E3: Forza Motorsport 3

By Oli Welsh Published 4 June, 2009

So, "the best simulator on any console"?

Microsoft's racing studio Turn 10 wants to make the "best simulator on any console", and one that a child of six could play. It wants to get 65-year-old classic car restoration enthusiasts playing videogames. It wants to make the biggest racing game the world has ever seen. It wants to be the first to bring you tyre flex and deformation at 60 frames per second. It wants to foster the most vibrant user-generated-content community in all gaming.

There's not a lot that Turn 10 doesn't want, and going by a confident presentation to UK press after-hours at E3 yesterday, Turn 10 is pretty sure that it's going to get it all. It reckons it's creating "the definitive racing game of this generation", a phrase used so often in its Microsoft press conference debut that the meaning was worn out of it like the tread on a set of tyres. Forza Motorsport 3 has so much definitiveness that it can't fit on a single DVD.

That's right, this will be a two-disc release when it appears in October, hardly a surprise when you consider the 400 cars spread across 50 manufacturers and the even more astonishing 100 tracks. We're asked to consider it like getting a year's worth of DLC for free on release, which seems fair enough; the first disc will present a "complete game", and the rest can be installed to hard drive so there's no need for disc-swapping.

No matter the quantity of content, getting granddad and grandson involved in a simulation racer like Forza - historically a very good but rather dry one - isn't going to be easy. Many people, seasoned gamers among them, have a deep aversion to braking in racing games, but a realistic game like Forza demands it.

'E3: Forza Motorsport 3' Screenshot 1

Turn 10's solution is what it likes to call "one-button racing" - in other words, the latest addition to Forza's suite of driver aids, the auto-brake. This manages your speed through corners so you don't have to, and can concentrate on following Forza's signature racing line indicator instead. An assist too far? Certainly I found it a little disconcerting when I tried the game on easy, after I'd got over being disconcerted by the terrifying triple-screen set-up on Microsoft's stand, with force-feedback wheel and pneumatic racing seat.

Taking braking out of the equation seems very odd in a game that, even with stability, ABS and traction control turned on, feels true-to-life in its handling. Forza isn't a hell-for-leather arcade game and it's no use pretending it is, and the result, once you get over the sound and fury, is a rather uninvolving ride. Although you can turn it off of course, and it's certainly worth trying to make the game more accessible to more people, we wonder if this will give them the right idea. Regardless, there's nothing to suggest that Forza 3 won't have best-in-class handling at launch.

A much more successful bid for usability is the inclusion of the rewind feature pioneered by Codemasters' Race Driver GRID. Accessed at any point, taking you back as far you like, and with no penalty whatsoever for use, it works perfectly in the context of a game where glancing contact with a barrier can ruin lap upon lap of dedicated driving.

That kind of dedication is an overriding memory of Forza 2. Hugely involving in its handling, tuning and customisation, the game was more of a war of attrition in terms of its career mode content. Boiling down simply to vast tracts of circuit racing under various class, car and tuning restrictions, it was easy to get lost in its breadth, or weary of its lack of variety.

Turn 10's aiming to fix this with a "season mode". Although the main career will still present an overview of 200 events, season mode boils these down to three at any moment, populating your calendar with events based on your preferences, performance, what you've raced in the past and which cars you buy, and then feeding these through to you as necessary. As for variety, we're told to expect oval racing for the first time, as well as drifting and drag racing. It's a much-needed overhaul; here's hoping it goes deep enough that Forza's long-term structure can match its superb moment-to-moment racing.

On the multiplayer side, we're teased with an "emergent" multiplayer game type that will tie into Forza's philosophy of user-created content. On that front, Forza's adding a comprehensive video editor to its paint and tuning suites and photo mode, to give another set of creative car fans another outlet - two, in fact, since it will give drivers a chance to show off, as well as budding Top Gear directors. Forza has been incredibly successful in fostering community activity in the past, with Forza 2's car marketplace doing brisk trades in exclusive tuners and liveries, and this time Turn 10 is adding scoreboards for the most successful and famous creators, as well as the fastest drivers.

'E3: Forza Motorsport 3' Screenshot 2

Microsoft has three tracks on show, all originals, all set in a vertiginous, rocky and green alpine setting. A road circuit, a test circuit and a Formula One-style track, they are relatively fast and sweeping with some interesting bumps and camber changes - and pretty, too: lush, crisp, colourful and brightly lit, just like the cars, which sport full damage-modelling (cosmetic, simulation or intermediate) and can even roll. Forza 3 looks a little less clinical that its predecessor - but still quite clinical, and despite Turn 10's confidence that it has the best-looking racing game in the world on its hands, it can't quite match GT5 Prologue's near-photorealism, GRID's bustling track drama or Need For Speed Shift's thrilling in-car view.

Definitive or not, Forza 3 is certainly a full-service game for motoring enthusiasts, and it clearly represents a massive investment on Microsoft's part. Interestingly, Turn 10 was happy to admit that Forza sells better in Europe than the US - and bearing in mind that Xbox 360 has a much stronger presence in the UK than the rest of Europe, it doesn't take a genius to figure out why Microsoft was taking such pains to present the game to British press at E3. We are the market for Forza; from the clean UI to the cultured tones of the Peter Egan voiceover, they made it just for us - a bespoke, coach-built racing simulator. Given its luxurious spec, that's pretty flattering.

Forza Motorsport 3 is due out exclusively for Xbox 360 this October.

Picture of Oli.

About Oli Welsh

Oli is Eurogamer's acting deputy editor and reviews editor and likes to take things one word at a time. He is among the best dressed people in South London.

Read more articles from Oli by visiting the Oli Welsh archive page.

You may also like...

Comments (133) Latest comment 2 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Xerx3s #1 3 years ago

    Forzalol.

  • El-Dev #2 3 years ago

    Americans making racing simulators?

  • joe90 #3 3 years ago

    waiting for the ps3 fanboys to moan about the 2 disks.. *sigh*

  • Psychotext #4 3 years ago

    Can't wait. \o/

  • rhubarbandcustard #5 3 years ago

    100 tracks, 400 cars, in car cockpit views...all very well and good. But

    Have they fixed the biggest problem of Forza 2? You know the one. Where the cars handle like your driving on frigging ice no matter what car you choose.

    Best car games of this generation:
    1. Test Drive Unlimited
    2. Ferrari Challenge
    3. Dirt
    4. Grid
    5. PGR4
    18. Forza 2

  • Psychotext #6 3 years ago

    "Have they fixed the biggest problem of Forza 2? You know the one. Where the cars handle like your driving on frigging ice no matter what car you choose."

    Ummm.... what? I can only assume you're used to playing arcade racers?

  • Zomoniac #7 3 years ago

    People should start giving credit to those who deserve it. Auto-braking was in Grand Prix 2 long before Forza implemented it. The racing line was on F1 97 a long time before Forza implemented it, and GRID's rewind feature was in Full Auto. Don't know if any of the games I listed 'invented' the features, but just used as examples that the ones seemingly credited weren't the first by any stretch.

