How second hand sales on XBone will work Page 13

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  • kalel 28 May 2013 11:58:04 86,392 posts
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    I wonder if people would feel more comfortable moving towards a subscription model like Netflix or Spotify.

    The whole concept of "ownership" is going out the window in the digital age, and subscription models seem to make more sense for many.
  • Madder-Max 28 May 2013 12:04:48 11,622 posts
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    Personally I have never bought a used game and have never sold one on as I like to have my collecyion of 50 odd 360 games. I think that a possible fact is that there are enough gamers like this who don't give a rats arse what happens in the used game market and enough of us for MS and Sony not to give a rats arse about imposing restrictions.

    If you want the game badly enough then you will pay for it...........is a possible mindset for these companies.

    99 problems and being ginger is one

  • CosmicFuzz 28 May 2013 12:08:27 23,245 posts
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    kalel wrote:
    I wonder if people would feel more comfortable moving towards a subscription model like Netflix or Spotify.

    The whole concept of "ownership" is going out the window in the digital age, and subscription models seem to make more sense for many.
    I've always thought that would be a great idea. If happily pay £30 a month in order to play as many games as I could.

    Looking for a new gaming podcast to listen to? LOOK NO FURTHER!

  • mrpon 28 May 2013 12:12:25 28,463 posts
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    I'm coming round to subscription models, I have Netflix and PS+. However, I just feel at the end of the term I don't have anything to show for it. A bit like renting a house. I'm a tangible kinda guy, I like things in my hands.

    A hoarder basically.

    Give yourself £5 or ½ gig, you're worth it.

  • kalel 28 May 2013 12:14:54 86,392 posts
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    CosmicFuzz wrote:
    kalel wrote:
    I wonder if people would feel more comfortable moving towards a subscription model like Netflix or Spotify.

    The whole concept of "ownership" is going out the window in the digital age, and subscription models seem to make more sense for many.
    I've always thought that would be a great idea. If happily pay £30 a month in order to play as many games as I could.
    Isn't OnLive subscription based? Or it can be I think.

    I think there's definitely going to be a shift in the way these things work over the next gen. The whole idea of us having shelves full of games, movies and music in boxes is quickly becoming totally antiquated.
  • Deckard1 28 May 2013 12:15:42 27,197 posts
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    A film on netflix never made me cry.
  • CosmicFuzz 28 May 2013 12:17:41 23,245 posts
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    Having said that, I do love having boxsets on my shelf. Which I inevitably end up watching on Netflix anyway as I'm to lazy to walk across the room and get them.

    Looking for a new gaming podcast to listen to? LOOK NO FURTHER!

  • Fake_Blood 28 May 2013 12:18:16 4,074 posts
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    I'm selling this chair, it's like new, no scratches and never been shat on. How much should I send to the carpenter who designed and build this chair? It's his intelectual property after all.
  • graysonavich 28 May 2013 12:27:12 7,309 posts
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    kalel wrote:
    I think there's definitely going to be a shift in the way these things work over the next gen. The whole idea of us having shelves full of games, movies and music in boxes is quickly becoming totally antiquated.
    Netflix, Spotify and Steam cleared my shelves and filled my wallet sometime ago.

    Like you say, it will be the norm fairly quickly.
  • Deleted user 28 May 2013 12:28:07
    The physical aspect of a chair serves a purpose, the physical aspect of games/CDs/DVDs doesn't any more.

    People will get used to all digital games, just as they have on PC, just as they have for music and film. Plenty will whine now but the convenience of clicking a few icons and then be playing in less than 10 minutes will soon make them forget.
  • TheSaint 28 May 2013 12:28:08 14,201 posts
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    Fake_Blood wrote:
    I'm selling this chair, it's like new, no scratches and never been shat on. How much should I send to the carpenter who designed and build this chair? It's his intelectual property after all.
    Again the difference is that when you brought the chair the shop didn't try and sell you one that someone had already used for a couple of quid cheaper than your new one.
  • graysonavich 28 May 2013 12:29:41 7,309 posts
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    How much if you /have/ shat on it?
  • Lexx87 28 May 2013 12:30:25 20,869 posts
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    @mowgli

    Should get an expert in for that one

    Speak the truth hussy!

