Pro Evolution Soccer 2013 Page 5

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  • Ultrasoundwave 26 Jul 2012 14:02:26 3,276 posts
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    Anthony_UK wrote:
    Monsieur_Blade wrote:
    Ultrasoundwave wrote:
    I was Pro Evo back in the day, then i switched over to FIFA when it got good and i havent played a Pro Evo game for the last 4 or 5 years.

    Decided to try the demo last night to see how far they have come : not very far at all it seems.

    I honestly dont understand any football fan out there who is still loyal to Pro Evo - trying the demo last night, i felt embarrassed for Konami.

    They are so far behind FIFA on so many levels its not even funny - everything from the presentation, the menus, the graphics, the sound, controls, gameplay, player likeness, match atmosphere, etc,etc, etc........every aspect of Pro Evo is inferior to FIFA.

    Its sad, because back in the day Pro Evo was untouchable and genuinely a thrilling game of football. I hope they can recover one day and give FIFA proper challenge, but until then ill be FIFA all the way.

    Shape up Konami!
    The fact u put "presentation, menus, graphics and sound" in front of gameplay speaks volumes.
    I couldn't give two hoots about any of them above gameplay. Pes is definitely improving but i think its gonna be next generation when we finally see a new engine and a fresh and exciting new game.

    But to say pes is inferior to fifa in every way is total fan boyism and utter nonsense. Fifa prob offers the overall better package but pes is more fun and has the superior masters league.
    I wouldn't say it's fan boyism in the slightest, I was a huge PES fan up until Pro Evo 6 (released 6 years ago), and my initial impression on playing this was that it's basically the same game but slower. There's no wow, this is the new pro evo feeling just that it is the same game, which they tweak every year to try and get that magic back when in fact FIFA has left it for dust long ago.

    Exactly. To be honest, me being accused of fanboyism is hilarious - FIFA simply offers the better game of football these days.

    The truth is, only a Pro Evo fanboy would continue to stick up for it.

    Edited by Ultrasoundwave at 14:16:43 26-07-2012

    "The worst part is, I'll have to have the break-up sex with myself!"

  • King_Edward 26 Jul 2012 14:17:15 11,454 posts
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    ^That's clever that is.
  • lovely2cu 26 Jul 2012 14:25:50 1,194 posts
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    anon_ wrote:
    I kinda agree with his point though. Seems like every year with PES they're just switching sliders - faster, slower, looser, stiffer - trying to hit on a magic formula. Every year I get an initial eureka! firing up the demo, but a few games usually exposes the usual flaws. The stilted gameplay, the robotic animations. Engine needs a rewrite, not tweaking.
    i feel like Pro Evo's changes year on year are largely superficial tweaks.

    Where I think EA are going right with Fifa is that they try to evolve the gameplay in a fundamental way, whether it's 360 degree movement, tactical defending, first touch, etc.

    Until Konami rework Pro Evo's from the ground up, each new game is just going to feel like the one before it, just with a different slant.
  • Ultrasoundwave 26 Jul 2012 15:17:49 3,276 posts
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    King_Edward wrote:
    ^That's clever that is.
    To be honest, i think im just arguing for the sake of it.

    The bottom line is, im quite happy in a way that some people are remaining loyal to Pro Evo. If it can rack up enough sales to keep going and keep improving, i'll be happy.

    As disappointing as it is that Konami have fallen so far behind EA, i fully expect them to return to form one day because there is a lot of talent still there - a bit like Torres i guess......

    :eek:

    "The worst part is, I'll have to have the break-up sex with myself!"