  • Yossarian #8 3 years ago

    "Where the cars handle like your driving on frigging ice no matter what car you choose."

    LOL





    LOL

  • WJF #9 3 years ago

    Grand Prix 1 had racing line and automatic braking too...in 1992.

  • coomber #10 3 years ago

    Impressive number of tracks and cars but still not convinced this will top Gran Turismo. I own both consoles and I think GT5 is where my money will go. Thanks for making us Brits a nice game though.

  • TheStatics #11 3 years ago

    Is this and GT5 due to come out at similar times?

    I'd never have time for both so could be a tough choice!
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 12:48

  • berelain #12 3 years ago

    I cannot bloody wait.

    I loved Forza 2. I normally have no interest in such clinical, realistic racing games, prefering the instant-fun of Need for Speed and PGR for quick thrills, but Forza 2 spoke to me, it made me fall in love with the nuances of handling and tuning, and it did in all in such a way that a complete novice like me could understand it all. I would have been happy if Turn 10 had churned out a 2009 rehash, but it looks like they're trying bloody hard to make Forza 3 as good as they can possibly make it. Oh, and heres a thing- unlike Gt5, which might have a marginal visual edge, it actually has a release date, which I'd opt for any day of the week.

  • BadBoyBonner #13 3 years ago

    Test Drive unlimited at number 1? Is that an Ironic joke or something?

    EDIT2) It (Forza 2) does feel like you're on ice - but I think that was more to do with the sense of speed being very badly implemented - as when you look down at the speedo thinking "how the fuck am I sliding at 30mph?" turns out you're actually doing 85mph or something in the game.

    That said RWD tendancy to oversteer would make any rwd in the real world an instant death-trap - where almost all drivers would be involved in a fatal car crash at the first round-a-bout they approached.

    The real question is - will this support the G25 wheel?

    Great that it Work's well on the Fanatec - shame you can't bloody buy one!

    G25 support has been talked about since before Forza 2 - an still having to use the 360 wheel - i.e. no gears/clutch.

    EDIT - obviously GT on PS3 fully supports the G25.
    Edited by 2 at 04/06/09 @ 13:24

  • Darren #14 3 years ago

    Forza 3 sounds awesome already, can't wait to play it. And that's coming from someone who found Forza 2 a tired lazy retread of the original Xbox classic with little in the way of new content beyond new cars and far too many repeated tracks. Basically I just got bored of the game very quickly, much to my dismay, and it didn't help that the graphics were merely passable despite the upgrade to 60 fps over the original Forza.

    Add in lots of new tracks, a dashboard view, an overhauled career mode, significantly improved visuals and a rewind feature - GRID was terrific for including it - and Forza 3 is sounding like the proper current-gen sim that Forza 2 should have been but wasn't. The original Forza on the Xbox nailed down the handling, A.I. and presentation, it was only really the measly selection of tracks and the drab graphics that let the game down.

  • IneptPercy #15 3 years ago

    "and the rest can be installed to hard drive so there's no need for disc-swapping."

    Perfect on that front, even my 20gig HD can handle that.

    "That said RWD tendancy to oversteer would make any rwd in the real world an instant death-trap - where almost all drivers would be involved in a fatal car crash at the first round-a-bout they approached."

    I actually have a mate who got a RWD car, within 3 weeks the above happened, he is fine and he didn't hit anyone else, but the car and the sign he hit wasn't so lucky.


    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 13:05

  • Psychotext #16 3 years ago

    @BadBoyBonner: Turn10 can't exactly make the decision to support the G25. Either MS and Logitech work together to make a dongle (or something) or it's not going to happen.

    I doubt Turn 10 like the idea any more than you do.

  • FooAtari #17 3 years ago

    ""Have they fixed the biggest problem of Forza 2? You know the one. Where the cars handle like your driving on frigging ice no matter what car you choose."

    "Ummm.... what? I can only assume you're used to playing arcade racers?""

    The RWD cars were pretty broken.

  • smernicki #18 3 years ago

    more excited about blur

  • Darren #19 3 years ago

    P.S. Test Drive Unlimited was one of the most overrated racing games of this generation IMO. Initially pretty visuals and a huge open world quickly revealed itself to be repetitive with an empty, lifeless world, some awful vehicle handling (especially the bikes) and some of the dullest tracks to ever feature in a racing game (despite the Hawaiian setting). I never understood what was so great about it myself. It was ambitious, yes, but good? Definitely not IMO.

  • Matt_B #20 3 years ago

    Forza 2 was fun but a bit of a chore. I always found that with Forza I'd be in one of two positions, either last or in the lead. If I was last I’d just splash some cash and obliterate the opposition. I had very few close races, where there was no restriction on HP. I'm not sure what the answer would be to make the racing a bit closer on these events, maybe the AI should scale just a little bit.
    I also hope that Forza 3 introduces some realistic performance figures when it comes to tuning. For example my VW Corrado has 400-500 BHP on FWD car, that doesn't seem to realistic to me. I'm sure that it is achievable, however I can't imagine it being very usable on a race track. Forza 2 says otherwise.

  • muscleblade #21 3 years ago

    So, "the best simulator on any console"?

    Probably yes.

    @rhubarbandcustard

    LOL - BurnOut Revenge is my favourite racing game - but i dont compare it to Forza.

  • berelain #22 3 years ago

    @ MrZ GT5 prologue at least has rival cars that drive along a preset path. They'll just barge you out of the way if they need to. It really breaks the immersion for me.

  • beastmaster #23 3 years ago

    In two minds about this. Having played the original GTs to death on PS 1, I never really got back into the whole simulation genre again. Perhaps a purchase of the 360 steering wheel may change my mind. But (dare I mention it) NFS: Shift looks like it could be a bit more up my street.

  • Darren #24 3 years ago

    Forza 3 will be the best racing simulation on the consoles by virtue of the fact that it has no real competion other than its prequel!

    Gran Turismo 5 Prologue on the PS3 is an unfinished tech demo with poor A.I. and pretty graphics, and the recent Race Pro on the 360 was a rushed, unfinished mess of a game IMO redeemed only by the fact it had decent handling. Everything else was mediocre. Unless I've missed something, there are no other serious simulations on the consoles.

  • Darren #25 3 years ago

    Ah I forgot Ferrari Challenge but I thought that wasn't very good either.

  • BadBoyBonner #26 3 years ago

    KILLA

    After watching the MX5 Enthusia demo the other day I felt gutted it had slipped me by - think it might have been you that mentioned it actually.

    [link url=http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=pUex2w1lk4E
    ]http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=pUex2w1lk4E
    [/link]

    See Turn10 - this is actually how RWD cars handle - having owned and tuned an MX5 I can confirm this looks very close to how the car handled stock.

  • BadBoyBonner #27 3 years ago

    Not got my PS2 anymore but it seems it works flawlessly in the new build of PCSX2.

