For any of you sad bastards that have already finished the game.|
Yes I mean you neilka.
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For any of you sad bastards that have already finished the game.|
Yes I mean you neilka.
I can't believe you're a ghost.... |
Do I still need to spoiler tag stuff, considering the thread title I'm going for no.
So Bookers your Dad and Comstock. Still not sure why he kidnapped his own daughter and how he came to power. Lost me at hello. Awesome ending though and take it the end of credits scene shows he has second chance in another multiverse. Not sure where Rapture fits in other than being just another world.|
Edited by NOSAVIOUR at 10:44:43 27-03-2013
|Well I didn't see how after the credit bit fits as you are killed before she is born and all the Elizabeths vanish etc.|
Elizabeth did say it doesn't matter if you kill Comstock at one point as there will always be another, but then it contradicts itself. Head fuck. WIsh I understood it better, loved it though.|
Part of me wishes they made the twist so that you could then go back and play the game again and see it from a whole new angle. I don't think you will though.
Edited by NOSAVIOUR at 10:25:17 27-03-2013
Edited by NOSAVIOUR at 10:29:47 27-03-2013
Prefers other thread.
|Sounds like a classic example of a developer that was praised for a meaningful story in one game and then went right overboard with it in the next|
|I just accidentally read the first two posts in this thread before realising it was a spoiler thread. Ooops.|
|So there's no 6th Sense rip-off?|
Quick shout out for the modern music that Fink stole by hearing through a tear and copying. I like how they all fit the story -|
Girls Just Wanna Have Fun - "Some boys take a beautiful girl / And hide her away from the rest of the world" Elizabeth in the tower
Everybody Wants To Rule The World - Comstock and Fitzroy and so forth
God Only Knows - Reflects the despair that Booker feels without Anna
Edited by binster at 12:29:22 27-03-2013
|There's some things that don't make sense even the second time - when you're trying to get the gondola to the First Lady, there's a woman who walks up and calls Elizabeth "Annabel" which is never mentioned anywhere else in the game. What all that about?|
Finished it and I liked it a lot.|
Now to discuss the ending and everything, so move your cursor away if you've not completed it...
I love all the parallel universe stuff and I appreciated all the hints throughout - especially the brother and sister at the beginning with the coin toss being heads every time. The ga,e reminded me of the novel Anathem and the Incanters therein in many respects which was great, and if you like the quantum mechanics/multiverse stuff in Bioshock Infinite but haven't read Anathem then I highly recommend it.
But there's a couple things i'm not 100% on which might be cos i missed audio diaries. for instance, it was hinted in the diaries i did get and other stuff too that the brother and sister are actually from separate universes - only the woman was actually from the 'main' universe and her brother was effectively 'her' from elsewhere. she mentions that she was happy despite being 'dead' cos she was with said brother. is this the correct interpretation, cos i didn't see it explicitly mentioned...
I love the idea of a sterile Comstock stealing the daughter of himself from a different universe where he was never born-again. that was wonderful stuff. What i'm not sure of is why the brother and sister then reached out to that younger self and sent him to Comstock's universe 20 years into the future. I must have missed the audio diary explicitly stating their motivations for doing so - i know they talked about the girl being a loose end - was it just cos they felt guilty for taking her in the first place? or what.
Finally, did the source of Elizabeth's powers actually get properly explained? I don't know why she has this magical ability to open tears whilst the brother&sister and Comstock had to use machinery. Was it a magic they gave to her with their machinery? if so, why give her so much that it had to be contained with that equipment in the tower. Presumably it was power she had naturally but maybe Comstock gave it to her so she could wage the war on the mountains of men he was so obssessed with. Also if the Songbird was ever explained in audio diaries or whatever I missed those ones too
Sorry for forgetting the scientists' names and the tower machinery's name while writing this, but I'm sure you know to what I'm referring.