  • dagoberto 26 Jul 2012 16:37:02 279 posts
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    Why not just play and enjoy both like i do ,they both have there positives and negatives, fifa's stats piss all over pes from a great height, in fifa i love finding treats at shit teams.
    I love how players pace can still be high in lower teams and leagues like it should be, in pes mostly only good teams have fast players and in general the stats are a mess.
    But why the fuck can you use edited teams/stats online in fifa, so fucking shit when i play most games and they have messi ronaldo etc , or created player all the time, hate that shit.
    I hate how people only do that fucking r1 shot all the time or spam fucking skills.
    Fuck i also hate how people keep there finger on l1 one two pass looks so shit players all running up the pitch.
    Most the goals are always cut in and r1 curl shot , same shit over and over,or that fucking zidane spin roulette shit.
    The chipping and over the top threw balls are much better in fifa, and it feels more realistic in general.
    But for me pes is still just more enjoyable , and this year the shooting is back (fired a balistic missile with stevie deadhard from 35-40 odd yards that spanked the post, was so sweet), was always the best thing about pes , the sweet goals which make you feel good, still it feels clunky at times (hope thats just the demo)but still scoring a goal in pes is more satisfying than fifa.
  • Deckard1 26 Jul 2012 16:39:08 27,582 posts
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    Nicely put.

    Hush you ponce

  • freedumb 26 Jul 2012 19:26:32 1,110 posts
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    @lovely2cu

    Where I think EA are going right with Fifa is that they try to evolve the gameplay in a fundamental way, whether it's 360 degree movement, tactical defending, first touch, etc.

    tactical defending (hold up play/tracking pes 2011), first touch (R2 button initially, developed contextually in pes 2010-2012), these things and a lot others were introduced and refined in pes, which has always added fresh stuff to gameplay over each version whether people love it or hate it, but because they didn't wrap it up in snazzy pr marketing speak they were ignored and fifa was praised instead. I think that's what Jon Murphy was annoyed at but the way he put it across was slightly sour and unnecessary. The general consensus being, when FIFA announces it its like 'WOW, FIFA are really innovating', but when its something that PES has already done before, no one notices because, after all, 'pes is crap innit'. The tactial defending last year is a prime example of this.

    I'm not saying FIFA aren't innovating at all, they have added some things that have rightly been commended, I liked the jostling system in FIFA 09, that was a step up for footie games. But the overall effects have been over exaggerated a lot of the times because FIFA bamboozles people over with its animation engine and visual presentation.

    Fifa introduced 360 degree dribbling in 2010 but the effect was largely cosmetic compared to FIFA 09's 16 direction dribbling. PES continued to develop stat-based footplanting, momentum and inertia in player movement 1st throughout 2009-2010, then when that base was at a good level added 360 dribbling in 2011 to augment the game. FIFa's player individuality is minimal compared to PES, you'd think that would be a crucial part of of footie game, that's why FIFa's changes to me seem to be the cosmetic ones; remember things like the 'personality plus' stuff, did it really change FIFA? PES is unfashionable and animated in an inferior way to FIFA, but imo the fundamentals were being taken care of before the aesthetics.


    Monsieur_Blade wrote:
    - It still feels very similar to PES 2012. In fact I'd call this PES 2012.5
    - The pre-match build up is almost identical to PES 2012, as are the menus
    - The graphics are almost identical to PES 2012

    I'm pretty impressed with the demo overall but I was hoping it was gonna feel a bit more fresh and new. It really does feel so familiar in parts to PES 2012!!

    I agree with a previous poster - 'Definitely an evolution rather than a revolution.'

    They've already said they're at the limit with this engine on current consoles, so this is more of a refined, tweaked pes 2012, which I still think is a great game, flaws aside. There are enough changes to differentiate it and justify a purchase. They'll be using MGS5's fox engine for next gen systems.

    Edited by freedumb at 20:13:30 26-07-2012
  • freedumb 26 Jul 2012 19:42:07 1,110 posts
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    Post deleted
  • Skinner1889 26 Jul 2012 21:12:24 10 posts
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    New game engine next year apparently. All development been shifted to London studio.
  • King_Edward 26 Jul 2012 21:20:37 11,454 posts
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    They've sorted out the goalies which was PES 12's big issue. Looking forward to the 2nd (cocked up) demo and the Fifa one.
  • dsmx 27 Jul 2012 02:20:58 7,583 posts
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    I had fun playing the demo, that's good enough for me.

    Konami literally don't need to do any gameplay tweaks this time for demo 2, please konami don't change anything. The game is fun as it is please don't fuck it up.

