much-needed personality with sharp dialogue and the trademark burbling voices. Sadly, its appeal is completely uneven, and viewing it out of context ten years on does it no favours.

Perhaps the most jarring part of Banjo-Kazooie is the perpetually unforgiving level design, which regularly irritates with '90s conventions most of us will be glad to see the back of. After a well-directed introductory portion, three levels into the game it quickly slips into the worst excesses of late-'90s platforming, with poor signposting contributing to growing frustration as the trial-and-error gameplay comes to the fore. Inevitably, the novelty value of new moves and abilities gives way to genre clichés, like the obligatory toxic area, and an ice world, and creativity the game takes a tumble.

'Banjo-Kazooie' Screenshot 2

Still, it's good to see Klungo back to his old self.

That said, it's pleasing to see 4J Studios upscaling the visuals and tailoring the controls to the pad without any issues, but it comes at a hefty price. Jarring slowdown crops up in the unlikeliest scenarios, which is unforgivable for a game of this age. Adding the promised Stop 'N Swap feature (originally planned for Banjo Tooie) will be of particular interest if you happen to have bought Nuts & Bolts and want to unlock new vehicle parts, but it's one for the truly committed, rather than a selling point.

For a game costing a princely 1200 Microsoft Points (GBP 10.20 / EUR 14.40), we'd have hoped Banjo-Kazooie to have aged rather better than it has. As it is, it's still a solid platformer with some neat ideas, but it's undone by a host of camera and control issues. If you popped your gaming cherry playing Banjo as a youngster, prepare for nostalgia tinged by disappointment, as you discover it's not quite the classic you remember.

5 / 10

Read the Eurogamer.net scoring policy
Picture of Kristan.

About Kristan Reed

Kristan is a former editor of Eurogamer, dad, Stone Roses bore and Norwich City supporter who sometimes mutters optimistically about Team Silent getting back together.

Read more articles from Kristan by visiting the Kristan Reed archive page.

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Comments (163) Latest comment 8 months ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • gingerlink #1 3 years ago

    wha?

  • Lexx87 #2 3 years ago

    Don't agree, i'm loving it as much as I did back then. Maybe i'm just odd...swimming gets easy to control once you spend a bit of time with it too. 7-8/10 for me but fair enough if it wasn't your cup of tea.

  • chrisjm #3 3 years ago

    5/10?

    if this isnt another typo you need help.

  • ademkermad #4 3 years ago

    5/10? im sure

  • Lexx87 #5 3 years ago

    Anyone who was undecided and this review made them decide a nice big "fuck that then" I think you should reconsider. At least try the demo (there is one right?), it's as good as I remember. The music is still brilliant and the environments are varied, but I am a MUSTCOLLECTEVERYTHING whore so I dunno it might just be me.

  • bad09 #6 3 years ago

    Yet another 1200 game?

    Price increase on Live confirmed then....

  • ecureuil #7 3 years ago

    5/10 is about right. It's not aged too well at all.

  • seasidebaz #8 3 years ago

    Wow, that's 2 Banjo games in as many weeks that I'm no longer buying!

    Now let's all sing,

    "Rare are old and shit! Rare are old and shit! Haven't made a decent game since Goldeneye, Rare are old and shit!" etc.

  • Toothball #9 3 years ago

    By the way, there were nine levels to visit, plus the castle. I'm tempted to pick it up to see if I can remember where everything is.

  • Monkey_Puncher #10 3 years ago

    Game is still amazing in my books, I really don't agree with this review at all. The controls work perfectly, the camera for the most part works fine, occasionally snagging on scenery but nothing to get annoyed about. Sound and graphics are great considering it's a 'retro' game, the art design still shines through. Garish colours? What you mean bright colours? The game's unforgiving....are you sure you didn't just suck at the game?

    This review is overly negative, just makes me realise that Eurogamers opinions on Rare games mean fuck all to me. Banjo is still one of my favourite games, and a perfect example of the platform genre.

  • menage #11 3 years ago

    Everyone who thought only Goldeneye was a good Rare title should go back to playing CoD.

    Viva Pinata FTW!

  • DemonCleaner #12 3 years ago

    I'm more looking forward to Banjo Tooie. I could never bring my self to start it again after accidently deleting my profile 2/3rds of the way through. Damn me for tapping A quickly without reading the options properly. :(

  • Psychotext #13 3 years ago

    Played it for the first time after buying N&B. It's a good game, but there are a whole lot of problems.

  • peterfll #14 3 years ago

    I never finished this due to the difficulty level. I enjoyed it at the time. Funny tho, I remember it being very lush, one of the most colourful N64 games, but not garish. I will sample the demo.

    Gruntilda had the best lines, although Kazooie would also make me chuckle.

  • Les #15 3 years ago

    Why a two-pager? This could have easily been part of a round-up feature.

  • Gearskin #16 3 years ago

    ... Kristan... your mother now HATES you.

  • Quint2020 #17 3 years ago

    /outrage

  • Darren #18 3 years ago

    Uh oh... I totally disagree with the review and that score but then I played the original to 100% completion twice so I had absolutely no problems playing it on the Xbox 360. The review seemed a little mean spirited to me, as if it was written purely to fit in with the pun in the tagline. ;)

    I'd go as far as to say it looks and plays better than the original. For me this game was better than Super Mario 64, it had bags more charm and personality and kept me playing right to the end, twice over, something that other game didn't. The Xbox 360 controller feels perfect for the game, I have no problems using it for all the moves, and the slicker framerate makes some of the tighter platform bits like the jiggy dashes before the timer runs out on Bubblegloop swamp for example far easier. In fact, it probably makes it too easy. I managed to get half way through the game in less than seven hours but I guess that's down to familiarity not a complaint of the game itself or the quality of the port.

    I've not had major issues with the camera either, works exactly how I remembered it, that is to say that although there's the odd bothersome fixed viewpoint, overall it's fine and never annoyed me particularly. The swimming controls are a non-issue too, they weren't an issue in the original either once you get used to them.

    I love this game as much as I did the original and in that respect this port is as perfect as I'd hoped it would be. Looks great running in HD too with 4X AA and widescreen support and the jaunty, jolly tunes are as catchy and brilliant as ever. I guess if you were a fan of the original game then you'll undoubtedly love this game just as much so I'd be inclined to ignore EG's rather harsh review (IMO) and try the demo when it comes out next week. Well everyone should try it really because it's a classic blast from the past from Rare and is just so utterly refreshing to play on the 360. Did I say I love it? :D

  • muscleblade #19 3 years ago

    Nice honest review. I made my mind up about not buying it when i decided to skip Nuts N Bolts.

  • MyPointIs #20 3 years ago

    Kristan + Stake + Fire

  • Royal Fool #21 3 years ago

    I've enjoyed this a lot. It's been a long time since I played the game, but IMO it still has a lot of charm and fun. Microsoft could have invested a bit in upscaling the visuals (that is, giving the characters and environments just a bit more fluff) but they decided to release it "as-is" instead. As a result, Banjo-Kazooie does look a bit strange when compared to many other 3D games on XBLA.

    However, it is certainly much better than most of the crap that's available on the service. I'd give it a 7/10 (adjusted for price, the 1200 MSP is stupid).

    Another thing: Playing this game again made me realize that a straight cookie-cutter platforming sequel isn't what this franchise needed after all, and I'm actually glad that Rare decided to take Nuts & Bolts in another direction.

    EDIT: Regarding the slowdown, it's true that it's a problem. In the most unlikely of places too, when there isn't much happening on screen (most often underwater).
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 14:07

  • Darren #22 3 years ago

    Oh and the game is a 10/10 for me... and easily the best game on XBLA by far. Feels like a proper game for a change but then it *is* a proper game. Can't wait for Banjo-Tooie, only briefly played it on the N64 but it looked even better, although that will undoubtedly get an EG 5/10 too.

  • insincere_dave #23 3 years ago

    Aside from the achievements and the stop 'n' swop is there anything new in this version? Can you replay the end quiz after completing the game?
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 14:06

  • jonsaan #24 3 years ago

    I didn't rate banjoTooie hlaf as much as the original darren. It's alright, but nothing compared to this beauty.

