Pro Evolution Soccer 2011

Open play.

Change is easy to promise, but much harder to deliver. The pleading husband, as his long-suffering wife threatens to walk out, insists he'll change; things will be different this time if only she'll stay. Why should she believe him?

So it is with PES. The fanatical devotion Konami's football series has inspired in fans has been a virtual love affair of breast-beating intensity. But the gnawing sense of late that it has let itself go has tried the patience and passion of even its most ardent devotees. As they remorsefully turn away and into the arms of a pouting rival, PES promises to change. Why should we believe them?

The reality of this change could not be clearer as I step inside Konami's headquarters in Tokyo, an imposing skyscraper in Midtown housing 2000 of the company's top talents. Kojima Productions is based here, as is the ever-palpitating Dance Dance Revolution team. This is the first time Konami has invited Western journalists into the heart of its operation, to see where and how its games are made.

Barely a week goes by without a European or American studio exposing its mind, body and soul to the press, but in Japan this level of access is still a big deal. Indeed, it's taken years of internal wrangling to reach this point, I understand; and it's fallen to the PES team to usher in this apparent new era of openness.

A major step for Konami, then, and one Shingo "Seabass" Takatsuka, the redoubtable producer of PES, realises is a crucial part of the reinvention of his series. Another part is his own frankness about where it's been going wrong.

'Pro Evolution Soccer 2011' Screenshot 1a

"We are always challenged to make a change," he says, speaking through a translator. "In order to make the game feel like PES, this perhaps became an excuse for not making enough changes. This time our hidden slogan is 'break what is PES' - we wanted to take the change much further and we wanted to make the next step." To avoid misunderstanding, he adds: "We get asked if we'll lose the feeling of PES. I assure you this feeling will never be lost."

Strikingly, Seabass pinpoints the beginning of PES's problems at the advent of new consoles. "As the leader of the team, I really wanted to create PES 2011 at the start of the current generation of consoles," he reveals. "But from the PS2 to PS3 that timing was very difficult for us; probably we were not prepared enough. Looking back our team spirit needed a change as well at that time."

He adds: "We were running in many different directions; today I think we're pretty much stable on which direction we should go. We're not shy of saying we made our mistakes in the past, but we want to use that to give back double, even triple the expectations of our users today. I think we can do that with PES 2011."

'Change' and 'Freedom' are the key themes of PES 2011 for Seabass. He arrives at the initial presentation in buoyant mood, all smiles and handshakes as he leads us through this season's instalment. "The game isn't finished, but I want everyone to play it and give feedback".

It's by far the earliest the game has ever been shown to the press, a brave decision and another facet of the Change Agenda, inviting comment and criticism at a point where there is still sufficient development time to accommodate anything that resonates.

We're shown gameplay clips from PES 2010 followed by this year's version to highlight changes and improvements. Defence, Seabass notes, "has changed massively". Using the dash button to close down and press the player with the ball has been replaced by a three-pronged system using the X button (it's all PS3 in Japan) and directional input.

Hold X while directing the stick towards your goal to hold up play, a relatively passive option that makes it difficult for the attacker to pass you. The second option is simply to hold X and release the stick entirely. This stops your player and, if timed correctly, will halt the advance of the guy charging at you with the ball.

Finally, moving the stick towards the opponent while holding X results in a more aggressive effort to retrieve the ball. This is familiar to PES, but with greater risk attached, says Seabass - if the attacker anticipates your lunge he can pass you more easily.

In tandem, physicality assumes greater significance on the field as players jostle for the ball, with the aim to make players consider more the attributes of the player they are controlling and the best tactics to employ during these encounters. The essence of PES 2011 for Seabass is found in these one-on-one moments. It's the feature he cites to distinguish the experience from its main rival.

"FIFA is probably simpler because they have the overall gameplay balance just like we used to have - but the basics of football are one-versus-one, the ball carrier versus the defender," he explains. "So if you really want to go in deep, which we have, I think you'll get a more realistic flavour of this basic football element."