    "If we hit that bullseye the rest of the dominoes will fall like a a house of cards, checkmate." Zapp Brannigan

  • lovely2cu 27 Jul 2012 04:24:06 1,194 posts
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    @freedumb
    I think you're under-selling Fifa's gameplay evolutions and over-selling PES' a touch. I agree EA put a lot of messaging behind theirs, but to be fair, you genuinely tend to feel the changes in the game quite keenly, whereas the reason PES' tend to slip under the radar is precisely because they aren't nearly as pronounced. Which is also why PES games have generally felt a bit samey and stagnant this gen, PES13 demo included.
  • Zizoo 27 Jul 2012 07:35:47 8,248 posts
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    I tried this last night and I don't think I'll be switching camps. It is definitely a good game, but I still prefer Fifa.

    Playing as Germany was funny, while the camera pans across the team singing the national anthem, they get to Neuer and then lil Lahm, who's arm shoots straight through Neuer's body. Shoddy.

    The actual gameplay is decent, but still not enough of a step up.
  • binky Moderator 27 Jul 2012 08:33:03 9,560 posts
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    ZizouFC wrote:


    Playing as Germany was funny, while the camera pans across the team singing the national anthem, they get to Neuer and then lil Lahm, who's arm shoots straight through Neuer's body. Shoddy.
    Those sort of things will almost definitely be gone by the time the game goes gold.
  • binky Moderator 27 Jul 2012 08:44:29 9,560 posts
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    Does make me chuckle reading comments on PES v FIFA these days. The exact same arguments that were used by the PES boys 10 years ago are being used by the FIFA boys these days.

    Having worked for EA for 8 years I was partial to a bit (a lot) of FIFA. I won company tournaments and considered myself a damn fine player. Or the while the internet was screaming at me that PES was the better game.

    I tried it. I didn't like it. But mostly because of the PS2 controller and the window dressing. It felt sterile.

    A few years later I discovered I actually rather liked PES and bought a copy for myself. The single player game was far, far better than FIFA. The ai was more interesting to play against and if you were having big sessions (on your own) PES was worth the investment. FIFA (for me) was still a better multiplayer game. It probably still is.

    I was one of the only people I knew in my circle of friends to be playing both games side by side. PES at home. FIFA at work. Both had their merits.

    Fast forward to present day and I now find FIFA really frustrating to play. Whether that's because I can't get my head around the new defending or because I got tired of the push-me-pull-you fake results (seriously, how many games have you played where teams score against you or you score in the 45th min or 89th min??) but it just didn't sit right with me anymore.

    Because of that, I didn't invest any time in last years revision.
    Spending time with a game like this rewards you; which is why I think demo builds are almost a bad idea as it's normally quite hard to actually see what has changed.

    So to the demo...

    I fired it up last night for one go. Initial visual feeling was that it was a step back from last years game. It felt a tad slower and I really don't think I like the arrow that appears on the pitch when you hold LT. Passing seemed more or less the same but shooting has definitely been tinkered with. A screamer from Andy Carroll (that went inches over the bar) felt weighty and powerful, unlike the slightly floaty shooting from last time. Definite improvement.

    In one game that's all I could see. I'm sure there will be more once I scratch the surface.
  • roz123 27 Jul 2012 09:00:54 7,112 posts
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    ZizouFC wrote:
    Playing as Germany was funny, while the camera pans across the team singing the national anthem, they get to Neuer and then lil Lahm, who's arm shoots straight through Neuer's body. Shoddy.
    Surely that is not that bad considering FIFA 12s physics problems
  • Zizoo 27 Jul 2012 09:08:27 8,248 posts
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    Yeah, I suppose so. :)
  • Deleted user 27 July 2012 09:11:53
    @Ultrasoundwave Spot on , Pro Evo has fallen so far behind FIFA.
  • DarthKebab 27 Jul 2012 09:12:12 403 posts
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    Binky, that arrow you see when holding LT for manual can be turned off in options.
  • King_Edward 27 Jul 2012 09:26:39 11,454 posts
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    Was manual passing in the last PES? It's a great idea for when you need a little extra precision, but don't want the whole game bogged down in it. I hope Fifa pinch it and give it a silly name. If they haven't already.
  • THFourteen 27 Jul 2012 09:55:37 33,095 posts
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    Monsieur_Blade wrote:
    THFourteen wrote:
    Is the physics/collision detection. Any better.
    Perhaps slightly but still very similar to PES 2012
    actually i played a couple of games last night, i thought it was much better. the through balls didnt just woosh through players, and if you bumped into another player you stopped instead of running straight through them. slide tackling seemed much better too.

    it was allright actually. might play some more when theres a proper extender out.

    scored 2 long rangers one with lolotelli and one with cashley young
  • Deckard1 27 Jul 2012 10:03:24 27,582 posts
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    Yeah its definitely better than it was. Getting closer to Fifa 09 every year. Next year they're nailed on.