  • Nikanoru #25 3 years ago

    I wonder when people are going to realise that upping the resolution on old games makes them uglier. Low poly models aren't meant to be displayed in super high def, all it does is emphasize their lowpolyness.

  • Lexx87 #26 3 years ago

    /high fives Darren

  • Obiwanshinobi #27 3 years ago

    I don't get all this EG-bitching against Banjo and Rayman franchises. Awful (American way) animation ang cheesy (American way) dialogues of Jak & Daxter - good, Something (European way) different and fresh - bad?
    Maybe local reviewers aren't as much into platforming as they think they are.
    I'm not trying to start the fight, I just don't get it.

  • Darren #28 3 years ago

    "Jarring slowdown crops up in the unlikeliest scenarios, which is unforgivable for a game of this age."

    Huh... what slowdown? I've not come across any noticeable framerate drops so far playing it at 1360x768 and 720p and I've visited seven of the nine levels... even Clanker's Cavern is fine and better than I remember. The framerate is actually much improved over the original IMO which at times definitely got a little chuggy on the poor old N64. As I said earlier the slicker framerate in this port actually makes this game easier to play than the original so this strikes me as an odd criticism. :?

  • shotgun44 #29 3 years ago

    I always thought the N64 graphics looked horrible in comparison to the PS1. As great as goldeneye was, I always thought it looked like a vaseline smeared piece of shit! Much to the horror of my mates. Wasn't a massive fan of this or super Mario 64 either. Think the N64 might be the only console since the NES that I don't own. And the wii of course

  • alsotop #30 3 years ago

    It's definitely not great, but its not as much of a stinker as 5/10. Admittedly, I had this game for the N64, and the nostalgia probably ranks up the game some, but I think some of these points in the review have been taken too harshly.

  • rayk2099 #31 3 years ago

    I have to say I've not disagreed with an EG review so much in a long time. Abosultely the camera is tricky but just using the bumper buttons fixes almost all problems - including swimming and flying issues.
    Of course, you shouldn't have to work around something, but this IS a 10 year old game.

    Also, I'm surprised to see no mention of the incredible sound design. Whilst playing through (I'm at about 70%) I can't help but sing along to all the elements of the game, not just the music. Frankly it's brilliant.

    Yes the game is ugly as hell, and it certainly has some cliches and control issues, but again it is 10 years old, and there is the whole problem with reviewing retro games (even on re-release).

    I think the game is a blast, but perhaps would have been easier to stomach at a lower price point. There's lots of fun to be had, though.

  • Darren #32 3 years ago

    @Nikanoru - Well I think Banjo-Kazooie looks better than I remembered it, at least technically since I think it is still a very nice looking game artistically.

    Sure the textures aren't great and the geometry is simplistic but this port has a longer draw-distance (making it easier to find things) and an overall better framerate plus anti-aliasing and widescreen support so it is as good as it could possibly be without destroying the integrity of the original which is what most people would want I'm sure. This is a port of the original *not* a remake/reimagining after all. EG seem to have reviewed it as if they expected all the issues to be fixed but that was clearly not the intention here, instead it was to bring it to the Xbox 360 as faithfully as possible and that's what 4J Studios have achieved IMHO. I'm sure the fans of the original game will adore it and hopefully Banjo-Tooie will be just as true to the original too.

  • muscleblade #33 3 years ago

    Darren wrote: Feels like a proper game for a change but then it *is* a proper game.

    I think your definition of a proper game is different from my definition of a proper game. I love XBLA games and own about 60 XBLA titles and all of them definently proper games.

  • The_Inquisitor #34 3 years ago

    I'm giving this a miss (only because I have the original) but I still think Nuts And Bolts has something going for it so I wouldn't put it down so soon, it looks like one of those games that you get out what you put into it.

  • Darren #35 3 years ago

    @muscleblade - Well many XBLA games that I've played feel like something knocked out during a developer's lunchbreak while they're working on a major release to me and, as such, I rarely play any for more than 15 minutes tops hence the reason I've stopped buying most of them (although I still try the demos). The size limitations of XBLA means that production values invariably suffer and there's nothing on the 360 to match the slick values of Super Stardust HD, PAIN, Tekken 6 DR or WipEout HD for example.

    Banjo-Kazooie like many PSN games feels like I'm getting more game for my money and thus qualify in my book as being "proper" games. At the end of the day it's about perceived value for money and I don't usually feel I'm getting that from 90% of XBLA releases especially as there's a high quota of shite on there which diminishes the quality releases when they do arrive. ;)
    Edited by 3 at 25/11/08 @ 14:41

  • muscleblade #36 3 years ago

    @Darren

    Well ive played games like Geo Wars 2, Rez HD and Omega Five for dozens of hours. Enjoyed every minute of it too.Thats Value for money imo.
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 14:38

  • menage #37 3 years ago

    There's an immense amount of crap on live. But there are also some real gems on there. Braid, Puzzle Quest, Puzzle Fighter, etc. Braid is basely one of my 3 best games of the year.

  • Darren #38 3 years ago

    Well that's you obviously isn't it, muscleblade, I'm speaking purely for myself and as such XBLA has frequently been a letdown for me for games and seldom keeps my interest. I prefer the sparser but generally better quality releases on PSN myself and usually find they offer me more gameplay per pound.

    Banjo-Kazooie though, to get back on topic, is definitely a step in the right direction for XBLA and I'd like to see more of these quality ports instead of the sub-par tat that makes up 80% of XBLA IMO.

  • sneetch #39 3 years ago

    @Darren
    "@muscleblade - Well most XBLA games I've played feel like glorified tech demos to me and I rarely play any for more than 15 minutes tops hence the reason I've stopped buying most of them although I still try the demos. Banjo-Kazooie like many PSN games feels like I'm getting more game for my money and thus qualify in my book as being "proper" games."

    Is there that much of a difference between XBLA and PSN games? I'd always imagined that they were very similar types of games on both services (and indeed a lot of cross-platform games).

  • muscleblade #40 3 years ago

    "Banjo-Kazooie like many PSN games feels like I'm getting more game for my money and thus qualify in my book as being "proper" games"

    Its kind of odd that this comes from a guy that barely touches most of hes full retail games. No offense my friend i just find it strange that you think value is important but havent completed a lot of great games you own (even short ones like Dead Space and COD4).

  • BadBoyBonner #41 3 years ago

    The review is wrong - very wrong - so much so that perhaps it displays more of Mr Reed's contempt at having to "lower" himself down to reviewing duties for an Xbox Live game - which is also unusually difficult and lengthy.

    This was the best looking/playing game out there in it's day full stop i.e. played better than Mario64, was much larger and longer, contained British Humour and hammered m64 into the ground from a technical point of view.

    Made my (then) newly ass kicking Voodoo 2 powered PC look stupid playing Quake 2 - the texture quality in B&K that Rare managed on a non expanded N64 defied belief - my PC Graphics card alone had 3 times more memory than the entire N64.

    Only the original TombRaider challenged it for gaming greatness on console the year after - which was itself completely amazing in it's day (easy to forget for some people after the poisonous dilution by the sequels).

    Anyone who has played N&B will laugh at the comments it makes of todays gamers being namby-pamby i.e. slapped round the head a few times when drowning (kinda eradicates the feat of stressful daring underwater raids).

    Clearly that kind of challenging gameplay is an echo through time of the transition from Arcade to Home Entertainment - the reward is becoming less and less about skilful play - mealy sinking more time into something continues to reward (thank the lord for things like veteran level selection etc.)

    As for the strange slow down, someone on here indicated it slows down at exactly the same place as it does when running on one of the N64 emulators (can't remember which one but think it was Project64) so should bode well for future Rare releases if the emulator is stable enough to pass all of M$ stringent tests.

    If it does use the emulator it would be nice to see Rare to optionally incorporate some of the enhanced texture packs for an even greater looking release to appease those that remain unconvinced. Blast Corps would be my choice - its throw away gameplay would suit live fine - more so with a LIVE scoreboard.

