The cycling thread Page 159

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  • Deleted user 17 October 2012 20:29:10
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cycling/19930514

    Lance case creates unlikely hero - one of his team members story who didn't take performing enchancing drugs, quit professional cycling after being sacked by Us Postal for not keeping up to trainnig standards - i.e taking drugs.
  • oceanmotion 17 Oct 2012 20:38:12 15,942 posts
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    Nice read. Good guy.
  • grey_matters 17 Oct 2012 20:41:13 3,750 posts
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    Nike are rumoured to have helped one of his positive tests to go away. Rumoured cost: $500,000. I can see a lot of investigative journalists hunting down the trails now that he doesn't have the same level of protection. Nike, Trek, and especially the UCI (in particular Pat McQuaid) are not going to come out of this very well either.

    Edited by grey_matters at 20:42:37 17-10-2012
  • Lamb 17 Oct 2012 20:52:14 474 posts
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    @joelstinton

    That was a good article.

    "He was a brash young man back then, but clearly had drive and talent," Mercier says.
    "To come back from the illness he had was truly astounding, no-one can take that away from him.
    "But the methods he used to achieve his success were fraudulent. His story is the greatest in sport but it's also the biggest fraud."
    Still not happy with the media though, tearing down a childhood hero is hard to take.
  • Deleted user 17 October 2012 21:06:12
    It is. I think thats why people are so defensive/attacking.

    When it all came out , they interviewed alex dowsett and you can see the confusion on the guys face, grew up idolising the guy and it was a false illusion. He wanted to cling on to his childhood hero.

    Whats worse, was everyone bar a few were doing it. So they were all on a level playing field ( maybe not - perhaps its effects bodies differently). Racing in France at least he was still the best of his generation. That what hurts, if they weren't doing it, he still be the great athelete he is.

    I hope in some way he can come back from all this. I still think theres going to be a huge chunk of people who will have time for him. But its a long road upwards.

    Edited by joelstinton at 21:06:53 17-10-2012
  • elstoof 17 Oct 2012 21:17:05 7,328 posts
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    Doping for your your own gain is one thing, but you seem to overlook the ring leading and forcing of team members to adhere and put themselves at risk, and the trickle down expectation from younger riders with ProTour ambitions. People dropped down dead because of badly administered chemicals while Armstrong was living his ill gotten dream of heroism.
  • Psychotext 17 Oct 2012 22:01:45 54,195 posts
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    joelstinton wrote:
    Whats worse, was everyone bar a few were doing it. So they were all on a level playing field ( maybe not - perhaps its effects bodies differently).
    Even aside from that, the techniques used by USPS put them in a whole different league compared to other teams when it came to doping... and that's before you get into the whole A team vs B team stuff.

    And frankly, what about Armstrong at the top? Who exactly from his team is going to challenge him to win the tour when he's the don?

    It couldn't be more manufactured. Not even taking into account the fact that there really were those who didn't dope (and could have challenged Armstrong based on what we know scientifically about the performance increases).
  • grey_matters 17 Oct 2012 22:18:41 3,750 posts
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    How anybody had any time for him after the Simeoni incident in 2004 beggars belief. Or the LeMond/Trek incident. Or any number of other shitty poisonous things he was involved in. Top level asshole, always was, always will be.
  • MikeP 18 Oct 2012 10:01:27 1,866 posts
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    The Simeoni thing was disgraceful.

    LA making a "zip your mouth" gesture right at the supporting cameras sums that period of cycling up perfectly. Sad as that is.

    PSN ID: Mikenetic

  • Psychotext 18 Oct 2012 12:30:46 54,195 posts
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    This is fucking disgraceful, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a lawsuit in the US by people trying to get their money back:

    Livestrong hired lobbyist to persuade politicians that USADA should have its powers reduced. Is this what a cancer charity should be doing?
    https://twitter.com/DavidWalshST/status/258696136154570752
  • kalel 18 Oct 2012 12:40:08 87,682 posts
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    Lamb wrote:
    Lance Armstrong never harmed me, the media harmed me. They glorified him and built him up, and everybody said you gotta read his book, its so inspirational and grudgingly I did and I was inspired. Now the media comes out fifteen years later, OMG he is a cheat, lets burn his books and crucify him. WTF!?
    Lamb wrote:
    Still not happy with the media though, tearing down a childhood hero is hard to take.
    I'm sorry but this is quite blatantly shooting the messenger.