  • Darren #28 3 years ago

    Woooh, that Enthusia vs. real-life physics video was damn impressive. How come I've never heard of that game?

  • Psychotext #29 3 years ago

    Was likely overshadowed by GT.

    Hmm... don't know what happened to my post there.
    Edited by 2 at 04/06/09 @ 13:47

  • Waldo #30 3 years ago

    Best car games of this generation:
    1. Test Drive Unlimited

    I really like TDU, but it's hardly the best "car" game out.

  • Snooz #31 3 years ago

    Huh, I've never even heared about the Enthusia game... how could that slip me by?


    Anyways, as I usually post in these racing threads

    I WANT A PROPER NEXT GEN RALLY SIM NOOOOW!

  • MeBrains #32 3 years ago

    would this be like picking another car from your garage and being confronted with "please swap the disc" kind of disc swaps?

    anyhows... looks good enough...

  • Widge #33 3 years ago

    It'll probably be "Please install 2nd disc" option in the menu somewhere so that its always available. Think of it like a physical DLC that comes with the game.

  • Psychotext #34 3 years ago

    They've already said that you install the second disc. Sucks to be an arcade owner... but then they're worse than Hitler anyway.

  • Brianstorm #35 3 years ago

    Interesting that the new PSP Go GT games has over 200 cars more than the 2 disc new Forza...

  • oktava #36 3 years ago

    "the best simulator on any console"?
    No, because it's not a simulator.

  • Psychotext #37 3 years ago

    @Brianstorm: Yes, but 300 of them are Skylines. :p

  • b00n #38 3 years ago

    Looking very good! And i'll get GT5 also, but I still clearly prefer the 360 controller for racegames over the PS3 one. Can't get used to using the stick for acceleration / braking and the sixaxis triggers just don't do it for racing for me.

  • Darren #39 3 years ago

    How will Arcade 360 owners with only a 256 or 512 MB memory unit play Forza 3 though? Well they only have access to a limited amount of content from the first disc?

    If anything Forza 3 is going to be the first Xbox 360 to prove that either (a) Microsoft were silly to drop the HDD as standard for the Xbox 360; or (b) that Blu-ray for games storage really is a good thing to have after all. ;)

  • Machiavellian #40 3 years ago

    @Brianstorm
    Yeah but that game has been in production longer than all three Forza games combined

  • BadBoyBonner #41 3 years ago

    Brainstorm
    Interesting that the new PSP Go GT games has over 200 cars more than the 2 disc new Forza...

    Yes it is - and that PSP Go GT will only be 1 Gig so you could fit it onto an Xbox 360 DVD 8.5 times...

    EDIT - just to be sure my sarcasim is coming though - I do not think it is interesting at all.
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 14:20

  • lambtron #42 3 years ago

    I finished GT4 100%. However I didn't even bother playing GT5 prologue for more than a couple of hours, it has become so, so horribly boring.

    As such if Forza 3 is any good it will probably be a buy for me.

    As for Forza 3 coming on two discs - does no one remember GT2 came on two discs? ;)
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 14:20

  • aphexstwin #43 3 years ago

    yes to: 100 circuits, they should not be dlc, dlc circuits take length away from the main career. 400 cars, better than f2 but a ways to go to get to gt4 levels.

    no to: not allowing 3rd party logitech wheels into the game.

    i just bought a driving force pro gt and on gt4 its absolutley peerless. the ms wireless wheel is not even a close match to it. there had better be better force feedback implementation in f3 because driving with the wheel round two notoriously bumpy tracks, the ring and sebring was strangly smooth.

    also missing from f2, tho there were photos in the credits of it, was le mans. this circuit is more badly needed than the ring imo.

    i am looking forward to forza 3, its just i was so bored of playing forza 2, imo its not close to gt4 as a game because its lacking in depth and stuff to do, circuits to race on. i want forza 3 to not have d class muscle cars that take the piss out of you on long circuits when you are pootling along in your 206, i want to see a greater amount of closely matched, but different cars on leaderboards, i want to have my all japan gt cars to have different tyre compounds like real racing. but mainly i want to use my new dfp:gt on my xbox, its such a pain having two wheels and only one racing seat set up [link url=http://communi ty.eu.playstation.com/playstationeu/board/message?board.id=1 49&message.id=3796#M3796
    ]http://co mmunity.eu.playstation.com/play...[/link]

  • mcmonkeyplc #44 3 years ago

    They made it for us!

  • Mr_Dodger #45 3 years ago

    "Interesting that the new PSP Go GT games has over 200 cars more than the 2 disc new Forza... "

    And how many polys do you think those have compared to Forza 3's? Not knocking GT mobile (looks great) but the models will obviously take a lot less time to make. (Also weren't previous GT cars filled with lots of variants of basically the same car? Don't know, but I was told that).

  • Psychotext #46 3 years ago

    Here's a car list MrDodger: http://ww w.gtplanet.net/gt4/car_list/get...

  • Brianstorm #47 3 years ago

    You can also buy that GT PSP car list on 2 discs from play...

  • Darren #48 3 years ago

    @evilfoxhound - You do realise that a rally simulation only features a single car? Does that mean it isn't a simulation either? ;)

    No, it doesn't. Simulation doesn't have anything to do with the number of cars at all, if refers to the handling and physics of the vehicles themselves. Whether a game has 1 or 2,000 cars is irrelevant, it's how realistic it plays that determines its simulation status. Surely you knew that? :?

    As for your comments regarding Forza 3 only being the best-looking game for 24 hours... what? All I've seen of Gran Turismo 5 is a pretty trailer consisting of (presumably) 100% replay footage, which is likely running at the same 30 fps with more detail/effects of Prologue and, as such, will probably look better than the actual game itself. Prologue is proof of that. It looks nicer in the replays and photos than the game itself where it's prone to weak texture filtering, aliasing, framerate drops and tearing.

    I'll be interested in seeing how GT5 turns out but graphics have never really been the series problem, it's the gameplay where it needs to prove itself because the actual racing has always been a bit weak IMO. The predictable, bland A.I. that sticks resolutely to the racing line is what always rendered the game dull for me. At least Forza and Forza 2 had a bit of "personality".

  • lavalant #49 3 years ago

    @buggedbunny, you can bide your time till GT5 is released in 2011, I'll be playing forza 3 this autum :p

    As for the realism, if the physics engine of forza is still running at 60fps along with the framerate I'd take that over photorealism anyday.
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 15:00

  • Andee #50 3 years ago

    Not understanding the dislike of Forza 2 RWD cars. For me it's the only game that's come close to getting them right.

    Mash the throttle in most 250ish+bhp RWD cars and they will step out when cornering or the road has a bit of camber. Forza required careful application of throttle, just as you would do in real life. Different to most other racing games, where you could plant the throttle out of a hairpin and things stayed tidy.

  • drumbaby #51 3 years ago

    Why not just put it on one Blu-Ray disc?

