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  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 13:41:21
    Fly is an amazing episode.
  • Mola_Ram 14 Jul 2014 15:32:52 15,156 posts
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    Fly was fucking great. One of the best episodes the show did. Definitely not something you would expect from a bottle episode.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 15:40:50
    Mola_Ram wrote:
    Fly was fucking great. One of the best episodes the show did. Definitely not something you would expect from a bottle episode.
    Aren't bottle episodes always something like this?
  • Mola_Ram 14 Jul 2014 15:44:47 15,156 posts
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    I meant that you don't usually expect them to be good. Although that's not exactly true either, because now I've thought of a bunch of great ones in other shows.

    So yeah, disregard that last sentence.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 15:51:59
    The Fly is filler, and probably unnecessary, but at least they took the opportunity to do something interesting with it. Every TV show has filler episodes, but the good ones use those opportunities to really show their worth. Sopranos and Mad Men both have filler episodes that are in fact their best ones.
  • Mola_Ram 14 Jul 2014 16:04:47 15,156 posts
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    It's filler, but it's filler that is character building. No, nothing happens as far as plot is concerned, but Fly encapsulates Walt's character perfectly, and includes some of the best dialogue the show ever had. It catches Walt in a rare moment of honesty.

    But hey, I guess I only say I like it because I want to burnish my "artsy credentials" or something.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 16:23:40
    I was thinking more of the one where Paulie and Christopher get stranded out in the snow, which most people consider the best episode.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 16:24:34
    I like to think that people's reactions to Fly determine their level of culture.

    Basically, if you don't like it and think it's boring, you're a bit thick and simple and probably whoop like a bonobo at feeding time when watching shows like Hole In The Wall. Which you obviously watch. As you are thick. And simple.

    Edited by poot at 16:25:38 14-07-2014
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 16:30:18
    The alternative to filler episodes is something like 24, where the level of plot relevance of every single second of every single episode is ridiculous and exhausting.

    If done well they're not even "filler"episodes. They're just episodes that concentrate on character development instead of plot development, and they help pace the main plot arc.
  • CosmicFuzz 14 Jul 2014 16:34:13 31,784 posts
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    'Filler' episodes can be used to great effect to reduce the tension a little in a show like Breaking Bad. You can't have every episode being BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM, you need the downtime to allow the next tense episode to really hit home, otherwise as kal says it's 24 or something, where it's just constant. You get worn out by it.

    And the 'filler' episode of Sopranos where they get lost in the snow is one of my favourites. Just because the overarching plot isn't moving forward doesn't mean character development can't take place.
  • CosmicFuzz 14 Jul 2014 16:48:09 31,784 posts
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    Sir_Walter_Rally wrote:
    @kalel Hardly a filler episode in that sense.

    For a start, it's hilarious - and there is some great action.

    Then there are repercussions, as far as the Russian goes, and it sets up the tension between Chrisy and Paulies relationship that lasts throughout the show, on and off.

    The Sopranos is much more about subtleties than just about any other show, except perhaps Boardwalk. So a lot of this stuff - like Tony's relationship with Bobby (including laughing at his high-viz) can be considered intertwinable with the plot, which has long reaching arcs.
    Whether it's hilarious or not (or tense, or sad, or heartwarming) doesn't matter. Neither does the presence or absense of action. A filler episode is an episode that doesn't contribute to the over-arching plot.

    The tension between Chris and Paulie - what about the tension between Walt and Jessie? It's the same thing surely? Surely their relationship is one of the major parts of the show?

    The snow episode of Sopranos is filler, and so is Fly. For pretty much the exact same reasons. And they're both great!
  • drhickman1983 14 Jul 2014 16:59:21 4,586 posts
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    kalel wrote:
    The alternative to filler episodes is something like 24, where the level of plot relevance of every single second of every single episode is ridiculous and exhausting.

    If done well they're not even "filler"episodes. They're just episodes that concentrate on character development instead of plot development, and they help pace the main plot arc.
    I understand what your point, but I would argue that 24 had plenty of filler material in between the actual story critical scenes, so I don't think every single second of that show was relevant.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 17:00:59
    poot wrote:
    I like to think that people's reactions to Fly determine their level of culture.

    Basically, if you don't like it and think it's boring, you're a bit thick and simple and probably whoop like a bonobo at feeding time when watching shows like Hole In The Wall. Which you obviously watch. As you are thick. And simple.
    What if I've only ever watched one episode and wasn't fussed on seeing any more?

    /stretches braces
  • superdelphinus 14 Jul 2014 17:22:51 9,284 posts
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    Christ I hope I never get stuck on a desert island with any of you lot
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 17:34:19
    Anfony not quite grasping the subtle differences between plot development and character development there.
  • RyanDS 14 Jul 2014 18:23:45 11,535 posts
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    It is called a bottle episode and is there to save money.  Basically if you have a million per episode to spend you spend 1.5 million on the finale with special effects and make an episode for 0.5 to make up for it.

    These use only existing sets and stock footage.

    Usually they are rubbish but in a good show they v can make something special.  Such as duet in deep space nine or some of the community episodes.

    Fly I get what they were aiming for but I just found boring.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 18:33:53
    The basic principle of a bottle episode goes back to "two hander" (fnar fnar) scripts of old. It's the same thing. It doesn't necessarily have the implication of being a money saver or low budget. I don't think Samuel Becket was thinking of his plays has "filler" nor were they trying to scrimp on cash when they wrote Gravity.

    Yes, it has the added benefit of being an opportunity to save some cash, but they do also provide a unique opportunity for a very tense atmosphere and some real character study. That's why when done well some of the best episodes in TV shows are bottle episodes, including The Fly.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 21:54:21
    classic Hole In The Wall Fanblonski.
  • neilka 14 Jul 2014 22:20:40 19,886 posts
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    I liked the bit where Walt fell through the bar and Jesse didn't notice.
  • Deleted user 14 July 2014 22:23:00
    and then Gus made half a face
  • BinaryBob101 14 Jul 2014 23:11:37 26,502 posts
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    Sir_Walter_Rally wrote:Dare say no one gave a fuck about what happened to the fly.

    Anfony, I don't think you were paying attention. The fly died in the end.
  • Iain815 14 Jul 2014 23:26:39 561 posts
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    IMO Fly was great, but only on a second watch. When watching Breaking Bad in one go one episode after another, which I was doing just before Season 3 ended, Fly slammed the breaks on the rapidly accelerating plot of Season 3. It hampered the building tension leading up to the finale and felt way out of place. I hated it.

    It was only when watching the entire series again that I appreciated it as a great episode and soak up all its goodness.

    Anyway, that's my two pence.

    Edited by Iain815 at 23:45:13 14-07-2014
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