Random rants that don't warrant their own threads Page 240

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  • Deleted user 10 December 2012 23:26:47
    As part of a criminal justice course I had to enter into a debate about the death penalty. It's still going on (and will do for the course of about a week) but I've already had to step back because it's making me feel very angry.


    (strongly against, btw)
  • localnotail 10 Dec 2012 23:30:41 23,093 posts
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    Are the people you are debating with religious?

    A strange game. The only winning move is not to play.

  • Deleted user 10 December 2012 23:33:36
    And if not, can we sacrifice them in Wicker Men?
  • Deleted user 10 December 2012 23:33:57
    Surprisingly, no.
  • Load_2.0 10 Dec 2012 23:36:53 18,201 posts
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    Good luck with that, the land of the free love them some death penalty.
  • Deleted user 10 December 2012 23:41:26
    Eh, as a whole the population are against the death penalty. More states are leaning towards abolishing it outright (though Texas will hold on until the bitter end), and prison as a whole is moving towards rehabilitation rather than outright punishment. Wouldn't be surprised if it came up to the Supreme Court in the next few years. It's just 'cause I'm in a heavily red state that I'm getting worked up by the replies. If I lived in Portland I'd probably come away relatively cheerful.

    Edited by meme at 23:44:36 10-12-2012
  • Load_2.0 10 Dec 2012 23:44:45 18,201 posts
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    Google says 61% in favour.
  • Deleted user 10 December 2012 23:48:23
    This Criminal Justice book I have here from this year says it's about 53% against, rising year on year. Support is declining, anyway.
  • Load_2.0 10 Dec 2012 23:51:59 18,201 posts
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    It's definitely dropping, I could well be wrong the Gallup poll makes for interesting reading either way.

    http://www.gallup.com/poll/1606/death-penalty.aspx
  • Deleted user 10 December 2012 23:54:44
    Yeah, it seems states like Texas et al (who'd probably bring in Sharia Law if it meant they could string up more people) seem to swing the balance on some of the polls. The majority of the states still with a death penalty are looking likely to move towards abolition, it seems. I know California is the one everyone's looking at. 700+ people on death row, but only a dozen or so executions in 30 years, and none at all since 2006. Prop 34 was only rejected by a very narrow margin, so that's looking likely to swing around within the next few years.
  • megastar 18 Dec 2012 14:46:28 17,104 posts
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    Surely, if you buy a fucking 3G capable phone on a contract with a certain amount of data usage FOR said fucking 3G capabilities - yet you can never get a fucking 3G signal - then said phone (or phone contract) MUST fall foul of the Sales of Goods act!??

    Edited by megastar at 14:46:42 18-12-2012
  • Megapocalypse 22 Dec 2012 15:46:05 5,229 posts
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    Fucking DPD delivery. Paid an extra 10 to ensure something would be delivered yesterday and it never arrived. Still waiting now, and if it doesn't arrive in the next hour there's no point in it arriving at all.

    Edited by Megapocalypse at 15:47:13 22-12-2012
  • Jeepers 22 Dec 2012 16:15:12 13,172 posts
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    Megapocalypse wrote:
    Fucking DPD delivery. Paid an extra 10 to ensure something would be delivered yesterday and it never arrived. Still waiting now, and if it doesn't arrive in the next hour there's no point in it arriving at all.
    Get on Twitter and bitch. It's the only way to make contact with the feckless fuckers. They called me within ten mins of a public gripe aimed at their Twitter account.
  • spamdangled 28 Dec 2012 10:33:20 27,197 posts
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    As a smoker for a decade that has his habit wax and wane but actually enjoys it rather than it just being an addiction, I've become pretty immune to false-posturing lectures from government and being used as an easy tsx grab in every annual budget and punchable anti-smoking charity spokespersons treating me like I'm some sort of unwilling heroin addict in desperate need of liberating.

    But a piece on BBC News just now (specifically a single fuckwit campaign spokespeson sentence) made my blood boil:

    "We are launching this latest campaign because youngsters these days have never before been exposed to the shocking truth of what smoking can mean for your health".

    This was then followed by a load of bollocks from a so-called "expert" who trotted out the falsehood that all smokers are nervous wrecks desperately waiting to be liberated and are unaware of the health implications, without any attempt at balance outside of the news anchor saying "but aren't they already aware of the risks" at one point.

    That opening sentence made me shout "Oh, fuck OFF". Suggesting that despite over 20 concerted years of going overboard demonising smokers has somehow skipped the latest generation's attention is fucking lazy even by the standards of government and the anti-smoking gestapo.