'Pro Evolution Soccer 2011' Screenshot 2a

This has implications for attacking too, with the feints system overhauled. These tricks can still be performed manually using button/stick combinations; but there's the option now to automate and chain moves together into combos.

"I always thought in all of our games like PES and FIFA, feints were just used to show off," Seabass says. "What I wanted to do in PES 2011 was to make the feints and dummies useful to the player. I didn't want to make the controls super-difficult. In PES 2011 I was able to make the user perform these feints quite easily. At the same time if you overuse it there's a high risk - so it's more fun when combined with the defending I described."

Feints, then, work by holding L1 and using the right stick, with different approaches mapped to up, down, left and right. Aiding and abetting is a reworked animation system, with Konami claiming some 1000 new animations in PES 2011, equating to over 100 hours of motion capture in the studio's on-site facility.

In response to criticism that last season's "360 degree control", er, wasn't (it was 16-way), Seabass illustrates improvements here with a video of 2010 Messi versus this season's thrusting goal genie.

"For unique players like Messi, R1 dash dribble has changed dramatically in PES 2011," he explains. "He is now able to go in any direction; you can also see small touches just like real life. It's never been implemented well in our games before. Now it's properly reproduced."

Out of a roster of around 6000 players, there are only 15 "stars" - like Messi - with magic feet to bamboozle, befuddle and blind. Yet their pirouetting, pretentious ways remain fallible - balance, in other words, is preserved - through smart application of the new defensive techniques.

Elsewhere, the renewed focus on freedom is another product of the team's painful but necessary process of self-examination. "We've been developing PES for over 10 years since PlayStation 1," Seabass muses. "Every time we release a new version we've found that the freedom of the game has gradually disappeared. We maybe made it too complicated."

This manifests itself most clearly in passing, which, in tandem with a reworked shot power gauge, affords "unlimited freedom of passing" according to its creator.

Every pass or shot performed in PES 2011 brings up a power gauge on screen, which is situated in open play directly beneath the player so it is always in focus. Making use of this while holding L2 and pressing a pass button, the ball can theoretically be sent wherever you want it to go.

The team has clearly looked back in considerable detail over the history and development of PES to trace how it got here and where it needs to go. One unexpected side effect is the return of a long-forgotten feature: game speed.

'Pro Evolution Soccer 2011' Screenshot 3a

"In PS1 days there was an option to change the game speed," Seabass recalls. "I looked up how long it was before I decided to have this back and it was about 12 years ago the last time. I've put it back in this year."

In practice, you can change the speed at any point via the pause menu, from -2 to +2, with zero being the regular setting. The difference between the extremes is clear enough and while its ultimate utility remains to be seen, its inclusion can be no bad thing and gives an extra way to tailor the experience to taste.

When it comes to playing the game, the flipside to being treated to an unprecedentedly early showing becomes apparent, with many features yet to be implemented and others not working as they should. The feint system, for example, at present produces looping, sliding animations that are clearly unfinished, and tackling hasn't been fully worked in, making it hard simply to get a foot in.

These aren't criticisms, of course: it's simply not possible to make any meaningful qualitative judgements on such elements at this stage. What is possible with this build is to get a decent feel for the ebb and flow of a game, the new power gauge, redone throw-in system, game speed, passing freedom and so on.

The latter could well prove to be the most significant addition. Experiencing it at first is to realise how much the playing of PES has been, if not on autopilot then certainly in a comfort zone of familiar ease. Which is a roundabout way of saying I end up blasting the ball to row Z and beyond in my early attempts to precision-place a pass.

But further experimentation yields rewards and the flexibility becomes engagingly apparent the more I practice. Konami's claim of total control over the direction and destination of passes holds up; the one potential downside is the need to rely on AI with no apparent way to send a free player into the space for which you're aiming.

