Post Poll... Britain decided to... Page 809

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  • simpleexplodingmaybe 13 Nov 2017 10:35:52 4,886 posts
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    EU Withdrawal Bill is back this week.

    Lords will probably fuck the Government on it. Opposition should be interesting to watch since they support Brexit but oppose part of this bill.

    The Hard Brexit at all costs maniacs are already lining up to call anyone who stands in the way of Brexit as traitors.

    Westminster Hour with Frank Field giving it "its what the country voted for, all other opinions are heresy" was pretty miserable listening this week. eugh. Slimy creep. Trying to sound so reasonable while putting forward the hardest, most dissenters must be crushed view. Such a creep.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b09drj7t
  • thelzdking 13 Nov 2017 10:36:50 6,471 posts
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    FWB wrote:
    One thing is clear... Oxford University is producing some total and utter dipshits.
    Only because EU red tape won't let us educate in the proper British way.
  • senso-ji 13 Nov 2017 10:37:21 8,128 posts
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    British produced cars? Both the Japanese PM and Nissan bosses have said they'll close their factories in the UK if it's hard Brexit. Which car manufacturers are UK owned?
  • thelzdking 13 Nov 2017 10:39:52 6,471 posts
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    We'll bring back Great British cars which aren't full of anti-British EU PC rubbish. I'll sign up for a new Austin Maestro today and I'll have a lump of cheddar in the glove box and a picture of the Queen Mother on the dash.
  • FilthyAnimal 13 Nov 2017 10:40:40 173 posts
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    Oh I don't doubt that cheddar is awesome. Unfortunately here in Germany we only get the dregs of UK production (the UK barely produces enough to meet its own needs) but there's no other cheese that will do when it comes to making macaroni cheese.
  • simpleexplodingmaybe 13 Nov 2017 10:42:28 4,886 posts
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    senso-ji wrote:
    British produced cars? Both the Japanese PM and Nissan bosses have said they'll close their factories in the UK if it's hard Brexit.
    Not if the government gives them millions in backhanders they won't.
  • senso-ji 13 Nov 2017 10:44:09 8,128 posts
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    I'm not sure that's enough backhanders. We're talking billions in tariffs over the next few years if the UK leaves fully. Unless every single British driver buys a Nissan after Brexit, the UK plants are fucked.
  • simpleexplodingmaybe 13 Nov 2017 10:50:46 4,886 posts
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    They're flailing so desperately. Brexit will be deregulation and profits and subsidies for the rich and 'red tape' (employment protections etc) cut for the poor.

    Everyone who is into this is a tit.
  • sport 13 Nov 2017 10:52:12 14,034 posts
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    senso-ji wrote:
    I'm not sure that's enough backhanders. We're talking billions in tariffs over the next few years if the UK leaves fully. Unless every single British driver buys a Nissan after Brexit, the UK plants are fucked.
    We'll be riding Dyson V8s, DUH!!!
  • thelzdking 13 Nov 2017 10:55:50 6,471 posts
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    Everything will be the EU's fault. None of the dissembling Brexit campaigners will be held to account, and those who voted to leave are (sadly) unaccountable so they'll just shrug their shoulders and claim ignorance
  • FilthyAnimal 13 Nov 2017 10:57:38 173 posts
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    The funny thing is that the hard right and far right (UKIP, Tories) seem to envisage some kind of anarchocapitalist utopia unshackled from the socialist constraints of the EU, where the working-class plebs are slaves to their industrialist masters and their every whim, while the hard and far left (Labour chiefly) seem to be dreaming about some kind of socialist heaven free of the yoke of EU globalist capitalism where the workers are no longer enslaved by international conglomerates.

    In short, Brexiteers seem to be alternately in favour of strengthening and abolishing workers' rights.
  • simpleexplodingmaybe 13 Nov 2017 11:02:48 4,886 posts
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    thelzdking wrote:
    Everything will be the EU's fault. None of the dissembling Brexit campaigners will be held to account, and those who voted to leave are (sadly) unaccountable so they'll just shrug their shoulders and claim ignorance
    Of course. If he isn't Prime Minister by then David Davis will retire from Parliament at the end of the process claiming he is handing over a golden legacy with perfect timing for the incoming Labour government to take all the blame for the wreckage as they 'fail to seize the opportunity' in his inevitable words.

    Obviously if the Tories remain in power then all the problems will be the fault of the 'saboteurs' like Anna Soubry, Gina Miller and the Guardian.
  • simpleexplodingmaybe 13 Nov 2017 11:04:20 4,886 posts
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    @FilthyAnimal Those Labour leavers can think what they want, they're still supporting a xenophobic, anti-worker project which will ruin the local economies of their constituencies.
  • DocDawg 14 Nov 2017 00:49:14 159 posts
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    This country is so badly fucked. I've really lost faith in this country. It's so badly broken this country, its government has zero loyalty to the people or its future.

    That cunt investment banker telling his clients to take money out of Britain, is a prominent brexiter. Farage ran off to America. The guy who called the referendum ran off to America. The rich political class can always run off to America, so they have zero anxiety of fucking the country up.
  • FWB 14 Nov 2017 06:53:42 54,057 posts
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    So does May's speech on Russian meddling in politics include the EU referendum? Or is that totally legit and only the blow she sustained at the election counts?
  • FilthyAnimal 14 Nov 2017 09:06:30 173 posts
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    For what it's worth, there is genuinely little evidence of the Russians interfering in the EU referendum. That stupidity was all on Britain, who really don't get to blame anyone else with its fundamentally corrupt and influential tabloid media and troublingly powerful oligarchical structures.

