BioShock Review

By Kristan Reed Published 15 August, 2007

Cue rapturous applause.

Version tested: Xbox 360

Promise is possibly the most powerful weapon in videogames. The promise and possibilities that a title like BioShock dangles tantalisingly in front of us keeps us all hanging on in there, keeps us believing, keeps us pre-ordering. Even when the shelves are awash with me-too pap, cheap knock-off licensed fodder and hyped sequels, a title like this stands out like a beacon of hope amid a sea of mediocrity. No pressure.

But we all know from long experience that promise can be a bitter curse - one destined to magnify any minor disappointments when we finally get the game out of the cellophane and fire it up. A game is never as good as its hype, or so history seems to rub in our face over and over again. Some of us even try our best to avoid getting caught up in the hype bubble, so that, for once, we can actually be pleasantly surprised about how good something is without having it rammed down our throats by hysterical marketing and frothing commentators. Believe me, even as a reviewer - especially as a reviewer - you're always on your guard when it comes to the Next Big Thing. Disappointment comes practically gift wrapped for your displeasure.

So to have any shred of doubt surrounding BioShock comprehensively swept away within the first ten minutes, well, you feel like dancing. You want to tell people about this game who you know won't even care, just because it makes you so giddy inside. Before we get into the nitty gritty, here's the deal: Bioshock doesn't just meet your expectations, but completely redefines them forever in ways you never even expected - in ways that games used to in the past, routinely. The hours spent playing this masterpiece were the perfect encapsulation of why videogaming is such a favourite waste of time for so many of us. Thrilling, terrifying, moving, confusing, amusing, compelling, and very very dark. BioShock isn't simply the sign of gaming realising its true cinematic potential, but one where a game straddles so many entertainment art forms so expertly that it's the best demonstration yet how flexible this medium can be. It's no longer just another shooter wrapped up in a pretty game engine, but a story that exists and unfolds inside the most convincing and elaborate and artistic game world ever conceived. It just so happens to require you to move the narrative along with your own carefully and personally defined actions. Active entertainment versus passive: I know which I prefer.

'BioShock' Screenshot 1

Screen shots can't even hope to do the game justice.

The kicker is that for about 80 per cent of the time spent playing BioShock, you have absolutely no idea who you are or why you're even there. As players of the celebrated 360 demo will know by now, you're a castaway involved in a plane crash. You're in the sea. It's the middle of the night. There's floating burning debris all around you. And, oh look, there's a mysterious structure that just happens to be sticking out of the water with an entrance. What are the chances? Rather than bobbing in the ocean dying of hypothermia questioning this conundrum, you swim over, clamber out and head inside. It seemed like a good idea at the time.

In this strange subterranean otherworld of 'Rapture' exists a crumbling utopia gone very badly wrong. A leaking, decaying, but still recognisably beautiful art deco-styled outpost where a section of privileged society sought an even better life below the waves. A place where biological enhancements offered its high living population the carrot of physical perfection. Somehow, this relentless desire for morehas sparked a devastating civil war which destroyed their idyllic existence. There's a lesson there somewhere...

The thing that strikes you instantly about BioShock and Rapture as a place is the stunning atmosphere it manages to conjure - it really is quite unlike anything else in the way Irrational has managed to immerse your senses in a way you always hoped a 'proper' next generation title would. If you were looking for a reason to invest in a high end AV set-up, then this is definitely it. It justifies every last penny you can throw at it, because it's no exaggeration to report that not only does BioShock boast the most staggeringly beautiful environments you've ever lain eyes on in a videogame, but adds infinite depth to them through the absolutely astonishingly well-crafted audio that accompanies the experience. The significance of BioShock currently being console exclusive to the 360 can't be underestimated. If you don't already own a 360, you'll most certainly find your resolve weakened to breaking point - and failing that, you'll want to make your PC dance to its tune.

There are so many deft touches at every turn within Bioshock that's it's almost as fun to watch as it is to play. You'll probably spend the first few hours inside Rapture just playing tourist to your own amazement. Nothing's overcooked, and there's this constant feeling that you're wandering through the work of true visionaries. At times it's like walking through a living painting, where every creation makes you want to stop in your tracks and just breathe it all in. Walk up to some of the character models (take the Dolls, for example), and you'll swear they couldn't be infused with any more life than if they were sat there in the room with you staring you out over a Mocha. It might well be created with a modified version of the Unreal 3 engine, but it's got to the stage where you don't even care about the tech so much as the creativity eked out of it all. You almost don't want to know about what's behind the illusion. You're too wrapped up in it.

Simple things take on a new significance. Engage in something as basic as a firefight with a Splicer and the smoke of their gun can often leave you bathed and confused in the most convincing haze imaginable in your hapless attempts to give chase. Wade into a pool and the whole thing ripples; water dribbling down your face, as it splashes and refracts light in a manner that seems almost too natural. Not now. Not yet, surely? But here's BioShock in August 2007, looking for all the world like a game that's landed fully formed from a couple of years in the future. It's a game that's going to make a lot of rival developers either very excited or very depressed indeed over the coming months as they come to terms with how far ahead this game is - not just in technical terms, but in practically every other angle as well. Admittedly, the very nature of the tight, enclosed environments help give Irrational the extra headroom it needed to really pile on the detail levels, but that's not the only reason. There's genuine talent and vision at work here.

So, yes, the atmosphere and artwork is undeniably the thing that effortlessly grabs hold of the player, but BioShock is so much than an immersive tech demo poster child thanks to the amount of credibility that's been infused into every part of the game world: be it the combat, the exploration, the narrative, or the puzzling. It's a game that breaks down so well however you want to deconstruct it. And unlike so many shooters, this isn't a game that wilfully funnels you through narrow environments. The overarching nature of the game is still admittedly linear, but it's the kind of linearity that allows the player to poke around to your heart's content, and flit back and forth as and when you fancy sniffing out a few more secrets from a previously neglected area (and believe me, there'll be plenty). It's a game that will entice you to look at its map to explore, scavenge and go off the beaten track. And it's not just about the treasure hunt, either. With its subtle audio narrative forming as you go along, there's an even greater incentive to take you time - not only to discover yet more hidden audio diaries from the lost inhabitants, but because you're almost always rewarded for your explorational persistence.

As beautiful as Rapture looks from a furtive glance around its ornate marble-lined halls, whoever is left wanted to make damn sure that anyone attempting to unravel its secrets would meet swift retribution. Behind all the gloss and glorious attention to detail lies a game that, at its core, is just a shooter that wants to make things as fun and diverse for the player as possible. Security camera systems trigger flying sentry cannons. Tripod-mounted turrets spit hot lead the split second you poke your head around a corner you're not supposed to. Strange, mutated 'Splicers' hunt in packs at every turn. It might look like a quaint, crumbling underwater museum that's full of intrigue, but it hides secrets that only the extremely determined will get to find out.

'BioShock' Screenshot 4

Would you Adam and Eve it?

Bypass all these extreme security measures and you might have the pleasurable company of those legendary 'Big Daddy' creatures that you might have seen hanging out in your local game emporium (or is that just a commentary on the West's obesity epidemic?). These lumbering galoots, jealously stomp through the puddles on an inexplicable mission to guard syringe-wielding pre-pubescent girls known as 'Little Sisters'. Decked out in a rusting diving suit and uttering low scowls of discontent, they're not the kind of opponents that offer a fair fight. They're unexpectedly nimble, and armed with uncompromisingly brutal attacks - they're not the kind of foe that you're going to be able to take down without an almighty battle of wills. BioShock isn't a game that ever wants to make things easy for you. It tests you almost to force you to experiment - and that brings its own rewards.

That said, one of the most appreciated design decisions is how BioShock handles death. If you lose your health, there's never any need to restart from a checkpoint - essentially what happens is you get regenerated in a nearby pod, and carry on the fight from where you left off. Not only does this reduce frustration immensely, it means there's a kind of meaningful continuity about proceedings - the kind that has never existed in any shooter. Although this might sound like an awful cop-out in theory, in practice, it's a master-stroke, and one that'll help people carry on when otherwise they might well have given up.

Throughout BioShock, you're essentially tooling yourself up in a progressively elaborate fashion - but in a way that suits the way you want to play it. In common with 2K's other big summer shooter, The Darkness, it's a game with a dual approach to how you go about taking down your enemies. On the right trigger you have various conventional firearms, like the standard pistol, shotgun, machine gun, grenade launcher and so on, but they're a mere taster for what you're capable of.

Meanwhile on the left trigger you have the ability to call up your growing arsenal of biologically enhanced 'Plasmid' attack powers, such as electric bolts, freeze rays, telekenisis, fireballs, or more cunning ones that 'enrage'your opponents against one another, or allow you to fight with Big Daddy on your side, and such like. But even well before you're blessed with all sorts of options, the degree of tactical choice dawns on you. Within just a few minutes of playing the game you'll suss out that you can conjure quick one-twos that leave enemies vulnerable to being stunned by electricity, followed by conventional weapons fire to finish them off. But with a bit more experimentation, you'll notice you can frequently turn the environment to your advantage, too. Wait for an enemy to stand in water, for example, and zapping them with electricity becomes a whole lot more effective. Likewise, that oily patch you might other wise have overlooked becomes a flaming wall of death when ignited at the right time. It's a game all about being observant and experimenting - and when it all comes together, it offers possibly the most thrilling combat in any FPS you've ever experienced. The scope to do things your way is simply mind boggling, in such a way it makes regular shooters look pathetically dated and uninspired by comparison. To say that 'no two players will experience the same game' is bang on the money.No wonder we've been disillusioned for so long about the genre - this game offers up everything we've been hankering after: intelligence, invention, inspiration.

'BioShock' Screenshot 5

I'll have the extra big brain one, ta.

But some of the most effective methods of attack at your disposal can often be the simplest. For instance, zapping security drones, cameras and sentries with electricity enables you to take them out of action for a crucial few seconds - at which point you can either choose to leg it out of harm's way, or get closer and press X to fire up a simple but addictive hacking 'minigame' so that their sole purpose is protecting you, rather than hindering you.

With a little bit of patience and persistence, you can methodically turn the tables on your enemies by turning the entire level a death trap- which has the effect of also making the whole game a lot more fun to invest time and energy into. Better still, these grid-based hacking minigames are an awful lot of fun in their own right, tasking you with linking together pipes from an initial start point to a pre-determined end point. At the beginning, all the tiles in the grid are flipped faced down, and it's up to you to quickly and methodically create a path by quickly flipping the tiles over and switching them until you find the pieces you're looking for. With the flow of energy creeping inexorably down the pipe, you're under the cosh to get it all linked up in time - so if you're not into tile puzzles, this method of security evasion might not be for you. If, however, you do enjoy them, it proves to not only act as a welcome break from the action, but a wonderfully useful means of making the environment work for you.

'BioShock' Screenshot 6

Nice mask.

Inevitably certain sections of the shooter hardcore will grumble loudly about the lack of multiplayer. It's a fair point, but the most obvious riposte is are there not enough shooters out there that cater for this niche? Would Bioshock even benefit from the kind of tacked-on me-too multiplayer that most FPS titles sport like some sort of apologetic 'will this do' badge of dishonour? We'd much rather Irrational focused all of its energies on providing its audience with the very best that single player gaming has to offer than water down the experience by wasting time cobbling together yet another take on Deathmatch and CTF, thanks.

And with that out of the way, all that remains is to insist that anyone with a PC or a 360 goes out and buys this wonderful game on the 24th of August (or sooner if you happen to live near the street date-breaking US retailers), and send a message to the entire games industry that this is the kind of game that people want. BioShock is the ultimate rarity: not only does it live up to its lofty promise, but exceeds it through simple, old fashioned talent and imagination - not to mention verve, style,class, wit, and sheer bloody-minded ambition. It takes the tired, worn-out FPS genre by the scruff of the neck, reinvents and bend it out of shape in such a breathtaking fashion that it's going to take something very special to top this in the months and years ahead. For a game to be so outstanding in one department is one thing - to manage to tick every single box from graphics to audio to gameplay depth to atmosphere and innovation is pretty much unprecedented. Seriously - if you don't find something to love about BioShock, we'd recommend a trip to the nearest doctor to check if your heart's still beating.

10 / 10

Read the Eurogamer.net scoring policy
Picture of Kristan.

About Kristan Reed

Kristan is a former editor of Eurogamer, dad, Stone Roses bore and Norwich City supporter who sometimes mutters optimistically about Team Silent getting back together.

Read more articles from Kristan by visiting the Kristan Reed archive page.

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Comments (1028) Latest comment 6 months ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • jamespo #1 5 years ago

    bloody hell!

  • JediMasterMalik #2 5 years ago

    Ownage. Can't wait for this.

  • Restart #3 5 years ago

    Want!

    Now to read the review!

  • Whizzo #4 5 years ago

    Now this is earlier than I expected...

  • DUFFKING #5 5 years ago

    YES!

    Time to read review, the 24th can't come soon enough!

  • caligari #6 5 years ago

    Bring on the working 360s so that I can buy this game. Please!

  • George-Roper #7 5 years ago

    Stunning demo on 360, clearly an indicator of the quality on this. Roll on release!

  • richardiox #8 5 years ago

    24th August... 360 Elite and Bioshock out the same day? SOLD.

  • ecureuil #9 5 years ago

    I didn't expect anything less from this game, was always going to be a 10 IMO. Pity I can't afford a 360 at the moment.

  • TakeTheVeil #10 5 years ago

    next week wont come fast enough

  • Fixxxer #11 5 years ago

    Blimey, wasn't expecting this now.

    That 10, however, I was expecting.

  • Whizzo #12 5 years ago

    I think Kristan liked this for some reason...

    Nice non-spoiler review and you have now made the wait seem even longer, I hope you're bloody happy! :-)

  • JYM60 #13 5 years ago

    \o/

  • stampax #14 5 years ago

    Is this coming out on PS3?

  • Benno #15 5 years ago

    FIRST PAGE!

  • rudedudejude #16 5 years ago

    Liked the review :) Looks like an upgrade is in order...

    Nice one Looking Glass related people!

  • DUFFKING #17 5 years ago

    No worries disc, not long till Halo 3 comes out, then there'll be whinging no matter what score it gets.

  • JediMasterMalik #18 5 years ago

    @stampax - probably...eventually...just get a 360 or play it looking rubbish on your PC :)

    Excellent review btw, this is looking to be GOTY, screw Halo.

    Like the review said, just buy this game, it will send the right message to developers. Irrational should be very proud of this game and what they seem to have achieved.

    /runs from Xerx3s ;p

  • JayeM #19 5 years ago

    I clapped when I saw the score at the end.

    :|

  • Cannibal #20 5 years ago

    I think I'm going to go jerk off in a napkin, I'm THAT happy.

    I think this game should be used in all "Games as art" debates.

  • JediMasterMalik #21 5 years ago

    It seems like the perfect example for it, the narrative, atmosphere, and style seem to have such artistic flavour.

  • Yossarian #22 5 years ago

    YEEEESSSSSSSSSS

  • L0cky #23 5 years ago

    Better than h...

    mOLD!


    How spoilerific is this review? Is it safe to read?

  • Ryltar #24 5 years ago

    Great review, great demo, cant wait for the 24th! 'nuff said.

  • SniperWolf #25 5 years ago

    I knew it, this game is going to rock, the demo was so good I couldn't believe it, truly one of a kind and a modern classic. Bioshock FTW.

  • krudster #26 5 years ago

    The story is fantastic. That is all you need to know. You could write an entire review purely on that element of the game alone. Same with the combat and plasmid upgrade system. Same with the intricacies of the graphics and audio.

    There's so much stuff I didn't even really touch on, but I hope the main thrust of why this game is good came across.

  • jozz #27 5 years ago

    /curtains

  • Sub-kamikaze #28 5 years ago

    I didn't realise I was swept up in the Bioshock hype until I literally spent all day at work refreshing the official forum page at the Cult of Rapture concerning how 'Toys 'R Us' breached the official US release date (deluding myself about the date being brought forward, yet simultaneously knowing full well that would never ever happen...). System Shock 2/Deus Ex obviously have an unconscious power over me...

    That's when I realised I was a little bit unhealthily excited.

    When I saw this review at quarter past twelve, I ran downstairs, poured a drink, ran back up, sat down, and braced myself for the read. I haven't acted like this since I was about 14 (minus the drink part). I'm now 23. This is mighty ridiculous.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 00:36

  • RedPanda #29 5 years ago

    Post deleted at 14:31:59 28-01-2012

  • BartonFink #30 5 years ago

    Great review and fuck you krudster now I have to get this next week. The wife is gonna kill me :(

  • evilashchris #31 5 years ago

    Bioshock... FUCK YEAH!

    One more week to finish my strip early so i can play this when it comes.. Gnnnn

  • tobsen #32 5 years ago

    Damn! I just pre-ordered this game even though I don't own an Xbox 360, and wasn't planning to get one until at least 2008. What now?

  • Yossarian #33 5 years ago

    I feel like a proud dad somehow :)

  • Chtulie #34 5 years ago

    Might Shadowrun fill the multiplayer niche to the type of gaming/combat this game provides in it's single player?

  • Kazzahdrane #35 5 years ago

    Can't wait to get this, and before the demo and hype machine kicked in a couple of weeks ago it was just another game I thought I might get round to trying in the next 12 months. I know it's on PC too but these days the "hardcore" are actually console gamers, like Oblivion I expect this to sell 80%+ of its copies on 360.

  • dllord #36 5 years ago

    Well thats 4 out of 4 internet rewiews (so far) that have gave Bioshock 10/10

    I NEED THIS GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Cannibal #37 5 years ago

    2 reviewers in the next Game Informer also give it 10/10

  • Psychotext #38 5 years ago

    Damn straight. Good on you EG for not letting the hype get in the way of your review.

  • Yossarian #39 5 years ago

    for reference:

    Game Informer: 10/10
    Games Radar: 10/10
    PC Gamer UK: 95%
    OXM UK: 10/10
    Alternative Press: 5/5
    PC Zone: 96%
    Gamer.tv: 5/5
    Eurogamer.net: 10/10

    ...


    Playboy: 4/4 bunnies

  • BartonFink #40 5 years ago

    Maybe it might be time for me to pick up a set of these

  • SniperWolf #41 5 years ago

    It seems that we've been waiting for so long for a game like this, one that we can all agree on, one that makes us happy to be gamers.

    *group hug*

  • Lukus #42 5 years ago

    Wow! Sneaky midnight reviews are ace. If you did this more often I'd probably look at less porn..
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 00:47

  • Shonuff #43 5 years ago

    For the past year I've felt like maybe I was "getting too old" to be a gamer. Nothing coming out excited me or gave me that excited "can't wait to play this" feeling that I used to get in my younger years.

    I'm beyond glad to say that playing the demo for this game has totally shaken this feeling and has me beyond excited to play this game. I'm drawn to all the gaming websites and forums looking for news of this game, yet not wanting to read a word anybody is saying out of fear of spoiling this game.

    Krudster, I agree with you when you said that everybody should go out and buy this game to show the industry that THESE are the games we want to buy and support. I dont want graphical trickery alone, I want involvement in my destiny within the game and to play it the way I feel. I want emotional involvement. The demo teased me with a taste of whats to come, and I'm crawling out of my skin waiting to dive into it headfirst.

    God I can't wait to pick up this game, fire up my TV and surround system and just bask in the beauty that is this game. I feel like I'm about to get laid for the first time or something..it's just unbelievable how hyped I am about this.

    THANK YOU IRRATIONAL FOR MAKING ME FEEL THIS WAY ABOUT A GAME AGAIN!!!!

    And thanks for the sweet review EG :)

  • BremXJones #44 5 years ago

    My copy arrives tomorrow. I CAN'T GO TO SLEEP I'M SO EXCITED.

    KG

  • George-Roper #45 5 years ago

    @krudster

    No offence or anything but was this a review of the demo or the full game? The more I read through it, the more it seems to reflect the demo content. Or am I reading it wrong (like Hudson)?

    It's pre-ordered already, as i'd already decided via the demo, so I don't doubt the gushing praise whatsoever but it does read very similar to my experiences of the demo and then it kinda ends when the demo ends...

    Or maybe I expect too much contrast in gameplay post-demo content, but i'd heard there were dozens and dozens of Plasmid types?

    /puts tinfoil hat on

  • morriss #46 5 years ago

    heh

  • newt #47 5 years ago

    Underwater, no one can hear you salt the fries.

  • krudster #48 5 years ago

    I played it for two solid days. Yes, there are tons of tonics and plasmids, but, like I said, you could write an entire thesis just explaining the mechanics of the game. That's not a review, though, that's a fact sheet, and there are plenty of those types of reviews on the net if you fancy spoiling the game by having it all laid bare.

    As people have already sussed, I just don't want to ruin it for you by even listing half of the cool stuff - a lot of the fun of the game is discovering what crazy new shit you're going to get next.

    The important thing is to say enough to make people want to buy it.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 00:59

  • HoriZon #49 5 years ago

    Played the demo last night on a m8s 360 and i am very tempted to buy an Elite and this!

    PC or 360 ? :)

  • morriss #50 5 years ago

    How are the Achievements spread out? Do they enhance the gameplay? (if that's possible?)

  • manuel_garcia #51 5 years ago

    I'm literally giddy with anticipation at the moment. I can't remember getting this worked up over any game in years.

    I think I have about 4 pre-orders in now, just in the hope that one of them ships early...

  • Yossarian #52 5 years ago

    I have seen the achievements. they are clever and entertaining enough, I suspect.

  • krudster #53 5 years ago

    When I played it in Take 2's office, the build didn't even have acheivements in it. They wanted them to be secret right up to the last minute.

  • DarkChronicle #54 5 years ago

    Excellent, spoiler free review. I cannot wait to get my hands on this! August is looking to be a cracker of a month for good releases.

  • JediMasterMalik #55 5 years ago

    360 for acheivements, PC for best gameplay I would say. Everything else is related to your personal preferences in regards to PC vs Consoles.

  • morriss #56 5 years ago

    Ah! So they probably do have some kind of effect! Cheers Krudster.

  • weeno #57 5 years ago

    wow...that makes waiting until next week easier...

    me want now!

  • Yossarian #58 5 years ago

    what was the last great game in this vein? Thief 3 doesn't quite count, so I suspect it's Deus Ex, and System Shock 2 before that. seven-eight years?

    it's been a long, long, long wait. and yet one more week is intolerable.

  • JediMasterMalik #59 5 years ago

    I'd sasy it was HL2 tbh, but that has a mixed reception amongst some of EG's audience. But yes, other than that, DE it is.

  • JediMasterMalik #60 5 years ago

    Don't mention that...please...

  • BremXJones #61 5 years ago

    HL2, as great as it was, wasn't in this vein.

    KG

  • krudster #62 5 years ago

    Yeah, HL2 had its standout moments, but this has a coherent vision and an actual story that you give a shit about. A back story, an ongoing story...I need to play it over again to properly take in all the audio diary stuff.

  • TwistidChimp #63 5 years ago

    My copy arrives tomorrow. I CAN'T GO TO SLEEP I'M SO EXCITED.

    KG

    Gagh.. to be a reviewer.

    Brilliant review btw Krudster, perfectly pitched. Nevermind game of the year, game of all time by the sounds of it.

  • silke #64 5 years ago

    Excellent review Kristan. And I concur with alot of people in here, my interest in the videogaming world has definitely been waning, fast, these last years.
    But this, this apparent beauty of gaming design, makes me yet again all warm and fuzzy inside.

    August 24. You can't arrive one damn moment too soon....

  • BremXJones #65 5 years ago

    Krudster: I'm glad I've got something else I can write 10 page deconstruction features people pay me the BIG DOLLARS for. I can eat this month!

    KG

  • HarryB #66 5 years ago

    wow, EG gave something a 10! Halo 3 is fucked :)

  • krudster #67 5 years ago

    If there's one game that warrants a deconstruction, it's this. I think people will end up writing books about it. I'm not even joking.

  • Calgon #68 5 years ago

    I knew it would be great, these devs took the crown for my favourites as soon as I played SS2, you can just tell some devs have the knack to grab you more than others.

    I also think Bizarre will deliver on PGR4 too... my two picks for the year, followed by Mass Effect and Halo3, this is 360s year IMO. Who cares how many consoles they shift as an owner/ soon to be owner in my case you cant help but be pretty darn impressed with the amount of quality titles available(for me theres no better choice than the 360 right now... maybe more people will be picking up the Wii it doesnt matter to me I'll be happy enough not to care either way if I get a 360 this year).

  • Yossarian #69 5 years ago

    HL2, as great as it was, wasn't in this vein.

    yeah, I loved Half-Life/2 to death, but they aren't quite perched in that 'intelligent first person adventure/rpg' (for want of a better genre convention) loveseat that gets me a-sweatin and a-shakin.

  • TwistidChimp #70 5 years ago

    I only hope that Microsoft give this the marketing budget it deserves. They should be shouting from the rooftops about this. Dare I say it, outside of the gaming press, I havn't seen a mention of it. I want to see Bioshock on the side of busses. I want tv advertising.

    If this fails at retail.. well.. doesn't bare thinking about really.

  • Yossarian #71 5 years ago

    so krudster should we be boxing up copies and mailing them to one Mr. R. Ebert?

  • BremXJones #72 5 years ago

    Krudster: "If there's one game that warrants a deconstruction, it's this. I think people will end up writing books about it. I'm not even joking."

    I was just on the toilet and thinking about how I'd go about pitching that exact thing. That 10 page cradle article I did for Gamer as a sort of proof-of-concept or something.

    (Hell, I'd like to do a road to Bioshock sort of thing, tracing it back to Ultima Underworlds - I've always wanted to do a history of the Looking Glass Diaspora. Any lineage that takes in both Guitar Hero and Bioshock has got to be worth a good hard look at (Randomly: Eric Brossius, the splendid sound guy, worked on both))

    Yossarian: Tycho at Penny Arcade said this:
    "It is my intention to secure two copies of the game, entire - one Collectors' edition, and one exclusively to shove up Roger Ebert's ass. If Bioshock isn't "art," then art is the poorer for it."

    You know, after all this, I bet I hate it.

    KG

  • Fixxxer #73 5 years ago

    If Kieron deconstructs Bioshock the big winners won't be the developers or the readership but sellers of dictionaries :)
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 01:17

  • Yossarian #74 5 years ago

    Chimp, Bioshock is published by 2K and not by Microsoft. not to say there aren't cooperative marketing endeavours yadda yadda, but it will never get the push an Microsoft Games Studios title would.

  • Yossarian #75 5 years ago

    You know, after all this, I bet I hate it.

    well, you did like Deus Ex 2...

    *ducks*

  • BremXJones #76 5 years ago

    Shush! Now it is a happy time!

    KG

  • SniperWolf #77 5 years ago

    Half life 2 was good, but come on it wasn't that good. I knew within five minutes of playing the Bioshock demo that this is another kettle of fish altogether, it's just dripping with atmosphere, the immersion is just scary. I was actaully afraid to go any further as the sound effect and lighting were freaking me out and making me thing something was coming up behind me, it's a weird version of reality but it seems very real when you're playing, more so than anything I've ever played before.

    I have no idea how the developers pulled this one out of the bag, it's a game but it goes beyond gaming in the way it pulls you in.

  • JediMasterMalik #78 5 years ago

    I see your point about HL2, it was just another shooter (although, to me the best example of that aprticular genre), as opposed to a shooter RPG like this is.

  • TwistidChimp #79 5 years ago

    @ Yossarian. Ah, of course. You'd think MS however would want to publicise this as much as possible. If this isn't a system seller, I dont know what is.

  • Yossarian #80 5 years ago

    oh krudster, I have a genuine review-related question: does the camera/research element feel tacked on? I enjoyed it well enough in Beyond Good & Evil/Dead Rising, but it was mentioned so late on in Bioshock's development that I am sceptical.

  • Cannibal #81 5 years ago

    The only problem with buying the game to encourage developers to make more games like it is that they will make games EXACTLY like it.

    Expect to see MoonShock, where you come across a "deserted" moon base facility from EA, DesertShock from Ubisoft and JungleShock from Capcom.

  • TwistidChimp #82 5 years ago

    Sad but true. Trying to convince a couple of mates they need to get this, they both made 'is it an rpg.. cause I dont like rpg's' comments. To which I replied, well.. it has rpg elements, which was greeted with upturned noses.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 01:30

  • BremXJones #83 5 years ago

    You may now be unsurprised why Irrational spent the last 4 years repeating that it's an FPS.

    KG

  • TwistidChimp #84 5 years ago

    aye, I think that about sums it up.

  • BremXJones #85 5 years ago

    You know - I think they may have a point. Maybe it's time to just *take over the FPS and remake it in a more interesting form?*. I mean, System Shock is *very* close to as old as doom. Ultima Underworlds is older.

    KG

  • Cannibal #86 5 years ago

    So, is Resident Evil 4 officially dethroned as the greatest game of all time? Review wise it seems so at least.

  • Yossarian #87 5 years ago

    well to be fair it is much more of an FPS than Shock 2. while it retains a lot of the same structure, there is a very clear simplification/streamlining at work (even very minor details like not having to activate the respawn points, or more broadly the lack of inventory/paper doll). and, of course, the shooting elements and the combat generally are heads and shoulders -- and knees, and toes -- above SS2, as is every aspect of the presentation save perhaps the sound (SS2 miraculously still holds up to this day in that regard).

  • BremXJones #88 5 years ago

    It's always worth remembering that Shock *1* took a more streamlined approach to that sort of terrain too.

    KG

  • SacredVerse #89 5 years ago

    I don't doubt its a good game....But 10/10. Come on. That would be calling it perfect by definition. And sorry to be a wet blanket but I doubt that very much.
    Very good review. Just don't see the logic in the score.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 01:40

  • TwistidChimp #90 5 years ago

    a 10 does not denote perfection. If it did, then nothing could ever achieve that score.

  • Yossarian #91 5 years ago

    DONT DO IT

    NOT THE PERFECT 10 DEBATE

    NO NEVER PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE LET ME GET WHAT I WANT

  • TwistidChimp #92 5 years ago

    Quite, thats why I kept my answer concise and to a single sentence ;)

  • Guv #93 5 years ago

    Awesome review :) I preorderd months ago but still great reading that review.

    It reminds me alot of Riddick, by starbreze (if you havn't played it, you've missed out, best movie --> game ever) allthough obviously in an entirely diffrent setting, Both have the same great atmosphere and sense of innovation.

  • TwistidChimp #94 5 years ago

    Another quick question Krudster, did you find the item glow in any way obtrusive, out of keeping / suspension of disbelief straining? I realise its a ridiculously minor point when held up to what they seem to have made, but still, its a bit of a worry given that they provided an option to turn it off on the pc version.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 01:46

  • BremXJones #95 5 years ago

    It's worth noting that a section of the PC-community is VERY vocal about the loot glinting issue, which is - I suspect - why they included it.

    KG

  • TwistidChimp #96 5 years ago

    Yeah it is a ludicrously minor point I know, and its obviously by no means a deal breaker (in terms of which version I get, pc or 360). As I say, feels a bit silly bringing it up in light of how astonishing it sounds, but still, it is a bit of a peeve, and I was just wondering if you had any issue with it while you were playing ?
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 01:51

  • Yossarian #97 5 years ago

    it's a pet peeve for me too as a 360 player (from a lapsed PC-only background), but it's very subtle indeed compared to e.g. the noxious neon blue of Thief 3.

  • Calgon #98 5 years ago

    SacredVerse: If very few games get the full 10/10 it just tells you very few games are quite this good(EG dont throw them around lightly... although I dont think San Andreas deserved a 10 though). Or just ignore the score, read the review and decide whether to buy it so you can make you own mind up on the greatness out of 10.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 01:56

  • TwistidChimp #99 5 years ago

    Ah well thats good to know. I just find it rather ruins my suspension of disbelief. I'm not sure why they deem it neccesary to add it to console fps's and not to most pc fps's. Especially these days. What is it exactly that drives that decision ? Is it a presumption about the sort of screen they'l be using, The distance they think the player is likely to be from the tv, or the percieved intelligence of the people they think will be playing ?

  • freedumb #100 5 years ago

    'For a game to be so outstanding in one department is one thing - to manage to tick every single box from graphics to audio to gameplay depth to atmosphere and innovation is pretty much unprecedented.'

    It's not unprecedented, remember Deus Ex did this too in 2000, and it also recieved a 10. Not to mention System Shock 2 the year before.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 01:59

  • citizenHUNTER #101 5 years ago

    Great review.

    I remember seeing the first CGI trailer and the feeling for the world and getting excited about this, more so than anything else in recent years (I went out of gaming for a while due to just losing interest completely in it, but my 360 has brought me back to something like how I was when I first slinged my racer round a corner in Wipeout on the Saturn, or ran around in Tomb Raider for the first time.)

    Finally downloaded the demo today and set time aside once the sun had set to fire it up. WOW, so many great moments in that demo, especially when you first see the sprawling city of Rapture, it's brilliantly 'introduced' (great voice acting work, especially compared with most games 'I'll just record my dad through the telephone, that'll do' approach!).

    The graphics and definitely the sound are so immersive. The graphics still aren't perfect, you can still see blockiness in the shadows etc up close, but it's still the best graphics I've ever seen, and the art direction just sheer class, far more distinctive than just about anything I've seen in TV or films, or other games for that matter. This game is art, no doubt about it.

    Damn, think I'll go play the demo again. Oh and I totally agree with another commentator in that at places I really did not want to go on, The entrance to Rapture, totally black beyond the slightly ajar door, made me actually want to retreat. Now THAT is what gaming is really all about. I'll need to hassle about with my surround sound to get it out again for when I get this game!

    I know this will maybe cause silly arguments, but seriously, Halo 3... I don't think it stands a chance, reviews wise, nothing I've seen from it, nothing at all seems like any great leap over what I was already getting tired and bored of from Halo 2, and I rather despise the online play in it too so that's not grabbing me towards it either. Just a personal choice of course but Bioshock will definitely mean my wallet won't be opening anytime soon to get Halo 3.

  • Yossarian #102 5 years ago

    please don't bring Halo comparisons in here, they aren't exactly relevant -- or even feasible, beyond the fact that both involve shooting in the first person -- and they tend to derail the thread.

    edit: or what disc said. and for me, honestly, if I had to choose between never playing Halo 3's singleplayer and never playing it's multiplayer, I would opt for the former.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 02:08

  • Reihn #103 5 years ago

    Krudster:

    Thank you for a fantastic review - you've eloquently captured what makes the game great, without (and the importance of this cannot be overstated) spoiling one bit for it for us. That's the sort of recommendation you'd give to a friend: "it's great, trust me - just go get it". This is why I read Eurogamer.

    Also, I preordered the Bioshock 'special edition', because for this game I'm actually really keen to see some 'behind the scenes' footage of the team's creative process. I'll wait until I've finished the game before watching it, though!

    Long live the compelling single player experience!

    Edits: Morning does not suit me.
    Edited by 3 at 16/08/07 @ 03:38

  • Vandrius #104 5 years ago

    I don't understand this shift to console gaming, and it actually makes me die a little more inside every time.

    A game like this should be treated to an up-close and personal experience with a high-powered gaming rig, top-notch laser mouse and maxed out graphics, with mods galore.

    *sighs* Excuse me as I go and hitch the horse to my cart.

    Oh darn, the horse has bolted.

  • TwistidChimp #105 5 years ago

    I actually dont think I'll be watching any of the behind the scenes footage of Bioshock. Dont get me wrong I'm fascinated by the processes that must have gone in to producing something of this quality, but I find if I watch the makings of things, it tends to diminish the magic of the film / game itself. Sort of seeing the wizard behind the curtain as it were :)

    Oh... and off topic but that jumping 80's hair metal f**ktard on the Guitar Hero advert to the right is really getting on my tits.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 02:15

  • Calgon #106 5 years ago

    I think it would do MS good to get behind this game(like they did with Gears)... its the best so far by the sounds of it on the 360, its a console exclusive too, so if they have any sense they will be aware that this could sell alot of consoles for them this year.
    Edited by 3 at 16/08/07 @ 02:20

  • Peew971 #107 5 years ago

    @ Calgon: Gears of War was published by Microsoft so don't expect the same kind of support for Bioshock. Also, it's an unconventional FPS, difficult to advertise properly IMO. I think its success might come from word of mouth.

  • Retroid #108 5 years ago

    OH YES

    /Raz victory dance

  • Calgon #109 5 years ago

    Peew971: Ah I forgot MS published it, well I disagree with you on the difficult to advertise part, its still console exclusive(even if its not published by them its a big game... theyve shown GTA alot of excitement, this game deserves that sort of attention) and since its shaping up to be the most critically acclaimed game released on the system so far... its well worth MS putting some attention on it for the extra sales it could easily acheive(with games like this they are that good it doesnt matter on the type if asked you just say "what type? the great type, just play it";). Word of mouth is inevitable but MS could and should speed things up to let people see what they are missing.
    Edited by 3 at 16/08/07 @ 02:50

  • ChrisOTR #110 5 years ago

    I knew all along I'd love it, and I'm sure I will, BUT there's not much that sounds that different from System Shock 2 in terms of gameplay ideas... Hopefully it's that as Krudster said in one of the comments he's holding back a lot so as not to spoiler it.

    But hell I'd buy it for the underwater art-deco-ness alone! :D

  • NegativeZero #111 5 years ago

    This is the first game in years to have made me stop and say 'wow'. I think the last game I played that had this sort of reaction for me was Deus Ex. If the demo is anything to go by, this is going to be one of those games that becomes a measuring stick for subsequent generations.

  • logos01 #112 5 years ago

    Great review, and indeed an excellent game, I do hope some devs get a clue from this masterpiece so we can see some new aspects to fps games.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 03:45

  • Sucram #113 5 years ago

    Judging by reviews so far the second printing of the Bioshock box could have the most ridiculous amount of review blurb ever.

    "to tick every single box from graphics to audio to gameplay depth to atmosphere and innovation is pretty much unprecedented" - frothing reviewer

    "What is a drop of rain, compared to the storm? What is a thought, compared to a mind? Our unity is full of wonder, which your tiny individualism cannot even conceive." -The Many

  • figaro7 #114 5 years ago

    Smashing review, glad i preordered this baby! Bring it on!

  • Bumbuliuz #115 5 years ago

    Fantastic review, I cant wait for my Special Edition on 360 to arrive in the post. This is the game I have been wanting to play since System Shock 2. I still have ss2 installed on my Pc, it´s my favorite game of all time.

  • DrunKao #116 5 years ago

    10/10!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


    You didn't let me down Eurogamer. Now if only I could buy this now!!!!!!

  • Haloboy #117 5 years ago

    Wow. And I thought the PC Gamer review made me want this game more than anything else in the world, now EG made me somehow want it even more. And that should never have even been remotely possible.

    Kudos on the review. Let the "it's mind blowing" celebrations begin!

  • smoothn00dle #118 5 years ago

    10/10, is it hype? Is it real? time will tell

  • MetalDog #119 5 years ago

    =D
    Oh God, how am I going to concentrate on my job interview today?
    "Hi! By the way, how good is Bioshock looking? How fucking good? Yeah, yeah, job, shmob, Bioshock, baby, yeah!"

  • DDevil #120 5 years ago

    On Saturday I was undecided on whether or not to get Bioshock. This review and the demo changed everything.

    I'll be damned if I'm forking out for the collectors edition though haha.

  • evild_edd #121 5 years ago

    GET IN THERE!!!!
    That little f*cking c*nt Ronaldo sees red; the mighty Gooners get a 2-0 away lead for CHampions League qualification; and now Bioshock gets a 10/10!!!!
    As far as I'm concerned, that's 3 excellent results from last night :D

    I haven't read all comments yet, but surely, SURELY there's no way the Sony fans can put a negative on this.... I mean, a game that gets universal praise, pushes boundaries, and has a fresh/original setting and vibe. The cries of "is it coming to PS3" say it all (not before Christmas if at all, is the word). Just put your hands in your pockets and buy a 360.... you never know, you might learn to enjoy it!?!?!?

