The Official Doctor Who Thread Page 5

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  • quedex 13 May 2006 19:15:10 3,135 posts
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    Dunno, I'm just going on what the Sky digiguide says.

    They're probably 20 minutes out because of the football.
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 19:29:25 4,640 posts
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    Where's Johnathan Rhys-Davies???!
  • quedex 13 May 2006 20:08:43 3,135 posts
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    Gah! Hate those frickin "To Be Continued"s!!!

  • gerg 13 May 2006 20:16:42 880 posts
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    Tonight's episode was fun...

    Track n.90 please!

    "Awimbuwe, awimbuew, awimbuwe..."

    Edited by gerg at 20:17:35 13-05-2006
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 20:26:19 4,640 posts
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    Sub-standard Sliders plot (alternative dimension, set amount of time until they can escape again, usual world different because Germany won WW2 or something). Trigger pretending to be a Dark Lord of the Sith. Cybermen being created in contemporary London...

    Though it was enjoyable as tea-time sci-fi, it's still suffering the old "well is this really Doctor Who?" syndrone. What's with all the Earth-based, contemporary episodes?
  • quedex 13 May 2006 20:35:21 3,135 posts
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    Daryoon wrote:
    Though it was enjoyable as tea-time sci-fi, it's still suffering the old "well is this really Doctor Who?" syndrone. What's with all the Earth-based, contemporary episodes?
    There are two problems. First, RTD isn't a good enough writer to make quality sci-fi. Also, they don't have enough budget to create alien worlds. They can't even afford CGI that doesn't look like it was created by drunken students on work experience.
  • EatLessMoveMore 13 May 2006 20:38:16 126 posts
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    toto wrote:
    "Trigger pretending to be a Dark Lord of the Sith." LMAO!! :-D
    Give in to the hate Dave
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 20:39:53 4,640 posts
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    quedex wrote:Also, they don't have enough budget to create alien worlds.

    It didn't stop them in the past! I don't see why alien worlds have to be OMG-super-cgi-super-alien like something out of Babylon 5.
  • quedex 13 May 2006 20:45:52 3,135 posts
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    Yeah, but audience expectations have changed since the 70s.

    Back then, you could paint a palm tree blue, stick it in the middle of a room full of polystyrene, call it Pluto, and your average audience would have happily believed you.

    Nowadays, we've been spoiled by American imports with multi-million dollar budgets, so if it doesn't have fully rendered CGI backgrounds it'll get laughed off the TV schedules.
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 20:49:08 4,640 posts
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    quedex wrote:Nowadays, we've been spoiled by American imports with multi-million dollar budgets, so if it doesn't have fully rendered CGI backgrounds it'll get laughed off the TV schedules.

    But that's the thing, those American shows don't do much fancy for alien planets. How many times has Stargate reused that same Canadian quarry for different alien worlds?
  • quedex 13 May 2006 20:58:08 3,135 posts
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    Fair point...

    Doctor Who is filmed, and occasionally set in Cardiff. Does that count as an alien world? ;-)
  • Deleted user 13 May 2006 21:08:44
    I'm watching this now on Sky+ and have got totally bored. Fucking shit, frankly, this week.

    I love David Tennant, and even Mickey I'm warming to, but what's all this SHIT about Cybermen being invented on an alternate 21st Century Earth by some 'greed is good' style businessman who wants to live forever?

    How come Doctor Who is surprised to see them? How come he didn't know how they came about in the first place? And why aren't they in the slightest bit threatening?

    Oh hang on, it's because they've had all the mystery and threat written out of them, not least by having their 'dad' portrayed by a melodramatic Trigger.

    Cybermen are scary when they're marching around off their own back, come out of nowhere, and not moving like they're men pretending to be robots. I KNOW it's for kids 'n' everything but it's just bloody HAMMY.


    Really, REALLY bored now. :(

    EDIT: the end was getting towards the way I'd prefer to see the Cybermen - I don't want to know that there's really implausible 'homeless' people inside them. I'd rather they were anonymous robot soldiers.

    Edited by Owen-B at 21:13:24 13-05-2006
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 21:16:12 4,640 posts
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    Originally they were planning to have them more like the originals - people who had slowly improved themselves with cybernetic enhancements, who had eventally been taken over by the machine.

    But RTD thouht that was too "unrealistic" and opted for Darth Trigger and his Super Star Zepplin instead.
  • Deleted user 13 May 2006 21:19:15
    Really?