  • Emth #52 3 years ago

    It may not be as good as GT5 but it won't matter if GT5 doesn't come out for another year - and judging from the lack of a date given at E3 that is highly likely.

    We are getting restless PD, give us the damn game already!

  • thegamesthething #53 3 years ago

    My one wish for this game would be wiiiide tracks - PGR2 has tracks like Moscow, where most bends were wide enough to accomodate 2 or 3 cars on different racing lines, meaning more overtaking through good driving, less through barging. Doesnt need to be all tracks, just a few - most in PGR3, Forza 2 etc have felt too restrivtive, to me at least.

    If there is a racing nirvana, for me its PGR2, KGB Corner, Nobles. As close to that as possible would be great.

  • Harrihotpants #54 3 years ago

    There is a rumour going round the show floor at e3, that ms are making turn 10 hitchhike back to the studio as punishment for failing to put up a challenge to both new incarnations of gt.

  • Spekingur #55 3 years ago

    MS aren't going for the BR. They are going for DVD9 and digital downloads because they believe that digital downloads is where the future is at.

  • Der_tolle_Emil #56 3 years ago

    Andee: Mash the throttle in most 250ish+bhp RWD cars and they will step out when cornering or the road has a bit of camber. Forza required careful application of throttle, just as you would do in real life. Different to most other racing games, where you could plant the throttle out of a hairpin and things stayed tidy.

    Early april a rally race champion (forgot his name) got the chance to try out the Renault F1 car in a drag race (I think). A straight line. He crashed the car after about 6 seconds. And that's a racing champion in a car that has probably more downforce than anything else.

    RWD cars can be really tricky to handle - hit the gas a bit too hard and you will start to spin out. I'm not saying this is necessarily fun in a racing game but that's just what happens.

  • Eraysor #57 3 years ago

    The main problem I have with racing games is getting bored of the tracks, but if there are 100 here I doubt I will ever get remotely bored.

    Roll on release!

  • Scimarad #58 3 years ago

    I liked Forza 2 enough to be pretty hyped up for this, though I did find it's career mode incredibly dull. If they've fixed that 'issue' I'll definitely give it a go.

  • Darren #59 3 years ago

    @Eraysor - Don't be so sure. As others have mentioned, 100 tracks could mean 25 with four variations, including forward and reverse. It could mean 20 with five variations even. I've no doubt that the game will not contain 100 unique tracks.

    According to Wikipedia Forza 2 has just 14 unique tracks (two were downloadable and not available in the Career mode) but they came in 47 variations. If you do the maths then that means that Forza 3 will likely have around 30 unique tracks. A decent number for sure but still not 100 unique ones.

  • AtomicBanana #60 3 years ago

    'Early april a rally race champion (forgot his name) got the chance to try out the Renault F1 car in a drag race (I think). A straight line. He crashed the car after about 6 seconds. And that's a racing champion in a car that has probably more downforce than anything else.'

    I get the point you are trying to make; but this guy was just a fool. He gunned it when it had cold tyres, and the cars don't generate any serious down force until they reach high speeds. Cold tyres + little downforce + moron = crash.

    Most RWD cars are not death traps, they just require more thought about what you are doing with the car, and what you are asking from it in physics terms. You can't just turn in and pin the throttle like in a FWD.
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 16:00

  • Darren #61 3 years ago

    I find it quite funny that anyone could consider Forza a poor-man's Gran Turismo really. Do people really prefer a simulation where there' no damage modelling and lousy A.I.? Or it is just a case of which game has the prettiest looking cars? :p

  • warthog2k #62 3 years ago

    Hmm, guessing neither Forza nor Gran Turismo are ever going to make a PC appearance?

    Shame. Really going to have to buy a current-gen console at some point aren't I.

  • Calgon #63 3 years ago

    MS need to get more devs like these doing exclusives for them, always good to see devs spending the time to build their own 360 engines instead of opting for the easy way out and licensing UE3 or another 3rd party engine like has been the case so far bar a few exceptions(Bungie didnt seem to have bothered with building a new one from scratch, Rare have made an effort but they are hardly the fastest going devs with their output the rest have largely been UE3 based.)

    I tried to get into Forza 1 but I couldnt do it, maybe this one will be different, I like challanging without being to Simmy racers like PGR2 and RSC2 for instance.

  • UncleLou #64 3 years ago

    Sounds and looks all rather awesome.

  • JensonJet #65 3 years ago

    I think we're being completely misled about the 100 tracks. There won't be 100 different tracks, they'll be a dozen of those pointless snaking test circuits and a number of variations on the larger tracks.

    As for making the game accessible for everyone, I don't have an issue with this. But what Forza really needs are separate leaderboards for those who actually have the skill to play the game as a sim, and those who don't and play it as a dumb arcade racer.

    As previously pointed out by another poster, it's time to drop the ridiculous performance of the typical family, boyracer or salesmen's cars and have the true sport cars actually perform as they do in real life. Forza 2 is ruined by the 'wacky racers' grid line up of Ferraris and Porsches competing with dull, boring hatchbacks.

  • AtomicBanana #66 3 years ago

    'prefer a simulation were the cars actually feel and handle like real cars instead of like radio controlled cars on ice like Forza'

    It's pretty much a given that forza's handling model is superior to GT5:p, so I don't know what your problem is frankly. The breaking without ABS in forza has always been a bit strange, but by and large the handling is much more accurate. Neither is as accurate as rfactor or LFS mind ;)

  • Der_tolle_Emil #67 3 years ago

    @AtomicBanana: Of course RWD cars are no death traps. It's just that when people in this comment threads claim they "know everything about RWD cars because they spent 10 minutes in a tuned one before" it makes me chuckle. Of course the driver made a mistake in crashing the car but when even a professional makes those mistakes then I think people playing racing games on a console shouldn't be the one arguing how RWD cars actually handle.

  • AtomicBanana #68 3 years ago

    Yeah, sorry, I'm on your side here but it came across as me meaning the opposite! RWD fo' life!

  • cyber_nicco #69 3 years ago

    I have found most people that have trouble with Forza 2's handling model are those that aren't capable of modulating throttle and brake applications very well. They are always full on or off the brakes and throttle. I think the need to be quite precise with the application of those inputs is what makes Forza the best console racing series ever. Some just jam on the brakes and wonder why the plow into the outside armco (I think that's what you Brits call it), while others floor the throttle and wonder why the get under/oversteer in front/rear wheel drive cars. Then you have those that do both.

    Frankly, I prefer the Forza handling to that of GTR Evolution on my PC, but that admission is bound to just spur people to name-calling.