  • morriss 28 May 2013 12:31:42 70,911 posts
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    Thing is, I'm not a gamer, or a watcher of TV series. I like to watch the odd series, and play the odd game and listen to the odd album. Therefore a subscription model like Spotify/Netflix etc. is completely unnecessary.

    I would literally be throwing money away every month. I really hope things don't go that way. I think I'll alway buy physical media.
  • Deleted user 28 May 2013 12:34:30
    Yeah, subscriptions have totally won me over. Spotify, Netflix, PS+ etc. all great and I no longer miss the tangible items at the end. All for this being the new way. Still not sold on 100% digital though, as in paying for individual items. Preder a sub that gives me access.
  • kalel 28 May 2013 12:35:24 86,392 posts
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    morriss wrote:
    Thing is, I'm not a gamer, or a watcher of TV series. I like to watch the odd series, and play the odd game and listen to the odd album. Therefore a subscription model like Spotify/Netflix etc. is completely unnecessary.

    I would literally be throwing money away every month. I really hope things don't go that way. I think I'll alway buy physical media.
    Yeah, I don't think it can ever completely replace ownership of media (I think specifically physical media will die), and I still personally prefer to own music rather than use Spotify because I just don't really have a thirst for the latest music.

    But for the kind of people that like to constantly game and have new games (which I think is probably the kind of people who are most upset about what's happening with the secondhand market), a subscription model could well be the way forward.
  • Armoured_Bear 28 May 2013 12:45:41 10,288 posts
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    /Vinyl till I die :-)

    XBL : ecosse011172
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  • kalel 28 May 2013 12:50:25 86,392 posts
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    I like vinyl as well, but that's analogue media.

    Using up real physical space with digital media is pretty retarded if you think about it.
  • SomaticSense 28 May 2013 12:51:25 7,959 posts
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    TheSaint wrote:
    Fake_Blood wrote:
    I'm selling this chair, it's like new, no scratches and never been shat on. How much should I send to the carpenter who designed and build this chair? It's his intelectual property after all.
    Again the difference is that when you brought the chair the shop didn't try and sell you one that someone had already used for a couple of quid cheaper than your new one.
    I think you've touched on the root of the problem. That the major games retailers sell used right next to new.

    You can't go into Waterstones and buy a secondhand book, likewise Next for clothes, buy a used telly from Currys, or even - before gaming set the precedent - CDs or DVDs from HMV. This is the root of the issue, that the big-hitting games retailers, the ones that up 'til now publishers relied on most for physical sales, have been selling used versions of the same games alongside the new, and even more problematically are actively pushing the used sales ahead of the new copies for maximum revenue.

    But instead of clamping down on this and limiting used sales to the specialist secondhand stores, charity shops, and sites like ebay, like virtually every other retail product that isn't a car, they choose to charge the customer instead. Thus meaning that both GAME and the publishers are now both fleecing the customer of money they, frankly, shouldn't be owed.

    That's my problem with the whole stinking issue. The overlooking of the real reason used games are a 'publisher's curse', and instead focusing on punishing the consumer while allowing the money-grubbing retail industry to carry on the fleecing.
  • graysonavich 28 May 2013 12:54:04 7,309 posts
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    I don't think Spotify is really aimed at the latest hits, for me at least, it's all about the user created playlists. I can type 'insert sub genre here' and never have to touch it for 2 weeks.

    Interestingly* I rarely pirate anything now I'm a fully paid up member of Netflix & Spotify. This coming from someone who would download a film rather than get up off the chair to get the disc.
  • kalel 28 May 2013 12:58:19 86,392 posts
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    graysonavich wrote:
    I don't think Spotify is really aimed at the latest hits, for me at least, it's all about the user created playlists. I can type 'insert sub genre here' and never have to touch it for 2 weeks.
    I guess "new content" if not the latest hits. It's just not how I listen to music. I sometimes use the free version of Spotify or Last FM if I'm really in the mood for something I've never heard, but it's rare. I even had full fat Napster free for six months with my Sonos and I barely used it.
  • Deleted user 28 May 2013 13:01:35
    Yeah Spotify to me is all about finding new songs (new to me that is) and the updating playlists are brilliant. I just don't listen to music unless I have an active spotify sub. CD collection has long been gathering dust.
  • mrpon 28 May 2013 13:12:46 28,463 posts
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    @kalel have you tried iheartradio on Sonos? I love it, but ymmv.

    Give yourself £5 or ½ gig, you're worth it.

