Scientology advert Page 5

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  • elstoof 28 Feb 2013 15:36:27 6,626 posts
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    Adamical wrote:
    I didn't know she believed, so a little, yes.
    Not realising that the queen, the head of the Church of England, would believe in their book of stories displays a shocking lack of research in the subject by the way.
  • glaeken 28 Feb 2013 15:39:50 11,100 posts
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    The London scientology building (in Blackfriars) is in a building I knew before those nutters moved in so I happen to know that above the door is the inscription "the word of the lord endures forever" which is now covered up by a naff plastic scientology symbol.

    On some level this entertains me. I am not sure why. Maybe it's that the word of the lord only endures until someone sticks a naff piece of plastic over it or the fact the scientology headquarters actually has a Christian phrase above its door.

    This musing has nothing to do with anything.

    Edited by glaeken at 15:41:10 28-02-2013
  • elstoof 28 Feb 2013 15:40:26 6,626 posts
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    SClaw wrote:
    They must be great salesmen, if nothing else, because I've done street surveys in the past and let me tell you - people don't want to even look at you when you jump them in the street. You can feel the hate in them. I can't imagine how hard it is to actually con them into one of those tests.
    My brother was in pretty bad shape when he did his, some pretty harsh relationship issues. I can see why he would have welcomed a bit of comforting at the time.
  • Khanivor 28 Feb 2013 15:42:11 40,399 posts
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    Deckard1 wrote:
    neilka wrote:
    Tonka wrote:
    Deckard1 wrote:
    Questions make baby jesus cry.
    Oh, come hither with ye questions.
    Luke 12:14
    If an aeroplane is on a treadmill and its engines are running such that the wheels are moving at the same speed as the treadmill, will the plane take off?
    We covered this already

    \o/
  • Adamical 28 Feb 2013 15:42:50 313 posts
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    SClaw wrote:
    Adamical wrote:
    SClaw wrote:
    Adamical wrote:
    Does it not worry you that a person in a position of power strongly believes and willingly defends a story of unequivocal nonsense?
    That sort of statement always makes me chuckle.

    So I assume you believe the sun is bigger than the earth, right? And what scientific proof do you have of that - personally? Have you ever tested that belief, personally, or are simply going on knowledge provided to you by others? I thought so...

    That was a silly example off the top of my head, but for the majority of people empirically proving that basic fact is pretty much impossible. You just trust the science. It’s not so very different from faith when you strip it back.
    Do you know why I trust science over religion? Because science freely admits when it's wrong and changes in accordance with new findings. Science has nothing to gain from lying to me, whereas if, heaven forbid, religion were to be revealed as bullshit (I mean, more than now), they'd lose billions!
    Ahaha… ahaha… eh… no…

    Ask anyone working in research science whether they bullshit their figures sometimes and the resounding answer is yes. Suppression of false results, false positives and other unpleasant data is HUGE problem in published papers. The scientific journals are also pretty scandalous in their behaviour, because they hate publishing “negative” result papers and many, far too many, are driven by their connections to big companies (particularly in the medical fields). I mean… those big pharma companies would lose billions if they got bad press. But that’s another topic.

    You use the word religion as a catch-all phrase there. I must point that while, yes, many religions are like that… not all are the same. There are progressive faiths out there.
    Well of course. I'm not saying they're all saints(!). To be honest, pharma companies and the supposed science behind them are no doubt as full of shit as most religions are. Why wouldn't they be, their number one goal is financial gain.

    The science I'm referring to is that which seeks to explain our origins and behaviours. The stuff that conflicts with the "teachings" of the bible. Their goals, although partly financial of course, are largely about discovery.

    Because of that, I find it hard to believe that they would lie to me about the sun being bigger than the earth, to use your example.

    You're obviously not this nuts, but this conversation reminds me of this guy I once saw on TV who said science was a global conspiracy designed to eradicate religion.

    That's not its intention, but it's a fortunate byproduct.

