PlayStation 3: Are we there yet?

By Tom Bramwell Published 17 May, 2006

Post-E3: How Sony did.

"The next generation doesn't start until we say it does," says Kaz Hirai. Then again, Sony's E3 conference didn't start when it said it did, so who's counting?

A year ago, Sony stood up in front of the world and outlined a console more powerful than any other, with more forward-thinking technology than any other, and with more big-name games than any other. This year, it did practically the opposite. Gone was the extended technology sermon; instead Hirai name-checked Cell, Blu-ray and RSX to a crowd quite convinced the PS3 was much the same as Xbox 360. Gone was a lot of the forward-thinking technology; ports were shorn from the back of the console, while the new PS3 pad felt like another back-of-the-beermat special from Ken Kutaragi angling after a market Nintendo's had in mind for several years. And while the big-name games were still there, few if any felt close enough to matter.

Still, at least it's more expensive than the others, right?

The addition of motion-sensing to the new controller was one of the big stories. Using the traditional twin-stick Dual Shock design, with slight changes to the analogue sticks and a pair of analogue triggers, it's wireless, like Xbox 360's, and developers told us it lasts about ten hours between charges. A lot of people reacted to the addition of motion sensing by complaining it was very "me too" - Ubisoft Montreal's boss used those exact words - while virtually every developer we spoke to during E3 claimed to have no prior knowledge of it. But while motion sensing has the potential to pay dividends as a differentiator, a more likely result is that third-party publishers will use it as an excuse to co-develop boutique titles for PS3 and Wii, playing to the lowest denominator, the gyroscopic PS3, rather than the more impressive range offered by Wii. Cheers, Sony.

console

But while the motion-sensor was a jarring addition for some at the time, the loss of rumble functionality is likely to be more keenly felt - or rather not. And that could help drive gamers already enticed by Xbox 360's Achievement system towards multi-platform titles on 360. Precisely what Sony was hoping to avoid this time. Can you imagine SEGA Rally without rumble? Gran Turismo HD felt quite flat without it.

Confusion over technical specifications wasn't merely limited to the loss of rumble, either. The fact that you can use a regular hard disk in the PS3, and therefore save yourself the additional cost Sony's levying on the larger capacity, is better than having to make do without, ala the Xbox 360 Core System. It's not the same kind of dual price strategy. And the loss of Memory Stick ports might not grate too much either. But the loss of HDMI is a PR blunder of considerable proportions, and Kaz Hirai's defence of the cut-down 20GB PS3 model on CNN/Money was slightly comical. "The only difference is HDMI - and at this point, I don't think many people's TVs have that," he said. Not many have 1080p either, Kaz - at least try to sound consistent.

In the last 12 months, a lot of what was said at E3 2005 has been exposed as hot air - not least the unconvincing claims that PS3 game footage was running in real time. But the full extent of what's changed only became clear last week. Where are all the ports on the back of the PS3? Last year's prototype had about a dozen of the blighters. This one had three - with no mention of the dual 1080p output resolution everyone thought was preposterous anyway. Allowing players to look at their F1 car wing-mirror on PSP is hardly the same thing. Meanwhile, digital video content came up in just one passing comment, there was little sign of the impressive multi-panel stuff we saw last year (supposedly one of Cell's key strengths), and on the software front there was no sign of Devil May Cry, MotorStorm, Killzone and others.

booth

The software showcase that-was lacked real gravity - at the conference and at the show. When you compare Sony's E3 2006 line-up, six months out from launch, to Microsoft's E3 2005 line-up six months out from its own, the comparison's a bit more flattering - but who's going to do that? As it stands, Heavenly Sword certainly impressed and WarHawk was promising - albeit largely in concept form - while a host of others provoked more raised eyebrows than pulse-rates. MotorStorm belatedly made it onto the Sony show stand in tech demo format, and Resistance: Fall of Man received some positive write-ups, but demos of games like Eye of Judgement fell a bit flat. Gran Turismo HD certainly ran in 1080p at 60 frames per second, but then it used GT4 assets. Bundle it with the system and people will fawn for a bit, then complain about the lack of rumble, the lack of new content, and the lack of assets to rival those in PGR3, which will have been out for a full year by that point. As it is, we've no idea of GT HD's fate. We may never see it again.

With second and third wave 360 titles to face this Christmas, Sony can't afford to be complacent. A surprise Final Fantasy XIII, Metal Gear Solid or Gran Turismo launch announcement would settle nerves a bit, but otherwise an as-yet unconfirmed line-up known only to include SingStar and Fatal Inertia may have to face the likes of Forza Motorsport 2 and Gears of War on a mature 360 system - likely to have seen software revisions to cope with a heaving Live Marketplace, boasting downloadable Live Arcade games from Japan as well as Western independent developers, and a 12-month catalogue of software that already includes the likes of PGR3 and The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion. Most Sony developers we spoke to refused to commit to launch, or even near it, while WarHawk developer Incognito wouldn't either - suggesting that Sony may have a motion-sensing PS3 pad in every PS3 box, but that there won't actually be any games to use it. It's like a third analogue stick in some ways. Right now it's a bit like a third wheel.

With Wii likely to launch at a fraction of the PS3 price, with Metroid and Zelda proposed for launch and Mario a potential latecomer, punters considering their next-gen options may reconsider their PS3 fund's purpose - particularly given that 360 will now host both Halo 3 and Grand Theft Auto IV as soon as they come out. Given the gap between launches, that's likely to have a bearing on how the mass market, at least, greets the next generation. Another round of "target footage", from the likes of Getaway, Eight Days and Naughty Dog's unnamed platform shooter, is not.

heavenly

Finally, the price - greeted by polite applause. From an industry perspective, the price is fine. Sony will sell out the launch allocation at a high price. It worked for PS2 and PSP. But just as GTAIV appearing on PS3 and 360 simultaneously will weigh on the minds of casual gamers - most of whom probably fancy a go on Halo 3 as well - Sony's latest shameless tax on enthusiasm is likely to weigh on the minds of us lot. We buy every single console when it comes out. You're probably the same. But EUR 600 - even EUR 500 - is more than we're used to paying. The arguments need to be made in games, not with Blu-ray, Cell and RSX. Surely you can only cry "Emotion Engine" once?

As for Blu-ray - we're still wondering whether anybody actually wants it. As one colleague put it, when DVD showed up we were sick of VHS. We're not sick of DVD, whatever the benefits of Blu-ray. Nor, in an era where Sony itself is angling toward digital distribution, does anybody particularly care about improved storage capacity on first-gen titles. When games are big enough to fill Blu-ray discs, surely broadband pipes will be big enough to fit them too?

A lot of people in the days following Sony's conference remarked that it had positioned itself as the 90s Microsoft of the games industry. Where Microsoft is slowly starting to convince people that it wants them to have fun just as much as it wants to make money from games, Sony has gone from peering out over everyone at once with a puffed out chest to standing alone in front of a crowd of angry faces on a giant podium marked "diktat". And some of us are getting revolutionary feelings.

Granted, it's much too early to start talking about what will happen at Christmas - with crucial details like PS3 launch line-up, digital download pricing, game pricing and Nintendo's plans to come. But where Microsoft reacted to the criticism of its actions last year, Sony hasn't. Unless you reckon they borrowed the pad idea from Nintendo's TGS and the pricing from Microsoft, of course. There were certainly good things to come out of Sony's conference - a firm launch date, a promise to deliver six million units by next April, some sensible revisions to the pad, that reassertion of full backwards-compatibility and a free online service, Singstar the way we all wanted it in the first place, from day one, and games that look healthier six months out than Microsoft's did at the comparable point. But the tenor of Sony's conference was still quite bleak - and the sense was that it did more harm than good. Kaz Hirai can bluster all he wants, but you can't move the goalposts if you're not on the field.

Stay tuned for more E3 analysis later this week.

Picture of Tom.

About Tom Bramwell

Tom is Operations director of Eurogamer Network and Editor-at-Large of Eurogamer.net. He joined the company in February 2000. Follow him on Twitter.

Read more articles from Tom by visiting the Tom Bramwell archive page.

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Comments (234) Latest comment 6 years ago

Comments for this article are now closed, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • #1 6 years ago

    Wow, a succinct colabaration of the general tone of the EG forums to date.
    Nice to see up a official comments though.

  • ChrisOTR #2 6 years ago

    Is the... errr... visually challenged lady in the background a deliberate dig? ;)

    Oh and yes, what he said. This sums up exactly my feelings.
    Edited by ChrisOTR at 17/05/06 @ 15:04

  • w00t #3 6 years ago

    Classic EG anti-Sony bias ;) [Note - obvious joke]

    Good article, cheers!

  • Huntcjna #4 6 years ago

    Excellent article and highlighted the shortcoming's of the presentation very well.

  • Bertie Verified Senior Staff Writer, Eurogamer.net #5 6 years ago

    Is the... errr... visually challenged lady in the background a deliberate dig? ;)

    Hah! She isn't; a lucky choice I s'pose. Fate? :)

  • Freek #6 6 years ago

    Why tilt sensing replaced rumble.
    Seems reasonable enough, would explaine why nobody knew of it as it really was a last minute bolt on, got to have something in there or it would just be a controller without a feature.

    Expect to see rumble return when the court battle is over.
    Edited by Freek at 17/05/06 @ 15:10

  • ChrisOTR #7 6 years ago

    That does seem to make some sense Freek...

  • lambtron #8 6 years ago

    "Another round of "target footage", from the likes of Getaway, Eight Days and Naughty Dog's unnamed platform shooter, is not."

    How can ANYONE be anticipating a new Getaway game?!? They were terrible!

  • The12thMonkey #9 6 years ago

    A fantastic overview. This is the exact impression I got from all the E3 coverage I got hold of, be that text, video, or podcast.

    Eurogamer stuck to their attitude that Sony had a killer product on their hands after last years' E3, and some people might accuse this as a shift in attitude like leaving a skinking ship, but I think it actually marks out the quality of journalism we generally get here; that Sony's product actually did look killer this time last year, and the competition has bucked it's ideas up, leaving the PS3 suddenly looking very second rate.
    Edited by The12thMonkey at 17/05/06 @ 15:15

  • #10 6 years ago

    I remember reading somewhere that a Sony person said "there waqs nothing wrong with the Dual-Shock..." and then a guy went - "hang on, there IS! It was a PS1 controller with a couple of sticks basically shoved into it".
    Personally I've alway found it uncomfortable and a bit tricky to use well.

    I really do hope though that Sony get their act together and sort it out. Still I don't see their online service as touching Live for a long time anyway. I think you need experience of these things to get good at them - that's something MS did almost from the off with the old xbox - just so they could get the experience to make the next xbox's online service deliver the goods. In that respect I think MS will kick Sony for a while, and Live is a big part of my gaming experience personally.

    Considering how apparently important the online experience is to them, Sony have shown NOTHING in this regard AT ALL. No information of the way it'll work, the infrastructure behind it etc etc.
    Edited by at 17/05/06 @ 15:22

  • JediMasterMalik #11 6 years ago

    I liked the Getaway. Good article EG. It's very unbiased and basically says the most logical thing ever. WAIT AND SEE.

  • blicko #12 6 years ago

    They should have stuck to what they're good at. Fooling journos with pre-rendered videos ;-)

    Seriously though, this whole exhibition is about PR. And on that basis, you have to say that they have failed miserably.

  • atrus #13 6 years ago

    "not least the unconvincing claims that PS3 game footage was running in real time."

    Eurogamer captain to engine room - man the backpedal!!!

    "with no mention of the dual 1080p output resolution everyone thought was preposterous anyway."

    Have people forgotten the "WELCOME TO THE REAL NEXT GEN" Eurogamer article of E3 2005???

    Edited by atrus at 17/05/06 @ 15:18

  • Triggerhappytel #14 6 years ago

    TBH I don't really think any of the big 3 had an especially good E3.

    I thought some Sony games looked good (Heavenly Sword, Resistance, Warhawk), even if there was no killer app (I think God of War 2 should've been PS3, Sony!).

    I hope you are this critical of the other 2, although somehow I doubt it.

  • TurdBreaker #15 6 years ago

    Well written article...

    and quite depressing because it's just too damned acurate :(

  • blicko #16 6 years ago

    "TBH I don't really think any of the big 3 had an especially good E3."

    Didn't see that video of the Wii line? I certainly can't remember Nintendo having a better E3.

  • Cubfan #17 6 years ago

    A little late Eurogamer.

  • The12thMonkey #18 6 years ago

    Would you rather have late and well writen, or rushed cobblers?

  • ProfessorLesser #19 6 years ago

    I told you so :-)

    "I hope you are this critical of the other 2, although somehow I doubt it."

    I presume you are doubtful simply because the other two simply have far less to be critical of?