    At least the Yanks can attribute some of their stupidity to the actions of the Russian troll brigades (even if ultimately, their decision to believe the propaganda that Putin's cronies was pumping out was entirely on them).

    The stupidity and propaganda relating to the EU referendum in the UK was entirely home-grown. Far-right sentiment has always been strongest in the UK, driven by a mistaken belief that the country is morally untouchable due to its victory in World War II, as opposed to the continental countries whose history of fascist sentiment (Germany & Austria with the Nazis, France with Vichy, Spain with Franco, Italy with Mussolini) means that they tend to think carefully before embracing it again.
  • Deleted user 14 November 2017 09:17:18
    We were a nation of caring people after ww2, because of the horror brought on everyone. But unfortunately that didnt last long, we got sold out to international commerce, we followed the US model, and now we have have benefit cheat propganda shit running 24 7 even on BBC. Our country is fucked by vested interests, our major banks follow wonga style loan sharking with interest, and our goverment puts disabled people on the streets.

    Edited by mecha-DR at 09:19:07 14-11-2017
  • Psychotext 14 Nov 2017 09:40:47 62,149 posts
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    FilthyAnimal wrote:
    For what it's worth, there is genuinely little evidence of the Russians interfering in the EU referendum.
    But there definitely was evidence...

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/david-jones-pro-brexit-ukip-twitter-account-russia-fake-bot-troll-trump-disinformation-followers-a7920181.html

    http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2017/11/russian-twitter-trolls-seemed-to-be-pro-brexit/

    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/brexit-russia-troll-factory-propaganda-fake-news-twitter-facebook-a8050866.html
  • Tonka 14 Nov 2017 09:52:43 26,609 posts
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    Any thinking that Russia didn't meddle in Brexit (or are meddling in the Catalonian mess) need to ask themselves a series of really simple questions:

    Have Russia built a strong information warfare infrastructure? (Yes)
    Is it clear that Russia meddled in the US election in cheap, weird and effective ways? (Yes)
    Would Russia benefit from a divided Europe? (Yes)
    Is there a good reason for them to NOT apply the same cheap, weird and effective measures to divide Europe wherever possible? (Nope)
  • spindizzy 14 Nov 2017 10:00:26 7,681 posts
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    This almost makes me miss Vizzini. He might have been a bot but at least he was OUR bot dammit! :-(
  • StarchildHypocrethes 14 Nov 2017 10:06:58 30,779 posts
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    Don't be so sure. I've heard rumours that Putin is a firm believer in The Powah of The Cell.
  • FilthyAnimal 14 Nov 2017 10:12:36 173 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    But there definitely was evidence...
    That's not evidence. That's suspicion, and yes, Russia does stand to gain from a divided Europe, but motive alone does not constitute proof of a crime. Until a reliable intelligence agency or court of law states with reasonable certainly that they believe based on solid evidence that Russia interfered with the referendum, we have to assume that the British really are that fucking stupid.

    Whether the UK's intelligence agencies have been looking for such evidence is another thing. We may not know until they have an ironclad case (as opposed to the US, which is betting on transparency and sacrificing the element of surprise in the process).

    The US intelligence agencies have done a good job in uncovering manipulation of the US election. We may yet see something from the UK, but until then, there's nothing to go on.

    Edited by FilthyAnimal at 10:15:16 14-11-2017
  • sport 14 Nov 2017 10:20:31 14,034 posts
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    Well hello there putinbot.
  • oceanmotion 14 Nov 2017 10:25:09 17,269 posts
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    The government will no doubt blame the EU for competing, you're being so unfair, stop being successful and then that's their excuse for workers rights, regulation going down the toilet, we can only compete if we turn ourselves into the hell that is the USA, 51st state here we come. Just watch the US healthcare system get it's claws deeper into the NHS.
  • FilthyAnimal 14 Nov 2017 10:32:37 173 posts
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    sport wrote:
    Well hello there putinbot.
    Yay. Congratulations on being the next fucking idiot to throw any sense of nuance or rationality to the wind.

    I'd write a whole post on the necessity of being prepared before you fight your battles and the need to come armed with robust information when fighting an enemy that specialises in information wars, but I suspect this kind of approach would be lost on you.
  • JamboWayOh 14 Nov 2017 10:34:40 3,849 posts
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    Go on then.
  • sport 14 Nov 2017 10:36:28 14,034 posts
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    Shit, I've triggered agro-algorithm.
  • Tonka 14 Nov 2017 10:36:59 26,609 posts
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    Putin has everything in place already. The bot nets, the humans running them. The prepared strategies and messages.
    He benefits from a divided Europe.

    He can make that a reality by just pointing what he already have in a new direction.

    Why do you think he didn't?
  • oceanmotion 14 Nov 2017 10:38:33 17,269 posts
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    Escalated to Tier 2 putinbot.
  • DaM 14 Nov 2017 10:41:12 16,863 posts
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    An EU army (which isn't actually a thing, they just want increased co-operation) is a trigger for Brexiters, the suggestion makes them crazy. I've never understood the hate it inspires in them.

    But it is also something that Russia doesn't want.
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