  • wired009 #122 5 years ago

    I played the demo tonight after seeing the fantastic scores being posted for this game. I have to say that it's one of the best looking FPS titles I've seen in years. The level of detail in the environments has to be seen to be appreciated. Everywhere you turn, there's something odd and wonderful to look at. It was great to be able to carve my initials into the wall with the wrench, shoot a happy face into it with the revolver, then zap the floor lamps with my jedi like powers. A non gamer friend watched me play for some minutes then commented that it seemed like the game was all about killing people. I couldn't deny that, at the core, Bioshock has the standard kill em all FPS game mechanics but with a lot of style.

  • allen #123 5 years ago

    [The cries of "is it coming to PS3" say it all (not before Christmas if at all, is the word). Just put your hands in your pockets and buy a 360.... you never know, you might learn to enjoy it!?!?!?]

    Or.. just get it for pc? =x

    Not about to purchase a 3rd console for bioshock and mass effect when i could get one for pc and the other by borrowing a brothers console sometime.

    As for bioshock, totally been interested in this since the first trailers of its art design and water features. To see that its also got amazing gameplay and immersion is quite handy indeed.

  • Charroux #124 5 years ago

    Out of interest, are we going to get a PC review as well? Sounds like there are minor graphical differences (option to turn item glow off), as well as the rather major gamepad vs keyboard/mouse control difference.

    I usually find PC first person games more immersive - (potentially) higher resolution, sitting closer to the screen, I'm more used to kb/m control. I'd be interested to know how the two versions differ.

  • Scimarad #125 5 years ago

    I have to say I enjoyed the start of the demo more than the rest of it. Definitely pre-ordered but I'm not sure I'm going to enjoy the actual game as much as the atmosphere and setting of the game. Probably not as much as Krudster at any rate;-)

  • krudster #126 5 years ago

    I'm sure once we get it we can look at doing a more technically focused PC review, yes.

  • ProtoformX #127 5 years ago

    Dammit! Going on holiday then. I was gonna try and avoid this for a couple of months but so many reviews have convinced me I can't. Might have to pack my 360 on holiday and pray my Lake District camp site has power points and a spare HDTV going. :-P

  • HankScorpio #128 5 years ago

    Well that just about settles it then ... I'm like a giddy schoolboy over this game, sitting here in my underpants all excited reading this review, booking next Friday off work and getting ready for a "gaming till sunrise" session that I haven't had since Halo ...

    Can. Not. Wait.

  • morriss #129 5 years ago

    /wonders if disc is going to hang around all day being the resident Bioshock expert

  • TimiW #130 5 years ago

    Sold.

    Hang on, I already had it on preview...

    Thoroughly sold!

  • mkreku #131 5 years ago

    Holy crap. I'm late to the party, but damn.. GREAT review and the game doesn't seem half-bad either :)

    It's games like these that's killing the PS3, not the PS3 (or Sony) itself. Just so you know. I'm going to have to pre-order this now.

  • Pirotic #132 5 years ago

    I'd so buy the development team a drink if I ever bumped into them :)

    Another 10/10! talk about a sleeper hit :p

  • Mercatoria #133 5 years ago

    10!!
    Lordy cant wait to play this nooooooooow

  • neil_likes_bums #134 5 years ago

    YAY. Well I ignored the hype for this one, but the demo was stunning. Perfect timing as my 360 is back from the doctors with the new heatsink, so here's hoping :D

  • Darren #135 5 years ago

    Great review, EG. I expected a 9 at most. A 10 pretty much means it's essential for any gamer who owns a 360 or PC and all the other reviews have been equally complimentary about the game. The demo was astonishingly great, not that I ever expected it to be disappointing when a talented dev like Irrational are behind it.

    I can't believe I've survived the last six months eagerly awaiting this game only for the last week to be almost agonising!!! Hurry up 23rd (got BioShock C.E. ordered from Gameplay.com ya see so hopefully I'll get it this time next week)... :D

  • Les #136 5 years ago

    Will definitely try this one out.

  • Pachinko #137 5 years ago

    Oh my God... It's an exclusive review and it's a 10! What a surprise!

  • Daymare #138 5 years ago

    /goosebumps

  • SwedBear #139 5 years ago

    Hmmm, now how can I convince my wife that we should rebook our flight back from Spain on Thursday next week instead of on Saturday night .... I want a whole weekend with this game! Or maybe I just call in sick the week after. Luckily no-one at work has yet figured out that you can check xbox.com to see what a certian gamertag are playing right now :).

    Excellent review. Thanks for making it so spoilerfree.

    I loved the demo. I also didn't think the highlighting was intrusive at all. It's more of a faint shimmer which isn't immediatly obvious.

  • newt #140 5 years ago

    @Pachinko

    Oh my God.. Bioshock is getting 10's all over the net. Jewish-masonic conspiracy!

  • Verwandlung #141 5 years ago

    Hooray, finally a game I want to play!

  • Xnoybis Verified Senior Software Engineer, Holition #142 5 years ago

    Dammit, i almost wish i wasn't going to Leipzig now. All i'm going to be thinking about is getting home to play this. My collectors edition better still be in game when i get back.

  • Dizzy #143 5 years ago

    As expected....

  • drumbaby #144 5 years ago

    10...LOL...just like HL2. And that was crap.

    ;)

  • FuZion #145 5 years ago

    Sounds pap

  • mcmonkeyplc #146 5 years ago

    Fuck me!

    Hype overload detected. Halo 3 is in no way going to get 10.

    Way to go arseholes :p

  • HarryPalmer #147 5 years ago

    This may be the game to make me buy another 360, sold old one to get a PS3. But this looks too good to miss out on, strangely reminds me of Grim Fandango.

  • Wayne #148 5 years ago

    I haven't read the review, because I hate even minor spoilers. Can anyone tell me if there's many spoilers in the review?

  • mouse Verified Graphic designer, Eurogamer Network #149 5 years ago

    There are no spoilers if you've played the demo.

  • paulf #150 5 years ago

    just as my xbox suffers the red rings of doom - noooo !!!!

  • Bitkari #151 5 years ago

    Wewt.

  • belziah #152 5 years ago

    As an ex-360 owner and current PS3 owner I've got to say I believe this deserves to be game of the year.

    Had my eye on it for a while now and its my only reason for wanting a 360. Fuck the Halo hype, this looks like "the REAL DEAL".....

  • EmiliasHorse #153 5 years ago

    Great review thanks.
    This is why I play games and will continue to play. I always want to be stunned into slack jawed awe when playing but rarely achieve this. The demo did that, so much I would say the 20 minute demo is better than 90% of games released in the last 5 years on any machine. If you hate the 360 buy a big rig PC, but swallow your pride for a moment find a friend with a 360 and beg for a play on their demo. They will have it and will be more than happy to let you explore. People will be hailing total strangers in from the street just to show them why video games are not toys for Kids but genuine works of art.

    My only fear is Bioshock may taint the rest of the big releases this year. I only hope Bungie have not been throwing money at each other too much and actually made the ending to the trilogy we all deserve.

  • Clive_Dunn #154 5 years ago

    This game needs more Doug McClure.

  • That_Happy_Cat #155 5 years ago

    Today is my last day at 2K having spent a year really caring about Bioshock. In fact, Irrational were the reason I moved to the company in the first place. I didn't have anything to do with the making of the game but I've played my part in the project and I'm just happy that my name is in the credits.

    I feel like an action hero who's just saved a village from evil poachers and whilst they are all celebrating I nod, give a slight smile, swing a bag over my shoulder and head off to my next adventure.

  • souljacker2000 #156 5 years ago

    Well done... great review cant w8 to get this

  • NAC #157 5 years ago

    10 / 10 Did not think it would reach those dizzying heights!!
    Good to see a quality game in the used to be August games drought too!!

  • famous_roy #158 5 years ago

    Fuck yes, just confirms what I already thought. This game is this generations Ocarina/Half life/Metal Gear. Can't blummin wait.

  • GingerNathan #159 5 years ago

    Great review, can't wait to pick up my LE edition with Big Daddy figure next week.

  • crazyhorse174 #160 5 years ago

    Playboy: 4/4 bunnies

    WTF?

  • menage #161 5 years ago

    Goddamn awesome. The demo rocked, can't wait

  • coach_mcguirk #162 5 years ago

    I wonder how many 360s this review alone will sell. Feeling it hard to resist myself.

    I just pity all the poor sods with bricked consoles come next weekend.

  • Razz #163 5 years ago

    WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK?

  • afghan_jones #164 5 years ago

    Well, Im on holiday for 3 weeks then its Halo kitty time so this might have to wait.

    Which is a bit of a pain cause it looks fookin awesome. I curse the games industry for piling up all the good games at the end of the year.


  • Katsumoto #165 5 years ago

    Great news! I sold my xbox a few months ago after agonising 6 weeks-a-pop-to-get-it-back regular breakdowns, but my pc (Geforce 7800, 1gb, San DIago single core :() will just about run it. It's not dual core, but it was top of the range just before dual core became available. I just hope It will be as IMMERSIVE on medium settings! My dissertation is due in on 3rd September.. must try and wait till then.

    On a side note, i'm impressed by how positive this comments thread has been :)! It's so rare that a game can inspire coming up to 200 comments with only 3 or 4 mentions of the other console.

  • mkreku #166 5 years ago

    Thanks for your hard work then, That_Happy_Cat, and good luck on your next adventure :)

  • Hypercube #167 5 years ago

    Gah, I'm finally going to have to upgrade my creaking, ageing PC! Can anyone recommend a good purveyor of parts?

  • silentbob #168 5 years ago

    Which version was actually reviewed here? PC or 360?

  • psychokitten #169 5 years ago

    Eurogamer, all you're doing is making the wait even harder, I can't take it anymore :(

  • Killerbee #170 5 years ago

    Great review. The frustrating thing (for me) is my PC only just about meets the minimum spec... it may be time for an upgrade...

  • redneon Verified Programmer, SUMO Digital #171 5 years ago

    Can you fucking believe that I've had this pre-ordered with the 24th booked off for ages and then last night my second 360 goes red ring! GAHHHHH!!H!HH!H!H!!!!111ONE!!

    I'm going to grab myself a core from Ebay while I wait for my premium to get repaired and then sell it. Hopefully I wont lose too much money. Unless anyone else has a better idea?

    The game dev company I work for has said that I can borrow a retail kit but they can ask for it back at any time so I really should look at alternatives.

  • X201 #172 5 years ago

    Bit the bullet yesterday.

    New GFX card waiting for me at home and have just ordered Bioshock from Amazon.
    Might go mad and get the collectors edition as well.

    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 09:45

  • GingerNathan #173 5 years ago

    "Great review. The frustrating thing (for me) is my PC only just about meets the minimum spec... it may be time for an upgrade... "

    Same here, my PC just about scrapes into the minimum specs with its 2.4ghz P4 and Ge-Force 6600, so I'm getting the 360 version.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 09:46

  • chiz #174 5 years ago

    Unlocking the fps makes it run at 60fps most of the time. It's looovely

  • mkreku #175 5 years ago

    This isn't one of those DirectX 10 games, right..? That would suck for my XP system.

  • krudster #176 5 years ago

    360 version reviewed. PC-specific tech comparison review coming next week. 2K doesn't even have copies of that version yet - they only got 360 promos in yesteday.

  • Tomo #177 5 years ago

    Awesome. Very pleased I now actually have an Xbox.

  • Twincoil #178 5 years ago

    A FUCKING 1? THEY GIVE IT A FUCKING 1!?

    Right, that's it - me and my dyslexic buddies are gonna kick their heeds in!!

  • krudster #179 5 years ago

    Regarding the photography - it's like so much of this game...it's entirely optional. You could say it's tagged on in as much as you don't really suffer for not snapping away at enemies, but if you do, you gain better insight into their weaknesses, and get rewarded by minor upgrades.

  • Charroux #180 5 years ago

    @Twincoil

    "A FUCKING 1? THEY GIVE IT A FUCKING 1!?

    Right, that's it - me and my dyslexic buddies are gonna kick their heeds in!! "

    It's worse than that mate, they gave it a fucking "lo" - that's not even a fucking lol :|

    EG is cruisin' for a bruisin'!!

  • mkreku #181 5 years ago

    I just realized something when I was sitting here with my finger on the "Confirm Purchase" button on my favourite online retailer: what if the PC controls are all borked, as in "this is a console game first and foremost and the keyboard/mouse controls were added as an afterthought"?

    I hate when menus in games I buy are done with the console crowd in mind. "Press ENTER to start the game" and such.. Has anyone seen/played the PC version at all? What if it's not at all as good as the 360-version? HELP HELP

  • krudster #182 5 years ago

    Well, PC Gamer gave it their best mark in several years, so I'd assume that means you're safe.

  • Katsumoto #183 5 years ago

    mkreku - ive read a few articles on CVG and perhaps on Eurogamer, I can't remember, saying they gave the PC port a complete overhaul with a new interface, menu system etc so not to worry!

  • mkreku #184 5 years ago

    Bah, it's only €60, right? I'll go for it.

    (But I will hunt down krudster and Katsumoto if I see a single "Press ENTER to play" line :p)

  • Katsumoto #185 5 years ago

    eek! I think the British standard prices, if that helps, which I guess it doesn't, are
    PC - 25 quid
    360 - 40 quid
    PC Collectors - 40 Quid
    360 Collectors - 50 quid

    So we have to pay 15 quid for collectors and 360 only pay 10! I'm outraged!!!! Boycott this filth!!!

  • speedjack #186 5 years ago

    The first game to truly deliver on the promise of next-gen.

    A well deserved 10.

  • mkreku #187 5 years ago

    Rip-off Britain?

    In that case it's Rip-off (and hand us your first-born) Sweden.

  • EmiliasHorse #188 5 years ago

    Any chance of EA jumping on the bandwagon and re-releasing System Shock 2. I keep insisting to everyone that SS2 in the dark with headphones up loud is the best cure for constipation.

    I love the music in Bioshock demo, reflects my favourite film Shawshank Redemption (Even has the same music in the bar).

  • zuljin #189 5 years ago

    Pre-ordered! 10/10 game for 25 quid? Hasn't happened in a while! I loved the 50's art style in the demo!

    Now, to free up some space (8 gig install!)...

  • rashes #190 5 years ago

    wow.. over 200 comments before 10am. And its not for the usual reasons! How refreshing.
    Aresenal win in Europe.. Utd. get anther draw and the work deadline I thought was tomorrow is actually next week.
    And now this... what a good day!

    Play.com have a cool free faceplate if you pre-order this with them. I have!

  • rashes #191 5 years ago

    @Emilia'sHorse

    The music and feel reminds me a bit of the ballroom scene in 'The Shining'.
    And thats a creepy film.

  • theman70 #192 5 years ago

    this is already available for d/l online at the 'usual places' - it's gonna be a great, great weekend :)
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 10:19

  • mouse Verified Graphic designer, Eurogamer Network #193 5 years ago

    Christ I hope this sells. I don't just mean to us lot; that's a given, I mean to the Great British Public more than anything. I hope they play it and they get it.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 10:19

  • EmiliasHorse #194 5 years ago

    Agreed this deserves to shift 5 million plus copies. Do the right thing people spread the word.

  • krudster #195 5 years ago

    Do the right thing and *buy* it. Resist the urge to download.

  • rashes #196 5 years ago

    @mouse

    It'll sell a few million but it won't do Gears numbers. I know several of my 360 owning friends that this doesn't even register on their radar but they are well aware of COD4 and the like.

  • GamerG #197 5 years ago

    UK gamers

    Collectors eddition £34.99 delivered

    [link url=http://www.choicesuk/bioshoick
    ]http://www.choicesuk/bioshoick
    [/link]

    Going by the demo this will be the greatest game I will ever play, I am actually considering kicking out my lodger so he does not interfer with me playing this game

  • silver-jon #198 5 years ago

    My wife's away for that weekend. Oh deep unbridled joy !!!!
    hang on - is that wrong ?

    Thanks Kristan for not giving anything away about the game but somehow managing to convey this as an almost certain game of the year/nomination for game of the decade. Also, I agree with your multiplayer point. I've been looking forward to seeing some developers focus on the single-player experience, allowing others to specialise in online multiplayer.

  • spongebob #199 5 years ago

    Hey, could anyone answer if it's as combat heavy as the videos at the end of the demo suggest? Because I loved the demo's moody atmosphere and sense of wandering around so much that I'd hate to see it ruined by constant FPS fighting later in the game.

  • mkreku #200 5 years ago

    Actually, I am a bit pissed that it doesn't have multi-player. Why? Because System Shock 2 had co-op multiplayer! Whenever System Shock 2 made you crap your pants too much, you could always call in a friend to huddle in a corner with. But not so in Bioshock! I still think they should have made a co-op feature in this game too. It worked so well in System Shock 2..

  • spliffhead #201 5 years ago

    EA take note of the sales of this baby!

  • krudster #202 5 years ago

    It's not constant combat, no - some splicers do repopulate previously cleared areas, but in a way that feels credible.

    Hey, I've just thought of a niggle - that of being able to use a health pack even when your health is 100%. That was silly, Irrational.

    /bops on nose.

  • EmiliasHorse #203 5 years ago

    @mkreku
    Shock 2 didn't ship with a multi player mode. Maybe a co-op patch will be...oh hang on I don't want to share this with anyone, sod off it's mine!

  • kangarootoo #204 5 years ago

    I really f*cking wish I'd worked on this. Its the kind of title that just gives you a warm feeling.

    As a gamer because I love playing quality games, and as a dev because you just think "they just MUST have their shit in order to make a game this good, I bet it was a blast".

    Canada is a long way away though :(

  • Yossarian #205 5 years ago

    Hey, I've just thought of a niggle - that of being able to use a health pack even when your health is 100%. That was silly, Irrational.

    I guess that means it really should have been a 9, huh?
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 10:38

  • mkreku #206 5 years ago

    @Emilia'sHorse: was it patched in later, just as with Deus Ex?

    I have no clue as my version of System Shock 2 comes with co-op already installed.

  • afghan_jones #207 5 years ago

    You know what is interesting about this?

    A lot of people rag on the 360 and the PS3 for just delivering the same old thing but with prettier graphics, saying they dont add anything much to a game. (personally I disagreee but there it is.)

    Its just that in this instance, a bit part of what makes this game feel special is the incredible atmosphere and art direction. The game would have looked a lot worse on 'last-gen' tech and so would have lost much of what appeals about it.

    Could this be one of the instances where 'next-gen' graphics genuinely improve a game beyond just visually, in the way it makes you feel and immerses you?

  • Whizzo #208 5 years ago

    Hey, I've just thought of a niggle - that of being able to use a health pack even when your health is 100%. That was silly, Irrational.

    The demo stops you doing this with a health already full message in the top right.

  • nickthegun #209 5 years ago

    Im on holiday on the 24th!

    My pre-order copy is going to sit unloved on the doormat for 2 weeks.....

  • EmiliasHorse #210 5 years ago

    Maybe they fixed the terrible flaw in the game prior to release.

  • Yossarian #211 5 years ago

    Emilia'sHorse: was it patched in later, just as with Deus Ex?

    it was.

  • krudster #212 5 years ago

    Could be. My promo just showed up so I'll be able to check. Happy days!

  • DerFlange #213 5 years ago

    New pants please.....

  • wanksta10 #214 5 years ago

    from the demo i played, best game on 360 thus far and totally deserving of that 10/10 i reckon, im so happy for the game, everyone GO BUY IT 24TH AUGUST!!!!

    :)

  • rashes #215 5 years ago

    @afghan_jones

    You've summed up the exact reservations I have about the Wii. But thats a different thing... still meands you can never have anything as exciting as this on Wii.

    Metroid vs. this?

  • rhinoxious #216 5 years ago

    I can't wait eight days . . . every minute is agonizing . . .

    Butters you're going to have to freeze me in ice, and thaw me out when Bioshock is released.

  • Martin #217 5 years ago

    @theman70: Skip a round or two to the pub/bar/club and do the right thing and buy this game. It - and the gaming community - deserves it (not to mention the developers).

  • ukslim #218 5 years ago

    What your first paragraph is trying to say is:
    "Anticipation has a tendency to set you up
    For disappointment in gaming entertainment but
    Tonight there'll be some love
    Tonight there'll a ruckus, yeah, regardless of what's come before."

  • lennon #219 5 years ago

    "You want to tell people about this game who you know won't even care, just because it makes you so giddy inside."

    :) This made me smile. My other half is so fed up with hearing about the demo already and she really really doesnt care.

  • tiddles #220 5 years ago

    ell, I'd like to do a road to Bioshock sort of thing, tracing it back to Ultima Underworlds - I've always wanted to do a history of the Looking Glass Diaspora.

    Like a sort of games version of "Rock Family Trees"? It's funny how this subgenre has persisted and developed over the years, generally to critical acclaim and massive financial failure... looks like Bioshock will buck this trend, thankfully.

    Games that should probably be on the list:

    Ultima Underworld 1&2
    System Shock 1&2
    Deus Ex
    Deus Ex: Invisible War
    Vampire The Masquerade: Bloodlines (don't know if there's an Origin connection, but there's a lot of design similarities...)

  • souljah #221 5 years ago

    So, it's an ok game then?

    Time to dust off the 360. Was on the verge of selling it as nothing out or on the way really grabbed me but looks like thats going to change.

  • rashes #222 5 years ago

    @souljah

    Are you ok? This and Mass Effect... Halo 3 ... not to mention all the other stuff coming.

  • BremXJones #223 5 years ago

    mkreku: It was patched in after release by Irrational/Looking Glass. Dunno what version you've got, but I suspect if you got the (er) abandomware version, it may already be patched.

    (I presume this as since Shock 2 didn't have a budget release as far as I'm aware, the boxed copy is all you get).

    I know that Irrational regret doing Co-op in Shock 2. They were very aware that it was incredibly hard to get working and the vast, vast majority of people didn't play it significantly. They felt that if they put all the effort they'd lobbed into the co-op into single player, it'll have been a much better game.

    tiddles: As far as I'm aware, there's no actually connection in terms of staff between the guys at Troika who did Vampire at the LG area.

    KG

  • zuljin #224 5 years ago

    @nickthegun
    "My pre-order copy is going to sit unloved on the doormat for 2 weeks....."

    Naaah. Sods law. It'll either:

    1. Arrive the day before, so you get a taster, then you have to give it up!

    2. Or it'll be lost in the mail, and you'll be so dissapointed when you finally get back from your holiday that you need another holiday!

    :)

  • Daymare #225 5 years ago

    "@afghan_jones

    You've summed up the exact reservations I have about the Wii. But thats a different thing... still meands you can never have anything as exciting as this on Wii.

    Metroid vs. this?"

    Not even in Bioshock review thread we can't go by without someone obsessing over Wii. How's that possible? Oh, afghan_jones, of course:)

  • Martin #226 5 years ago

    @GamerG: Not a lot that was right with that URL...

  • PlugMonkey #227 5 years ago

    UK gamers

    Collectors eddition £34.99 delivered

    http://www.choicesuk/bioshoick

    That looks like the limited edition tin rather than the full collectors edition with soundtrack and Big Daddy figurine.

  • nickthegun #228 5 years ago

    @Zuljin - Actually, you are probably right. Judging by how shit the post in my area is, its a good job im away for two weeks or they could find our local sorting office burned to the ground.

  • rashes #229 5 years ago

    @Daymare

    We're just threatened by all those bloody sales :-)

  • Sebo #230 5 years ago

    I'll hold my hands up. Even after reading the review and all these comments, I have no idea why this game is sposed to be so good.

    I will be buying it next weekend. Hopefully I'm in for a total revelation, cus I just can't get excited bout this one at all. I'm going to be buying it purely for its hype.

  • Yossarian #231 5 years ago

    Gillen didn't your copy arrive this morning? what are you even doing here

  • Freelancepolice #232 5 years ago

    There is a budget release of SS2 (which isn't abandonware for the record!) as I own it. It never had the coop patch though. Coop was buggy as hell when it came out as well

  • BremXJones #233 5 years ago

    I haven't a 360 to play it on. Have to walk over, borrow someone's, walk back. About an hours walk, in all.

    Freelance: My mistake. I believe I got confused since it certainly wasn't kept in print for very long.

    (And that's why I went "abandonware" rather than saying it really was. That it's available in torrents from the more reputable sites means that EA hasn't actually told them to STOP)

    KG

  • Azazel #234 5 years ago

    If this game does indeed live up to the 'spiritual successor to System Shock' label, then it would be nothing short of justice for it to sell a gazzillion copies.

    Great review EG, this is the game on the promise of which I bought a 360.

  • HarryPalmer #235 5 years ago

    Anyone out there in the dark reaches of space know if this is still selling in Toys R Us?

    Thanks in advance.

  • Yossarian #236 5 years ago

    all reports seem to suggest it is no longer selling. also if you're in Europe it was never selling here.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 11:35

  • HarryPalmer #237 5 years ago

    @ Yossarian

    Thanks

  • dustrat #238 5 years ago

    Oh-ah.

  • miiiguel #239 5 years ago

    too many comments.
    I just wanted to say:


    "ooooh! wow! yeah!... can't wait!"

  • afghan_jones #240 5 years ago

    @Daymare.


    I never mentioned the 'W' word actually.

  • xdiesp #241 5 years ago

    Question: is Bioshock's enviroment as dark and claustrophobic as Doom 3? I understand that screenshots are unjust to this game and that's what they make me remember. Bad memories!

  • mkreku #242 5 years ago

    @BremXJones: Er, no abandonware here. I have a DVD case with a "Classics" version of System Shock 2 and it came with co-op. Never thought it was buggy either. Maybe I'm living in bizarroworld and I'm talking to you all through a rift in the space-time continuum?

    Looked it up on the great I-net: [link url=http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/system-sh ock-2/release-info
    ]http://ww w.mobygames.com/game/windows/sy...[/link]

    Check out the patch notes: "Only for the original (US) SS2 release - not needed for re-packaged "budget" versions." Phew, I'm not going out of my mind after all.

  • Bulbatron #243 5 years ago

    I've been looking forwards to this for about a year now. The demo was great and I have my Limited Edition copy pre-ordered!

  • SomaticSense #244 5 years ago

    Oooh. Bit early isn't it?

    /reads review

    edit: "There is a budget release of SS2 (which isn't abandonware for the record!) as I own it."

    Well, I would love for you to inform me where to get it, as there isn't any copies of it anywhere. And I don't use Ebay. I've been looking for it for ages now.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 11:50

  • Yossarian #245 5 years ago

    Rapture's halls are dark and claustrophobic, yes, but lit with dappled ocean greens and the distant sizzling neon of their broken dreams.

    it's a pretty enough place, in a horrific, blood-spattered, dystopian sort of way.

  • Triggerhappytel #246 5 years ago

    Great review. I'm pleased this game lived up to all it's promise; this has pretty much sold me a 360 by the time I've managed to save enough money to get one early next year (putting away £60 a month) unless Sony can pull something incredible out of the PS3 bag before then.

    Getting this as an exclusive was probably the best thing MS have done for the 360 to date.

  • MrsPacMan #247 5 years ago

    Preordered

    Had to check order tracking immediately in the vain hope it was already on the van!!!

    Boo hoo!!

  • sem1604 #248 5 years ago

    have to agree about the trailers and videos around for this, didnt grab me at all, until i played the demo last night and my Projector in 5.1 surround - very atmospheric and a pre - order has now followed. good work guys and a great review.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 11:59

  • miiiguel #249 5 years ago

    Just canvelled the normal version, and pre-ordered the special one. Devs who do their job proprelly deserve my hard earned money.
    "Enjoy me euros, I'll enjoy your code"

  • zozart #250 5 years ago

    Me want. Now! :(

  • SomaticSense #251 5 years ago

    "Question: is Bioshock's enviroment as dark and claustrophobic as Doom 3? I understand that screenshots are unjust to this game and that's what they make me remember. Bad memories!"

    Claustrophobic on a totally different level to Doom 3, going by the demo. In fact, they shouldn't really be compared, as Doom 3 was clautrophobic because of cramped level design and darkness, and Bioshock is because of sheer atmosphere, both corridors and open scenery, and sound design.

    Bioshock is what Doom 3 should have been, and then a hell of a lot more.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 12:08

  • the_sas_man #252 5 years ago

    What I want to know is this:

    Is Bioshock as significant, or god forbid, more significant to the videogames industry than the original Doom?

    By the sounds of the review, this game is already in the top 3 games of ALL time?!

  • InsoFox #253 5 years ago

    "The first real testcase for my newly build rig. I'm still not entirely convinced of the high marks though, the gameplay trailers that have been shown are a bit lacklustre. "

    You'll just have to trust people who have played the demo and the full game: it's obvious from the start that the one thing BioShock certainly doesn't lack ... is lustre.

  • Sebo #254 5 years ago

    Yeah, with the 10/10 etc, are we already talking about bioshock being the best game ever. Is this as important as say Mario 64.

  • Razorus #255 5 years ago

    Very impressed by the demo although repeated plays dim the excitement a little cos the opening part is looong. However, seems very promising indeed, but for me other games like Mass Effect and Halo 3 have higher priority.

  • Drpwnage #256 5 years ago

    Great review, my anticipation has really escalated now even after reading the PCG review last week.

    I have the game on order, but will be on holiday when it's delivered :S.

  • afghan_jones #257 5 years ago

    "Very impressed by the demo although repeated plays dim the excitement a little cos the opening part is looong. "


    If you thought that was a long part, wait til you see what ive got in store for you....


    Boooiiinggggg!
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 12:27

  • Fab4 #258 5 years ago

    I havent looked at the MP in ages, so help an old man out...is the Bioshock demo available on the UK MP?

    Thanks.

  • xdiesp #259 5 years ago

    A fps in a completely closed enviroment in 2007 scores immediately a -3 malus on my book. But I won't judge the game from this thing alone. Only, don't tell me that neither of you or the reviewer knows that after Half Life or Halo and the like, we have just moved beyond that point and no matter how good a game is, decisions like this can harm it.

  • Rodney #260 5 years ago

    Yuusss

    283rd!!!!

  • kiroquai #261 5 years ago

    xdiesp: I don't agree. The whole point of BioShock is that Rapture is cut-off from the rest of the world and imploding in on itself. The whole claustrophobia thing is, in my opinion, integral to the atmosphere the game gives. You can look outside and see a vast ocean teeming with life, but at the same time you're very aware that you're trapped inside a narrow, twisting city that is rotting away.

  • InsoFox #262 5 years ago

    @xdiesp

    Yes, why?

    If a game took place in a shoebox it could still be the best game ever/in years/of the year, as long as the stuff that happens in the shoebox is utterly awesome.

  • Yossarian #263 5 years ago

    xdiesp has some pretty arbitrary specifications for what makes a game great

  • Azazel #264 5 years ago

    "There is a budget release of SS2 (which isn't abandonware for the record!) as I own it."

    home of the underdogs, clicky link, job done.

    @Sebo:

    Only people who care about such things are talking about it, the rest of us are just looking forward to the first properly ground-breaking fps game in a while.

  • SniperWolf #265 5 years ago

    I know it's a good game, but let's not go over board with the fapping. It's not the best game ever made, and hearing everyone gushing over it becomes nauseating. Buy it, play it, have a good time. But less of the oscar worthy speeches please, I've just eaten

  • mkreku #266 5 years ago

    So why are you reading this thread then?

  • PearOfAnguish #267 5 years ago

    "Well, I would love for you to inform me where to get it, as there isn't any copies of it anywhere. And I don't use Ebay. I've been looking for it for ages now."

    Amazon Marketplace. Expect to pay more than you would for a brand new PC game.

  • kiroquai #268 5 years ago

    I don't get why it's a 'bad thing' to be enthusiastic or excited about a game. The bloody industry has enough of a hard-edged cynical business air to it as it is, so if people want to post here about looking forward to BioShock or them feeling excited by it then all the better as far as I am concerned.

  • Vivid #269 5 years ago

    Yes, yes, yes. But is it any _good_?

  • oldergamer #270 5 years ago

    Why are readers congratulating EG on the review when they've not played the whole game yet? Weird. Anyway, I just bought a 360 for this game. Congrats Irrational!

  • InsoFox #271 5 years ago

    @SniperWolf

    I've only played the demo, so I can't tell.

    But why can't it be the 'best game ever made,' if there is such thing? Personally I think that games are too diverse for there to be a single 'best', but assuming that there's an over all best, why not this one?

    If we assume that every so often a game comes out that surpasses everything gone before (which must be true, if you believe in a 'best game ever'), I don't see why Bioshock has any less of a chance of being that game than anything else.

  • rashes #272 5 years ago

    @kiroquai

    Here! here!

    (that looks weird when written)

    Or is it:
    Hear! Hear!

    Ahhh..
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 13:01

  • BadBoyBonner #273 5 years ago

    This game looks amazing, defo 10/10
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 13:06

  • BadBoyBonner #274 5 years ago

    Best price I could find

  • BadBoyBonner #275 5 years ago

    **Start of public Xbox 360 transmission**

    Asda are doing Bioshock for £34.97 (already good as it includes free delivery)

    Here's the best bit, currently they are giving 10% discount on all Entertainment orders.

    The code is ENT10 (that’s a one and a zero - ten in other words)

    Brings it down to £31.47

    AND

    They send it out as soon as they have the stock from the publisher (i.e. normally a few days early).

    **End of public Xbox 360 transmission**

    Edit - PearOfAnguish obviously forgot to mention the price was for 360 hence the edit - thanks for pointing it out though, "forgot" about the PC for a second.


    Edited by 2 at 16/08/07 @ 16:34

  • JediMasterMalik #276 5 years ago

    @WaxBrazillian - You can fuck right off, that was completely uncalled for. There are very very few wankers in this comments section incidentally, you're one of them.

  • Rash' #277 5 years ago

    This and Halo 3 are the reasons to get 360 this year. Sadly without a price cut and with that hardware I can't convince myself that it would be a smart buy. Roll on 2008!

  • rashes #278 5 years ago

    @Rash'
    I'd say there will be a price cut in September.

    @Jedi
    Ha ha.Well said.

  • Peew971 #279 5 years ago

    @Rash: I say, fuck the price cut... This might be the best game ever released.

  • Emortal #280 5 years ago

    Dunno if this been posted, theres also a patch for system shock 2 that switches the models to high detailed ones

  • dryden555 #281 5 years ago

    a 10. awesome news. I could care less about multiplayer. I appreciate the non-spoiler review.

  • Rash' #282 5 years ago

    Price drop is part of the problem, if the hardware was reliable my resolve would have been greatly tested. I want a games console not an addition to my list of worries.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 13:23

  • Katsumoto #283 5 years ago

    You can tell this game is causing a stir, people in the comments thread are getting angry about the fact the vast majority of people have a consensus and are excited about something for once!

    However, as someone else said, considering EG are the only ones out of us on this thread to have played the full game, I think we should refrain from the "good it was a 10/10 thats what it deserved this is the best game ever" speak just yet.

  • Crea #284 5 years ago

    I'm on this like a fat kid on cake.

  • killyourtv #285 5 years ago

    paid

  • markypants #286 5 years ago

    Have to add to the general excitement and buzz behind this game. When I was playing through the demo, the opening when you are making your way in the sub and the film is projected intoducing you to the 'experiment' - and then the reveal of Rapture as the screen is pulled away. I swear it was the 'Jurrassic Park' moment, when you first saw the Dinosaurs and the music built up and all the hairs stood up on your arms... This game already had me at "hello".

  • spongebob #287 5 years ago

    krudster: It's not constant combat, no - some splicers do repopulate previously cleared areas, but in a way that feels credible.

    Thanks for answering my question. You also just sold me the game :)

  • PearOfAnguish #288 5 years ago

    Bonner, shopto has it for £24.99 (PC).
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 13:43

  • stoopidgreg #289 5 years ago

    OMG FIRST

    oh wait

  • kangarootoo #290 5 years ago

    @Emortal

    There are a couple of SS2 mods, one that updates some of the enemy models (Rebirth I think its called), and another that reskins the environment with higher res textures (forget what that is called).

    Some handy links.

    [link url=http://filesoup.co.uk/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t 93227.html
    ]http://fi lesoup.co.uk/forum/lofiversion/...[/link]
    [link url=http://mods.moddb.com/3329/system-shock-rebirthhig h-poly-pack/
    ]http://mo ds.moddb.com/3329/system-shock-...[/link]


    @WaxBrazillian

    What is your purpose in life?

  • Azazel #291 5 years ago

    /hugs BadBoyBonner

    /pre-orders

  • SBfistfun #292 5 years ago

    "This and Halo 3 are the reasons to get 360 this year. Sadly without a price cut and with that hardware I can't convince myself that it would be a smart buy. Roll on 2008!"

    My sentiments exactly.

    Or I could just spend the money on my pc....hm......

  • jack_klugman #293 5 years ago

    I know it's a good game, but let's not go over board with the fapping. It's not the best game ever made.

    Are you sure?

  • xdiesp #294 5 years ago

    The one about close dungeon vs open enviroment fps is not a matter of tastes or arbitrary decisions. One can prefer the former or the latter, fine. A story can be about a tropical island or a cave, fine.

    But technologically the dungeon crawler type has always been the easiest to make and the history of fps is chock full of them. They are a thing of the past, they feel old. The genre has moved away from maze running.

    You value more the finely tuned gameplay and story value of Bioshock, fine. You value the highly researched artistic component, fine. You miss a macroscopic point like this and the game becomes an underdog played by purists while the others play whatever new Halo and Half Life comes out. And comments like "it's like Doom 4!" start popping out.

  • Sebo #295 5 years ago

    I asked that earlier on. Do people think this is the best game ever?? Vote now

  • Peew971 #296 5 years ago

    @Sebo: Only EG reviewers can answer that at the moment since most of us have only played the demo. By reading the review, I'd say it might be.

  • SomaticSense #297 5 years ago

    What total bollocks. It's the actual game's quality that counts. Just because it's set in an enclosed environment doesn't make it shit. Doom 3 didn't work, not because it was a corridor shooter, but because it was fucking crap.

    From what I played of the Bioshock demo, it was already leagues ahead of Halo 2 in the pure gameplay, immersion, and innovative sides. And which game was the one with open envirnoments again?

    edit: Fair enough, everyone has different tastes in games. But anyone who dismissed the quality, immersion level and enjoyment of a game just because it's not set in wide open environments is an idiot frankly, and shouldn't be gaming.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 14:06

  • uk_john #298 5 years ago

    Let get a little real here. PC gamer said 'a little short', and no one seems to want to tell us how many gameplay hours? PC gamer wouldn't say 'short' if it was over 20 hours, so I reckon around 15 probably. That's short, for even £31.95! Also, PC gamer said it had a bad ending. Again this was glossed over. They also talked about an 'entry-level' £80 4200 CPU and 8800 video card being required to max the game. If these are entry level, I don't want to know what 'high end' is! PC gamer negleted to tell us, of course, what the minimum requirements are, or how well it played on a average PC.

    So look to see what isn't being mentioned and think a little before you get caught up in all this sales hype. And mark my words, this is sales hype. Everyone and their Uncle is saying this Christmas is the most important in video gaming and could make or break PC gaming.

    I get a feeling of Deja Vu. System Shock 2 got all this adulation, and sales were abysmal. In it's day, it too needed an above average PC. In it's day it was seen as an 'adult/mature' story and not your 'typical' FPS.

    Don't get me wrong. This seems like a great game. But we need great games to sell, and when great games need high end PC's, are short and have poor endings, they end up not selling as many copies. If they don't sell in high numbers they don't get emulated. System Shock 2 wasn't emulated because it didn't sell well. The great reviews and awards didn't matter at all to other publishers.

    If I have hardware that can run this game sufficiently, I will buy it. If I need to spend money on m PC to play it reasonably I won't. Despite all the hype, that is what millions of average gamers are saying with regard the PC version. Because despite all the hype, if you don't have a PC that will run it, will need to spend £300 to have a PC that will, that will be your major purchasing decision. Not the story, or the graphics, or the ambience of the environment, etc!