Off-pitch, a drag-and-drop system tidies up tactical tweaking of player positions from a manager's-eye view. Meanwhile, automated switches can be set up to change tactics according to certain conditions. For instance, you could set it so that a 2-0 lead initiates a defensive strategy to preserve the lead; or so that going 1-0 down triggers a more pressing mindset as you push for the equaliser. This can also apply to formations, and should save a lot of menu fiddling while maintaining a realistic flow to a match.

The licence issue is always a sticky one for PES and at this stage it's too early for any concrete news on developments in this area other than a "yes" - that there will be new licences added. Watch this space.

And then there's Master League Online. A massive feature that's been a long time coming, sadly we're shown nothing of this, but we are assured that it's another vital part of the team's desire to change and improve - in this case an acknowledgement that online play hasn't quite cut it to date. Seabass also teases us with the promise of a further major "surprise" to come. But that's all he's saying for now.

'Pro Evolution Soccer 2011' Screenshot 4

The PES community is vast, deep and outspoken, and Konami rightly pays lip service to fans, insisting it now listens more closely than ever. An example of this, shared with us by PES European Team Leader Jon Murphy - his community-facing role in itself symbolic of this - is with nets. Yes, nets. A minor point to most of the universe, but enough fans have asked for the ability to edit the net style and so I'm assured it's now on the team's agenda (although that's not confirmation it'll make it into this year's version).

Seabass' team's passion for the beautiful game remains utterly undimmed. On my last night in Tokyo a few of us are taken out for drinks by senior members of the team. The language gap is unbridgeable for the most part; but in a wonderfully charming backstreet bar that might as well be (come to think of it, might actually be) someone's living room, at a table with a computer terminal, the exec producer beams with delight as he plays us YouTube highlights of great footballers: Zola, Ronaldo, Weah. Suddenly, we're all on the same page.

It's a side that has been sadly hidden from view before now. But for PES to move forwards and stem the flow of FIFA converts, reconnection with its fanbase is vital. And that connection will always be strongest on the pitch.

The PES team has, of course, claimed each year of this generation that its new game would be the profoundly improved, overhauled masterpiece footy fans crave. However, here in Japan the mood this time is unmistakably one of genuine, self-aware change. Whether that is, at last, the change PES needs and fans demand, we'll see more clearly over the coming months.

Pro Evolution Soccer 2011 is due out for PC, PS2, PS3, PSP, Wii and Xbox 360 this autumn.

Comments (53) Latest comment 1 year ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Zomoniac #1 2 years ago

    I'll believe it when I play it...
  • Fab4 #2 2 years ago

    I'll believe it when others play it...and then tell me he isnt lying.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/10 @ 09:06
  • Rodchenko #3 2 years ago

    Good article Johnny. I have high hopes for this one as I almost broke my disc of FIFA WC last night getting all worked up over the AI cheating. Can't stomach it anymore.

    So far this sounds like it could be a winner.
  • asharkman #4 2 years ago

    What do you mean by Fifa AI Cheating?
    I'm looking forward to the reviews of this game though.
  • killyourtv #5 2 years ago

    "Change is easy to promise, but much harder to deliver. The pleading husband, as his long-suffering wife threatens to walk out, insists he'll change; things will be different this time if only she'll stay. Why should she believe him?"

    Because they always do.
  • Postumo #6 2 years ago

    FIFA IA cheating? i play on maximum difficulty and it can't even dream of beating me. When you learn to play, to make tricks, when you know how your team works... FIFA IA is no match for you.

    For me, online playing es more frustrating due to the mistakes and strange things that happens some times: those passes that you miss in a nonsensical way, those defendes who loses the ball in strange ways, those "cheaters" that always rely on England speedy players (well not cheaters, but they turn the game in something boring and predictable).

    now i'm playing mostly with Italy, great defense and good, strong forwards, both left and right wing play make the difference with Gilardino and Iaquinta being two beasts using their heads
  • mcmonkeyplc #7 2 years ago

    Is this change we can believe in?!

  • Harmonica #8 2 years ago

    Good article on a difficult subject matter, really.