    Edited by Deckard1 at 11:57:56 27-07-2012

    Hush you ponce

  • Lyserberg 27 Jul 2012 11:53:48 349 posts
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    ZizouFC wrote:
    Playing as Germany was funny, while the camera pans across the team singing the national anthem, they get to Neuer and then lil Lahm, who's arm shoots straight through Neuer's body. Shoddy.
    It is because of the different body shapes of the players (one is longer than the other, one is more muscle packed than the other...etc) i'm totally sure that this is a current-gen limitation, and once the next-gen are out, we can expect a dynamic calculation for this stuff.

    AND HOLY BROWN COWS a guy from EA comes here and post, waouh, i'm totally impressed.

    I think i kinda agree with him on most aspects of these two games.

    La cerise sur le gāteau!

  • THFourteen 27 Jul 2012 12:03:52 33,095 posts
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    binky wrote:
    Does make me chuckle reading comments on PES v FIFA these days. The exact same arguments that were used by the PES boys 10 years ago are being used by the FIFA boys these days.
    whats funny is, in my circle of friends we were all PES fanboys from like 2-4. FIFA was a load of shit. Now we all without exception play FIFA.

    I think it says a lot for how the games have changed.
  • ecureuil 27 Jul 2012 12:40:51 76,652 posts
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    I still can't get on with FIFA, I don't like how it looks or how it plays. Feels weird to me. Problem is, newer Pro Evo games haven't been doing it for me either, it really doesn't feel to have changed much. I didn't play much of 2012 at all.
  • SolidSCB 27 Jul 2012 12:50:59 6,511 posts
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    ecureuil wrote:
    I still can't get on with FIFA, I don't like how it looks or how it plays. Feels weird to me. Problem is, newer Pro Evo games haven't been doing it for me either, it really doesn't feel to have changed much. I didn't play much of 2012 at all.
    I'm much the same. Haven't really been too into football games since Pro Evo went down the pan at around PES 5-6. I can enjoy an odd game of FIFA but it is so, so slow. Plays absolutely nothing like a proper fluid game of football. Found PES 2012 half decent apart from the shooting. At least they managed to inject a bit of pace into the game. FIFA really feels like playing football in treacle to me, horribly sluggish. Also, the single player AI is beyond horrendous so forget having a game on your own.
  • DreadedWalrus 27 Jul 2012 13:00:31 335 posts
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    Lyserberg wrote:
    ZizouFC wrote:
    Playing as Germany was funny, while the camera pans across the team singing the national anthem, they get to Neuer and then lil Lahm, who's arm shoots straight through Neuer's body. Shoddy.
    It is because of the different body shapes of the players (one is longer than the other, one is more muscle packed than the other...etc) i'm totally sure that this is a current-gen limitation, and once the next-gen are out, we can expect a dynamic calculation for this stuff.
    2K have got this sort of dynamic animation (or whatever you want to call it) down for their NBA 2K series. Playing My Player (Be a Pro equivalent) as a 5'7" guy (where almost everyone is 6' at the minimum), you really notice it. My all-time favourite example was when I passed the ball to a 7'3" guy, and after he scored and was fouled he came over and fist-bumped me. Our arms hilariously-angled to make it happen, but happen it did. Fist to fist. :p
  • gregjd 27 Jul 2012 13:17:53 3 posts
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    Quite impressed with the XBox demo. What's the current thinking on the best version to get though? I've recently got me a spanky gaming PC and, whilst I need to sort out a joypad for it, I'm thinking this could be the way to go as presumably updating kits/players/teams/badges etc is much easier on the PC?
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