    So good luck Bioshock. This story will b just as interesting after the game is released as it was before it was released!

  • Chewy #299 5 years ago

    @BadBoyBonner

    You star!

    Considering all the games that I want to buy (COD 4, Halo 3, Ace Combat, Assassin's Creed, Half Life - orange) that are coming out before xmas need to maximise savings!

  • Ed6445 #300 5 years ago

    I've preordered it off shopto.net, they're selling it for £32.99, with free next day delivery (and they often send games a few days before release, so you might get it on the wednesday before, for example.)
    Really looking forward to this game, it looks awesome.

  • Artemis_Matsas #301 5 years ago

    Ok... When the hardware revisioned 360s come out, i'm definately gonna get one!

    The wife's gonna kick my ass, but i'll survive!!!

  • SniperWolf #302 5 years ago

    When you hit the water in a plane crash it's like smashing into concrete, there is no way he would have survived, one the impact, and two the explosion that created that fire. And if he did survive he would have burned in the fire. If this game wanted to be realistic he should have drowned at the beginning. Thus rendering Rapture irrelevant.

    Also he would not stick himself with the first dirty needle he finds, in all likelyhood he would get Aids as that needle would have been shared by many splicers, so would get very ill with the Aids within the first five minutes of the game, making him unable to continue due to weakness ect.

    This game is very unrealistic and deserves a 8/10 for this reason.

  • Carrybagma #303 5 years ago

    Gosh - yeah, you're right. It's rubbish really. So's Half-life now I think of it - Aliens do not exist, so HL should really only have got 5/10 or something.

  • afghan_jones #304 5 years ago

    @sniperwolf

    Silly post, but I actually do agree with you about the needle thing. that really bugged me in the demo, that he would find a honking great needle with like a litre of glowing shit in it and immediately inject himself with the stuff.

  • Valver #305 5 years ago

    It's even cheaper (£29.74 with free delivery) at Softuk.com if you use the 15% off promotional voucher "broadband" during checkout. (X360 version)

    PS thats not a delivery code, skip that, its entered on the next page after, under promo voucher.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 14:20

  • rashes #306 5 years ago

    @uk_john

    1up guys reckoned it clocked in around the 20 hour mark. Which is plenty long for most people, I think. For an action game anyway.

    As regards system specs and all that... thats why most of the units will probably be sold on 360.

  • SomaticSense #307 5 years ago

    Sniper Wolf -

    It's already been explaned elsewhere that all that is explained later on in the plot. It might sound stupid at first, but apparently it'll all make sense ;)

    And as regards to the needle. The demo is a cut and modified version of the opening to the full game, and even when playing that part I got the feeling that there will be some kind of explanation about plasmids before you come across the needle (noticable with Atlas talking like you already know what it is). I'm sure it'll make more sense in the full game.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 14:19

  • Penguinzoot #308 5 years ago

    This game is very unrealistic and deserves a 8/10 for this reason.

    /rolls eyes

  • Yossarian #309 5 years ago

    I played the demo again on hard and managed to finish with five eve hypos and six health packs. with the camera and the turret on your side you barely have to do anything except shock the pool a few times. :)

  • FunkyRenegade #310 5 years ago

    @SniperWolf

    Orly? Unrealistic?
    I always thought that underwater self-sufficient cities were a thing of the 1950's...

    Get a grip, it's a video game.
    Firing blasts of electricity out of your hands isn't exactly the height of realism now is it?

  • zuljin #311 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo
    "What is your purpose in life?"

    I think you meant "what is your function?".

    And stop watching Survive Style 5+!

  • GamesConnoisseur #312 5 years ago

    Very little trolling so far!

    Man, if you want to desconstruct a lot of games out there, you would find virtually all of them unrealistic! What I liked about BioShock it that it is all contained in a consistent universe and strong artistic direction throughout (in the demo at least).

    If you pick any of the top 5 titles on any platform, you will find all of them containing unrealisitic stuff. No one should be able to reset their car after a crash, no one have more than one live (apart from Jesus if you count him), you cannot be able to carry more than few items etc

    BioShock is another universe and a pretty real one in that! Just glad that I will be able to immerse myself in that pretty soon!

  • Monkey_Puncher #313 5 years ago

    So it's pretty good then?

    *cums*

  • the_sas_man #314 5 years ago

    where are the PS3 fanboys to hijack the thread? I'm gutted...absolutely gutted

  • xdiesp #315 5 years ago

    Second Question: does the main character talk or is he a Gordon Freeman?

    From review I get that he is in contact via radio with a guy, listens to voice recordings and there are no other sane main characters: but even if he's not Duke Nukem, maybe there is dialogue and first person narrative like in Clive Barker's Undying.

  • Sebo #316 5 years ago

    @the_sas_man

    I think they are on Ebay selling their PS3s

  • wadgem #317 5 years ago

    How many hours of play does one get out of it?

  • Drpwnage #318 5 years ago

    @ xdiesp

    Your argument still doesn't wash, your personal preference is for open environment shooters leave it at that. Most of these are still linear, you just spend more time walking through open space. It's the experience the game delivers in it's chosen environment that matters not the nature of the enviroment regardless of technical contstraints or otherwise.

  • groovychainsaw #319 5 years ago

    Cheers badboybonner - thats a better dela than my previous pre-order, as long as they send it out on time, I'll be happy (fingers crosseD). After the demo's fantastic sound design i knew i had to get this, sounds like rest of the game follows suit (anyone with a full dd5.1 surround setup will know what i mean - awesome atmosphere!)

  • Mun #320 5 years ago

    oh garn, my pc cant play this (as nicely as I need it to) so shall i just get an xbox??
    I was waiting to see if ps3 might be the way to go, but it looks like this might have swung it.. this is exclusive right? if I buy an elite, will it break in a week?
    /lights fuse, steps away.. :D

  • rhinoxious #321 5 years ago

    @BadBoyBonner

    Good call, got my order in as well, anything that might knock a couple of days off the wait, plus a good price too.

    Cheers!

  • Yossarian #322 5 years ago

    Second Question: does the main character talk or is he a Gordon Freeman?

    he speaks at the very beginning of the demo. his name is Jack, at least according to the package he is carrying from his parents.

  • the_sas_man #323 5 years ago

    Sniperwolf: "When you hit the water in a plane crash it's like smashing into concrete, there is no way he would have survived, one the impact, and two the explosion that created that fire. And if he did survive he would have burned in the fire. If this game wanted to be realistic he should have drowned at the beginning. Thus rendering Rapture irrelevant."

    Oh right, I never knew that. I guess you better tell your kids (if you have the bollocks to make some) that they better not ever read Harry Potter, because in real life he would be jumped by chavs and die.

    Tosser

  • monkie_king #324 5 years ago

    @Sniper Wolf: well, i laughed. seems to be a bit of a lack of irony around here today...
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 14:42

  • InsoFox #325 5 years ago

    "When you hit the water in a plane crash it's like smashing into concrete, there is no way he would have survived, one the impact, and two the explosion that created that fire. And if he did survive he would have burned in the fire. If this game wanted to be realistic he should have drowned at the beginning. Thus rendering Rapture irrelevant."

    By the looks of it, he jumped from the plane, as the plane follows him into the water shortly afterwards. He probably wasn't particularly high up when he jumped, and wasn't in the plane when it exploded. You lose one point.

    "Also he would not stick himself with the first dirty needle he finds, in all likelyhood he would get Aids as that needle would have been shared by many splicers, so would get very ill with the Aids within the first five minutes of the game, making him unable to continue due to weakness ect. "

    1) It's 1960. 2) Even then, since when do people get ill with aids within 5 minutes? try 5 years.
    You lose 2 more points.

    3) It's true that it's strange how he just goes and does it, but if you explore the area there are plenty of clues to show it would be useful for him e.g. the advertisments, and the door sparking. But anyway, perhaps this is introduced more naturally in the demo, who can say?

    "This game is very unrealistic and deserves a 8/10 for this reason. "

    What, you point to 2 rather dubious reasons in the demo and decide you know better how to score the game than someone who has played the full thing? Oh dear, you'd losing points all over this place. Your argument is very unrealistic and deserves a 3/10 for this reason.


    EDIT: @sniper

    Okay -I admit it... you got me. But you have to admit, I wouldn't put what you said past a lot of the posters around here - it was believable! :) I'm keeping the above post because... I'm not afraid to admit I was mistaken.


    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 14:47

  • SniperWolf #326 5 years ago

    I want Bioshock more than any other game this year, the demo alone has convinced me this is one of the best games ever made.

    I guess it's hard to tell when people are joking around on the interent.

  • afghan_jones #327 5 years ago

    so... Better than Shrek the Third?

  • Ryltar #328 5 years ago

    A bit off topic here, apologies if its been said on some previous page, but is this like some kind of record for the amount of comments for any one review ever?! I've never seen this many pages of comments before! its like... woaaa.

    8 days and counting!! ..........

  • xdiesp #329 5 years ago

    @Drpwnage

    The WW2 first person shooters clone army. Unreal 2.
    Were they underappreciated because they were really bad games, or because the market just had seen enough of that setting already?

  • chiz #330 5 years ago

    Oh, don't be daft, nothing beats Shrek the Third, ffs!

  • Ace_McCloud #331 5 years ago

    I dunno about that ryalter, but I think this many and no arguments to have broken out and for us all to be talking about something entirely unrelated is pretty much unprecedented....

    I've been checking back on this thread steadily since around nine, each time clicking the last page button chuckling to myself saying "I wonder what sort of chaos this thread has descended into?"... to my disappointed you're all still banging on about the actual game!!

    (Except for a little bit of chat about whether a person could survive a plane crash or something *Raises an eyebrow* To you guys, I salute you for your efforts, excellently random chat)

    Now to get this thread back on track: Imagine if this came out on PS3? Oh wait it can't cos it'd take like 5 gazillion years to make it work for it! PS3? PSGAY more like!!! ... PS3 is so gay...

    And just for good measure. Wii could never make a game like this, and is also shit.

    BAM! Take that thread!!
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 14:57

  • monkie_king #332 5 years ago

    @SniperWolf: no, it's really not. anyway, thanks to you and your slow-witted respondents for delivering my lunchtime lulz.

  • xdiesp #333 5 years ago

    @Sniperwolf

    In the fifties people were made of sterner stuff, they could take that. Also you only get aids from people (or their stuff) who already got it ... and since Rapture is inspired by Atlas Shrugged, the main virus around would be capitalism.

  • JediMasterMalik #334 5 years ago

    @Ace_McCloud - Your PS3 effort get's a 7, but your Wii one was weak, that get's a 3. :)

  • kangarootoo #335 5 years ago

    @SniperWolf

    "When you hit the water in a plane crash..." etc.

    Was that a joke post to see how many of us you could reel in?

    You are actually marking down a video game for not being realistic? Since when when did realism means anything at all outside of a simulation? Some of the greatest works of fiction in history might be described as a bit unrealistic you know.

    I really do hope that was a joke post. If not, I think you should the gass leak emergency number asap.

    Edit: /reads on through the thread a bit..... well thank f*ck for that.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 15:02

  • sniglet #336 5 years ago

    Great thread for a great game. I hope the game makes me cry, laugh and poop (in that order) as much as this thread has.

  • InsoFox #337 5 years ago

    @xdiesp

    'WW2' is a much more limiting concept than that of simply a 'closed environment' I mean, a closed environment can pretty much be anything as long as it takes place in an environment which is, in some way closed. It's hardly a limit at all.

    A WW2 game is a war game set in a very specific time period with a specific backstory, historical so limiting as to what sort of things can be in the game, and so it's much easier for that concept to get 'old'. Granted, someone could think of a really innovative way of doing WW2 that nobody has thought of yet, and then YES, certainly it could still be game of the year. Why not? But the point is there are far fewer ways to be original within the considerable constraints of WW2 than within the negligible constraints of it being 'not outside'.

    Think of it this way: we're always either indoors or outdoors. And there's about as much cool stuff you can do indoors as there is outdoors. The line is drawn pretty evenly between the two. To compare to your analogy, we're always either in WW2 or not in WW2. That line is being drawn completely unevenly. Of COURSE there's going to be more ways of doing cool stuff outside of the constraint of WW2, it's not a good comparison.

  • Ryltar #338 5 years ago

    @Ace_McCloud

    lol , good stuff!

    I have decided to nick one them huge Big Daddy statues from GAME. I need a plan! I'm thinking about crashing a van into the store on Oxford Street! Perhaps a crane of some sort will also be needed? hm... I must have one dagnabit.

    Its so annoying to think that some uber lucky GAME employee will probably end up taking it home :(

    Alas... I reckon the 6inch figurine with the special edition will be sufficient.
    Have you guys ever experienced pre orders arriving earlier from online retailers with other games? (*crosses fingers that gameplay will do just that*)

  • Ace_McCloud #339 5 years ago

    I know my Jedi Master, I just don't have it in me to flame... I am weak and have no place on the dark side... and as for my wii effort: well despite my "I am unbiased and impartial when it comes to consoles" persona I try to present, on the inside I think I may be growing a little tumour of hate for the PS3 that's gonna explode out of my head like one of those parasites in RE4... and I own a wii and quite likes it :p ....*mutters* stupid PS3 and killzone demo from years back setting expectations too high for the next gen, almost ruining it for everyone.....garble garble..........

    (Mentioning Killzone! That's GOT to do it!!!)

  • The_Inquisitor #340 5 years ago

    Damn I wish I had a HD TV. I guess my 17" old piece of crap will have to do. No doubt it will still look lush.

  • Azazel #341 5 years ago

    /laughs at SniperWolf defeating the internets with irony

  • chiz #342 5 years ago

    "Damn I wish I had a HD TV. I guess my 17" old piece of crap will have to do. No doubt it will still look lush."

    Get the VGA adapter and use it on a PC monitor, mate - looks the biz.

  • oldergamer #343 5 years ago

    I've read reviews on other sites and I have to say they are all very well written, more so than usual. Game Informer's is almost poetic. (EG's is always good, of course.) So I'm thinking, this game must be good cause it's bringing out the muse in reviewers.

  • InsoFox #344 5 years ago

    Yes, yes. Sniperwolf did good ironies, lol, etc.

    But the reason not everyone got it was nothing to do with inability to detect irony and everything to do with the fact that it was a completely believable post. I've seen far more ridiculous posts written with no irony at all, and I'm sure you all have.

    Also, the reason I personally believed it was because the bit about the immediately injecting was almost a good point, at least as far as the demo was concerned.

  • Duke_Red #345 5 years ago

    Yeah Baby!

  • JediMasterMalik #346 5 years ago

    @Ace_McCloud - Not after E3 '07. ;)

  • Arkanite #347 5 years ago

    Ah ha!

    Australian's can make good games, apparently bloody good games!

  • lennon #348 5 years ago

    Ahhhh I cant wait. Im going to have to look out System Shock 2 tonight to help me get through to next Thursday :(

  • krokomkiller #349 5 years ago

    10/10 by my favourite reviewer.
    I have a feeling I wont regret my preorder yesterday.

  • manic_mouse #350 5 years ago

    I was totally prepared for this game to merely "above average" after all the hype, pleasantly surprised that it's that good!

  • the_sas_man #351 5 years ago

    anyway - did Aids even exist in the 50's?

    (I know it existsed but did WE know about it?)

  • Sebo #352 5 years ago

    No, aids came about in the 60s

  • groovychainsaw #353 5 years ago

    theoretically, if something hit the water first (just before your body), it would break the surface tension of the water, albeit temporarily, and allow you to slip under. ALthough, at that sort of speed, probably about 100m underwater, but maybe you were a championship pearl diver in a former occupation... ;-)

  • gaijin #354 5 years ago

    @ sebo

    yeah, when some big dude in a diving suit had sex with a monkey.

    or something.

    edited due to inability to keep up with pace of comments on hitherto ridiculously on-topic thread
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 15:46

  • neonxaos #355 5 years ago

    This must be some kind of record with all these posts...

    Anyway, been following Bioshock since the very beginning. I liked System Shock, but this just seemed even more promising.

    Cut to two days ago. Demo flattens me, makes me sit and drool, quite literally.

    neonxaos needs game, badly.

  • Guff-Pipe #356 5 years ago

    Not going to sell my PS3 but looks like ill be getiing a 360 too now.
    Overtime city here I come!!

  • InsoFox #357 5 years ago

    @Dr. D00m if that's your real name.

    Well... I'm not saying ANYTHING, this time, for fear of missed irony.

    I mean, well... obviously, you are joking, right?

    ...Right?

  • FunkyRenegade #358 5 years ago

    "I guess it's hard to tell when people are joking around on the interent."
    Awwhh I've been had :(

  • Azazel #359 5 years ago

    This must be some kind of record with all these posts...

    I think the only record being set here is for the ratio of posts that are not flames and actually relevant to the article.

  • Duke_Red #360 5 years ago

    WaxBrazillian is an idiot and stupid

  • spliffhead #361 5 years ago

    We going to top 400 with this one then?

  • rashes #362 5 years ago

    no fighting now... this has been a good thread.

  • BM #363 5 years ago

    @dr.d00m

    You missed out (b)

  • EmiliasHorse #364 5 years ago

    WaxBrazillian is a very special boy. very...special

  • pyrat6 #365 5 years ago

    Better than Sensible soccer 2k6 then ?

    nice.

  • Monkey_Puncher #366 5 years ago

    Anyone know if you still get a normal game case inside the special edition, or will I have to keep the game in that stupid sized tin box?

  • kangarootoo #367 5 years ago

    @WaxBrazillian

    You protest too far much. I think you like kissing men, on the lips, probably with tongues. And I think one of the men you like kissing has sat on your CAPS-LOCK key whilst you were kissing them.



    @Monkey_Puncher

    Are you talking about the smaller tin box (as in, not the big tin one that comes with the model Big Daddy thing)?

    Usually the metal DVD case sized tins don't have an additional case inside, they just have the disc holding gubbins fixed inside. The big metal tins usually have a seperate game box inside.

  • Chim_chimma_nee! #368 5 years ago

    That is one metric fuckton of hype.

    Don't care still won't be playing it.

  • boyscout #369 5 years ago

    Ultima undwerworld I and II, System shock I and II were all games in a similar vain. All were brilliant and awesome and all sold about 5 copies each.

    Im hoping that the producers will sell a motherload of this game, but im not expecting it.

  • kangarootoo #370 5 years ago

    Things have changed somewhat since the days of SS2 et al. With XBLive market place, its a lot easier for a game like to get the coverage it needs to ship copies. This game also looks very good in trailer form.

    Whether the PC version will do so well I'm not sure I'm a bit out of the loop on that side of things thb, so I don't really know how info gets around for PC games).

  • Ryuken #371 5 years ago

    "Not only does this reduce frustration immensely, it means there's a kind of meaningful continuity about proceedings - the kind that has never existed in any shooter. Although this might sound like an awful cop-out in theory, in practice, it's a master-stroke, and one that'll help people carry on when otherwise they might well have given up."

    So, not as disappointing as the Prey-death approach then? Because that was awful, it isn't a challenge anymore (something that can be said of most shooters of the last few years, except for FEAR I'd say).

  • afghan_jones #372 5 years ago

    He doesnt get AIDs cause in 1950s America, Gaylords hadnt been properly invented and so AIDs was a competely unheard of disease.

    This is a well documented fact what can found in all manner of history books.

    Gaylords were originally invented in ancient Greece as a means for blokes to sleep with young boys. Unfortunately this practice became somewhat unfashionable and so gayness went out of production for many years. Gayness was then rediscovered in 1962 by a professor at San Francisco University of Science, who invented bumming after accidentally sitting down heavily on an upturned cucumber.

    The practice of 'bumming' gained in poularity and gave rise to the Gaybo scene. Eventually bumming overtook patriotism and also racism as the number one pursuit of American males. Realising that America's two principle exports (racism & patriotism) were under threat, the CIA came up with a cunning plan built around AIDS. AIDS (or Ass Invader Destruction System) were tiny nano bots designed to be secreted into the Gayhole or 'anus' via their secret inclusion in a popular brand of lubricant. These tiny robots then detonated within the Gaylords winkie upon its insertion into the Gayhole.

    Unfortunately, during the sexual revolution of the 60's many heterosexuals or 'straights' started using lubricant, as the classic 'two pumps and a squirt' missionary action that had served previous generations so well, had become unfashionable.

    As a consequence, whilst many Gaylords did suffer from AIDS, they also made their way into the mainstream population. This did cause a slight drop in popularity for the American government of the time but they soon regained ground by deflecting attention onto the everpresent 'Red Peril' of Russia and claiming that anyone who criticised the government was some sort of Commie.

    And that, boys and girls is the true story of what AIDS is and how it came to be..

  • Azazel #373 5 years ago

    lol @ Kato

  • jack_klugman #374 5 years ago

    Death in an FPS is meaningless when you can hotkey the quick save. Far better than it become meaningful gameplay, than a reason to return to the front end.

  • InsoFox #375 5 years ago

    @jack_klugman

    you make an excellent point. I for one am a compulsive saver. Games like this with a lot of tension make me nervous, and if it had a standard save feature, I would be using it at almost every turn. It was a real pleasure not to have to drop myself out of the game in this way.

    I might be a compulsive saver, but sometimes I'll get engrossed and forget. Never in this game will I have to cry out 'Oh no! I was doing so well... when did I last save?' And lovely that it's not just standard checkpointing in that it's more continuous than a simple autosave.

  • JediMasterMalik #376 5 years ago

    I agree, it's a much better way to immerse the player.

  • Ryuken #377 5 years ago

    Just being revived at the point where you died is meaningful gameplay? Is there any point to still trying to avoid "death" actually then?
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 17:01

  • jack_klugman #378 5 years ago

    By the sound of the things its entirely integrated into the story's internal logic too. Inspired stuff.

  • jack_klugman #379 5 years ago

    @Ryuken

    No. Death as deterant is ridiculous.

  • JediMasterMalik #380 5 years ago

    You don't revive where you die, you revive in certain rooms, like a checkpoint, but things don't revert back to how they were before you died. I think that's right anyway.

  • Ryuken #381 5 years ago

    It was inspired in Prey too, it was a mini-game there, but even that couldn't conceal the lame nature of it. Ah well, new casual FPS-times I suppose?

    EDIT: ah, some sort of middleground then, still, sounds too easy.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 17:04

  • afghan_jones #382 5 years ago

    "afghan_jonese, you have way to much time on your hand. "


    The irony is that I am actually incredibly busy and shouldnt be wasting my time typing nonsense stories. But its so much fun!

  • zuljin #383 5 years ago

    Hmmm, I have to say, the more I hear people talk about it, the more I worry (bout the way death is handled).

    It almost seems like the game becomes less about skill, and more about perseverance...

    Not sure how I feel about that, but I like to play games on easy anyway :)

  • pyrat6 #384 5 years ago

    @afghan_jones

    Um. yeh. Don't give up the day job just ... I mean the one that isn't typing gibberish on here. My money (shot) is on you being an accountant, estate agent or something.

    Never mind.

  • afghan_jones #385 5 years ago

    @pyrat6

    Keep your money shot to yourself you dirty bertie.

  • pyrat6 #386 5 years ago

    @afghan_jones

    But the plasterer's radio look is *so* you ! You know you want it ...

  • superted #387 5 years ago

    First!!!1!!!!one!!!!

  • gaijin #388 5 years ago

    yeah, the death thing was my one reservation about the demo. I didn't die until the transit hub right at the end, where the exit you need goes into lockdown and you get jumped by loads of splicers... there's a pod right there in the room, so you reincarnated with your enemies pacing around right outside. Which was unnerving. They don't actually come for you until you step out, which is a relief, but just slightly broke the immersion - for me, anyway. And as you're using ammo every time, if you keep getting killed and being resurrected then it would actually be quite welcome to have a bit of time first to scoot around and pick more stuff up... that said, they do give you some new eve each time so you can keep using your plasmids, and the enemies don't respawn so you can eventually take them all down. But yes, this is where any concerns I have are currently centred, in that it might just allow me to slog through without being inventive, and I'll have to concentrate on being virtuous and playing properly, which is trial for someone as lazy as me... :-).

  • Santino #389 5 years ago

    Can be Pre-loaded on steam now for any pc owners

    http://www.st eampowered.com/v/index.php

  • SBfistfun #390 5 years ago

    "afghan_jonese, you have way to much time on your hand."

    I though it was the funniest thing I've read in ages!

  • krudster #391 5 years ago

    You know, if regenerating after dying somehow offends your gaming principles, you *can* just reload a save game. It's totally up to you. I don't see this being a problem for anyone.

  • Barkotron #392 5 years ago

    "Can be Pre-loaded on steam now for any pc owners

    http://www.st eampowered.com/v/index.php"



    AHHHHHHHHHHH! I didn't know it'd be on Steam! Should I have?

  • afghan_jones #393 5 years ago

    @SBfistfun

    Its also 110% true as it is all made out of some facts I found lying around somewhere.

  • Dr.Mott #394 5 years ago

    What's with this ridiculous number of comments? You'd think it got an 8 or something? ;)

  • Rodney #395 5 years ago

    Afghan Jones.

    that Aids post made me laugh out loud.

  • afghan_jones #396 5 years ago

    "that Aids post made me laugh out loud. "

    Thanks.

    Hey, you might be interested in a little timesaver I stumbled across on the interweb the other day.

    Apparently a lot of people now use the abbreviation 'LOL' to signify 'laughing out loud.'

    Give it a go, I hear its pretty popular.

    ;-)
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 17:58

  • Scimarad #397 5 years ago

    "If the hype is true, this game should get two extra points for promoting good old SP, with a great story, immersion, and engagement of the player over silly, mindless MP, AND the fact that it runs against most of what Nintendo said recently about how games of the future should be like."

    +gazillions

  • GamesConnoisseur #398 5 years ago

    1) LOL!

    2) Laugh out loud!

    One of them give the impression of coming from a sad teenage geek with pented up frustation (just ran out of Johnston Baby wipe) and do particpate in flaming war just for the hell of it.

    Established that BioShock is one hot shit, now it is obviously impossible to fully replicate for Wii and interested if will ever be released on PS3 and how it would differ? I know PS3 is a good hardware and happy to have it but what with the tendency for a slight inferior port to date. Also with recent EA statement on PS3 having 30 fps as opposited to 360 60 fps for Madden 08 is worrying.

    This is the time where X360 and PC owners are just glad to have BioShock and other console owners probably never more tempted to upgrade PC or getting X360 via ebay!!

  • Ryuken #399 5 years ago

    "You know, if regenerating after dying somehow offends your gaming principles, you *can* just reload a save game. It's totally up to you. I don't see this being a problem for anyone. "

    It was pretty annoying in Prey. I mean everyone wants to keep on playing the game since we all assume that's what the devs want us to do. Providing the quickload option as an alternative is trivial after that, things already got spoiled bad enough and using the in-game way of handling "death" creates a (bad) habit. The choice shouldn't be there in the first place, either make a believeable and challenging in-game death solution or just provide loading options, it should be everything or nothing imo.

  • Pablo2k5 #400 5 years ago

    Holy mother of god!! 10?!

    w00t

  • chischis #401 5 years ago

    It DOESN'T run under Windows 2000.

    It DOESN'T run without an internet connection, which it requires just to "authorise" or "activate" the game.

    2K CAN S*D OFF.

    (I'm not apologising, this may be the greatest artistic moment in gaming since System Shock 2, but if Irrational/2K insist on limiting their fanbase, and putting a finger up at their PAYING customers, that's their problem.)
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 18:18

  • Wendelius #402 5 years ago

    Chischis,

    Get yourself a decent OS (that XP thing that came out a little while ago is not too bad I hear) or get a 360 if you really don't like the internet activation thing. Win2K is hardly being promoted as the Gamer's choice. Not all MS OSes are created equal for gamers. *shrug*

    Played the demo. Really enjoyed it. Called the wife over to point out things and she ended up sitting down and following my progress with the same amount of trepidation I felt entering dark corridors. Fun!

    Really looking forward to the full game. 360 for me as the big screen and 5.1 sound will make the experience so much more enjoyable.

    Wendelius

  • konstantinos #403 5 years ago

    hmmm, people here seem to forget that the definitive RE4 version came out on PS2 eventually... yes, it wasn't as graphically accomplished but it played every bit as brilliantly as the GC version (something that will not be a problem for PS3, handling Bioshock specs that is, if anything it will probably look even better)...

    in any case, I just hope that sales for this go through the roof (not like Psychonauts)...

    cheers...

  • captainrentboy #404 5 years ago

    I don't think Halo's Campaign stands a chance against this, and it really saddens me to say that, being the gigantic Halo fan that I am :)
    Bungie seem to be faffing about with too many other things (Most of which, once again, are multi-player related) rather than have concentrated on a truely amazing single player experience.
    I've got a feeling that Halo 3 will feel a little bet ''meeehhhhh'' after I've completed this stunning looking title.
    But thankfully I love playing over live, and I think H3 will live up to its hype with regards to its online modes.
    Now facking hurry up the 24th!!!!

  • InsoFox #405 5 years ago

    "Just being revived at the point where you died is meaningful gameplay? Is there any point to still trying to avoid "death" actually then?"

    1) just one small point, you get revived at the time of death, but you respawn at certain locations in a special chamber. Don't know if that's what you meant.

    2) Yes, there is. If I'm getting beaten down, I'll be using more items and stuff. Not dying = not wasting items. Technically you might be able to go through the game just dying all the time until you beat the enemy, never using health packs and just getting through on brute force.. but that wouldn't be very fun, would it? So even though it's possible, I don't know anyone who would choose to play the game by just dying their way through it.

    3) but then again, if there's a section that you can't get past and is really frustrating you, it's nice to think that with a bit of persistance you will be able to force your way through. I don't think there's any real fun in playing the exactly same 2 minutes of game over and over
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 18:54

  • zuljin #406 5 years ago

    @Wendelius
    "Get yourself a decent OS"

    Win 2k rocks. Never had it crash, never had any networking problems, never had any games probs (except Grim Fandango wouldn't run - which I admit is a crime). Theres times I wonder if it actually is a Microsoft OS.

    Win XP.... Don't get me started.

    @InsoFox
    Cheers for clearing that up.

    EDIT: argh spelling
    Edited by 2 at 16/08/07 @ 18:56

  • Wendelius #407 5 years ago

    @Zuljin
    "Win 2k rocks. Never had it crash, never had any networking problems. Theres times I wonder if it actually is a Microsoft OS.

    Win XP.... Don't get me started."

    In true MS fashion, my experience is about the reverse of yours. PC's and OS's are always fun to mix and match. :)

    But, seriously, Win2K is a good work OS (that's what it's used for on a very large scale in the company I work for) but I wouldn't use it as the ultimate Gamer's OS. And XP SP2 is very stable, thank you.

    Wendelius

  • zozart #408 5 years ago

    "It DOESN'T run under Windows 2000.

    It DOESN'T run without an internet connection, which it requires just to "authorise" or "activate" the game."

    I'm sure it'll run under Win2k with some prodding.

    I wish I could think of a positive thing to say about the online activation, but I know the hacking groups will probably break that soon after release, if not zero-day. Which means, yeah, I guess it's pretty pointless.

    Still, since I have an Internet connection I don't care! Bring on the 24th!

  • Avenger1324 #409 5 years ago

    Normally I would dismiss a score of 10 as over-hype, but having seen the 360 demo I HAVE to get this game.

    Thanks for not ruining the plot as well :-)

  • thinred #410 5 years ago

    Great... Call me back when they have sorted that carcrash of a console named 360... or when the Falcon has landed *wink-wink

  • Duke_Red #411 5 years ago

    To all the nay sayers. I LIKE WHAT ive seen so far because of the atmosphere of the game and finding out whats going to hapen, as well as the game play.

    I dont see why the people who say they dont like it/ wont buy, cant see this... They must have no taste or something...

  • George-Roper #412 5 years ago

    @thinred

    Sure mate, you stick with your stale, pointless, PS3 or gimmick-driven-and-barren-gamescape on your Wii.

    I'll stick with my *working* 360 and play this *stunning* game, in just over 7 days.

  • DanMW #413 5 years ago

    I didn't need a demo to convince me I wanted to experience Bioshock.

    As for a 10, to me this kind of score doesn't suggest that the game is perfect, but that it offers something new, something refreshing to the genre. Of course if you are not a fan of this kind of games, then no matter how many 10/10s it gets you might not like it, but at least give the demo a try.

    I am very excited about Bioshock, I haven't felt this way about a game in a long time, the older I get the harder it seems to get excited about games, to be honest I thought I never feel like this about a game ever again, but Bioshock is just something pretty special in my eyes.

    I'm getting both versions :D I hope this game sells many millions.

  • SniperWolf #414 5 years ago

    Why is there no black people in this game?, surely that deserves a -1 on the score. I mean it's very unrealistic to think a 1920's Eutopia wouldn't have at least some black people working in Rapture.

    9/10 it is then, -1 for not portraying the time period correctly.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 19:23

  • TheUnionFrag #415 5 years ago

    Bloody hell do I want this game now! Just picked up the demo and it was truly superb. Kristan's review did it for me.

  • _Price_ #416 5 years ago

    Any chance of an early price cut on the Elite? No? None at all?

    Bugger it. I'll probably buy one anyway.

    Clever sods.

  • smelly #417 5 years ago

    Just read the review twice.. i still cant get excited by this. Dunno why.

    I want to feel like it's the saviour of my 360, and will be the bestest game i have..

    .. but i just cant bring myself to be excited by it..

    I'll download the demo...

  • Wendelius #418 5 years ago

    "I'll download the demo... "

    Maybe playing the demo is indeed a better way of seeing how good the game is than reading a review. Just a thought. :)

  • smurphs #419 5 years ago

    just downloading the system shock 2 demo. seems like I may have missed something....

  • Monkey_Puncher #420 5 years ago

    "Any chance of an early price cut on the Elite? No? None at all?

    Bugger it. I'll probably buy one anyway. "

    I wouldn't be suprised if the Elite is cheaper than people are expecting. They still haven't announced a Euro price for it and everyone is expecting them to announce the European price drop at Leipzig.

  • chischis #421 5 years ago

    @Wendelius

    Bugger off will you?

    XP has activation, 2000 doesn't. 2000 still works perfectly for everything ELSE I use it for.

    And hell, it runs DirectX 9 as well. Irrational are either caving to MS's demands or are simply lazy. Or both.

  • Sebo #422 5 years ago

    I swear I've seen the elite advertised for £329.99

  • smelly #423 5 years ago

    "Maybe playing the demo is indeed a better way of seeing how good the game is than reading a review. Just a thought. :)"


    Which is why i'm doing it...

    still downloading (sloow connection here *sulk*)

  • dcangel #424 5 years ago

    Argh... now I either have to upgrade my desktop or buy an X360. Damnit :D

  • zendragon #425 5 years ago

    Stupid death system seems like the one in the warcraft 3 bonus campaign.

    It was ultimately without a doubt crap. Positive that you can just continue without a need for time to save or a loading screen, but still, it's a cop-out. It's dumbing down clearly. Why care?

    If in life you could just respawn, think how would life be, behaviour and attitude?!

    Bioshock is exactly system shock 2 in the sea and dumbed down for consoles and review people.

  • spliffhead #426 5 years ago

    Get a 360, Unreal Tournament 3 is going to be the benchmark for PC performance.

    I'd wait until then before spending out right now.

  • dcangel #427 5 years ago

    zendragon, have you by any chance forgotten that you could also respawn in both System Shock and System Shock 2 when you found a regeneration cubicle? I'd argue anything that reduces the annoying reliance on constant quicksaving as insurance against death is generally positive.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 20:57

  • Nikanoru #428 5 years ago

    I don't trust Eurogamer's 10 scores anymore. When's the PC demo coming?

  • kangarootoo #429 5 years ago

    @chischis

    You seem way too tense.

    1. Your OS is two generations old for crying out loud. At some point you have to expect things to stop being supported. Its called progress, and you create the choice for yourself. Either be satisfied that less games will run on your PC, or buy a more recent OS. Its not 2Ks choice, its yours.

    Also, its not a matter of anyone being "too lazy", its a matter of them saying "shall we invest time and money in supporting an OS two generations old for the tiny minority out there still running it on a gaming machine, or shall we invest that time and money on making the product better for the majority?". The answer seems obvious to me.

    2. Err, if you decide not the buy the game... you aren't a paying customer are you. So what are you on about when you talk about 2K putting the finger up at their paying customers?

    Welcome to the real world, a world where we as customers decide whether we like a product, and if we don't, we don't buy it.

  • chischis #430 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo

    "Your OS is two generations old for crying out loud."

    I've seen this argument elsewhere. All I can say is, so what? It does everything else I want just fine. It also happens to run Stalker, Spaceforce and Tomb Raider Anniversary just fine.

    As for the buying issue, you're obviously too dense? You don't mind the fact that 2K don't trust you enough that they REQUIRE internet activation before THEY let you play the game? You go right ahead, then. Be a good little consumer.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 21:38

  • Miths #431 5 years ago

    "... Get yourself a decent OS (that XP thing that came out a little while ago is not too bad I hear) or get a 360 if you really don't like the internet activation thing. Win2K is hardly being promoted as the Gamer's choice. Not all MS OSes are created equal for gamers. *shrug*"

    I'm a Win 2K user as well, and the sad thing - and also what's kept me from upgrading, through numerous hardware upgrades and even complete system changes - is that until very recently (we're only talking months), practically every new game released (minus a select few from - surprise, surprise - Microsoft studios) would run under Windows 2000 SP4 without any problems whatsoever.

    All of a sudden here in 2007 it seems like damn near every other title requires XP SP2 - and considering some of the workarounds that have been found for a few games (a user released "patch" for C&C3 if I understood it correctly, and I think it was Age of Empires 3 or something that ran without any problems on 2000 if you could manage to bypass the installer in one way or another) and the fact that 2000 and XP are based on almost the exact same core, it is a tad annoying that most developers won't bother to take the seemingly often very small steps required to make it run on 2000.
    Hell, I'm not asking them to provide official support - it is an outdated OS of course, no argument there (even if it's virtually identical to XP in most areas "under the hood";) - so just don't mention it on the box, but make sure it runs.

    Upgrade to XP?
    Good idea - but the thing is, buying XP and spending an annoying day or two reinstalling (the easy part) and restoring backups, application data, application profiles, system setups etc. (the annoying part) probably less than six months before I'm gonna get Vista anyway (don't want to jump the gun with that one just yet, sounds like it may be a bit too soon for some applications and games), seems like a really bad idea, or at least a serious inconvinience.

    If game developers feel that all gamers should be running at least XP, why didn't they go out of their way to make their games incompatible with 2000 just a little sooner - like a year or three ago?

    Alright, vent (almost) over :p - this is really something that's been p...... me off the last five or six months as I've been forced to pass on several titles I was looking forward to, because I just couldn't justify doing a temporary upgrade to XP this late in its lifespan.
    Happened last week as well with the Tabula Rasa beta, and according to reports on their beta forums it had actually been running perfectly well on 2000 until one of the latest patches.
    Edited by 2 at 16/08/07 @ 21:46

  • psychokitten #432 5 years ago

    Nikanoru,
    2k said the PC demo should be out tomorrow.

  • Amnesia #433 5 years ago


    Chischis - you might have seen that argument elsewhere. Perhaps a lot of people are telling you it because, well, just possibly, they are right.....?

    2000 wasn't a gaming platform anyway, it was a pro-platform and hanging out on it bleating about how a bleeding edge absolutely kick-ass game (as reflected by these mounting, piling-up scores which are denoting this as a major gaming event for the PC) is not saying *anything* about the developers, only about you. For god's sake man, come some 7 years into the present day eh? Alternatively do it properly and piss off to tweaking Solaris 10 or Lunix or something eh? Jeez.