    It's nice to speculate but I'm with everyone else saying 'I'll believe it when I play it [the demo]'. PES has promised too much in recent years and made up no ground whatsoever on its rival, I'm doubtful that Konami have the talent to turn the ship around at this point.
  • sfp_noodle #9 2 years ago

    I'm just going to say this - All these improvements sound AMAZING. Even at this early stage. However, after Fifa World Cup I have been salivating for Fifa 11 as World Cup has stopped me from playing Fifa 10 completely. The gameplay improvements are massive considering the game only came 6 months after Fifa 10.

    Problem, for a lot of people, myself included, made the jump from PES to Fifa a few years ago. We've been spoilt by all the licenses and the excellent gameplay. Even if PES has good gameplay, I still think most will pick Fifa because it has become the complete package. Also, it has something PES never will - Live Season. That is probably the best thing to happen in a football game. If they could improve it, I only wish they would release player updates more frequently. Once a week does not always reflect the form of the teams last game.

    Good luck to Konami and PES. Loved you for 10 long years but things change. You changed. I'm with Fifa now and we're very happy together.
  • sfp_noodle #10 2 years ago

    ^^^

    Fans are allowed to compare matey. Just like Gran Turismo will get Forza mentioned and for every Halo there will be Killzone. Nothing wrong with logical comparisons, especially when one, in Fifa's case, is better.
  • Rodchenko #11 2 years ago

    FIFA IA cheating? i play on maximum difficulty and it can't even dream of beating me. When you learn to play, to make tricks, when you know how your team works... FIFA IA is no match for you.

    Except it's not about winning or losing.
  • Dave797 #12 2 years ago

    Is she back? The PES we all knew and loved? Perhaps, the noises and direction Konami are heading are very positive but being promised the earth and recieving little has been the PES mantra over the last few years. Let's hope they bring it back to it's former glory!
  • hiddenranbir #13 2 years ago

    Well, the idea of simplifying the tricks method is something I will be on the look out for. I can't be arsed to remember silly left stick right stick combinations when I'm busy trying to move a player and either dribble ahead or pass.
  • freedumb #14 2 years ago

    PES 2010 is the best football game ever made. I've explained why in the PES 2011 thread in the forums. You need to get under its skin with extended play to see why, yes even with the rigid animations, and once 2011 comes out many people will see what Konami were trying to achieve, and realize it was a better football game than they gave it credit for.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/10 @ 10:07
  • lambtron #15 2 years ago

    Pfft. I'm baffled why people bang on about how PES has become shit "recently". It's been a pale shadow of its former self for years now.
  • INSOMANiAC #16 2 years ago

    Its not fair, I want to be called Seabass !
  • Markitron #17 2 years ago

    Iv been unflinchingly loyal since the utterly sublime ISS 64, ill be getting this regardless, but im liking the sound of this more than I have previously. And 2010 was a great PES!
  • chasejamie #18 2 years ago

    Kick their ass Seabass!
  • lmephisto #19 2 years ago

    Let hope the are not trying to copy Fifa this time!
  • El-Dev #20 2 years ago

    We keep being promised change from Seabass but it never really comes, just slight tweaks. I hope it does come good and the series can reach the heights of PES5/6 again, Fifa despite it's very obvious flaws is light years ahead of PES now.
  • brseg #21 2 years ago

    My favorite football game ever was ... (wait for it) the original ISS Pro 98 on ps1 (the one with Incey on the cover). It was *fun*.
  • rotmm #22 2 years ago

    I don't understand the hate for PES games this generation. Sure, they have issues, but then so do FIFA games.

    I like the fact that we now have two very different football games, with FIFA becoming close to the perfect football simulation and PES rooting itself firmly in a more arcade approach.

    And that's good for us consumers.