    Somebody get that fucking camp idiot off this show, please. I genuinely think it could be done just as well without him. Actually, it could be better. Why does Doctor Who have to be so fucking limp-wristed to be a 'family show'? Why can't it be ACTUALLY a bit scary?

    The music is still pissing me off, trying to tell me what I should be feeling ALL the time.

    And the soft focus glow really doesn't work on EVERY. SINGLE. SHOT. either.

    :(
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 21:22:35 4,640 posts
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    Early drafts of this story featured "Body Shops" where wealthy people would purchase new cybernetic limbs. Russell T. Davies vetoed this element because he found it unbelievable.

    interview
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 21:22:40 4,640 posts
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    Post deleted
  • Deleted user 13 May 2006 21:25:00
    Daryoon wrote:
    Early drafts of this story featured "Body Shops" where wealthy people would purchase new cybernetic limbs. Russell T. Davies vetoed this element because he found it unbelievable.

    interview
    I'll read it in a minute, but frankly I find that premise TOTALLY believable. More believable (and edgy) than the nonce that went out to round up homeless people that can't act in his truck, and turn them all into Cybermen in the space of an hour. BISH BASH BOSH there's an entire mythology utterly decimated by RTD and his ego.
  • Deleted user 13 May 2006 21:31:26
    I've read it, and to be honest it reads like RTD makes a statement and then utterly contradicts himself with what he produced as the answer to his own (non-existant) problem.

    I really don't see the problem in 'body shops'. I find it totally believable. I don't believe that they would be on every street corner, but then there aren't plastic surgeons on every street corner either, and the vast majority of celeb-dom is becoming ever more plastically enhanced, and that's not only unbelievable on paper, it's ACTUALLY TRUE. He goes on about basing things in reality and not creating a pantomime, and yet the idea of body shops is closer to reality than the shite he greenlit in its place.

    Furthermore, what's all this bollocks about not making the 'alternate characters' opposites of their 'real life counterparts'? Rose's dad is not only ALIVE (and that's pretty much the opposite of dead) but more pertinently he's successful. And her mum is now a totally self-obsessed bitch who doesn't want a child. If you ask me they are TOTALLY pantomime.

    So, in summary, "way to talk bullshit, Russel!"

    Twat. He fucked up the Cybermen, big time. I can't forgive him that.
  • Dynamize 13 May 2006 21:37:18 1,672 posts
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    Daryoon wrote:
    Early drafts of this story featured "Body Shops" where wealthy people would purchase new cybernetic limbs. Russell T. Davies vetoed this element because he found it unbelievable.

    interview
    Wow, to me RTD seems to completely miss the point of sci-fi. Yes, you have to give ground to make stuff "believable" and keep suspension of disbelief. But christ, he couldn't believe it's a possibility that in the future (or alternate-reality) there might be human augmentation shops? Isn't that a deplorable lack of vision and imagination? A capital crime for someone who writes bloody sci-fi?!
    Of course, it's far more believable that a zany man would kidnap homeless people and turn them into cybermen. Insane people often become rich and powerful. It's far more believable to use the sledgehammer of criminal activity and corrupt corporation than the slow, steady, seemingly logical progression of man's lust for immortality and perfection.
    RTD needs to go away now.

    Edited by Dynamize at 21:40:41 13-05-2006
  • Artemus 13 May 2006 22:01:46 1,007 posts
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    Hmm. It feels slightly unfair to judge the episode on its own but yes, apart from the last ten minutes (I actually liked the Cybermen in action), it was probably the weakest since the first.

    Christ, was Trigger hammy! He ruined every scene he was in. Just how did they let him get away with such a pantomime performance?! The sooner he gets turned into the new Cyber Controller the better.

    Not keen on the way they STILL insist on shoehorning Rose's family at every opportunity. I mean what was the point of the parallel Earth setting? Just to get Rose's dad in again for a 'heartwarming' reunion? And I guess so they could rewrite the Cybermen's history and happily ignore the continuity of the old series. That does give them a perfect excuse - 'it all happened in a different universe, silly!'

    Music was overbearing again. They need to lay off, and give the audience time to think. Funny, I thought it was good last week.

    That earlier draft of the story sounds much better. Damn RTD for dumbing it down. Seems he's getting his sticky mitts in as many stories as possible and tainting them as a result. Leave your other writers alone, please!

    I hope next weeks can redeem it...somehow.