  • George-Roper #434 5 years ago

    @chischis

    "Your OS is two generations old for crying out loud."

    I've seen this argument elsewhere. All I can say is, so what? It does everything else I want just fine. It also happens to run Stalker, Spaceforce and Tomb Raider Anniversary just fine.

    As for the buying issue, you're obviously too dense? You don't mind the fact that 2K don't trust you enough that they REQUIRE internet activation before THEY let you play the game? You go right ahead, then. Be a good little consumer"

    Are you for real? All you can say is, so what? ROFLMAO! If W2K does everything else you need it to, stfu and accept that it won't run Bioshock. It's as fucking simple as that.

    Newsflash, the world doesn't revolve around you or your old, likely pirated, O/S.

    You seem oddly, strongly, against the concept of 'checking' software for authenticity. Why is that? Surely the only people who would be against such a thing are the people who aren't going to buy the software in the first place (read, pirate). Be it an O/S, game or whatever.

    Too right 2K don't trust us. Why the fuck should they? Software companies have been getting ripped off for fucking YEARS by pirates and the like. Bioshock DESERVES to reap the rewards of all the time spend in development. The end product is CLEARLY worthy of a measly 25 quid on the PC (and in my case, 40 quid on 360) and I will damn well do my utmost to support devs/publishers that continue to try and push originality into the marketplace.

    An insignificant online activation will NOT cost me anything and in fact will only serve to bolster the chance of a sequel.

    Muppet.


  • MasterControlProgram #435 5 years ago

    Game Informer: 10/10
    Games Radar: 10/10
    PC Gamer UK: 95%
    OXM UK: 10/10
    Alternative Press: 5/5
    PC Zone: 96%
    Gamer.tv: 5/5
    Eurogamer.net: 10/10
    Playboy: 4/4 bunnies

    So, any chance Famitsu giving it a 40/40 ?


    /hysterical laugh
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 22:26

  • George-Roper #436 5 years ago

    You tell em, Wax!

    But you know what they say about people who are openly phobic about homosexuality, right?

    You can read, right?

  • sajtion #437 5 years ago

    demo was nothing special. this reviewer is clearly on crack
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 22:30

  • Nikanoru #438 5 years ago

    Are you for real? All you can say is, so what? ROFLMAO! If W2K does everything else you need it to, stfu and accept that it won't run Bioshock. It's as fucking simple as that.


    I don't think you've really understood all that's been said. Reread it.

    The point was that YES, it WILL run these games. Perfectly. Except that recently, they often seem to deliberately block out Win2K and have some lame-ass excuse for it. The very fact that games have had TINY user-made patches released to make them run on Win2K exactly the way they would run on XP, proves this. There's nothing you can say.

    It's like banning all cars that predate 1997 from driving on half of the roads in the country, just because someone feels people should buy new ones. It's 2007 now for chissake! Just STFU and accept it! No, of course not, because it's retarded.

  • psychokitten #439 5 years ago

    Hmm, now there's no confirmed date for the PC demo:
    [link url=http://w ww.shacknews.com/laryn.x?story=48490
    ]http://ww w.shacknews.com/laryn.x?story=4...[/link]

    It was supposed to be before the game is out but that's on monday (in the US).

  • George-Roper #440 5 years ago

    @Nikanoru

    I've just reread...

    "It DOESN'T run under Windows 2000.

    It DOESN'T run without an internet connection, which it requires just to "authorise" or "activate" the game.

    2K CAN S*D OFF.

    (I'm not apologising, this may be the greatest artistic moment in gaming since System Shock 2, but if Irrational/2K insist on limiting their fanbase, and putting a finger up at their PAYING customers, that's their problem.)"

    And follwed up on subsequent posts and I don't think im misunderstanding anything.

    Bottom line is, you're getting upset because a game released mid-late 2007 won't *officially* run on an unsupported O/S, released approx 7 years previously and one that was not even originally designed for 'home' (read, gaming) use.

    How about the fact that Win2K isn't flagged as being supported because 2K simply didn't have time to thoroughly test it on that platform? Or because the online activation can't be properly supported in Win2K? Or because pre-reqs (whatever they may be) won't run on Win2K?

    I'm not sitting here, preparing a factual list of reasons WHY it's not supported. I just don't care enough. You may be happy enough to run with an unsupported O/S of a bygone era, but frankly, i'm not. If your Win2K runs everything and you're happy, stick to what works and is supported and stop thinking that devs owe you an explanation. They don't. They obviously want to go for O/S's that are current and are supported. There's simply NOTHING wrong with that and as someone who works in a software dev environment and I can completely see their POV.

    If I were to wax on about how disappointed I am that Bioshock won't run on Win98, how is that any different? At what point is the 'cut off' where it becomes fucking stupid to continually bang on about how badly done to older O/S users are?

  • chischis #441 5 years ago

    @Miths (edit: and Nikanoru!)

    Thankyou for an insightful, MATURE reply that I completely sympathise with. I have XP on another PC that I use purely as a music production system. It doesn't have, nor does it require, some monster ninja bastard Geforce in it, therefore it won't run Bioshock.

    Although I guess, If I could be bothered, I could temporarily put my 6800GS in there. But I still violently oppose this internet activation BULLSHIT. So yeah, I'm quite happy to keep my money, thanks. I refuse to give any to publishers that don't trust their customers.
    Edited by 2 at 16/08/07 @ 23:02

  • captain-future #442 5 years ago

    solid review and I'm still blown away from the XBL demo.

  • George-Roper #443 5 years ago

    @chischis

    "Although I guess, If I could be bothered, I could temporarily put my 6800GS in there. But I still violently oppose this internet activation BULLSHIT. Because it just shows distrust for customers, on the part of the publisher"

    Are you 8 years old, living in la-la land, or just genuinely fucking thick? Of COURSE theres distrust there. Of FUCKING COURSE.

    I'm not naive enough to think that the protection won't be bypassed, quickly, but this is very simply an attempt by 2K to protect their investment.

    Software piracy is fucking rife but I have hopes, based on the contents of this thread so far, that the majority of gamers will pay homage to the devs by putting hard cash on the table for this game. It deserves it, for a number of reasons, one of the main being that the gaming populace want ORIGINALITY and THOUGHT in their games, not mindless, yearly, 'upgrades' at 40/50 quid a pop. Yes, EA, i'm looking at you...

  • dryden555 #444 5 years ago

    the death system in Bioshock looks lame and console-ish, but I'll give it the benefit of doubt until I play the game

  • chischis #445 5 years ago

    You are an immature, mouthy wanker, George. If I don't want to buy the game, that's my choice. I've given a perfectly reasonable... reason, so your attempts to shoot down it down in flames seem like childish pandering to 2K. You don't work for them do you? You must be, if you agree that 2K aren't trusting customers but you'll still be buying the game?
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 23:13

  • jiveguy #446 5 years ago

    Woah, did someone shut down some CounterStrike servers somewhere? Where did all these "dumbed down console version" comments spring from?

  • WJF #447 5 years ago

    My money's on Chis having a music rig........filled with pirate software.

    I don't think I know a single PC music owner who hasn't got at least one piece of software illegally. Please be an exception to the rule (or else your argument is shit).

  • manic_mouse #448 5 years ago

    "the death system in Bioshock looks lame and console-ish, but I'll give it the benefit of doubt until I play the game"

    Yeah, we should auto-save every three seconds instead! PC gaming rocks!

    As for Bioshock not running on Win2K, 2000 called and asked for their OS back. It's nearly 2008, the number of people running Win2K on a rig capable of running Bioshock and want to buy it is MINISCULE. Supporting a dead and irrelevant OS isn't exactly a good way to spend limited development funds.

  • chischis #449 5 years ago

    "I don't think I know a single PC music owner who hasn't got at least one piece of software illegally. Please be an exception to the rule (or else your argument is shit)."

    Haha, oh you poor deluded idiot. If that's really the view you have, then how do you explain these boxed copies of Sound Forge and Vegas that I have?

    ... and my 8 HARDWARE synths. Can't pirate those. (Having a job really helps, if you didn't know already)
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 23:26

  • chischis #450 5 years ago

    "Supporting a dead and irrelevant OS isn't exactly a good way to spend limited development funds."

    Jade Empire is an "XP-only" game.

    It works on 2000 flawlessly after performing a small hex edit to one DLL file.

    You work the rest out.

  • WJF #451 5 years ago

    Gosh, I must be a poor deluded idiot.

    SHALL I POST MY HARDWARE??

    No, because I'm not an arrogent twat

    EDIT: On a serious note, you're telling me that even when you didn't have a job, you never, ever, ever, ever used /one/ piece of pirated music software? Just wondering, what with it being quite an expensive career/hobby to get into and all.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 23:37

  • George-Roper #452 5 years ago

    @chischis

    "You are an immature, mouthy wanker, George. If I don't want to buy the game, that's my choice. I've given a perfectly reasonable... reason, so your attempts to shoot down it down in flames seem like childish pandering to 2K. You don't work for them do you? You must be, if you agree that 2K aren't trusting customers but you'll still be buying the game?"

    LMFAO!

    That's it?

    That's your answer?

    Small tip... you are (hopefully!) not 8 years old and therefore you need to desperately and with all haste understand that the world you live in is not populated by honest, trustworthy, people. The sooner you understand this, and lose your incredibly naive view on life, the better off you will be.

    In fact, no, please ignore the above. Send me 150 quid and I *promise* i'll send you details on how to earn 500 quid/week. No, really! Trust me!!

    The point is, you spout shit about this and that with no real 'reason' behind your anger at 2K for requiring activation (and, just on this, ive not investigated online activation on the PC, so im taking your word that this is needed).

    Why don't you enlighten us as to why you're so vehemently against installing the game on your PC and clicking the 'Ok, please verify my install of Bioshock' button.

    What exactly are your fears and reasons behind not wanting to perform this small task?

    And...LOL...no I don't work for 2K. In fact, i'll be on the Xbox360 not the PC version, so I won't even have to register it online. It just really amazes me when I see posts such as yours, which give no detail as to why you're so against this kind of requirement.

    To summarise, you're using an old O/S that *doesn't* require online activation (newer O/S's do) and you're now angry that Bioshock will also require online activation. The more cynical amongst us might think that you simply don't want to buy the game and would prefer to download and play on a cracked version. Why don't you just admit it? You'll feel better!

  • manic_mouse #453 5 years ago

    "Jade Empire is an "XP-only" game.

    It works on 2000 flawlessly after performing a small hex edit to one DLL file. "

    Unfortunately game developers need to do a bit more testing, and have a bit more responsibility if things go wrong, than a bedroom l337 haxor.

    I doubt 2K will be losing sleep over all the lost sales due to a lack of Win 2K compatibility.

    Honestly, cry me a river. Are they going to waste time and resources for about ten people? The PC version is niche enough, it'll be outsold by the Xbox version by about five to one.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 23:38

  • quantumsheep #454 5 years ago

    It's great to see so many positive comments, and I'm sure it gives the devs a warm glow inside. As will buying the game itself no doubt, so will hopefully be getting the special edition next weekend!

    Seen the achievement list and they don't seem too hard to get - having said that though, I've only played the demo so you never know!

    As to the online activation thing - it's a slight inconvenience (I remember wanting to play half life 2 a while back but couldn't because I had no Internet connection at the time). However, it's not aimed at paying customers really, is it? It's there to deter pirates, as most copy protection is.

    Unfortunately, due to piracy, we have to put up with these things as paying customers.

    Needing an internet connection to verify your game shouldn't inconvenience you too much. It *should* inconvenience pirates. That's its goal.

  • Yossarian #455 5 years ago

    the death system in Bioshock looks lame and console-ish

    SysShock 2 was lame and console-ish?

  • chischis #456 5 years ago

    Haha, oh you guys... you GUYS... you're making me spill my pint here. I've never seen such sheer wankery and ignorance.

    You believe what the hell you want, I'm past caring now.

    Short summary: Bioshock may be a peak for FPS gaming, games as art, and so on... but those of us mature adults with principles that happen to be incompatible with the game's requirements (I'm not buying XP AGAIN just to play a fucking game, and a 360? Go away), will go on living just fine without playing it. And we'll be £25 richer. Which is nice.

  • quantumsheep #457 5 years ago

    Apparently so, Tiste!

    \o/

  • chischis #458 5 years ago

    @Quantumsheep

    "Needing an internet connection to verify your game shouldn't inconvenience you too much. It *should* inconvenience pirates. That's its goal."

    Trouble is, it probably won't. The game will likely be cracked, and pirated just as much as the rest. Whether it does or not, there's also the question of ethics: do you really want to give money to a publisher that doesn't trust you? It will only encourage them to continue using such "protection" in further games.

  • Ryltar #459 5 years ago

    oh please, its not even worth mentioning ethics in a case like this, if the game installed starforce or other type of stealth protection system thingy i can see your point. But from my understanding all it does is need online activation during the install. I dont see anything different (in terms of ethics) from this to using the more conventional CD key.

  • manic_mouse #460 5 years ago

    @chischis

    Stop foaming at the mouth. You've yet to give a single reason why you have a problem with activating it, you're the one being an idiot. My "principles" are that pirating is wrong, and that I have nothing to hide or lose by activating a game. What are yours?

    Here's some advice, buy a 360 and enjoy playing great games. Forget OS politics, forget incompatibility and just have fun. Isn't that what games are about?

    "do you really want to give money to a publisher that doesn't trust you?"

    They're right not to trust everyone they sell the game to. Your ideas of principles and ethics are fundamentally flawed because they simply don't work in the real world, and then you whine when people don't follow your non-functioning ideals. Welcome to the real world. People pirate. 2K have every right to protect their investment, and as a paying customer you are in no way being harmed by the measures they've taken. Good for them, and you need to shut up and grow up. Unless you're a pirate you have no need to be offended or upset by their decisions, since they're not aimed at you.
    Edited by 3 at 16/08/07 @ 23:55

  • quantumsheep #461 5 years ago

    chischis, that's a fair point, but I don't think that it's *you* they see as untrustworthy. Just those that will not pay for the game at all who they're trying to stop.

    It's the price we pay for the selfishness of others!

    Edit: Ryltar, good point too. It's no different to any pc game requiring a CD key far as I can see. If you were to boycott games that used CD keys and online activation, I've a feeling your choice in software would diminish somewhat.
    Edited by 2 at 16/08/07 @ 23:52

  • chischis #462 5 years ago

    "I dont see anything different (in terms of ethics) from this to using the more conventional CD key."

    You don't have to connect to the internet just to get the CD key, it's there in the box. "Pirated" CD keys are blocked from playing online. This seems completely fair to me.

  • George-Roper #463 5 years ago

    @chischis

    "Haha, oh you guys... you GUYS... you're making me spill my pint here. I've never seen such sheer wankery and ignorance.

    You believe what the hell you want, I'm past caring now.

    Short summary: Bioshock may be a peak for FPS gaming, games as art, and so on... but those of us mature adults with principles that happen to be incompatible with the game's requirements (I'm not buying XP AGAIN just to play a fucking game, and a 360? Go away), will go on living just fine without playing it. And we'll be £25 richer. Which is nice"

    *scratches head*

    Erm, I don't quite see the point in why you're here, on this thread, in that case.

    On the one hand, you blather on about how it won't run on your pirated O/S and how that's an outrage, which clearly indicates that you're GUSHING to play it, but then you wrap up by saying that you don't really want to buy it anyway and would sooner save 25 quid.

    Part of which could be sorted out by buying XP Pro for, what, 40 quid nowadays*? You're not exactly all that bothered really, are you, which then raises the question, were you ever bothered? Or was this just an opportunity to impress everyone with clever ways of typing 'wanker' such as 'mouthy wanker' and 'wankery'

    And, just for the record, wanking isnt a *bad* thing unless you do it 15 times a day. So check your palms and get an eyesight test. Soon.



    *maybe

  • quantumsheep #464 5 years ago

    /can't see palms

    /needs an eyetest

  • manic_mouse #465 5 years ago

    "You don't have to connect to the internet just to get the CD key, it's there in the box"

    Oh noes, they're comparing what you enter to an off-site database rather than a local one on the CD. What scum, they shout be rounded up and shot!

    Waa, waa mommy. If you have time to worry about this stuff you need a life.
    Edited by 1 at 16/08/07 @ 23:58

  • chischis #466 5 years ago

    "People pirate. 2K have every right to protect their investment, and as a paying customer you are in no way being harmed by the measures they've taken."

    I have the choice not to be a customer to them. Which I won't. If you're any kind of sensible adult, you'll understand that. Obviously you aren't, and you don't.

    I don't want a 360. There are no (other) games on it I wish to play. I don't want to give MS any more money (It's my money, you know), and certainly won't give them any for a console that they have admitted develops faults. I'd rather save up for something more important like, well, a house?

  • manic_mouse #467 5 years ago

    "I have the choice not to be a customer to them."

    The phrase "cutting your nose off in spite of your face" springs to mind here. Refusing to play a brilliant game because you need to active it, a process which in no way is detrimental to you.

    You've still to give a single, valid, reason why activating it is a bad thing. Because 2K don't trust you? Newsflash, humanity (as a whole) isn't trustworthy. It's the reason there are penalties for breaking the law. The government doesn't trust you. Gonna start whining about that now, or just accept reality?

  • Santino #468 5 years ago

    "And, just for the record, wanking isnt a *bad* thing unless you do it 15 times a day."

    ah fuck
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 00:08

  • WJF #469 5 years ago

    "Pirated' CD keys are blocked from playing online. This seems completely fair to me."

    And this is a SINGLE PLAYER ONLY game.

    ....

    Work it out.

  • Vic #470 5 years ago

    Cant wait for this to come out on the PS3.

  • GamesConnoisseur #471 5 years ago

    /Scratching my head in puzzlement

    I m wondering how the hell the so called superiority of old MS software got praised and at same time all kinds of insults and hatred being addressed at the same old MS (with the dreaded sound of a nose being sliced off) got into the Bioshock thread?!

    I have to own up that at one time I was a Amiga/PC snob and honestly thought consoles beneath me but seen the light that it was purely all about the games and not the platform.

    Why you guys bothering trying to change the mind of a rabid fanatic? Its pointless!
    Edited by 2 at 17/08/07 @ 00:18

  • corzair #472 5 years ago

    oh my I didnt reckon on this game being a 10! gonno have to eat some humble pie and just order it...
    damn whens mi 360 coming back...

  • chischis #473 5 years ago

    @ Manic_mouse (and, hell, George as well, why not)

    "The phrase "cutting your nose off in spite of your face" springs to mind here. Refusing to play a brilliant game because you need to active it, a process which in no way is detrimental to you."

    Would they then let me activate the game again on my laptop should I wish to take the game on holiday? (hypothetical, if you can actually understand that word, as it is an older Thinkpad also running Windows 2000... because IT JUST WORKS)

    I'm not going to say this again: I am opposed to activation because it shows distrust on the part of the publisher. You can spout your arguments about humanity as much as you like (you must be a very lonely, sad person if you think that EVERYONE is so unreliable), this is my reason and I'm sticking to it. I will not support a publisher that uses activation, and NO I'm not going to fucking download the game. I don't care if you don't believe me, but as it happens we do not have broadband so it's not feasable even with Steam.

    So, yes, I'll be denied the "pleasure" of playing Bioshock. Mildly irritating, I guess, but I'll live. Have you tried going outside once in a while? There's more to life than gaming, you know.

  • chischis #474 5 years ago

    "And this is a SINGLE PLAYER ONLY game.

    ....

    Work it out."

    Wasn't even talking about Bioshock, try to keep up.

  • OnlyMe #475 5 years ago

    Played the demo for a few seconds, this is nowhere near a ten. Closer to a 6 or maybe seven. All you do is SWIM!

    Nice graphics though!
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 00:30

  • bdc #476 5 years ago

    360 > PS3


    Bioshock wins.

  • WJF #477 5 years ago

    No of course not. It has nothing to do with the subject.

    Silly me in forgetting you were talking about why you don't have to connect to the internet to activate a CD key on a manual. Or that if you pirate said CD key you can't play online thereby somehow making it all alright...

    Oh wait, hold on a moment! /I/ was making the logical step of taking you're inept argument about why you don't want to buy Bioshock (because of the internet activation....and that it won't run on an outdated OS but we'll leave that one for now) and making it clear why they couldn't, y'know, make it a more conventional CD key protection that you seemed to support. Of course, if CD keys make it useless to play online, then it would make it useless for Bioshock, a single player game, to use one....wouldn't it?

    EDIT: Taken out my childish retort at the end before I head off to bed. Want to hear a decent comeback though Chis while I sip my morning coffee or I am cry :-(
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 00:42

  • Shrike #478 5 years ago

    While it's sad that anger has finally taken hold in this comments thread, I'd like to say that chischis' circular logic really is quite pretty from up here. It's like a fractal drawing made of contradiction and hypocrisy. Which means it's not really "circular" or "logic", but that's sort of the point.

    While we are all going outside and getting a life, might I suggest that we also stop clinging to misguided notions about the nature of the technology industry and just buy that which will facilitate that greatest amount of Yay.

    Oh.

  • lockload #479 5 years ago

    GOTY until Mass Effect at least..

  • loopy #480 5 years ago

    "And, just for the record, wanking isnt a *bad* thing unless you do it 15 times a day."

    "ah fuck"

    Well, it's an alternative option for sure.

  • Skywise #481 5 years ago

    @lockload: "GOTY until Mass Effect at least.."

    the best box quote ever and so true :D

  • manuel_garcia #482 5 years ago

    So have we all agreed that this is potential best game of all time material? I haven't kept up with the last 500 comments.

  • Skywise #483 5 years ago

    @chischis: I can understand your position on this. I am pissed too that Bioshock won't play on my original xbox which is even newer than your windows 2000 :)

  • quantumsheep #484 5 years ago

    @onlyme

    Well, *I* laughed =D

  • RazorObsession #485 5 years ago

    Chischis - you bang on about being into your music and shit, and putting money towards a house, and going on holidays, there are no games on 360 that interest you at all (even Wii PS3 and PC owners look at certain titles and lust after them, or at the very least register interest, even if they never admit it. E.G Dead Rising) and finally you mention that theres more to life than games.


    do you actually play any games at all, or are you just an antagonistic cunt?

  • Miths #486 5 years ago

    "I can understand your position on this. I am pissed too that Bioshock won't play on my original xbox which is even newer than your windows 2000 :)"

    Yeah, well - I can't speak for chischis (I don't have any beef with the online activation thing for instance), but I think, and as I already pointed out a few pages back, that the thing that annoys us few remaining Windows 2000 users is the knowledge that while you all may be making fun of us for using an outdated OS, the fact is that until very recently, 2000 and XP have for all intents and purposes (minus user interface and a few fairly non-important system related features) been virtually identical.

    XP is based on the 2000 core. They use the same drivers. They run (or ran :)) the same versions of the same applications and games. They both support the same hardware (possibly with the exception of a few obscure devices).
    Basically, most of the differences between the outdated Windows 2000 and the slightly less outdated XP were and are cosmetic (ie. somewhat less pronounced - to say the least - than the differences between an XBox and an XBox 360 as jokingly suggested in the quote above).

    And that's probably the reason why most of us long time 2000 users - on each Windows reinstall after eg. hardware upgrades or complete computer purchases over the years - have asked ourselves "is it worth getting XP?".
    I know that for me the answer each time, including last time just six or seven months ago when I bought a new Core 2 Duo E6600 system with 2 GB RAM and a Geforce 7900GTO (ie. a gamer system), has been a resounding "no!" (guess that one came back and bit me in the a.. soon after :p).

    I'm not a member of the "XP sucks!" crowd, there has just been zero point in upgrading from 2000 because the two were 99% identical where it mattered - which also means of course that I didn't go around recommending XP users to try out 2000 instead, for the very same reason :).

    As I said in my last post, I've accepted that I won't be getting a whole lot of new games this year unless I upgrade to Vista sooner than planned, or go ahead and buy and install XP as a very temporary solution (not gonna happen, moving Vista up is more likely) - but it nevertheless still annoys me that a whole bunch of developers practically from one month to the next (in terms of release dates) earlier this year decided to, in some cases, seemingly go out of their way to make XP with Service Pack 2 a requirement for the games to run (and those tiny user made patches and workarounds for several games have proven that it shouldn't be a problem, whether or not they choose to officially support 2000).
    Had it happened a year or two ago I would have upgraded to XP without hesitation, but right now I sort of feel a bit stuck as a (nearly :)) fully working, software and driver supported and patched Vista is lurking mere months or even weeks away.

    Sorry for this (second) long post - that always seems to happen when I start writing something :).
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 04:29

  • Tyronne #487 5 years ago

    527 comments...527!!!...it would practically take as long to read all these as it would to possibly play it.

    Will be buying it on xbox as present pc not up to it and will no doubt get it on pc when I have new pc later in the year..

  • Masarin #488 5 years ago

    Another day. Come on, say something lads. :-)

  • mkreku #489 5 years ago

    My stupid retailer has stopped sending out pre-ordered games ahead of release day :(

    What's the point in pre-ordering then? :p

  • OnlyMe #490 5 years ago

    @quantumsheep

    Even if only one person laughs... mission succesfull.

  • RichGL #491 5 years ago

    I cancelled my pre-order a week ago as I have yet to have a game sent to me before it was out in the shops.

    I'll pay 10 quid extra and get it on the morning thanks!

    Besides that will save me from hanging around the door like a chav on giro day.

  • espy #492 5 years ago

    If this is anywhere near as psychologically taxing as SS2 I'll be a slobbering wreck by the end of the month.

    Oh, and I need a new PC. And this will probably make me buy one.

  • Twincoil #493 5 years ago

    Well the demo left me thinking it would be a great 1st person experience, but a so-so 1st person shooter. Controls felt wooly in combat and the atmosphere, whilst original and well executed, soon became repetitve.

    Still going to purchase, but, I dunno....
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 09:18

  • Nikanoru #494 5 years ago

    "I can understand your position on this. I am pissed too that Bioshock won't play on my original xbox which is even newer than your windows 2000 :)"

    Yeah, well - I can't speak for chischis (I don't have any beef with the online activation thing for instance), but I think, and as I already pointed out a few pages back, that the thing that annoys us few remaining Windows 2000 users is the knowledge that while you all may be making fun of us for using an outdated OS, the fact is that until very recently, 2000 and XP have for all intents and purposes (minus user interface and a few fairly non-important system related features) been virtually identical.

    XP is based on the 2000 core. They use the same drivers. They run (or ran :)) the same versions of the same applications and games. They both support the same hardware (possibly with the exception of a few obscure devices).
    Basically, most of the differences between the outdated Windows 2000 and the slightly less outdated XP were and are cosmetic (ie. somewhat less pronounced - to say the least - than the differences between an XBox and an XBox 360 as jokingly suggested in the quote above).

    And that's probably the reason why most of us long time 2000 users - on each Windows reinstall after eg. hardware upgrades or complete computer purchases over the years - have asked ourselves "is it worth getting XP?".
    I know that for me the answer each time, including last time just six or seven months ago when I bought a new Core 2 Duo E6600 system with 2 GB RAM and a Geforce 7900GTO (ie. a gamer system), has been a resounding "no!" (guess that one came back and bit me in the a.. soon after :p).

    I'm not a member of the "XP sucks!" crowd, there has just been zero point in upgrading from 2000 because the two were 99% identical where it mattered - which also means of course that I didn't go around recommending XP users to try out 2000 instead, for the very same reason :).

    As I said in my last post, I've accepted that I won't be getting a whole lot of new games this year unless I upgrade to Vista sooner than planned, or go ahead and buy and install XP as a very temporary solution (not gonna happen, moving Vista up is more likely) - but it nevertheless still annoys me that a whole bunch of developers practically from one month to the next (in terms of release dates) earlier this year decided to, in some cases, seemingly go out of their way to make XP with Service Pack 2 a requirement for the games to run (and those tiny user made patches and workarounds for several games have proven that it shouldn't be a problem, whether or not they choose to officially support 2000).
    Had it happened a year or two ago I would have upgraded to XP without hesitation, but right now I sort of feel a bit stuck as a (nearly :)) fully working, software and driver supported and patched Vista is lurking mere months or even weeks away.

    Sorry for this (second) long post - that always seems to happen when I start writing something :).


    Just quoting this for emphasis.

    People can keep shouting to themselves "oh but your os is like a hundred years old" all they want, I guess they realise how irrelevant this is when 2000 is virtually identical to XP. "You might as well go play something in DOS" or "go back to your Xbox 1" saying that is just stupid and you know it.

    I'll wait for the patch.

  • Linkn #495 5 years ago

    Gotta finish this before halo 3 and end of summer!

    piece of cake :)

  • GamerG #496 5 years ago

    This game is not coming out on the PS3.

    If you listen to Ken Levine on Major Nelson's podcast he states that by signing an exclusive deal with Microsoft they allowed him to do a games for Windows version and a 360 version.

    http://www.majornelson.co m

  • bushwod #497 5 years ago

    You see, it's all this having to upgrade systems and OS's that makes me happy to play games on consoles. I don't know if it's more cost effective, but I certainly find it a lot easier.

  • GamerG #498 5 years ago

    regarding the PC issue..

    Making a game on the PC must be a nightmare with all the different operating systems out there is it not unreasonable for them to draw the line somewhere? XPSp2 seems perfectly reasonable to me, anyone with a older version of XP probably has a pirate and why spend time ensuring a game works on Windows 2000 when that OS was never meant to be for games anyway.

    Besides really if you have an HDTV you should buy a £250 360 and be done with it.

  • GamesConnoisseur #499 5 years ago

    Timed exclusive more likely rather than permanent exclusive?

    If it is indeed never going to come to PS3 then you know that salty water surrounding Rapture? Those are probably from PS3 owners' tears of frustration.

    All the days, weeks, months and years to come.

    Pause and join our thoughts at their vast and deep sorrow, oh and let us not forget Wii owners.

    /Look at my PS3 console and wonder when it will get my attention again what with BioShock coming

  • zuljin #500 5 years ago

    @George Roper
    "You seem oddly, strongly, against the concept of 'checking' software for authenticity. Why is that? Surely the only people who would be against such a thing are the people who aren't going to buy the software in the first place (read, pirate)."

    Please, please never ever use that argument again. Can I see all your credit card statements, know where you live and work? Why not if you have nothing to hide?

    This isn't about whether you have something to hide, this is a case of privacy. Very good read here:
    [link url=http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=9985 65
    ]http://pa pers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?a...[/link]

    @manic_mouse
    "You've still to give a single, valid, reason why activating it is a bad thing. Because 2K don't trust you?"

    Personally for me it would be because I don't trust the company, rather than the other way around. No problem for me with Bioshock, but its the single reason I don't have an oyster card.

  • George-Roper #501 5 years ago

    @zuljin

    Seriously. Get help.

    All that stuff you listed. Reality-check. THEY* already know. THEY* already have that information. THEY* can access it whenever they like.

    2K are not the next big terrorist threat to hit the civilized world. Nor are they intending to take your identity and force you to shore up with Gene Hackman.

    /boggle


    *THEY being the thought police

  • TonyCocaCola #502 5 years ago

    Cant be arsed to read all the comments. All im gonna say is.
    Played it the demo yesterday, i think visually it looks amazing, the combat looks really dramatic without it being to hard to control. I havent really been paying any attention to this game as the trailers didnt catch my eye so im gonna ask a really dumb question.

    Is this in anyway related to system shock? Playing it remided me of system shock 2. I know its probably a really silly question for those who know more about the game.

    Peace.

  • EmiliasHorse #503 5 years ago

    I own a PC that would very comfortably run Bioshock but I will be buying the 360 version, why? Because it will run as intended by the devs with no faffing with settings and no OS worries, I love the achievement points and finally I have grown to love the dual analogue control method for FPSs on the Xbox. I would never have thought that a game pad is more enjoyable than the more accurate mouse/keyboard affair but I find myself saying it.

  • kangarootoo #504 5 years ago

    @chischis

    "I've seen this argument elsewhere."

    There is probably a good reasdon for that.

    "It does everything else I want just fine."

    What is your point? They decide as a company which OS versions to support and which not to. They make this decision based on the time investment required against the number of people that benefit. They made their descision, so now you can make yours. You don't need to be so stroppy about it.


    "As for the buying issue, you're obviously too dense? You don't mind the fact that 2K don't trust you enough that they REQUIRE internet activation before THEY let you play the game? You go right ahead, then. Be a good little consumer."

    Wtf are you talking about? I said that until you buy the game you aren't the paying customer you suggest yourself to be, and that is your response? This internet activation business just sounds like a form of authentication to avoid piracy, the same in principle as any other. OF COURSE they don't bloody trust you, they don't know you. You are just one of millions of others, many of which would simply avoid paying for the game if they could.

    Reading down, manic_mouse puts it better than I have.

    "They're right not to trust everyone they sell the game to. Your ideas of principles and ethics are fundamentally flawed because they simply don't work in the real world, and then you whine when people don't follow your non-functioning ideals. Welcome to the real world."


    And by the way, every time you insult someone on here (and its clearly not limited to just me) you just demonstrate your own inability to form a constructive case to support your point of view.

  • GamerG #505 5 years ago

    Its funny that some PC gamers moan that they dont want to upgrade their OS from a 7 year old eddition but quite happily spend £100s on hardware each year keeping it up to date

  • TonyCocaCola #506 5 years ago

    Thats coz new hardware speeds the computer up, and new os's slow it down.

  • kangarootoo #507 5 years ago

    @chischis

    "So, yes, I'll be denied the "pleasure" of playing Bioshock. Mildly irritating, I guess, but I'll live. Have you tried going outside once in a while? There's more to life than gaming, you know."

    Lol, the irony.

    Still relying on insults I see. Tsss, kids.

  • psychokitten #508 5 years ago

    TonyCocaCola,
    It's a "spiritual successor" to System Shock 2. They don't own the rights to SS2 so they couldn't do a real sequel.

  • EmiliasHorse #509 5 years ago

    @chischis
    I have read all your comments and it is clear you do not want to upgrade and do not want to allow validation. Bioshock is clearly not for you in your present state of mind.

    Your loss

  • psychokitten #510 5 years ago

    Emilia'sHorse,

    Don't say that, he'll just come back and tell you it isn't his loss, and games are sad, go outside you weirdos!
    The ironing is delicious.

  • zuljin #511 5 years ago

    @George Roper
    "Seriously. Get help.

    All that stuff you listed. Reality-check. THEY* already know. THEY* already have that information. THEY* can access it whenever they like."

    Please actually read my post before replying. I said I have no problem with the Bioshock validation. As for the things I listed, whether "they" know, is neither here nor there. I don't know, but do you mind me knowing? And the answer is, of course you do, because that information is none of my business.

    I mind HSBC knowing what I buy - it is none of their business, so I take out cash.

    I mind LU knowing where and when I travel, so I don't use them.

    I really was just correcting a reason as to why people would want to have their privacy, you know private?
    Edited by 2 at 17/08/07 @ 10:21

  • EmiliasHorse #512 5 years ago

    On a happy note

    Only 7 days to go..WooHoo

  • mkreku #513 5 years ago

    Did someone blow the gates to the nearest mental institution and all the paranoids came running to this thread?

  • miiiguel #514 5 years ago

    "I don't want a 360. There are no (other) games on it I wish to play. I don't want to give MS any more money (It's my money, you know), and certainly won't give them any for a console that they have admitted develops faults. I'd rather save up for something more important like, well, a house? "

    Man..., ppl talk about the 360 price as it is something huge, come on..., how many 360 you must NOT buy to buy a house. A lot, I'll tell you, as a house owner. It's 400 eur, it's no big deal. The trust issue: I also don't trust ppl I don't know, at least I don't trust them my money. Anti-MS seem to be upset because the game seems to be good, lighten up, you are 449.99 Eur richer, you can have lunch for two weeks, have fun.
    tip: leave your principles to the voting booth, because, it's really your loss.

  • kangarootoo #515 5 years ago

    @psychokitten

    "The ironing is delicious"

    Big LOL. I'm not sure if that was intentional abstract subtlety or a typo.

    If it was a typo, please don't take offense at my chuckling at it.

    If it was intentional, you are my hero/heroine!

  • George-Roper #516 5 years ago

    @mkreku

    "Did someone blow the gates to the nearest mental institution and all the paranoids came running to this thread?"

    +1 and amen to that!

  • miiiguel #517 5 years ago

    Vic: "can't wait", lol, yes you can! you are used to wait, or at least you should be, by now.

  • zuljin #518 5 years ago

    @George Roper
    "Did someone blow the gates to the nearest mental institution and all the paranoids came running to this thread?

    +1 and amen to that!"

    Lol. Coming from the man who said "they" know everything about you...

  • Wendelius #519 5 years ago

    One thing I really enjoyed in the demo is the way some of the splicers were more than generic lurching monsters. The woman singing over the crib, the man banging at the door and arguing with his wife, ... I find it rare enough that the baddies you are about to shoot actually are helping bring depth to the world.

    Then again, I don't play many FPSes. But Bioshock really drew me in from the moment the lights started switching on in the lighthouse.

    7 days is going to be a very loooong time.

    On the copy protection thing, I'll play on the 360. but, on my PC, I'd rather have a 1 off activation than having the game install Starforce or other stupid DRM software on my machine.

    Wendelius
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 10:29

  • DrunKao #520 5 years ago

    [link url=http://bioshockpwns.yt mnd.com/
    ]http://bioshockpwns.yt mnd.com/
    [/link]

    lol

  • miiiguel #521 5 years ago

    humm..., 360 vs PC...:
    got scared when my gf said I was developing a hunchback, I quit office-desk gaming ever since... a good few years ago.

    DrunKao: priceless! lol!
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 10:37

  • mattigan #522 5 years ago

    Good Review, Good Demo.

    Hopefully it will get the sales it deserves, I'm certainly going to be purchasing it!

  • kangarootoo #523 5 years ago

    @Wendelius

    "The woman singing over the crib, the man banging at the door and arguing with his wife"

    !!Possible spoilers follow I suppose!! Better safe than sorry.


    They were both great moments. You really got this feeling that they hadn't totally devolved into stock enemies, rather they had just gone a bit mad. They still had much of their humanity, which made their dispatch seem a bit cold.

    I remember creeping up the woman at the pram thinking "I'm sure you are nuts, no good can come of this, but I should probably be sure before I clonk her on the back of the head". Then she flipped out and attacked me, boy did I feel foolish ;)

    I will admit in the other case however, I took the argument as opportunity to creep up and put a bullet in the top of that guy's head. I guess I had learned a cold lesson earlier in the demo... First time around though, I wasn't really listening to the argument (later discovering it was more of an aggressive domestic). When the woman came out and was actually upset at finding her husband dead, it did kind of strike a chord with me. Until then I was just assuming they were crazy people trying to kill each other. Nice subtleties I thought.

  • psychokitten #524 5 years ago

    "Big LOL. I'm not sure if that was intentional abstract subtlety or a typo. "

    I'd like to take credit, but it's a Simpsons joke :)
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 10:49

  • afghan_jones #525 5 years ago

    "When the woman came out and was actually upset at finding her husband dead, it did kind of strike a chord with me."

    I know what you mean. My first go through i walked stright past them witohut listening, it was only this morning when i went back for antoher stab at it that I heard their little barney. Killed the bloke and the woman started screaming his name whilst fighting me. quite unsettling.

    They do still just charge at you in a lunatic manner once theyve identified you though. Id also have liekd to see some more poignant death animations to make them seem less like faceless goons.

  • George-Roper #526 5 years ago

    @zuljin

    "@George Roper
    "Did someone blow the gates to the nearest mental institution and all the paranoids came running to this thread?

    +1 and amen to that!"

    Lol. Coming from the man who said "they" know everything about you..."

    THEY do. The difference is, i'm not here trying to somehow stop that information from getting to THEM. I already accept that it's out there and when the ID cards come in, you'll be in for a very sharp shock if you don't believe your activities can be tracked.