    It's the same with racers. Sometimes I like to play Forza 3 and sometimes Dirt 2. Dirt 2 isn't a worse game than Forza 3 just because it leans heavily toward arcade. And the PES approach isn't worse than the FIFA approach just because it has chosen the same route.
  • geeza2020 #23 2 years ago

    Are we going to get more than a handful of real stadia this time?
  • Feanor #24 2 years ago

    Konami's PES people are a bunch of liars. Even on their officially supported PESFan forums, they don't respond to suggestions that they put back useful features that were in earlier versions of PES like Play Again in Training or proper info for replay saves.
  • anamenos #25 2 years ago

    PES is PES, and FIFA is BETTER...
  • freedumb #26 2 years ago

    FIFA has the illusion of realism because of its animations. In reality it a very hollow football game, with poor AI, ball physics and player individuality. At the moment PES looks worse because of its rigid animations, but spend time with it and learn to master the game and it is a far deeper, more rewarding experience, with superior AI and tactics, ball physics, player individuality and ball control.
  • SHPanda #27 2 years ago

    For a "Hands-On" article you didn't really seem to do much in terms of getting your hands on the game, you just spoke to Seabass.
  • TonyHarrison #28 2 years ago

    FIFA isn't exactly a bastion of perfection is it? The latest one is full of bugs that still haven't been patched despite being found by players way back on launch day in early October.

    If all you do is play online with mates then I can see why FIFA would appeal because its online mode actually works (for the most part) and the core gameplay is probably ahead of PES despite there still being a slight air hockey like feel with FIFA, but when it comes to offline single player, PES is still king. The Master League is first of all a better game mode than the Manager Mode, and secondly, it isn't riddled with bugs...

    As someone who spends more time with the single player, there hasn't been enough from FIFA to get me to leave PES behind yet, and if these improvements actually come about and they work, then it's unlikely I ever will after being less than impressed with FIFA last time.
  • thehipster7 #29 2 years ago

    I moved from PES to FIFA around the time of the 08 version...the Euro version of FIFA was the best to date...sadly since then it's gone downhill - shooting is poor and there is a lack of fluency to the gameplay.

    Picked up PES10 a couple of months ago and it's superb...perfect pace, great shooting, dribbling and passing...some faults mainly AI player off the ball movement but blimey it plays a well balanced game of football.

    Really looking forward to this one...be interesting to see people shift back voer I reckon.

  • JensonJet #30 2 years ago

    I'm one of the few PES players that actually thinks each version is an improvement on the last. However, I also think the PES team, especially Seabass, are some of the laziest developers in the history of gaming. I don't believe for a second that the current PES features and improvements couldn't have been implemented into the game over a decade ago. It seems to me that the team do barely enough to justify a new game and seem to hold back on features or improvements in order to incorporate them into the next version. Equally there are still issues that are never resolved (pointless to mention as Konami DO NOT care what fans think, only that we'll hand over our money each year).

    PES is only justified as a full price game when it has a new engine and animation and is totally reworked, perhaps every two-three years. Minor changes and team/player updates, the usual new PES features should be sold as a cheap add-on. I know that will never happen as Konami want more of our money than I'm suggesting, and so the pattern continues that we're charged full price, every year, justified with the minimum of changes. I expect all the improvements in this new version could have been incorporated into the years ago. Yearly updates feel more like a tax-to-play than the purchase of value-for-money entertainment. For me there are no alternatives so I only play the game at friend's.

    On FIFA. Seriously why do fans of this games or ex-Pro Evo players feel the need to spew their comments over PES threads? As the owner of one racing game should I make comments on all the other race game that I don't play? Or as a gamer playing only one first person shooter right now should I comment on every other shooter and suggest the one I'm playing is superior to all others? Of course not. How pathetic, dumb, paranoid or immature would that make me sound!?
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/10 @ 12:47
  • Salaminizer #31 2 years ago

    I know they won't just settle with my idea, but I think the most important thing right now is having the game feel like a REAL new PES and not like a PES snowball. when you play PES 2010 you can clearly notice that it suffers from what any old and still updated software suffers: it's a bit of a mess (alright, alright, "it's a bit messi";).

    other than that, very often I felt like I was controlling an AI that, in turn, was controlling my team. I hope that goes away too.

    with no more real FIFAs on the PC (apparently that's the case), I'm really looking forward to PES. especially because FIFA Online will be based on yet another older FIFA engine.
  • bigbadbeasty #32 2 years ago

    I am looking forward to these changes. I remember playing ISS back on my Snes, and evolving with the franchise into the Pro Evo series.