    Wait, am I militant? :o
  • ModishNouns 28 Feb 2013 15:43:26 4,654 posts
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    Khanivor wrote:
    Deckard1 wrote:
    neilka wrote:
    Tonka wrote:
    Deckard1 wrote:
    Questions make baby jesus cry.
    Oh, come hither with ye questions.
    Luke 12:14
    If an aeroplane is on a treadmill and its engines are running such that the wheels are moving at the same speed as the treadmill, will the plane take off?
    We covered this already

    \o/
    That was one of the best threads ever.
  • kalel 28 Feb 2013 15:44:08 86,392 posts
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    The thing I can't quite work out about Scientology is whether there is really anyone high up behind the scenes cackling away at what a bunch of gullible idiots they all are and counting the piles of cash, or whether the belief is genuinely engrained throughout the organisation.

    Surely the longer it goes on, the more it moves towards the latter, and therefore the closer it becomes to being a legitimate religion.
  • Adamical 28 Feb 2013 15:44:54 313 posts
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    elstoof wrote:
    Adamical wrote:
    I didn't know she believed, so a little, yes.
    Not realising that the queen, the head of the Church of England, would believe in their book of stories displays a shocking lack of research in the subject by the way.
    Funnily enough, the Queen nor the Church of England are regulars on my news feeds.

    Edited by Adamical at 15:45:14 28-02-2013
  • elstoof 28 Feb 2013 15:48:16 6,626 posts
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    In a strange twist, Miscavige is actually a client of the company I work for. Ive not met him but judging by the amount of money he's encouraged disciples to spend on him I'd be inclined to think the latter.
  • SClaw 28 Feb 2013 15:51:43 826 posts
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    @Adamical

    Not to be drawn back onto that topic but I’m of the opinion science and religion are two sides of the same coin. There’s no reason why they can’t exist together.

    I think that any and all gods people believe in exist, along with all their creation myths and so on, but only for those people. The world is subjective based on our perceptions, and each person perceives the world in a different way. This, to me, is what it is to be human. There is no right or wrong anything; there is only you.
  • SClaw 28 Feb 2013 15:54:51 826 posts
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    kalel wrote:
    The thing I can't quite work out about Scientology is whether there is really anyone high up behind the scenes cackling away at what a bunch of gullible idiots they all are and counting the piles of cash, or whether the belief is genuinely engrained throughout the organisation.

    Surely the longer it goes on, the more it moves towards the latter, and therefore the closer it becomes to being a legitimate religion.
    I think it’s become a gestalt. While it may have been started cynically – nor not – it now simply exists and the individuals who are within its clutches simply don’t have the power to change it. I don’t think there is a super-villain at the top stroking his white cat; just group psychology at work. A self-perpetuating demon I think.
  • Deleted user 28 February 2013 16:01:58
    I imagine it as being 10% rich people with nothing better to do and 90% gullible fuckwits.
  • Adamical 28 Feb 2013 16:06:40 313 posts
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    SClaw wrote:
    @Adamical

    Not to be drawn back onto that topic but I’m of the opinion science and religion are two sides of the same coin. There’s no reason why they can’t exist together.

    I think that any and all gods people believe in exist, along with all their creation myths and so on, but only for those people. The world is subjective based on our perceptions, and each person perceives the world in a different way. This, to me, is what it is to be human. There is no right or wrong anything; there is only you.
    Well, you paint an appealing picture. Unfortunately, I disagree with everything except your right to your beliefs.

    So, good talk. :)
  • glaeken 28 Feb 2013 16:18:15 11,100 posts
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    kalel wrote:
    The thing I can't quite work out about Scientology is whether there is really anyone high up behind the scenes cackling away at what a bunch of gullible idiots they all are and counting the piles of cash, or whether the belief is genuinely engrained throughout the organisation.

    Surely the longer it goes on, the more it moves towards the latter, and therefore the closer it becomes to being a legitimate religion.
    I think it's turtles all the way down.
  • kalel 28 Feb 2013 16:18:40 86,392 posts
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    The thing that makes Scientology that little bit to most religions, and more cynical is the fact that it's (supposedly) selective.