    And just to be clear, this isnt a discussion about anything sinister like credit card details/tracking. This is a fucking *game* activation. Nothing more, nothing less. So 2K know you're playing Bioshock, whoop-de-fucking-do! What exactly can they do with that info? Spam you with mails about the sequel?

  • TonyCocaCola #527 5 years ago

    By the way, you think id card tracking is bad. How many of you have actually read the facebook terms of agreement?

    Get your eyes on this vid man

    [link url=http://www.kontraband.com/show/ show.asp?ID=7342&rtn=search-7342&Keywords=facebook
    ]http://ww w.kontraband.com/show/show.asp?...[/link]

  • kangarootoo #528 5 years ago

    @George Roper

    "I already accept that it's out there and when the ID cards come in, you'll be in for a very sharp shock if you don't believe your activities can be tracked."

    Two distict wires seem to be getting crossed here. No one is denying that lots of information about us is already held. That does not mean one cannot still hold a principal of not giving away information about our activities for free.

    zuldjin didn't say that his activities CAN'T be tracked, he simply said that he objects to freely giving companies information that have no business knowing.

    I'd agree with that. I don't have a nectar card for example, I'd much just perfer cheaper prices at the counter thanks very much. I also totally agree that the suggestion that "the innocent have nothing to fear" is just subversion and distraction. That whole principle assumes that those in possesion of information about said innocents are also byond reproach. And even if they are in most cases, there is still value in the phrase "none of your damn business".

  • zuljin #529 5 years ago

    @George Roper
    "I already accept that it's out there and when the ID cards come in, you'll be in for a very sharp shock if you don't believe your activities can be tracked."

    I don't have an ID card. And by the looks of things I never will. Awful assumption to assume I'm English :)

    And yet again I reiterate - I have no issue with the Bioshock validation.

    EDIT: Thanks for picking the words from my brain
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 11:21

  • mattigan #530 5 years ago

    What's with all the swearing that's started to appear in this surprisingly sensible thread, very uncivilised.

  • kangarootoo #531 5 years ago

    @TonyCocaCola

    Good link.

  • Edward_Gamer #532 5 years ago

    Bioshock is LITERALLY on track to become the Highest Rated Game of All-Time!!!

    And rightfully so!!!

    Ever since the 2006 E3 when Bioshock was shown for the Xbox 360, the games that have been winning ALL of the preview Awards were Gears of War, Mass Effect, and Bioshock.

    When I first played the Xbox 360 demo of Bioshock, I was absolutely AMAZED!!!

    The gameplay, graphics, and atmosphere of the game are PERFECT in the way that they work together to create a FUN and IMPRESSIVE experience!!!

    I DEFINITELY agree with all of these "Perfect," Reviews for Bioshock!

    To answer a person's question, Bioshock is only being released for the Xbox 360 and PC.

    I'm definitely getting the Xbox 360 version, because the Xbox 360 is the Lead Development Platform...and I have already played the demo on Xbox Live, and it is PERFECT!!!

  • kangarootoo #533 5 years ago

    @Edward_Gamer

    Are you a sock?

  • Edward_Gamer #534 5 years ago

    All I can say is TRUST ME, and TRUST THIS REVIEW, and TRUST ALL THE REVIEWS...

    Bioshock for the Xbox 360 is AWESOME!!!

  • Wendelius #535 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo

    "I'm sure you are nuts, no good can come of this, but I should probably be sure before I clonk her on the back of the head"

    Yep. Exact same reaction here. :)

    Wendelius

  • afghan_jones #536 5 years ago

    "I'm sure you are nuts, no good can come of this, but I should probably be sure before I clonk her on the back of the head"

    I liked that she talked to the gun like it was her baby.


    also the one that yells at you for stealing from a corpse.

  • EmiliasHorse #537 5 years ago

    @Edward_Gamer

    Calm down you may explode with excitement before next Friday.

  • AhrimaaN #538 5 years ago

    Well.. it only took a little over 450 posts for the retards to appear from the woodwork.

    I've bought my copy on Steam and am ready to go on the 21st! Take that you limey buggers.

    Looking Glass are my favourite dev company so they deserve my money without question to support games that do good things like this... and yes even still on the pc when everyone else is abandoning it for mmorpgs or rts. Hopefully this sells a bucket load of copies - which unfortunately I have to admit thanks to the 360 it probably will. Later down the track I might even pick it up on my 360 for the points and to play through it on the couch.

    To the poor people that can't afford a good pc/os/xbox/internet. Have fun... you're the ones missing out and pirating isn't going to help your plight of being incable of affording what it takes to be a gamer.

    Luckily I have no uni Wednesday so the whole day is BioShock! wooo.

  • Pac #539 5 years ago

    Did anyone else experience a bug in the demo when respawning.

    My character looked upwards and fired a whole round of machine gun fire at the roof. This left me a bit exposed when I had to face all the spilcers waiting for me outside with no amunition.

    Could be a problem with my pad I suppose - damn scary though.

  • George-Roper #540 5 years ago

    Perhaps I have lost the point of Zuls posts, perhaps not.

    Fundamentally, what's being touted here is that people feel uncomfortable giving detailed information on what they're up to. Which is fine. But you know what? When its a decision thats out of your hands, in so much as 'Like it or lump it' I fail to see why the whining even begins.

    It all comes down to one thing. If you really want to play Bioshock on the PC, you have *NO ALTERNATIVE* but to activate the game. Thats it. Whining about it wont change that fact.

    Im sorry but is it just me who finds it VERY suspicious that someone would go to such lengths as paying for everything with cash, rather than a card, because theyre afraid of being watched? I mean, seriously, what is the reason behind that?

    It's just stupid to try and maintain any attempt to keep anonymous, in this day and age. FFS, you fire up your PC and immediately your ISP knows youre online. You browse to EG and add a post. All logged. You download a demo, your download amount is tracked and logged. Where does it end? Are you even aware that each and every day, youre tracked by dozens and dozens of CCTV cameras? Do you avoid flying because THEY track your passport usage? What next??

    GET. A. GRIP.

  • kangarootoo #541 5 years ago

    @George Roper

    You keep presenting things as if only a binary state exists. Either restrict information held on you to zero (impossible, we all agree) or give in entirely and make no efforts to restrict said info held on you.

    This is simply not the case.

    "Im sorry but is it just me who finds it VERY suspicious that someone would go to such lengths as paying for everything with cash, rather than a card, because theyre afraid of being watched? I mean, seriously, what is the reason behind that? "

    "Do you avoid flying because THEY track your passport usage? What next?? "

    This is sensationalist and does not help you convince anyone (anyone with a mind anyway). If your points are valid they will stand on their own. They won't need shoring up with multiple question marks, upper case letters and strawman examples.

  • George-Roper #542 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo

    "You keep presenting things as if only a binary state exists. Either restrict information held on you to zero (impossible, we all agree) or give in entirely and make no efforts to restrict said info held on you.

    This is simply not the case.

    "Im sorry but is it just me who finds it VERY suspicious that someone would go to such lengths as paying for everything with cash, rather than a card, because theyre afraid of being watched? I mean, seriously, what is the reason behind that? "

    "Do you avoid flying because THEY track your passport usage? What next?? "

    This is sensationalist and does not help you convince anyone (anyone with a mind anyway). If your points are valid they will stand on their own. They won't need shoring up with multiple question marks, upper case letters and strawman examples."

    And yet, interestingly, you don't present any facts as to why any sharing of data is a bad thing and actually adversely affects anyone.

    Ive been using credit cards for the last 15 years, along with making purchases online very regularly. How am I worse off? What precisely has happend to me, in that time, that would want me to now shield everything, anything or none of what I do, to third parties?
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 12:03

  • Azazel #543 5 years ago

    quick-save requirez tru skillz!!!1

  • TonyCocaCola #544 5 years ago

    Nothing wrong with wanting a bit of privacy here and there.

  • Yossarian #545 5 years ago

    Edward Gamer is one of the more transparent marketing messageboard shill dudes I've seen in a while

  • psychokitten #546 5 years ago

    Either he's a shill or a fake (troll) shill:

    http://ww w.eurogamer.net/article_discuss...

  • Hypnopedia #547 5 years ago

    Really hope this gets huges sales, but seeing the latest X360 pissed me off a bit - PGR4 emblazoned on the front cover with an "INSIDE!" list that doesn't even mention Bioshock, inside there's the contents, no mention again, just listed in the reviews, no special attention given to it - move to the reviews section, listed again, but Blue Dragon given the focus and a big picture, then the review......10 / 10 "best 360 game ever, go and buy it" - WTF?!!!

    GRRRRRRRR

  • George-Roper #548 5 years ago

    @WaxBras

    "George a phobia is a FEAR I'm sorry to say I don't fear any queers but there is a saturation of them here and on TV I don't know what they say unlike the majority of the public I got better things to think about than a bunch of fucking mincer's but I guess you cosy up for Teatime with Anthony Cotton FINE SO DOES MALIK so singalong and be happy

    I guess I can read yes! BIOSHOCK IS ONLY A GAME sorry i'm lexicsyd"

    What if King Kong was 'queer', would you fear him?

  • TonyCocaCola #549 5 years ago

    Would you liked to be bum raped by king kong!?

  • ChrisOTR #550 5 years ago

    @TonyCocaCola + kangarootoo...

    Just watched that video about Facebook. Much as I hate the site myself and would never use it, I checked Facebook's terms and conditions and that video deliberately misrepresents them by missing out the final bolded sentence below, which totally changes the meaning of the paragraph:

    "When you post User Content to the Site, you authorize and direct us to make such copies thereof as we deem necessary in order to facilitate the posting and storage of the User Content on the Site. By posting User Content to any part of the Site, you automatically grant, and you represent and warrant that you have the right to grant, to the Company an irrevocable, perpetual, non-exclusive, transferable, fully paid, worldwide license (with the right to sublicense) to use, copy, publicly perform, publicly display, reformat, translate, excerpt (in whole or in part) and distribute such User Content for any purpose on or in connection with the Site or the promotion thereof, to prepare derivative works of, or incorporate into other works, such User Content, and to grant and authorize sublicenses of the foregoing. You may remove your User Content from the Site at any time. If you choose to remove your User Content, the license granted above will automatically expire, however you acknowledge that the Company may retain archived copies of your User Content."
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 12:44

  • afghan_jones #551 5 years ago

    "Would you liked to be bum raped by king kong!?"

    Its only rape if you dont consent.....

  • TonyCocaCola #552 5 years ago

    So if your user content is still on there.... they can "distribute such User Content" Still reads like spammage to me boyo. Even the applications on the site have terms of agreement that say they have to access your personal details.

  • gorf #553 5 years ago

    Thats it, i'm convinced im off to get a 360. Stunning

  • GamesConnoisseur #554 5 years ago

    Holy Shit!!!

    Metacritic have BioShock at 98 out of 100 with 11 reviews in so far!

    It will drop with more (sensible) reviews but a dead cert for the best X360 and would likewise expect a good score for PC version.

    This is the moment that is too rare in gaming, and you are witnessing it now!!

    Edit: dropped one point from 99 to 98 but still too high!
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 12:56

  • GamesConnoisseur #555 5 years ago

    600th!! My first 600th post, yay got achievement score for that!
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 12:55

  • ChrisOTR #556 5 years ago

    @TonyCocaCola:

    Oh, I definitely agree that Facebook et al are very intrusive and dodgy, was just pointing out that the "good guys" who made that video are just as willing to misrepresent things to sell their agenda...

  • kangarootoo #557 5 years ago

    @George Roper

    "And yet, interestingly, you don't present any facts as to why any sharing of data is a bad thing and actually adversely affects anyone."

    Irrelevant, and more diversion.

    Whether I can present evidence that credit card information is a risk to personal freedom has nothing to do with whether avoiding giving out that information in the first place freely is possible by degrees.

    You suggested that attempting to restrict that information in principle is pointless, that it is already out there, so giving up is the only answer. I suggested that there were shades of grey. Whether giving out that information or not puts you at RISK is an entirely different discussion.


    @ChrisOTR

    After watching all of that vid, I did think that the presentation was extremely loaded. Its all just propaganda I guess, and we still have to apply our own judgement.


    @WaxBrazillian

    Jesus christ, were you smacked in the head as a baby? Clearly not nearly hard enough.

    "I got better things to think about than a bunch of fucking mincer's"

    Isn't it strange then that the person who regularly and consistently brought sexuality into the discussion was you?

    It seems that during most of your posts (almost all of them in fact) you clearly DIDN'T have anything better to do than think about homosexuality. Some might even suggest that thinking about gay men is becoming a frequent enough activity for you that it might be described as a hobby.

  • afghan_jones #558 5 years ago

    "Some might even suggest that thinking about gay men is becoming a frequent enough activity for you that it might be described as a hobby. "

    He probably just got confused and misspelled http://www.eurogaymer.net< /a> in his browser.

  • TonyCocaCola #559 5 years ago

    @afghan_jones
    Its only rape if you dont shout 'Surprise!' first

  • Les #560 5 years ago

    @ Edward_Gamer/mike_mgoblue

    Please take your viral marketing ass someplace else. :(

  • George-Roper #561 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo

    Let me wind this right back, because it's gone off track a little.

    This discussion came about because someone stated that they would refuse to register Bioshock online, clearly reluctant to want to share whatever information comes about from registering a computer game.

    /sigh

    Then someone else came in and started spouting off about how they don't even use credit cards or certain airlines, because of what information gets stored about such actions.

    /puts tinfoil hat on

    Whilst not in the same league, the two share common aspects that cover the concepts of tracking individuals actions. Arguing against registering Bioshock online is so fucking pointless, based on what information you're going to be handing over (hey look, im playing a computer game!), that you have to honestly wonder what mindet these people are actually in.

    The degrees of information sharing, the grey areas as you put it, are dictated on a situational basis. You want to play Bioshock on the PC? Buy it and register it online or don't. There is no grey area, unless you illegally download a cracked version or somehow try to bypass the online registration.

    You want to book a flight using a cheap online site that has an amazing deal but that only accepts payment by credit/debit card? Go ahead and put your card details in or don't. There is no grey area.

    Want to travel to the US? Get your passport out or don't. There is no grey area.

    I understand what you're saying but the majority of the time, there is no choice in these matters. Well, there is a choice. Don't participate and miss out on one of the gaming stunners of 2007.

  • afghan_jones #562 5 years ago

    @TonyCocaCola

    Well, unfortunately for you, I doubt that is going to hold up in a court of Law.

  • TonyCocaCola #563 5 years ago

    @afghan_jones
    Of course, you'd definatly get caught if you tried it in court. Your better off doing it in a park at night!

  • zuljin #564 5 years ago

    @George Roper
    "But you know what? When its a decision thats out of your hands, in so much as 'Like it or lump it' I fail to see why the whining even begins."

    Thats true enough, but I really do think people have more power than they think (or rather give information out too readily). Ultimately it is a simple case of: should my principles hold me back from enjoying a service.

    For Bioshock I think the info needed for activation is something I happily divulge. Reason I mentioned the HSBC thing was that they phoned me up at one point because my spending habits were "unusual". That kinda worried me. Hence why I go to greater lengths to avoid revealing stuff to them. The reason I even mentioned credit cards is because ultimately everyone has stuff to hide. You don't have a life if you don't. And also everyone differs in how much they like to reveal about themselves.

    And why are people worried about Facebook? They have your email address (which could just be a Hotmail account). Anything else you add is purely optional.
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 14:38

  • Monkey-Wizard-Ken #565 5 years ago

    Forum madness :)
    Played the demo and loved it
    I'll be buying this one.
    If you claim to like games, then you need this game

  • kangarootoo #566 5 years ago

    @George Roper

    zuldjin said he was fine with the Bioshock registration. He made a general point. I then jumped in with my size 9s.

    Anyway, lets let it slide. Bating WB is much more fun.

  • Amazing Bryan #567 5 years ago

    Wow! Most comments ever. I so knew this was going to be a 10 without even knowing that much about the game apart from videos. That and System Shock being an incredible game.

    So glad I don't have to upgrade my PC to play this and can get it for the 360.

  • jonnyreb #568 5 years ago

    I loved the demo, but to be honest I was hoping for something a bit more 'Deus EX IW' and a bit less 'Quake 4'.

    I'll buy it and play it for what it is though.

  • polymorph #569 5 years ago

    Hey, probably well to late but i want to play system shock 2, that underdogs thing some1 posted a couple of days ago i can never get to work, tried a few months ago as well. any1 got a good site or torrent to grab it from. i have downloaded the demo, but i want the choice of armed service!

  • polymorph #570 5 years ago

    @jonnyreb, it is more deus ex than invisible war.

  • jonnyreb #571 5 years ago

    @polymorph

    I hoped as much - the short demo seemed to be alot of running and gunning.

    I'll reserve judgement until it arrives next week :)

  • polymorph #572 5 years ago

    @jonnyreb,
    I did not run and gun when i played the demo.
    Use the plasmids, play around with them. ie set some1 on fire wait till hey dive into some water then use your lighning in the water!!

  • rhinoxious #573 5 years ago

    I donlt think I've ever seen such an amazing selection of gushing quotes from reviewers. It's certainly the kind of game that the critics like:

    [link url=http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/xbox360/bios hock
    ]http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...[/link]

  • polymorph #574 5 years ago

    @rhinoxious,
    Yeah it does seem like no1 can argue with a absolute quality game!
    Lets hope lazy developers take note, and this sells "shitloads"

  • polymorph #575 5 years ago

    Wheres dizzy? has he played the demo yet?

  • DocTep #576 5 years ago

    Yay! It's apparently as good as I'd been hoping!

    Yay! My Collector's Edition is being processed!

    ARGH! Why did my 360 choose this particular moment to ring-of-death on me? Dying an hour into The Darkness was bad enough, but now not getting to play BioShock asap... :-(

  • George-Roper #577 5 years ago

    @DocTep

    "Yay! It's apparently as good as I'd been hoping!

    Yay! My Collector's Edition is being processed!

    ARGH! Why did my 360 choose this particular moment to ring-of-death on me? Dying an hour into The Darkness was bad enough, but now not getting to play BioShock asap... :-("

    BWUAHAHAHAHAHA!

    So if your 360 is busted why is your Collectors Edition still being processed instead of being cancelled?

    I smell troll scat....

  • polymorph #578 5 years ago

    @ George Roper,
    Well i would not cancel mine.
    You sound like the troll!!

  • George-Roper #579 5 years ago

    @polymorph

    "@ George Roper,
    Well i would not cancel mine.
    You sound like the troll!!"

    Hey, look, if you get your kicks out of *looking* at game discs rather than y'know, putting the discs into consoles and *playing* games, then all power to ya!

    Wierdo.

    PS, Trolls are much easier to smell than they are to hear. Bilbo told me.

  • SniperWolf #580 5 years ago

    I don't see how a game with no Blu-ray can score 10/10. Without Blu-ray this is just another game, it needed Blu-ray to truly be next gen. Oh well maybe Bioshock 2 will have the Blu-ray and score something like 11/10

  • polymorph #581 5 years ago

    @George Roper , "Hey, look, if you get your kicks out of *looking* at game discs rather than y'know, putting the discs into consoles and *playing* games, then all power to ya!"

    Right?!! what the fuck is that?
    Did you even read my post??


    My point is i would not cancl my order cause my xbox fucked up!!
    I would still buy the game and then wait till my box had been fixed.
    nob.
    Edited by 1 at 17/08/07 @ 18:38

  • George-Roper #582 5 years ago

    @polymorph

    "@George Roper , "Hey, look, if you get your kicks out of *looking* at game discs rather than y'know, putting the discs into consoles and *playing* games, then all power to ya!"

    Right?!! what the fuck is that?
    Did you even read my post??


    My point is i would not cancl my order cause my xbox fucked up!!
    I would still buy the game and then wait till my box had been fixed.
    nob."

    Oh, sorry, I see now.

    See that you're a numpty for...

    A) Not cancelling your order and waiting for a fixed console, by which time said game may have come down in price (like any logical person would)

    and

    B) For using the word 'nob'

    Nob

  • jonnyreb #583 5 years ago

    "I don't see how a game with no Blu-ray can score 10/10"

    Joke post?

  • polymorph #584 5 years ago

    @George Roper,
    You see this is why YOU are a massive fucking bellend, i was quoting some1 else.
    I will be buying this the day its released. I will also love it.
    You will not, your loss NOB!!

  • polymorph #585 5 years ago

    @biker_bob,
    Im no troll.
    I own all current gen consoles.

  • George-Roper #586 5 years ago

    @biker_bob

    "@Jonnyreb: No, just to prove that George can't smell Trolls..."

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

  • George-Roper #587 5 years ago

    @polymorph

    "You see this is why YOU are a massive fucking bellend, i was quoting some1 else.
    I will be buying this the day its released. I will also love it.
    You will not, your loss NOB!!"

    I will not what? Eh?

    The last time I heard the words 'nob' and 'bellend' were over 20 years ago, at school. Sorry, scratch that, some ratty looking chav was talking like that outside the Co-Op last night. Was that you, poly?

  • polymorph #588 5 years ago

    just click my name,
    i dont give a shit what console its on, ill play it.

  • PlugMonkey #589 5 years ago

    Why would you cancel your order just because your Xbox is getting fixed? You are getting it back, right?

    First you have to go to the effort of cancelling the order. Then you have to go to the effort of re-placing your order for when you get your Xbox back. You've even got to go to the extra, added effort of ensuring that your 2nd order arrives in time for your Xbox returning so you don't lose any play time. Or you could just do nothing, let the game arrive, let your Xbox return and get on with life. Why over complicate it? Because the price might come down a few pence?

    I count two, and arguably even three, lots of wasted effort involved there. Each one of which is even greater than the effort I've wasted on writing this post. And frankly, even that was too much wasted effort for my liking.

    By the way, EG: What is the longest ever comments thread?

  • polymorph #590 5 years ago

    Not me, I live in a respectable area.

  • polymorph #591 5 years ago

    @PlugMonkey,

    Spot on.

  • George-Roper #592 5 years ago

    @PlugMonkey

    "First you have to go to the effort of cancelling the order. Then you have to go to the effort of re-placing your order for when you get your Xbox back. You've even got to go to the extra, added effort of ensuring that your 2nd order arrives in time for your Xbox returning so you don't lose any play time. Or you could just do nothing, let the game arrive, let your Xbox return and get on with life. Why over complicate it? Because the price might come down a few pence?

    I count two, and arguably even three, lots of wasted effort involved there. Each one of which is even greater than the effort I've wasted on writing this post. And frankly, even that was too much wasted effort for my liking"

    You throw words like 'waste' and 'effort' around quite a lot there, for what amounts to clicking a favourites link and clicking the mouse once or twice.

    Lazy. Bastard.

    No offence, though =P



    @polymorph

    "Not me, I live in a respectable area."

    /applause

    Credit where it's due, you got me =)

  • polymorph #593 5 years ago

    Im done, just agree with each other, and ill enjoy lurking.

  • Polymath #594 5 years ago

    Hey --
    Are any of you on Facebook, speaking of which?

  • polymorph #595 5 years ago

    "Not me, I live in a respectable area."

    I realise that makes me look like quallity twat. Thats not how i typed it(well it is) but not how i meant it.

  • GamesConnoisseur #596 5 years ago

    SniperWolf: You failed to bait us with comment re BluRay version of BioShock would get 11 out of 10!

    Ohh, too late I am now struggling with the hook as having been so baited to give my answer!

    Simple answer will be thus, Yeah according to your private logic, Mobile Suit Gundam with Metacritic score of 34 and it being on Bluray have increased its worth and in actuality it is only worth 24 out of 100 if released on DVD?!

    Noo, the same argument would be that the possibly due to the memory setup of PS3 and therefore likely that the textures would have to be limited and with some lightening effects changed, if released on PS3 no matter what optical disk it came on? (look at some multi-platform titles except for Oblivion)

    However I would hope it ll be released on PS3 so that such classic title would not be missed out by non-ninja PC and X360 owners.

  • polymorph #597 5 years ago

    However I would hope it ll be released on PS3 so that such classic title would not be missed out by non-ninja PC and X360 owners.


    AMEN.

  • jetsetdemo #598 5 years ago

    Well, I’ve played the demo through 3 times now, and it’s not very often I can say such a thing about games these day’s. This I feel is going to give you that special feeling inside from the moment you start playing it. It’s tragic that more games don’t get you to that level, remember the first time you looked at J.C. Denton in the mirror and thought how cool am I or the ride in to Black Mesa listening to the blurb on the intercom and marvelling at the proposition that you could move your head and see a world living outside the windows of the monorail car. I have a terrible affliction, I always go and buy a new console on the day of release and so I guess I don’t really have a particular allegiance to hardware manufactures but I am defiantly addicted to games. So far I have been cursing my sickness as I feel that of the £425 I spent on my PS3 I haven’t got any where near a hundred quid’s worth of value from it. I had been feeling the same way about the 360 this year until Forza2 came along and made me go all Grand Turisimo again. Now with Bioshock coming along I am begining to think it’s pointless buying consoles any time during the first 6 months of there release. Still I will probably never learn, release date on the 360 Elite anyone?

  • CHAZBIGPOTATO #599 5 years ago

    Wow, a lot of comments and hardly any retardedness (relatively speaking).

    Well done consensus!

  • gmmonkey #600 5 years ago

    Nerd fight! Nerd fight!

  • VMerken #601 5 years ago

    (Better late than never)

    Don't need no demo, they already had me at System Shock :)

    Already anxious to find out how crowded my regular store will get on the 24th - whatever's the turnout, I'll be there to pick up a PC copy and go wild.

  • the_sas_man #602 5 years ago

    I pre-ordered the Collectors edition (with Bid Daddy) from Game at 00:48 in the morning and it was accepted no problem. A few hours later (around 10am Saturday) it got taken off line and is sold out!?

    Did I get lucky or you guys think I have missed out and the order only accpeted because the site wasn't updated late at night? Is it real time order tracking? So hope I got it!

  • WickedDeeJ #603 5 years ago

    Collector's Edition order is being processed, should have it Friday morning, yipee.

    With regards to the activation scheme on the PC version, that's a very thin line the publisher's walking there. I can to some degree understand that they wish to be seen doing *something* to combat piracy, but in the end measures such as these end up hurting the consumer who paid good money for the product.

    EA's Battlefield 2142 was so laced with "copy-protection measures" that my friend never managed to get it running, because the game apparently didn't like his DVD drive. Comparatively, he could go on the Internet, download a version of the game that didn't have that protection, install and run it perfectly fine, with his own CD-key.

    If these measures make buying legal games a hassle for consumers, consumers will start to look elsewhere, and the simple fact is that no matter what the publishers do, there's usually a crack for pretty much every scheme they come up with available within a week or two of a game's release.

  • samadriel #604 5 years ago

    "The realisation that single player experiences are the way forward to overjoy the modern day gamer.
    Not multiplayer.
    Unless of course IDSoftware don't do something incredibly stupid. "

    At first I thought Xiphos was just an acid-casualty fruitcake, but some of what he says... I dunno man, it ain't all bullshit...

  • Errol #605 5 years ago

    Will this run on a x1950xt?

  • captainrentboy #606 5 years ago

    ''The settings are cool and all, but im like halfway trough the game and nothing even happend, its very repettivive, same retarted enemies over and over, then those big daddys, killed like 8 of em but the fun went down allready after beating them 3 times. I thought there were gonna be some more original cretures. And im sure it will be the same till the end. Its still good to go trough it one time, but scores are way too hig. Its more like 7.5. Nothing more, noting less. They could have done so much more with these settings, more creatures, breathtaking cutscenes, but it lacks it all, it doesnt have a real story either. Its more like collect 10 stuff of these, 5 of that before proceeding to next part of area. ''

    Hmmm, who to trust, who to trust? The 15 or so fairly decent/trusted websites and magazines who have absolutely raved about this game in their reviews. Ooooor, some demented fucker from the Xbox forums who can barely string a coherent sentance together.
    ''It's more like collect 10 stuff of these'' indeed. :)
    No, my anticipation for this game is still pretty darned high, and that maniac's view of the game hasn't dampened my need to play it one bit.

  • George-Roper #607 5 years ago

    @lavalant

    "The settings are cool and all, but im like halfway trough the game and nothing even happend, its very repettivive, same retarted enemies over and over, then those big daddys, killed like 8 of em but the fun went down allready after beating them 3 times. I thought there were gonna be some more original cretures. And im sure it will be the same till the end. Its still good to go trough it one time, but scores are way too hig. Its more like 7.5. Nothing more, noting less. They could have done so much more with these settings, more creatures, breathtaking cutscenes, but it lacks it all, it doesnt have a real story either. Its more like collect 10 stuff of these, 5 of that before proceeding to next part of area"

    Hmmm, I hope this is just some disgruntled pirate trolling the boards. Although, as per my first comment on this thread, was surprised that the reviewer didn't really tell us anything beyond the demo content...

    /paranoid thoughts rising

  • WickedDeeJ #608 5 years ago

    Ever since Knights of the Old Republic 2, I take reviews with a very large grain of salt. That being said, the demo of Bioshock is promising, and I wish to see more of the game.

  • jachap #609 5 years ago

    This has probably been said already in the landslide of comments but I'd just like to praise the excellent usage of italicised stresses in that review.

    However, I would have appreciated some passing mention on how scary it is. I mean, it might be the closest gaming has ever come to art but if its utterly terrifyingly jump-out-of-your-skin frightening I'm far too much of a pussy to buy it.

  • captainrentboy #610 5 years ago

    From what I can understand, the game's more eerie than shit your pants frightening. The demo was quite chilling, and built up an unsetttling atmosphere quite well.

  • RichGL #611 5 years ago

    Bethesda were quite open about the fact that they had to scale back the radient AI in Oblivion. It was effectively game breaking because all hell could break loose with NPCs effectively rioting.

    I agree though, it was a 9 in my opinion.

    SS2 was more eerie than scary, apart from the first time I opened a locker and those bee things came out. I nearly crapped myself then ok.

  • RichGL #612 5 years ago

    Bethesda were quite open about the fact that they had to scale back the radient AI in Oblivion. It was effectively game breaking because all hell could break loose with NPCs effectively rioting.

    I agree though, it was a 9 in my opinion.

    SS2 was more eerie than scary, apart from the first time I opened a locker and those bee things came out. I nearly crapped myself then ok.

  • Calgon #613 5 years ago

    Thats it I no longer consider myself a fanboy, because Ive never been as petty as - joining threads and dismissing a game because its being received well on platform you dont like because of fanboyism. It would be like bashing RE4 simply because it was Cube game("bah overated paid for reviews and hype, seen some post of people that played it and didnt think it was *all that* so yeah Im not bothered honest... I'll find a site that bashes all games released I dont *get* or wont buy because its on *that* console";).
    Edited by 3 at 18/08/07 @ 19:11

  • fluff_the_tiger #614 5 years ago

    My favourite review:

    [link url=http://www.sony defenseforce.com/?p=83
    ]http://www.sony defenseforce.com/?p=83
    [/link]


    lol

  • foamy #615 5 years ago

    lol wtf.

  • Cunningmouse64 #616 5 years ago

    CM64: Bioshock is receiving universal acclaim from gamers and press, both online and print. They're calling it one of the defining gaming experiences of this generation and perhaps ever. There's never been anything like it. Are you going to get a 360 for this game? I think it would be worth it along with all the other great titles coming later this fall.

    Sonyfan: It's not a 360 exclusive it's coming to the PC too.

    CM64: That's true. Do you have PC powerful enough to run Bioshock in all of it's glory?

    Sonyfan: No.

    SDF illuminati: Upgrade your PC! Don't give your money to M$. Better yet, throw away your current computer and wait till Bioshock is ported to Linux.

    CM64: So what are you going to do, buy a 360 or spend almost twice the amount to get your PC up to specs?

    Sonyfan: God I don't know what to do. I despise the 360 so much for not being a Sony platform, but I don't have the money to upgrade my VAIO. Buying a 360 would also go against all of my morals and principles.

    CM64: I know saving money is a hard decision. You have a cause and all. I say follow your heart.

    Sonyfan: You know, I think you're right. Thanks for the advice.

    CM64: No problem.

  • sajtion #617 5 years ago

    no game should deserve 10 out of 10 score. this reviewer should be sacked imediatelly

  • HighDef #618 5 years ago

    Personally I don't care what Reviews say. I've played the DEMO via Xbox LIVE and therefore know it's gonna be a fantastic game.
    But your right, neither words or pictures do this game justice.

  • DjFlex52 #619 5 years ago

    "no game should deserve 10 out of 10 score. this reviewer should be sacked imediatelly"

    @sajtion

    what a dumb statement...and I thought a game reviewer could score as he sees fit...just as you have the right to disagree.

    you should be ignored immediately

  • Batman2100 #620 5 years ago

    A quick coment on the whole internet activation thing. I have no worries, a 360, a fairly decent PC rig and no problem clicking a button, but my cousin lives in the middle of nowhere, deep in the wilderness that is Holland. And I really do mean that, the nearest town is about 25 miles away. She's an avid gamer, has a ridiculously high end machine (I mean seriously, it's crazy-daft-powerful, i can't imagine anyone EVER needing that much go-go juice in their PC).

    However, she doesn't have a phone line. The cost of getting one installed is astronomical. Unfortunately, does this therefore mean she can't play (and i quote from a previous comment) "one of the best games of all time" on her PC???

    Obviously I'm aware she can buy a 360 for much, much less than the installation cost of the line, and in actual fact she already has one, but HYPOTHETICALLY it does seem a tad unfair on her.

    Before I press the lovely brain-speaky button i just wanna make sure y'all know i'm not whinging or anything (dont wanna get flamed!), i'm just curious...

    EDIT* Finished reading the thread and realised i may restart an old arguement by leaving this post here, but 1) i'd really quite like just a yes or no answer so i'm not deleting it and 2) hey, reading arguements is fun. Sorry!
    Edited by 1 at 19/08/07 @ 07:42

  • Verwandlung #621 5 years ago

    http://ww w.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/art...

  • blicko #622 5 years ago

    From the review.

    "it's no exaggeration to report that not only does BioShock boast the most staggeringly beautiful environments you've ever lain eyes on in a videogame, but adds infinite depth to them"

    Infinite depth? No exaggeration? Well, I guess I'll just have to check it out then.

  • mattigan #623 5 years ago

    @Batman2100

    I assume that she has a fairly recent mobile phone and that going by the spec of her machine, it would support bluetooth if this is the case she can use her mobile phone as a modem to dial out and authorise the game, a bit slow, but it would get the job done.

    Just a thought.

  • Katsumoto #624 5 years ago

    I don't think saying that upgrading a PC is more expensive than buying a 360 is really a valid reason to have a go at Sony fanboizyzzyzyz. Cuz... Bioshock isn't the only game coming out this year that will need an amazing pc. Crysis anyone?

  • Rusta #625 5 years ago

    Played this for 2 hours last night, it is probably the best game I've played visualy, and the playability keeps you hooked also. Without a doubt I've got it pre-ordered, if you have a 360 and enjoy games it's a must have, period. Forget people finding faults, no game is perfect but it sure does feel worth the money. Played it on a 7ft HD projector aswell, great game.

  • Haloboy #626 5 years ago

    A friend on msn linked me to the site below. Check out the god awesome art created completely using paint man!

    [link url=http://forum.preys-world.c om/viewtopic.php?t=14835&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=1155
    ]http://fo rum.preys-world.com/viewtopic.p...[/link]

    That is fantastic. Oh and come on friday!

  • siro #627 5 years ago

    I used to take eurogamers reviews seriously but when I buy this and it turns out to be a 7.5/10 or 8/10 I'll be looking to another site for reviews which I respect.

    You won't find a single site which gives BioShock a 7.5 tho.

    With all the hype stirred up, this one could finally break the rave reviews to shitty sales "tradition" of its spiritual predecessors SS and SS2.
    Edited by 1 at 19/08/07 @ 13:25

  • AlexiusYindor #628 5 years ago

    I...CanNoT WAit ANYmoRe!!11!1oneoneone

  • Socrates #629 5 years ago

    @lavalant , I agree with the repetitiveness of this game. Killing Big daddies is like closing all of the Gates of Oblivion.
    It is a really good game, but after killing a few Big daddies it gets really tiresome to hear the sound of another Big daddy approaching. Missed change there, could have been so much more interesting if there was more diversity in the opponents.
    Edited by 1 at 19/08/07 @ 15:53

  • ChocNut #630 5 years ago

    I was interested in aspects of bioshock but the more I see of it the more I realise I won't actually enjoy the game.

    I've played the demo, I love the graphics style, and I like FPSs but beating little girls (even nasty ones) to death with a wrench aint my cuppa cocoa.

    Can someone explain why they go to all the artsy effort and then ruin it by having you beat up women and children? Why couldn't they make it all monsters/robots/hovercopter thingies/big Daddys?

    I was tempted after playing parts of the demo to get this game but then I left the game on the startscreen and it loaded up the images of you pulling a little girl (she didnt even look demonic like the ones you usually see) out of a pipe where she was hiding. You tear her out and she tries to hide and protect herself with her hands and you see the wrench on screen tapping into the other palm of the player.

    That was when I turned off my 360 and said "I don't think so" to myself.

  • PlugMonkey #631 5 years ago

    ChocNut - I think you may have missed the point. The moral dilemma you're experiencing is intended. If you don't want to kill the little girls, I think the basic idea is that you choose not to.

  • floppylobster #632 5 years ago

    Holy shit my heart's stopped beating. I've only played the demo and seen the demo video but I don't like it at all. If it's cinematic, then it's cinematic in a shitty-teen-blockbuster-Hollywood kinda way. What's up with giant squid that happens to float in front of the camera? Why are so many fish that deep swimming around clean structures that offer no food? What the fuck is a whale doing swimming down the middle of two buildings? Most people won't care about this shit but where's the deep-sea research? It's been tossed out in favour of impressing the gamer. But if the gamer's not impressed then it takes them right out of the game.

    This whole game relies on the illusion of immersion. But seriously damages that goal by putting the player at the centre of everything happening on screen. You suddenly realise your being manipulated in convenient and contrived ways. You feel like your 'choices' are being made because you have to, not because you want to. And the choices I really wanted to make were simply not allowed. I wished they had learned from Infinity Ward how to immerse a player - by NOT making him the centre of the universe.


    Anyway, disagree with me all you want, I'm not buying the game. I post this only so that anyone else out there who thinks the emperor has no clothes doesn't think they're going nuts. 8/10 is more realistic (but for me personally 6/10 - 5 being average and an extra point for the nice graphics).
    Edited by 1 at 19/08/07 @ 16:27

  • BremXJones #633 5 years ago

    So... you're not going to buy Bioshock because the demo had a whale in it. Right.

    Just finished it. I'll second Kristan said. The Irrational girls and boys' done good.

    KG

  • Monkey-Wizard-Ken #634 5 years ago

    @floppylobster
    You must be silenced, you silly fool!

  • Rusta #635 5 years ago

    @floppylobster - you are a strange boy indeed - if this game is rubbish then what is a good game.

    Only a fool would miss this if you own a 360 - then again it's probably the one's without a 360 putting it down.

    Good game period that's well worth the purchase and time spent playing it - who cares if it's 8,9 or 10

  • DjFlex52 #636 5 years ago

    @floppylobster

    The most pathetic argument yet and this thread is long.

    I've read more than a few arguments (ahem..Chocnut) just as flimsy and pathetic in this thread. Some people are determined to hate this game and ANY reason will do.
    They can keep playing Mario Party 8, Vampire Rain and Go! Puzzle for all I care

    edit: hey floppylobster...I guess you questioned how come you didn't see Luke and his father change the batteries in their light sabers too.



    Edited by 1 at 19/08/07 @ 17:42

  • GamesConnoisseur #637 5 years ago

    Some rare brave people will not buy the game, same people will not agree with the brainless conforming mass who seem to behave as a lemming blindly falling off the cliff in praising the game and throwing their money after the game.