  • Perfecto #42 3 years ago

    I don’t usually post on these forums, but after reading this review I genuinely believe that the reviewer hasn't been playing the same game. Not only is Banjo-Kazooie still one of the best 3D platformers on any system, but it also has charming characters and humour that is such a rarity these days. If you enjoy platformers, you should go on Xbox Live and buy the game if they haven’t already done so because the review misses the mark completely. It is a real shame that some people will read this review and dismiss the game; they will be missing out on lengthy enjoyable single player experience and a piece of gaming history

    I work in a games company and we have regular discussions on what sort of games we would like to see on Xbox Live. If there’s one thing we all agree on is that 'Live' needs more games like this. Keep up the good work Rare, bring Banjo-Tooie on XBLA too.

    Eurogamer.....you truly disappoint me on this occasion.

  • Rdeal #43 3 years ago

    There is no slowdown what so ever in this game aslong as you dont have your 360 set to 1080p or 1080i,i run mine at 1360x768 and there's not one bit of slowdown same as if you run it at 720p,check for yourself

  • Liam64 #44 3 years ago

    I'd be interested to know how many people defending the game played it when it was new, on the N64. There's a strong feeling of nostalgia in a lot of people's posts. The game isn't being reviewed as a retrospective, it's being reviewed as a new title that has just been released, like all other Live Arcade games. 5/10 seems about right to me. If no-one had played it previously, and no-one had any fond memories, it would be getting slagged off a lot more than it is right now. Because it doesn't stack up.

  • X #45 3 years ago

    Also disagree with this review. I could see where it is coming from if you never played the original and are now playing it for the first time expecting a decent platformer.

    I am one of those who loved the originals however (disappointed by the direction they took the new one in) and got used to the little quirks so all of the faults are not faults in my eyes. If you didn't play the originals but understand that it is a 10 year old N64 game brought to the Arcade in 2008 then, again this score should be of little use when deciding whether to buy it.

  • Der_tolle_Emil #46 3 years ago

    Trial and error gameplay? It saddens that people nowadays call everything trial and error as soon as you can make a mistake or two. It's a challenging game, that's for sure. And I don't care wether people enjoy linear levels where the only thing you have to do is press forward and then stop for a second or so to completely refill your healthbar. If that is what people enjoy I don't blame them.

    What I don't get it is why everything else is stamped off as unforgiving, ancient, trial and error etc. BK is not a game where you constantly fall to your death without having any chance to avoid it. In fact it is always your own mistake if you do so.

    I'm sold, even if 1200 points is more than most other XBLA games. It's definitely worth it.

  • Cappy #47 3 years ago

    I agree that Blast Corps is the Rare title most deserving of a revisit. Banjo was always a more poorly designed derivation of Mario 64.

  • peasoup #48 3 years ago

    If you think this game is better than Mario 64 you are off your rocker.Of course you're entitled to your own opinion :)

  • Calgon #49 3 years ago

    OMG Yet again Eurogamer showing they are in Microsoft's back pocket obviously, wait what?...

    Hmmm perhaps alot of the harshness towards Rare is from disgruntled fans of Nintendo in the snes - N64 days with sentiments of"Its not right seeing this on a none Nintendo console"... unless of course EG have treated Virtual Console with the same scrutiny as they have here(I really dont know if they have or not but I did see 10/10 in there for a few of them).
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 15:12

  • firefly #50 3 years ago

    It's difficult to know where to stand on this one. When I started replaying the game it was hugely nostalgic, and I quickly got through the Mumbo's Mountain level. However as the game progressed I began to have more and more frustrations - particularly in areas that required precision control or a half decent camera. By the time I got to the final boss things got even worse as I remembered that the whole affair is broken into four sections ranging from the simple first two parts to a frustrating third and bloody difficult final section. Of course die at the end and you have to do the whole lot again.

    Of course this was gaming in 1998 and as a school child with limited funds available and lots more free time than I have now I was happy with such things. Nowadays I have less free time and more games and I don't want to keep dying at the same boss fight. In defense of this port though they did fix some of the worst excesses of the original - namely the fact that if you died on a level with 99/100 notes, or 4/5 Jinjos you'd have to collect the whole lot again. At least this time you only have to pick up what you missed the first time around.

  • BadBoyBonner #51 3 years ago

    Guess Mario 64 would be getting a 4 out of 10 on virtual console then?

  • muscleblade #52 3 years ago

    I love Rare. Ive loved them since NES days. Snake Rattle N Roll comes to mind. I will try the demo when it comes out. I never usually try the XBLA demos. Either i buy the full game or just skip it alltogether. I will make an exception for Banjo even though ive decided not to buy it just to see if i change my mind.

  • seasidebaz #53 3 years ago

    Viva Pinata and VP 2 are great. so that's not true at all.

    No, Viva Pinata is a fairly solid 7/10. It is fine until micromanagment kills the whole relaxation of the thing. Which is after about 4 hours.

    There's no harshness towards Rare from me either for being on a non-Nintendo console. In fact I used to like their Speccy games. The simple fact is, they can't make fantastic games anymore.

  • Landmaster #54 3 years ago

    I hate Eurogamer.

  • Monkey_Puncher #55 3 years ago

    "The game isn't being reviewed as a retrospective, it's being reviewed as a new title that has just been released, like all other Live Arcade games"

    That's an absoloutly bullshit approach to reviewing retro games then. Are you telling me Sonic 2 should be reviewed in line with games like Call of Duty 4 and Bioshock? "No 3D, awful graphics, unforgiving level design 2/10"

    If you're picking up a retro game like this and expecting the graphics and production quality to be on par with a modern game, me thinks you might be looking in the wrong place.

  • rogueJT #56 3 years ago


    So is Banjo Tooie definitely coming to Live?

    Please respond!

  • Muddtallica #57 3 years ago

    Like a lot of people, I was once firmly of the opinion that Banjo-Kazooie was better than Mario 64; I played both in fairly close succession not long after I purchased my N64, and B-K just seemed so much more varied, vibrant, and full of character. Within a year, though, my opinion did a complete 180-degree switch; maybe it's because I then played Donkey Kong 64, which exposed the flaws of the template established by B-K by stretching them to breaking point (collect all 80,000 bananas to unlock a new hat!), but even on its own merits Banjo's game mechanics, level design and overall aesthetic just seemed to age incredibly badly once the sheen of its presentation and scope had diminished, particularly in comparison to Mario. Given the way that both the genre and the technology have developed even further since then, I can't see any reason to hope that the game would appear anything other than even worse now...this is one I'm definitely leaving to nostalgic memories, I think. Great music, though. :)

  • Britesparc Verified Creative, ITV #58 3 years ago

    Banjo Tooie is definitely coming out on Live.

    Incidentally, this does sound like a very harsh way to review a retro game. I know time is rarely kind to these games, but I'd have thought (considering how good this was at the time) a 6 or 7 at least unless they made a technical hash of it, which doesn't seem to be the case.

    Still, I've not played it and can't be arsed buying it either, so I'd best shut up. N&B is still great, though. Also, Mudtallica does make a pretty convincing argument: I too once thought this loads better than Mario 64, a position I've since reversed.
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 15:28

  • andywilkie35 #59 3 years ago

    Its true that its harsh to review this whilst comparing with how modern games are, but that being said, I played Mario 64 recently and I can honestly say that holds up to the test of time. I had this on the N64 and it was always second to Mario 64....

    I'll probably still get it though

  • Calgon #60 3 years ago

    lol Fanboys facts are amusing... if only they knew how silly that looks to make claims of facts because of their personal tastes.

    "pizza is better tasting than ravioli and thats a fact people" :p

  • mechamonkey #61 3 years ago

    RareLOL

  • Daithi #62 3 years ago

    I'm loving this again, the camera is annoying and there has been sporadic slowdown in 1080P (not enough to make me bother switching to 720 yet though) but it's the first retro game I've enjoyed as much as i thought i would.

  • GrumpyLlama #63 3 years ago

    Are people really saying that Banjo is/was better than Mario 64? Come on get a grip. Mario 64 is a classic, Banjo was a good clone but its just missing the spark that sets a good game from a great one. Just my opinion obviously.

  • Der_tolle_Emil #64 3 years ago

    It's true that it's not as good as Mario 64. At least in my opinion, I can't argue for other people. If they enjoy it more than SM64 then let them have their fun. But even if a lot of people think that SM64 is the better game that still makes a lousy argument as to why BK is supposedly not a good game.