  • ecureuil #20 6 years ago

    Great article, although much harsher than I expected. This caught my eye -

    "a more likely result is that third-party publishers will use it as an excuse to co-develop boutique titles for PS3 and Wii, playing to the lowest denominator, the gyroscopic PS3, rather than the more impressive range offered by Wii."

    A very good point, and that does raise some concerns. I'd previously thought the motion sensor on the PS3 pad would benefit cross-platform games. I guess we can only hope those concerns are unfounded..

    This Christmas we'll be faced with a choice of a £450 PS3, with £50 games, most of which will be forgettable rubbish, or a £200 (or less) Wii, with Zelda: Twilight Princess, Metroid Prime 3 and the potentially brilliant Wii Sports, with the promise of Mario Galaxy and Smash Bros. in the following 6 months, I'm not even gonna have to think about this one.

  • #21 6 years ago

    and on the software front there was no sign of Devil May Cry, MotorStorm, Killzone and others.
    What is there apart from the sofware front for real gamers? - It's the games!
    These are some glaring ommissions, and the Sony guys should have been heckled to death at the end of the presentation for them.
    Edited by at 17/05/06 @ 15:26

  • Zomoniac #22 6 years ago

    particularly given that 360 will now host both Halo 3 and Grand Theft Auto IV as soon as they come out

    Was there ever any doubt that 360 wouldn't have Halo 3 as soon as it came out? :)

  • NoCodeNed2 #23 6 years ago

    "games that look healthier six months out than Microsoft's did at the comparable point"

    that's an interesting point of view that's not come up much.

  • Triggerhappytel #24 6 years ago

    "Didn't see that video of the Wii line? I certainly can't remember Nintendo having a better E3."

    I think the Wii looks like potentially the most promising of the consoles, but from reports I've read it seems the control still needs a bit of work, and is feeling somewhat tacked-on at the moment.

    Although I appreciate that is based on a bunch of journalists who have probably played the thing for an hour or two each, so it's not gonna be the be-all and end-all of my decision.

    "I presume you are doubtful simply because the other two simply have far less to be critical of?"

    Well - based on what I have seen and read - Microsoft are lacking quality first-party titles this year and the Wiimote still needs a lot of tweaking. That is what I was specifically referring to.
    Edited by Triggerhappytel at 17/05/06 @ 15:31

  • El_MUERkO #25 6 years ago

    Well said EG.

    Sony needs to scrap the budget model, add rumble to the pad (just pay the licence) and drop the price to £399.

    Then it'll sell truck loads.

  • NoCodeNed2 #26 6 years ago

    @Jamesphilp - "and the Sony guys should have been heckled to death at the end of the presentation"

    Wow. you are one angry young man, aren't you : )

    Perhaps we should line them all up so you can stone them - probably more effective than heckling - I reckon you'd go hoarse before anyone actually, you know, died. ; )

    /sorry just found the idea of heckling someone to death amusing and extreme.

  • patchbox360 #27 6 years ago



    Sony certainly has set their standards high - its natural to shoot them down haha

    funny enough the repackaging of the cube with a motion sensor remote is hailed as the best thing ever

    whats the difference between a Wii and a cube with a adapter that allows use the Wii motion sensor remote ???? not a damn thing

    if Sony had introduced a new look ps2 with a motion sensing remote they would have been a joke

  • el_pollo_diablo #28 6 years ago

    We buy every single console when it comes out. You're probably the same.

    You're joking, right?

  • RichGL #29 6 years ago

    Excellent article.

    Sony won't fail to shift those units as the installed hardcore base will easily cover those amounts. However, how they do in the casual gamer league if the price is kept high will remain to be seen.

    Still, I orignally bought a PS2 the week before GTA3 came out. As I allready have a 360 and GTA is coming out simultaneously I can't see me bothering with the PS3. Unless they have some really great next-generation title hidden away that I simply must play of course!

  • kangarootoo #30 6 years ago

    @NoCodeNed2

    "sorry just found the idea of heckling someone to death amusing and extreme"

    You missed childish out of your list. Whatever happened to direct and stern questioning? Heckling is what annoying pissed fuckers do when I am at a comedy gig.

  • HazyUK #31 6 years ago

    Good article.

  • The12thMonkey #32 6 years ago

    Games six months out from launch still don't tip the boat for most people. It takes a big push, a big singular release, or an attractive bundle pack, to shift new consoles after the initial buzz. Obviously, after a year and a half, the sales remain steady, peaking at Chrimbo, but in the first year, it has to be something really special to get people to put money down for something.

    On the PS2, it took nine months (ish) for GT3 to appear, and then they started selling, nicely timed with a bundle pack. And the difference this time, will be the price tag. When you were able to get a PS2 and GT3 for £279.99, it seemed like a pretty good deal during the summer months. Even if there are some excellent titles six-nine months after launch, it's still an investment of over four hundred pounds. And by then, the XBox 360 will have had it's first price cut, and it's line up will be looking very tasty, with some big attractions on the horizon, or already out.

  • #33 6 years ago

    Wow. you are one angry young man, aren't you : )
    Well, it was a figure of speech! It would probably be hard to literally heckle someone to death, but I dunno!? :)
    If you'd like be to neutralise and say "and they should have at least have been challenged on these ommisions given the weight they put on these titles a year ago" then ok. Bland it is, just for you my dear :p

  • Zomoniac #34 6 years ago

    "games that look healthier six months out than Microsoft's did at the comparable point"

    that's an interesting point of view that's not come up much

    It's also a load of bollocks. Apart from Heavenly Sword and Resistance, no PS3 games look graphically as good as the PGR3/Kameo/COD2/DOA4/Oblivion real-time footage that was shown this time last year. IIRC MS had a real-time trailer for Gears Of War as well, if not at E3 then at GC in Leipzig a month or two later.

  • Cubfan #35 6 years ago

    "Would you rather have late and well writen, or rushed cobblers?"

    Late in the sense that they proclaimed the PS3 'The Real Next Generation' at last year's E3, and never raised any doubts about Sony's dubious game footage and whether Sony would actually make good on it's promises. They bought into it. Other sites, forumgoers, all raised doubts after Sony's E3 last year, Eurogamer didn't, and look where we are now. That's what I mean by 'late'.

    With that said, Sony will still be the market leader this gen, however, the lead they had from last gen will diminish.
    Edited by Cubfan at 17/05/06 @ 15:40

  • Kiigan #36 6 years ago

    Good article I thought. Summed it all up pretty nicely.

    It wasn't all doom and gloom of course... MGS4 and Resistance both looked great.

  • #37 6 years ago

    You missed childish out of your list. Whatever happened to direct and stern questioning? Heckling is what annoying pissed fuckers do when I am at a comedy gig.
    I guess you've never watched the house of commons in session then! :)

  • smoothpete #38 6 years ago

    Well written, and bang on.

  • Darren #39 6 years ago

    What a great article. It echoes my own thoughts too.

    I'll still be buying a PS3 but perhaps not at launch, it really depends on what games are available at launch. However, commonsense tells me that I'd be better off buying a Wii and waiting until the price of the 60GB HDD PS3 drops to a most reasonable sub-£300 at least. By then there'll be an even wider choice of decent games...
    Edited by Darren at 17/05/06 @ 15:46

  • NoCodeNed2 #40 6 years ago

    @kangarootoo - yes. I can barely go to comedy nights these days after such experiences.

    @jamesphilp - aah, bland, thankyou...now, where's my bread sandwich.

  • JediMasterMalik #41 6 years ago

    I prefer the ps style controller to the others tbh. :)

    I agree with blackdog!

  • trevd72 #42 6 years ago

    what it boils down to was that at the last show they knew they were going to entering the market after M$ so they told big fibs about thier machine in order to make people think twice and to see what thiers had to offer. I just wish they would swap the analogue and digital pad round cos the xbox pad is so much better for it.

  • blicko #43 6 years ago

    "Although I appreciate that is based on a bunch of journalists who have probably played the thing for an hour or two each, so it's not gonna be the be-all and end-all of my decision."

    And a smart move too. I just responded to your claim that none of the big 3 had a good E3. As I said before, E3 is about hype and I think the clear winner was Nintendo. Microsoft also did well by way of not being Sony.

    I don't think Sony are in a hopeless position - they've still got a fair bit of mindshare but it looks like the public are waking up to, and getting weary of their shenanigans (dishonesty, lack of inginuity, proprietary junk). The tech-savvy crowd anyway.

    Can't say the prospect of Microsoft taking over excites me though. Wouldn't mind Sega to comeback and make it one-two with Nindendo just like the good old days.
    Edited by blicko at 17/05/06 @ 15:44

  • Daikon #44 6 years ago

    What point is there in the 20gb version having a Blue Ray drive if it doesn't have any HD output?

  • #45 6 years ago

    Here's the prob I have with the ps controller:


    games.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=185838&cid=15339239


    No reactionary comments please. Contructive criticism welcome.

  • PearOfAnguish #46 6 years ago

    So...

    - little in the way of actual games demonstrated
    - no final hardware
    - terrible yields on Cell CPUs
    - some developers don't appear to have devkits yet
    - developers who do have devkits saying it's tough to program for
    - major new additions to the system being done at the last minute
    - higher price than any other system
    - confusion over two different bundles
    - a Blu-Ray drive that will probably be useless once BR fails
    - a system that isn't actually more powerful than a console that is already on sale
    - demos that were actually running on a PC (GT HD) and a 360 (Assassins Creed)
    - the usual desperate Sony hyperbole and flat-out lying

    Yup, they're onto a winner here!

  • NoCodeNed2 #47 6 years ago

    as an honest question - how many of the 'wider public' do you think has a) the same opinion of the conferences at E3 as people here through following online games media like EG and b) even know it exists?

    Because if it's not many, I can't see it doing much damage in the long run.

  • Xerx3s #48 6 years ago

    Well written article imo. Very balanced. The more or less 'lets see what will happen' attitude that a journo must have.

  • Daikon #49 6 years ago

    @frod

    I doubt many games will use the full capacity of a Blue Ray disc though, most PS2 games aren't even on DVD...

  • NoCodeNed2 #50 6 years ago

    Daikon - there's plenty of other threads to explain - or attempt to - the whole HD thing. The 20Gb can output at least the same HD as Xbox360 as far as can be gathered thus far - just not through HDMI.

    But granted it does seem very confusing.

  • NoCodeNed2 #51 6 years ago

    Daikon - "most PS2 games aren't even on DVD... "

    Really - I'm pretty sure that's not true - you don't want to be telling fibs round here, mate, there's a guy who'll want to heckle you to death : )

  • #52 6 years ago

    NoCodeNed2 I really hope that bread doesn't have NUTS in! (Da da daaa..)

    Blackdog is currently on my ignore list, but reassured to say that every comment I have seen him write i pure fanboyism a far as I can tell. Either that or he's joking.
    My mate who has been a PC/PS2 gamer for years got a 360 and describes the controller a "a badboy". The 360 controller is certainly the best controller I have EVER used (and I'm going way back). Except the D-pad sucks. I'll give you that. Good thing it's not a major control for the system.

  • ecureuil #53 6 years ago

    "no PS3 games look graphically as good as the PGR3/Kameo/COD2/DOA4/Oblivion real-time footage that was shown this time last year."

    That's just because those were new and impressive at the time. If they demonstrated COD2 graphics right now, you wouldn't be overly impressed, because we're getting used to games looking that good.

  • Darren #54 6 years ago

    "I doubt many games will use the full capacity of a Blue Ray disc though, most PS2 games aren't even on DVD..."

    Huh?!?

    I don't own a PS2 anymore but prior to selling it I'd bought over 150 games for it and about 98% of them came on... you guessed it... DVD!

  • #55 6 years ago

    PearOfAnguish
    I like-ed it! I Like-ed it a lot! - But not really, because I think what we all want is a really competitive market. However, I think it's a given that the PS3 will sell well; Sony know this too, which is probably why their outings have been less good recently.

  • JetSetWilly #56 6 years ago

    +1 to the excellent article comments.

  • Steroyd #57 6 years ago

    So...

    - little in the way of actual games demonstrated
    - no final hardware
    - terrible yields on Cell CPUs
    - some developers don't appear to have devkits yet
    - developers who do have devkits saying it's tough to program for
    - major new additions to the system being done at the last minute
    - higher price than any other system
    - confusion over two different bundles
    - a Blu-Ray drive that will probably be useless once BR fails
    - a system that isn't actually more powerful than a console that is already on sale
    - demos that were actually running on a PC (GT HD) and a 360 (Assassins Creed)
    - the usual desperate Sony hyperbole and flat-out lying

    Yup, they're onto a winner here!

    You know if you close your eyes virtually I swear you've just described the PS2 before it sold 100 million units.