  • obscured021 #70 3 years ago

    the only down fall off forza 3 will be you can't get a good wheel for the 360, i have the offical wheel and it sucks, if only my g25 would work :(

  • KreyAtiv #71 3 years ago

    I'm hoping that 100 tracks isn't counting any courses that may be reversed.
    Being able to roll the car over is also quite good hopefully any damage to the roof is shown in the cockpit view.
    I won't be making much use of the brake assist. As for the rewind I'll not bother with it, well unless I mess up on the last corner or something like that after an 8 lap race. Definitely looking forward to trying out a demo of this when it comes closer to the October release date. :D

  • GamesConnoisseur #72 3 years ago

    Any LoLling of the 2 DVDs only need to recall how MSG4 need you to reinstall each chapter every time and in essence felt like much more work than changing a DVD!

    Admitted its shown up limitation of DVD very well, nicely solved with installing extra stuff onto HDD and shown that MS SHOULD have HDD included from the start to work around the non HD optical capacity disk(even if Arcade X360 proven MS right). As although MS recently started allowing games to be installed to HDD they should serious lower the price of 120 gb HDD and introduce new capacity or options to use our own hdd.

    Looking forward to this game and I m also going to get GT5 but get a feeling I would enjoy Forza 3 more (more than previous iteration as well).
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 16:50

  • XdarXideX #73 3 years ago

    I've just re-bought Forza 2 because of the news of Forza 3. I think I'll try to spend more time completing the races and working through the achievements this time instead of spending 6 or so hours on a single paint job! Geekery!

  • busboy33 #74 3 years ago

    @evilfoxhound:

    Did you just LOL twice in seven words? During the same sentence?
    Was it some sort of spasm? Do you need me to call a doctor or something?

    @JensonJet:
    Well, I assume the F3 leaderboards will be at least as informative as the F2 leaderboards, and they clearly mark what assists were on or off for each posted time. I can't remember where, but I read one of the Turn 10 guys mentioning that any leaderboard posts that use the "rewind" get marked as "uncertified".
    Wouldn't suprise me if the leaderboards had an "all assists off times only filter", but we'll see.

  • TONYgr #75 3 years ago

    i really like it.i hope gt5 is out this year too.it will be the best year for racing fans!

  • Rodchenko #76 3 years ago

    It sounds good and I'll certainly give it a spin, especially with GT5 probably taking another decade to come out, but when will MS realize that their constant bigmouthing doesn't exactly earn them any sympathy points outside of the insecurest of faboys.

  • chris_ace #77 3 years ago

    Post deleted at 11:55:13 13-12-2011

  • septimus #78 3 years ago

    Is it as dull as Forza 2?

    No racing game recently has done much for me, be it PGR 4 or Forza 2. Grid was the most appealing recently, but so many aspects of it are borked that I didn't want to finish it.

    GT5, this and Shift could make things right.

  • FooAtari #79 3 years ago

    @der

    I will need to go an check, but I'm pretty sure that the guy who crashed the Renault in Abu Dhabi was neither a Rally Champion or a professional.

    /goes to check

    Ok, so he was UAE Rally Champion. Not very credible IMO, he would probably get his ass handed to him in the Scottish Rally Championship.

    Anyway, the RWD physics in Forza were bad. Even the low powered cars would step out all over the place under hard acceleration. They tried to make a the RWD and FWD cars feel very different I think, and well they succedeed but in the process made every RWD car feel like you were driving a V8 on 20 year old budget tyres.
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 20:26

  • sacul92 #80 3 years ago

    Alright, now lets get this straight, Forza will never EVER be a better driving simulator than Gran Turismo. Forza has cars which never ever really handle like their real life counterparts, whereas GT has always been spot on, and you honestly have to be ignorant if you disagree. However, because of this, GT has always put off many gamers due to it's gameplay which is meant for serious racers, putting off the casual gamer, whereas Forza has satisfied the casual gamer more, so why argue, if you have a 360, get Forza, if you have a ps3, get GT, stop telling the world which one your gonna like better as it just entices people into becoming their inner fanboy, like GamesConnoisseur over there. Dude, seriously, talking bout MGS4 and comparing it to Forza? Wth man......

  • Tetsuo_Shima #81 3 years ago

    Am I the only one that liked the numerous variants on cars in GT? Makes it feel much more like car shopping when you get to pick your trim, that and the awesome used car markets.

    Big missing from Forza 2 was the R33 Skyline, maybe they'll have it this time. 100 tracks sounds encouraging, but the dodgy season mode doesn't. Hated that in PGR4 where you only had a selection of three or four races per 'week', and you'd end up doing all the best ones first which left you with crap races the next time the selection came round.

  • AtomicBanana #82 3 years ago

    'Alright, now lets get this straight, Forza will never EVER be a better driving simulator than Gran Turismo. Forza has cars which never ever really handle like their real life counterparts, whereas GT has always been spot on, and you honestly have to be ignorant if you disagree.'

    You're the only one showing your ignorance by posting dross like that without any credible sources. There's very little between them, and you can find many people who *do* know what they're talking about on either side of the fence (People on the pay roll of PD/MS notwithstanding)

    'However, because of this, GT has always put off many gamers due to it's gameplay which is meant for serious racers, putting off the casual gamer, whereas Forza has satisfied the casual gamer more'

    This is also rubbish. I think you are confusing a very dry presentation as meaning it is for 'serious' racers. I also think that you assume because with Forza they make an effort to make it accessible to new comers that it is automatically not as serious.

    Firstly, 'serious racers' know GT5:p isn't the be all and end all of sim racing - That's the home of the PC: Live For Speed, Rfactor, I-racing. Sure it's a solid title, but don't buy into PD's hype that it's the be all and end all.

    Secondly, there's no reason why a game can't have a bit more sould and/or be more accessible to new players via driver aids, and be a 'hardcore' console sim.

    . . . 'stop telling the world which one your gonna like better as it just entices people into becoming their inner fanboy . . '

    Pot, kettle, black etc.

    Have fun enjoying your ignorance - I hope I don't have the misfortune to meet you out on the virtual race track.

    Edited by 3 at 04/06/09 @ 21:06

  • aphexstwin #83 3 years ago

    @foo re: rwd, the mazdaspeed mx5 is a classic case of that, low speed and low revs and still get oversteer.

    and while folks moan about the ai in gt do remember that its almost as thick in f2, they dont see your brake lights and still defend their position in endurance events while lapping them. touch them even minutely and kiss goodbye to a lot of money and leaderboard position because of the 5mph straightline speed loss.

  • oktava #84 3 years ago

    "Forza has cars which never ever really handle like their real life counterparts, whereas GT has always been spot on, and you honestly have to be ignorant if you disagree. However, because of this, GT has always put off many gamers due to it's gameplay which is meant for serious racers..."

    Sorry to bust your bubble but both titles are not anywhere near reality. Which doesn't mean that they are not great and can both be enjoyed.
    <a href="http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=yyVHj3sHVHQ
    ">http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=yyVHj3sHVHQ
    </a>
    Edited by 1 at 04/06/09 @ 21:53

  • dirk_aircool #85 3 years ago

    nice idea trebll . gimmie 40 million so I can have a go at F1 . Joking aside , Race pro is a pretty good sim . I like forza , both games do a decent impression of driving , but I agree its not like the real thing . its all about the tyres and the modeling and hard sums .
    I just wish they would stop dumbing the games down . its like having auto aim in a FP shooter , pointless . if you dont know when to brake and turn your probably not intrested in driving so why bother with all the needless assists .