  • PenguinJim 28 May 2013 13:13:57 5,758 posts
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    vizzini wrote:

    You still don't get it, the point I'm making is that the world of game creation is paid for (at premium prices) and “driven” by home consoles consumers that want to own games (in the style of books).
    Any figures for that? Surely there would be no PC exclusives if they didn't pay for themselves?

    vizzini wrote:

    Who pays for AAA game development is an old console versus PC argument that everyone accepts that consoles pay for the industries biggest software technology achievements.
    Again, who is this "everyone"? Got any figures for that? :p I think that a little thing called the "3D Arms Race" happened on PC, not console. If consoles were pushing 3D tech, why did the PS3 have the RSX inside? (Oh, right - it's brought ray-tracing to the masses! FINALLY!) Until this generation, consoles could barely do anything other than games - surely there are thousands of software technology achievements unrelated to games and therefore impossible to attribute to consoles? (Oh, no, wait - let me guess! Those don't count!)

    vizzini wrote:

    So preserving AAA gaming history is far more important on a disc based medium(drm free) on home consoles than any other device.
    Tried copying a PS3 game recently? Mind letting me borrow one? (Just upload a copy of the disc for me to download - there surely won't be any DRM to get in the way)

    And when all of the PS3 consoles have YLOD'd in six-eight years, how will we play them then?

    vizzini wrote:

    If you've ever really enjoyed gaming, you should worry about its historical preservation, and be in the same boat the rest of the vocal gamers are in condemning any home console system that seeks to doubly reward the arse hole publishers at the expense of gaming preservation and consumer rights.
    Historical preservation? The only console I can see that being a problem for is the PS3 - how are we going to emulate it? Oh, it's not a problem, because Sony are offering backwards compatibility through streaming. FOREVER. So you're absolutely not being hypocritical in the slightest, and you're absolutely the best person to make that point. :)

    vizzini wrote:

    ...if it is true that they abandon the SPU/EiB Cell R&D. I'll be the first person in line to tell Sony they've repeated the Vita hardware mistake, and won't be buying a PS4 if it is just a Sony PC.
    Oops, that quote's a month old. However did it get in here?
  • Retroid Moderator 28 May 2013 13:17:19 44,503 posts
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    Thought: I wonder if Sony could tweak PS+ so it 'verified' pre-owned games? That way you'd still be paying for them with the devs getting a cut, but not specifically each title.

    I have been bloody impressed with PS+.
  • kalel 28 May 2013 13:18:53 86,392 posts
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    mrpon wrote:
    @kalel have you tried iheartradio on Sonos? I love it, but ymmv.
    No, I'll give it a go. Looks a bit like Last.fm.

    My thing is that I like listening to albums rather than playlists, and the best albums generally need a bit of work put into the listening of them, and I just find I don't really do that with streaming services. If I don't like something on Spotify I'll instantly move onto the next thing. I don't really give music the time it might need to really grow on me.
  • Benno 28 May 2013 13:19:34 9,792 posts
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    graysonavich wrote:
    kalel wrote:
    I think there's definitely going to be a shift in the way these things work over the next gen. The whole idea of us having shelves full of games, movies and music in boxes is quickly becoming totally antiquated.
    Netflix, Spotify and Steam cleared my shelves and filled my wallet sometime ago.

    Like you say, it will be the norm fairly quickly.
    Yep, same!

    EG Hearthstone Tournament

  • TarickStonefire 28 May 2013 13:20:51 2,900 posts
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    I find Spotify uuuuuuugly. Rdio for me all the way.

    Any Netflix library in the world for a couple of quid a month? Gimme!

  • mrpon 28 May 2013 13:23:47 28,463 posts
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    @kalel yeah, it's one of those pick a band/track and we'll play other similar artists. Plus loads of genres, radio stations etc.. my most used music app.

    Give yourself £5 or ½ gig, you're worth it.

  • SomaticSense 28 May 2013 13:27:27 7,959 posts
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    Retroid wrote:
    Thought: I wonder if Sony could tweak PS+ so it 'verified' pre-owned games? That way you'd still be paying for them with the devs getting a cut, but not specifically each title.

    I have been bloody impressed with PS+.
    Again, that would be kind of skirting the issue a bit. Not to mention travelling down a rocky road. Albeit less rocky than the one MS seems to be venturing down, admittedly.
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