Getting back into the PC building game Page 3

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  • Bremenacht 28 Jan 2013 14:34:56 15,753 posts
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    @vizzini

    You've been talking about memory bandwidth in every post you've made.

    I linked an article about memory bandwidth.

    You say the link is irrelevant, because you're talking about memory bandwidth, which is completely different from memory bandwidth?

    You just opened the first page, saw some memory speeds mentioned and jumped to a conclusion. Sounds like you have a troublesome reading issue.

    ed. either that, or you don't like having your pet subject dismissed as being insignificant.

    Edited by Bremenacht at 14:38:02 28-01-2013

    Once an eagle taught me courage. And I will never forget that day

  • FutileResistor 28 Jan 2013 14:54:39 1,208 posts
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    redneon wrote:
    Ok, so I've built an AMD 8350 spec on eBuyer (without monitors) which looks like this: http://www.ebuyer.com/lists/list/136497. What do you think?

    I could probably stretch to getting this motherboard too: http://www.ebuyer.com/393530-asus-sabertooth-990fx-r2-0-socket-am3-8-channel-audio-atx-motherboard-sabertooth-990fx-r2-0. You may have noticed my budget is being broken a little :)
    Your system costs £642, the system I gave as an example on the last page was £524 and they perform pretty much the same.

    It doesn't make sense to spend more money for the possibilty of SLI later when for less money you can have better performance now. In two or three years time just sell your current card and put the money towards a better single GPU.

    Taking into account your preference for Nvidia and that you've gone from not wanting to overclock in the OP to specifying unlocked processors, I've put together the following system for £583.94 or £558.94 with the £25 discount.

    EVGA GeForce GTX 660 993MHz 2GB PCI-Express 3.0 HDMI
    Gigabyte Z77-D3H S1155 Intel Z77 DDR3 ATX
    Intel Core i5-3570K CPU
    Corsair 430W Builder Series CX 80+ Bronze PSU
    Crucial 8GB (2 x 4GB) Tactical DDR3 1600MHz CL8 1.5v
    Pioneer DVD-RW 24x SATA Internal - Retail Box
    XIGMATEK Asgard Pro Chassis
    Seagate 1TB Barracuda SATA 6Gb/s 64MB 7200RPM Hard Drive

    If you're going to be doing a bit of programming/compiling at home you could also swap the i5 for a i7-3770K for £668.92 or £628.92 with the £40 discount and still cheaper than your Ebuyer build.

    In fact if you will be doing any significant programming/compiling at home you would actually be better off going for the FX8350 as opposed to the i5-3570K as the 8350 will outperform the i5 at properly multi-threaded applications. Also leaving enough budget for 2 monitors will increase your productivity enormously (but you know that already).

    Also an SSD can dramatically improve compile times depending on the programming platform and project size so you might want to consider that too.
  • redneon Programmer, SUMO Digital 28 Jan 2013 15:53:28 46 posts
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    @FutileResistor You're right, I have been contradicting myself but I think I've finally settled on what I want. I'd rather spend a bit more on a system now that has the *potential* to be upgraded easily later on. I have the money, at the minute, so I'd rather spend more on the barebones.

    Incidentally, I've been reading today about the 8350 and (while it does look like a superb processor) I am going to drop it for an i5 3570k. I've no doubt it'll perform fantastically for heavily threaded applications but I'm more fussed about game performance, at the minute. And my compile times on my own home projects aren't too bad, anyways ;)

    Funnily enough, I built a spec on Dabs earlier very similar to yours. It looks like this:

    Gigabyte Z77X-D3H S1155 Intel Z77 DDR3 ATX £95.98
    Intel Core i5-3570K S1155 3.4GHz 6MB £172.99
    Gigabyte GeForce GTX 660 2GB PCI-Express 3.0 HDMI OC £167.54
    Kingston 8GB (2 x 4GB) HyperX Predator DDR3 1866MHz DIMM CL9 XMP £35.98
    Seagate 1TB Barracuda SATA 6Gb/s 64MB 7200RPM Hard Drive £54.99
    Pioneer DVD-RW 24x SATA Internal - Retail Box £16.48
    OCZ Technology PSU, ModXStream Pro, 700W - UK £64.99
    XIGMATEK Asgard Pro Chassis £29.72

    This totals to £640.89, so £600.89 with the £40 discount, which I don't think is too bad at all. I could probably up the hard drive to 2TB too. Or would you recommend a different change?

    EDIT: Just thought I'd add that I went for that PSU as it's modular. I quite like the idea of a modular PSU as cables get on my nerves :)

    Edited by redneon at 15:56:24 28-01-2013
  • Deleted user 28 January 2013 15:55:27
    @Bremenacht

    You told me you quoted the important part, so I didn't give their article another click count.

    “would need to be about twice as fast as ours to realize the real-world benefits of faster RAM.”

    Faster RAM is not memory channel bandwidth, it is module speed. If they've discussed memory bandwidth in one game using a GPU that is already doing all the heavy lifting then it isn't going to show anything meaningful, unlike sandbox's video.

    Building PCs around expensive GPUs is a false economy for system shelf life; it has been for 20years, especially when new consoles are looming 9months away. Mid-range PC's CPUs/Motherboards quickly become a casualty of software engineering practices that exploit the new console designs. Are you confident that it will be different this time?
  • Bremenacht 28 Jan 2013 17:35:25 15,753 posts
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    Umm. I think you're still not reading it properly, or at least not understanding it. Never mind though - I'll leave you to it.