    I think for me the series lost its magic after Winning Eleven 6 on my GC, for me it was the best football game experience. The controls were excellent (aided by the wonderful GC analog stick), you moved past players with subtle tweeks on the stick rather than over elaborate button combos. I still played the newer versions, but none of them seemed to match up.
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/10 @ 13:17
  • gjgjg #33 2 years ago

    hmm, im actually optimistic
    Im not a fifa fan, yet i cant argue that PES hasnt done enough in the last 3 years to keep me defending it to the EA fanboys.

    If theyd improve the overall AI and 'robotic' flow of PES it should be basically back up there. Plus make it a bit more simplified online, all that boxy UI makes me think Im applying for planning permission to get a 'quick' game going.

    gj'PES fan since #4'gj
  • glencooley #34 2 years ago

    Can't really guage any improvements or innovations from this early preview. I mean most of the things mentioned are already in FIFA (jockey, jockey press, skill dribble, offensive/defensive team mentality)

    Doesnt look too good on the features front compared to FIFA 11. That said the individuality sounds promising although EA is working on this as well and it was looking quite good too.

    Interesting to see what other licences PES gets as well.
  • djed #35 2 years ago

    Lip service

    :insincere expression of friendship, admiration, support, etc.; service by words only
  • PierrePressure #36 2 years ago

    I want to love you again PES but you've hurt me too many times in the past...
  • Skire #37 2 years ago

    I fell for this "dramatic change" story last year with PES 2010. Boy did I feel abused. They have to make a 180 degree turn in order for me to buy another PES.

    I loved PES 2009 though, it felt very similar to PES 6. The controls were fast and responsive, in contrary to the sluggish and unresponsive feel of PES 2010.
  • Seabeast #38 2 years ago

    We have heard all of this before, but it sounds like we will finally get some major changes this time. I will try the demo and decide what to do after that.

    I still can't get into Fifa so I really hope they finally make another great PES game.
  • renzo #39 2 years ago

    @thehipster7

    Pretty much agree with everything in your post. I went from the disappointingly bad PES6 to FIFA 08, which despite looking like a decent football game just never felt right to me. Actually switched to PS2 version of PES2009 for the next year, and then picked up PES2010, which I've been playing since it released last year. Thoroughly enjoyable game.

    But, as addicted as I have been to PES2010, I decided to pick up FIFA 10 since it has been reduced in price and to see what all the fuss is about, since I've seen just about everyone raving about it.

    It's a good game, nice fluid animations and the passing and 'weight' of the ball feels right. It just looks much more like real football, but after 2 weeks I sold FIFA and went back to playing PES2010, for two reasons:

    1) PES is more fun to play and it has a satisfyingly 'solid' feel to it, whereas FIFA felt a little 'floaty'. Hard to explain this.

    2) Become a Legend. Sure, FIFA has Be a Pro, but Konami's implementation is just far better suited to my tastes and expectations of what a control-one-player experience should feel like in terms of career structure and progression. In PES, you have to work your socks off at a small club and play really well to get that dream move to one of the European superclubs.

    With PES2011 I'm not expecting any drastic changes, but the passing power gauge and easier to pull off skill moves already sound like the kind of fixes PES needs since I'm already quite happy with how PES2010 plays. Smoother and more fluid player animations would be nice too.
  • Xs1ght #40 2 years ago

    I've been a PES fan since the amazing days of ISS Deluxe on snes. The only FIFA games I have parted money with is FIFA RTWC 98 and FIFA World Cup 2010. I recently exchanged PES2010 for FIFA WC as the magic has faded, and FIFA just plays a better 1v1 game. Overall I'd say FIFA is better 1v1 or 2v2 with your mates and PES is all about the Master League. This year I won't pre-order either for the first time in 7 years and will put them head to head so they can earn my money. COME ON PES!!
    Edited by 1 at 01/06/10 @ 19:24
  • awb83 #41 2 years ago

    Can't wait, this sounds very promising.