    This is where the Hollywood angle comes in. Nothing an egomaniac likes more than being told their special, and nowhere is more full of egomaniacs than Hollywood. Plus they're rolling in money. It's a match made in heaven, and as a convenient by product it gives Scientology a voice and credibility it wouldn't otherwise have.
  • RedSparrows 28 Feb 2013 17:54:24 22,061 posts
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    Great to see this thread has descended into the usual bollocks of ATHEISM VS ALL, which is never really very helpful.

    (Alright, page 3 and possibly page 4. I got bored and then watched Cruise. He sounded like Arthur Koestler c. 1929. But prettier.)

    Edited by RedSparrows at 17:55:19 28-02-2013
  • kalel 28 Feb 2013 17:56:24 86,392 posts
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    What was so helpful about that post?
  • RedSparrows 28 Feb 2013 17:56:36 22,061 posts
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    Adamical wrote:
    elstoof wrote:
    Adamical wrote:
    I didn't know she believed, so a little, yes.
    Not realising that the queen, the head of the Church of England, would believe in their book of stories displays a shocking lack of research in the subject by the way.
    Funnily enough, the Queen nor the Church of England are regulars on my news feeds.
    Nor mine, but I still knew that fundamental fact of the history of Christianity in this country.

    etc etc yawn
  • RedSparrows 28 Feb 2013 17:56:52 22,061 posts
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    kalel wrote:
    What was so helpful about that post?
    It made me feel better.
  • Deleted user 28 February 2013 18:06:05
    Everyone should read this - http://www.amazon.com/Going-Clear-Scientology-Hollywood-Prison/dp/0307700666
  • Tryhard 1 Mar 2013 04:49:11 3,700 posts
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    I remember one of these dudes in Brighton giving the old Scientology spill, this must have been in the late 90's.Thought I'd check what these people were all about for a laugh.He took me up to a room and started saying key words, before I knew it I was in some hypnotic trance.I remember fighting it and could feel sweat on my forehead.

    The only question I remember during that was if I was gay.

    I heard that they were trying or had created the immaculate conception on a ship.

    Also being a Postman in East Grinstead back then every other house seemed to be into it.With posters on the doors,and getting invited in by women in sexy night wear.Used to deliver parcels to their main base of operations at Saint Hill Manor.

    Some guy was into it in another place I worked at some years later.He looked like a skeleton and drank cabbage water.And made some weird trumpet noise every so often.Not from his arse, from his mouth.

    I wonder if I will hear a certain key word from them over the phone it will send me off on a crazy mission.:evil:
  • OptimusPube 1 Mar 2013 06:28:32 2,909 posts
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    Adamical wrote:
    elstoof wrote:
    Adamical wrote:
    I didn't know she believed, so a little, yes.
    Not realising that the queen, the head of the Church of England, would believe in their book of stories displays a shocking lack of research in the subject by the way.
    Funnily enough, the Queen nor the Church of England are regulars on my news feeds.
    Nor mine but isn't it common knowledge? if you didn't know the Queen was a church goer well then... :redface:

    You better watch out.
    You better beware.
    Albert said E=MC²

  • Dirtbox 1 Mar 2013 06:56:38 77,474 posts
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    ModishNouns wrote:
    Khanivor wrote:
    Deckard1 wrote:
    neilka wrote:
    Tonka wrote:
    Deckard1 wrote:
    Questions make baby jesus cry.
    Oh, come hither with ye questions.
    Luke 12:14
    If an aeroplane is on a treadmill and its engines are running such that the wheels are moving at the same speed as the treadmill, will the plane take off?
    We covered this already

    \o/
    That was one of the best threads ever.
    If only for Lutz's

    Lutzie wrote:
    phAge, the plane doest have rope you fool. In your analogy the skater is holding onto something. If you let go the wheels would drag you back. The plane is attached to 1 thing only, the floor. If the floor is moving, then the plane will slide backwards. The jets will counter this, and keep the plane staionary relative to a fixed point. Relative to the rollers it'd be doing the roller speed. That's all pointless thoguh, I'll say it again, what causes lift? Difference in air pressure on either side of a wing. Your plane is not moving an iota relative to me stood on the ground (not the rollers) So neither is the air. Plane will not lift.