  • Psychotext #86 3 years ago

    What difference do assists make to you if you're not using them?

    It's like being offended by walking sticks or glasses.

  • JasonB81 #87 3 years ago

    I can't wait, forza 3 is going to be awesome. GT fans can have their GT5, unfortunately whenever it comes out, i'll be playing forza 3 come this fall. And i'm sorry, but forza series has out-handled the GT series since inseption.

  • HiredMan #88 3 years ago

    @lavalant

    Forza 2's physics engine doesn't run at 60 calculations per second, it runs at 300 calculations per second. 60 calcs per second is not sufficient to accurately replicate suspension behavior of a car traveling at speed over very close corrugations, such as on a track like Sebring.

  • Spekingur #89 3 years ago

    I don't see the point of arguing about GT5 and Forza 3, really. It's not like someone who only owns a PS3 will buy Forza 3. Or vica versa. And only the PC has a true car sim. Much like only the PC has a true flight sim.

  • spacenugget #90 3 years ago

    Shit >:(

    Another 6 months painting cars for me then.
    Ive only just got over the last addiction.

  • myke6699 #91 3 years ago

    I don't know how Turn 10 even considerd the word Definitive especially when you consider the fact that Forza 3 just like its predecessor only support 8 cars in both MP and SP. That's a number usually reserved for arcade racers like Burnout and Midnight Club. Even 360 other exclusive, the less pretty Race Pro supports 16 cars for both SP and MP, and so does GT5 Prologue and undoubtedly GT5. PC sims like GTR2 and iRacing boasts MP numbers in the 30s. Even the more acrade racers like the upcoming NFS: Shift has 12 and I would assume Dirt 2 will be around the same number. While I applaud Turn 10 decision to maintain the 60 fps framerate (and perhaps full HD at 1080p but definitely choking the 360 at its limit) but by staying at 8, Forza 3 is a generation behind most other racers when it comes to gameplay.

  • FooAtari #92 3 years ago

    @aphextwin
    "i just bought a driving force pro gt and on gt4 its absolutley peerless"

    Peerless? It's a decent enough wheel no doubt, and hugley better than the over priced peice of crap that is the MS Wheel (cpnsidering their pretty decent Sidewinder wheels I expected so much better of it) but the Logitech G25 is a better wheel for a start. And then you want to have a look at some of the high end wheels available for the PC. DFP Pro peerless? Not even close.

    @sul92
    "However, because of this, GT has always put off many gamers due to it's gameplay which is meant for serious racers"

    GT aimed at serious racers?? Come on. I agree that the physics are probably slightly better than the Forza. But the "racing" is crap. Terrible AI and no damage ruins the experience and does not simulate racing. It's nothing more than car porn. A car collecting game. It's a pretty clinical and souless experience. You want a serious sim, try iRacing.

    @Ashed
    ""I have found most people that have trouble with Forza 2's handling model are those that aren't capable of modulating throttle and brake applications very well."

    This is the truth of it. People don't like it when you have to apply a little finesse to control of the car, because it's too much like real life.""

    Forza does not require much finese. I have played pretty much every sim since Geoff Crammonds Grand Prix. If you want an example of some that games that require excellent throttle control and balance of brake and throttle try Grand Prix Legends (especailly the 65,66 and 69 mods) or Richard Burns Rally. Stick a clutch and H-shift on for added realism and suddenly Forza feels pretty arcade in comparrison.
    Edited by 2 at 05/06/09 @ 08:31

  • muttler #93 3 years ago

    Looking forward to Forza 3. My only concern is yet more driver assists to cater for the special needs mass market. In Forza 2 (great game) you could turn them all off, hopefully you can do the same here without any detriment whatsoever to the game, or I'll be giving F3 a miss.

    I think I'm looking forward to GT5 more, which is odd as I think GT4 was/is very overrated. One thing I do like about GT is getting the licences and upgrading your car- very addictive!

  • CHAZBIGPOTATO #94 3 years ago

    @ sacul92

    "Alright, now lets get this straight, Forza will never EVER be a better driving simulator than Gran Turismo. Forza has cars which never ever really handle like their real life counterparts, whereas GT has always been spot on, and you honestly have to be ignorant if you disagree. However, because of this, GT has always put off many gamers due to it's gameplay which is meant for serious racers, putting off the casual gamer, whereas Forza has satisfied the casual gamer more, so why argue, if you have a 360, get Forza, if you have a ps3, get GT, stop telling the world which one your gonna like better as it just entices people into becoming their inner fanboy, like GamesConnoisseur over there. Dude, seriously, talking bout MGS4 and comparing it to Forza? Wth man...... "

    I couldn't beleive what I was reading here, then I read it through again; I think you have clearly got Forza mixed up with Project Gotham Racing..

  • Darren #95 3 years ago

    I think it's a little disappointing that Forza 3 still only supports 8 car races, the same number as the original Xbox game. Even the PGR series managed to double the number of cars between generations of hardware. While I'd much rather had a rock-solid framerate and nice visuals than something like Race Pro, which looked visually unfinished and ugly, I can't understand why Turn 10 couldn't have increased the car count from 8 to 12 for this game. Maybe they still will?

    Still I don't suppose it really matters at the end of the day if the A.I. is decent and puts up a good fight during a race. Thinking about it I don't think I really noticed or really cared that there were only 8 cars in Forza 2 because my memories of many of those races were jostling for first place with a rival car. The races were rarely dull... unlike Gran Turismo for example.

  • myke6699 #96 3 years ago

    It has nothing to do with wanting more. 8 on a multiple lap race at Nordschliefe will gurantee a safe but sterile experience but even on normal length course, a game like GRID shows that by having 12 to 20 cars on the track at the same time, you end up with an incredibly dynamic and exciting race albeit crash proned. My bet for the best racing "sim"on the console, however, is the upcoming NFS:Shift. You just have to look at how well the game's cockpit view is compared to Forza 3 and GT5 Prologue which in turn are quite bland and lifeless. Personally, I much rather have a game with less cars and tracks but with higher quality racing experience. But to each his own.

    fartboy- stop the fanboy whining- it's so last gen. Sorry but I can't see you anymore.
    Edited by 3 at 05/06/09 @ 12:15

  • Darren #97 3 years ago

    @Ashen-Shugar - "@Darren

    Ask yourself one question: Why exactly do you want 12 cars instead of 8 on track?"

    Because every other franchise that has moved from one generation of hardware to a more powerful one has added more cars: Need for Speed, PGR, Burnout, Gran Turismo, etc. You kind of expect it really.

  • IneptPercy #98 3 years ago

    How can anybody say GT5p looks great... LOOK AT THE TREES!!!!

    The PS1 would be proud of them, surely they could have saved a bit of power to make a proper tree.