  • aliki #65 3 years ago

    lol rare

  • Darren #66 3 years ago

    @muscleblade - Just because I don't always complete the games, doesn't mean I don't enjoy them or get many hours of play out of them. I've played GTA IV for over 90 hours across the PS3 and Xbox 360 versions and have completed neither. Some of those games *will* be finished over a period of time as was the case with Kameo for example which I finished after a year but not every game interests me enough for me to complete it but that's not something I'm going to know before I buy it, is it? ;)

    If I complete a game then it means it was good enough to keep me playing it until the end. If I want to play through it again, like with Banjo-Kazooie, then it means it's exceptional.

    P.S. I *have* completed Call of Duty 4, finished it within weeks of getting it last year, so I don't know why you think I haven't. I wouldn't judge my gaming habits purely on Achievements (if that is what you're doing) because I'm not in the slightest bit interested in online gaming so I don't earn many points there, if any.
    Edited by 2 at 25/11/08 @ 16:13

  • Calgon #67 3 years ago

    Banjo was a good clone but its just missing the spark that sets a good game from a great one.

    By that you mean plumbers I take it?

  • Darren #68 3 years ago

    @GrumpyLlama - Well everyone is different and for me Mario 64 is the more dated game of it and Banjo-Kazooie, something I realised when I purchased it for my Wii last year as I've barely played it. I loved it at the time but I can't be bothered to play it now, totally unlike Banjo-Kaooie, which I'm loving every second of despite this being my THIRD run through. I'm not saying that Mario 64 isn't a great game but it is very much of its time for me and personally I'd rather play Super Mario Galaxy now than that.

  • Krelle #69 3 years ago

    Call my crazy, but I enjoyed this more than Mario64 "back in the day". The world is just fantastic, colorful and cozy. And, i really fukken love collecting Notes.

    EDIT: Oh! Im far from the only one who enjoyed BK, I notice. *Highfives everyone* (even the haters, they need some love aswell)

    EDIT: They got the amount of collectibles just right in BK.
    The overflow of bananas/characters in DK64 killed that for me, and Starfox Adventures is a rather nice game with laugable collection-mania. Also, the way you collect coins to reach 100 in Mario-games is not as fun as vacuum-cleaning a BK-level for that last Note.
    Edited by 2 at 25/11/08 @ 16:21

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #70 3 years ago

    Banjo Kazooie was better looking, more varied in gameplay and funnier than Mario 64. I enjoyed is considerably more, and for longer than mario in the day. Click-clock wood's four-dimensional puzzles are one of the best pieces of games design I can think of, exploring the sorts of ideas revistited in Braid all these years later.

    It also irritated me that there was an anti-banjo brigade, that seemed to be led by the editorial team of Edge who were constantly doing it down, describing it as a pale imitation etc. Which struck me as odd, since at the time, even if I conceeded that my preference was a matter or personal taste, the original Banjo Kazooie was certainly the second-best game of its type be a considerable margin. Kristan's attitude is very reminiscent of all that to me.

    I particularly don't like the 'If you defend this, you're just spouting blinkered nostalgia' argument in the review.

  • Darren #71 3 years ago

    Well Banjo-Kazooie's level design was more interesting and inventive for me than Mario 64 and the different worlds were less obviously designed for a game so consequently they were far more fun to explore. It was also bigger and felt more varied with all the different moves. Also the music, graphics, cheesy British humour and the charming personality of the two leads made Banjo-Kazooie more memorable for me but, let's face it, Mario himself has no real personality, it's only that people recognise who he is because he's been in 10,000 other Mario games where he was also a nobody! Granted B-K "borrowed" a lot of elements from Mario 64 but IMO Rare made a better game overall and one that has stuck with me for the past ten years. I think of the game and it makes me smile.

    If a game does that to you then it's hard for anyone to convince you otherwise that something else was better and, besides, there's no right or wrong when it comes down to which game is better anyway, it's just down to personal taste.

  • carrotcake #72 3 years ago

    I played it all day and night to 100% completion, which is something I never managed to achieve ten years ago. Entirely forgot that I have a real life separate to that of the game while I was playing. Never got uncomfortable or bored. It's my favourite Xbox 360 game, along with Ninja Gaiden II. Cannot wait for Banjo-Tooie to come to XBLA. I remember it being bigger and better than the original. Still haven't played Nuts & Bolts; I only managed to get the original game because they accidentally put it on the XBL Marketplace, briefly. Thanks to the person who made the forum post linking to the kotaku article about it.

    I can see why someone might not like B-K though. At first I wasn't impressed with the graphics and camera, and the levels didn't seem as big as I remembered them, but after the easy tutorial stuff was over I just sort of got over it and became addicted. I still much prefer platformers like this and Super Mario Galaxy over something like Call of Duty any day.

  • Darren #73 3 years ago

    Yeah, replaying Banjo-Kazooie now: the first thing I thought when I'd completed three of the worlds was that they didn't seem anywhere near as big as I remembered them. Mind you, I had just been playing B-K: Nuts & Bolts so that be partly the reason why! LOL

  • Mayhem64 #74 3 years ago

    I still think Mario64 is the better overall title, but there are certainly parts to BK that are better than it. I absolutely loved it when it first came out, and I actually fired it up on a proper N64 not so long ago just to refresh my memory given I knew it was coming out on XBLA. My thoughts haven't changed about it, although like Goldeneye, you can see it has aged a bit in the ten years since. Still a damn fine game though, and worth far more than 5/10 given here.

  • FenderMaster #75 3 years ago

    Very harsh EG...

    The game has aged, but it is still a superior (possibly the best) example of the genre

  • seasidebaz #76 3 years ago

    @warzin:

    That's cos Saints Row 2 is actually better. It's a marked improvement over the first game, and knows how to make fun at itself and others.

  • login_name #77 3 years ago

    This and Diddy Kart Racing were both poor imitations. Sorry, but they were poo back then and still poo now, albeit very nicely decorated poo. Of course, this is just my opinion.

    I still have a soft spot for Goldeneye though. Which is why I hope they never re-release it.

  • Bitkari #78 3 years ago

    ...but Ms. Pacman gets an 8?

  • Xerx3s #79 3 years ago

    Sorry, but having played the game: Bollocks to the review.

    EDIT: And I barely played the original so there are no retro glasses here.
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 17:31

  • the_dudefather #80 3 years ago

    wait, whats going on? Banjo is shit? diddy kong racing is shit? donkey kong country was shit?

    Nintendo have clouded your minds! in the words of Niteninja: WAKE UP!

  • BBIAJ #81 3 years ago

    Having never played either of the N64 Banjo games (I'd either sold my N64, or just wasn't clued up enough back then), this review has actually made me even more interested in the game, and am looking forward to grabbing the trial on the 3rd December even more so to see once and for all just what all the fuss is about!

    I loved X-Box Conker and Grabbed By The Ghoulies, and hope this will have the same charm and humour.

  • Kyle #82 3 years ago

    I couldn't disagree more. Admittedly there are some really bad bits of slow-down, but they're not so frequent that I wouldn't buy the game and, in my opinion, the camera isn't as much of an issue as this review makes it out to be.
    It's certainly worth the 1200 points, especially if you consider the sheer amount of content compared to othe LIVE Arcade games that go for the same amount.

  • Daithi #83 3 years ago

    @ login_name: Couldn't disagree more, I've never had a bad thing to say about Mario 64, preffered Banjo at the time but there was so little between them that for me it's pretty irrelevant. Diddy Kong on the other hand was so much more enjoyable than Mario Kart (single player at least, can't actually remember what multi was like), I've never even looked at another Mario Kart game since the N64 version. The thing I'd like most from Rare now is an avatar version of Diddy Kong, give me that game play with avatars and I'd be there in a shot.

  • LausDomini #84 3 years ago

    I disagree so wholeheartedly with this review that I created an account just now to post this comment.

