E3: Project Natal - Milo demo

paedophilic

Looks a bit rubbish to be fair.

claire = would

only if she shut up

I call BS on this for a couple reasons (if it's the video I'm thinking of - can't see it at work)

When Claire is interacting with the boy he tracks her motion from OUR perspective instead of hers. For example.. when she moves to the side of the screen his head follows her and we see the side of his face... which means SHE sees the side of his face too as the image on TV is really 2D, like a poster.

She stands too close to the TV sometimes for the camera to be able to pick up all her motions because the camera is sat on top of the screen. (Look how quickly she flashes the picture she gives him to the camera too)

Everything in that video is acted, Molyneux you fraud. It's even made obvious by the conversation she's having with the boy.

This is a pre-visualisation, not a demonstration. The Project Natal video of the family playing the games is terrible too. I bet the finished product is nothing better than "You're in the Movies" in terms of quality and responsive...ness(?)

what the thrill in making fake waves in fake water? 'better spend the day at the beach/lake/swmpool
games are meant to be played, this is no game

I like the spiffy huge Xbox next to the TV.

XdarXideX - I agree that most of this is mocked up, but the perspecive bit is probably just a bug (or it's been done so that it looks right for us). They obviously have 'something' working to some degree. Read Engadget's interview. They got to tell Milo a joke and it recognise it and giggled.

Eraysor - That's a 360 dev kit.

Cynics much?

@XdarXideX

Sorry mate but, it's not a mock up. It's a prototype AI model using Natal. The camera tracks limb and face movements and can do face recognition (which isn't as complex as it sounds). It's sampling at around 60fps so scanning the image wasn't going to take more than a split second.

The only thing fixed is the scenario in which Milo is based i.e. the riverside.

A lot of PS3 people seem very pissed off that Microsoft have pulled this one off. If it takes off in the mainstream, then it's going to be huge. Meaning that Sony will follow this with interest while making their own plans for someting similar.

FireMonkey - But in context with the video and Molyneux's own words in it, it's mostly a lie.

He says this is the stuff of the future happening right now and that it's not acted... both of those statements are untrue. Sure the voice recognition probably works as does face recognition but i highly doubt the 360 can cope with it as fast as it appears to be doing so.

I'll believe it when I see it i person.

penhalion - yes i know how it "works" but that is not real time in the "demo". Another thing... look at the perspective of her reflection in the water compared to the position of the camera. The camera wouldn't even be able to see most of her arm.

Looks good.

Makes me want to question how Milo would react if you stopped being nice to him though? What kind of restrictions will there be in your interactions with characters like Milo? If I was to play this and tell Milo to fuck off, would his character take it to heart and then stop all possible future interactions? If so, then that's a powerful tool and very realistic, but if not (and it would seem wise not to be able to do this so that the experience can still be played) this stops it being a truly faithful interactive experience.

It is amazing to think that these possibilities are now being explored, however, it should only be used for certain types of games, I would not like this to be the future of how ALL games will played. Food for thought though.

I'm sure there are parameter it has to work under but man is this exciting stuff!

Step closer to getting our holodecks!

It's cool, but I'll have to agree with zoweewowee.

W.

T.

F.

It's a wide angle lense people. The camera is designed for close use not for looking at people from 2 miles away!

If you've ever used a playstation eye or the 360 camera you'd know that it takes in a lot even when you are close to it. Same with any laptop web camera for frak sake.

It's getting kind of wierd that people simply don't want this thing to work. Even to the point where they are making blatantly silly claims about it's camera now!

zoweewowee - No, it's not a game. It's a Tech Demo to give an impression of what may be possibly.

XdarXideX - Yeah, you have to take what Molyneux says with a very large bucket of salt. The only thing I doubt in this video is the level of interaction. Yeah, it can recognise facial expressions and vocal tones to identify if you are telling a joke or not, but having a proper conversation just won't happen. In his interview he admits that it is just a series of clever tricks.

Engadget just did a hands on with it: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/e3-pro...

Ill believe it when I see it.

But then, why would I want to play with a fake boy?

Not for me.

@Penhalion

Actually, some of us are pissed off because its the most transparent bit of smoke and mirrors chicanery since Sony's KZ2 "trailer".

Its a bit of theatre that is dragging attention away from far more interesting and importantly REAL stuff on show.

@penhalion
"A lot of PS3 people seem very pissed off that Microsoft have pulled this one off."

Erm... Yea... Pulled off in my book would be "released". Theres plenty of things revealed at E3 which even when they are playable are very heavily scripted to one particular scenario. Not to mention that right now, whilst very impressive tech wise, it isn't quite a game yet.

"Meaning that Sony will follow this with interest while making their own plans for someting similar."

I think making plans is a slight understatement when you look at something like EyePet (not 100% similar but you can see both feeding each other ideas).

natal looks good, but they'd better use it for physics-interactive multiplayer online games

AI thing is impressive, but really sad

I don't care if it is just "theatre". At least the idea is out there and if it is out there then it is being worked on.

penhalion - Don't get me wrong I would love this to work as it's being touted and I would totally buy it for my beloved 360, but this demo is a lie. Unless that camera has an eyeball style lens with a view range equal or better than that ofa human eye, it's NOT seeing her hand swoosh around underneath it (though remember I can't see the video at work and I watched it late last night so I'll admit I'm wrong if Claire isn't swooshing her hand VERY close to the screen to manipulate the water).

FireMonkey - yeah I read the interview but he only really speaks about the voice and face/body recognition. If there's more that I've missed then I'll try to look busy while re-reading it!