  • NoCodeNed2 #58 6 years ago

    @Ledilettante - agreed, however, I kind of think one or two sniffs of 'cool' things under johnny public's nose and he'll happily go running back to the 'safety' of his Playstation brand.

    and the weird thing is I kind of think the mainstay of the 'sony fanboy' is that johnny public bloke who'll either not listen or will find reasons to believe what they want. I think if MS had done a bit more in terms of being in the public eye with 360, Sony would be in a more precarious position.

  • YogiTah #59 6 years ago

    It's all about the money again - Microsoft has the money to buy all developers on this planet and i guess the whole universe (incl. Rockstar) and to spent another 150 dollars on every console they sell... Bill Gates will be the MASTER OF THE UNIVERSE

  • #60 6 years ago

    frod - I'd hate to be the developer of that game! A non-linear adventure with enough content to exceed DVD9 capacity - expect to see it out in 2015!

    Sorry, having real problems with my 's' key today.

  • kangarootoo #61 6 years ago

    @jamesphilip

    ""and they should have at least have been challenged on these ommisions given the weight they put on these titles a year ago" then ok. Bland it is, just for you my dear :p"

    Well thats certainly satisfied me, and I've been a right grumpy shite since E3 started.

    "I think you'll find the Xbox pad, the 360 pad and the Wii-mote (by all accounts) are way, way better"

    Seconded (the MS controllers anyway, not used the Wii one obviously).

    @NoCodeNed2
    "aah, bland, thankyou...now, where's my bread sandwich"

    Proper lol. I'm going to nick that one for future use if thats OK with you :)

  • JetSetWilly #62 6 years ago

    You know if you close your eyes virtually I swear you've just described the PS2 before it sold 100 million units.

    You mean, shipped 100 million units. Sony never release how many they've actually sold.
    Edited by JetSetWilly at 17/05/06 @ 16:01

  • The12thMonkey #63 6 years ago

    Yes, 100 million shipped. I bet I'm not the only poor schmuck who had to buy two PS2s because the first one died the day after the warrenty ran out.

  • PearOfAnguish #64 6 years ago

    You know if you close your eyes virtually I swear you've just described the PS2 before it sold 100 million units.

    Yeah there are similarities, except the PS2 didn't cost that much, didn't use an unproven new format that was competing with another, very similar, format, wasn't as tough to program and, vitally, wasn't up against such tough competition.

    I think what we all want is a really competitive market

    Sure, but Sony is setting themselves up for a fall. They're betting the future of their company on PS3 and Blu-Ray. I'm sure they'll pull through but I'm also pretty sure they are not going to be the market leaders this time round and, if you look at what happened to Sega and Nintendo, it's very difficult to make a comeback after you've stumbled.

  • bauhaus #65 6 years ago

    Am I the only one that thinks GTA is crap?

    Bland graphics, repetative gameplay.

    Sure it shocks the daily mail crew, and perhaps makes the player feel a bit dangerous, but as a game its shite

  • lefizz #66 6 years ago

    Personally i think E3 was a bit flat all around this year. Nintendo had plentry to show but in truth very few surprises, still quite a solid showing. Same goes for MS really, plentry of solid stuff going on in the 360 sphere yet few really big announcments ( come on we all knew halo 3 would be announced).

    Sony on the otehr hand had a dire E3 IMHO, there huge PR bubble from last E3 has already been burst, the games look no better than 360 stuff at best. The continual downgrading of the PS3 hardware is something of a joke, and as if to make things even funnier you show case your shit hot new system playing GT 4 in high deff. Hey why didnt MS show Halo 2 upo ressed as well. Please that just daft, also after playing the test drive demo on 'live' you kind of think that unless gt5 moves that way it will be left behind. We dont need the 5 revision of the same game and yet no serious inovation to the play mechanic. Just gets boring.

    Heavenly sword looked really nice from what i saw, yet there is nothing out there that to me is a killer app for sony in the west. On PS3 it was GTA and we now know that that wont be this generation. Not that i expect GTA to keep its place as the top Sandbox game, its has already spawned a whole genre and some of them actually look quite interesting. Maybe even Halo 3 might go that way a bit?

    Anyway which ever way you look at it Sony is in for a rough ride, the issue sint what happend at launch but what happend in 2 years time. The sligh power advantage they might have mayb well to damaged more by the fact they will always have to price it more than MS.

    As MS learnt first time around there is only one thign worse than having and underpowereed machine and that have an over powered one. The xbox was too powerfull for it gen so always cost to much to make. I can see MS being able to compete with Sony very very aggressively on price.

    This could really be the decider to the mass market

  • #67 6 years ago

    bauhaus - your opening a can of worms with the "Am I the only one who thinks...."
    But in essence I agree with you, although I heard great things about San Andreas. GTA:LCS certainly didn't grab my attention, not like Lumines, Phoenix Wright etc. etc.

  • PearOfAnguish #68 6 years ago

    _neon

    You do realise these are figures for Japan?

    ...and that I'm referring to the home console market?
    I never said Nintendo was on the verge of bankruptcy, but it's not exactly the NES/SNES golden days, is it? They are one console and one handheld away from becoming the next Sega (not that I think that'll happen, the DS is doing far too well and the buzz for Wii is enormous).

    Am I the only one that thinks GTA is crap?

    Um, yes?

  • login_name #69 6 years ago

    "I think you'll find the Xbox pad, the 360 pad and the Wii-mote (by all accounts) are way, way better."

    Hahahahaha thanks, I needed that. The Xbox and 360 controllers are way, way better? Man, I'd hate to see your hands. Ok, ok, the 360 fits comfortably in your hands, I'll give you that, but it's not a good controller. The D-Pad sucks and the sticks feel cheap.

    Oh, and although I like the DualShock 2 dpad and button layout, I certainly don't think it's even close to being perfect. The Analog sticks are awful, simply awful. Better than the Xbox and 360 controllers though, without a doubt.

    If you include the Wii then you must include both the N64 and Gamecube controllers also, since they both were perfect for what they were designed for. Just not very good all purpose controllers.

    The Gamecube is the most comfortable, just not the most practical. The DualShock is the most practical, but nowhere near the most comfortable. The 360 is in-between these two. The XBox controller is balls.

  • The12thMonkey #70 6 years ago

    lefizz: As MS learnt first time around there is only one thign worse than having and underpowereed machine and that have an over powered one. The xbox was too powerfull for it gen so always cost to much to make. I can see MS being able to compete with Sony very very aggressively on price.

    That's spot on, I think. And surely we're looking at a price cut come autumn? The 360 could potentially be even cheaper when the PS3 finally makes it's arrival. Microsoft pushed hard and ended the last generation prematurely for this reason, I think. There's a big possibility that it just might pay off.

  • chavatar #71 6 years ago

    and the weird thing is I kind of think the mainstay of the 'sony fanboy' is that johnny public bloke who'll either not listen or will find reasons to believe what they want.

    This is true. I found myself thinking that the generation growing up now is the first whose parents have grown up with videogaming and consoles. Will johnny public dangle their little ones on their knee and extol the virtues of one platform over the other. Do any parents here do this? Is LeDil singing XBox 360 lullabies to his brood (sorry, but I've seen the pictures ;))

  • #72 6 years ago

    login_name I guess it's horses for courses then, because I disagree with almost everything you said.
    The GC controllers nearly give me blisteds every time I play - the raised plastic bits - ouch.
    The Dual Shock sticks - my god, could you get a vaguer stick!?
    In hindsight the 'S' verion of the xbox controller was a lot better than the massive one, but I found both useable and more comfortable than the cramp-inducing Dual Shocker.
    360 controller - best. controller. ever.

  • JHuxley #73 6 years ago

    Something tells me this generation is going to be pretty evenly split between Sony, MS and Nintendo.

    Hmm...don't know if that's a good thing or not.

  • PearOfAnguish #74 6 years ago

    The 360 could potentially be even cheaper when the PS3 finally makes it's arrival.

    I'd say this is almost a certainty. Imagine the damage done to Sony if MS announced a price cut AND a major game release (GTA, Halo 3, GoW etc) on or around the same time as the PS3 goes on sale.

  • #75 6 years ago

    PearOfAnguish

    Damn, I was hoping for GoW, like, now!

  • kangarootoo #76 6 years ago

    @login_name

    What an awful lot to write about what is essentially a purely subjective issue of preference.

    Except on this point.

    "The Analog sticks are awful, simply awful. Better than the Xbox and 360 controllers though, without a doubt."

    Are we talking about the same things here? The PS2 sticks are the worst analogue sticks I can bring to mind in recent history. The XB sticks are a dream of variable and controlled input by comparison. Errrr... in my purely subjective preference of course ;)

    EDIT: I preferred the pre-S Xb controller incidentally, but I think the 360 controller is the best out there currently.
    Edited by kangarootoo at 17/05/06 @ 16:29

  • login_name #77 6 years ago

    @jamesphilp

    Yeah, it always is and I know a few people that will agree with you (although not on the orginal XBox controller). Obviously hand size comes into play quickly followed by the way you hold each controller. For my hands and style, the Gamecube was a perfect fit. The DualShock is uncomfortable to hold to some degree especially when trying to use the dual analog sticks but the quality of build is that much better than the 360. The 360 controller, although pretty comfortable, feels cheap. The dpad sucks big time and the sticks don't feel right. Could be their position or height or sensitivity, whatever, they just don't feel right to me. I loved the N64 stick and to a lesser degree the Gamecube one. Sony and Microsoft just haven't got that feel, for me anyway.
    Edited by login_name at 17/05/06 @ 16:35

  • PearOfAnguish #78 6 years ago

    Damn, I was hoping for GoW, like, now!

    Oh that was just an example, I haven't a clue when that is due out.

  • reality_cheque #79 6 years ago

    I want to see someone heckled to death :(

  • SergioAguero #80 6 years ago

    As someone just mentioned, the PUBLIC will be mostly unaware of E3 and the negative reaction to Sony's machine in places like here.

    Not surprisingly any newspaper reports have basically said "The PS3 is amazing, but it will be expensive."

    I've thought this all along about HD-DVD and BR, how are the hell do you sell it

    "Oh Mr Jones, your 300 DVD's are great, good picture, features etc, but wouldn't you like an even sharper picture?"

    Er, not really.

    PS3 would be a great machine 3 or 4 years down the line after HD Television is much more mainstream.

    But right now, this Christmas (or just before), at THAT price, Sony are going to lose a lot of market share to both the other players.

    -I still may buy one though, becasue I've always been a sucker for new tech!


    Edited by SergioAguero at 17/05/06 @ 16:31

  • login_name #81 6 years ago

    It is a purely subjective issue of preference, true, but I'm bored and the dog shat on the floor so I needed to vent.

  • Steroyd #82 6 years ago

    Yeah there are similarities, except the PS2 didn't cost that much, didn't use an unproven new format that was competing with another, very similar, format, wasn't as tough to program and, vitally, wasn't up against such tough competition.

    DVD's were expensive at the time, MS could take a hit like they did with the Xbox even if they do get dreamcasted it'll only be by their check balance, I thought PS2 and Dreamcast were considered similar, PS3 is easier than the PS2 (if that's anything to go by), guess what PS2 was $100 more than the Dreamcast.

    The public mindset might be that the public wasnt a Sony console not a games machine, which is kinda scary.

  • chavatar #83 6 years ago

    No I don't.

    Apologies if I offended you there - wasn't the intention.

  • peterfll #84 6 years ago

    Ooo! What a lot of comments!

    Good article.

    Please please please lets see some of this realisation reflected in your next interviews with the Sony Exec - similar to the line you played with Peter Moore - and less like the puff-pieces we've seen in the past. And then I'll be a happy man.

    Ta.

  • drumbaby #85 6 years ago

    PS3 will sell out at Xmas. Not to parents buying for their kids (although there will be a fair few who are rich/ mad/ kid-pecked enough to do so) but to those preordering hardcore early adopters, or Ebaying mofos, who (combined) number in the millions.

    If they sell out the projected 4 million by the end of 2006 then they're ahead of PS2's initial total by over a million, and in a fraction of the time to boot. If? I should really say 'when'.

    But if they don't bring about some price drops soon after, or come out with some bloody good bundles/ games, then that momentum is going to stall pretty damn quick, imho.

  • #86 6 years ago

    LeDilettante why not! :p You have failed - Bill Gates will be round your house in no time with some parenting tips I don't doubt! :)

    login_name it really is just one of those things I guess we're going to have to disagree on. I think the exact opposite - the Dual Shock feels really cheap to me (rattles plasticy smooth feel) wheras the X360 pad feels solid, really well built, and has taken the punishment I have delt it over the past 6 months with no problems.
    I don't think you're wrong, I just disagree, strongly! :p
    EDIT: BNTW I actually do like elements of the GC pad, so we do agree on some things. Nintendo sure as hell make the best d-pads and touch-screens!
    Edited by at 17/05/06 @ 16:43

  • PearOfAnguish #87 6 years ago

    Blackdog, it doesn't work like that. MS can and will revise their hardware. Sony doesn't exactly have it easy with Cell and BR. Cell production yields have been terrible and the BR drives are expensive. Not going to matter if they can produce them cheaper in a year or two if they don't sell enough consoles straight away.