    I must applause those people for taking the courage to stand up and be different! They managed to tear aside the blind hype and have rare ability to see the truth.

    Joking aside...

    Certainly, there can be too much hype that it get so sickening, that is the danger for BioShock. After playing the demo few times, I can see the faults BUT I judge this game on its own merit and will be very glad to immerse myself in the full game for a while. This game is important and will have influences by raising the bar yet further.

    Those who will not get it, that is their choice, afterall FPS is not to everyone taste such as wrestling games is not mine!

    So many comments is interesting as an indication of the level of interest that the game raised in jaded gamers and otherwise.

  • DjFlex52 #638 5 years ago

    "Those who will not get it, that is their choice, afterall FPS is not to everyone taste such as wrestling games is not mine! "

    Agreed, but I don't go to the wrestling forums and say Raw sucks cause I don't like wrestling games.

  • mattigan #639 5 years ago

    I'm sure that there are plenty who do, I certainly would if I stumbled across a Wrestling game forum thread.

  • DrunKao #640 5 years ago

    ChocNut, you should at least know what the hell you're talking about before you start complaining about an aspect of the game that doesn't even exist. You are not suppose to attack the Little Sisters and even if you do you won't inflict damage upon them. They're practicly invincible. The game doesn't show you murder them either. You can either choose to harvest their adam or save them. If you want to be so moral, you should play the game just so you can save all the Little Sisters. The game doesn't show the harvest anyway. The screen goes black and you hear sounds implying that you killed them. But the choice is yours and yours alone.

  • DUFFKING #641 5 years ago

    @floppylobster

    It's stupid isn't it? I mean, there's EVEN A CITY UNDER THE FUCKING SEA! RIDICULOUS!

  • Calgon #642 5 years ago

    I'm sure that there are plenty who do, I certainly would if I stumbled across a Wrestling game forum thread.

    lol Nice, wasnt expecting that one. :) but it is annoying, perhaps if mods were able to delete their whiney posts --that no one wants to read-- theyd find something they are interested in to post on instead.
    Edited by 1 at 20/08/07 @ 00:13

  • GamesConnoisseur #643 5 years ago

    As annoying as it may seem to be, I find that I prefer EG forum far more than US game magazine forums, seem so dominated by teenagers and flaming wars.

    Too heavy on fanboyisms, at least we get more of a debate and occasional trolling compared to majority out there.

    Approaching 700th? Who ll get it?

  • quantumsheep #644 5 years ago

    700 \o/

  • DrunKao #645 5 years ago

    omgwtf

  • Stoatboy #646 5 years ago

    FloppyLobster's clearly insane. Not immersive? It's set under the fucking sea, how much more immersed do you want to be? You'll be claiming that it hasn't got any depth next...

  • mattigan #647 5 years ago

    "lol Nice, wasnt expecting that one. :) but it is annoying, perhaps if mods were able to delete their whiney posts --that no one wants to read-- theyd find something they are interested in to post on instead."

    Unfortunately, it seem that they are interested in trolling.

    On another note 700+ must be a record for a Eurogamer review thread?

  • Yossarian #648 5 years ago

    Gears of War thread says hello

  • psychokitten #649 5 years ago

    Gamespot are putting up their review today, if anyone's interested. Think it's one of the only big ones left to post their review (and then there's Edge).
    Edited by 1 at 20/08/07 @ 10:46

  • DjFlex52 #650 5 years ago

    Gears of War review only had 234 posts

  • psychokitten #651 5 years ago

    That's the multiplayer review. The single player review had 778 comments. So really you could combine those two figures.

  • krudster #652 5 years ago

    This was the single player review - 778 comments was the record.

    Edit: beat me to it!
    Edited by 2 at 20/08/07 @ 12:17

  • the_sas_man #653 5 years ago

    We need to beat that recprd! Hmmm...lets get fanboys wound up:

    The PS3 is still by far the bestest, sexiest console I have ever seen. Bioshock is over rated, and above all...its UNREALISTIC!

    Fucking whales and octopuses in a city. OMGWTF!

  • Demiath #654 5 years ago

    Hmm...the obviously brilliant idea of challenging the fanboys aside, another way of beating that EG comment record would be to discuss the stereotypical, socially constructed gender relations characterizing the "Big Daddies" and the "Little Sisters" in the game. As any respectably postmodern social science establishment figure would tell you, the notion of powerful Big Daddies (who's drill-like weapons have obvious phallocentric connotations) protecting virtually defenseless Little Sisters is a clear example of both sexism and microfascism. Thus, what follows naturally from these self-evident facts (which only repulsive and conservative naive realists would deny) is that the implicit ideological message being communicated through a disgustingly commercialized product such as "BioShock" is the necessity to preserve an oppressive capitalist New World Order and defend male supremacy from the threat posed by any radical, emancipatory struggle.

    ...on second thought, let's focus exclusiely on infuriating the fanboys... ;)

  • afghan_jones #655 5 years ago

    @Demiath

    Ah, but is it really promoting a male dominated society? I think not. In the game, it is the little sisters who ultimately control the Big Daddys not the other way around. Also note the Little Sister's role as the ultimate consumer, devouring the very essence of her victims.

    In fact, surely this is the most potent imagery of the game. The central ideas and themes of a world created by man fallen into ruin, yet within that world, it is a female presence which exercises control over the most powerful males of that world. At the same time, these powerful males are simply used as a means to allow the females to prey upon those around them and take their life.

    Also, While the Big Daddy's 'phallus' is used as a weapon in what could be seen a honorable combat, up front and open, the Little Sister has her own phallus in the form of he syringe which she uses far more deviously by scavenging life force form her victims.

  • mattigan #656 5 years ago

    O_o.......Yeah.....what he said! +1
    Edited by 1 at 20/08/07 @ 13:04

  • Azazel #657 5 years ago

    /slaps afghan_jones and Demiath about a bit with a generic IRC insult

    I didn't know KG was lending out his wank-hat these days :)

  • GamesConnoisseur #658 5 years ago

    Sing for joy! Cos that bastard flash advert of jumping frizzy haired grandpa with guitar is now replaced with artistic BioShock advert.

    Seem that this posts is running out of steam and not on track to beat GoW score of 778.


  • GamesConnoisseur #659 5 years ago

    However doing my bit

    Metacritic score now stands at 99 out of 100 from 12 reviews in, was expecting it to do down and believe it would likely end up with 96 at least.

    [link url=http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/xbox360/bios hock
    ]http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...[/link]

  • floppylobster #660 5 years ago

    Hey, I didn't say it sucked, I said it I'd give it 6 out of 10. Upon reflection I should have added another point for good sound design. So 7 out of 10. And no, the whale won't stop me buying it, it was just one of many things that bugged me about the game. The whole thing just doesn't gel to create a believable world. I apologise to all I offended. Perhaps I am too old to immerse myself in this type of fantasy anymore. I even offered an 8 out of 10, but no, you all seem to want 10 out of 10. Well then label this perfect if that's what you want. This game has apparently obtained perfection, look no further, games don't get better than this. I'm still not buying it though.

  • Les #661 5 years ago

    “you all seem to want 10 out of 10. Well then label this perfect if that's what you want. This game has apparently obtained perfection, look no further, games don't get better than this. I'm still not buying it though.”

    10/10 doesn’t mean perfection, it just means very, very good from the POV of the reviewer. Personally, I don’t care about scores, it’s all about the words. I’d love to have reviews without the silly scores. Would definitely reduce the number of pointless discussions around here… ;)

  • floppylobster #662 5 years ago

    I fully admit to some insanity here. I'm clearly not seeing what everyone else is seeing. But Stoatboy made me laugh so now I'll go away.

  • rhinoxious #663 5 years ago

    Agreed, if 10/10 meant perfection then it would never be given and it would be pointless to have a mark that high.

    10/10 should be a mark reserved only for the best games of any particular console generation. If you write games reviews as buying advice then you should be giving the odd ten out of ten, as those are the best games that people can buy.

  • ChromeMud #664 5 years ago

    The 360 demo is absolute quality.
    The Art Deco style and the music of that time just sucks you in.An under water Brave New World that's eerie,disturbing, intelligent and loads of FUN!

    10/10 for a pure single player experience that completely overwhelms you with it's atmospere.

  • Demiath #665 5 years ago

    afghan_jones: Thank you! You have freed me from my false consciousness, which reflected a narrow positivist discourse of 'objective truth'. Now I can finally recognize the politically subversive potential of mad, prepubescent girls and dirty syringes. Armed with this consciousness-raising knowledge, I'll head off and found the Revolutionary Vanguard Party of Rapture! ;)

  • Azazel #666 5 years ago

    I know one thing... and that is that the Sony Defenders review is the one of the best I've ever had the pleasure to read.

  • MrE26 #667 5 years ago

    Never played any of the SS games, and Bioshock didn't particularly grab my attention until i played the demo. It's just astonishing. The art deco style, the music, the underwater setting and the best visuals i've seen in a game yet combine to create an amazing and truly immersive atmosphere. Nice to hear that the game behind it is worthy of this amazing world the developers have created. Can't fucking wait for this one now!

  • afghan_jones #668 5 years ago

    @ Demiath

    Lets not forget that rapture itself comprises a large phallic tower, thrusting skyward, coupled with an underwater womb-like retreat, neatly encapsulating the overt sexuality of both genders in a single setting.

    The central mechanic of the game even revolves around the injection of fluids into oneself to cause growth of new life and power from within.

  • GamesConnoisseur #669 5 years ago

    I know that Kristan in reviewing the game clearly says that there is a lot to deconstruct and indeed the message boards will be alive fo a long time after the game got released and gone into history.

    I wonder at the state of mind of some gamers, whether they are actually applying meta-consciousness-busting thingy whilst playing the game? Would we get too immersed for our own good? Would this game be potentially dangerous in not merely changing the fabric of a pretend society in Rapture, but be responsible for changing the society as we know it by starting with the unwitting and foolish gamers?
    Edited by 1 at 20/08/07 @ 16:15

  • Demiath #670 5 years ago

    GamesConnoisseur: Relax! Let go of your rigidly dichotomical concepts of sanity/insanity! Break through the illusory confines of the atomistic Self! Lose yourself in the endless, free play of signifiers! S-L-I-D-E!

  • DjFlex52 #671 5 years ago

    I wonder at the state of mind of some gamers, whether they are actually applying meta-consciousness-busting thingy whilst playing the game? Would we get too immersed for our own good? Would this game be potentially dangerous in not merely changing the fabric of a pretend society in Rapture, but be responsible for changing the society as we know it by starting with the unwitting and foolish gamers?

    @GamesConnoisseur

    The beauty of this game for me, besides the obvious, is that the unwitting and foolish gamers can play Bioshock like Doom3 or Prey but they'll probably give it a 7/8 and have some fun. At least they'll buy it which isn't what happened with SS & SS2.
    For discerning gamers, we will absorb Bioshock in a whole different way which is why reviewers are giving it a 10.

    "I know one thing... and that is that the Sony Defenders review is the one of the best I've ever had the pleasure to read."

    @Azazel

    is this the only way to get the post count above GOW's?

    /hoping fanboiyz stay clear

    Edited by 1 at 20/08/07 @ 19:50

  • DjFlex52 #672 5 years ago

    "...And no, the whale won't stop me buying it, it was just one of many things that bugged me about the game. The whole thing just doesn't gel to create a believable world. I apologise to all I offended. Perhaps I am too old to immerse myself in this type of fantasy anymore."

    @floppylobster

    err....how can you put "believable world" and "this type of fantasy" in the same criticism of Bioshock and make any sense? If this game bugged you for the reasons you stated....don't buy Heavenly Sword, Lair, Super Mario Galaxy or Assassin's Creed either.

    btw....too old? are you 80?

  • Carrybagma #673 5 years ago

    but

    what would blerk think?

  • DrunKao #674 5 years ago

    Does anyone think it was a coincidence that Kristan Reed reviewed both games that currently have the highest comment count? I think not! He planned this all along. You should really be ashamed of yourself Kristan for manipulating the innocent Eurogamer readership here. We don't deserve this treatment.
    Edited by 1 at 20/08/07 @ 21:55

  • CHAZBIGPOTATO #675 5 years ago

    "What the fuck is a whale doing swimming down the middle of two buildings?"

    Because those two buidlings are under the Fucking sea! Ha ha ha!

  • DrunKao #676 5 years ago

    Did someone really say that? That's classic. I was wondering the same thing. Who and the hell would even imagine a fucking whale swimming between buildings underwater? Twisted minds at Irrational that's who.

  • Xerx3s #677 5 years ago

    /runs from Xerx3s ;p

    Why? I've been an Irrational fan since the dawn of time.

    hmm, that didn't come out the way it thought it would...

  • floppylobster #678 5 years ago

    @DjFlex52

    Also bugging me was -
    - Why would I inject something into myself without prompting?
    - After a bad reaction why do I from then on keep injecting it happily?
    - "My Genetic code is being re-written"? What the hell does that mean anyway?
    - My character only gets a couple of lines at the start but he seems slightly arrogant. Why does he choose to help the guy's family? I wouldn't, so I should have a choice not to, or a better reason to (like he wouldn't help me if I didn't).
    - My guide has a few lines about 'splicers' that are obvious exposition. I know it's needed for a game, but I've seen it written better.
    - Why do I sit watching a guy get killed at the start? Why can't I move in the sphere to hide in the corner or something?
    - Why does time almost freeze while I rewire the bot? And the pipe mini game seemed easy and kinda stupid.
    - Fish flood in when the plane hits the walkway. Highly unlikely as fish would have swum away. Not that they'd be there in the first place anyway. Of course it is for effect, and to remind me, the player, I'm underwater.

    Yes they're all minor, yes they're all trivial. But they all combine to bother me just enough to ruin the immersion.

    I played it again to make this list and I enjoyed it slightly more so I'm giving it an 8/10 and I'll be done with it.

    Anyway, I said I was going, so I'm gone.

  • Calgon #679 5 years ago

    Is floppylobster basing all his assumptions off the demo?

    Smells like a troll to me, already made his mind up, how dare an MS console get a generation defining game that will be remembered for years to come... I can hear him now "it should have been Sony/Nintendo/PC exclusive!".

    Not that it matters we all know this is a killer app(perhaps thats whats bothering him... rival fanboy?) games like this dont come around often, I suspect it will be on many peoples best games of all time lists... heres hoping it makes it onto mine anyway. MS will probably try and hold onto this one if they can, sorry Sony fanboys but its games like this which attracted people to Xbox, if it was going to be exclusive to anyone it was always MS they were the ones who brought PC developers onboard with the console industry in a big way(there were some already but many sloppy ports and lack of care from PC devs) it started last gen, this shows what can be done when talented devs get bigger budgets due to better sales on a platform thats good to lead on to boot(consoles are where the money is at for devs/publishers... more people play them and more people pay for them). The PC and 360 stratagy could work out well for alot of devs, its not overly expensive and the PS3 fanbase isnt large enough for some yet(given the increased cost/time difficulty it would take to keep the PS3 version on schedual with everything else), do they sell as well on Sony consoles anyway?.
    Edited by 2 at 21/08/07 @ 03:14

  • DjFlex52 #680 5 years ago

    @floppylobster
    I wont even copy your comment in my post ...the less attention it gets the better.
    You said you were gone twice....I doubt it though

    The utterly ridiculous questions that came out of your noggin while playing Bioshock makes me wonder....do you play games for fun and entertainment?
    I can question the concept of realism throughout every great game I've ever played. I don't care to do so because that's not why I play games.

    hmmm...the questions that goes through floppylobster's mind while he plays games.

    for instance:
    "I wonder why an italian plumber lives in a mushroom world?" "It's unbelievable so I'll rate this game a 5/10"
    And of course "I wonder why Final Fantasy keeps adding numbered sequels though all the games are totally unrelated?" "hmph...makes no sense so it gets 7/10"

    Edited by 1 at 21/08/07 @ 04:38

  • mattigan #681 5 years ago

    And don't forget the other big quection, why does floppylobster have to view all the action through a TV screen, why can it be a total virtual reality assault on the senses, and when you die why don't actually really die in real life, it totally ruins the immersion!

    Cock!
    Edited by 1 at 21/08/07 @ 07:18

  • sharpfish #682 5 years ago

    so... better than gears then!

    Seriously, well done on a good review I'm glad you didn't dish out an 8 again.

  • sharpfish #683 5 years ago

    Oh and great news for the Xbox again - seriously how many MORE great games does a system need to convince FB idiots that it's the real deal?

    Im getting bioshock on PC (been playing the demo lastnight and it runs beautifully on my new system) but even I can see how this is going to shift more Xbox's than have been shifted since gears (and possibly including gears). But I may grab it for the Xbox too when it's cheaper.

    Amazing demo, amazing game (from reviews) and from here on in we have a new benchmark of 'standard' so it's only going to get better for gamers because the 'me too' FPS's will now stand out like a sore thumb.. and possibly, just possibly future 'half life' games are going to have to innovate even more and get off it's complacent lazy arse and push all envelopes instead of just the ones it thinks it invented.
    Edited by 1 at 21/08/07 @ 07:50

  • Les #684 5 years ago

    @ Calgon and DjFlex52

    Wow, incredibly mature reaction! The guy says for him it’s not a 10/10 game and he tells you why. What’s the problem with that?! Why can’t you guys accept that there are people with different opinions than your own?

  • PlugMonkey #685 5 years ago

    Les - Largely because his reasons are so utterly bizarre.

    I think I've yet to play a single game that would pass that level of scrutiny. Most films I've seen and books I've read would fall foul of it as well. If you can't suspend your disbelief over the occasional badly written line then you might as well give up on every form of entertainment medium.

    Stick to very, very thoroughly researched documentaries only.

    Go on. Name any game and I bet we can pick it apart in exactly the same way. But then, that's rather missing the point of why games are made in the first place.

  • DjFlex52 #686 5 years ago

    Wow, incredibly mature reaction! The guy says for him it’s not a 10/10 game and he tells you why. What’s the problem with that?! Why can’t you guys accept that there are people with different opinions than your own?

    @Les

    hey, I wish all he said was that it's not a 10/10...fine then...but noooo
    he asks us questions like "why time freezes in Bioshock when he rewires a bot" and you have the nerve to question my maturity, Les?

    edit: darn, you beat me to it PlugMonkey ;-)
    Edited by 1 at 21/08/07 @ 08:58

  • Calgon #687 5 years ago

    Les do you always have to defend the trolls? You expect everyone to agree with them? Isnt that hypocritical just because alot of people disagree with their reasons for posting on a thread? Do they ever listen to any oposing veiws to their own? Nope they are there to tell everyone they know better, which is how arguements/flaming starts.

    As far as Im concerned Im happy enough that this game has lived up to its promise, since I played SS2 Ive been waiting for this, it doesnt bother me what anyone else thinks, I want to play the game and make my own mind up but so far it looks like nothing but greatness. What I saw in his posts was the usual hater practise, find ANY EXCUSE to dismiss the game and its critical acclaim from reviewers and gamers... it just looked kind of petty/trollish, if it wasnt he could have kept to one post("I played the demo and didnt quite get into it" would have been enough... he's barely played it and is giving it a review = not right, Kristian has done perfectly good review here so its not necessary and quite annoying actually) and much shorter because the more he typed the more people picked up on it.
    Edited by 5 at 21/08/07 @ 10:59

  • GamesConnoisseur #688 5 years ago

    Golly, 33 more post to break the record for most posts in review article!

    [link url=http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/xbox360/bios hock
    ]http://ww w.metacritic.com/games/platform...[/link]

    After 19 reviews in, now a respectable score of 97 out of 100, Gamespot giving it only 9 out of 10 and the lowest review score out of 19.
    I think their review is quite reasonable and virtually spot on.

    floppylobster lived up to his name, flp flopped onto a score of 8 out of 10, I agree wth him that the game is not perfect but no game on this Earth is! What should ever deserve 10 out of 10?

    The problem here is a game worth 5 star? 10 out of 10 doesn't automatically mean it is equal to 100 percent score! That where things fall apart, Bioshock for me is certainly a dead cert for 5 stars, and one of the handful to be worthy of 10 out of 10 (accepting that there is faults).

    BioShock deserving of 100 out of 100? No way!

    Only few days left to get my paws on it, and 100 percent dead itching to add this to my collection and given a favoured easy to reach position!
    Edited by 1 at 21/08/07 @ 12:04

  • Les #689 5 years ago

    "Les do you always have to defend the trolls? You expect everyone to agree with them?"

    I don't see why he is a troll as he comments on the game. It's not like he's saying "BioShock sucks" or something.

    And personally I don't agree with him. I just think it's better to have an argument, so discuss the weaknesses that he points out, than to just resort to calling him a troll or trying to turn this into another console fanboy flame war. That's all.

  • jonnyreb #690 5 years ago

    C'mon.......keep it going to hit the big 1000 :)

  • dryden555 #691 5 years ago

    flobbylobster isnt a troll c'mon. Trolls try to incite trouble and that doesnt seem to be his intent at all.

    As someone who loved SS1 and 2, I was duly impressed with the demo for PC. I DO have to say that the polygons and bitmaps for lots of objects are a bit more low res than I would have expected. In the full PC game is there an option for hires textures? But the overall atmosphere of the game makes up for some low poly stuff.

    And I genuinely feel sorry for anyone who has to play any shooter with analog sticks and not a mouse.

  • floppylobster #692 5 years ago

    I guess more for the sake of seeing if these comments will go to 1000 I will return, despite saying I was gone, (apologies DjFlex52).

    - Firstly, thank you Les. And people like Stoatboy, who don't get angry but deflect with humour while making their own point. I'm a minority, I understand.

    - I listed some points that bothered me. It was not a definitive list. They were some of the reasons. It was only a representation to explain where I was coming from. I've already apologised to all I might have offended so I don't see the point of doing that again.

    - @ DjFlex52 - I don’t look for realism in a game, I look for consistency within that fictional world. If things don’t gel it bugs me. I don’t care that an Italian plumber lives in a mushroom world. But what if Mario pulled a gun? Wouldn’t that create a disconnect with you? Wouldn’t that betray what the game is trying to achieve? Granted my problems with Bioshock are much less obvious. That doesn’t make them invalid.

    - Yes I have very high standards. I started playing games around the time they were invented. I have seen and played more than most. I worked in the industry for nine years and I have worked in film too, so yes, I'm very sensitive to little things that causal and even hardcore gamers wouldn't care about. Yes Plugmonkey, we can pick apart everything. But you’re right, we would miss the point of games. So let’s not pick apart anything, and that would miss the point of reviews. I only posted to ease the mind of any like-minded people who felt the same way as me. I guess no such person exists. I'm okay with that.

    - There must be some film out there that everyone tells you is awesome but you just didn't think was that good. Surely there must be one? 'Titanic'? 'Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind'? 'The Matrix'? 'Independence Day'? 'Revenge of the Sith'? People rave about these films (yes, people raved about Titanic). Yet others don't like them. Is it so hard to accept?

    - A fanboy? I doubt it Calgon. Yes I was basing my opinion off the demo. I stated as much earlier on. The game’s not out in my territory yet. But guess what? I downloaded it, with my Xbox 360. So how does owning a console make me a fanboy of another one? I love the 360. Hey I love Tenchu Z on the 360. Why don't you pick that apart? I won't feel bad. I won't feel threatened. I'll still know why I love it. I can see why other people might not like it. I enjoy being presented with different viewpoints. It makes me think more and appreciate how a simple object can be viewed 100 different ways.

    Me, I’m off to play that Tenchu Z. Goddamn I love it. I give it 7/10.

  • GamesConnoisseur #693 5 years ago

    Would not touch Tenchu Z with bargepole myself, no disrespect intended but months ago after downloading it off Japan Marketplace, gave it half hour disliked it and hey I gave it another go when in European Marketplace months later, but no still of the same mind.

    Yeah to each his own, as for keyboard and mouse or gamepad, I had said elsewhere I was a former PC/Amiga snob who thought consoles/gamepads beneath me. I played all classics on keyboard and mouse and thought it was good enough.

    I now am quite used to play FPS via gamepad or K/M, and the main thing is immerson can be better via HDTV, melted back onto Ikea rocking chair and in darkened room. Get more spirited away than when sitting upright and occasionally checking right keyboard button to be pressed (other than standard aswd).

    Strategy titles is best on PC and I m keeping it there. But FPS is not too bad on consoles now. Though I would admit X360 gamepad is far better than Sixaxis as found aiming too loose on PS3.
    Edited by 1 at 21/08/07 @ 14:54

  • darc #694 5 years ago

    The collector's edition for PC should have been a bundle with SS1 and 2, rejiggered to run hassle-free on XP/Vista - in the same way the premium HL2 version included HL. (Valve went the extra mile and retextured for the new engine, etc; that sort of treatment would just be icing.)

    Who needs a figurine? This would have been a great opportunity to get SS2 more of the exposure it deserved.

  • rhinoxious #695 5 years ago

    System Shock 2 was published by Electronic Arts, and knowing them they probably still own the whole thing.

  • darc #696 5 years ago

    Oh right - I forgot about that... hence Bioshock being merely the "spiritual successor" to SS2. Shame to see that property just sitting collecting dust all on account of legal issues. But I can guarantee, if Bioshock sells a bzillion copies, EA will be suddenly "inspired" to contract and distribute a System Shock 3. (And more than likely it will suck.)

    But no matter - my cell phone just rang and my pre-order of Bioshock is waiting for me at the local Game Crazy. :D

    Besides I was lucky enough to play SS2 99% of the way through "back in the day". (According to rumor, the last-ish room, which I found very, very difficult was in fact impossible to beat without a patch. Oops.)
    Edited by 2 at 21/08/07 @ 20:08

  • darc #697 5 years ago

    P.S. What the hell is "illusion of immersion" supposed to mean?? If anything it sounds like a good thing. Was anyone here hoping to unwrap Bioshock and receive an actual swirly?

  • DjFlex52 #698 5 years ago

    @floppylobster

    well, I didn't say you were a fanboy, fl, but I do think you're a loony....considering your last post just contradicted all your points/arguments about Bioshock.
    You said you look for consistency within the world of each game and then brag how you love Tenchu Z. Tenchu Z???...probably one of the most inconsistent worlds on xbox 360.

    From being able to run by guards to get to the end of the level and also those same lobotomized guards sometimes do nothing if they see their dead friends lying there. Also, when you do a silent kill...it's not so silent. Characters don't even move their lips when they're saying something....jeez

    This all goes to show me that your rankling of Bioshock's world of inconsistencies has nothing to do with consistency and more to do with bias. All well and good....be biased but at least admit it, floopy.

  • DjFlex52 #699 5 years ago

    And personally I don't agree with him. I just think it's better to have an argument, so discuss the weaknesses that he points out, than to just resort to calling him a troll or trying to turn this into another console fanboy flame war. That's all.

    @Les

    glad to know you don't agree...(already knew you weren't a loony, Les)
    but he's not discussing weaknesses, Les.
    why time freezes when rewiring a bot isn't a weakness....it's a game mechanic.
    all games have them.
    there's nothing to discuss.

  • MasterNameless #700 5 years ago

    3 days to go... 3 DAYS TOO LONG!!!!!!!! ARGH!!!
    Edited by 2 at 21/08/07 @ 20:06

  • Carrybagma #701 5 years ago

    @calgon: If you're not bothered about what people think, why do you *always* go on and on
    and on
    and on
    and on
    about what you think people are thinking?

    That said..

    Anyone who rubbishes games because of their poor resemblance to real-life is either a troll, or amazingly petty.

  • krudster #702 5 years ago

    Goodness knows how long this thread will go on for once people have actually *played it* :)

  • Calgon #703 5 years ago

    Carrybagma yeah sorry(granted it was a mamoth rant but I was half asleep and I did say I would probably delete it, Im just trying to make sense of these beings) I wish my posts were as good as yours though, very productive that. It just ticks me off what can I say?(if its not trolling there should be a word for it because it looks intentional and Im not the only one who gets annoyed by it surely?) "am I the only one who"... you know whats coming next and how the debate is going to go(9 times out of 10 anyway). Theres some rare occasions where its actually interesting and not constant back and forth "ooooh yes it is!" > "ooooh no it isnt!" blah whatever.

    I still beleive giving his own review and score was kind of taking the piss though. There's a function on EG for that purpose, only I think its only available for games that have been released, you know because you are supposed to have played them?.

    Edited by 6 at 21/08/07 @ 22:08

  • mattigan #704 5 years ago

    Is this thread still going???

  • mattigan #705 5 years ago

    Krudster, one thing I've been wondering, how does the save system work? Is it a save anywhere type deal or is there a mechanism like the RE printer ribbons employed to stop you abusing it.

  • DjFlex52 #706 5 years ago

    "Anyone who rubbishes games because of their poor resemblance to real-life is either a troll, or amazingly petty."

    but presumably not amazingly petty about Tenchu Z

    I just played the PC demo of Bioshock...1280x720 everything maxed. Looks pretty good with same atmospheric feeling as 360....360 version looks a bit better. I've always preferred my k/m to a gamepad, especially with FPS games. Though for some reason, I miss the rumble effect Irrational implemented in this game. I guess I'll be playing the 360 game. I should buy both versions....just for support that this game doesn't become the "Psychonauts of 2007".

  • GamesConnoisseur #707 5 years ago

    Kruster
    Goodness knows how long this thread will go on for once people have actually *played it* :)

    Well would it be a damned record if BioShock get the highest posts compared to Gear of War total of 3rd EDIT: 774 (incorrect figure previously 778) AND it get beaten BEFORE the flaming game get released?!
    3rd EDIT: Only 6 more posts to go for that record.
    Also it is your damnable fault in first place for giving it 10 out of 10 plus the article you wrote! Good one though.

    DJFlex52, I honestly doubt that this game would need us to buy both PC and X360 to support them, I think they will do well and if game doesnt really sell then it is down to not enough marketing. I know there are other titles that were worthy to own but are undeservingly undersold. That happens but don't think BioShock will suffer from this disgrace.

    Final post from me, 30 reviews in Metacritic and still 97 out of 100, BUT be warned the one main critical thing repeated is that on normal difficulty the game can be too easy and unchallenging combat-wise, so PLAY it on hard setting.

    2nd EDIT: Game Rankings now second highest of all time with 96.5%
    [link url=http://www.gamerankings.com/itemrankings/simpleratings .asp
    ]http://ww w.gamerankings.com/itemrankings...[/link]

    EDIT: Game come in three difficulty setting so forget Easy and Meduim modes!

    The WAY it meant to be played.

    /Plannig to get new lock from Wickes tomorrow so can play uninterrupted by kids and wife on Friday morning.
    Edited by 3 at 22/08/07 @ 12:54

  • Carrybagma #708 5 years ago

    @calgon: You've got to take all that crap with a pinch of salt. Maybe even let some comments pass without further comment.

    PS. Me, good? Productive? Now you're definitely kidding. I was telling you I designed PPC chips the other week, remember? :o)

    Re: Tenchu Z: Ahhh. An excellent review and comments thread that. Getting towards 'Awesome!/10!' infamy. Look how many times the reviewer defends himself.
    /salutes

  • VMerken #709 5 years ago

    Yahoo, finished reading all comments from start to finish. A few very quick observations:

    * It's usually good practice to carefully consider the situation before divulging private information. Is the amount of private details you release worth the service you want to receive? If you're serious about the matter, ALWAYS read disclaimers carefully, from top to bottom to find out what you hand out to the world.

    Privacy is an important matter. Personally, however, in this case, I feel I'm going to risk the activation. If only to say a rather vague "hello" to 2K. Here's to them seeing a lot of hellos, actually - might help PC gaming a bit, who knows.

    * In reference to the arguments made by people who have problems decoupling realism from immersion in games (lethal plane crashes and observing a murder in plain sight while not able to move etc): welcome to Game Land, where everything is able to not be what it seems. Where concepts and minimal interfaces are enough.

    With that said, I do have sompething which disappointed me.

    - SPOILERS FROM DEMO EVERYONE HERE PROBABLY KNOWS BUT OH WELL -

    The choice, or rather the lack of it, given to you by the game when it presents its first plasmid to you. I remember reading the first texts on Bioshock dealing with plasmids, dealing with choice and consequence and my first thought was, "All right, this is really cool. My first game will be plasmid free - no ADAM, no EVE, nothing, I'm going to stay entirely clean. Next game will be juiced up to the extreme without ADAM, the next one with". Yeah, I had a plan going on, but I guess that's all out of the window now. Unless the demo is a cunningly crafted decoy of course (not likely).

    I feel like someone who just got handed a new Resident Evil title without a Combat Knife or something of the like :). Great times lie ahead, but that little bit extra which completes a hardcore player's experience with the game is missing. Mrm, I can still do a time attack I guess, or a one-plasmid run (if the game allows that of course), but it just won't feel the same as a wrench-only run. Note to developers: you know, that default wrench is nice and big, you could probably get enough leverage out of it to use it on a locked door as a prybar and allow a plasmid-free run hint hint ;).

    All right, need bed now.
    Edited by 1 at 22/08/07 @ 04:55

  • chischis #710 5 years ago

    As I predicted, PAYING customers are already getting worked up - over at the 2K Forums - about the 2-activation limit. You pays your money, you get your arse reamed:

    http://fo rums.2kgames.com/forums/showthr...
    Edited by 1 at 22/08/07 @ 13:23

  • dryden555 #711 5 years ago

    I'm halfway thru the game (no spoilers will be given) and I love everything the game does except the "no penalty death and instant respawn." I'm playing at hard difficulty and even then, the difficulty level is too easy. It also jarringly draws one out of the game. It is the only real weakness of a stellar game, but its a doozy. I get the sense the developers did this for a few reasons: if death prevented progress in the game as with most single-player PC games, some Bioshock players would unintentionally gimp their character. The only way to make this impossible is to allow the player to reswpawn infinitely in a level and let the player run around and gather ammo and buffs with impunity. So that is exactly what Bioshock lets you do. Bioshock also lets you save at any time where most console games force you to save at "save points." Hence, BioShock tries to appease both the PC and console crowd in the manner in which you can progress in the game, and the result is imperfect at best. I LOVE the game for its atmosphere and story, but I have to say that System Shock 2 is the better game in terms of gameplay. Bioshock is still a 9/10 game.
    Edited by 1 at 22/08/07 @ 13:35

  • BremXJones #712 5 years ago

    dryden555: But System Shock 2 does everything you've just described, and you use it as evidence that it has better gameplay.

    KG

  • darc #713 5 years ago

    Got in about 2 hrs last night. I feel like this game is my first taste of "next-gen" as I imagined it when that buzzword started buzzing ca. XBOX 360/GeForce 8800 release dates. I was fully expecting this game to push me toward another PC upgrade, but instead it's got me grinning and thinking, "Wow, I had no idea this PC was capable of graphics like this!"

    First impressions - best graphics/ art direction/ cinematic presentation. Ever. Almost too creepy (I never thought I'd say that...) Gameplay-wise... verdict is still out. For pure shooter fans it will surely fall short, per the previous comment that weapons and controls feel a little sluggish and uncertain. As an adventure it really excels, simply in terms of presenting an *experience* you won't forget. As far as delivering the sort of innovative RPG/tactical gameplay elements that SS2 did, I see it trying, but not yet delivering. I'm hoping that ramps up later.

    This game will definitely sell a lot of copies, with or without proper marketing. It's a very different landscape than the one that SS2 had to contend with: gaming is much more mainstream now, and embraced by a much larger adult market. When SS2 hit the scene PC gaming was in... well, not its infancy, but maybe its early adolescence, and there was no console release (or console capable of running it as far as I'm aware.) Now we have a release for a PC with fully matured gaming technology (and a vast market fueling it) *and* a dedicated gaming console early in its lifespan. Even if this sells slowly across a number of years, and even if it stumbles on the PC and sells primarily on XBOX or vice-versa, it'll be a huge success. (And the reviews aren't going to hurt LOL.)

    P.S. Agree re: the 1st Plasmid use. WTF? Something as simple as a radio transmission instructing you to use (vs. die) would have made this more plausible. Doesn't impact the quality of the game, though; it's just a minor curiosity.
    Edited by 1 at 22/08/07 @ 14:51

  • darc #714 5 years ago

    Has anyone seen any reviews comparing DX9 visuals to DX10 visuals yet? Wondering whether this is the carrot to make me (am I going insane) upgrade to Vista. It's hard to imagine this game looking much better anyway. Presently running with everything except DX10 textures and Force Global Lighting (whatever that means.)

  • Les #715 5 years ago

    "Anyone who rubbishes games because of their poor resemblance to real-life is either a troll, or amazingly petty."

    Bull. The required level of realism differs from game to game (and from gamer to gamer). E.g. for a game like Bioshock, which relies heavy on the feeling of 'being there' realism-requirements will be higher than for a game like Geometry Wars or Ninja Gaiden Sigma.

    Of course there are limits to realism requirements. They are games in the end and realism doesn't always equal fun.

  • mattigan #716 5 years ago

    Does anyone know any sites where I can get this cheap? I'm talking sub £35 ish.

  • the_sas_man #717 5 years ago

    You can put a code in on Game website and get a fiver off. So you can get it brand new for 35 quid delivered!

    EDIT: The code by the way is SUMMERFUN
    Edited by 1 at 22/08/07 @ 15:25

  • rogermellie #718 5 years ago

    In anticipation to getting Bioshock I installed System Shock 1 to see if it was as good as I remember (640x480 version / audio logs). And 3 levels later...it's still an awesome game.

    I'm really glad a title like this has reached the main stream and I hope it sells.

    I can't wait to get this!

  • GamesConnoisseur #719 5 years ago

    Gear of War's record of 774 posts for (single player) EG Review now duly lost and BioShock's Big Daddy shredded Marcus Fenix's tight backside to take the crown.

    Little Sister is cackling and punching that oversized syringe into what counts as a remain of a sort.

    Cue rapturous applause for the record!

    Fact 1:
    GoW 774 posts from 7th Nov 06 to 3rd Jun 07 (99 percent from Nov to Jan)

    Fact 2:
    BioShock 775 plus posts from 16th Aug 07 to 22nd Aug 07 and before 24th release date to boot.



  • darc #720 5 years ago

    A couple more random points (yes, slightly fixated):

    - The HUD and selection screen elements are slightly sub-par IMO. I see the look they're going for, but it comes off more cartoonish than it should. If it had been slightly more "reliced" and/ or techy it would have been a better fit.

    - Someone said this reminded them of FEAR, which is interesting. I think the two titles are just about diametrically opposed, aside from their both featuring a creepy little girl. FEAR was a razor-sharp shooter, all about AI and precision (on the positive side), but a little unambitious in terms of variety and presentation (on the negative side) - by which I mean, same rectangular corridors and crates and human enemies for miles and miles. Bioshock seems quite the opposite on both counts - all about story and toys, and not so much about precise headshots to flanking mercenaries, etc. (Personally, I thought FEAR was an over-rated yawner.)

    - Why does the music creep me out so much?!? I guess if I was born in the 20's or 30's I'd have had a constant case of the shivers. For comic relief, I sing along with the words from South Park's "Butters" tap-dancing scene: "I've got something in my front pocket for you..." :)
    Edited by 2 at 22/08/07 @ 15:42

  • darc #721 5 years ago

    Roger, you're lucky to still have a copy of SS1! What OS are you running it on and are there any gotchas? All this talk has inspired me to reinstall my copy of SS2 (after I've finished Bioshock, of course.)

    All of which should keep me occupied until Fallout 3 ships. :)
    Edited by 1 at 22/08/07 @ 15:42

  • oldergamer #722 5 years ago

    First hour of Bioshock hasn't grabbed me yet emotionally... Hopefully, purchase of 360 will be justified after I'm done. On the other hand, The Darkness was riveting from start to finish, except for those parallel-universe episodes like Krudster said.

  • rogermellie #723 5 years ago

    Roger, you're lucky to still have a copy of SS1! What OS are you running it on and are there any gotchas? All this talk has inspired me to reinstall my copy of SS2 (after I've finished Bioshock, of course.)

