No Man's Sky Page 3

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  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 08:52:05
    Dizzy wrote:
    @Dirtbox That seed can be anything.... it doesn't have to be the same for everybody. I don't know where you got that weird idea TBH. Or is that the way the devs said it going to work in this game?

    The big question is... do they generate a big universe "on the fly" or is it done in advance and then stored on the disk. I guess it will be the second option, they don't have the CPU power to do it on the fly I would guess.

    Cloud servers would really solve that problem.
    Dammit! We nearly went one E3 without hearing that BS. Even MS didn't use it.

    Edited by Adv at 08:52:21 10-06-2014
  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 08:53:22 89,178 posts
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  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 09:02:34 89,178 posts
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  • Dizzy 10 Jun 2014 09:02:50 3,417 posts
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    @Adv That is because you are pretty brainless. Cloud servers are the perfect match for procedurally generated stuff. Async and high CPU requirements.

    Quick question, how do you think they made Elite 1 simulate a large chunk of a never-changing galaxy with 30kb with a 2mhz CPU?
    Lol? Are you serious?

    There is almost nothing procedurally generated about Elite that requires computational power. Just a few coordinates of planets and space stations and the price of goods on the market. No graphics, no models, no textures... wow...

    Edited by Dizzy at 09:05:14 10-06-2014
  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 09:04:03
    @Dizzy yeah, yeah, yeah. All hail the mighty cloud. We are not worthy of its BS that even MS didn't talk about.

    Edited by Adv at 09:07:58 10-06-2014
  • Phattso 10 Jun 2014 09:04:17 21,809 posts
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    This gives a vibe of somewhere that'd be nice to pootle around in, if not necessarily an amazing game experience.

    Hard to see what they're aiming for with the videos released thus far. Too much potential and not enough context.

    If the relatively unadventurous Joe Danger was the price to pay for them getting to make something like this, then hats off to 'em for having a plan and potentially making good on it.

    Fun times in the spacey genre right now.
  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 09:04:22 89,178 posts
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  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 09:06:45
    Phattso wrote:
    This gives a vibe of somewhere that'd be nice to pootle around in, if not necessarily an amazing game experience.

    This is always the problem I have with 'sandbox' stuff. I love the idea, the promise, the idea of possibility, but 9 times out of 10 what I really love are semi-sandboxes: structured games that offer a certain dose of freedom, rather than total freedom. I need gameplay rules as well as massive expanses.
  • Phattso 10 Jun 2014 09:07:42 21,809 posts
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    Dizzy is making, as we say in high society, something of a spectacle of himself.

    This is the slow motion car crash of the games punditry world. It's all the right words, but with almost zero understanding of the concepts behind them. Staggering. :)
  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 09:07:57
    RedSparrows wrote:
    Phattso wrote:
    This gives a vibe of somewhere that'd be nice to pootle around in, if not necessarily an amazing game experience.

    This is always the problem I have with 'sandbox' stuff. I love the idea, the promise, the idea of possibility, but 9 times out of 10 what I really love are semi-sandboxes: structured games that offer a certain dose of freedom, rather than total freedom. I need gameplay rules as well as massive expanses.
    Isn't this one supposed to be a multiplayer affair? Rushing to "discover" parts of the universe before others?
  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 09:08:58
    Trailer looks nice but so far I'm getting a Spore vibe from this.
  • Dizzy 10 Jun 2014 09:11:23 3,417 posts
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    @Dirtbox I replied to this before.

    Elite was brilliant at the time... but I don't think you can compare it to the scope that modern procedurally generated games try to achieve.

    Even Minecraft takes time to generate a quite "simple" world.

    I do a lot of work in this kind of stuff... and you can be sure it isn't that straightforward to do it. It is very elegant and probably the future of gaming, but there still are some interesting problems to solve.

    Like I said... It is highly likely that they will generate quite a lot of the universe in advance and store this on a disk. That will help them with the seamless transitions demo-ed in that video.
  • Dizzy 10 Jun 2014 09:13:38 3,417 posts
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    @Phattso Seems like I am the only one here who is a developer it seems (and yes working with Cloud servers as well). So yeah... keep it up. Lol and you even are a moderator.

    Edited by Dizzy at 09:14:13 10-06-2014
  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 09:13:41 89,178 posts
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  • Dizzy 10 Jun 2014 09:15:20 3,417 posts
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    @Dirtbox Ofc you can... it just takes time (and that is what async cloud servers can help you with or you can store a lot of the work in advance on the game disk). Maybe you should read my posts. You can generate the whole universe with an tiny seed. That is not the point.

    You obviously have no clue.

    Edited by Dizzy at 09:19:13 10-06-2014
  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 09:17:03
    Oh lord.
  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 09:19:02 89,178 posts
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  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 09:19:36
    Bail, bail, bail!
  • Phattso 10 Jun 2014 09:19:59 21,809 posts
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    Dizzy wrote:
    @Phattso Seems like I am the only one here who is a developer it seems (and yes working with Cloud servers as well). So yeah... keep it up. Lol and you even are a moderator.
    I'm a developer. And I've worked in procedural generation. And it was even in a game. Shall we whip our dicks out now and compare or shall we do that later?
  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 09:21:09 89,178 posts
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  • Dizzy 10 Jun 2014 09:22:52 3,417 posts
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    @Dirtbox I have read Brabens stuff... I am an Elite kickstarter.

    It is very simple... it is just a balance between time and storage. The smaller you want your storage to be the more time it will take to generate what you want. You want tiny storage (for example just one seed to generate EVERYTHING, with the size of the seed determining how many unique end results you will have) it will take a lot of time to do that on the fly. You want to cut down the time to generate procedurally, you increase your storage (and in the extreme case, you store almost everything so that you don't need to generate on the fly).

    Simple math and simple computer stuff.

    Yeah go ahead... screenshot this and forward it to the devs of No Man's Sky. This will be fun. Let's do this, be a man.

    Edited by Dizzy at 09:26:29 10-06-2014
  • Dizzy 10 Jun 2014 09:24:24 3,417 posts
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    @Phattso Ok... so instead of talking shit... let's talk about it then. How do you think they do it? Hmm? Any ideas?
  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 09:25:36 89,178 posts
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  • Dizzy 10 Jun 2014 09:27:35 3,417 posts
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    @Dirtbox Dear god... are you blind? You can fit a galaxy in an integer. Good luck trying to generate the whole thing while flying through it in a game. FFS this is getting ridiculous.
  • Deleted user 10 June 2014 09:28:18
    Back on topic,

    Has the devs said much about the game? Need to know what the objective is etc to get a good idea of what this is. Also, the space scenes look a lot of fun too.

    Edited by Adv at 09:29:17 10-06-2014
  • sport 10 Jun 2014 09:30:46 13,955 posts
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    Jesus guys, have you seen the footage - of course they use cloud servers - it's pretty obvious when the spaceship flies through the atmosphere into space!!!
  • Dirtbox 10 Jun 2014 09:30:51 89,178 posts
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  • HitchHiker 10 Jun 2014 09:31:24 2,882 posts
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    So it sounds like it will be a pre-procedurally generated universe, with seeds and assets already in place. Then it's boiled back down to just seeds and assets to keep the shipping data size down. So while it may generate on the machine when your playing it from these seeds and assets, every player will end up with the same universe because the universe has already been created in the studio.
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