    I KNOW all the fucking risks.

    KIDS know all the fucking risks. Fuck, I was taught them in school science lessons and PSE as part of the whole "drugs are bad mmkay" compulsory education, and I am now in my 30s.

    Government will NEVER, EVER EVER fucking outright ban it because it's a cash cow for them and, combined with alcohol duty, funds the entire NHS by itself (a fact which also instantly negates the fucking morons who suggest smokers/drinkers are drains on the health service). They will, however, continue to wave their hands and make themselves LOOK like they hate it because the demonisation campaign was so successful any attempt to unpick or at least fix its moronic extremes would be electoral suicide.

    There is a very compelling argument involving actual data which links the introduction of the blanket smoking ban to the now seemingly-irreversible death of the British Pub as an institution, which has rather unfortunately but ironically coincided with a massive rise in problem drinking through people drinking at home unsupervised/moderated.

    There is no evidence to suggest these fucking campaigns have any effect (more powerful is the effect of constantly hiking tobacco duty, which is a blunt instrument destined to end in a colossal foot-shooting final analysis in some internal treasury report in the future that finally makes them realise their slavish devotion to milking the cow in ever-increasing amounts is actually counter-productive).

    Edited by darkmorgado at 10:37:59 28-12-2012

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  • RyanDS 28 Dec 2012 10:39:52 8,701 posts
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    darkmorgado wrote:


    There is a very compelling argument involving actual data which links the introduction of the blanket smoking ban to the now seemingly-irreversible death of the British Pub as an institution, which has rather unfortunately but ironically coincided with a massive rise in problem drinking through people drinking at home unsupervised/moderated.
    Having just got back from Romania and South Africa, both of which allow smoking in pubs I can catagorically say that the smoking ban is the best thing ever. It's only now, after being in fresh air that you realise just how dank and shit pubs used to be.
  • spamdangled 28 Dec 2012 10:46:14 27,197 posts
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    I think an optional smoking/non-smoking license (or some other halfway compromise) would have been better. I do respect non-smoker's right to not be subjected to it, but treating smokers constantly like borderline criminals is up there with anti-piracy legislation and the war of drugs as endeavours trying to ram a square peg into a round hole and thinking they are the ideal solution.

    3DS: 4055-2781-2855 Xbox: spamdangled PSN: dark_morgan Wii U: Spamdangle Steam: spamdangled

  • skuzzbag 28 Dec 2012 10:46:16 5,483 posts
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    I'd like my taxes to go towards supporting non-smokers and non-heavy drinkers with medical conditions thanks please government.

    You wouldn't pay for my wife to have a back operation to fix a condition she's had since she was 5 that keeps her awake at night in pain.

    It's the least you can do for us honest healthy tax payers that are trying to not be a burden.
  • boo 28 Dec 2012 10:47:25 11,604 posts
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    You sound mightily stressed, DM.

    I suspect it's your filthy smoking habit that's to blame. You should give up and eat celery instead.

    Just Another Lego Blog

  • RyanDS 28 Dec 2012 10:47:55 8,701 posts
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    darkmorgado wrote:
    I think an optional smoking/non-smoking license (or some other halfway compromise) would have been better. I do respect non-smoker's right to not be subjected to it, but treating smokers constantly like borderline criminals is up there with anti-piracy legislation and the war of drugs as endeavours trying to ram a square peg into a round hole and thinking they are the ideal solution.
    How is saying "don't smoke inside in public" treating someone like a criminal?
  • spamdangled 28 Dec 2012 10:49:26 27,197 posts
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    skuzzbag wrote:
    I'd like my taxes to go towards supporting non-smokers and non-heavy drinkers with medical conditions thanks please government.

    You wouldn't pay for my wife to have a back operation to fix a condition she's had since she was 5 that keeps her awake at night in pain.

    It's the least you can do for us honest healthy tax payers that are trying to not be a burden.
    The point about how tobacco and alcohol duty actually pay for the NHS budget obviously passed you by.

    3DS: 4055-2781-2855 Xbox: spamdangled PSN: dark_morgan Wii U: Spamdangle Steam: spamdangled

  • MrTomFTW Moderator 28 Dec 2012 10:51:35 36,290 posts
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    The smoking ban was a very good thing indeed. I used to come home with sinus pain after a night out due to that constant, foul-smelling haze.