  • Kashmere #88 6 years ago

    As an aside, it seems we can't go calling Sony's new controller the DualShock3. While it wasn't mentioned in the conference, according to Sony's press release, "the vibration feature that is currently available on DUALSHOCK® and DUALSHOCK®2 controllers for PlayStation and PlayStation®2, will be removed from the new PS3 controller as vibration itself interferes with information detected by the sensor." Hmm...yes. Well, there's that and then there's the Immersion lawsuit that the press release doesn't refer to. In 2005, Immersion sued Sony claiming their haptic feedback intellectual property had been used in DualShock controllers. Sony chose to fight...and lost. Microsoft had previously faced the same lawsuit over their XBox controllers, but in true Microsoft style, they settled out of court and bought stock in Immersion. The Immersion case may have had something to do with the removal of rumble from the PS3 controller. After all, they could have included both tilt-sensing and rumble, and left it to developers to decide when to use either feature.

    SOURCE: http://consoul.blogspot.com/2006/05/sonys-...rence-2006.html

  • Psi #89 6 years ago

    are parents spending this much money on their kids now? or have sony figured out that most dads play the blinking things now anyway?

  • asphaltcowboy #90 6 years ago

    Fantastic article. Looks like it's time to start up my 360/Wii fund!

  • ChrisS #91 6 years ago

    Great article, and pretty much echoes my thoughts.

    Good work.

  • #92 6 years ago

    are parents spending this much money on their kids now? or have sony figured out that most dads play the blinking things now anyway?
    I think that was around the same time they realised there's a huge installed base of 1080p HD TVs and a massive catalogue of Bluray Movies. :p

    EDIT : Sorry for all the posts - bored at work! Roll on half 5! (Must work tomorrow!!)
    Edited by at 17/05/06 @ 16:47

  • L0cky #93 6 years ago

    "whats the difference between a Wii and a cube with a adapter that allows use the Wii motion sensor remote ???? not a damn thing"

    http://gamerfrance.verygames.net/dotclear/index.php?2006/05/11/111--news-wii-comparaison-graphique-gamecube-wii

    I disagree.

  • The12thMonkey #94 6 years ago

    "Due to unprecidented demand, you have been placed in a queue. Your video will begin shortly."

    So I'm not the only one trying to rewatch the Sony Conference Highlights for a giggle?

  • Carrybagma #95 6 years ago

    @LeDil & Pear - BTW Microsoft own the CPU & GPU designs this time,so they can revise/reduce them all they want. Sony are in a partnership. I'm not sure if they 'own' the GPU design either, so they may be stuck with it in the same way MS was on XBOX.

    The Nvidia XBOX contract was a big sore point with Microsoft.

  • login_name #96 6 years ago

    "I don't think you're wrong, I just disagree, strongly! :p"

    Aww...you stole my line :(

    Ok, I'll put the high horse away for the night. Besides, cleaning up after the dog was bad enough, I really don't want to be knee deep in horse shit too.

    Good article by the way, excluding the blatant hypocrisy of course :p

  • thinktank #97 6 years ago

    I'm just gonna come out and say it, im a bit of a m$ fanboy.

    But it's not as if Sony are giving me much choice, C'mon u Sony lot u must be gettin p***ed at the way Sony treat u.

    I'm sure they think your all half wits who scramble drooling with wods of cash in hand for anything with playstation written on it. Honestly i don't know who's worse sony for constatly shafting their LOYAL fanbase or you lot for blindly following.

    come over to the dark side..................the chief has been waiting for u.

  • login_name #98 6 years ago

    @thinktank

    Yeah, it's not like Microsoft has ever overcharged for any of their perfectly fine tuned products....

  • WicKeD #99 6 years ago

    Balor: I Told You So! :D

    Tough Luck, really. Nice turnaround by EG though! But yeah, we knew already that PS3 = PSX2.

    /Hastily awaits the return of the SEGA! Hey, why not! Their business is currently booming! :D
    Edited by WicKeD at 17/05/06 @ 17:06

  • Eighthours #100 6 years ago

    Excellent article, Tom. Can't wait to see your views on Nintendo and Microsoft.

    Great to see differing opinions this time round, too: This is the true polar opposite to Rob Fahey's material over the past week, and you've redressed the balance in style.

    EDIT: I'm with those who'd like to see you get the next bash at a Phil Harrison interview.
    Edited by Eighthours at 17/05/06 @ 17:10

  • Xerx3s #101 6 years ago

    "PS3 will sell out at Xmas. Not to parents buying for their kids (although there will be a fair few who are rich/ mad/ kid-pecked enough to do so) but to those preordering hardcore early adopters, or Ebaying mofos, who (combined) number in the millions.

    If they sell out the projected 4 million by the end of 2006 then they're ahead of PS2's initial total by over a million, and in a fraction of the time to boot. If? I should really say 'when'.

    But if they don't bring about some price drops soon after, or come out with some bloody good bundles/ games, then that momentum is going to stall pretty damn quick, imho."

    +1

    /is an ps3 buying/ebay selling mofo ;p

  • kangarootoo #102 6 years ago

    @blackdog

    "The reason for this at a guess, they are limited by who can supply their componets"

    Given MS's wealth and weight I would expect that they they can get their components from wherever they want. I don't see any other console maker having an advantage in that respect.

    The ability to streamline the original XB was more an issue of architecture than logistics. And also bear in mind that the PS2 only changed form factor after about 7 years on the market.

  • belziah #103 6 years ago

    you were too drunk to play motorstorm then

  • kangarootoo #104 6 years ago

    Don't mean to pick on you ChrisS, you just happened to appear at the right moment.

    "Great article, and pretty much echoes my thoughts"

    I'm continually surprised by how people rate the quality of an article by whether they agree with its editorial slant. I guess that is why newspapers have defined readerships, but I just want to the info, I often as not don't really care (and by that, I don't necessaarily mean I feel negatively) about the opinion of the writer.

  • thinktank #105 6 years ago

    @login_name

    May i ask what you are refering to??

  • Eighthours #106 6 years ago

    Blackdog, it doesn't work like that. MS can and will revise their hardware. Sony doesn't exactly have it easy with Cell and BR. Cell production yields have been terrible and the BR drives are expensive. Not going to matter if they can produce them cheaper in a year or two if they don't sell enough consoles straight away.

    Eh? I thought the Cell chips had the "best yields ever". Or was that a load of bullshit?

  • login_name #107 6 years ago

    @thinktank

    You may.

  • drumbaby #108 6 years ago

    the PS2 only changed form factor after about 7 years on the market.

    About 2 years out, but never mind :)

  • thinktank #109 6 years ago

    @login_name

    tut

    What are you refering to............

    cocky little bugger

  • Rambaldi #110 6 years ago

    EG: bloody Sony fanboys ;)

  • #111 6 years ago

    thinktank
    try windows for one!

  • Yossarian #112 6 years ago

    despite being one of those '360 fanboys' around this time last year, I still think everyone should lay off EG

  • login_name #113 6 years ago

    @thinktank

    Weeeelll let me think...hmm....I think I'll start with Windows ME.

  • thinktank #114 6 years ago

    funny i wasn't aware you could play PS3 or 360 games on windows....

    U must be able to or alse ur post would be irrelivant ;)

  • kangarootoo #115 6 years ago

    I've been a Windows hater in my time, but given how many different HW configs it supports its impressive it runs at all and it quite an impressive pieve of software in that regard.

    Now of course, Linux kicks its ass in most repects, but that is publicly moderated software for you. An army of millions is a lot of fingers typing on keyboards.

  • login_name #116 6 years ago

    @thinktank

    Your post had nothing to do with the consoles and everything to do with the way the company treats you. Just as irrelevant then, I guess.

    I shouldn't really mention the fact that Microsoft decided to allocate a spot for Windows Vista, the interaction between the XBox 360 and PC, and the new Games for Windows brand (of which they've already lost one title by the way, to SOE of all people) all within their E3 conference.
    Edited by login_name at 17/05/06 @ 17:42

  • NoCodeNed2 #117 6 years ago

    @Xiphos- it's called redundancy - it's a very common if not essential part of CE hardware manufacture.

    Public Information Service : )

  • chavatar #118 6 years ago

    An army of millions is a lot of fingers typing on keyboards

    But an infinite number of monkeys would almost surely produce superior software ;)

  • login_name #119 6 years ago

    "I've been a Windows hater in my time, but given how many different HW configs it supports its impressive it runs at all and it quite an impressive pieve of software in that regard."

    Windows does do a lot of things right, I agree. It's a buggy, over priced piece of software but when it works it's good. WinME, on the other hand, is complete donkey turd.

  • NoCodeNed2 #120 6 years ago

    @Wonga - prob because these guys will sell precious few so the license cost won't be that great - whereas Sony has quite a few more on the market.

    And now that MS owns the company I bet they'd be wanting to charge Sony a very, very special rate.

  • Nikanoru #121 6 years ago

    Sony might suck, they'll still win.

    The only fucking console every little American highschool rap music fan knows about is "Playstation". This is probably because every single rapper retard on MTV's cribs has a PS2 in their "chill room" or whatever. It's the only thing that matters American kids' lives, whether they're hip or not.

    The Japanese are under some sort of spell it seems, even though Sony screwed up E3, the PS3 is apparently still the most anticipated console by FAR, making everything else look insignificant. I highly suspect a big reason for this is that the unbelievably ridicilously fucking popular main FF and DQ series are still Sony exclusives (bar FFXI).

    They don't even have to do anything. They've got next gen in the bag.




    Also: Don't you just love surprises? Isn't that the coolest thing?

    /sticks finger down throat

    I just want to kick his goddamn face in, ugh.

  • J_C_X #122 6 years ago

    Well I know what Ill get for posting this but its intresting...

    http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/10976/Xbox-360-Outsells-the-PS2-in-April/

    If Microsoft cut price and ramp up production. If the PS3 graphics are no better than the 360's. It will be difficult to make the PS3 seem a bargain at £450.

  • NoCodeNed2 #123 6 years ago

    @Nikanoru - now, now don't be violent, just be mildly annoyed - it's better for your health.

    I have to say I still think it's better than last year's '1billion people' debacle.

    Maybe next year Reggie will claim that Wii will cure cancer by 2012. I reckon they all meet up and decide whose turn it is.

  • NoCodeNed2 #124 6 years ago

    J_C_X - very interesting. so interesting that I'm tempted to make you the very first person I've ever 'ignored' for sending me to a bogus link.

    But I won't, I'm not that petty. I bet you're nice, really. : )

  • J_C_X #125 6 years ago

    Its not a bogus link its on IGN and teamxbox but they are pro-MS.

  • login_name #126 6 years ago

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJElsNaC6yQ&search=ps3%201%20minute

    Dunno if this has been posted before. Worth a chuckle, if only for the 'So here's a giant crab' jokery.

    P.S. I'm aware some of you will hate this, I don't care - I didn't make it or make you watch it.
    Edited by login_name at 17/05/06 @ 18:07

  • captainrentboy #127 6 years ago

    I'm not sure why people still think the dual shock is the best pad ever made,as for people like me with sasquatch like mitts the ps2 is bloody horrible,and after an hour's use gives me rocking hand cramp.Another thing that's missing from the playstation pads?Bloody analogue triggers!Is it that much to ask for,personally I think they make a world of difference to shooters and driving games,pushing x to accelerate just isn't the same.

  • Yossarian #128 6 years ago

    hey guys I don't know if you've read the latest TeamXbox/IGN posts or whatever but 360 is outselling the PS3 too!!!!!

  • tiddles #129 6 years ago

    @captainrentboy - good thing they put analogue triggers on the PS3 pads, then ;)

  • weaselrat #130 6 years ago

    Once again as with previous sony machines they just never deliver what they promise. All fancy CGI and nothing spectacular at the end, well nothing that you won't be able to see on the 360. With the 360's great live experience I thinks it's microsofts time for some ass kicking.

    Given the choice now and with the ever increasing multi platform releases, I think my choice would be...........................................................................................................360 360 360!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • thinktank #131 6 years ago

    Quick thought,

    If an entry level BR player is around £500 and a decent one is £1000

    What kind of quality/tard r u getting in the PS3?

    /feels slightly guilty for joining "the bash sony gang"...............only slightly

  • J_C_X #132 6 years ago

    I have also read Japanese found the PS3 show most intresting in E3 (strange). Will they be intrested that thier tansfering thier Japanese production line to China. If thats cut labour costs how much must the PS3 cost to make? Will the Japanese be happy that the Chinese are stealing there work? I also believe this to be the first Japnese console to made outside Japan. I dont see it affecting sales that much to be honest but it will be intresting to see how the Japanese public react to this news.