    I know and I treasure good games (new and old). Mind you, I prefer the newer games as the older ones came in bulky packaging.

    Anyway, I'm still running XP and I use DoxBox to run the older stuff (esp. dos protected mode games).

    Dosbox is great and it runs on just about any OS, Linux, OSX. It's funny, but originally you couldn't buy a PC that could run the 640x480 mode. I remember it brought my shiny new P90 to its knees.
    There's absolutely no gotchas that I've found as it runs everything I've thrown at it. I would've like the Roland card to have been emulated, but I realize it would cause copyright issue with shipping the ROM.

    I did have issues with XP and SS2 as it crashed without the indeo codec / run-time (pre mpeg) and the game needed to be installed on C:\ before it worked for me.
    Edited by 1 at 22/08/07 @ 16:21

  • darc #724 5 years ago

    Great info. Thanks for the heads-up!

  • chischis #725 5 years ago

    Oh look... a hack to get the game to run under Windows 2000. Another small hex edit... http://ww w.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.ph... So, chalk another one up for the best Windows MS doesn't want anyone to use.

    So maybe I will go and buy Bioshock... oh, it still has this shitty limited-to-2-occasions activation. Never mind then.

  • sanctusmortis #726 5 years ago

    If it had been less than 10, there'd be complaints.

    Come on Grainger Games, break street date...

  • darc #727 5 years ago

    Damn chischis, no one's ever seemed so ticked off about finding what they wanted.

  • dryden555 #728 5 years ago

    bremXJones, what are you talking about? In ss2 your character doesnt auto-respawn. You get killed, you load your savegame. In Bioshock you are effectively immortal with no death penalty whatsoever. Its a great game but Bioshock makes it too easy not to care what's lurking around the corner because you will simply respawn 40 feet away. It is patently jarring (even in the context of this game) that I can simply respawn again and again in order to take down a bigdaddy while it cannot repair its damage. Awesome game in so many ways but the game falters in terms of how it handles character death.

  • chischis #729 5 years ago

    @darc

    Doesn't matter anyway: [link url=http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5527
    ]http://fo rums.2kgames.com/forums/showthr...[/link]

    I hate to say to you all that "I told you so" ....

    Well done 2K. Well, fucking, done. What a glorious day to be a PC gamer.

  • darc #730 5 years ago

    chischis - I can't get to that last link; I'm guessing the 2K servers are being clobbered today. If it's a link to a bunch of rants about the activation issue, it's a yawner IMO. I paid, I activated, it worked, I'm happy. I very rarely play more than 2 instances of a video game at a time anyway. (Yes, that's tongue in cheek, and I'm sure there are exceptional cases where blah blah blah...)

    Point is, this is within the devs rights and it's increasingly commonplace. In non-game software it's been around forever, and it's frequently *broken*. Imagine paying ~$500 for a recording application, find it's useless out of the box, wait a week for the developer to e-mail serial numbers, cd-keys, activation codes, ad nauseum. If Bioshock gets you riled, that scene would definitely make you postal. At least 2K did a decent job with their implementation.

  • darc #731 5 years ago

    OK finally got to page 1 of that link - 1 of 11 pages of speculation by the looks of it. If the assumptions on page 1 prove out, then I'll admit you're right and there's a major problem. I'll also eat my shorts. There's no way 2K would expect to get away with essentially a one-shot install DVD, and frankly they'd bankrupt themselves by way of support calls alone. Typically, once you've reached a max number of installs (I believe 2 in this case) there is a way to deactivate a previous installation before installing to another system. (Otherwise, I'll be ranting along with you shortly.)

  • Rusta #732 5 years ago

    You telling me Bioshock is not based on real life events!!???

  • VMerken #733 5 years ago

    @Chischis, Darc

    Been reading the 2K forum link too. In there is a link to the Steam forums (http://fo rums.steampowered.com/forums/sh... where Martinoo/Valve responded as follows:

    "SecuRom limits Bioshock installations to 2 hardware configurations at the same time. If you want to install BioShock on a third computer using the same Steam account, you have to uninstall one of your previous installations('Delete local content')."

    For the moment, I'll treat this purely within the Steam context, but it's my humble guess that Martinoo's statement pertaining to Securom applies to the retail PC version as well.

    I do admit that the responsible parties should have been more transparent about something as important as this. If people are kept in the dark and led to believe that their purchased DVD evaporates if they try to install it a third time, something went wrong somewhere. I mean, if I were to buy a mint book which crumbles to dust the third time I try to open it by publisher's intent... then I'd like to see that printed on a big sticker somewhere on the cover :).

    @Dryden555

    "... I love everything the game does except the "no penalty death and instant respawn." I'm playing at hard difficulty and even then, the difficulty level is too easy... "

    ... and this differs substantially from (quick)saving/loading, how? Virtually every PC game is a walk in the park due to freestyle saving/loading all over the place. There's a cure for this: clench your fist and start the game from the beginning whenever you die. Or save only when entering a new area and restart there. Maybe a little change in a .ini file or the registry turns off the Revitalising chambers to get the right experience? Etc.

    Edit: Hey look, it's Elizabeth/2K on page 12 of the 2K forum link confirming the humble guess:

    "first, let me say this. you DO NOT NEED TO USE THE INTERNET EVERY TIME YOU PLAY THIS GAME. it is only the first time.

    second, you can uninstall and reinstall this game, and if, by chance, you have 2 computers you want to simultaneously play this game on, you also can do that.

    if by some chance you are reinstalling this game without uninstalling it first, a lot, there is a chance you may have to call securom and get a key, or deactivate some older installations.

    but if you upgrade your hardware next week, you'll still be able to play the game. if you revamp your system and need to reinstall bioshock, just uninstall it before you go through the overhaul, and then do your reinstall.

    calling it "hardware fingerprinting" is a bit alarmist. we do not transmit any of your data to any companies.

    really, the only people who will be concerned about any of these security measures are those who are rapidly putting bioshock on many pcs... if you use the game as you normally do, you won't notice this at all."
    Edited by 4 at 22/08/07 @ 23:15

  • DjFlex52 #734 5 years ago

    just wondering....my Bioshock shows up tomorrow :)

    Is it one save only like Dead Rising?

  • Ryze #735 5 years ago

    Popular game, then?

  • MrsPacMan #736 5 years ago

    lets get to 800 before release date!!

  • MrsPacMan #737 5 years ago

    I mean, i won't be too difficult, we only need 2 more comments now.

  • MrsPacMan #738 5 years ago

    Help me out someone, do your bit!!!

    You get to say 'Whoohoo, 800' gotta be worth the effort
    Edited by 1 at 23/08/07 @ 08:51

  • General Coxykiller #739 5 years ago

    I have the game and it rocks! Total 10/10! Got up this morning and turned on the XBOX and got into it again before work, havent done that since HL2!

  • kinggid #740 5 years ago

    1000 is the target now - will the EG website be able to take it?

    or will it explode?

  • RichGL #741 5 years ago

    @dryden555

    You auto respawn in SS2 at the last pod you activated, with whatever items you had when you died.

  • Azazel #742 5 years ago

    Not in any Guinness-based sense :(

  • Sebo #743 5 years ago

    805.........

  • Sebo #744 5 years ago

    Hey, what's this bioshock game all about anyways?

  • Nikanoru #745 5 years ago

    Holy crap, 800?

    I'm surprised this game runs so well on my 6800GT, on Windows 2000 with just two tiny new DLLs. ;D

    Though, does anyone else think the mouse movement doesn't... feel right? Sorta annoying. Feels like stick controls mapped to the mouse... which I guess it is. :\

  • DrunKao #746 5 years ago

    BioShock. Not only the highest rated 360 game ever, it also holds the record for the most comments for a review. BOW TO YOUR KING!

  • VMerken #747 5 years ago

    Hmm... didn't really notice anything out of whack with the mouse movement so far, but have to admit I wasn't paying special attention to it either. Just how does it feel... wrong?

    I do want to retract an earlier statement, though - there appears to be some tearing, even with v-sync turned on. The tearing, which always occurs halfway the screen, appears in every resolution. Does anyone observe this while using the new 163.44 nVidia drivers?

  • Carrybagma #748 5 years ago

    It'll need help to hit 1000 though. Either some trolling or reports on how good it is.

  • IN4ARIOT #749 5 years ago

    Got mine an hour ago , can't do anything with it 'cos 2k servers are stuffed and I can't DL the patch .... You HAVE to be online then they go off..sheesh!! ..'aint technology wunnerful?...pffffffttt .... basts!!!

  • viper_h #750 5 years ago

    Here's one for the record.

    Mine came in the post from play today. Woo-hoo!

  • abelardie #751 5 years ago

    er, I really dont want to go back through all this so sorry if this was covered already.

    I don't have a 360 or good enough PC to play this (student life - boo), but given that it appears that an incredible amount of creativity and thought has gone into this game, I want to see it succeed, because, well, it seems deserved.

    However, I'm slightly concerned that there has been little to no marketing of this game beyond a poster or two in GAME. I'm in Ireland, which may explain this, but has there been much of a marketing or media push elsewhere? If not, given the potential and quality of this game, is that not dropping the ball a little?

  • Carrybagma #752 5 years ago

    Well, yes. Crap isn't it? A game that most un-biased people would welcome, yet there's only enough hype for one particular 360 game this year..

    I'm almost dreading seeing Bioshock sales figures. I do hope I'm wrong.

  • BremXJones #753 5 years ago

    dryden555: As RichGL says, what you say simply isn't true. You respawn at the last respawn pod, with low health and psi, but otherwise exactly the same.

    (Exception: If you haven't actually found a respawn tube on the level you're on, in which case you die.)

    Dryden - is it possible you played all the way through Shock2 without noticing a major mechanism?

    KG

  • darc #754 5 years ago

    Re: the mouse controls, I felt the same way at first, but it's kind of passed. In fact, all of my minor complaints are kind of dissolving the more I play the game. I'm getting calibrated with the mouse and weapons, the UI bits I didn't like are starting to gel, and most importantly, the game play is starting to show more of the SS-like complexity I was hoping for. :)

    Re: the tearing, yes I've noticed this, too. Tried setting my monitor refresh rate to 60Hz to match; that didn't help. Most glaring near stairs - that's right, staircasing on staircases LOL. Maybe I'll just turn off V-sync to get a couple extra FPS.

    Re: marketing and sales, I wouldn't worry about it. The PC press is doing a fair enough job to keep the game afloat, and it's only a matter of time before word of mouth takes over for the console crowd. It may take a little while, but it will sell. This game's not going out of print any time soon.

    BTW, am I the only Yank on this forum? Everyone's talking release dates and I've been playing since the 21st. (Not gloating...)

  • rob177467 #755 5 years ago

    Does anyone know anywhere in london that is selling this today? Please you gotta help me.

  • smoothn00dle #756 5 years ago

    mmmm.. is real that many ppls here or just marketer playing conversation *v*

  • darc #757 5 years ago

    It's real. That's what a 10/10 gets ya. :)

  • ostrasized #758 5 years ago

    I just bought one copy over the counter at Woolworths - I just asked the girl behind the counter for a copy, and she went off and fetched one.

    [hugs copy of bioshock]

  • jonnyreb #759 5 years ago

    Mine just arrived in the post today :) Yippeee'

    Gonna be a late night......

    /thinks about throwing a sick day tomorrow

  • Sebo #760 5 years ago

    Isn't this bioshock stuff a bit gay

  • Fitzmogwai #761 5 years ago

    So who's going to wave the flag for Bioshock being filthy left-wing commie propaganda then? I hope everyone's read their Ayn Rand before they start(ed) playing. Computer game as political discourse shocker. When's the Daily Mail shitstorm due to start?

  • SniperWolf #762 5 years ago

    There's fear and darkness all around you
    The criminals are on the run
    No use in hiding in the dark
    I'll hunt you down 'cause I'm the Dog

    I'm the Dog
    The big bad Dog
    The Bounty Hunter

  • viper_h #763 5 years ago

    I think the shitstorm's gonna start when they figure out you can kill little girls.

    "SHOCKER: computer game allows you to kill virtual versions of Madeline McAnn"

  • Azazel #764 5 years ago

    EXCLUSIVE!!1: Man Brain Twisted Into Attacking Newspaper Cover By Shock Maddy Murder Simulation Horror!

  • Fitzmogwai #765 5 years ago

    That'll be the Daily Express. Possibly with a badly photoshopped picture of Princess Di wearing a Ball mask and carrying a length of pipe.

  • InfiniteEndings #766 5 years ago

    I'm very surprised that there hasn't been much controversy at the "Beating little girls with a Wrench factor"

  • viper_h #767 5 years ago

    http://i17.tinypic .com/663d4bc.jpg

  • Fitzmogwai #768 5 years ago

    Magnificent! Although he still has some way to go to beat the Tron guy...

  • GamesConnoisseur #769 5 years ago

    [link url=http://i17.tinypic .com/663d4bc.jpg
    ]http://i17.tinypic .com/663d4bc.jpg
    [/link]

    That certainly so Gay!!

  • VMerken #770 5 years ago

    @darc:

    Shut up yank and give us our regional countdown ;). At least there are only a few days between the NTSC and PAL release, so things are nice enough... quite unlike what happens with the remaining 99,8% of the game releases (Paper Mario anyone? Final Fantasy Tactics? ;).

    By the way, I read a review where the player wasn't too pleased during the first few hours and became quite giddy as he was possibly going to become the only reviewer in the world not to give it top marks... a few hours later, everything panned out for him - so it's quite possible that the first impression (i.e. demo) actually underrepresents the game.

    As for the tearing bit, yeah - until there's a workaround somewhere in the future, turning off v-sync is a solid consideration.

    I also have been thinking about the *spoilers from this point* fact that you are forced to "juice up" early to continue the game. The dev team must have discussed this, considering that forcing a plasmid onto the player the way it has been depicted generates quite an uneasy feeling (you get "dirty" or you don't play the game (for more than 4 minutes)). Which is then taken into the rest of the game. Still, personally, I would have prefered the choice. Sigh.
    Edited by 1 at 23/08/07 @ 22:17

  • jonnyreb #771 5 years ago

    168 left to go................

  • patchbox360 #772 5 years ago

    this game better be great after all these comments - no doubt it will

    virtua fighter 5 online, bioshock, Gears, Mass Effect, Halo 3

    thank you 360

  • jonnyreb #773 5 years ago

    Don't forget Two Worlds :) That looks good I think

  • darc #774 5 years ago

    "Still, personally, I would have prefered the choice. Sigh."

    Not quite a spoiler... more like a self-spoiler. ;)

    I don't mind that there was no choice (since I'd not likely have chosen to ignore half the game...) but I *do* mind that there was no exposition to even make the decision seem rational. They'd already introduced the radio transmissions, so all it would have taken is for Scottish-sounding-guy to chime in and say, "now listen up, if you want to survive you'll need to etc etc." Instead I get to watch myself do the very last thing I'd do in light of all experiences up to that point. Sketchy...

    But no matter. It's true - the game does just keep getting better. :)
    Edited by 1 at 23/08/07 @ 21:32

  • chischis #775 5 years ago

    The anti-activation hostility starts heating up. PC Gamer's (USA?) official word:
    [link url=http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6696
    ]http://fo rums.2kgames.com/forums/showthr...[/link]

    Those of you that have bought the game and installed it, I hope that's the PC you want to CONTINUE playing it on...

  • VMerken #776 5 years ago

    @darc

    "...but I *do* mind that there was no exposition to even make the decision seem rational."

    Yes, but I think the reason I described above is why they made it like this. It would have been a piece of cake to get the voice actor to say a few more lines at that point to reassure you that you'll need the plasmids. And I bet the dev team has those lines locked away, somewhere. But, by keeping them out of the game at that point, the result is that noone is holding your hands when you decide to inject a decidedly gigantic syringe filled with a completely unknown fluid into your (player character's) bloodstream. You, and only you are responsible for making the choice. Even though the game kind of forces it upon you if you wish to actually play it beyond the intro map :).

    "Instead I get to watch myself do the very last thing I'd do in light of all experiences up to that point."

    Exactly :). I cursed silently once I realised what had to be done (no "clean" runs? Wth?). Why couldn't I use an explosive, or the wrench as a prybar? Anything except that horrible alternative. And even though it's a dev's choice I do not agree with, its effect on the player cannot be denied. So, well done dev team. Sort of :).

    PS: Oh and please don't think I'm one to forfeit half the game. Of course I was going to do subsequent runs all plasmid- and ADAM-ed up :), I merely hoped clean runs were an option (an extra role to play, so to speak) and am slightly disappointed by that.
    Edited by 1 at 23/08/07 @ 22:38

  • VMerken #777 5 years ago

    All right, I've been mild about chischis' topic so far, but this quote from Dan Stapleton's PC Gamer article is blowing my mind:

    "... After four minutes on hold [Canadian Customer hotline to reactivate copy -ed] , I was told that the only way they'd unlock it is ***if I take a photo of the disc and the manual and email it to them***. Wow… even Microsoft doesn’t make you do that."

    Yes, Dan. "Wow...". My thought exactly. So what happens to owners of the Collector's Edition if they run into the same situation? Do they have to send a picture of the Big Daddy figurine as well, with a good view of the product number?

    Dan appears to have followed the right course of action - the only thing I can think of is that he wasn't online (or Securom didn't detect him as online) while uninstalling. If that wasn't the case, then we'd actually have a 2-installs limit on a full-price game?! What? And worse still, we have to take pictures of our purchase as proof to get a reactivation?

    I shudder to think how this will be handled in Europe. Tomorrow, I will check the box carefully to see if the above is explicitly mentioned on it. Consumer transparency, and all that, you know.

    We just might get 1000 posts here...

  • chischis #778 5 years ago

    Come on then George? Where are you?

    Oh yes, you're quiet now, aren't you? Paid for the game then? Eat your words you sarcastic, smarmy imbecile.

    Yes, I realise I'm being particularly vitriolic about this, towards someone I don't even know. But we're all on a slippery slope here: Bioshock is a SINGLE PLAYER, OFFLINE game. This kind of activation may be fair for RENTING games, but for software you're purchasing at full price, it's damned disgraceful (don't get me started on the SecuROM rootkit bollocks). If we stand by and let publishers enforce this bullshit, more games will start to use it. Then try to define "ownership".

    Oh, you'll notice it hasn't stopped Xbox 360 players with modded consoles playing downloaded copies.
    Edited by 1 at 23/08/07 @ 23:17

  • chischis #779 5 years ago

    Wish I made this up, but *cough*, as quoted from 4chan (whatever that is?):

    "Is man not entitled to the game he buys?

    NO, says the man at Securom. It belongs to 2K.
    NO, says the man at 2K. It belongs to us.
    NO, says the man at Microsoft. It belongs to our license purchasers.

    I rejected those answers.

    Instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose...piracy! Where the gamer would not be censored, where the PC owner would not be bound by petty encryption, where the buyer would not be constrained by corporate greed. And with the downloading of your torrents, piracy could become your salvation."

    Funny though this is... I do wish people would stop misusing the word piracy. If you're a paying customer and choose to use a crack... is that piracy? No. And neither is downloading the game without paying for it. Piracy is SELLING or PURCHASING an illegally made COPY of the game. But no, people can't be bothered to understand Copyright law...
    Edited by 1 at 23/08/07 @ 23:26

  • chischis #780 5 years ago

    Tried there. Still no official word other than Elizabeth's statement.

  • Fitzmogwai #781 5 years ago

    "Funny though this is... I do wish people would stop misusing the word piracy. If you're a paying customer and choose to use a crack... is that piracy? No. And neither is downloading the game without paying for it. Piracy is SELLING or PURCHASING an illegally made COPY of the game. But no, people can't be bothered to understand Copyright law..."


    Whatever your definitions are, chischis, downloading a commercial product without paying for it is theft. You might disagree with the industry, you might disagree with DRM, whatever, but if you haven't paid for the product, you're stealing it.

    Use a crack on a game you've already bought, no-one with any common sense could argue with that (of course, licensing lawyers are another story), but rip something off, that's wrong, no matter how you try to justify it.

  • VMerken #782 5 years ago

    Looks like things are looking up a bit for those worried about PC Bioshock (see final august 23 entry):

    [link url=http:/ /www.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/home.html
    ]http://ww w.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/hom...[/link]

    Up to 5 reinstalls/activations and a revoke tool + increased FOV tool/patch in the works.

    Corrected customer support numbers only for US and Canada right now, though :/

    I feel somewhat better now.
    Edited by 1 at 24/08/07 @ 02:56

  • smoothn00dle #783 5 years ago

    this is not normal here..

  • DjFlex52 #784 5 years ago

    Well, my Bioshock showed up last night :D
    All I have to say is that if you don't enjoy Bioshock ALOT (minor flaws included)then you're not a true gamer.

    There...I said it :)

    /clicks monitor back to Bioshock

  • Fitzmogwai #785 5 years ago

    So I preloaded Bioshock on Steam over the last few days (yes, i know this is a 360 thead, but there you go.) My only minor gripe with Steam is the time zones. If I was waiting outside the shop when it opened this morning (and I had taken the day off work, of course), I could be playing Bioshock now. But because steam works on Valve time I have to wait until 5pm tonight to play it.

    Damnit! If you're going to make me wait for the UK release, and pay UK prices, at least unlock the damn game on a UK timescale. I wanted to start playing on Friday, 00:01 BST, not seventeen hours later. Swines!

  • Pac #786 5 years ago

    "only" 8 out of 10 in Edge they seem very dissapointed with it for reason or another.

    Not as dissapointed as I am for not receiving my copy from Asda online even though it was depatched 2 days ago.

    Bastards.

    Could be worse, Heavenly Sword only got 6 - ouch!

  • Azazel #787 5 years ago

    Yes, but Edge are joyless, pretentious wankers.

  • DuncDisorderly #788 5 years ago

    Pac, that makes two of us that havent recieved our copies from Asda today.

    Last time I pre-order from them, Useless gits! ; )

  • Pac #789 5 years ago

    @Azazel

    I know. Still read it though.

    Might have to read a few more reviews of Heavenly Sword before I make my mind up on that one.

    Worringly, they say Bioshock is great for a couple of hours but then it doesn't really go anywhere - I am sure they are wrong on this one though.

    Kill Joy wankers.

  • Pac #790 5 years ago

    @DuncDisorderly

    Might be because they are sending it from the channel Islands.

    Not even sure if they are delivered by Royal Mail or not, so there could be some hope yet :)

    Otherwise it wont be delivered until Tuesday! (sob)

    At this rate I'll have to play Space Giraffe instead.

  • menage #791 5 years ago

    I played it for 2 nights in a row now. What a fucking incredible piece of software.

    Pretty hard too, but I suck at shooters.

  • -TKF- #792 5 years ago

    SecRom on the PC version that limits the number of installs, currently 2.

    Widescreen support sux

    l

  • Nallen #793 5 years ago

    Play came up with the goods yesterday, I played for about 2 hours, then a friend came over and wanted to see it from the start so I played the same section again.

    Second run through I probably saw about 30% more content so without a doubt it'll be getting multiple run throughs. Second time I played Half Life 2 I don't remember seeing anything new at all, that speaks volumes to me.

  • Fitzmogwai #794 5 years ago

    2K are at least "improving" the SecuRom problem, and completely fixing the widescreen "issue" in a patch. Publisher does listen to public (a bit) shocker!

    [link url=http:/ /www.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/home.html
    ]http://ww w.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/hom...[/link]

    Edited by 1 at 24/08/07 @ 11:55

  • menage #795 5 years ago

    "SecRom on the PC version that limits the number of installs, currently 2.

    Widescreen support sux

    l

    "

    Well, go play some inferior game then which can be cracked and has widescreen. Your loss.

  • TonyCocaCola #796 5 years ago

    I got my missis to pick it up this morning, im chuffed coz she got the special edition which i didnt specifically ask for and now i get to play with the toy without her thinking i wanted it,... if you get what i mean.

    Now i can play bioshock in the bath.

  • SleepyMagpie #797 5 years ago

    ZOMG TonyCocaCola, Mr. Bubbles in teh Bubble Bath r00lz!

    Can I have your stuff?!! By that I mean your Big Daddy model, oh and your girlfriend of course?

    No, seriously. ^^

  • TonyCocaCola #798 5 years ago

    Girlfriend -yes, Big Daddy -No way man

  • CannonAnBall #799 5 years ago

    I've played a short time on it. Want to wait until I finish my work really before delving right in.

    It's incredible really. I was actually scared at one point. I turned round, saw nothing, carried on searching, heard a noise behind me (5.1 goodness!) and when i turned round again something ran across the room at the same point I heard some womans insane voice. Quality.

  • Decap #800 5 years ago

    Got my CE today. The Big Daddy is quite nice, much heavier and bigger than I anticipated. Feels like a real statue instead of a cheap plastic-figure. :)

    Dont have the time at hand to start the game yet, must wait till sunday.

  • rhinoxious #801 5 years ago

    I cancelled my asda pre-order on wednesday when the site said they hadn't shipped it yet.

    Got mine this morning from Game, lessened the pain by trading in Forza 2.

  • viper_h #802 5 years ago

    The Houdini Splicers are fucking scary.

    Scariest bit for me was in a room full of steam. was searching a desk and suddenly everything got really steamy. tried to back up but couldn't, so i turned round and there's a splicer standing right there! Made me jump anyway.

  • Fitzmogwai #803 5 years ago

    Damn you and your spoilers, Viper. I haven't played it yet. Now you've ruined it. RUINED IT, I tell you. I wonder if I can get a refund from Steam.

  • darc #804 5 years ago

    Re: "PC gamer's official word" looks like the problem was more serious than I realized and maybe I owe chischis an apology. A photo of the disc and manual - unbelievable!!! Eating my shorts as promised... But glad 2K is already making improvements. Spitting out shorts, and gratefully LOL.

    Glad the DRM complications didn't slow me down any. I guess I was lucky this time.

  • viper_h #805 5 years ago

    Sorry :p

  • Fitzmogwai #806 5 years ago

    You will be, once I've learned how to shoot lightning from my fingers :)
    Edited by 1 at 24/08/07 @ 16:37

  • mattigan #807 5 years ago

    So is it any good then?

  • dllord #808 5 years ago

    Just got my copy from blockbusters for £35! Yay!

  • herrpoon #809 5 years ago

    Eppendorfs are great, Pete.

  • Carpathian #810 5 years ago

    I knew it was too good to be true - slapped Bioshock in the drive and have had two "This disc is unreadable" errors within 40mins and kicked out, losing my time, in the usual way each time. Anybody else?

    Just curious as Oblivion had this issue and got patched so any clues, EG folks?

  • mattigan #811 5 years ago

    No problems here, this game is AWESOME!!!!!! Everyone buy it now, really, NOWWWWW!!!!!!!!

  • Doogle #812 5 years ago

    My Big Daddy has a snapped off arm :(.

    Its lying in the box.

    Bah!

  • Carrybagma #813 5 years ago

    heh more first impressions please

    1000 posts looks well doable

  • mattigan #814 5 years ago

    ***SPOILER***
















    When they say that the Demo was a directors cut it is true but it's pretty much the same they just moved bits around so unfortunately it is a case of Deja Vu when you get the full game, it really starts to pick up at the point that the demo part ends though.














    ***End of Spoiler***
    So far it's top notch on all levels, gameplay, visuals, audio, AI, the lot!!


    Buy this game, you won't be dissapointed!
    Edited by 3 at 24/08/07 @ 20:54

  • kinggid #815 5 years ago

    I'm impressed with the metal case of the PC version -very classy. Haven't had time to play the thing yet though. Bit scared to play it now - what if it disappoints?

  • Wendelius #816 5 years ago

    Well, if I ever wondered how to make play with shadows, smoke effects and everything goes dark sequences right, I'd have found the game to teach me. Goodness. I play sitting on the ground against my sofa and more than once I've tried to jump on the sofa, much to the amusement of my wife. :)

    I love love love how the game rewards exploration. If you make the effort to reach an area, you will find something there to make it worth your while.

    I'm having trouble with my plasmid supply though. Health is fine but boy are they stingy with those blue syringes... Guess I'll have to start spending my dollars.

    Called it a night and probably won't be able to play until after the week-end but I'm looking forward to it.

    Oh, and the orchestral score is available to download for free here: [link url=http:/ /www.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/home.html
    ]http://ww w.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/hom...[/link]

    Enjoy.

    Wendelius

  • Brogan #817 5 years ago

    picked this up for the 360 yesterday while buying my new hdtv. total geekgasm. shagged now though didn't get to sleep til about half 2 this morning had to be up for 4 to get to work

  • DjFlex52 #818 5 years ago

    It's amazing that so many Sony and Nintendo gamers talk about how f*cked up 360 gamers and fanboyz are but throughout the game forums from many game sites I've seen gamers give Bioshock a 1/10. That's saying Ratatouille, Shrek The Third, Harry Potter and even Super Rub-a-Dub are better in their eyes.

    There are alot of jealous Ninty and Sony boys and girls destroying the true ratings for Bioshock throughout the internet with these low scores....it's a shame!

  • Xerx3s #819 5 years ago

    Lol at the daft idiots who gave this a one. Being really desperate now behind your fanboy shield of anonymity. EG would do good by making it possible to view who gave what score so these utter fanboy twats can't hide behind anonymity any more.

  • Xerx3s #820 5 years ago

    It doesn't really matter. Bioshock is No. 1. They can give it zero's for all we care, it will still be the highest rated game ever.

  • Nikanoru #821 5 years ago

    Alright, so:

    [link url=http://games.slashdot.org/games/07/08/24/213256.shtml ]http://ga mes.slashdot.org/games/07/08/24...[/link]
    [link url=http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6664
    ]http://fo rums.2kgames.com/forums/showthr...[/link]

    Even the DEMO of Bioshock installs a fucking root kit apparently.

    A root kit. In the DEMO. They didn't mention anything about that in their fucking apology. Uninstalling does not get rid of it.

    All you good little consumers go right ahead and be happy with your internet activations, limited installs and virus shit (talking about the idiots in this thread arguing in favour of them). Yeah, keep supporting it. Is the water getting warm yet, froggy?

  • GamesConnoisseur #822 5 years ago

    Word of warning, apparently some X360 owners like myself who played BioShock smoothly then for some reason the game then regularly freezes for 1 or 2 seconds then carry on as normal. Happening 3 times per minutes or so which killed the game for me.

    Solved when I removed HDD and smooth as baby bottom once again, still it give me excuse to get 120 GB HDD! I had HDD for a long time and filled it up once or twice before deleting files. So that may account for the freezing, just an advice in case anyone else have same problem.

    By the way yeah got the same fright in the steam room!!

  • viper_h #823 5 years ago

    @Nikanoru: RTFA. SecuROM is not a rootkit.

  • Miths #824 5 years ago

    I usually don't play shooters (in fact I don't think I've ever gotten further than a couple of hours into one before), but I couldn't resist getting Bioshock off Steam last night - it's been a while since the last time I played for nearly eight hours straight :).
    I do think the "RPG light" features - and of course the amazing graphics, sound and atmosphere - are what keeps me playing, but after I (hopefully) complete Bioshock I think I better give the FPS genre another try.
    I've even managed to avoid motion sickness this time, probably because of the exploration factor in Bioshock, rather than just having to run around like a madman, constantly turning corners and spinning around :).

    Oh, and once again a few players managed to show there's absolutely zero reason for developers to not at least unofficially support Windows 2000 (which seemingly half of them suddenly decided to stop doing earlier this year). A tiny hex edit of one dll file and another one copied to a different folder and the game is running just fine.

  • wiiluv360andps3 #825 5 years ago

    jesus christ, a rating is a rating, as long as you personnaly enjoy the game what does it matter what others think of it

  • quantumsheep #826 5 years ago

    Usually I have Fridays 'off' from Mrs Sheep, but she stayed so I got playing quite late-ish last night.

    Finally stopped for some sleep around mid-day today.

    It really is just fantastic. Chose to rescue the girls instead of harvesting them (well, Mrs Sheep was watching for a long while and I didn't want her to think I was some kind of monster!) so I can see myself going back and re-playing this to harvest them at some point.

    Absolutely loving this. With Space Giraffe, Trauma Centre and this out recently, I've got my gaming mojo back! =D

  • mattigan #827 5 years ago

    Doesn't look like it's going to get to the 1k mark. Still broke the record though.

  • kinggid #828 5 years ago

    Anything is possible mattigan.

    Don't let the dream die.

  • indian23 #829 5 years ago

    BioShock ftw

  • indian23 #830 5 years ago

    Anything is possible mattigan.

    Don't let the dream die.

  • indian23 #831 5 years ago

    must

  • indian23 #832 5 years ago

    hit

  • indian23 #833 5 years ago

    nine

  • indian23 #834 5 years ago

    hundred

  • indian23 #835 5 years ago

    be

  • indian23 #836 5 years ago

    game ever

    NINE HUNDRED

  • indian23 #837 5 years ago

    BIOSHOCK'D

  • Nikanoru #838 5 years ago

    viper_h: technically it may not be, but it contains rootkit-like functionality, which is all that matters. Continue defending it, frog.

    Oh, and:

    http://i17.tinypic .com/6c8i5hy.jpg

  • bodypopper #839 5 years ago

    Started played it at 9pm last night, went to bed at 6am this morning. I think I like it ;-)

  • captainrentboy #840 5 years ago

    Been on it for around 8 hrs now, I'm filling out a psycho's photo board with my own snaps at the moment (If you've finished it, you'll know what I'm on about)
    Damn impressed with the whole thing so far, definitely my game of the year at the moment.
    Like a few have said, I haven't played anything for years that brings on the same amount of dread, and anxiousness about what's coming up around the corner, it's one spooky mo-fo, the amazing lighting and sound work really ups the atmosphere.

  • quantumsheep #841 5 years ago

    ***WARNING-MAY CONTAIN SPOILERS***


    @floppylobster

    "- Why would I inject something into myself without prompting?
    - After a bad reaction why do I from then on keep injecting it happily?
    - "My Genetic code is being re-written"? What the hell does that mean anyway?
    - My character only gets a couple of lines at the start but he seems slightly arrogant. Why does he choose to help the guy's family? I wouldn't, so I should have a choice not to, or a better reason to (like he wouldn't help me if I didn't). "


    These questions are kind of explained later on. Though in a manner that you may find 'not realistic'. But hey, I thought it was great, and a real 'Fight Club' moment!

    Hope that helps


    ***END OF POSSIBLE SPOILERS***

  • darkbhudda #842 5 years ago

    Astounding game. Lots of little references if you know your Objectivism.

    Haven't tried killing the little girls yet, rescuing them is a sublime experience.

    Love the 40s styling, at times reminiscent of Fallout, though that was more 50s influenced. The 40s music is well placed and forms the basis of some black humour. Any game with The Ink Spots and Perry Como is a must buy in my book.

  • MrsPacMan #843 5 years ago

    WTF!!

  • defdaz #844 5 years ago

    Got the PC edition the other day and tbh its not as good as I was hoping. Doesn't seem to be better (in terms of graphics and gameplay) than HL2, for instance. Its a different type of game to Gears of War but for my money Gears is by far the most enjoyable and memorable experience.

    Then again, I've not finished Bioshock yet so ...

    And is there any consensus yet on which version is better?

  • DrunKao #845 5 years ago

    onward to 1000! We need some controversy.

  • DrR0b3rts #846 5 years ago

    Reason #909 to love this game: the little cartoons that illustrate what the upgrades do.

  • Lemming81 #847 5 years ago

    Really looking forward to playing the full game of this. The demo was good, but I only hope they got rid of that laughable whale model at the beginning. It looked fucking awful.

  • immateriaux #848 5 years ago

    Bit disappointed in this so far, good but not nearly as good as I was expecting from reading the review - though I can understand how it would get an XBox owner much more excited given the dearth of really good games on the platform.

    Wish I'd known too about the horrible protection mechanism in play with the PC version: firstly, I'm regularly getting "no cd in drive" type messages and failures to launch, I've had one massive lock up whilst trying to launch the game with BioShock defying any attempt to kill the process in the background and now I discover it's stuck a rootkit on my system too.

    If I'd know all this prior to buying I would not have bought the game.

  • login_name #849 5 years ago

    Good game, although the review goes a little over the top - a bit over excited me thinks. Certainly one of the prettiest games I've played. Gameplay wise, it reminds me of Deus X (the original) more than anything else. The atmosphere is more akin to SS2 than Deus X though, being more horror than sci-fi thriller. I wouldn't exactly say this pushes the bar, that was done a good few years ago. This is just a little more polished.

    However, very enjoyable and certainly a must buy.

  • dllord #850 5 years ago

    Must..... reach.....1000.....posts!!!!!

  • quantumsheep #851 5 years ago

    @login_name

    I think the reason it's been so well received was because, in general, people LOVED the two games you mention - so an updated version, with awesome style, art direction, and imagination etc is seen as a good thing! =D

  • lefizz #852 5 years ago

    Got this on saturday morning and i have to say its bloody ruined my bank holiday weekend.

    Brilliant game, never played anything as richly and loving design in my 25 odd years gaming. Just for the work that been put in and the atmosphere it creates it deserves a 10. Seems like someone one set out to make the game of there lives and delivered, its not without faults, the camrea gets dull and you forget to use it, the actual combat gets too difficult for no reason and the vitial pod doesnt work that weel you often end up saving to keep you health and plasmid energy but as a whole it is quite brilliant. make my preveous fav game of this generation Oblivion seems a bit flat compared.

    By the way Blockbuster were selling it when everyone else had sold out on the Isle of Dogs for £35 with a free face plate with seems like a bloody steal to me.

    If you havea a 360 you simply have to get this game.

  • JaysonG #853 5 years ago

    sounds good.

  • mattigan #854 5 years ago

    It is

  • quantumsheep #855 5 years ago

    Big time =D

    Edit: I've been wondering about something pretty much all the way through this game and it's this:

    Is it really wrong to ask your significant other to call you 'Mr Bubbles' in bed?
    Edited by 1 at 27/08/07 @ 19:50

  • mattigan #856 5 years ago

    Not if she's got glowing yellow eyes and is weilding a funky blood filled syringe.

  • login_name #857 5 years ago

    @quantumsheep

    I totally agree, it's been too long a wait. I still think the review is a little over the top though.

  • bdgr #858 5 years ago

    It's a very good game this, don't get me wrong, but isn't it slightly easy?! I mean, if you die you respawn not too far away with the only penalty being not too much health. All enemies you shoot before dying don't recover any health and the security alarms reset. I find that if I set off an alarm I wait to get killed by the robots instead of tryng to fight them to stay alive, and then go back and try not to set them off again.

    That's my main gripe. In other games where there are (proper) checkpoints if you die everything resets (including the bad guys health) and it makes you think of how to overcome the problem you face. With bioshock it doesn't matter - just keep shooting and dying until your foe dies and then carry on.

    10/10 is a bit too OTT. 9, or maybe even 8 is what I'd give it.

    It looks the dogs nuts tho, it really does!

  • Amazing Bryan #859 5 years ago

    Got it this afternoon for the 360 and have only just stopped playing it. All of the games I've got on the 360 so far have been completed within a couple of weeks, due to trying to savour the longitivety, but this game cannot be put down once you pick it up.

    The amount of different ways of playing it seems immense and I'm only on the 4th level. This game is easily going to be the benchmark for all fps, as everything else is going to pale in comparison.

    I know it's not a true fps, but going back to playing games with unlimited amounts of ammo and hundered of enemies is going to feel like a step backwards.

  • quantumsheep #860 5 years ago

    Just finished it, and I have to say, I'm really having to fucking fight the temptation to start it up all over again right NOW!!!

    Great game =)

  • DjFlex52 #861 5 years ago

    "I know it's not a true fps, but going back to playing games with unlimited amounts of ammo and hundered of enemies is going to feel like a step backwards."


