Nuclear waste Page 2

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  • chopsen 30 Jan 2013 17:08:30 16,127 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    Suuuuree... but we wouldn't do something retarded like that now without testing, so unless we get utterly and massively retarded in the next 10k years I just can't see it happening.
    Well, that's the point. You can't test for how civilisation holds up for 10 thousand years.
  • Psychotext 30 Jan 2013 17:08:40 54,495 posts
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    Chopsen wrote:
    We barely have access to a fraction of stuff we wrote down a couple of thousand years ago. Hell, I remember watching a Time Team episode where they used archaeology to make sense of stuff from WWII! Do you really think stuff's guaranteed to carry on as normal and we're going to have everything at our fingertips for ever?
    What are you going on about? I'm not saying anything about having access to stuff from 10k years ago (in the future). I'm saying that you wouldn't just lose all your technology and knowledge overnight... and as we can work out that the stuff would kill us now, I'm 99.999999999999% sure that people in 10k years could work it out with their tech too.

    Also, frankly... why would we care if the opposite is true? Future person wanders (!) into a nuclear waste dump deep underground. Future person dies horribly... others work out that stuff there is bad.

    Edited by Psychotext at 17:10:43 30-01-2013
  • chopsen 30 Jan 2013 17:10:23 16,127 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    What are you going on about? I'm not saying anything about having access to stuff from 10k years ago (in the future). I'm saying that you wouldn't just lose all your technology and knowledge overnight... and as we can work out that the stuff would kill us now, I'm 99.999999999999% sure that people in 10k years could work it out with their tech too.

    Overnight? No. Over 10 thousand years? Who knows. Possibly, and quite likely given how the last 4 went.
  • chopsen 30 Jan 2013 17:11:43 16,127 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:

    Also, frankly... why would we care if the opposite is true? Future person wanders (!) into a nuclear waste dump deep underground. Future person dies horribly... others work out that stuff there is bad.
    Well quite. The idea is to try minimise bad and horrible things happen generally if you can at all help it.
  • Psychotext 30 Jan 2013 17:13:06 54,495 posts
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    Not to mention all your signs and warnings are pretty unlikely to be there given that all of a sudden the nuclear waste is in a place it could harm people instead of hundreds of meters underground. :p
  • Deckard1 30 Jan 2013 17:13:16 28,765 posts
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    Fuck those dammed dirty apes.
  • Psychotext 30 Jan 2013 17:13:49 54,495 posts
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    Pedantry aside. Apparently they're going to bury a bunch of this in the Lake District. Yay!
  • chopsen 30 Jan 2013 17:14:46 16,127 posts
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    Sure, whatever you do it likely to be futile. But you can't have it both ways. You can't argue that we're be technologically intact enough to manage it 10k years and that everything will be gone so there's no point worrying about it :p
  • MetalDog 30 Jan 2013 17:15:29 23,778 posts
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    We could lose most of our tech and knowledge almost overnight. It depends what happens.

    Let's say Yellowstone blows itself up and some people manage to survive the ensuing shitstorm in sufficient numbers to repopulate further down the line.

    How many of the initial survivors do you suppose will know even a tiny fraction of our collective knowledge? How many will know how to use all the surviving tech? How much do you know?
    How concerned will they be with anything other than staying alive for the first few generations at minimum?

    In the Victorian age people were drinking radiation 'health' tonics and stuffing it down their trousers as an aid to virility - in the second world war, people were painting their teeth with Radium for shits and giggles. It took us a while and some miserable experiences to work out how dangerous it is.

    -- boobs do nothing for me, I want moustaches and chest hair.

  • MetalDog 30 Jan 2013 17:18:31 23,778 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    Also, frankly... why would we care if the opposite is true? Future person wanders (!) into a nuclear waste dump deep underground. Future person dies horribly... others work out that stuff there is bad.
    So... it would be okay by you if you ran into something left by a past civilisation and it killed you and yours horribly because they couldn't be arsed to even try to leave a warning?

    Do unto others as you would have done unto you - it's just basic empathy.

    -- boobs do nothing for me, I want moustaches and chest hair.

  • chopsen 30 Jan 2013 17:25:31 16,127 posts
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    MetalDog wrote:
    How much do you know?
    I think this is the interesting question for any culture that is living anything above sustenance levels.

    Hunter-gather tribes in some jungle the arse-end of nowhere: ok fair enough. They could probably survive as they don't rely on any infrastructure. But the technological environment on which we survive is a house of cards in terms of infrastructure. Nobody really knows how everything works. Most people at a basic level couldn't farm or look after animals effectively, and then there are whole layers of complexity above that and I don't think there any single person who really knows how *everything* works.

    If society crumbled, and you had a random sample of survivors, could they rebuild society to where it now? No way.

    The more advanced we become, the more susceptible we are to being completely put back to nothing by a major insult. Technological advancement means we can cope with smaller problems better (minor epidemics, seasonal variation in weather) but the big stuff could really fuck it up. We're playing a game with big stakes.
  • Psychotext 30 Jan 2013 17:31:41 54,495 posts
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    If we're talking about all computers failing to work because of some tech style disaster then I'd imagine I'd largely be fucked in tech terms. Would need to take out all the libraries too to get rid of industrial age level stuff though (which we could easily build now without access to silicon tech).

    Technology aside, I do know how to farm, so that's something. :)
  • MetalDog 30 Jan 2013 17:35:38 23,778 posts
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    Do you know how to find, extract and purify ore then metalsmith it into machine parts? You can probably find out in a library how to do those things in theory, but could you physically do it? Would you have enough people and enough time left over from keeping body and soul together?

    We could absolutely get back up after a major hammer blow to humanity, but it wouldn't be quick and easy and we'd probably lose as much knowledge as we managed to hold on to.

    -- boobs do nothing for me, I want moustaches and chest hair.

  • Psychotext 30 Jan 2013 17:39:32 54,495 posts
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    Yes, and actually have done some of it. Not to mention that you're not suddenly going to run out of scrap metal (unless the nanobots ate it all).

    However, on my own I'd be useless. Would have to teach people to farm whilst so I could get on with some of the more mechanical related things.
  • MetalDog 30 Jan 2013 17:44:51 23,778 posts
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    Well, if you're medically trained as well and know basic survival for the first few rocky months and don't die in the initial event and aftershocks, you'll be fine! =D

    -- boobs do nothing for me, I want moustaches and chest hair.

  • Psychotext 30 Jan 2013 17:47:47 54,495 posts
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    I was a scout back in the day! Did DofE as well.

    Fucked in terms of medical training though. Could put on a plaster if I tried real hard.
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