    If you were right phAge then a plane could take off with just 1b of thrust. The reason why planes take of at speed is to alter the pressure at the wings, and this is done by moving faster relative to the air, not the ground. Your plane on a treadmill isn't moving jack comparred to the air.
    I mean I like the guy and all, but fuck me.

    +1 / Like / Tweet this post

  • Deckard1 1 Mar 2013 07:43:35 27,197 posts
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    Haha, I remember billy_sastard kept posting every few pages to say "are you fucking morons still saying it would take off? Jesus I can't believe how dumb some people are on here. Idiots". Textbook sastard.
  • Rodney 1 Mar 2013 09:16:28 1,847 posts
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    elstoof wrote:
    My brother's been sucked in by this cult, and I've hardly seen him for the past 9 years. He's recently come back from a 3 year stung at Flag in the US, a sort of retreat where you wait hand and foot on your superiors and have to behave as you are told - for no money. He's actually a different person than the guy I remember now, it's almost as though you can see the machinations of his "teaching" considering the conversation and how he can guide the topic into whatever suits his/their agenda. It's really bizarre to experience actually. Soon after joining he spent a lot of time trying to convince all family and friends to join, bombarding us with books, leaflets, because we needed "help". All got rejected of course, but this alienation just pushes people further into the system. He got back about a year ago and he's been keen to make contact all of a sudden, the only time I heard from him while he was "studying" was when he wanted a flight back paid for, I've met with him a couple of times but as I said, he's a different person.

    It's not so much about protecting the gullible as you say, it's about protecting those who need some sort of confirmation, he was caught on Tottenham Court Road with a stress test, told him he was depressed and you know what? He was a bit down actually. They massage the ego to the point where you get hooked on their stuff, and now he's basically given his life to them, he's the one on the pavement dishing out the stress tests. It's a nasty cycle.
    This sounds identical to my experience with anither cult. Uncanny. Same shit reskinnef
  • nickthegun 1 Mar 2013 09:33:48 58,805 posts
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    Was it Psychandrics?

    Edited by nickthegun at 09:34:01 01-03-2013

    ---------------------------------------------------------
    He totally called it

  • Rodney 1 Mar 2013 13:24:08 1,847 posts
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    SClaw wrote:
    Adamical wrote:
    SClaw wrote:
    Adamical wrote:
    Does it not worry you that a person in a position of power strongly believes and willingly defends a story of unequivocal nonsense?
    That sort of statement always makes me chuckle.

    So I assume you believe the sun is bigger than the earth, right? And what scientific proof do you have of that - personally? Have you ever tested that belief, personally, or are simply going on knowledge provided to you by others? I thought so...

    That was a silly example off the top of my head, but for the majority of people empirically proving that basic fact is pretty much impossible. You just trust the science. It’s not so very different from faith when you strip it back.
    Do you know why I trust science over religion? Because science freely admits when it's wrong and changes in accordance with new findings. Science has nothing to gain from lying to me, whereas if, heaven forbid, religion were to be revealed as bullshit (I mean, more than now), they'd lose billions!
    Ahaha… ahaha… eh… no…

    Ask anyone working in research science whether they bullshit their figures sometimes and the resounding answer is yes. Suppression of false results, false positives and other unpleasant data is HUGE problem in published papers. The scientific journals are also pretty scandalous in their behaviour, because they hate publishing “negative” result papers and many, far too many, are driven by their connections to big companies (particularly in the medical fields). I mean… those big pharma companies would lose billions if they got bad press. But that’s another topic.

    You use the word religion as a catch-all phrase there. I must point that while, yes, many religions are like that… not all are the same. There are progressive faiths out there.
    I've read some of Ben Goldacre's stuff on medical research and it has massive problems. Commercial interests corrupting the scientific method basically.

    But science is generally self correcting, although sometimes slowly. You have to be in complete denial to think that science does not generally trend towards progress. Even in medical research the good outweighs the bad. The efficacy of modern medicine proves this
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