    I totally called it.
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  • skuzzbag 28 Dec 2012 10:51:52 5,483 posts
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    That's right - the only taxes the government collect are from fags and booze.
  • skuzzbag 28 Dec 2012 10:52:31 5,483 posts
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    MrTomFTW wrote:
    The smoking ban was a very good thing indeed. I used to come home with sinus pain after a night out due to that constant, foul-smelling haze.
    The only drawback is that a lot of pubs now smell of bleach and sick. :)
  • spamdangled 28 Dec 2012 11:00:20 27,197 posts
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    RyanDS wrote:
    darkmorgado wrote:
    I think an optional smoking/non-smoking license (or some other halfway compromise) would have been better. I do respect non-smoker's right to not be subjected to it, but treating smokers constantly like borderline criminals is up there with anti-piracy legislation and the war of drugs as endeavours trying to ram a square peg into a round hole and thinking they are the ideal solution.
    How is saying "don't smoke inside in public" treating someone like a criminal?
    It's ostracising people. Social engineering at its bluntest.

    As I said, I totally respect non smokers and don't light up around them, don't smoke around children, and even in my own home smoke near an open window for ventilation (amazingly, even smokers appreciate clean air despite popular opinion). We're not all evil Grimm Fairytale monsters out to give as many people as cancer as possible you know.

    There's a lot of shit that's bad for you. In a pub environment, there's a degree of irony that drinking alcohol beyond the so-called daily recommended limit (which is so conservative as to render the enjoyment of it practically impossible, similar to fun-size chocolate bars and Tara Palmer-Tomkinson's breasts) is arguably just as likely to give you cancer as getting the whiff of the odd puff of smoke.

    Make smoking areas well-ventilated. Make them closed rooms. Sticking us out in the cold and wet is treating us like lepers.

    Though funnily enough, nearly every club/pub loving non-smoker spends more time outside chatting with the smokers than they do inside a venue (personal anecodte admittedly, but one I hear echoed pretty frequently from others).

    3DS: 4055-2781-2855 Xbox: spamdangled PSN: dark_morgan Wii U: Spamdangle Steam: spamdangled

  • L_Franko Moderator 28 Dec 2012 11:00:21 9,690 posts
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    I've been smoking about 14 years and I am a fan of the smoking ban in pubs. Not only does it make you feel more comfortable in a pub now it is also more sociable from my experience because going outside for a ciggy puts you in with people you wouldn't normally have spoken to while in the pub.
  • spamdangled 28 Dec 2012 11:00:53 27,197 posts
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    skuzzbag wrote:
    That's right - the only taxes the government collect are from fags and booze.
    Don't be wilfully dense.

    3DS: 4055-2781-2855 Xbox: spamdangled PSN: dark_morgan Wii U: Spamdangle Steam: spamdangled

  • spamdangled 28 Dec 2012 11:02:21 27,197 posts
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    L_Franko wrote:
    I've been smoking about 14 years and I am a fan of the smoking ban in pubs. Not only does it make you feel more comfortable in a pub now it is also more sociable from my experience because going outside for a ciggy puts you in with people you wouldn't normally have spoken to while in the pub.
    This is what I was talking about!

    Smokers are more interesting people!

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  • nickthegun 28 Dec 2012 11:04:26 55,877 posts
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    Don't be fatuously dense. Fags pay for the nhs is an utter fallacy and one trotted out by morons.

    ---------------------------------------------------------
    He totally called it

  • RyanDS 28 Dec 2012 11:16:31 8,701 posts
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    nickthegun wrote:
    Don't be fatuously dense. Fags pay for the nhs is an utter fallacy and one trotted out by morons.
    Quite.

    Annual budget NHS: 106 billion
    Annual tax revenue smoking: 12.1 billion (VAT plus Excise combined.)

    The best that can be argued is that smoking pays for smoking related diseases on the NHS, and that is debatable.
  • spamdangled 28 Dec 2012 11:23:54 27,197 posts
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    That 106 billion figure is a huge inflation on what I've seen cited this year, got a source for that?

    I did say as well, in fairness, tobacco & alcohol duty, not either/or (and that's without taking into account other taxes like VAT, IT, fuel, NI, etc). Maybe I misremember what I read on the subject and it was estimated the total tax take of the smoking/drinking population, rather than just the duty from their vices?

    Happy to be proven wrong, but it won't change my opinion.

    If it helps, up to the age of 19 I was the most fanatical anti-smoking person you have ever met. Deliberately fake cughing fits whenever anyone lit up, exagerrated hand flapping to clear the air, the lot. I do genuinely see where non-smokers come from, it's the fanatical devotion to treating smokers like inconsiderate scum who must be cast out and then stamped out like cancer that really gets my wick, along with general social hypcocrisy of it.

    Edited by darkmorgado at 11:27:57 28-12-2012

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