Edited by Mudo at 15:50:11 27-03-2013
I thought she was always just called Anna apart from that one line. Either way, who was that woman and why did she know Elizbeth as Annabel?|
Also if you buy a hot dog from the guy on the boardwalk he says "one hotdog for the gentleman and his pretty little daughter"
|I think the woman calling Elizabeth 'Annabelle' was related to the different dimensions getting mashed together, something that is hinted at later in the game when Booker starts getting nosebleeds when passing between dimensions because his brain is trying to comprehend all the crazy shiz that's going on. I'm no expert on any of this though, I've been reading a lot about it all but I don't pretend to know everything|
The siblings motive was that comstock tried to kill them when in the machine and that's why they stuck in between realities. |
Ffs re hot dog and the woman saying Anna, feel I should have got it before the twist. I guess not getting it makes for a better ending.
Elizabeth also said when she was younger, before they drained her powers, she could move at will between dimensions. |
One thing I never got is why is Elizabeth so powerful?
From what I understand the Lutece's are the same person, the female one existed in Comstocks reality but was male in an alternate timeline, the two of them paired up somehow along the way. Also Comstock actually did kill her/them, and killing them had the side effect of splitting them across all the alternative dimensions|
The little incidental details such as the woman calling Elizabeth Anna, the hotdog vendor calling her your daughter etc are just little touches that reward the player on subsequent playthroughs really, they're not in place to cause the player to figure out the ending before they should. Clever really, as in game you just dismiss them as meaningless mistakes, I mean compared to everything else that's going on with a floating city and all that it's not the strangest thing for a woman to apparently mistake Elizabeth for someone else
From what I understand the Lutece's are the same person, the female one existed in Comstocks reality but was male in an alternate timeline, the two of them paired up somehow along the wayglad I wasn't imagining this then
The siblings motive was that comstock tried to kill them when in the machine and that's why they stuck in between realities.I guess, though one of the Lutece audio diaries has the woman explicitly happy in her post-killed state as she's with her 'brother'. I didn't notice any malevolence towards Comstock or desire for revenge
Edited by Mudo at 16:27:50 27-03-2013
|I just read on Neogaf that the woman who calls Elizabeth Annabelle has a Voxophone linked to her somewhere, and on this you can hear that she has been foretold of the coming of the False Shepherd and Annabelle and is on the look out for them|
She actually said "it's not that bad being stuck here as with my brother".|
Doesn't mean she is happy that he tried to kill her.
One flaw I noticed while playing was when DeWitt's stated mission was to get weapons for the Vox. They find the weaponsmith dead so they pass into another Universe where he's still alive. Despite being in a different Universe, they continue with the same mission despite the possibility that the Daisy in this universe never made the same deal with DeWitt. And they then pass into yet another Universe of course where DeWitt's a Vox hero but still - the first thing they should have done after switching Universes is to check on the status of the airship to escape, which might not even be in the Vox's possession. Instead they remained 100% focused on an inconsequential weaponsmith. |
I guess you can understand it as DeWitt and Elizabeth not fully appreciating the consequences of moving into a totally different universe, so it gets a pass.
Also I get why it's like that in terms of the game's construction - it's establishing all the multiverse stuff which comes into play later but in a way not directly related to the core plot, but I nonetheless thought my character was being pretty dumb at the time
She actually said "it's not that bad being stuck here as with my brother".Haha, fair enough.
Edited by Mudo at 16:38:10 27-03-2013
|I just noticed when starting up 1999 mode, the first thing you see in the game in the quote about how the mind can make up memories (tied into how Booker makes up memories when the Lutece's take him through the tear at the end of the game), but that quote is from a book by R. Lutece called 'Barriers to trans-dimensional travel'. It's like they were trying to tell us all along|
|Jesus so many hints, starting again at seven and doing a bioshockathon. (playing for six hours straight, as I want to trade it in Saturday and only have tonight and Friday night as any spare time.)|
Just read the eg review and talk about major spoilers in several places. |
Also tells you about half the game.
Having finished the game, my thoughts are (in no particular order):|
|Just started again and in the boat the twins argue and the brother states he just wants to see where his memory experiment goes.|
|Yep, I also noticed when you use your first viewing telescope you can see the Lutece's juggling on the platform down below you, however out of the telescope, they're not there.|