    (like the XBOX being an American product you know the patriotic Japanese)

  • Yossarian #133 6 years ago

    to be honest the 'quality' of the DVD experience offered by the PS2 would sour me on buying the PS3 for its Blu-Ray functionality anyway

    Blu-Ray is a colossal ten ton load hanging around Sony's neck, and it's going to choke them

  • J_C_X #134 6 years ago

    http://www.wii60.com/uploads/93.jpg
    http://www.wii60.com/uploads/89.gif

    This website a hoot for Sony haters.
    Edited by J_C_X at 17/05/06 @ 18:33

  • thinktank #135 6 years ago

    HAHA login_name

    the editing in that clip is seamless

    the crab bit is pure gold

  • Gradthrawn #136 6 years ago

    "I have also read Japanese found the PS3 show most intresting in E3 (strange). Will they be intrested that thier tansfering thier Japanese production line to China. "

    There's seems to be some confusion here about what's going on in regards to production. <a href=http://ps3.ign.com/articles/708/708886p1.html>The only article</a> I've seen about this states production will initially begin in China along side of Japan. They are not shifting production, they are increasing production capacity. This is in stark contrast to their normal policy of initial production (1st year or so) taking place entirely in Japan, and then shifting production over to China. That was the production schedule they followed for their previous 2 consoles. Which is why I'm confused as to why you think this is the 1st Japanese console made outside of Japan?
    Edited by Gradthrawn at 17/05/06 @ 18:36

  • Swaain #137 6 years ago

    Great article!

  • J_C_X #138 6 years ago

    Sorry I meant first launch console in the Japanese market made outside Japan.

    Japanese press agency Jiji reported that Sony plans to shift the PlayStation 3 production to China in summer 2006, making it the first Japanese console to be produced outside Japan at launch.

  • Lost_in_Darkness #139 6 years ago

    EG is nothing but a site put up for 360 circlejirks.

    I mean look, there's green all over the site :0
    ;)

  • thinktank #140 6 years ago

    mmmmmmmmmmm the green glow, its so warm

    i'm going to touch it now...

  • JediMasterMalik #141 6 years ago

    ACKH, green ftl. Red is far better, or blue. :p

  • theindustrialone #142 6 years ago

    "Quick thought,

    If an entry level BR player is around £500 and a decent one is £1000

    What kind of quality/tard r u getting in the PS3?"

    About the same quality level as the PS2/Xbox/360 DVD playback

  • thinktank #143 6 years ago

    Brilliant, well worth the £425 then

  • Scimarad #144 6 years ago

    Bunch of Sony Fanboys....hey, wait a second?!?? :-)

  • BartonFink #145 6 years ago

    Excellent article and echoing a lot of the views held by quite a lot of people on the forum. About the only thing I would disagree with is the comparison on the games between Sony and MS. I reckon MS look much stronger on that front. But that's just me.
    I suppose we can forgive last years The Real Next Gen article now.

    I can only assume EG will do similary articles for Ninty and MS?
    Edited by BartonFink at 17/05/06 @ 20:20

  • effinwooly #146 6 years ago

    please SONY what are you doing !!! i did want a PS3 but not at that price !!!

  • the creeper #147 6 years ago

    @effinwooly

    But plenty of people will - easily enough to outstrip supply, so there's little incentive for them to sell it cheaper at launch.

  • Qbert2k #148 6 years ago

    Oh well, I guess with the amount of pro-MS fanboys that visit this site, it was only a matter of time before EG would do a 360 (pun intended), from being the mildly pro-sony fanboys they were before. I wasn't wholly impressed with Sony's showing either, but I do think the article is a tad harsh.
    Edited by Qbert2k at 17/05/06 @ 20:58

  • JediMasterMalik #149 6 years ago

    If someone did a 360 they'd be right back where they started, You mean 180.

  • chavatar #150 6 years ago

    According to the marketing blurb, it was actually a 540.

  • Knot #151 6 years ago

    Well, PAL PS2 launched at a premium price too and it was marred until at least half a year after launch (the jaggies debacle, anyone) .

    So, once more Sony has the position where it cannot prove immediately what it promises.

    I wouldn't write off PS3, THAT quickly....

  • Yaz #152 6 years ago

    "Well, PAL PS2 launched at a premium price too and it was marred until at least half a year after launch (the jaggies debacle, anyone) ."

    The PS2 launched for the price gamers expected from consoles at the time, which was the same price as the Playstation and the Sega Saturn.... i.e. £299. The XBox launched at this price too.

  • Azazel #153 6 years ago

    "The game is based around battles that actually took place in ancient japan....

    ... so here we're fighting this giant crab."

    priceless!

  • Virvel #154 6 years ago

    Nice article highlighting Sony's arrogance!

    While XBox fanboys interpret the mediocre performance by Sony during E3 as a sign that things will change in the console-world (read XBox taking over the show), I (a Sony fanboy ;) believes quite the opposite. In my not so humble opinion, Sony will dominate this generation as well. Average Joe will take care of it all. This is why:

    - PS2 is still outselling everything on the market, and will continue to do so for a long time. Hardcore gamers will naturally jump onto the 360/ps3 wagon. But that group of people (YOU guys, reading this) is vastly outnumbered by the average Joe's roaming the streets. You dont count at all in the big console battle. Well nearly anyway.. I can absolutely guarantee you, NO Joe is ever going to read a blog on Eurogamer.

    - Average Joe is not thinking like you and me:

    * A-Joe only buys cheap consoles (for a long time this will be PS2 & Wii)
    * A-Joe only buys consoles having lots of mainstream games
    * A-Joe only buys consoles with a well known trademark. In a worldwide sense, only Playstation and Nintendo has established a trademark that penetrates Joe's brain.
    * Online gaming? What the hell is that? Average joe doesnt care. He has more than enough with even the simples Artificial Intelligence in single-player mode.
    * High-Definition? Joe doesnt care.
    * Joe is attracted to consoles/systems that stays on the market for a long time. Like PSX,PS2, NES, SNES, C64. Not systems changed every 4 years (read X-Box).
    * Joe wants to put his old game-discs in new systems he buys. Backwards compatability COUNTS!

    And you know what? I like Joe! He is the foundation of a worldwide mass-market in gaming. That results in a gigantic number of games (like you see on PS1 & PS2). Never mind half of it is shitty games, Joe likes them! The synergies of that mega-market means alot of classic games, cheaper games, better availability, standardisation, longer life-time of each generation. More People play games!

    But, I will admit: If Microsoft can get through to Joe's mind, the 360 headstart might just really start eating away at Sony's share of the market. But, I kind of doubt it.




    Edited by Virvel at 17/05/06 @ 22:27

  • TheJanitor #155 6 years ago

    i dont freakin care what anybody says, ps3 is the only console that looks good so far, the other ones have no good games planned for release. they can suck my thingies. and so can whoever wrote this biased crappy article.

  • BartonFink #156 6 years ago

    reality is a bitch ain't it.

  • SeesThroughAll #157 6 years ago

    But, I will admit: If Microsoft can get through to Joe's mind, the 360 headstart might just really start eating away at Sony's share of the market. But, I kind of doubt it.

    It already did. I have the impression that by the end of the fiscal year, the market share will be of about 60% or 70% on Microsoft's side. That being the case, by mid 2007 the true purpose of the XBox brand will finally be revealed.
    Edited by SeesThroughAll at 17/05/06 @ 22:51

  • captainrentboy #158 6 years ago

    TheJanitor: dont freakin care what anybody says, ps3 is the only console that looks good so far, the other ones have no good games planned for release. they can suck my thingies. and so can whoever wrote this biased crappy article.

    My god,what is this?I'm not the biggest fan of Sony i'll admit,but I can see they have some promising looking titles coming out over the next few years.And if you can't say the same for the other console formats then you truely are a gigantic turd.

  • onyxbox #159 6 years ago

    I totally agree with this article.

  • JediMasterMalik #160 6 years ago

    disc is very correct it is all a matter of taste. I personally consider it to be a fight basically between games like warhawk, heavenly sword, and resistance for the ps3 and Mass Effect, and Gears of War for the 360. They all look fantastic IMO. I dodn't mention the Wii because it's in different market basically.

    Personally I think that the PS3 launch titles are better than the 360's but hey, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

  • mrbandersnatch #161 6 years ago

    PS3 E3 2005 - blew my mind and I was SOOOO hyped! Would have bought that machine at a £600+ price point.
    PS3 E3 2006 - overpriced, underspecified. Wont touch until the price drops and enough AAA titles are available....if at all!

    Im a software developer - I KNOW just how often what should work in theory doesnt translate into practice and I cant help but suspect that the technology promised for the PS3 to Sony just isnt doing what it was specified to do. Hence we have this neutered, disappointing Blu ray monstrosity that, while it might compete with the 360/Wii and get Sonys media format into the market; is not 1/2 of the next-gen console that many of us were anticipating.

    Anyways - good article EG.

  • Arwin #162 6 years ago

    Nice to write an opinion article, isn't it? That way you don't have to bother with presenting a balanced view.

    However, even allowing for that, there are a few blatent oversights/errors in this article. For instance, I watched practically all E3 footage on gamespot, and nearly all developers interviewed by the Gamespot staff were asked about the controller. Yes, all replied that they either only just learnt about it along with the rest of us, or knew for a few weeks, but also all of them indicated that they were sure they were going to support these new features somehow into their games, with one developer reporting that those devs that hadn't come over to the E3 booth already working on them. Of special note was the EA team, which not only said they were sure to put these functions to good use, but also added that they had a dedicated 360 team and a dedicated PS3 team, and that the PS3 team would be using the extra power of the PS3 to enhance the games. Which I thought was an interesting comment.

    Also interesting is that nearly all devs are already using the Cell's SPUs to some extent and that programming for it isn't nearly as hard as theye'd expected, that most devs actually enjoyed it and were surprised how well they worked, and that the PS3 in general was much easier to program for than the PS2, clearly demonstrated by many devs who already used it - the hair in HS, the clouds in Warhawk being just 2 clear examples. The significance of which, by the way, are considerable as they prove that the SPE can in fact be leveraged for such problems effectively and from the looks of it, very seamlessly.

    A more glaring oversight is this weird economics thing called inflation, which means that the PS3 is actually released at just about exactly the same price-point as the PS2. I've shown this in another thread already, but try 2% of interest over 6 years. It's more than you think (and for the U.S., with the drop of the Dollar against the Euro thanks to a record-breaking deficit, it is worse).

    Funnily enough, if Sony hadn't listened to last year's E3 criticism and instead of turning this into a GDC like presentation had pulled out the hype registers like Nintendo did with an entertaining show (after all, this is the ENTERTAINMENT EXPO people, so entertain us!), then they'd probably have done tonnes better.

    Instead, they focussed primarily on showing playable content this time. They could have shown MGS4 in the main presentation, but instead they wanted to prove that 1080p/60fps could be done - even though this was a historic first, people really just wanted to see shiny graphics, so they'd have been better off showing more of the gorgeous GT5 Car models (Rx-7 and Evo IX, if I remember correctly) from last year. The fact that the system can actually handle 1080p/60fps, just in terms of raw pixels, is impressive, but of course only to those who understand such numbers. PGR3 runs 720p/30fps ... at least, most of the time. Sure, adding effects will potentially slow things down, and sure I believe that 720p is good enough for games for a while yet, but it certainly seems a significant testament to the robustness of the PS3s architecture.

    Though it was still a mistake to show so much of it. I´m a great fan of GT4 as many may know, but even I thought it was out of place.

    However, I´ll take substance over style any day. The careful observer has seen and heard what is possible and what the future holds. That the casual observer has had a much harder time doing so is fully to blame on Sony´s marketing team. (I´m personally a great fan of Phil Harrison and his ducks, and wouldn´t mind if he and he alone did the full E3 presentation.)

    Adding everything up, Sony is looking great. But they're not showing themselves by their best angle. While that harms them right now, it could actually benefit them come release, as with expectations low, it will be easy to surpass them.

    But not mine - I will be happy if my expectations are simply met. Right now, the PS3 still looks like the most versatile platform, with the best range of software (platformers, rpgs, fighting games, racing games, fps games, online games, games supporting innovative controllers - yes, the wii would still be a poor man's guitar hero, the poor man's Driving Force Pro, the poor man's DDR metal pad, the poor man's GunCon, a very poor man's Singstar, and so on), and now also with the best hardware and who knows even the best on-line. And that controller looks impressively precise, without needing that rather un-cool sensor bar. Surprised noone took issue with that (yet).

    And if they will really include Linux, then ... wow.

    You may think now that I am a PS3 fanboy and would like to see the Wii or 360 fail. Not in the least. The better they all three are, the merrier I, the consumer, will be when I walk into that shop to buy my next console(s).