    I have beaten the game (13 hours) and unlocked all 12 achievements and it is definitely one of the top 5 XBLA games out there. The game looks great on an HDTV and I experienced no slowdown. The camera is slightly finicky and swimming controls are difficult, but overall the game is an absolute gem. Addictive and very fun exploring the worlds and figuring out where all the jigsaw pieces are. Yes the nostalgia shaped my view of the game, but I found it to be just as fun as it was ten years ago. 9/10.

  • dudefella #85 3 years ago

    Do not agree with this review at all. I'll leave it at that. Retro game reviews are sort of pointless anyway.

  • Toadie48 #86 3 years ago

    I dis-agree so much with this review.

    1'st off the gameplay was a slight evolution on Mario 64.

    Next the camera was way better then Mario 64.

    The music is amazing, where did you mention anything about the compositions in the game in that review?

    Next the graphical textures arn't that great, it is a Nintendo 64 game. What Nintendo 64 game has better textures then this. Some but very few.

    Trial and error gameplay? Come on! I could say that any game has trial and error gameplay to an extent.

    Im not knocking the review for this. After all a review is an OPINION and OPINIONS can't be wrong just mis understood. But I think that the review doesn't show enough of the merits to this game and shows too much bad points. Almost as if the review was nit-piking bad points just to justify that score.

  • Snidesworth #87 3 years ago

    5/10? What madness is this? And apparently Kirstin never learned the move that sends you slamming directly down into the ground, seeing great use as "that thing which stops you from flying right now". And poor level design my arse.

  • BMXer #88 3 years ago

    5/10 is a piss take. It was deserving of a
    Better score. After being sucked into this all weekend I disagree with arwardcamera and controls.

  • fluff_the_tiger #89 3 years ago

    it was never that good the first time around.

    +1 to the return of Blast Corps though

  • Pulsar_t #90 3 years ago

    WTF is it with you N64 fanboys? I haven't had a good laugh like this in ages. Getting worked up like this is hilarious. Tools.
    Oh and all N64 platformers sucked. As much as the system did.

  • J.C #91 3 years ago

    Dont agree with that review at all. in fact, its one of the worst i have read in a while. kristan was probably still in nappies when Rare released this excellent game.

  • Picnic #92 3 years ago

    I didn't buy an N64 until after I'd bought a Gamecube (and I got what must have been one of the last brand new N64s in shops at the time too for only £50, including Mario 64 as standard).

    Unfortunately for Banjo Kazooie, I actually played Conker's Bad Fur Day (and, I think, Donkey Kong 64) first and so BK's first world, Mumbo Mountain, did initially feel like one of the lesser platformers on the PS1 by comparison. I found it a much harder game to start with- I had no idea what the things I was collecting did.

    To cut a long story a bit shorter, it has since become apparent that Banjo Kazooie avoids the excesses, in different ways, of Donkey Kong 64 and Conker's Bad Fur Day and is a beautiful, well designed game. The more self consciously 'funky' DK64, whilst sporting some great mini games and the memorable mine cart section, had you repeating your same tracks with 5 different characters and its desert level that gave a deja vu sense of Banjo Kazooie. Conker's Bad Fur Day may have refreshingly dispensed with most collectables altogether but its darker tone and gross-out humour makes it an acquired taste.

    Banjo Kazooie, on the other hand is entirely like a great fairytale, like a collection of great surreal bedtime stories- wicked witches, treasure islands, journeys under the same with giant whales/sharks, haunted houses, getting lost in the woods etc.... But it also has a sense of some kind of groundedness eg Rusty Bucket Bay. It takes the Mario 64 idea of jumping into paintings and gives them a better twist- you create a picture using jigsaw pieces but, brilliantly, you don't do anything as obvious as jumping into the picture- it simply opens up a door elsewhere, sometimes close by and sometimes quite a trek away.

    The worlds are all found around the witch's lair whch is a complex level in its own right. To access certain areas that contain the entrances to those worlds, you must reach more than a certain amount of musical notes the amount being your best number collected in total from all worlds you have accessed. But you don't only need to collect musical notes in each world. you need to collect the aforementioned jigsaw pieces, 'Jiggies' as well. You don't have to collect every single one but, as level progress, it becomes evident that to reach the later stages, you may need to replay earlier ones.

    I didn't play Banjo Kazooie with any sense of nostaligia clouding my mind as I played it about 5 or more years after it had been released. In some ways the experience sometimes feels like it could have been expanded, e.g. Mad Monster Mansion itself could have been bigger inside. (in some ways the castle in Conker's Bad Fur Day fulfills this desire). It can be annoying missing a musical note when you are swimming down a tube in Clanker's Cavern (that actually seems like design rather than accident as in Freezeezy Peak Banjo is forced to jump over a section of a slope, making it necessary to go back up on foot).

    There's something about the way that Rare were getting to grips with the N64 that makes this game their most charming N64 game- the way that the sharks (that are thankfully not overused) in the game appear out of nowhere makes them more mysterious. Mysterious is a good word to use about Banjo Kazooie and is summed up in the great idea of Click Clock Woods, that you must play the same level in different seasons. Maybe it seems dated to some but I see a lot more timeless game here than Super Mario Sunshine turned out to be, although Super Mario Galaxy looks very, very good. It's a Dream of a Project indeed, worthy of at least 8/10 even now- I'll still give it 9- perhaps it's playing it on the Xbox360 that diminishes the experience- much better to play it on the N64 surely despite (or perhaps because of) some graphical differences. How can a fly accidentally crashing into a more see through Rare badge look as good as the old one? How can 'Microsoft Game Studios' surplant Nintendo in the opening section when the game was derived from the Rare/Nintendo spirit of invention?
















    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 19:39

  • seasidebaz #93 3 years ago

    Oh and all N64 platformers sucked. As much as the system did.

    The N64 still sold more during its lifetime than the original Xbox. And more than the 360 has so far.

  • WillyWanka #94 3 years ago

    Still first day purchase. banjo is teh sexxez, you're fucking WRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANG eg!

  • Pulsar_t #95 3 years ago

    The N64 still sold more during its lifetime than the original Xbox. And more than the 360 has so far.

    I was being aggressive due to the tone of this topic. I didn't mean that literally. You people need to get over yourselves.
    As for me the only two games I treasure on the N64 are Waverace 64 and Sin and Punishment. There's little else to worry about.
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 19:54

  • knocker #96 3 years ago

    oh - I missed BK first time round. And after going nuts over mario 64 first - and second time round I will give it a try. Though it would be hard to top SM64 - which still ranks as one of my favourite games ever.n

    Oh - and another vote for blast corps. And diddy kong racing was better than mk64.

    Not for the first time a comments thread has over-ridden the review. Equally retro games have the best (albeit nostalgic) comments :-)

    (apropos nothing - iPhone wanted to turn my mistyped diddy kong into 'soddy kong' !)

  • seasidebaz #97 3 years ago

    You people need to get over yourselves.
    Already did. BK is 10 years old. I paid £50 or whatever it was 10 years ago for it. I'm not paying £10 again for it now when I can get something far better, and far more modern, for the same price. Therefore, 5/10.

    And diddy kong racing was better than mk64
    Getting eaten by a giant poo-monster is better than mk64. Definately the low point of the series, the SNES one is still best.

    iPhone wanted to turn my mistyped diddy kong into 'soddy kong'
    You may like Banjo then, tbh, as you appear to value style over substance.

  • knocker #98 3 years ago

    you were being 'aggressive due to the tone of the topic' the topic being; retro cartoony video games ?

    Then tell other people to get over themselves !?

    Hahaha funny

  • knocker #99 3 years ago

    50 quid ? Really ?

    Iphone is my work phone. Would post with my phone - but would have to pay for it - and it only works half the time ! Agree over mario kart though .... I hope the poo was an apt conker reference ;-)

    Editted for drunken abuse - apologies :-(
    Edited by 1 at 25/11/08 @ 21:09

  • seasidebaz #100 3 years ago

    Yep. 50 quid was the norm for cartridge-based games of 10 years ago.

    Beats the NES though with its £60-per-game thing. And that was the 80s ffs!

  • Mayhem64 #101 3 years ago

    Not sure what shops you were buying from, NES games were 40 quid round my way in the late 80s. Still a lot for a teenager though to save up for here...