    Once an eagle taught me courage. And I will never forget that day

  • FutileResistor 29 Jan 2013 02:36:39 1,208 posts
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    @redneon

    Yes definitely worth £20 to bump the 1TB HDD to [link url=http://www.dabs.com/products/seagate-2tb-barracuda-sata-6gb-s-64mb-7200rpm-hard-drive-7XD7.html?q=barracuda&src=16]this one/link].

    That OCZ PSU is a definite no. It fails HardOCP's test procedure.

    The power rating of a CPU means nothing. Testing PSUs properly is complex and needs quite a lot of investment in the testbed and a sound methodology. Specifically, most sites do not use precise programmed amp loads, nor do they use oscilloscopes to test for ripple and noise. Basically if a site's methodology does not include at least these two things, I wouldn't trust their review. I personally would also never buy a PSU unless it has been rated by one of these sites.

    Sites you can trust include SPCR, Anandtech, PC Perspective, Hardware Secrets, Xbitlabs, jonnyGuru, HardOCP and extremeoverclocking. There a few others but not many. Its worth mentioning that jonnyGuru do the most comprehensive reviews (including a teardown) because they only do PSU reviews.

    It's a lot harder to recommend a suitable modular PSU because many of them don't have reviews or are not available in this country at a reasonable price or from a reputable seller.

    However after a bit of a search, this is the one you should get if you want modular.

    Edit. Oh nuts just had another quick search this morning and you posted while I was editing. Well modular is not really necessary and the TX650 V2 is an excellent PSU.

    Edited by FutileResistor at 09:27:21 29-01-2013
  • redneon Programmer, SUMO Digital 29 Jan 2013 07:44:31 46 posts
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    @FutileResistor Shit. I've already ordered it all :) Ah well, I'll give them a ring today and see if I can change the PSU. I suppose I could always order the one you recommended separately and send the original one back.
  • tossum 29 Jan 2013 08:45:08 11 posts
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    Don't ati graphics cards crossfire with the integrated amd gpu for a tangible perfermance boost, or am I completely wrong about that? A bit academic now for redneon as hes placed his order, but ill be building my own in a month or two.
  • redneon Programmer, SUMO Digital 29 Jan 2013 09:20:31 46 posts
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    @FutileResistor Heh. As luck would have it, my order was delayed because the PSU I'd selected wasn't in stock! :D So I've got them to replace it with the Tx650 and it's all gone through.

    @tossum I haven't seen anything about that while I've been researching... I dropped AMD 8350 as I could only find that one video where it beat the i5 3570k. All other benchmarks I found put the i5 3570k ahead. For gaming at least, anyway. Plus, the 8350 consumes more power so, technically, over the life of the CPU you'll end up paying a lot more for it anyway. Though I'd be lying if I said that even factored into my decision. I went with an NVidia GPU purely because of the quality of the Linux drivers over ATI. While I admire ATI for supporting open drivers, as a consumer I'm more bothered about performance so I'll take NVidia's closed drivers :)
  • redneon Programmer, SUMO Digital 29 Jan 2013 09:31:35 46 posts
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    Incidentally, this is what I've ordered in the end:

    CoolerMaster Silencio RC-550 Mid Tower Case No PSU £57.02
    Gigabyte Z77X-D3H S1155 Intel Z77 DDR3 ATX £90.25
    Intel Core i5-3570K S1155 3.4GHz 6MB £162.66
    Gigabyte GeForce GTX 660 2GB PCI-Express 3.0 HDMI OC £157.53
    Kingston 8GB (2 x 4GB) HyperX Predator DDR3 1866MHz DIMM CL9 XMP £33.84
    Seagate 1TB Barracuda SATA 6Gb/s 64MB 7200RPM Hard Drive £51.70
    Pioneer DVD-RW 24x SATA Internal - Retail Box £15.50
    Corsair Memory TX650 V2 650W ATX Enthusiast Series £62.10

    After the discount it came to £630.60. I did think about getting a 2TB hard drive but I thought I'd rather put the £30 towards a better case.

    I also ordered two LG IPS224V IPS monitors and a wireless PCI-E card from Amazon for £220 too. So I have gone over budget but I'm quite happy with what I've ordered and thanks everyone for your help! :)
  • TheSaint 29 Jan 2013 09:39:08 13,629 posts
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    redneon wrote:
    Gigabyte GeForce GTX 660 2GB PCI-Express 3.0 HDMI OC £157.53
    Where was this from?
  • superdelphinus 29 Jan 2013 10:10:36 7,265 posts
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    By the way - is it a pain in the arse changing from an ati card to an nvidia one? I mean keeping everything else the same, just changing the card
  • redneon Programmer, SUMO Digital 29 Jan 2013 10:19:59 46 posts
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    @TheSaint It was from Dabs but it'll be a bit misleading as that'll be after the discount was taken off. I used a £40 discount code so I imagine it would have blanketed the discount across all the items.
  • TheSaint 29 Jan 2013 10:22:17 13,629 posts
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    Ahh that makes sense. I've been looking at that card but I hadn't seen it that cheap anywhere.
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