  • Ryze #99 3 years ago

    Not read it all, but do they say anything about being able to install disc 2 to the HDD, and play with disc 1 in the drive?

    edit:

    /reads next paragraph

    Oh aye!
    Edited by 2 at 05/06/09 @ 13:10

  • FooAtari #100 3 years ago

    @farticus
    "No, not in the slightest. GT5p looks slightly nicer than Forza 2 when it's not moving. When GT is in motion the tearing destroys any immersion."

    Your such a fanboy. If there is one thing GT5p does have gowing for it, its graphics. I will play it again tonght but I rmember it's pretty smooth 60 fps with no tearing. Unlike Forza which can only manage 30 as far as I remember, its been a long time since I played it. But 30fps is a sin for a racing game, especailly a sim.

  • FooAtari #101 3 years ago

    @Ashen
    "Ask yourself one question: Why exactly do you want 12 cars instead of 8 on track?

    I don't beleive you want more than 8 cars for any other reason than 'more, more, more'. Your obsession with screen resolution shows that you put far more stock in numbers for numbers sake than is healthy."

    Do you watch motorsport? Would you watch any series with only 8 cars? I wouldn't. Any decent RACING sim should have a decent filed of at least 16 cars.

  • Psychotext #102 3 years ago

    For those that might actually be interested in the game (I appreciate that's likely to be about 10% of the people here, the rest being console warriors), sim hq have a good little write up on their time with the game: http://ww w.simhq.com/_commentary/all_090...

  • FooAtari #103 3 years ago

    Actually sounds quite promising, thanks for the link Psychotext

    I would also like to know about the structure of the game. Forza 2 felt almost identical to Forza 1 as far as the structur of the single player game went.

    Sadly I no longer have a 360 so wont have a chance to play it unless a mate gets it :(

    Pretty disapointed to read most people appear to play the game with some aids on. Throws most previews and handson into doubt.

    Pretty decent that the Xbox is getting the Fanatec Porsche force feedback wheel, it's supposed to be a great wheel, although the pedals are not up the the same auality as understand it. Although there are high spec pedals that can be bought seperatly, at least for the PC

    edit
    Ok so it says further down can be used with other pedals.
    Edited by 2 at 05/06/09 @ 14:23

  • Psychotext #104 3 years ago

    You're a great troll J1GSAW. Really quite amazingly accomplished at it.

    I do congratulate you.

  • lagoonalight #105 3 years ago

    Let us all be honest here. GT5P was nothing more than a tech demo made into a half a** game. We all know they have gotten a better handle on the game and its engine. Forza 3 seems like another great improvement to a sequel I didn't really like that much. I didn't like Prologue that much either soooooo.........

    I am still thinking after all this is said and done and who cares how long it takes GT5 is going to reign supreme by a country mile.

  • FooAtari #106 3 years ago

    @J1GSAW

    Did you read the write up at SimHQ Psychotext linked to? Forza would appear to be shaping up very well indeed and GT has some stiff competition. If Polyphony wish to compete they will have to do more than bring out the same game yet AGAIN but with more cars/tracks/better graphics. The physics are decent but there is more to a great driving sim than that.
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/09 @ 14:46

  • sacul92 #107 3 years ago

    @fooAtari, i mean it's meant for more serious gamers because of the number of hours you need to clock in to achieve 100% completion. I'm not entirely sure how long it take in Forza, I'll admit that. But each Gran Turismo has taken every gamer numerous hours to complete, which is what i meant by it's meant for more serious gamers who are willing to spend alot of time completing it. I will indeed be getting GT5 when it comes out, I don't care whether its better than Forza 3 or not, because I don't need to justify my own purchase. I also heard that damage physics will be in the game, and A.I. should be pumped up, who knows, I'll just have to wait then....
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/09 @ 14:58

  • NightAntilli #108 3 years ago

    @JIGSAW: You sir a a fanboy and have no idea what the hell you're talking about. Saying GT5 looks better than Forza is just crap, and I'm also referring to the article in this case. The overall feel of Forza 3 might be less realistic, but Forza 3 has awesome environments while the environments in GT5 just look dull and boring because of low textures. GT5 has almost no bump mapping while Forza 3 uses it consistently to make the game look awesome.. Forza 3 is simply pushing the graphics further than GT5 on a technical level, and everyone who is objective will see that. Forza 3 looks realistic enough and certainly is not defeated by GT5 in a lot of things..

  • sacul92 #109 3 years ago

    @faticusmaximus....lol, what a fanboy......dude, seriosuly, it's obvious u have a 360, so just get Forza 3 when it comes out, and stop bashing a game u know nothing about. Honestly, don't you have anything better to do?

  • Darren #110 3 years ago

    There's tearing a plenty in Gran Turismo 5 Prologue, even the Spec III version, although it's only minor on most of the tracks but it's especially obvious on the London track, which just happens to be the best one in that game. Also the replays show a lot of tearing despite running at 30 fps. There is also a lot of slowdown, especially when several cars are on-screen, again you only have to play the London track to notice this.

    While Prologue is only a work-in-progress in effect, I do hope the final game has a v-synced framerate because the earlier games did. Seeing tearing in Gran Turismo at all is like a step backwards for the series IMO. Seems to me that Polyphony Digitals's priority is 1080p over 720p even though it's obvious (to me anyway) that the PS3 isn't really powerful to handle 60 fps games at that resolution without numerous issues. If it was every game would run at 1080p, right, only they don't. They should have stuck with 720p IMO. Besides, why go through all the effort of making a gorgeous-looking 1080p racer with near photo-realistic visuals if you're going to tarnish it with unrealistic screen tearing? When did you ever see tearing in real life?!?!? ;)

    @FooAtari - Forza 2 runs at 60 fps with physics calculations running at 360 fps (according to Turn 10). Like GT5 Prologue, replays are also 30 fps with additional effects and motion-blur. The first Forza on the Xbox only ran at 30 fps though, in-game and replays.

  • Darren #111 3 years ago

    JIGSAW - It's hardly poor as such but sticking with eight cars for the third sequel, the same number as the earlier Xbox game, is disappointing I'll have to admit. I'm sure there are reasons for it though. The first sequel, as I mentioned above, had physics that ran at 360 fps so that might have limited the number of cars on the track. It seems that improving the graphics was the order of the day for Forza 3 so eight cars it is.

    That's assuming they don't increase the number for the final game. There is still another four months to go before the game is released.

  • sacul92 #112 3 years ago

    @farticus

    GT4 has sold over 10.1 million sopies while neitehr Forza 1 or 2 has come close to that. GT5 WILL have damage modelling and better AI. As for realistic handling, GT has always been more realistic than Forza. Ans just 8 player races, seriosuly? I mean, with many huge and massive tracks, you would think that they at Turn 10 could allow a few more players. And GT4 was the ONLY ran turismo to not top over 90% in meatacritic, excluding the prologue games. So, please farticus, get your facts straight.

