EU rules that downloadable games to be resellable Page 2

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  • Deleted user 4 July 2012 14:46:31
    Assuming this was enforced then couldn't someone buy 1 copy and then distribute to as many people as they want to, effectively legalising piracy?

    I refer to my quote above about transfer of ownership.
  • Dirtbox 4 Jul 2012 14:49:07 77,480 posts
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    If it did come to pass and was made possible then the first thing they'd do is have the game removed from your account on resale.

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  • Deleted user 4 July 2012 14:49:51
    Dirtbox wrote:
    Aargh. wrote:
    Make all games require an online connection and then you're licensing access to that/charging for that service and not the game software.
    Turning games into an ongoing paid for service is akin to making everything an MMO. And that doesn't touch things like ebooks, movies, TV shows and music unless they're cloud served.
    I'm thinking like the Diablo 3 approach. It's not ideal, especially for non games, but it's one way around it, I'm sure any of the existing distributors could find better ways.
  • disusedgenius 4 Jul 2012 14:53:10 5,227 posts
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    I imagine it'd work similarly to game gifting as it exists on Steam at the moment, which doesn't seem to be a massive issue for them.
  • Dirtbox 4 Jul 2012 14:55:57 77,480 posts
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    Except the money transaction part is a bit of a hurdle.

    Still doubt it'll happen though.

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  • CosmicFuzz 4 Jul 2012 15:19:23 23,350 posts
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    Nothing will happen until someone takes valve etc to court. Which probably will happen at some point going on the suits brought by the folk after Sony removed Linux etc.

    And even then, the massive impracticalities will stop it I think.

    Can video games be a force for good? My latest article says yes!

  • jakuande 4 Jul 2012 15:46:26 192 posts
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    Steam is already acting like a sort of digital rights registra so it would be fairly trivial for them to put together a system for transfering rights between account holders. (As pointed out above they already have the game gifting system.)

    Of course there's no profit in it for them, unless they decide to charge an "admin fee" for processing the transfers... I also doubt they would provide the actual marketplace for selling 2nd hand stuff, but who knows, they could set up their own 2nd hand, digital game store and take massive cuts from second hand sales to the extent that they get more money from them than they do from first sales...
  • santashi 4 Jul 2012 15:47:25 5,057 posts
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    Aargh. wrote:
    Assuming this was enforced then couldn't someone buy 1 copy and then distribute to as many people as they want to, effectively legalising piracy?

    I refer to my quote above about transfer of ownership.
    Presume the idea is it would work in the same way that you share Kindle books, ie. if someone else is using your copy then you can't use it. Not that that would really work in this case, but it's the best example that comes to mind.

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  • CosmicFuzz 4 Jul 2012 15:50:35 23,350 posts
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    santashi wrote:
    Aargh. wrote:
    Assuming this was enforced then couldn't someone buy 1 copy and then distribute to as many people as they want to, effectively legalising piracy?

    I refer to my quote above about transfer of ownership.
    Presume the idea is it would work in the same way that you share Kindle books, ie. if someone else is using your copy then you can't use it. Not that that would really work in this case, but it's the best example that comes to mind.
    Can't be too hard to make a system where once you've transferred the game you no longer have access to it.

    The problem comes with companies that unlike steam don't have such a robust system in place.

    Can video games be a force for good? My latest article says yes!

  • santashi 4 Jul 2012 15:55:06 5,057 posts
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    CosmicFuzz wrote:
    santashi wrote:
    Aargh. wrote:
    Assuming this was enforced then couldn't someone buy 1 copy and then distribute to as many people as they want to, effectively legalising piracy?

    I refer to my quote above about transfer of ownership.
    Presume the idea is it would work in the same way that you share Kindle books, ie. if someone else is using your copy then you can't use it. Not that that would really work in this case, but it's the best example that comes to mind.
    Can't be too hard to make a system where once you've transferred the game you no longer have access to it.

    The problem comes with companies that unlike steam don't have such a robust system in place.
    That wasn't the part that I thought would be problematic. I was thinking more that you would have to do something to stop people just passing it back and forth or having a chain of people passing it along and only buying one original copy between them. Just something in place to stop people taking the mickey, really, like how only one person can log into a single Steam account at a time. I'm sure they could do it but I imagine they'd probably rather not.

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  • disusedgenius 4 Jul 2012 16:04:01 5,227 posts
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    Makes just as much sense as selling it in the first place.
  • CosmicFuzz 4 Jul 2012 16:15:44 23,350 posts
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    santashi wrote:
    CosmicFuzz wrote:
    santashi wrote:
    Aargh. wrote:
    Assuming this was enforced then couldn't someone buy 1 copy and then distribute to as many people as they want to, effectively legalising piracy?

    I refer to my quote above about transfer of ownership.
    Presume the idea is it would work in the same way that you share Kindle books, ie. if someone else is using your copy then you can't use it. Not that that would really work in this case, but it's the best example that comes to mind.
    Can't be too hard to make a system where once you've transferred the game you no longer have access to it.