    As I have said previously, when it comes to actually playing a game of football PES is better than FIFA, no doubt about it. But in terms of an overall package (i.e play modes, online play etc) FIFA is better.

    I also think it is about time Konami ditched making it for PS2.
  • Power_n_Glory #42 2 years ago

    Pro Evo better get it right this time and I like the sound of the new defending system, the tactics sound great as well. Setting the team up to switch tactics and formation depending on the score sounds fantastic.

    The one thing Fifa has over PES in terms of gameplay is the feel of freedom. The build up play in Fifa is sublime. Stringing together a counter attack with 3, 4 players with a flurry of passes can be amazing. But the game has some really annoying bugs like the keeper running out too early, defenders backing off attackers and giving them space when in the box instead of getting tighter onto their man, the offside trap where full backs always play a man on side, manager mode bugs, doesn't show the cup after winning the league....I could go on and on.

    EA have really taken liberties with Fifa 10 and the bugs. They haven't even done a patch to sort them out and some of the problems like players only getting injured for a week, no celebration cut scene when winning the league have been like that since Fifa 07.

    If PES get their act together, I'm going back!
  • thesonglessbird #43 2 years ago

    Godsake. The PES vs. FIFA argument IS SO BORING AND RETARDED.

    Great, you like FIFA over PES or vice versa. Nobody cares. Shut up.

    Anyway, I like the sound of this. More tactical and a slower pace = win for me.
  • vitalic #44 2 years ago

    You'd have to be a sado-masochist to buy this game.

    Some say PES is dead, I just go one step further and say football games are dead period. I used to play WE religiously, now I can just about stomach the odd game of FIFA against a friend but that is about it. Anyone who postulates that PES is a "deep game once you dig beyond the surface" is either deluded or hallucinating I'm afraid. You may believe that but anyone analysing the game with an objective mindset would point out what a ridiculous statement that is. You may believe it is good, that's fine, beliefs are neat - but don't go around saying it's true because that is an offence to anyone who spent many, many hours playing PES/WE when it really did capture the essence of football -- in contrast to the rigid, banal, soulless offerings of recent years.

    The "change" being promised for PES2011 is about as genuine as it was with the Obama presidential campaign.
    Edited by 1 at 02/06/10 @ 02:50
  • vizzini #45 2 years ago

    “The licence issue is always a sticky one for PES and at this stage it's too early for any concrete news on developments in this area other than a "yes" - that there will be new licences added. Watch this space. “

    Eurogamer could have mentioned something along the lines of an anti-competitive monopoly on the only license in football worth having. Ask Fifa's development team producers, they'd tell you that selling their own game without the FIFA license would be suicide.

    In fact it shows some intelligence of the gaming public that PES is still in business, when no other football game could survive without the Football licenses EA has exclusively held since I can remember.

    The problem isn't that PES isn't good, it is that neither PES or FIFA play better than the best PS2 version (PES 5?) with the training drills; but FIFA just appeals to the Bob the Builder music buying, Big Brother, X-factor watching public better. And Eurogamer reviews both game series wearing that hat.

    I stopped buying PES on every release, when they went multi-platform. I felt betrayed by the development team when they were wasting time on multiple SKUs, rather than focusing on one system and it's award winning control pad.

    Metal gear has also been damaged by this poor publishing decision. Seeing it running on a PC devalues the game.