    But for now, my next gen will still probably only start when Sony says so. And yes, that's about as lame a marketing shibboleth as Nintendo's disruptive whatchamacallit. Right now, I'm looking at the PS1 and PS2's lifespans and libraries, and am liking what I see, especially comparing to some other consoles ... Where the PS3 however shows that it is likely to catch up with the online part, the 360 shows little sign of addressing its last-gen's flaws (and will have a browser unlike the Xbox because Microsoft doesn't want you to replace your PC with an Xbox, after all, or else they'd have to charge you what they charge for Windows XP along with the price of the Xbox - they'd rather you buy PCs and Xboxs alongside each other for a good while, and as often as they can make you. Can't blame them, but don't like it.)

    The Playstation 1 and 2 have been great for good reasons. I so far don't see any reason whatsoever why the 3 isn't going to follow in their footsteps. More importantly, I still don't see how Xbox is going to improve its library issues. If it is not, it may do well initially based on the good rep the old Xbox had, but will then later on lack the benefit it had last time of being a more powerful system to win position thanks to third party titles.

    Anyway, I could go on for hours. Guess that's why I don't write opinion articles - they'd be too long, too nuanced, and noone would probably read them.
    Edited by Arwin at 18/05/06 @ 01:24

  • Lemon Project #163 6 years ago

    I dearly love Eurogamer and will always turn to them first for my gaming news however on reading this I can't help but think they pumped PS3 up too much last e3 and in an attempt to square that ledger are being too harsh now.

    I continue to read "Sony copied Nintendo" on the issue of motion sensing. Sony have been moving in that direction for a while /c- Eyetoy. Eyetoy demonstrated the market for more physically involving control methods and that's being relfected in this upcoming generation. People seem to forget or ignore Eyetoy when commenting that Sony stole Nintendo's idea.

    Sony's show last year was impressive but it was always more style than substance, especially when measured against MS's especially lacklusture showing. Personally I've viewed Sony as having a solid show this year. They got drilled in the conference war but impressions I've heard from people on the floor were generally pretty favourable.

    Major Sony e3 letdowns for me are price-point and no rumble. No rumble... I still can't fathom it.

  • WicKeD #164 6 years ago

    All that said, € 600 is still a rip-off. And the PS3 is the laughing stock of the online community.

    People are still waiting for the promises Sony made last year to actually materialise, anything else the bunch of liars have to say will never be enough until those promises are fulfilled, especially with there beaing at least € 600 on the line. At that price, no one wants to buy into another PSP/UMD fiasco!
    Edited by WicKeD at 18/05/06 @ 00:54

  • IronGiant #165 6 years ago

    I for one love all this competition between MS and Sony, means they keep pushing each other which should benefit us as gamers.. for that reason i hope Sony don't go tits up with the PS3 and in fact keep on top for the next gen, god knows what MS will come up with next time!!

  • Venkman90 #166 6 years ago

    @Arwin

    Sorry mate but that was less than balanced. Admit you love Sony and or work for them and be done with it :)

  • Arwin #167 6 years ago

    @Venkman
    It was more intended as correction and counter balance. ;)

    I've been talking on the three systems so much now, I think I should compile everything I know and turn that into something I can continuously update and people can shoot at to try and make the most balanced view out there. I have a lot of nice things to say about the Xbox too, you know.

    For instance, if last Christmas you had 500 euro to spare and already had an HDTV, you could have bought yourself a 360 and have had a good year of fun with it without it having any direct competition. Even if you sell it for 200 euro afterwards, and lose another 100 euro on a few games, you could still have had a lot of fun with the system for a whole year. If you play a few games a fair bit, that's good value already - much better than, say, investing in a new graphics card and keeping your desktop in shape for the latest games.

    And yes, Live just works, Gotham TV is awesome, and Live Arcade is a great addition and possibly as effective a way of getting non-gamers behind an xbox as the wii controller may be. We'll see. They should probably consider releasing some IQ test/train type game and see how that pans out. ;)

    Also, I'm fully convinced the market is big enough for three consoles (at least! - it's even big enough for 2 handhelds, after all). They all look to be in pretty good shape.

    In the end though, I feel that the Xbox 360 is the better Gamer PC, the PS3 is the best allround machine, and the Wii is the best Nintendo game player - er - kiddy console - er - entry level console - er - I'll manage to say something nice eventually - wait, I got it - the most playful of the lot. ;) (just kidding doods - but I'm a little more skeptic than average joe when it comes to Nintendo - it seems all the rage all of a sudden, and I've been wary of fashionability for a long time now). The wii has great mass-appeal potential though, and like the DS a high iPod factor. If it manages to appeal to the female gamer also outside of Japan, it will be a tremendous hit regardless of what any other console does. One of the surprising aspects of the 360, after all, is its appeal to female gamers, thanks in no small part to Live Arcade. Many people of the current generation of gamers grew up along with games themselves, but that leaves a lot of people who didn't catch on early and to whom the current generation of games is far too complex for them to comfortably enter the gaming world now.

  • Venkman90 #168 6 years ago

    ...I couldnt type that much if I tried ;)

    But fair one, you seem to know of what you speak. I will only get the Wii for now as its the smallest of the bunch and I travel alot, along with my dual core laptop and DSlite I should have a fair few games to keep me busy...Sony and MS will have to wait for my cash this time.

  • Santino #169 6 years ago

    RIIIIIIIIDGE RACER!!!!!!!!!

    I think anybody who mentions 'kiddy' again should stop being so image conscious and deserve to suffer 'MASSIVE DAMAGE' similar to what those ancient Japanese giant crabs felt...and especially in Arwins case realise that being a Playstation worshipper doesn't make u mature and cool. Sorry to break the news but many nintendo fans are people who grew up with the NES, thus older gamerws who enjoy the many great games for thosed platforms, so do me a favour and shove your 'entry-level' crap where the sun don't shine till u can take a more balanced approach to this.

    EDIT: 360 Wii combo for the same price as a PS3 is a real no brainer...seriously
    Edited by Santino at 18/05/06 @ 03:34

  • Carrybagma #170 6 years ago

    the PS3 is the best allround machine

    It's an empty box! A load of cobbled-together dev machines, fingers-crossed sdks, demos and promises! You haven't seen a *real* game on it yet! Or do you mean 'best allround disaster', for that is what PS3@E3 was?

    I've never been so enthralled by such bollocks.

  • Dizzy #171 6 years ago

    The PS3 doesn't even exist yet....

    Why are people like Arwin trying to convice us to buy a pice of junk. BTW your arguments are void. Software makes a console... if 360 wins, the 360 will have the best software and the biggest library (and the same goes for Wii). Doesn it matter if it has a Sony or a MS logo?? At least with 360 you have a real next gen online network and you don't have to pay for Sony's attempt at spreading the Bluray love. It is the Britney Spears of the console world. Designed by marketing people... (unlike the PS1).

    PS1 was how it should be. Sony designing a good machine, good software support and had a plan. Average Joe has been supporting them ever since because of that. Never mind the (hardware) junk that was PS2 and probably PS3. That is what is good about 360 and Wii... machines designed by people that *have* to win market share and your heart. And don't give me the "Japanese games" excuse.... of all those Japanese games only a few shine bright. There are just as many good non-Japanese games.

    Oh and BTW... I became a daddy this week!!!!! ;) My half Japanese kid is surely going to buy a 360 :)
    Edited by Dizzy at 18/05/06 @ 06:39

  • Nikanoru #172 6 years ago

    People are still waiting for the promises Sony made last year to actually materialise,

    I'm still waiting for the promises they made with PS2 to materialise. Toy story in real time goddammit! :\

    Though regardless, Playstation will always be the junior-high-fiddy-cent-fan-mental-retards console...eh, I mean the Final Fantasy games player (god I wish they just moved that franchise over to Wii, or even 360, so I wouldn't have to bother)...eh, I mean the....well...I can't think of any other reason to buy it. Sorry. :\

  • chavatar #173 6 years ago

    If you play a few games a fair bit, that's good value already - much better than, say, investing in a new graphics card and keeping your desktop in shape for the latest games

    Thia may be true, but a factor in my decision to upgrade my 4 year old PC for £250 to confortably handle oblivion (and other recent games) is that PC games tend to be £10-£15 cheaper than their 360 counterparts. If you play a fair few games, this adds up - with the proviso that I'm happy to miss 360 exclusives, of course ;)

  • BartonFink #174 6 years ago

    @Arwin - well done on that nicely thought out balanced view. You really have fallen for the Sony real next gen hype. Would you like some more hype-pie with those lies. I would suggest having a nit of a trawl around for some opinions form developers on the processing power of the PS3 and the controller. If anything they are saying it's barely more powerful (in raw processing power) than the 360 if at all. Remember PS2 in raw processing terms is supposed to be more powerful than Xbox but was let down by the rest of the architecture and we are hearing similar rumblings this time around.
    That aside the price is just plain wrong and the consumer could prove it to be so. It's probably already happening.
    As for catching up with Live with their Online 'service' what are you smoking? Yea it will be better than the last mess that wouldn't be hard though.

    Edited by BartonFink at 18/05/06 @ 08:02

  • Scimarad #175 6 years ago

    "I think you'll find the Xbox pad, the 360 pad and the Wii-mote (by all accounts) are way, way better."

    I'd probably agree that the 360 pad is better than the DSII but that Wii thing is definitely a tad 'marmite', aside from the fact that isn't really directly comparable to a new pad.

    I'd use a DSII over a Gamecube or Dreamcast pad anyday.

  • johnboy_johsnon #176 6 years ago

    @Arwin: A more glaring oversight is this weird economics thing called inflation, which means that the PS3 is actually released at just about exactly the same price-point as the PS2. I've shown this in another thread already, but try 2% of interest over 6 years. It's more than you think (and for the U.S., with the drop of the Dollar against the Euro thanks to a record-breaking deficit, it is worse).

    Sorry, don't agree with this at all. Consoles, over the years, have very much stayed the same price, reagrdless of inflation. The Saturn and PS1 actually outrpiced the XBox360 (the Staurn was on sale for £399 in Ireland which is the equivalent of about €600). Also, there hasn't been too much of a change in the price of games. Games for the 360 currently retail for €70. Games for the Megadrive were IR£50-55 (~€65). The €70 will probably drop over the next year or so as did the price of XBox games.

    If you look at most electronic goods you'll see that they are the only things that go down in price (as they technology and processes improve the price goes down). The hefty price tag for the PS3 is probably attributable to new technology i.e. Blu-Ray.

  • bloodflowers #177 6 years ago

    Scimarad: overall I'd say you're right on DS2 v 360 pad, but the 360 pad has one HUGE letdown. The d-pad on it is absolute rubbish. Just try playing Robotron with it. Poor response, too loose, diagonals nearly impossible, throw is far too big preventing quick movements. It's a shame, nearly a perfect pad.

  • #178 6 years ago

    @arwin
    good to see that someone is well informed and can write posts that are well thought out.


    But for many of the other posters like, Dizzy, Carrybagma, Barton Fink, etc..
    it seems they don't know shit about what they are talking about. They're the kind of people that don't have the ability to reason or listen, they just spout nonsense in such a way that other people think it's right. These guys first attack the PS3, then they attack people supporting the PS3 telling them "The PS3 doesn't even exist yet.... " etc.

    Hmm, what a bunch of psychopaths.


  • Dizzy #179 6 years ago

    >it seems they don't know shit about what they are talking about

    Strange then that I am a (games) developer and Arwin is probably working for Sony Marketing. I guess you believe what you want to hear I guess. Good luck with your PS3.

  • #180 6 years ago

    @Dizzy

    call yourself what you will.

    You were probably one of those talking crap about the PS2 also.


    I'm really happy with the PS2, so I'm glad I didn't follow your "qualified" spout.

  • #181 6 years ago

    @Dizzy

    "Why are people like Arwin trying to convice us to buy a pice of junk. "


    lol @ Dizzy, you seem like a balanced informed developer, roflomgzorroflcopter!!!!11

  • Dizzy #182 6 years ago

    "I'm really happy with the PS2, so I'm glad I didn't follow your "qualified" spout. "

    I never said the PS2 is not a good investement. It is just pretty weak designed hardware and Sony got their market share due to PS1 (good machine) and some big lies and promises. In the end developers made some awesome games.. so yes, consumer wise there is nothing wrong with PS2 (and the PS3 will probably also do fine in the end)

    Yes you can be happy with PS2 and yes, maybe you will be very happy with your PS3. Sadly you are rewarding Sony for bad design, lies and weak support for the developers. Fine by me since I don't make PS games ;)

    >you seem like a balanced informed developer

    Err... yes... no serious developer could actually be happy with PS2/3. Jusk ask Carmack if you want a famous one.
    Edited by Dizzy at 18/05/06 @ 09:37

  • kangarootoo #183 6 years ago

    Calm down you two. The thing isn't out yet. So lets try to avoid waving out CVs in the air or calling each other psychopaths. This isn't Ricky Lake you know.