  • RedSparrows #102 3 years ago

    I remember paying £60 for DK64 and the exp. pack. I loved that game, despite the criticism levelled at it/the water level which sucked.

    BK = love. 1200 points atm seems a bit steep, despite my oft-professed love. I know I'll be sorely tempted, however.

  • RedSparrows #103 3 years ago

    'Oh and all N64 platformers sucked. As much as the system did.

    The N64 still sold more during its lifetime than the original Xbox. And more than the 360 has so far. '

    The thing to pick out here is not system, but genre. He said that Mario 64 and BK sucked.

    Which = LOL, seeing as the former is probably the finest ever, and the latter is almost as good.

  • Pulsar_t #104 3 years ago

    Let us all agree 3D platforming < 2D platforming :p

  • RedSparrows #105 3 years ago

    Lies, had more fun on Mario 64 than any 2D game, including the glorious SMW.

  • hoathenfold #106 3 years ago

    I just looked on Live Arcade Marketplace for this and cant see it? Whats going on?

  • zooms #107 3 years ago

    Really don't agree with the review. I'm still finding the game as engaging as I did originally. Soon as you start to grok the way the level design works any notion of "Trial and Error" gaming is blown away - you just start to understand where places and objects of interest will have been put - very satisfiying.

    Much better than the humorless Mario64, or the sterile Super Mario Galaxy being produced by the Nintendo "Fun" camps.

  • Liam64 #108 3 years ago

    "Retro game reviews are sort of pointless anyway."

    I know I've already said this, but they're only pointless if you're looking back. Banjo Kazooie has just been released as a new Arcade game, and as such should be reviewed as one. You can't go around saying "all games should be reviewed fairly and honestly... except the ones I have fond memories of."

  • Landmaster #109 3 years ago

    I still have my £49.99 receipt from day one inside my prestiene Banjo-Kazooie's box.
    Ahh (:

  • dk_rare #110 3 years ago

    Collecting IS fun and rewarding, I don't know why people would think otherwise. Sure some games have given collecting a bad name, but when it comes down to it there is nothing else that is a truly pure gaming experience.

    Also Eurogamer, you forget to mention a classic gaming past time that died at the end of the 90s. I am of course talking about "clocking" games, which is to say finishing them as quick as you can while collecting as much as you can. The leaderboards for this game justify your clocking and you can see how good you are compared to your friends or on a world wide ranking.

    And finally this is a piece of gaming history, you would be insane not to own it (though the price is a little insane too, considering that the people most likely to buy this will already have a copy of it in their closet).

    The only fault is that I am a big boy now. When I first played it the worlds seemed HUGE and collecting everything on even a single level was a monumental task. But now that I have grown up the big boy toilet doesn't seem as big anymore. Wait, I mean the levels seem tiny in real life compared to how I saw them all those years ago.

    And Eurogamer, why did you not mention the fantastic music? By far the best rendition of Teddy Bears Picnic ever created, and the seamless theme changes to the song as you walk around is something so simple and clever that you wonder why almost no other game has done it since.

    I'd say this game deserves a 8/10 for the fans, 7/10 for everyone else and a 4/10 for the hyperactive tossers who masturbate over Halo and think that the story line in Halo was too cerebral for them to understand.

  • fanboy_bionicjim #111 3 years ago

    It's a shame that the reviewer knocked this port of the original Banjo Kazooie game for not meeting standards that I don't believe apply. The concept for this XBLA game was to either introduce or re-introduce the characters for their new X360 game. Instead of doing a vast overhaul of both sound and graphics, a la Conker on the original Xbox, they've utilized the original art and sound and spiffed it up to play on a widescreen TV. The results are better than I dreamed.

    If you've ever downloaded a $10 N64 game from WiiWare, you'll see what happens when almost nothing is done to enhance a title. I got burned by Nintendo with Super Paper Mario, which looks pretty crappy on a modern TV. With BK, Microsoft has decided to go the extra mile by cleaning-up the character models so they're not jaggy and using a typeface that's very readable. Everything I loved about BK 10 years ago is still there, in high-res, with surround sound, and better than I expected.

    As for the complaint in the review that this game shows off how bad game design was 10 years ago, I disagree. I'll play through this game for the next few weeks while I let everything else sit on the shelf. My 3 year-old daughter couldn't sleep the night I bought this game and when I sat her on my lap to show her what I was playing, she was instantly engaged and laughed out loud at the characters and their antics (especially as Banjo slides on his face down a slope before he gets the power to use Kazooie's claws). She's never really cared about any of the other games I've showed her. She calls it "My Game" now.

    I look forward to getting some time this weekend to continue playing "My Game" with her as there really isn't anything like it out there right now. Rare was at the top of their form 10 years ago. They invested heavily in creating a memorable character and providing it with a world to interact and explore within. It was great then and is great now.

  • Trevannosaurus #112 3 years ago

    I'm really enjoying it at the moment. I only bought the xbox yesterday, got this straight away and all my new super-de-dooper graphic games are sat waiting till I finish Banjo.

    One thing I noticed was different is that it will save your notes so if you die mid level you don't have to find all the notes again which is making it a lot less frustrating but somehow a bit less rewarding. Onto Mad Monster Mansion!

  • Woffls #113 3 years ago

    Ultimately it's still fun to play. Sure it's entrenched in old mechanics, but they aren't broken and the game is still enjoyable. I'd rather not justify it as I'm sure anything worthwhile will get lost in the other 119 comments on this story, but it really comes down to me getting everything in the game AGAIN and still thoroughly enjoying it. Nostalgia does not apply as I played it recently anyway.

  • viper51989 #114 3 years ago

    They gave this a 5/10 because they judged some of the gameplay mechanics to be unpolished by today's standards? And they gave Fable II, a game that is fundamentally broken, a perfect score? What a joke

  • seasidebaz #115 3 years ago

    OK, I think I've FINALLY got the gist of this, after enduring countless comments lists (including this one):

    1. Kristan Reed isn't allowed to write objectively, it hurts the Xbots' feelings.
    2. Every game on the 360 must get high marks, or it hurts the Xbots' feelings.
    3. If it doesn't get a high mark (based on hype / feelings towards game), then the XBots come together like nanobots with their cries of "I've played this, it's definately a 9, EG is wrong"... Even if the game's not out yet.
    4. Don't put any numbers in a comment, the Xbots will pull bigger ones from their collective arse.

    I mean come on, it's getting silly now. Play nicely. No need to so zealously defend the little off-white box of jet engines and red rings.

  • Widge #116 3 years ago

    I think its more from the perspective that people gave this an internal high mark based on love for the game a long time ago. If goldeneye got ported and released now, it would get spanked in reviews. I actually found an N64 dumped in my apartments waste area a couple of years back. It had goldeneye with it and I booted that up with glee. Found that it looked and played like arse.

    If it gets released now, then it has to be judged as such, not on memory.

  • Pulsar_t #117 3 years ago

    @Widge
    Finally someone with sense comments here!

  • seasidebaz #118 3 years ago

    @Widge:

    I did the same thing, although I found mine in a cupboard at my grandad's house.

    The amazing resolution of 320x200 or whatever it was really cuts into your eyes ;)

  • knocker #119 3 years ago

    @seasidebaz Yeah thianks for the brief history lesson on video games prices : if you had a time machine you'll find a forum posting I made making the point about snes games at the time ;) I had gone ntsc/imports by N64 times - so wasn't aware they were still that bad.

    Kristan can't write an objective review. It would be damn near impossible and exceptionally boring of it was. He writes pretty damn good subjective reviews in my (subjective) opinion, I may not agree with his opinion - but value it.

    Can't see where "xbots" and the rest really fits into this particular discussion - certainly agree with the general point though.

    Like your iphone comment you have strong opinions which you like to share - whether they are appropriate or not ;-) I use mine for ssh, a lightweight wireless NAS, reading web pages - and rarely for phone calls. If I liked style over substance my main phone wouldn't be a N95 ;)

  • knocker #120 3 years ago

    @widge

    It's hard to say how we should approach reviewing of retro-games. I don't hold too much with the "games as art" thing. But if, for example, the original Nosferatu was re-released - anyone criticizing it for flickery picture quality, being in black and white or not widescreen would be laughed at.