    Am I excited about a future exclusive PES on PS3? you bet I am.
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/10 @ 19:31
  • z8Jay #46 2 years ago

    I used to be pro all the way but as soon as i played fifa 09 and enjoyed it, i knew that pro was on it's last legs. I still play both Fifa and pro but much prefer fifa. it's just a better game.
  • Power_n_Glory #47 2 years ago

    Konami care about the Fifa vs PES debate otherwise they wouldn't be so open about their plans for this new edition and the criticism they've received over the years. They know they;re has been a sudden swing to Fifa and l'm glad their not going to stick their head in the sand.

    Competition is good otherwise complacency kicks in. It happend with Pro Evo and it looks like it's starting to creep in with Fifa.
  • vizzini #48 2 years ago

    Regardless of PES's failure to re-include the comprehensive training drills, and failing to pay homage to its' core audience; by keeping it exclusive to Playstation. Fifa is still an inferior clone with a unfair and uncompetitive license advantage (imo).

    I feel it has taken them nearly 10 years of hiding behind the easy sales of the Fifa license to get a game that was even a respectable clone of the underlying ISS Pro engine.

    Had Konami's game engine ever fell to the lowly depth's of its' rivals in the last decade, it would no longer be in business, just like the short list of games that tried to survive.

    Kick Off
    Sensible Soccer
    Tecmo Soccer
    Olympic soccer/Uefa Champions' league
    Ronaldo V-Football
    This is Football
    Virtua Striker
    Club Football

    When you play Fifa do you really feel the subtle difference with each player, like you do in PES? Where Rooney responds like Rooney?

    The scouting and skill modelling of unknown world talent in PES has been so good since day 1; that from playing the game you can be alerted to real up and coming talent in football, that even serious football spectators don't even know exist. And that's not because their name is swizzled :)

    Has Fifa ever done that?
  • jambo74 #49 2 years ago

    This is last chance saloon Konami....
  • vizzini #50 2 years ago

    “This is last chance saloon Konami.... “

    Well I certainly hope that's not the case. If Fifa ended up being last man standing, I'm quite sure that the European Competition Commission might receive a few letters to initiate an investigation, even if they are just from the French.

    Does it not bother anyone, that almost every other gaming genre is rife with competition from publishers?

    Whether it be FPSs, hybrid FPSs, 3rd Person games, Racing, karting, simulators, adventure, platform, beat'em ups, fighting games, and every other sport, etc.

    Yet no publisher, other than Konami has been able to compete at this type of Football game for probably 5 years; when there are more gaming consumers than ever.

    Does this lack of competition help make football games in the future better or worse?
  • r3n #51 2 years ago

    PES was good when it was simple but fun. With the improvements in technology at the developers' disposal they've really done little, if not made it worse. It says all this and more in the article, I know, but having had 3 (or more?) versions of the game to get up to speed there really is no excuse.

    I would rather go around my mates' and play PES on his PS2 than put my copy in my 360, and I think that says it all for their next gen efforts.

    As for the promised improvements: the freedom of passing is nothing new (not to mention the white elephant in the thread, but that game already has it in the options) though it is about time it was introduced; all the feints and tricks talked about add little to football games for me - just unnecessary flare where some well constructed passing or a decent change of pace or direction would suffice.

    I hope PES2011 is a big improvement because I think we all realise this genre needs the competition, no matter which side your loyalties fall on.

    (Also - bring back Random Selection Match! This feature was great fun against friends and allowed you construct a fresh squad and tactics for every game, greatly improving its lifespan.)
  • darth_paul #52 2 years ago

    maybe its time for Seasbass to step down and give the franchise to another producer... for a real reboot of the series. EA did it with FIFA in 2005/6... and it worked out for them.
  • jamesmunroe #53 1 year ago

    http://www.p roevolutionsoccer2011.co.uk - Option File for Pro Evolution Soccer 2011 PS3 includes:

    * Correct team names
    * Correct team squads including starting line-ups and formations
    * Correct team strips - home, away & goalkeepers
    * Correct player names & numbers
    * Correct competition & stadium names
    * Player transfers up-to-date as of Summer 2011 transfer window
    * This option file Update will work with online modes of PES 2011