  • toy_brain #184 6 years ago

    Wow, lotta anti-Sony fanboys around these days....

    Ahem, anyway, with regards to Sony's showing..... well, last year the only piece of game footage I believed to be 'real' was I-8 (now Resistance: Fall of man) and the various tech-demo thingys. The Killzone and Motorstorm stuff was clearly pre-rendered so I just mentally dismissed them with a "yea, would be nice, but thats clearly marketing bull"
    So for this years E3 showing, I just wanted to see if I-8 had improved at all, and if any of the games had come at all close to their 2005 showinngs.
    Heavenly Sword seems to be very close to what was shown last year, which is good, most games sites had decent things to say about it too which is promising. Motorstorm... yea, its not really close to the CGI stuff, but it also isn't as bad as 'that' screenshot ukresistance.com had up a while back - which is a relief. It still has a long way to go though.
    Killzone being a no-show raised a few eyebrows, and with good reason. I suspect the finished game will look nowt like last years trailer. If they didnt have enough ready to put togeather a 5-minute realtime demo, then that probably means they are still creating the games basic assets - which would imply that they couldnt re-use any of what was in that trailer (I'm reaching here I know. But wild speculation and uninformed guesses is what the comments section is for :p ).
    I-8/Resistance seemed to be coming alsong just fine though. Graphically it's nothing eye-shattering, but everything seems smooth and well-detailed so it gets a thumbs-up from me.

    Basically, after the PS2 (and Xbox - hey remember that demo with the girl and the dancing robot?) I've gotten used to marketing bull and mentally cutting through the pre-rendered-footage shite, so I actually had quite low expectations going into E3, which sony managed to meet and even very slightly surpass with Heavenly Sword.

    Looking ahead and to the price.... y'know what, the price of the hardware dosen't bother me that much. A one-off payment of £410 for a machine thats good for 5-6 years isn't going to hurt my finances that much. But its the price of the software that counts. £50 for Xbox360 games is a hard pill to swallow after I'd gotten so used to £30 PS2 games. Will PS3 games cost as much? Probably, and that's what will hurt the most, and this could be where the Wii could win out. If Nintendo deliver their promise of having the cheapest software then I'll gladly hand over my cash to them. Scew the daft controller - just gimme good, cheap games!

  • Nikanoru #185 6 years ago

    Anti-Sony fanboy? That's like saying there are anti-Bin Laden fanboys.

    People merely judge their actions.

  • JediMasterMalik #186 6 years ago

    @toy_brain - Great arguement, I agree with pretty much everything you say except about the Wii. I'm not bashing it butfor things like the Wii, I'd really have to play it before making a decision about it's games, they still seem to be havng some teething problems with the motion sensing, which surprisingly Sony (despite only 1 demo) don't seem to have. Don't bash me now, it's just what I thought.

  • PearOfAnguish #187 6 years ago

    Arwin is probably working for Sony Marketing

    Certainly sounds like it, he talks enough crap to be a marketing man.

  • ToeWars #188 6 years ago

    Sony PS3 backlash - It's like watching a train wreck in slow motion. Anyway...

    I'm not bothered about the price, I just want them to put the rumble feature back into the controller and stop bullshitting us about why it was removed.

    It might sound petty, but it's the sole reason why I've been thrown into doubt about the PS3. Before E3 it was a dead cert, now it's 50/50. The damn thing isn't backwards compatible without the vibro-sprout challenge. Psycho Mantis will look bloody silly for a start.

    *sighs*

    .......

    *sighs again*

  • #189 6 years ago

    @Dizzy "Yes you can be happy with PS2 and yes, maybe you will be very happy with your PS3. Sadly you are rewarding Sony for bad design, lies and weak support for the developers. Fine by me since I don't make PS games ;) "

    Dizzy, how can you say that it is badly designed, or that that support for the devs is bad?

    From the articles I've read, many devs are happy, and don't tell me both Ninty and MS keep all of their devs happy. Also, you don't particiapte in making PS games, do you work for MS?

  • Dizzy #190 6 years ago

    >From the articles I've read, many devs are happy

    Oh please... give it up.

    And no I don't work for MS... I make games on PC and maybe (hopefully) some day a Live Arcade game :)

  • Arwin #191 6 years ago

    Come now, surely if I were a marketing person I'd spend all my time thinking about L337 graffiti advertisements, push dirty rumors through affiliate gamesites, or think up cool slogans with the word 'disruptive'.

    Instead I'm just a (31 year old) gamer who can read and who's been around for 20 years of gaming.

    That doesn't mean I wouldn't love to work in the game industry, but in marketing I'd be a problem because I hate lying, and game development means I won't see my wife anymore. Maybe I'll write for games-sites some more.

    Who knows, though, one day I'll find a way to make work of my hobby. Maybe I can start a games-consultancy firm here in Europe like the guy who did that in the U.S.
    Edited by Arwin at 18/05/06 @ 10:56

  • Arwin #192 6 years ago

    Oh, and for the record, I think that the Sony marketing department should be fired - or at the very least their Playstation division in the West. They suck.

    I haven't had any training in marketing, but I know about gaming and I am willing to bet money I could do a much, much better job.

  • Dizzy #193 6 years ago

    "Who knows, though, one day I'll find a way to make work of my hobby. Maybe I can start a games-consultancy firm here in Europe like the guy who did that in the U.S. "

    Well you have some serious work ahead of you mate.

  • NoCodeNed2 #194 6 years ago

    @Dizzy - so you don't make games for playstation, you never have, but you know how hard it is to develop for PS3?

    Because john carmack says so?

    does that mean that the devs that have got stuff up and running this early on Ps3 (and remember Tom's 'not particuarly pro-Sony' article saying that - "games that look healthier six months out than Microsoft's did at the comparable point";) are lucky or are have got to grips with it better?

    I don't mean to pick on you but I'm not understanding how if what you say is true, what we've seen and what's been said about the games on the floor can be true as well?

    I'm not a programmer, so throw terra-flip-flops at me at your peril ; )

  • WicKeD #195 6 years ago

    Someone fetch the giant enemy crabs.

    *throws a rubber duck at Arwin's head*

  • Dizzy #196 6 years ago

    @Dizzy - so you don't make games for playstation, you never have, but you know how hard it is to develop for PS3?

    I can read PS3 tech sheets and I can see (some) of the tools they have. I am also not saying it is SUPER hard... but in my (technical) opinion it is a bad decision to use Cell for a console when much better and cheaper options are available (look how easily IBM designed the 360 design... and yes.. the Cell team did that as well strangely). Cell was originally part of a plan to produce (cheap scalable) chips for "devices" and take on the competition. Sadly that plan seems to have fallen into the water for IBM and Sony. While Cell is a very interesting concept it seems way to expensive and doesn't really offer the features that were planned when the original idea began to take shape. So now the only use for Cell is likely going to be PS3. Obviously Sony wants to use Cell after spending so much money on it... but there are so many better options for consoles and sadly the developers will have to pay the price (in time and money) (and the consumers as well apparently). I am not a hardware engineer, just a software engineer so for me the hardware is a tool. I am sure hardcore hardware guys can tell you more about the 360 vs PS3 design. From where I am standing it looks like Sony designed the hardware mostly from a marketing POV and as a "reaction" against the competition (always a bad decision IMHO). The whole Bluray thing is worse.... but I am not getting into that.

    >Because john carmack says so?

    And BTW John has also never developed on PS3 (they dont even have a dev kit). he is also basing his opinions on the tech sheets. Do you think we software people have to actually use it before we can give an opinion (ok maybe not always 100% fair). Car freaks can give option on a car based on the tech information without driving it (allthough of course that might change their opinion ;)
    Edited by Dizzy at 18/05/06 @ 11:16

  • TripleSeven #197 6 years ago

    Wait till TGS this year, then complain (if justified ;) ).

  • tiddles #198 6 years ago

    Car freaks can give option on a car based on the tech information without driving it (allthough of course that might change their opinion ;)

    And the chances of that opinion being worth more than jack shit are? :)

  • NoCodeNed2 #199 6 years ago

    @Dizzy - I'm not disputing your tech knowledge (I have none myself with which to dispute it : ) but all I'm saying is there are games there, they appear to work and according to some appear to be in a better state of development than 360 games at a similar time before launch.

    Now given the publicised lateness of SDK delivery and taking into account Microsoft's renowned toolset and dev support, I'm just imagining that beyond the tech specs there must be something that's making it easier to develop for than was originally thought.

  • PearOfAnguish #200 6 years ago

    And the chances of that opinion being worth more than jack shit are?

    Why? If you have knowledge about something you don't always have to see it in action to have an idea of how it works. For example, I know enough about PC hardware to judge how well a graphics card or processor will handle particular games. It's an opinion, but one based upon knowledge and experience.

  • toy_brain #201 6 years ago

    "Wait till TGS this year, then complain (if justified ;) ). "

    Good point, Sony are still very much a Japanese company and Japan will be their primary focus (despite what they may tell you about worldwide launch plans), so its likely they will put in a much stronger showing there.
    Well hopefully.

    And hey, mabye TGS 06 will be where the Wii is finally priced and dated.......

  • The-Bodybuilder #202 6 years ago

    @Arwin-"Where the PS3 however shows that it is likely to catch up with the online part"

    What are you basing this one? Sony haven't shown anything or told us of thier infrastructure.

    But why ask? We all know where you stand.

  • The-Bodybuilder #203 6 years ago

    And I don't get why people are comparing the ps3 in its current state the the 360 last year E3.
    Weren't the ps3 devs this actually using devkits, when the 360 devs were using PCs?
    And don't forget Gears of War was in a playable form last year (also excluding the oblivion and GR screens).

  • morriss #204 6 years ago

    /is late to the party

    Great article. Mirrors what many have been saying all along.

  • Arwin #205 6 years ago

    What do you mean they haven't shown anything? Tell me what they haven't shown precisely.

    http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=8652
    http://money.cnn.com/2006/03/22/technology/sony_ps3/index.htm
    http://ps3.ign.com/articles/706/706090p1.html

    ... and some examples of implementation in-game were shown in Warhawk, Formula 1, and Singstar, among others, both at E3 and the GDC earlier this year.

    As for the new interface, showing the basic ps3 enhanced browser and the friends section (though not fully demonstrated) there's some more details shown in the E3 clip at the bottom of this page which you might have missed:

    http://www.joystiq.com/category/sony-playstation-3/

    Now I'm sure there's a lot more to be shown, but I have a feeling we will over the next six months.

    Feel free to challenge anything I claim. If you prove me wrong at anything I've said, even a year from now, I'll gladly and publicly apologise and say I was wrong, and you were right.

    Yes, really, I'm not hyping myself. I actually come with that feature installed. I know, almost no-one does, but hey.

  • bladeaku #206 6 years ago

    Sony just seem to be saying we are going to do it our way,and dont give a shit what its customers think, 100 million ps2s sold maybe they have a right to be arrogant.
    Still I hope people wake up and dont fall for the hype,buy it if its got fantastic games not because its the hot new gadget on the street.

  • PearOfAnguish #207 6 years ago

    "Where the PS3 however shows that it is likely to catch up with the online part"

    Total horseshit. Catch up how? They're unlikely to catch up on subscribed users, not unless they sell a royal-fuckload of consoles and the service, as it's coming from Sony, is 99% certain to be a buggy, irritating pile of bollocks.

  • kangarootoo #208 6 years ago

    "A one-off payment of £410 for a machine thats good for 5-6 years isn't going to hurt my finances that much. But its the price of the software that counts. £50 for Xbox360 games is a hard pill to swallow after I'd gotten so used to £30 PS2 games."

    A very good point.

    @Arwin
    "I haven't had any training in marketing, but I know about gaming and I am willing to bet money I could do a much, much better job."

    People say that about all aspects of this industry. All. The. Time. And they are almost always wrong.

    Knowing about gaming is honestly way down the ladder when it comes to development. Production management, setting appropriate targets, forcasting trends in current markets, finding ways to attract new markets, reacting appropriately to focus testing.

    Man, I could bimble on for ages, the point is that "knowing about games" is certainly an advantage but it won't get you anywhere without the other skills that are mandatory.

    A lack of training doesn't mean you wouldn't necessarily have an affinity for doing the job, but marketing is a skill like any other. Marketing a product to w world market is an absolutely collosal job. Some mistakes will occur (as we have seen with all three big hitters), but that is because success is so extremely hard to achieve.

    If you can honestly sit there and think that you could do a better job without any training, you have a ludicrous ego problem.

  • login_name #209 6 years ago

    @Dizzy
    Being in development does not make you any less of a fanboy. I've worked with a ton of em.