    We can either look at them in the context of the time, or as they stand up today. Very very few games manage to achieve success in both areas. Mario Kart snes as Seasidebaz mentions would be an example of one that would.
    Edited by 1 at 26/11/08 @ 09:16

  • seasidebaz #121 3 years ago

    Just making a point though. The 360 has some great games, and I love my Xbox. The PS3 has some great games, and I love my PS3.

    Both have shit games. The 360 has more games in total, and therefore more shit games than the PS3. But I have never seen a group actively defend the shit games as much as the people on here, defending every possible Xbox game to the bitter end.

    BK is a 10 year old game. It has 10 year old mechanics. It has 10 year old graphics. It has 10 year old MIDI sound. It DESERVES a 5/10. N64 games don't age well, in fact 99% of 3D games don't age well. If I wanted to play an N64 game, I'll play it emulated seeing as I can then run it at 1600x1200 resolution with huge amounts of AA and ansiotropic filtering, with a framerate that remains rock steady throughout.

    I'm all for retro gaming, but not when I already own / have owned / have completed the games, and then have to pay a further £10 for the same game where I can actually buy the original for about £1.99 and use it on the hardware it was made for. (edit: Plus, you can't even pay £10 for it. You need to buy points in stupid denominations, and the nearest is 2100 points for £17... Or about the price of a decent pre-owned game)

    I don't try and "do" fanboy inciting, I leave that to Eurogamer and their faceoffs. What I DO do, however, is agree with most of the reviews that emerge. Trouble is, the Xbox fanboys on here are just that. Complete, unabashed, fanatical fanboys, willing to believe that the Xbox360 is the last bastion of hope for gaming.

    If I really wanted to incite fanboys, I can just spout the truth: The 360, 2 days after its 3rd birthday, surpassed sales of the original Xbox. Which were totalled up over the 3 years 6 months that it was available. And THAT console was deemed a failure.
    Edited by 1 at 26/11/08 @ 09:41

  • Oceadge #122 3 years ago

    I'm a little late after so many similar comments but I just have to say that I totally disagree with this review. It still plays really well. I haven't enjoyed a game this much in ages. I got this last Wednesday, along with Nuts & Bolts and Left 4 Dead. I've barely touched Left 4 Dead. The two Banjo Kazooies are far better in my opinion.

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #123 3 years ago

    @seasidebaz

    You're off-target, mate. It's not Xbox fanboys you're dealing with, it's N64 platform game fanboys (and their young children, apparently - thanks fanboy_bionicjim).

    And we're totally right and you and Kristan are wrong.

  • seasidebaz #124 3 years ago

    "I have never seen a group actively defend the shit games as much as the people on here"

    YOU think the game is shit. The general concensus from posters here is that they DO NOT think the game is shit.

    Touchy. And proving my point.

  • seasidebaz #125 3 years ago

    I'm not the first, and it's nothing to do with the platform it's on.

    As I said, it's a 10 year old game, with 10 year old mechanics, 10 year old graphics, 10 year old MIDI sound, and hasn't aged well. At all. And this coming from someone who, when I went and bought that marvellous grey cartridge, had a 6 hour non-stop session on it. And loved every single minute of it.

    edit: I'd wager some people defending BK here don't even own an Xbox.
    Then they have no room to talk.
    Edited by 1 at 26/11/08 @ 10:08

  • canIdoyabombsforya #126 3 years ago

    ouch

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #127 3 years ago

    Part of the trouble with the balance of this review is that this site appears to believe that it's perfectly acceptable to appreciate new releases with gameplay that is 20 years out of date, but gives a sound beating to one which has gameplay that is perceived to be 10 years out of date.

    And the complaints about the graphic style are well out of order.

  • seasidebaz #128 3 years ago

    I think I love you.

  • Darren #129 3 years ago

    @Widge - Erm... I think you'll find that some people are commenting on the game having played it on the XBLA as it has been available for pre-orders of Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts & Bolts to download for almost two weeks now and for nought pence. So, no, in my case I'm commenting on the game having completed over 50% of it and for me it's every bit as good I remember so I don't need to wear rose-tinted spectacles. :p

  • Darren #130 3 years ago

    @Mentalist(air) - I think it depends on the person reviewing it to be honest but Kristan Reed's reviews do seem more harsh and erratic than the others and rarely match my own views anyway so he's not someone who I'd trust for reviews particularly, especially in this case.

    I'm not saying he's wrong or anything, that would be absurd, he clearly doesn't like the game. No, it's just that his reviewing criteria for these games seems at odds with how other retro games are reviewed, e.g. the dated Mega Man 9 which relies heavily on memorising level layouts - the dreaded "trail and error" gameplay - got 8/10 but that was reviewed by Dan Whitehead. He should have reviewed this IMO, not because he would necessarily have given it a good score but because I feel he would have been more objective about the game's shortcomings and flaws. He was one of the few who appreciated LEGO Batman for what it was for example and stood by it.

  • Widge #131 3 years ago

    I loved Goldeneye, and once out of uni, bot play with Perfect Dark was awesome. I started off on the Dam on my replay and it was just awful. Plodded along, muddy as you say, the controls that seemed so tight at the time were suddenly awful coming from the land of twin sticks.

    I would expect a good few games from the past wouldn't gleam so brightly now, Jet Force Gemini etc.

    Not all old games become bad by default, some do get worse over time. I slapped Secret Of Mana on my PSP to see if it was rose tinted glasses telling me that it was fantastic after trying the atrocious Sword Of Mana on the GBA (one of 2 games I've returned, ever). Was happy to find that it was still a great game to play! Plus 2D sprites or not, it doesn't matter.

  • Der_tolle_Emil #132 3 years ago

    Mega Man 9 review is a fair comparison. I really enjoyed Mega Man 9 but that's not the point. The point is that Mega Man 9 relies a lot more on trial and error - or better yet - memorizing the level layout and enemy patterns, just as Darren posted. However in the Mega Man 9 reviews those were good things. In this BK review here it's bad game design. I guess some people, myself included, simply don't see why it's a good thing in Mega Man 9 but a bad thing in BK.

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion and reviews are subjective, that just happens when you have different reviewers. However, even though every reviewer will have their own opinion I think it's bad for the site if they do contradict each other; Unless they give good reasons but there aren't any in this review. After all I am visiting the site for an EG review and I don't want to check the name of the reviewer first just to know wether I can "trust" that review or not. I go to EG because usually I know I can trust their reviews. EG has great reviews and I often agree with their opinions but this review contradicts a lot of other EG reviews. Maybe the wrong person reviewed this game. That doesn't mean that I don't respect Reed's opinion, in fact I do - but it seems like this game could not have appealed to him in the first place which makes his opinon as worthless as a review of a metal album of someone who doesn't like metal. Of course it's still his opinion and that person will not find 90% of the things he is looking for.

  • Pulsar_t #133 3 years ago

    Ahahaha thanks for the 3-page laughter Ninty fanboys. Yes and I believe this is latent N64 fanboyism acting up and little to do with current gen fanboyism (though neither is mutually exclusive).

    And you keep wondering why gaming will never grow up.

  • Der_tolle_Emil #134 3 years ago

    The same way music will never grow up when people "discuss" what genre is better? People like to argue, so what.

  • seasidebaz #135 3 years ago

    OK, EG's scoring policy:

    A five won't be a disaster. In fact those who won't have played the better games in the genre might even get a great deal of enjoyment out of it. In a lot of cases scores come down to user expectations, but the standards games are built on are constantly shifting sands; what is ground breaking in one generation is the bare minimum standard a few years down the line, and things we once tolerated routinely can suddenly become very irritating.

    Now read the above and tell me a 5 is wrong. Cos it damn well sounds like a 5/10 to me.

  • iago71 #136 3 years ago

    Edited by 2 at 27/11/08 @ 09:24

  • jamiscool #137 3 years ago

    This game had a personality and humour that few games these days can match. Not only that, but it's a reminder of what is fast becoming a lost genre. For those facts alone I would rate this above a 5.

    I still consider this era to be Nintendo and Rare's golden age. Where there was a drought in Nintendo's release schedule, then Rare would usually chip in a classic game of its own to fill the void, they complimented each other well.