    Bioshock should be called an rps : role-playing shooter :)
    Thats what Deus Ex and SS2 were, IMO. I'd rather play a rps than a standard fps.
    I was hoping Mass Effect took that route but it looks like it will a rpg with 3rd p shooting.

  • TonyCocaCola #862 5 years ago

    Finished the game yesterday. 100% awesome. Going to start a new game tonight.

  • DrunKao #863 5 years ago

    So... is the PC version still the definitive?

  • kinggid #864 5 years ago

    I have the PC version. Any opinions on which is best for this game - Keyboard+Mouse or Xbox 360 Controller?

  • zoidberg #865 5 years ago

    come on people, push this thing over 1000.

    EG deserves it.

  • Sebo #866 5 years ago

    Puuuuuuuuuussssshhhhhh

    Anyone know why some shops aren't selling the tinned edition?

  • Xerx3s #867 5 years ago

    Doesn't look like it's going to get to the 1k mark. Still broke the record though.

    No it isn't. Lot's of other games that are way over this number, GoW got 1300 I believe.

  • Xerx3s #868 5 years ago

    Sebo: They are, it's most likely sold out by now.

  • kinggid #869 5 years ago

    Gears of War got 816 comments (+ 234 for the multiplayer review)

    So it appears this is the record.

    ...I should be working...
    Edited by 1 at 28/08/07 @ 15:37

  • patchbox360 #870 5 years ago


    heard edge gave bioshock an 8

    fu*k that

  • TDS #871 5 years ago

    This is a good game

  • Ryltar #872 5 years ago

    An 8?! that is so typical of them, just to stand out I bet.

  • Roachdog #873 5 years ago

    Adding my contribution to hitting the 1k mark.

    Absolutely awesome experience, it's been a long time since a game has managed to captivate me in this way..... one of the few I've played where the hype has actually delivered.

    Bravo :-)

  • MasterNameless #874 5 years ago

    Oh no, I must say the link I have provided below is by far the best and most accurate review of BioShock out there.

    [link url=http://www.sony defenseforce.com/?p=83
    ]http://www.sony defenseforce.com/?p=83
    [/link]

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

    Silly Sony fanboys.

  • symmetry #875 5 years ago

    Come on, 1000 posts people.

    Big daddies - best way to take them down is use "Hypnotise Big Daddy" on one, then go up to another and shoot it. Then sit back and watch the fight :)

  • DjFlex52 #876 5 years ago

    i guess it really should be:

    Nintendo platforms - 913k
    Playstation platforms - 595k
    poor lonely MS platform stuck in 3rd - 170k

  • MasterNameless #877 5 years ago

    With the addition of the original Xbox numbers though, MS would probably still be loosing. Although, if we're speaking platforms, would that not include all versions of windows too? Microsoft may then stamp upon all competition with their mighty boot!

    Which all goes prove the original comparison from the Sony fanboy's site to be all the more irrelevant and ridiculous!

  • Pulsar_t #878 5 years ago

    +1

    Oh and screw the PC version.

  • indian23 #879 5 years ago

    oh

  • Kryon #880 5 years ago

    That has got to be the funniest website I've ever seen, the pure unadulterated desperation of it all is just phenomenal ! Hilarious :D

    ..Surely though, the people/person running that site must know that they're actually doing the PS3 a severe disservice. I mean just admitting that the console/brand needs 'defending' says it all tbh, anyway, still comedy gold for sure.

  • Carrybagma #881 5 years ago

    It's a piss-take site.

    Allegedly..

  • Kryon #882 5 years ago

    I bloody hope so ;)

  • indian23 #883 5 years ago

    ooks like the gaming world still belongs to Sony.

  • Amazing Bryan #884 5 years ago

    That has got to be the biggest flames of a comments thread ever. This one was my favourite.

    "I just want you to die so i can shit on your grave"

  • mattigan #885 5 years ago

    It is a poor mans ukrestance.co.uk

    On another note why does the front page display 950 comments, but the jump to box below only 939??

  • MrE26 #886 5 years ago

    It makes me sad that i've finished this astonishing game & won't ever get to experience that first playthrough ever again.
    Best game i've played in years, a truly amazing piece of work. The world of Rapture is both amazingly beautiful & genuinely unsettling & the story that's woven through it had me totally hooked. It just does so much right & very little wrong.
    From the amazing opening, it just gets better & better & i really hope people take notice of this & it sells in droves. For a game like this to be overlooked while EA's endless yearly updates fly off the shelves would be a crime IMO.

  • masterson #887 5 years ago

    MrE26 said it all. A solid 10/10 if ever there was one. The kind of game that reminds me why I play games in the first place. I'm actually gutted to have finshed it...

  • viper_h #888 5 years ago

    47 to go

    I like bioshock.
    Edited by 1 at 29/08/07 @ 10:23

  • mattigan #889 5 years ago

    I don't like Bioshock. . . . . . . . I LOVE IT!!!!!!

  • TonyCocaCola #890 5 years ago

    So chaps. Anyone here tried goin back to system shock 2? I really want to but it wont run on my PC, some fucking xp bullshit no doubt. System shock 1 seems to work fine though which is strange

  • Frogger #891 5 years ago

    Last ! \o/

  • FaceOmeter #892 5 years ago

    Denied, frogger.... denied.
    ;)

  • zoidberg #893 5 years ago

    so... can we all just get behind these comments and PUSH to 1000?
    for EG's sake?

    anyway, last week in Leipzig, the Collector's Edition with the Big Daddy thingy was 59.99 euros! Compared to normal version which was just 49.99... That was a big choice. Anyway, the Big Daddy thingy seemed really well made... all metal-y and stuff...

  • TonyCocaCola #894 5 years ago

    Mine broke in the bath

  • robertster #895 5 years ago

    For some reason I can't get to the last page of comments.

    But I'm only saying this to help push for the big k.

    I agree with whoever was saying it is like a role-playing game, all that fire/electricity/ice stuff feels very much like Zelda. I keep expecting a scene where lighting a ring of torches opens a secret door.

  • zoidberg #896 5 years ago

    Playin' with your Big Daddy toy in the bath Tony?... that seems... normal. :)

  • Sebo #897 5 years ago

    Ooooh, is the metal toy thing worth it then?

  • chudders #898 5 years ago

    Enjoyable, but overrated.

    8/10

  • TonyCocaCola #899 5 years ago

    If you like that kinda thing, its pretty heavy plus you get the tin and a separate DVD making of type thingy, pretty good for an extra 10 quid

  • TonyCocaCola #900 5 years ago

    @Chudders, what sort of game would you give a 10/10?

  • viper_h #901 5 years ago

    "Look Mr. Adam, bubbles!"

  • Fitzmogwai #902 5 years ago

    /shudders

    Eww
    Edited by 1 at 29/08/07 @ 12:21

  • RichGL #903 5 years ago

    "Look Big Daddy, bubbles!"


    erm....

  • krudster #904 5 years ago

    Indeed, if this isn't a 10, what is?

    No game's perfect, but I know that in all the years of game reviewing (500 odd reviewed now, lost count) few have deserved top marks as much as this one. If this really is worth 8, then every other game around would be hovering around the 4, 5 and 6 mark.

  • Sebo #905 5 years ago

    I haven't played this so I don't know, but for those who are saying it's not a 10, let me know which games are, because I want to make sure I own them soon

  • PlugMonkey #906 5 years ago

    I think this is a strong case of the game being undermined by the hype. If someone tells you something is the Best Game Evar (TM) you're bound to look at it with an over critical eye.

    Personally, I'm only about an hour in and it has generally scared the crap out of me, intrigued me greatly, and I can't wait to get back to it tonight.

    But I think if you sit down to any game, film, TV series, album or book thinking "Go on then! Be the best thing ever! I dare you!" you're pretty much bound to be disappointed.

  • zoidberg #907 5 years ago

    people aren't pushing :(

  • symmetry #908 5 years ago

    You are right on the money there PlugMonkey, which is why when I first started up Bioshock, I was thinking: "There's no way it can be as good as everyone says it is, I bet it'll be crap".

    I do this with every over-hyped game and am very happy to be proven wrong most of the time.

  • wattoo #909 5 years ago

    It does things really well and everything seems so polished and the art direction is great and i love it, but it's not a 10 in my opinion. I haven't seen anything so far that's made me go "Wow! That's revolutionary!". It's all been done before, just not this well or this coherently.

  • TonyCocaCola #910 5 years ago

    I think the question you gotta ask is could they have made it any better. I dont think theres much more they could have done, its an awesome game, self contained and straight to the point. A true member of the system shock family.

  • superrobot #911 5 years ago

    @TonycocaCola
    "I think the question you gotta ask is could they have made it any better. "

    As a left-handed player I'm finding it a real problem
    to survive in this game (on the 360).
    Sadly they have not allowed the user to swap the control sticks
    which makes life a lot harder for those who prefer to aim with the left stick.
    (think of how hard it would be to use your other hand to control the mouse
    on a FPS on a PC)
    So yes they could have made it better.
    It also ignores the preferences in the 360 options.
    I've enjoyed the game in all other respects so far....but I'm not sure
    how much of it I'll get to see :(

  • Roachdog #912 5 years ago

    @ TonyCocaCola

    Apparantly there is a way to get System Shock 2 working on XP, I read it on a forum somewhere - you have to do a bit of code editing, if you google it, you should find out how...

    My new PC with Vista however - don't like my chances :-(

  • TonyCocaCola #913 5 years ago

    @superrobot
    Didnt notice that. Im sure the PC version will allow you to customise the controls though surely.

  • GamesConnoisseur #914 5 years ago

    Everyone has different rating system, I have sit in many job interview and often proven to be more critical than other panel members. However we were usually the same at rating some being higher and other of lower score, just on a different scaling/numbering.

    This is the same with the review score, such as Krudster who said if this is 8 then others will get 4 or 6 instead.

    Oh.. That mean poor old Blue Dragon which got 5 would be likely to get a 3?!! Or is that just the reviewer's scale is critical and thus for others more likely a 7? That makes more sense!!

    That is just for people who basically agreed or see things in same vein but on different scaling. Different matter for those who disagree and on a different perspective.

    Conclusion, NO rating system can ever be perfect on it own. Disagree? Refer me to a perfect and accurate system!

    Holey Moley, approaching 1000 posts!!

  • superrobot #915 5 years ago

    @ TonyCocaCola

    It's never as much of an issue with the PC as I can usually control which
    side the mouse is on (except after Mrs robot has been playing The Sims).

    I'll have to muddle on and hopefully it will click eventually, but too often
    I end up staring at a wall instead of strafing left while getting bludgeoned
    by splicers.

  • TonyCocaCola #916 5 years ago

    Splicers are twats.

  • Sebo #917 5 years ago

    I'm still waiting for someone to tell me a better game? So can I take it that when I do finally purchase this that I will be getting the best game ever?

    Can't remember who criticised it for not being inovative enough, but I always think that's a really harsh reason for marking something down. The wheel doesn't always have to be reinvented.

  • pigwhistler #918 5 years ago

    the trouble with a "out of 10" scale is its a bit too absolute - were it not for the occasional lockups and use of securom (no i didnt have any trouble installing - went on a treat!) I'd go for 10/10 - as is they knock it back to a 9 - no indication of the games quality but perhaps an indication that all is not right in the world.
    the "out of a 100 scale" i'd probably go for a 97% - 2% off for the activation system and 1% for occasional lockups.
    out of a 1000 scale... i'll stop now...
    A better game? maybe Civilization 4 but nothing FPS'ish.
    Edited by 1 at 29/08/07 @ 14:46

  • kinggid #919 5 years ago

    1000 posts by the end of the day - you mark my words

    Still haven't had a chance to play this yet but I take the tin case out once in a while and stroke it.

  • rhinoxious #920 5 years ago

    This game made me jump last night, and had my other-half hiding behind a sofa cushion in terror.

    Great stuff, so far, we haven't had this much 'fun' since resi 4.

    Is anyone finding it too easy on medium though, I'm going to play it through twice anyway I'd imagine, so I'm saving hard till later.

  • mattigan #921 5 years ago

    @rhinoxious

    Was it in the steam room as that one got me too!!!

  • rhinoxious #922 5 years ago

    @superrobot

    Agreed, I'm not a lefty but I cut my teeth playing goldeneye and perfer to look around with the left stick. I an play it the other way round but very occassionally (usually when I panic) I end up lookingat the ceiling.

    Let's hope they will rectify this when the inevitable LIVE patch comes along.

  • rhinoxious #923 5 years ago

    Spot on! that's the one, got a squeal from the missus and an expletive from me.

    Great atmosphere and solid design coming together.

  • TonyCocaCola #924 5 years ago

    I standing at the top of some stairs the other day in the frolic level or whatever it was called. Anyway just aving a look, turn round to find myself face to face with a splicer, he wasnt trying to attack me or anything he had just been standing behind me- his cat mask pretty much took up the whole screen, luckily i had the shotgun out. Still jolted me a bit.

  • TonyCocaCola #925 5 years ago

    @rhinoxious
    Yeah i think the game sometimes looks harder than it actually is. It looks dramatic without it being to hard to control,

  • mattigan #926 5 years ago

    I was just wondering, there have been strong hints that there is DLC in the works for Bioshock, with Levine all but outright admitting it. But I can't for the life of me think what more they could offer, what do you reckon?

  • TDS #927 5 years ago

    bug bait

  • JackyB #928 5 years ago

    Sebo. I have not got too far with it, but its in my top 10 games already. I still rate Mario 64, Goldeneye, Ocarina of time, Super Mario world better though. For my money its of a similar standding to Resi 4 or Metroid Prime. Though you will note that may of those are not similar games to Bioshock
    Edited by 1 at 29/08/07 @ 15:31

  • wattoo #929 5 years ago

    I liked (and this is said having not yet finished it so maybe it wll change) Bioshock, but I preferred Oblivion. I'm not saying Oblivion is better, just it suited my playing preferences more.

    I can't work out which I preferred out half Life 2 and Bioshock. Or which one is better.

  • Sebo #930 5 years ago

    Who can smell the 1000!!!!

    Thanks JackyB, that gives it some perspective.

  • Paolo_ray #931 5 years ago

    ... almost.

  • TonyCocaCola #932 5 years ago

    I think its gonna be such an anti climax getting to 1000

    typos
    Edited by 1 at 29/08/07 @ 15:46

  • JackyB #933 5 years ago

    Sebo. To give it some more perspective. Those fave games i listed were, for the most part, wholly revolutionary in terms of gameplay. Bioshock so far, is not. In terms of story it seems like it will be though, and i have to say i have never been so emotionally involved in a game before. You really do feel like your actions affect the course of proceedings. it may also be worth noting that i was able to devote a lot more time to those old classic games and may be viewing them through rose tinted speccies, as they were from my younger years, and in my gaming heydey where i could devote a whole half term to a game! now work spoils it :(

  • JackyB #934 5 years ago

    @sebo. Put it this way. Buy it

  • TonyCocaCola #935 5 years ago

    I think they should have more heavy metal in the game and call it Dioshock

  • Sebo #936 5 years ago

    @jackyB

    There's industry milestones , such as Mario 64, Streetfighter 2, Ocarina of Time, because they bring something completely new to the table

    And then there are games which are simply just better than anything that's gone before, like Goldeneye and Resi 4.

    So we are saying Bioshock is more of the Goldeneye/Resi 4 mould. That's cool. Still looking forward to playing it. Which hopefully won't long now.

    And we are past the 1000 it seems...........

  • TonyCocaCola #937 5 years ago

    No this is the 994th the external counter buggered up in the 800's i think

  • rhinoxious #938 5 years ago

    How many 1000th posts are we going to get (with inevitable edits)?

    and to stay on topic, do people find themselves using a wide range of plasmids? I always seem to have electro equipped, as it's good for most situations.

  • TonyCocaCola #939 5 years ago

    Yeah, electro and telekenesis were probably my most used ones. I dont think i bothered buying all the plasmid slots, didnt need them

  • Sebo #940 5 years ago

    Jesus, so it's still not at a 1,000??? The external is saying 1,007 now?

  • robertster #941 5 years ago

    Yeah, most of the plasmids are novelties, it's just the flame, electricity and telekinesis that I have permanently assigned. But that doesn't stop the others being top fun.

  • robertster #942 5 years ago

    One away...

  • robertster #943 5 years ago

    Me?

  • Sebo #944 5 years ago

    999, can I have an ambulance please???

  • TonyCocaCola #945 5 years ago

    Push it to 2000?

  • Sebo #946 5 years ago

    No way, 2000 can't be done

  • mattigan #947 5 years ago

    Now, everyone go back through and delete their comments, and see if we can get it back down to 0

  • JackyB #948 5 years ago

    @Sebo. It's somewhere inbetween a Resi 4 and a Mario 64 then :-). i would consider Goldeneye a milestone too though, if only for the trigger, the analogue stick, the objective based gameplay, the pacing, the graphics oh alright then everything. No console game had ever seen it before!

  • TonyCocaCola #949 5 years ago

    And the multiplayer is still awesome

  • TonyCocaCola #950 5 years ago

    How comes most of the splicers dont even use plasmids?
    Even though the reasons the people started becoming splicers was coz they "Messed up their mind with plasmids"

  • pigwhistler #951 5 years ago

    SPOILERS INCLUDED (unless you've played demo)

    I'm only on the arcadia level at the moment but have to disagree with most people about getting emotionally involved in the game. There seems to be little to explain your actions early in the game or to realistically push you forward to piloting the bathysphere.
    I mean, you've just been in a plane crash and manage to swim to safety. my first thought in this situation was to sit on the steps and wait to see 1. if survivors turned up, 2. if rescuers showed up - i mean there'd be a black box n all - and they'd know about the Rapture bathysphere station wouldnt they - hell how else would they populate the place - and the bathysphere seems pretty small for transporting people and items (i.e. infrastructure) down to rapture.
    Then, when you finally get down to rapture and go for your first plasmid - there's no build up to what you are doing - you just - oh theres a machine with a big needle in - i'll just shove that in my arm with no prompting or reason. Hell atlas doesnt even tell you to do it its just something that happens. Wouldnt your character be a bit more apprehensive of things like this following what they'd witnessed in the dock?
    Putting aside all thought on why your character so blindly follows the plan the plot from here the story unfolds nicely but i can't for the life of me feel any empathy for my character due to the way he's introduced to me - hopefully things will become a bit more clear later on...

  • kangarootoo #952 5 years ago

    @pigwhistler

    All will become clear if you play the full game.

  • zimzu #953 5 years ago

    anyone able to add substance to the rumour that is the installation of a rootkit when installing this game? i understand it has securom security and that this is an issue that has occured in the past... you'd hope that developers and publishers and what-not would get the hint after the first few slapped wrists =/

  • Fitzmogwai #954 5 years ago

    There is no rootkit. There is the SecuRom system, but that isn't a rootkit.


    Good show on the 1000 barrier, chaps.

  • krudster #955 5 years ago

    /claps.

    This doesn't beat our all-time thread, by the way. That was last year....some sort of PS3 feature if I recall. Got into the 1200s.

  • Amazing Bryan #956 5 years ago

    The electro plasmid uses too much eve though. I find myself only using it if there's an annoying turret of security camera I can't get around. I find enrage and incinerate to be the most useful in face-to-face combat, but it all depends on the situation really.

  • wiiluv360andps3 #957 5 years ago

    @krudster

    Is that some sort of challenge? If you don't think we can talk balls about bioshock for another 200 posts at least, then you are wrong

  • PastyMuncher #958 5 years ago

    Totally love this game. Best of its type by miles. My only gripe is the splicers and little sisters seem to say the things over and over. Takes the edge off a tiny bit, i think. An absolute must buy game tho, if good story and atmosphere are your thing. Its made me jump several times (epecially those bastards that play dead).

  • InsoFox #959 5 years ago

    @pigwhistler

    Oh, they will. They will.

  • Twincoil #960 5 years ago

    OK, so I'm guessing the random flashbacks to our protagonists parents are a nod to him having murdered them and this is, y'know, like is own personal hell and none of it is real?

  • Twincoil #961 5 years ago

    Oh, and the infinite lives bag is a bit lame. Other than that, great.

  • Carrybagma #962 5 years ago

    \o/

    Well done, comments-thread scum.

    :o)

  • thepiedpiper #963 5 years ago

    Phew just finished the game, twas great. Obviously I wont mention the ending but I will ask, does anyone know whether it has multiple endings? Do they mention it in the review? They probably do but I haven't looked. The only thing that annoyed me about this game (apart from ruining my social life) is it's one of those games that...hang on...is this spoilery? Give me sec and I'll think about it, nah, i don't think it is.

    So yeah the only thing that annoys me is that you can't save after you've finished so, unlike resi 4 and dead rising you can't carry over your stats. Must be just a capcom thing. Or does Bioshock do that and I'm just a 'tard?

    Answers on a postcard.

    Gosh I'm tired.

    Bedtime now....

  • GamesConnoisseur #964 5 years ago

    Second to Pied Piper, just finished BioShock, and yes it make a lot of things clearer when playing through the whole hog.

    As I understand there are two endings, I believe I have got to see the good ending as was determined to rescue every little sister from every level without guide/cheat.

    Played it at hard setting, was not that difficult, more harder in beginning without enough upgrades. I more regularly use the wrench in the last few levels! Saving up ammo and plasmids in case of any harder encounter.

    Beaten the final boss on second attempt. Those who have freezing problems and only solved by removing HDD, words of warning only can have two-three save slots on memory card!

    ..chain tattoo..

  • TDS #965 5 years ago

    vgg

  • Ryltar #966 5 years ago

    Ahh, I'm very near the end yet I wont be able to play for a week, so completion will have to wait!! gutted :p

    I love the fact that you can be the "candy man" in this game. Candy Man powers are freakin awesome.

  • immateriaux #967 5 years ago

    @@krudster -> "No game's perfect, but I know that in all the years of game reviewing (500 odd reviewed now, lost count) few have deserved top marks as much as this one. If this really is worth 8, then every other game around would be hovering around the 4, 5 and 6 mark."

    That's an interesting remark and one I'd agree with - ie other games should be hovering around 4,5 and 6 :)

    10 for me should be the score for a landmark game which I don't think Bioshock is. It is certainly excellent enough but it is a combination of existing game elements presented well, rather than a step onto a new vista, which is what some games have been ... so, what do they get, 11???

    Edit: though, having said that, perhaps I'm coloured from playing it on PC and comparing it with other PC experiences - maybe it actually is such a big step for the 360 platform?
    Edited by 1 at 30/08/07 @ 11:17

  • GamesConnoisseur #968 5 years ago

    I think we need to consider what we mean by having new elements to be worthy of 10. In the past due to hardware restrictions everything was 2D, and numbers of sprites displayed and so on.

    New genre introduced, different take of each genre and forth, having first aid or doing away with it. These are new elements which help make the game a landmark.

    Man, we are now at a point where we would not see so many new large elements being introduced, and thus perhaps at a same position as there is only seven type of stories being retold in books and films. 'Course better processing power in next generations will enable more physics and more realisation of games imagined in our minds.

    So what would you consider the best book and best film of the year? The subject matter and how it was written/directed? So the game should be judged on the same scale even if using the same engine/familar genre with a small subtle differences.

    Games as an entertainment as we know is maturing and hopefully in near future will be seen as an equal medium to other estabished formats.
    Edited by 1 at 30/08/07 @ 11:29

  • bdgr #969 5 years ago

    I have to moan at one thing in this game...

    When you collect the Telekinisis plasmid, and you can muck about with the tennis balls...

    Why aren't the balls nice and smooth and round?!

  • RichGL #970 5 years ago

    @Kangarootoo

    What? You mean you can't form a full and reasoned opinion of the game based upon playing the demo?

  • Katsumoto #971 5 years ago

    im just waiting for them to patch it so i can play with shaders on and without it crashing every 20 minutes or so. Grr

  • Saintaw #972 5 years ago

    Amazing game! One of the highest point is that I have almost finished it and have yet to notice a single bug. I don't remember having seen a bugless game in ... years!

    The one small thing i'm not too fond of is the 'hacking minigame' ... fortunately, there are plenty of alternatives to do this hacking 'automatically'.

    I've had some pretty nice action last night: it included a hacked camera, a couple of hacked turrets, some carefully placed mines...a friendly 'big-daddy'... and a lot of enemy splicers swarming. they all died painfully, with me firing nothing else but my camera. (i wish there was a way on the 360 to review the shots you've taken).

    Tip: Saving the 'little sisters' will get you less ADAM when performing the action, but is offset by them giving you 'gifts' (containing ADAM, dosh & other stuff)... it's well worth it.

    I'm not sure about replayability, looks like after 2-3 runs, the game will be too linear to enjoy again... but as a 1st run, it's excellent. Get it now.

  • Azazel #973 5 years ago

    /talks balls

  • Azazel #974 5 years ago

    balls balls balls

  • Frogger #975 5 years ago

    Last ! \o/

    Finally...

  • PlugMonkey #976 5 years ago

    Hardly...

  • DrunKao #977 5 years ago

    People, BioShock has made history in become the number 1 commented review ever on Eurogamer. This is a proud moment.

  • defdaz #978 5 years ago

    Wish I'd bought Bioshock on xbox360 rather than PC as forgive me if I'm wrong but the graphics and gameplay aren't really anything spectacular for the PC. Sure the game is oh so polished but a ground-breaking 10/10, no.

    I'm going to have to go back and play Gears as I'm sure the graphics and gameplay were much better... maybe it's nostalgia having a laugh with me? /shrug

  • smoothn00dle #979 5 years ago

    this score is just wrong

  • PlugMonkey #980 5 years ago

    Wish I'd bought Bioshock on xbox360 rather than PC as forgive me if I'm wrong but the graphics and gameplay aren't really anything spectacular for the PC. Sure the game is oh so polished but a ground-breaking 10/10, no.

    You are forgiven.

    Name five PC games that are its equal for graphics and gameplay. Your time starts...now!

    Edit: And as if buying it on 360 would some how have made it a better game, due to other 360 games not being as good. I'm beginning to regret replying to you at all.
    Edited by 1 at 31/08/07 @ 08:29

  • defdaz #981 5 years ago

    Yeah that's okay plugmonkey. I just meant that I have lower expectation levels with 360 games, for some reason. Should have explained, sorry.

  • PlugMonkey #982 5 years ago

    Even now you've explained, it still doesn't make any rational sense.

  • chischis #983 5 years ago

    Someone asked:

    Yes, there are multiple endings. Comes down to the only choice you're actually given in the game...

  • immateriaux #984 5 years ago

    Think it's about time Eurogamer did something formally to inform visitors of the DRM debacle with BioShock. Other gaming/PC related sites have taken up the baton to protect LEGITIMATE users of the product from having their system invaded by malicious software that hides and protects itself from removal, even after a Bioshock un-install, why are Eurogamer ignoring this issue?

    The fact that Bioschock snidely avoided informing users of the existence of this malicious software, plus avoided informing people of the fact that they would only get to reinstall the game twice (now upped to five) is a galling development that one would expect a genuine supporter of PC gaming to rail against.

  • DrunKao #985 5 years ago

    2000, can we do it? I say no, but as long as I keep making these unnecessary comments I'll at least be doing my part.

  • PlugMonkey #986 5 years ago

    DrunKao: +1

  • Perjoss #987 5 years ago

    System Shock 2 is still on my 'top 10 of great games of all time' list, so to say that i'm really really enjoying this one is a huge understatement. I hope they make at least one more game like this, one similar to system shock 2 would be great, there was a chilling feeling of isolation know that you were trapped on a huge space ship.

    ANYONE that has the ability of looking past visuals to find gameplay and depth, and is currently enjoying bioshock should give system shock 2 a try for sure (after finishing bioshock at least once of course), you will see how similar these 2 games are.

  • Perjoss #988 5 years ago

    "Is it really wrong to ask your significant other to call you 'Mr Bubbles' in bed?"

    It all depends on how small she is in size in comparison to you, and does she have child-like features?

  • Bremenacht #989 5 years ago

    A thousand years from now, our descendants will look back on this thread as an epoch in gaming. The EG bioshock comments thread is year zero.

    Oh, and +1 for any pointless comments that help string it out

    Pointless comments in the Bioshock comments thread is the new black.

  • PlugMonkey #990 5 years ago

    "It all depends on how small she is in size in comparison to you, and does she have child-like features?"

    And how big your drill is?
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    TAXI!!
    Edited by 2 at 31/08/07 @ 19:38

  • Rodriguez #991 5 years ago

    This game is utter brilliance!!!

  • MisterFalseName #992 5 years ago

    Given the success this is having, do you think there's any chance of them making System Shock 2 for Live Arcade?

    Probably just dreaming, but it'd be nice...

  • mattigan #993 5 years ago

    Finished it yesterday, with good ending, excellent game.

    If you haven't bought it yet, would you kindly go out and get it this instant! You wont be disappointed!
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/07 @ 10:29

  • Mercatoria #994 5 years ago

    What was the ending all about?

  • wiiluv360andps3 #995 5 years ago

    Think Gears is actually better than this. You get killed far too often in this game

  • MrsPacMan #996 5 years ago

    you're obviously rubbish then

    http://ga mers.eurogamer.net/fight.php?re...
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/07 @ 21:20

  • mattigan #997 5 years ago

    What was the ending all about?

    Which ending did you see?

  • wiiluv360andps3 #998 5 years ago

    @MrsPacMan

    How sad are you?

  • MrsPacMan #999 5 years ago

    kicked your monkey ass!!

  • Verwandlung #1000 5 years ago

    I'm finally playing it! And by God do I love it.. It has been a very very long time since I enjoyed a game so much. .

  • mattigan #1001 5 years ago

    So 1062 is the final count then, we nearly beat the record, roll on the Halo 3 review thread !!

  • rhinoxious #1002 5 years ago

    Last.

  • Carrybagma #1003 5 years ago

    There's more pointless life in this thread yet!

    For example:
    (To come) Which is better? Bioshock or Halo3?
    Now that you've played it to the end, is it still a 10/10?
    What would co-op have been like?
    (Ahem. I assuming there's no co-op of course. I've not played it u c)
    (To come) Which is better? Bioshock or Metroid?
    (To come) Which is better? Bioshock or Mario Party 13?
    etc

    Come on peeples - act like you're bored: post some crap. :o)

  • zimzu #1004 5 years ago

    not a 10/10 game unfortunately... story and atmosphere *check*. gameplay *N/A*

    the addition of the invincibility cheat for all (also known as the vita chamber) effectively means the whole game is nothing more than a minor irrelevant slow down in between leaking tidbits more atmosphere. who needs to fear death when they're invincible! utterly atmosphere destroying ultimately.

    i wonder how many people who voted on this game actually played it before they checked out the eurogamer review. i know i didnt, but i wasnt bought in by the coy and seductive words of *checks reviewers name* Kristan Reed.

    but more importantly, how many people were able to formulate their own opinions of this game without the words of *checks reviewers name again* Kristan Reed.

  • Carrybagma #1005 5 years ago

    Did you know that Kristan Reed never actually plays these games? It's true. He actually pays Chinamen to play games 24/7 and send him the .mp4s of how they got on. It's disgusting. Then he forces his own children to write the reviews, refusing to feed them until they're done. It's disgusting.

  • floppylobster #1006 5 years ago

    I posted a few hundred comments back and said I didn't really like the demo. But now I've played the full game I'd happily retract what I said. The game is great.

    I still get bored when hacking things and sometimes you can't really tell from where someone is shooting at you, (although I am playing through on the hardest difficulty because people said it was too easy, so maybe it's not as imperative to know on easier difficulties). And while the graphics are very, very impressive I still don't love the art direction as much as everyone seems to. But that could be because I grew up in a city with Art Deco architecture (however my city was not underwater). I also find 'creepy' little girls a bit of a cliché, and that goes for creepy circus carnival music too. The levels are quite small but the layers and detail packed into them is awesome. There's much to love, it's a solid 9/10, and I'm not disputing anyone who wants to give it a 10.

    Roll on 2000.
    Edited by 1 at 06/09/07 @ 13:53

  • GamesConnoisseur #1007 5 years ago

    I am content at having played through hard difficulty and got to see the good ending, it is memorable game, one of the few that will standout among me too crowd.

    Very solid 9 out of 10, DESPITE freezing problems which I solved by removing HDD. Now got new 120 GB HDD and will give it a go along with a patch that is live as of yesterday. Seem to be worse for some?!

  • mattigan #1008 5 years ago

    DLC should definately include a "Malfunctioning Vita Chamber plot device" to ramp up the dificulty for those who want to spend time loading save games rather than getting straight back to the action. Or maybe force you to manually use the Vita Chamber to save your game? What do you reckon?

  • zimzu #1009 4 years ago

    the addition of a "difficulty" level is surely a joke, since invincibility basically boils everything down to "trained monkey" level. a patch where the vita chamber charges you adam/max life/cash would be a far better solution. still need to do something about the combat though, its boring as hell...

  • mattigan #1010 4 years ago

    it's as boring as you make it

  • Ryze #1011 4 years ago

    Damn this game's caused a stir.

    Hurry up with that damn falcon chipset, M$!

  • dryden555 #1012 4 years ago

    I'd give Bioshock an 8 if it had an ounce of replayability or any difficulty at all. Bioshock's atmosphere is perfect I'll give it that, but, even there, the story falters quite a bit at the end. Not a 10 game.
    Edited by 1 at 11/09/07 @ 03:25

  • pigwhistler #1013 4 years ago

    Just finished it last night, agree its not a 10, more of an 8 as you say. the vita chambers does make it a mad rush through and your own invincibility does distract a bit. Would be better if either the vita chamber charged you (as zimsu suggests) might make you think a bit more about how you approached combat, or even resetting damage on the last foe to full health would have added a lot more to the game.
    Ending was a little disappointing but storyline was superb up to that point. At end of day it was still the old doom style play of collect such and such parts to progress - very linear -i don't mind this so much though but it is a tried a tested approach and warrants a couple of dropped points.
    Would like more of the same, but dont think its really replayable.

  • Carrybagma #1014 4 years ago

    Thought I'd bump this fine comments thread.

  • Exones #1015 4 years ago

    The TRUTH about BIOSHOCK

    Seriously guys, the game was a disappointment really. It is not bad or crap, but it is a disappointment.

    I am a very big fun of the FPS genre, but this game was as linear as it gets with no balanced mechanics at all. The Plasmids are cool for the first 2 hours but then you realize that you don't need to use them at all if you don't want to. You can do with just shooting. Only in some cases you really need them to melt the ice infront of a door or something.
    Also the enemies are very boring and they seem the same through out the entire game. The difference is that some disappear and some jump on walls....etc but they all are the same. The AI is bad bad. After a point there is nothing there to keep you wait for something to happen. After a point you are so strong with so many ammo and plasmids and you just wonder around easy just killing everything so easy without having to think much at all.

    Also the Big Daddies are very impressive and scary at first. But after a while you realize they are a disgrace and that you can hide and run and make them follow you and get trapped behind obstacles every single time. And they stack there and run against the wall forever and ever until you kill them.....Yeah great fun...

    Also the graphics are not so impressive if you think that is a complete corridor game and all the detail is only drawn in one interior room box......
    I would give it a good 7/10 and i wouldn't recommend to anyone to run and play it. Wait until is a lot cheaper. There is nothing revolutionary there to see really....so
    The marketing killed the game and ruined our excitement like usual. They got our money at the end, and that is what matters....lol
    Not my cap of tea.

  • MrsPacMan #1016 4 years ago

    You Asshole!!!

    Last?

  • mattigan #1017 4 years ago

    No, I'm Last

  • BornFreeTaxedToDeath #1018 4 years ago

    Best game I played in a long time!

  • symmetry #1019 4 years ago

    So Last.

  • Azazel #1020 4 years ago

    I'm Lost.

  • Verwandlung #1021 4 years ago

    http://ww w.escapistmagazine.com/articles...

  • Injurak #1022 4 years ago

    This game is... WOW I mean WOW. Bioshock really is art, it is one of the best games I have ever played.

    Game of the year /vote.

  • Paukl #1023 4 years ago

    Last!

  • wayn3h #1024 4 years ago

    last! bwuahaha

  • calvindexter #1025 4 years ago

    Awesome game.

    Last!
    Edited by 1 at 20/01/08 @ 11:28

  • Ryze #1026 4 years ago

    Now playing and enjoying this creepy masterpiece.

    Oh yeah... last!

  • Les #1027 4 years ago

    Had some spare time over the weekend and installed Steam again (did so years ago on my previous box but never really bothered with it much). Downloaded the Bioshock demo to see what all the fuss was about. Must say it was a big disappointment. I hope the full game looks better than the demo, though it will probably still have the hideous Unreal engine look. I don't know how they do it but it seems every game created with it shares terrible lighting and a sort of 'cleanness' to everything that give a very unreal look to the game world (which I guess isn't what the engine aims for dispite its name). Fired up the Half Life 2 demo directly afterwards to see whether my expectations maybe were too high but that game looks so much better, I couldn't believe it.

    The start of the story isn't that impressive either but maybe it's changed in the full game. What bothered me the most is when you come across a syringe for the first time the character grabs it and injects it directly into his arm.. Rather ridiculous.

    What I did like was the soundtrack but the rest (graphics and gameplay) were kind of a let down. But again, I only played the demo so possibly the full game is much better.

  • marco.antonio.costa #1028 4 years ago

    Last. If you played SS2 and is as sad as I am that this very good looking and interesting-at-first game didn't reach its full potential, check out this review: http://ww w.escapistmagazine.com/articles...! I probably had more fun viewing it than finishing up the game. Laughed tons, especially on the "cybernetic modul... sorry, ADAM". :-D
    Edited by 1 at 29/04/08 @ 11:06

  • gohda #1029 4 years ago

    last k?

  • sirtacos #1030 4 years ago

    Fucking amazing.

    This is without a doubt the best game I've ever played. Maybe it helped that I had no expectations at the start... and that I never played System Shock.

    This is a 10/10 game... and it manages to be so much more than a game! (Actually, it literally is 'more than a game'. Sure, you could consider it a piece of art, and I'd agree with you. But this is the first game that could just have easily been a philosophical treatise: it is essentially a rebuttal to Ayn Rand's philosophy of objectivism.)
    Edited by 1 at 24/06/08 @ 20:27

  • Jordy #1031 3 years ago

    I'm only at the neptune level and so far this game does not seem as good as the reviews have said it is. I was expecting an amazing experience like when I first played Half Life/2 or CoD 4 or Ico. I will finish it but I hope there is more to come because so far this is rather boring...

  • loopy #1032 3 years ago

    I finally got around to finishing this game (I got the "good" ending), having delayed playing it until I had a system that could run it competently...

    it's one of the best games I've ever had the pleasure of playing, and the key plot sequences and ending were well worth all the effort.

    10/10
    Edited by 1 at 11/05/09 @ 01:46

  • brof #1033 3 years ago

    Last!

  • RedSparrows #1034 3 years ago

    I was expecting an amazing experience like when I first played....[]........ CoD 4 or...[].... '

    ARGGGGGGGGGGGG :)

  • mkreku #1035 2 years ago

    I actually bought the Collector's Edition of this, back in the day (I have a few year old comments in this thread), and I must agree with the retractors this time. In hindsight, this wasn't a 10/10. More like an 8/10 for me. Vita chambers? Go away! Pipe dreams mini game? Shoo! End boss? So lame! Pause while in menus? System Shock 2 handled that better. FIVE different enemies for an entire (albeit short) game?! Not enough!

    It's a great game, don't get me wrong.. but 10/10? Sadly, no. I still think System Shock 2 beats this on all accounts except graphics.

    Last? :p (probably not)

  • X #1036 2 years ago

    Finally got round to this after buying Bioshock 2 on release due to it's cheap pre-order price at Argos. Quite enjoying this and I'd agree with some others that 8 may be more like the score it should get. Last? :)

  • Dolly #1037 2 years ago

    Like Rapture, it appears that this thread will never truly die.

  • Daeltaja #1038 6 months ago

    Agree.

  • psychokitten #1039 6 months ago

    Bioshock! \o/