I can see this being clever stuff but that tech demo was clearly staged

Guys, there are previews on the net of journos actually using this tech. To help them, you can find them by using something called a 'search engine'.

it doesn't work today - i just held a peice of paper up in front of my 360 for AGES... and it didn't do anything! :P

Eurogamer has certainly got alot of cynic wankers on here hasn't it, just a basic tech demo showing what could be a possibility is now being called the kz2 for microsoft. Fuck. I really hope this takes off so i can virtually bitch slap some of you cynics back to your generic fps.

It's an interesting combination of technologies but I don't get who Milo would appeal to. If you've got kids, why would you want to spend time working out Milo's problems too? And if you've not got kids, make the most of the freedom! It kinda says "don't expect too much out of the AI" (as Peter Multiplex said himself, they've not beaten the Turing test).

I switched off at the human waggle so missed this.

Creepy. OK if you want that sort of thing I suppose but doesn't really interest me.

Amazing tech demo. This thing has real potential.

If Milo becomes Cindy the stripper id be much more interested

Not sure how interested I'd be in talking to a virtual boy.
I'd hate to see the full retail price for all the kit required.
Something like that Fish thing that was for the Dreamcast?

Why is everyone getting so emotional about this? There is very little to go on right now, so it is frankly normal to be skeptical about it. Anyone letting their imagination run wild is just asking to be disappointed later.

I bet porn industry guys are already stroking their, erm, chins.

"The camera wouldn't even be able to see most of her arm. "

?????

That all depends on the lens.

You have got to love old PM, one day the technology will catch up with his mouth.

We are about 5 years away looking at this video.

bodypopper - Don't be an idiot. People with sense can see that the video is clearly staged. Whether the hands-on previews are staged is a different matter... but then these journo's aren't interacting on the same level as the girl in the video demonstration.

kingnothing - Eurogamer also has a lot of wankers who register just to argue with the cynics. We're allowed to have opinions here and the fact is there are several people on here now who will also agree with me that it is staged. You can tell by the fine details.

Molyneux is famous for this kind of BS. I'll never believe any of his hype.

EDIT: Dizzy - yes it does depend on the lens. It would have to be a fish-eye style lens rather than a regular camera lens as, if I remember correctly, she's standing too close to the screen for a normal camera lens sat on top of the TV to be able to see what she's doing. If you have a Live Vision Camera, try it yourself. If I'm wrong then I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure I'm not.

Looks bollocks.

If they put that Claire (I would) in the demo I bet everyone would be a lot more receptive to this concept, the bad choice was choosing a young boy for the tech demo.

Can we replace that little boy with Megan Fox?

This would've been very interesting if Molyneux could just shut the fuck up and let me watch it without the video cutting to his condescending bullshit every 10 seconds.

@DrCheese

and see what else you can wave infront of the camera? ;)

Just imagine the possibilities for Fable 3 if they manage to pull this off. Cool.

Okay that freaked me out, and also I agree with XdarXideX; everything seems so put on, from the conversations to the physical interactions (paper thing WTF?), almost like the videos Nintendo show of families playing on Wii. Total fraud and fake.

I don't like Molyneux.

XdarXideX +1

I can see them being exited about this, there is a lot of potential, but this is a tech demo and might not noever actually work in real life. If it does work, however, then the implications for controlling games and for interacting with other gamers through the xbox will be huge. Big if, tho.

A few things tho, to look at what this really is:
Everything Milo is SAYING is pre-recorded, as fas as I can understand. Is it at all possible for a computer to make sentences like that and render them with a computer voice sounding like that? It wasent the last time I checked, but if the xbox can do that now, in real-time, then I am blown away.

The animations and movemet patterns also seem to be pre-recorded. In fact, everything Milo does has been staged, but it is possible that the software does trigger events based on input from Claire to some extent. Such as saying hello - a recognizeable phrase that gets a response, and maybe the word "play" which triggers a new response, and so on.

There are quite a few clever trichs here, like putting on the "goggles" to let the camera locate the eyes (and thereby the location of the face) and other things.

Milo is a price of script responding to various kinds of input; that is impressive enough, and the whole point is of course to make it seem even more impresssive than it really is.

The swishing with the water and the attempt to catch a fish is, I suppose, the only approximation of actual gameplay that I can discern here. That is pure eyetoy.

PM is the master of bullshit, but he usuelly does deliver on his bullshit, so this could be grand. Im interested, but not convinced.

it might be breaking new ground but... i don't care. the technology maybe there if you like Eliza-like intelligence (cough) but to me it doesn't look like any fun, it looks like work.

the best demonstration they could devise was a "babysit a stroppy 12 year old that needs to be spoken to like he's a retard" simulator?

it's technology for technology's sake. it looks like they found the solution to a problem that no one is interested in.

show me how this would be used to create/enhance an AAA title and i'll be interested. but at the moment i'd avoid games with this technology like the plague, it's just a gimmick and not a fun one at that.

The way you have to look at this is in the same way as when they unveiled things like direct x way back in the day.. this technology being used with a game like lets say.. morrowind. Imagine that. interaction with a game character who is looking right at you and scanning YOUR face not some hidden ingame face, it opens a whole new world of idea's for game developers and the like, not to mention educational uses, scientific, medical the list is endless. Its a technical demonstration parts of it are likely to be "set up" to show off or .. funny enough.. demonstrate what its capable of in the right hands and THAT is worth singing about.

What a joke.

The Natal tech is impressive enough without Moly talking such toss, and such a blatantly faked vid. "Not acted" my arse. Even Natal won't see at 89' downwards angle, certainly with depth perception. Hell, at least KZ2 ended up damn close to the infamous vid. AI Interaction at this level on a 360 (or PS3)? Not a fooking hope.

"Science fiction writers haven't written about this yet"?
ORLY? Ray Bradbury's calling from the 1950s. He wants a word.