  • merkdot #138 3 years ago

    Rare are fucking terrible.

  • Toadie48 #139 3 years ago

    @ merkdot "Rare are fucking terrible."

    But not Banjo Kazooie! That game is class.

  • merkdot #140 3 years ago

    do me a favour

  • VicViper #141 3 years ago

    Ok first off games never age well, even just 5+ years can do horrible things as graphics, sound and gameplay evolve in the current gaming enviroment. I never played the orginal and I'll try the trial for this to see what the fuss is about.

    If EG are going to do this to retro games on the live where is the reviews of the major releases on the virtual console, where is the re-review for Lylat wars, Mario 64, Zelda OOT etc. Re-review these, will you compare the graphics? sound quality and gameplay compared to todays equlvilent? These where no small titles (In some cases they have become legendary games) in their time, have they just been side lined into a virtual console round-up? Where is the re-reviews for the bigger PSN PSONE re-releases?

    Yes I know that in many cases you can't review all retro release but surely Zelda OOT/Mario 64 is worth a page.

  • merkdot #142 3 years ago

    who said anything about debating?

    did I touch a nerve or something? Curious ad hominem defence.
    Edited by 1 at 26/11/08 @ 15:51

  • Toadie48 #143 3 years ago

    @ merkdot did I touch a nerve or something? Curious ad hominem defence.

    You sir are on drugs! Oh and try punctuation in your comments. Makes you look a little smarter.

  • merkdot #144 3 years ago

    have you guys ever used the Internet before?

  • RedSparrows #145 3 years ago

    You know, the internet'd be a nicer place if you didn't post such things. Being a fool because a system allows it is still you being a fool.

  • seasidebaz #146 3 years ago

    Rare are fucking terrible.

    This is how you debate about Rare being shit.

  • Collymilad #147 3 years ago

    Rare ARE fucking terrible.

    They can't even make a game where the MENU's don't lag.
    Edited by 1 at 26/11/08 @ 22:10

  • hoathenfold #148 3 years ago

    Do you have to buy Nuts and Bolts to get this? I cant find out on the Live Marketplace? Cheers.

  • Darren #149 3 years ago

    It's free for those that pre-ordered Nuts & Bolts hence why many of us in the comments section are able to pass judgement on the game. For the rest of you, it's not out until 3rd December and will cost 1,200 MP (£10.80).

  • hoathenfold #150 3 years ago

    Thanks Darren for clarrification - I wondered why i couldnt find it!

  • Toadie48 #151 3 years ago

    @ Collymilad They can't even make a game where the MENU's don't lag.

    LOL.

  • merkdot #152 3 years ago

    RedSparrows: if Rare weren't fucking terrible you might have a point, but they are, so really I'm just stating an awkward truth.

  • chrisjm #153 3 years ago

    my ignore list has just doubled in size to 2.

  • moz4720 #154 3 years ago

    I don't have a 360 but I'd have to say this review is a bit harsh. I still play this from time to time and it is still fun and an enjoyment to play. I wish there were more games like it around. 8/10 And I do have the right to an opinion as I have the N64 version of this!:)

  • illogicalhawk #155 3 years ago

    I think the game is better than ever. The updated graphics make the game look sharp, and while the textures and geometry obviously aren't up to par with modern technology, the simple fact is that the graphics in no way hinder the player from playing the game nor from recognizing anything in it, and the game still has the same charm it did a decade ago. The camera certainly has its low points, but it's rare that it ever actually causes you to err.

    From the sound of some of your complaints, you simply don't know how to play the game, or have ridiculous expectations. It's a port of a 10 year old game. You don't go in with high expectations, but even so, the game looks great. Go back and play the original if you doubt that.

    The more you pick through the often painfully garish environments, the more it becomes apparent just how irritating most of the mechanics are.

    What's garish about them? They're supposed to be charming, and I can't think of a single one that goes over the top with extravagant decorations.

    Learning to fly is almost as painful, with a ruinous inability to land on any surface without physically being about a centimetre away from it, causing you to constantly overshoot. Precise jumping is something of a dark art as well, thanks to a lack of, well, precision, a restless camera, and an ever-present inertia always threatening to send you too far.

    There's this wonderful thing that's been around since the dawn of our time on this Earth called the 'shadow'. It tells you what you're directly over. And if you're having trouble flying, just do a ground pound as soon as you fly over your target (Again, watch for the mythical 'shadow').

    Inevitably, the novelty value of new moves and abilities gives way to genre clichés, like the obligatory toxic area, and an ice world, and creativity the game takes a tumble.

    Mad Monster Mansion and Click Clock Woods would like a word.

    Jarring slowdown crops up in the unlikeliest scenarios, which is unforgivable for a game of this age.

    It's a problem with the HD settings. Put it down to 720 and it plays flawlessly.

  • convercide #156 3 years ago

    This review is a load of bollocks. The game is as much fun as it was all those years ago.

    A much better selection of reviews.

  • yagisencho #157 3 years ago

    I'm definitely playing this with rose-tinted glasses, but the music alone makes it worth a 6/10. Add HD resolution and a fix for the awful texture blurriness of the N64, and I'm in retro gaming heaven. 8/10 from me, though 800 points probably would have been about the right price.

  • DAN.E.B #158 3 years ago

    GRUNTY/

    This games as good as it was then,
    Well worth a ten out of ten,
    So buy this game ignore the score,
    EG,s talking out their ass for sure!

  • sayargh #159 3 years ago

    You sir are a moron.

    "Nuts & Bolts fans checking this out might take a while to adjust. There's no driving, kids. "

    Urrr.... most people who play Nuts & Bolts actually feel the exact opposite, if you had played the original you'd see what a drastic difference Nuts and bolts is and many of the fans of the original were outraged by the vehicals. I was.

    I personally hated the vehicals at first, I love the game now but i'd still have loved a traditional platformer like this game you gave 5/10, pfft. you wouldn't know a good game if it came and bit you in the face.

    Eurogamer is a joke with people like you around, you don't even bother to know your stuff. If you had you've have known your comment which I pasted above is as stupid as saying that Command & Conquer Generals fans wouldn't like the original C&C.

  • viper51989 #160 3 years ago

    "Learning to fly is almost as painful, with a ruinous inability to land on any surface without physically being about a centimetre away from it, causing you to constantly overshoot. Precise jumping is something of a dark art as well, thanks to a lack of, well, precision, a restless camera, and an ever-present inertia always threatening to send you too far."

    If he's going to make any judgements about the game, it should be compared with other games of its time and genre. Flying in Mario 64 was absolutely more frustrating than in Banjo. I'm not saying that game was ever considered flawless, but it seems like Rare is getting undue criticism here.
    Edited by 1 at 12/12/08 @ 22:06

  • viper51989 #161 3 years ago

    Also, does the game really not have any slowdown in 720p? That would be an excellent discovery because it tends to get a tiny bit choppy at times running in 1080p.

  • addyb #162 3 years ago

    Firstly whats with all the rare hate? Sure they may not be the devs they once were but they deserve a little respect. I remember playing many of there games on my speccy when i was a kid and over the years they have churned out many a great game.
    Snake, Rattle n roll and rc pro am on NES are a joy to behold and are still playable now.
    Obviously we all know rare's crowning glory was Goldeneye and i'll admit that hasnt aged well but to be honest most fps games dont these days.

    As for BK well for me its still the best game they have made and HAS aged well imo. Sure it wont appeal to anyone but with the total lack of decent platform games in todays generation of console i feel its a welcome addition and the more you play the game the more you will grow to love it. I remember playing it again a couple of years ago and nearly turned it off after the painful introductions and total lack of moves but i perservered and once id done a couple of levels i was hooked again.

    This is a quality game and worthy of at 7/10 rating but i suppose if they base the review on how it compares today then i suppose a 6/10 would be fair.

    Im looking forward to getting stuck into this game again as i can remember the board game you play near the end and that was fun! I hope they bring out Conkers Bad Fur day!!

    But no nostalgia tinted goggles here. Its still a fun game and still one of the best platform experiences you can have.

  • Collymilad #163 8 months ago

    Crap review.

    5/10 my arse.