    I'm sorry your childhood hero has turned out to be a cheat of epic proportions, and I can understand that is a hard reality to accept, but the villain of this story is absolutely without doubt Lance Armstrong.

    If you live by the sword, you die by the sword, and the media is Lance Armstrong's sword. He is a media mastermind and used them at every stage of his journey with cynicism, adeptly wielding their power to further his agenda. It is quite right that they have now turned on him to tear him down again.

    And it is the very least that he deserves. Frankly I believe he should go to jail - the extent of his crimes which include fraud and corruption go well beyond being a sports cheat. He is a criminal.
  • pistol 18 Oct 2012 15:16:06 13,019 posts
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    Lamb wrote:
    My two cents

    Lance Armstrong the media built him into a hero and now they ripped him apart. I for one don't care if he used epo or didn't. He remains a hero in my eyes for all he did for cancer and bringing celebrity status to the sport.

    Epo and other performance enhancing drugs should be studied and utilized to make the human race and its food supply better. Given also that testing is inefficient whenever a new drug comes out, then whats the point? Only ban hazardous substances thats what drug testing should be geared toward.


    @MikeP

    Kudos thats hilarious. :p :D
    I'm sorry, but WTF are you going on about??

    Outside the cycling world the media didn't know he was a cheat until recently, so obviously someone who comes back from cancer and wins 7 tour de frances is going to be hailed a hero. His cancer foundation Livestrong wasn't started until he'd already won 5, and prior to him getting cancer he could barely finish a tour, nevermind win it. Yes all his competitors doped but not with the same perks at the top as he had, and the most advanced doctors. And what sort of prick continues to dope after recovering from cancer? What sort of message is that to send out to all those cancer sufferers out there, or people who have been affected by cancer. The guy is one big contradiction.

    Hero my ass.

    Edited by pistol at 15:18:36 18-10-2012
  • pistol 18 Oct 2012 15:19:50 13,019 posts
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    grey_matters wrote:
    Nike are rumoured to have helped one of his positive tests to go away. Rumoured cost: $500,000. I can see a lot of investigative journalists hunting down the trails now that he doesn't have the same level of protection. Nike, Trek, and especially the UCI (in particular Pat McQuaid) are not going to come out of this very well either.
    McQuaid wasn't around until 2005 so a lot of it happened before he was involved. Verbruggen is the main culprit, athough Mcquaid needs to go too.
  • Youthist 18 Oct 2012 15:23:42 10,018 posts
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    So did anyone do the Palace to Palace - 45 mile bucks palace to Windor castle last weekend?

    2hrs44 here if anyone cares....

    Think of how stupid the average person is, and realise half of them are stupider than that

  • pistol 18 Oct 2012 15:43:30 13,019 posts
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    Youthist wrote:
    So did anyone do the Palace to Palace - 45 mile bucks palace to Windor castle last weekend?

    2hrs44 here if anyone cares....
    Nope, but I did a 70 mile training ride around the Chilterns last weekend.
  • elstoof 18 Oct 2012 15:49:47 7,328 posts
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    2h44 pistol? ;)

    Thats a Good effort Youthist, it's got some good scenery down that way. Had you done much riding at that distance before?
  • pistol 18 Oct 2012 15:58:16 13,019 posts
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    elstoof wrote:
    2h44 pistol? ;)

    Thats a Good effort Youthist, it's got some good scenery down that way. Had you done much riding at that distance before?
    ..;-)

    Elstoof, I can normally do about 50 miles undulating in around 2.40 on my own, and quicker in a group.
  • Dougs 18 Oct 2012 23:18:31 67,705 posts
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    /buffs 25 mile 2 hour badge. :)
  • Psychotext 18 Oct 2012 23:51:43 54,195 posts
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    One of these days I'm going to get me one of these tiny bikes and see what I can do on it.
  • pistol 19 Oct 2012 09:42:34 13,019 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    One of these days I'm going to get me one of these tiny bikes and see what I can do on it.
    Can't see that happening anytime too, the way you refer to us "roadies".

    Like it's some cult or something..;-)
  • elstoof 19 Oct 2012 10:28:11 7,328 posts
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    Joinnnnnnn usssssssssss....