    Fanboys are idiots. They miss out on so many great games. In the end they only hurt themselves...poor misguided children....
    Edited by login_name at 18/05/06 @ 14:25

  • Eighthours #210 6 years ago

    Arwin seems to be king among fanboys. I thought the article was very balanced. The fact of the matter is that Sony put on a poor show, nothing more.

  • PearOfAnguish #211 6 years ago

    I do like the way Arwin slates an opinion piece for having an opinion.

    (slow clap)
    Edited by PearOfAnguish at 18/05/06 @ 14:47

  • login_name #212 6 years ago

    "The fact of the matter is that Sony put on a poor show, nothing more."

    Yup, they sure did and they fully deserve all the negative feelings towards them right now, but I have to say, Microsoft didn't exactly set my world on fire either. Nintendo had a couple of interesting things but the Wii feels more of a party/novelty type of console at the moment. Also, I'm a big supporter of gameplay over graphics but I couldn't help feel just a little disappointed at the Wii's graphical prowess.
    Edited by login_name at 18/05/06 @ 14:54

  • kangarootoo #213 6 years ago

    Lets chill out on Arwin now eh? I feel like I have prompted a ganging up attack, and that is never cool.

  • chavatar #214 6 years ago

    Knowing about gaming is honestly way down the ladder when it comes to development. Production management, setting appropriate targets, forcasting trends in current markets, finding ways to attract new markets, reacting appropriately to focus testing

    I agree with your main point completely, but marketing and development aren't the same thing.

  • Arwin #215 6 years ago

    kangarootoo, chavatar:
    I work as a software designer and project manager in CRM systems, and work closely together with marketing and business development people for a big international firm. I know enough about this business to know that marketing is a big field with many aspects, of which business development and communication are two important ones. I am also a big fan of Socrates ... .

    I take no issue with Sony's business development strategies, as these seem to be fairly solid. These lead to decisions that will have to prove themselves and probably make sense from a business perspective. But then you have to sell these decisions (and relevant products) to your audience, and there comes the part that we are dealing with right now and I take issue with.

    For starters, there are a lot of people talking to the press that are really content people, and although of course they can and probably are press-trained to a decent extent, some of them aren't all that suitable for the job. Phil Harrison isn't bad, he's an entertaining speaker to some extent, though that doesn't necessarily mean he will come across as sympathetic to a U.S. audience. But some of the others are horrible speakers and it would do them well to be packaged more attractively in terms of a nicer, more interactive and fluent presentation. Nintendo did that better, at least for a certain part - what was this Reggie guy doing there, for instance? Did he just get that job because people were too scared to turn him down?

    E3 may be a large scale press-event in theory, but in practice E3 is an Expo and a lot shown there is relegated to the public directly. What I would do is try to get the probably very expensive but not very original ads to present more coherence with clear consumer oriented communication strategy from the get go. And certainly more accessibly.

    Basically, if you keep track of the industry through following online press and forums, you can predict what kind of issues will come into play and what you need to address during a presentation. E3 is just one long extended commercial, and your advertisement campaign should be in line with it. If you can show you have a clear vision of your own future, one of the best ways is by presenting this as clearly as possible to your audience.

    Sony have not been clear, and there's nothing more obvious in that respect as the need they've had to clarify things afterwards. This should not have been necessary. While I think they can afford this kind of strategy because they have a strong position and a strong product, you should never rely on reputation alone.

    They don't have to defend their pricing strategy to me, or to a lot of business analysts, but they have to defend their pricing strategy to many others. A player in Sony's position has it easy, but should take that comfort zone and make the most of it, not sit back until you've lost it and are at the mercy of your competitors. I've seen a few companies go down from up close. Won't happen to Sony now, but it will happen eventually.

    That said, I think that communication and PR is one of the few things that Sony could be doing better. For the rest they are doing quite well, imho.

    A good strategy in development circles is to draw up coherent branching plans that get you a good consistent campaign with nice buildup that you can accomodate to different strategic plans that can dynamically follow tech and business development. It doesn't have to be expensive or wild, as long as it outputs something that builds on a certain message so that people remember what you say - that way communication is a lot more effective. Right now it just seems as if their marketing is intentionally as non-commital as possible, and they let the devs talk whenever they have something to say that's deemed not to clue in the competition too early.

    By the way, I have no problems with being ganged up on. I can take it. ;) (certainly on-line)
    Edited by Arwin at 18/05/06 @ 16:17

  • chavatar #216 6 years ago

    Arwin I think kanga was taking issue with your claim you could be a successful marketeer with no training and experience because you have a good knowledge of games.

    As for work experience, my role is similar to yours, but not CRM. Definitions of marketing, business and software development and methodologies vary considerably in my experience (which is longer than you have been playing games - not being patronising, just putting it into perspective).

    However, given the length of your carefully crafted posts, I have to wonder how busy you actually are! ;)

  • mankell #217 6 years ago

    You know what the problem is - fecking Blu-ray. I don't want it. No-one fecking wants it.
    I want a games console. I don't want the PS3 to play films on, or to cook my tea, or wash my socks or pull me off when the missus has got the painters in.
    Take off the price of that piece of unproven crap and your laughing and game over MS.

    Us gamers are just the pawns in the centre of a bigger war then just consoles.

    /salutes with a tear in the eye.

  • JediMasterMalik #218 6 years ago

    Does anyone think that MS are selling the HD DVD drive for less then £140?

  • mankell #219 6 years ago

    @Jedi

    MS quote that the total cost of the system + Drive will be less than PS3. What does that make it? £130 ish.

  • Carrybagma #220 6 years ago

    Sony cannot market this machine any better because they haven't got anything to market yet.

    I'm surprised that anyone who claims to be a fan of Playstations will stick up for what Sony did at E3. They raised expectations sky-high last year, and now they've failed to live up to them. They should have done so much better in the time they've had since last year, but they've just gone around in a circle. They deserve all the stick they're getting at the moment. Hopefully it will prompt them to do something.

  • MDL199 #221 6 years ago

    Tom Bramwell talks out of his ass if you ask me. The only next gen console you can really judge is the 360 because it's the only one that's out yet.

  • kangarootoo #222 6 years ago

    @Arwin

    Dude, you really need to stop with these huge posts. You often have some interesting stuff to say, but I'm telling you people will stop reading after a couple of paragraphs (or immediately once they realise how long the post is, because they know they won't reach the end, so there is no point continuing).

    If you were running a semina you would hold the floor, but in here where everyone wants to make their point, soapboxing won't actually get across what you want to say. I do it myself sometimes sure, but I know it doesn't really help me any.

    @chavatar

    Yeah, I agree on the marketing and developing being different machines angle. I started off wanting to respond to Arwin's marketing claim, but then after my own "people say this about many parts of this industry" statement, I kind of went off on my own little agenda and lost focus somewhat. Oops :)
    Edited by kangarootoo at 18/05/06 @ 17:34

  • chavatar #223 6 years ago

    @kangarootoo

    With you on that one ;) Ignorance is bliss, but a little knowledge is a dangerous thing...

  • AOFanboi #224 6 years ago

    People who do not want Blu-Ray in a console: You're in effect saying you don't want games on 25/50 GB media instead of 5/9 GB media. Are you the same ones who didn't want a CD-ROM because the floppy drive was good enough? Hint: It wasn't.

    People who think it's too expensive: Are you aware of price/demand curves? Why would Sony pick a price point that was lower than an estimated sale of 4 million units before year end? Why create demand for ten million when you only produce four? Sony aren't in business to give away income to eBayers.

  • BartonFink #225 6 years ago

    And there isn't a format war about to begin.
    This really is Sony's Trojan horse to get Blu-ray into your home and gamers are being expected to subsidise it with an overpriced console.

  • Carrybagma #226 6 years ago

    If your game isn't >25GB then there really isn't any point?

    @BartonFink: Quite right. If the PS3 is such a bargain 'cos you get a fabulously expensive BD player with it, why don't Sony create an even BETTER bargain by dumping the BD, and sticking a regular DVD in there for £280? Guaranteed success, no?

    Of course, they never will - and if a journalist was to press them on that, they'd seriously claim that less than 25GB is insufficient.

    ED:
    Cooo - a 'less than' symbol removed half a line..
    Edited by Carrybagma at 18/05/06 @ 23:34

  • BartonFink #227 6 years ago

    Exactamundo - I have always thought BD was going to bite them in the ass and it may very well come to pass given the reaction the price is getting.
    Edited by BartonFink at 18/05/06 @ 23:38

  • admir #228 6 years ago

    this years E3 sucked
    all i wanted to know the PS3 price $600 which i dont mind and to bad they didn't show killzone

  • Les #229 6 years ago

    Coming to market with 2 models is a smart decision, at least in the way Sony does it: the differences between the two versions will not affect gameplay. And in this way they might attract some extra buyers of their machine. It'll not confuse consumers too much and those who are confused are probably not the ones able to buy a 1080p capable TV... Unless they are professional football players of course. ;-)

    That the cheaper model doesn't come with HDMI is a perfectly sane decision: Sony doesn't want to hand out a bargain blueray player to people that will not buy games for the machine. Remember, even on the expensive model they'll make a significant loss which they can only make up for by selling enough games. People who attack them for this are idiots: if you want the functionality, you can get it, but for a bit more money. If you don't, then please shut up. Although Sony brought it a bit upon themselves by stressing the 1080p so much beforehand.

    Whether blueray is really needed for games in another thing, but anyone who has a HD TV set right now must admit that DVD really will not do for the new generation of TVs. So a new format is needed eventually and that Sony wants to use PS3 to establish a strong foothold for their own format is again a logical decision. Whether gamers will buy the machine at this price is another thing, but given the shortages at launch time, it'll probably be no problem. How PS3 will fare after that is another thing. I don't have the impression for example that 360's are flying of the shelves now that the shortages have been solved.

    But in the end it's the games that count and the launch lineup doesn't look that impressive (but not worse than that of 360 of Wii). But as soon as FF XIII, PS3 Gran Turismo and MGS4 hit the shelves, I'm afraid I'll not be able to constrain myself.
    Edited by Les at 19/05/06 @ 09:07

  • TripleSeven #230 6 years ago

    I bet Sony (and especially Capcom with Devil May Cry 4) will show some great stuff and rule this year's TGS.
    It'd a fitting concept. Announce an high price and nothing too exciting and concentrate all the awsome stuff in an event short before the PS3's release.

  • 786Beast #231 6 years ago

    It's obvious what will happen, they will rule the gaing industry just like with ps2.

    in tgs I'm expecting to see games like mgs4, devil amy cry, gran turismo, gt4, ff13 and resident evil 5, killzone 2, these games are what people will drool over!

  • miiiguel #232 6 years ago

    I think most of you domn't get the whole picture. Do you realize that the majority of people that own a PS2 doesn't even know what's DMC, right ?
    I couldn't care less who "wins the console wars" I don't own shares of neither companies, but I'm having a real blast with my 360.

    And the ones who say Sony's online feature can cope with Live, come on..., that's too much wishfull-thinking. Do you realize what takes to run a datacenter, capabable of delivering 24/7 for millions of people ?
    In my opinion you can't go over + 20 years of networking expertise. And most likely you don't use Live, for sure you are those 4 people that play PS2 online, right ?

    Sony "supporters", chill, please, I feel for you. Somehow you have this urge for Sony's consoles to sell more than other, it's awkward, but hey..., maybe that enhances your game experiences - I sometimes wonder: If PS3 outsellls 360, will Oblivion be a worse game, from that day on ?
    Last year the reason for Sony box to be the god of consoles, was this super-power, the 7 controllers, the 2xhdmi; now is the 4 (four) exclusives that everyone talks about..., it's no use, Sony suits can do whatever they want, you will allways wave their flag. Don't you have a football team to support ?

    An for what I see, this guy might be right:
    "Sony Computer Entertainment Europe CEO David Reeves boasted, "We have built up a certain brand equity...that the first million [consumers] are going to buy [the PlayStation 3]...even if it doesn't have games."...,
    I could add that Sony could sell an empty box with its logo and some still would buy it.
    Edited by miiiguel at 28/05/06 @ 17:42

  • Les #233 6 years ago

    @miiiguel

    Don't really see why you're so upset if you don't care...

    "I could add that Sony could sell an empty box with its logo and some still would buy it."

    And in what way does this differ from Microsoft, Nintendo, Apple, Coca-Cola, etc.? Don't really see your point.

  • miiiguel #234 6 years ago

    @Les

    I'm not upset, I just think it's funny. Believe me I've tried to undestand the "console brand supporting thing" but I can only feel that kind of feeling towards my football team, you know..., that mine rules, every other suxs, one.

    Another funny thing in game industry, is the need that many gamers, and even major companies have, that they must have Japan aproval for a game or a console to be any good, I mean, it's something like the movie industry, unless a movie is applauded at Cannes it's not any good.

    May I think for myself ?
    Edited by miiiguel at 06/06/06 @ 13:06