    Edited by Artemus at 22:03:11 13-05-2006
  • Daryoon 13 May 2006 22:12:39 4,640 posts
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    Quinn Malory will save the day
  • Deleted user 13 May 2006 22:23:32
    Who?
  • quedex 14 May 2006 07:00:13 3,135 posts
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    Bod from Sliders, I think.
  • Jesus-Action-Figure 14 May 2006 16:20:39 512 posts
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    I actually quite liked it, though it was a bit dull in places.

    The alternate universe thing helped. As in, even though you knew they were fucking about with Cyberman history, it gave them an excuse to re-introduce them as bad guys.

    And I thought they looked very cool to be honest. Especially when you saw them 'full frame'.

    And was it just me or did anyone else get reminded of Davros by Trigger's John Lumic?

    I'm half expecting that after the doctor defeats the cybernen and pisses off back to his own reality that there'll be a computer screen somewhere with a new prototype model on it that looks like a dalek...

    which would fuck with Dalek history even more - but then again, this *is* a parallel universe ;)
  • Daryoon 14 May 2006 18:29:37 4,640 posts
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    Jesus: Action Figure wrote:I'm half expecting that after the doctor defeats the cybernen and pisses off back to his own reality that there'll be a computer screen somewhere with a new prototype model on it that looks like a dalek...

    which would fuck with Dalek history even more - but then again, this *is* a parallel universe ;)

    Well the end-of-season 2-parter is meant to feature the Cybermen AND the Darleks. And I honestly can't see them bring the original Cybermen into it, because that would probably mean telling a story somewhere other than Earth/London, and we all know the TARDOL (Time And Relative Dimensions Of London) can't go to alien planets anymore!

    So alternative universe Cybermen and Darleks built by Darth Trigger. RTD should have just gone the whole way and brought in Bobby Davro(s).
  • Artemus 14 May 2006 18:52:28 1,007 posts
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    In the next two-parter they finally go to an alien planet. Woo!
  • Daryoon 14 May 2006 19:49:31 4,640 posts
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    Artemus wrote:
    In the next two-parter they finally go to an alien planet. Woo!

    The Satan's Pit one? I read it was actually a spaceship on the "edge of a black hole", rather than the alien planet it first appears. If it's a human-based space station, I've lost all hope for the series.
  • Deleted user 14 May 2006 20:01:47
    Jesus: Action Figure wrote:
    And was it just me or did anyone else get reminded of Davros by Trigger's John Lumic?

    I'm half expecting that after the doctor defeats the cybernen and pisses off back to his own reality that there'll be a computer screen somewhere with a new prototype model on it that looks like a dalek...

    which would fuck with Dalek history even more - but then again, this *is* a parallel universe ;)
    Yes, I had that exact thought (about him looking like Davros). However, this 'parallel universe' thing is utter bollocks as an excuse, and if it crops up as an excuse to make John Lumic (anagram? Gratuitously unusual names usually have significance) into the original Davros then I will stop watching Doctor Who and send STRONGLY worded letters to RTD. He cannot POSSIBLY do that. Davros is a humanoid from the planet Kaled, deludedly trying to save his race from nuclear poisoning (or something) isn't he? Even RTD couldn't possibly recreate Davros as a HUMAN who just happened to be in a wheelchair, from the planet Earth (you know, that planet that nobodies heard of but which the Tardis seems magnetically attracted to).

    RTD minced into the forum and wrote:
    "Actually, sweety darlings, it's terribly funny but actually I really CAN, don't you know, ha ha ha! Coz it's an alternative universe, and it's so terribly wonderfully believable that way, darlings!"
  • Daryoon 14 May 2006 20:39:26 4,640 posts
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    Owen-B wrote:He cannot POSSIBLY do that. Davros is a humanoid from the planet Kaled, deludedly trying to save his race from nuclear poisoning (or something) isn't he? Even RTD couldn't possibly recreate Davros as a HUMAN who just happened to be in a wheelchair, from the planet Earth (you know, that planet that nobodies heard of but which the Tardis seems magnetically attracted to).

    Well the Cybermen were aliens too, originally...

    So I wouldn't out it past him. It irritates me greatly (could you tell?) when something with so much potential is turned to shite because the producer is a retard (see Sliders as another example, coincidently enough)
  • quedex 20 May 2006 18:37:02 3,135 posts
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    Quick bump to remind anyone who still cares that it's starting early tonight cos of Eurovision. It's on in a couple of minutes...
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