    I'll lend you some Lycra. Some tight Italian fit stuff.
  • Psychotext 19 Oct 2012 11:01:56 54,195 posts
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    pistol wrote:
    Like it's some cult or something..;-)
    You should see the middle age fuckers going around in packs round these ways. Cult would be being generous. :D


    elstoof wrote:
    Joinnnnnnn usssssssssss....

    I'll lend you some Lycra. Some tight Italian fit stuff.
    But who will wax my legs? :(

    Edited by Psychotext at 11:02:41 19-10-2012
  • elstoof 19 Oct 2012 12:12:45 7,328 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    One of these days I'm going to get me one of these tiny bikes and see what I can do on it.
    Are road bikes all that small? I always picture mountain bikes to be the small ones with their teeny weeny wheels and low saddles. Bikes like the Lapierre Zesty look microscopic to me.
  • andytheadequate 19 Oct 2012 12:19:34 8,173 posts
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    @Psychotext - ride around on boring roads through rush hour traffic in constant fear of getting run over by a lorry, all whilst looking like a rubbish super hero in lycra?

    Went to the Yorkshire dales last weekend and the route we did involved a few miles of road riding. I know a mountain bike isn't the best thing to ride on roads but my god it was dull, even with pretty scenary and quiet roads
  • Psychotext 19 Oct 2012 12:23:37 54,195 posts
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    elstoof wrote:
    Are road bikes all that small? I always picture mountain bikes to be the small ones with their teeny weeny wheels and low saddles. Bikes like the Lapierre Zesty look microscopic to me.
    29ers innit. A downhill 29er looks massive next to your average road bike. But I was talking mostly about the slim frames / wheels and whatnot.

    That aside, was just browsing through some of Mountain Bike Rider's Killer loops when I saw this elevation profile.



    Fuck.That.Noise.
  • Psychotext 19 Oct 2012 12:24:27 54,195 posts
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    Ooh, these too. lol





    Edited by Psychotext at 12:28:24 19-10-2012
  • Trafford 19 Oct 2012 12:44:23 5,791 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    elstoof wrote:
    Are road bikes all that small? I always picture mountain bikes to be the small ones with their teeny weeny wheels and low saddles. Bikes like the Lapierre Zesty look microscopic to me.
    29ers innit. A downhill 29er looks massive next to your average road bike. But I was talking mostly about the slim frames / wheels and whatnot.

    A 29er has the same size wheels (700c) as a road/Cx bike. It's the big tyres that give it the monster truck look/feel.
    Not sure if they'd be any good on a low profile Downhill specific Mtb either.
  • MikeP 19 Oct 2012 12:44:45 1,866 posts
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    I'm used to 26" wheel MTBs, but I do like the look of 29ers. There's also a sub-class of Cyclocross bikes called Monster Crossers, which use MTB 29er tyres. I'd love to have a go on one.

    They're getting towards drop-barred rigid MTBs, like Tomac rode in the 1990s. Nothing new under the sun...

    Downhill on drop bars, 1" of front travel and a rear disc. LIKE A BOSS.

    http://youtu.be/rbWR4uhebeY?t=2m16s

    Edited by MikeP at 12:45:14 19-10-2012

    PSN ID: Mikenetic

  • Psychotext 19 Oct 2012 12:47:41 54,195 posts
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    Trafford wrote:
    Not sure if they'd be any good on a low profile Downhill specific Mtb either.
    29ers are getting very popular in the DH market. Have seen a ton of them in the mags recently. But you're right, they're more popular for XC bikes.

    Edit - Unrelated: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cycling/20001685


    Rabobank is ending its sponsorship of its professional cycling team following the Lance Armstrong doping revelations.

    The Dutch bank's decision follows a United States Anti-Doping Agency (Usada) report which concluded that Armstrong engaged in "serial cheating".

    "We are no longer convinced that the international professional world of cycling can make this a clean and fair sport," said Rabobank's Bert Bruggink.
    I can only really see that as a good thing; it's going to put massive pressure on UCI.

    Edited by Psychotext at 12:57:09 19-10-2012
  • elstoof 19 Oct 2012 12:56:12 7,328 posts
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    My teeny tiny road bike, half built.

    Should have it finished this weekend.
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