    The problem comes with companies that unlike steam don't have such a robust system in place.
    That wasn't the part that I thought would be problematic. I was thinking more that you would have to do something to stop people just passing it back and forth or having a chain of people passing it along and only buying one original copy between them. Just something in place to stop people taking the mickey, really, like how only one person can log into a single Steam account at a time. I'm sure they could do it but I imagine they'd probably rather not.
    Ah of course, sorry I see what you're meaning. Yeah that is a problem, but isn't that just what happens with physical games too? I buy a copy then pass it around my friends? Hell there's a lenders group right here on the forum!

    Can video games be a force for good? My latest article says yes!

  • CosmicFuzz 4 Jul 2012 16:17:49 23,350 posts
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    TheDynamicDc wrote:
    So...you can resell something that technically doesn't exist in the physical world.

    In that case I've got an absolutely brilliant quasi-laser gun for sale if anybody wants to throw up a few hundred quid for it.

    Sent in finest quality imaginary bubble-wrap and a make-believe cardboard box complete with limited edition pink polar bear.
    There's a difference between something intangible and something made up. The money in your bank account for example (it's intangible not made up).

    Can video games be a force for good? My latest article says yes!

  • nickthegun 4 Jul 2012 16:25:50 58,896 posts
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    Thats some fairly spectacular point missing.

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  • Stickman 4 Jul 2012 16:43:33 29,662 posts
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    If you're Manatank's finest, God help the rest of them.

    THIS SPACE FOR RENT

  • nickthegun 4 Jul 2012 16:47:25 58,896 posts
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    Their junior uk editor rides to work on the sunshine bus.

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    He totally called it

  • MrTomFTW Moderator 4 Jul 2012 17:08:36 37,383 posts
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    TheDynamicDc wrote:
    So...you can resell something that technically doesn't exist in the physical world.

    In that case I've got an absolutely brilliant quasi-laser gun for sale if anybody wants to throw up a few hundred quid for it.

    Sent in finest quality imaginary bubble-wrap and a make-believe cardboard box complete with limited edition pink polar bear.
    What in the actual fuck.

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    Voted by the community "Best mod" 2011, 2012 and 2013.

  • mal 4 Jul 2012 18:53:10 22,341 posts
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    CosmicFuzz wrote:
    Nothing will happen until someone takes valve etc to court. Which probably will happen at some point going on the suits brought by the folk after Sony removed Linux etc.
    That Sony lawsuit was one of those mickey mouse class action things they have in the US, wasn't it? In Europe I believe you have to do more than click 'Sue' to sue someone.

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  • CosmicFuzz 4 Jul 2012 19:12:30 23,350 posts
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    mal wrote:
    CosmicFuzz wrote:
    Nothing will happen until someone takes valve etc to court. Which probably will happen at some point going on the suits brought by the folk after Sony removed Linux etc.
    That Sony lawsuit was one of those mickey mouse class action things they have in the US, wasn't it? In Europe I believe you have to do more than click 'Sue' to sue someone.
    I think you can still get class action lawsuits in the UK, but I'm not sure. But you're right, it'll be harder to find a firm to represent you here I'd hope than in the states.

    Can video games be a force for good? My latest article says yes!

  • bad09 1 Feb 2013 12:14:45 5,643 posts
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    Valve now being sued over not letting people sell on games, (also notes the nasty problem of Steamworks chaining people to Steam even when they buy a disc \o/ )

    http://www.pcgamer.com/2013/02/01/valve-sued-by-german-consumer-group-because-steam-users-cant-resell-games/

    Doubt anything will come of it sadly but more and more pressure about these DRMs the better for consumers especially given most of the industry now uses Steamworks or their own client to chain you down disc or download.
  • DFawkes 1 Feb 2013 12:45:08 22,616 posts
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    Wasn't the original ruling that you couldn't block the sale of downloaded games? I don't remember anything saying you HAD to facilitate the selling of them.

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  • bad09 1 Feb 2013 12:51:03 5,643 posts
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    True but more and more pressure may mean they do end up providing a means. May not go that way of course but as you say as it stood nothing actually changed with the ruling.

    Anything that fights back against DRM is positive in my book.
  • Stranded87 1 Feb 2013 15:24:43 865 posts
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    But how do you sell a Steam game without selling a whole account (which I'm guessing they don't let you do anyway)? Surely if it's impossible to sell it then they are essentially blocking it.

    Unless you can sell Steam games, in which ignore me.
  • jabberwoky 1 Feb 2013 20:42:25 467 posts
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    Well I hope they do something soon, I havn't bought a PC game for ages because of the way they are sold, would be quite nice to be able to again.
  • Destria 1 Feb 2013 20:56:15 2,819 posts
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    Problem with this is that a used digital game isn't like a used car (or even a used DVD), as there's no wear and tear and no discernable difference. Why would anyone need to buy a new game if it was available used
  • Deleted user 1 February 2013 21:07:07
    True, generally pc games are far cheap. Gamers seem to be the most demanding consumers around, seem to think they have a right to everything.
  • onestepfromlost 1 Feb 2013 21:10:00 2,039 posts
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    Destria wrote:
    Problem with this is that a used digital game isn't like a used car (or even a used DVD), as there's no wear and tear and no discernable difference. Why would anyone need to buy a new game if it was available used
    Well ifi no-one buys new ones who will sell them on?
  • Moot_Point 9 Mar 2013 23:01:40 3,920 posts
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    Looks like both Amazon and Apple are preparing to set up 2nd hand digital marketplaces for unwanted digital content.

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