  • Psychotext #113 3 years ago

    You know... given all the comments about 8 cars on the track thing you'd think that none of the people here would have been able to play GT4 (6 cars on track at one time) for all the disgust it makes them feel.

    sacul92 - GT sales are one thing on a console that sold 120m+... probably another on a console that hasn't sold 30m yet. It'll sell like hotcakes, no doubt. But I don't think it'll come close the previous incarnations of the series.
    Edited by 1 at 05/06/09 @ 16:09

  • sacul92 #114 3 years ago

    @psychotext

    Well, that's partly because that was last-gen and the fact that GT4 had no online mode. In GT5, there will be 16 player races.Also, the only reason i brought up sales was because of farticus who doesnt know his facts. Sales won't affect us in any way, so why do we acre, we dont get a cut of the profit do we? But in all honesty, I apologize 4 becoming a fanboy in my earlier comment. Again, I ahve to say, if you have a 360, get Forza 3, and if you have a ps3, get GT5, as simple as that, unless ur farticus of course, the ultimo fanboy......
    Edited by 2 at 05/06/09 @ 16:15

  • sacul92 #115 3 years ago

    @ farticus

    Forza and Gran Turismo are both great games, so why do you have the bash either, just get your game of choice and stop bashing the other as if it was utter crap. Plus, I seriously doubt that you have actual track racing experience, and comparing the handling of Forza and GT will always bring about a different outcome depending on who you ask. So you get Forza 3, and I'll get GT5, and we can all live happily ever after.

  • Psychotext #116 3 years ago

    I'm getting both... SO FUCK YOU ALL!

    \o/

  • sacul92 #117 3 years ago

    @ psychotext

    you lucky bastard.....

  • Psychotext #118 3 years ago

    There's a couple of posters that didn't read the impressions from a site dedicated to proper sims.

  • FooAtari #119 3 years ago

    Why would they want to do that when they can turn on the blinkers and talk a lot of bollocks instead? If they listen to people that know what they are talking about, they cant really make their argument then, so best to ignore it

    It's not about the game, it's about which console they are on. I'll bet 90% of the posters here only own once console, and most probably don't care that much for these games anyway. Like you said earlier, console warriors.

  • Pipemould #120 3 years ago

    J1GSAW obviously feels the need to constantly troll an article on a rival system because he feels threatened and disappointed that there will have been 3 Forza games from Microsoft in the last 4-5yrs while Sony have released a demo with a price tag attached.

    GT is a good game, I've played all but GT5p but there is no need for the AI when they don' even pose a threat or make mistakes like real drivers do.

    As for 8 cars, well, I was sure that some night time races in GT had only 6 cars but are people complaining about that? No. Gee what a surprise.

    I'm proud to be an unbiased gamer, means I enjoy more than just one franchise.


    PS: I read SimHQ's take on FM3, it's a refreshing change to read impressions from some proper sim fans. (I used to play Grand Prix Legends myself a few years ago)

  • FooAtari #121 3 years ago

    (I used to play Grand Prix Legends myself a few years ago)

    /still does

  • chris_ace #122 3 years ago

    Post deleted at 11:55:13 13-12-2011

  • Pipemould #123 3 years ago

    FooAtari
    "(I used to play Grand Prix Legends myself a few years ago)

    /still does"

    I would too, but I moved overseas and only own a laptop now. Gaming rig is still back home. :^(


    chris_ace

    "that was last gen, be nice if things moved on a bit as GRID showed.

    8 cars LOL!

    GRID has a lot because the physics engine doesn't have to work as hard. The more mathematics going on behind the scenes, the less polys you can have on screen. Formula 1 97 had 20 cars on the track but Gran Turismo couldn't even manage half of that. See how that works?

    The reason why FM3 is only having 8 cars is because the poly count is way higher than FM2 and there is more going on including the newly added tyre deformation and tyre rolling/flexing, whatever you want to call it. Add on top of that the AI makes mistakes instead of 7 AI cars following one driving line (or in GT's case, 12 cars driving on magnetic strips LOL!)
    Edited by 2 at 06/06/09 @ 02:05

  • secombe #124 3 years ago

    I'd personally take a graphics hit to have more than 8 cars on track. Most race series wouldn't even run with 8 cars, it's a pretty poor amount to have on track. Surely we should be at a stage where 16 or 20 is the absolute minimum? As always the graphics wars mean that other more important areas take a hit.

    Starting from the back and working through 30+ cars on my local circuit (Castle Combe) with the difficulty pitched just right so I should be able to get on the podium within 40 laps (as long as I make very few mistakes) is what makes sims like GTR2 so brilliant for me.

  • des #125 3 years ago

    GT5 will have to lot to live up,especially at online.
    Sorry PD,online is now half of the game(some would even argue that crap online=crap game)
    Environments too...two poly tress =lol
    AI also,damage
    We shall see what they did when the first gameplay footage appears...not this bullshot replay crap

  • FooAtari #126 3 years ago

    secomb:
    "As always the graphics wars mean that other more important areas take a hit."

    Depressing isn't it.

  • RobTheBuilder #127 3 years ago

    F2 is my most played game of this gen (in terms of time played online and offline); I hope they get this right. F2 was a mile better than any GT, fun instead of deathly dull.

    Would be nice to get round first corner of online Nordschleife without everyone crashing into each other though!

  • chris_ace #128 3 years ago

    Post deleted at 11:55:13 13-12-2011

  • Pipemould #129 3 years ago

    Sorry, I thought it was 12 offline and 16 online. My bad.

  • chronom4n #130 3 years ago

    anyone remember motogp2:urt and the feature in the time trials where you you could place the rider anywhere on the track you wanted. for example, if you were not able to master a certain corner you could place your driver before the corner and keep practising until you hit the nail on the head. great little feature which should be implemented in every racing game.

  • davisorle #131 3 years ago

    @farticusmaximus
    Dude you need to stop feeding the poor.. ( the jigsaw kiddo.. lol )

    Apparently he doesnt know wtf he is even commenting or responding about. Let him be in case he gets a life. that, for starters ofc only, might boost him into having a more clear and accurate perspective of things..

  • MARKIV #132 3 years ago

    2 discs? First off I now install the 360 game I want to play to my HD, the DVD noise is too much of a distraction otherwise. But what with me, like most folk having only a 20gb drive ( albeit 13gb ) and then take off the space for say the Halo3 map packs ( 1.1gb ) and a few XBLA games, that leaves me spare with only just over 10gb's.

    So if Turn10 are saying it's gonna be over 10gb to install both discs, I'm almost already put off! I may end up with Blur and GT5 on the PS3 instead and to think I've got an almost silent Bluray player and 260gb's or so of hard disk space too..!

  • cfunicelli #133 2 years ago

    love the game, but the cockpit view could definatly be improved... hopefully the game u can change ur seat position in the full game but one thing i noticed is the when u shift the person in the car doesnt move .. please respond and tell me what u think about that.