Next generation of consoles come in Page 305

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  • beastmaster 19 Jun 2013 21:49:55 11,992 posts
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    Didn't everyone except MS see that it would be commercial suicide with that kind of DRM? I've got one One on pre-order and was prepared to put up with it as it wouldn't really effect me that much.

    However, I'm pleased that they've gone down this route. It shouldn't really be a surprise that they've done it but I still though they'd go through with it. I suppose it's a case of seeing what they could get away with?

    Going off what I've read and giving it the benefit of the doubt, it looks as though

    a) the games seem to be in better shape
    b) no more DRM as originally stated

    so what's left

    a) Kinect - That won't go away but I suspect they'll announce that it won't need to be connected all the time
    b) Price - Seriously doubt they'll lower it.

    Still, for console owners, it's a great time. Some new toys to play around with and it's not that far off. No doubt, they'll be a few more twists and turns.

    Now, just announce Shadow Complex 2 already.

    The Resident Evil films. I'm one of the reasons they keep making them.

  • IMO 19 Jun 2013 21:59:49 5,745 posts
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    IMO wrote:
    What twisted twilight zone have I entered here?
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 00:10:42 4,661 posts
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    beastmaster wrote:

    so what's left

    a) Kinect - That won't go away but I suspect they'll announce that it won't need to be connected all the time
    b) Price - Seriously doubt they'll lower it.
    a) I'm not sure they'll do that, they can still sell Kinect as a feature, as opposed to their previous DRM crap.

    and b) they can't, Kinect has to be included, the whole system is built on it.
  • RobTheBuilder 20 Jun 2013 00:12:43 6,521 posts
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    @DrStrangelove Don't forget option C, secretly upping the spec so that the console is the most powerful.
  • Ziz0u 20 Jun 2013 00:13:44 8,648 posts
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    Confused now... oh, wait. I'm not.

    I'll just get both eventually.
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 00:14:37 4,661 posts
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    RobTheBuilder wrote:
    @DrStrangelove Don't forget option C, secretly upping the spec so that the console is the most powerful.
    I think it's a bit late for that, but that would raise the price point even more. Might do more harm than good.
  • RobTheBuilder 20 Jun 2013 00:31:12 6,521 posts
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    @DrStrangelove they wouldn't raise it, but take the opportunity to build on this U Turn by adding more power. Take the financial hit to strengthen their position.
  • Deleted user 20 June 2013 00:33:09
    @DrStrangelove
    Late for what? How exactly do you up specs that haven't been announced to the public? They'd have to commit to more than a Raspberry Pi for any new specs to be an improvement on the first Raspberry Pi. I'm still completely amazed that anyone would be prepared to buy a console at that price without some idea way to gauge if they were being sold goods equal to the value.

    No one else find the lack of X180 specs in exchange for 430 a massive leap of blind faith?
  • Psychotext 20 Jun 2013 00:36:08 55,032 posts
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    Yeah, secretly I'm hoping they'll announce it's got a CELL in it.

    What the fuck are you talking about. Since when did anyone buy consoles on specs? We go on games and what they look like.
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 00:46:59 4,661 posts
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    vizzini wrote:
    @DrStrangelove
    Late for what? How exactly do you up specs that haven't been announced to the public?
    Uhm... aren't the X180's specs widely and unrefutedly known for some time now? Or am I missing something?
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 00:47:32 4,661 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    Yeah, secretly I'm hoping they'll announce it's got a CELL in it.

    What the fuck are you talking about. Since when did anyone buy consoles on specs? We go on games and what they look like.
    I bought a PS3 :confused:

    It was such, I mean it had so many gigaflops.

    Edited by DrStrangelove at 00:48:16 20-06-2013
  • RobTheBuilder 20 Jun 2013 00:50:04 6,521 posts
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    @DrStrangelove until recently it WAS a gigaflop
  • Deleted user 20 June 2013 00:50:23
    @psychotext

    I thought you were a seasoned gamer. Video game magazines have been doing hardware breakdowns and analysis from as far back as I can remember for console launches/releases. Price versus perceived value of goods is as old as commerce itself.

    If you every got to play the laser disc version of dragons lair in an arcade at 2 per go (back in the day)you'd know what I mean about price and perceived value, and then feeling ripped off.

    @DrStrangelove

    As yet we have no official confirmation from Microsoft.
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 00:53:57 4,661 posts
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    vizzini wrote:

    @DrStrangelove

    As yet we have no official confirmation from Microsoft.
    Is that really saying anything?
  • RobTheBuilder 20 Jun 2013 00:55:52 6,521 posts
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    DrStrangelove wrote:
    vizzini wrote:

    @DrStrangelove

    As yet we have no official confirmation from Microsoft.
    Is that really saying anything?
    To be fair you did say that we have known the specs for some time.
  • Psychotext 20 Jun 2013 00:58:41 55,032 posts
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    vizzini wrote:
    I thought you were a seasoned gamer. Video game magazines have been doing hardware breakdowns and analysis from as far back as I can remember for console launches/releases.
    Yes... you know, actually after the console has released.

    Anyone with half a brain cell (who actually cared about that shit) would wait for the kit to be in the hands of DF etc before making a decision. Hell, even with what Sony have announced we don't really know anything.
  • Deleted user 20 June 2013 01:13:19
    @psychotext

    No, that is the case. I can vaguely remembering reading all about the SNES and Megadrive hardware(and the rest) before they were released in the world.

    You are also missing another important part of the transaction. Are the X180 goods as described? If you don't know the hardware specs how can you assess if the game footage you've seen is plausible based on what you know of the hardware? Milo and kinect anyone?

    Have you already forgotten the 3DS launch? DF initially made all sorts of claims about the consoles performance and expect game experiences because it did 3D (before release). Just from reading the technical specs I torpedoed many of their overreaching claims, like claims of it being of gamecube capabilities and much more powerful than the PSP. Everyone expressed great interest in the system at the start before launch and Nintendo priced high, then people realised it was overpriced (in spite of getting games to look at) and ultimately waited for a price reduction where the price for perceived value of goods met their expectations.
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 01:13:43 4,661 posts
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    RobTheBuilder wrote:
    DrStrangelove wrote:
    vizzini wrote:

    @DrStrangelove

    As yet we have no official confirmation from Microsoft.
    Is that really saying anything?
    To be fair you did say that we have known the specs for some time.
    Yes, maybe I was being ambiguous... my point: how often do we get official confirmations? One of Microsoft's official confirmations so far was the whole DRM/used/share stuff, and that just popped like a balloon.

    You can much quicker change DRM though than the hardware of a games console everyone is developing their games for for quite a while now.

    Sony was happy to announce details of their hardware, because they were confident that they're offering the best. Microsoft has hardly said anything about this, instead on the reveal they stated that they don't really matter. In my logic, if they were on par or even better, they would have pointed that out, but they didn't.

    edit: and to be fair, for market success better specs do hardly matter, MS isn't that wrong there. For me, being a PC gamer too, they do matter, but for most they don't. How many can actually tell the difference between PS3 and X360 performance? What they can see is that they like the 360's controller and that the X360 is cheaper. The PS3 was still bought a) because it's the new Playstation and b) because it's a BD player. No one cared about gigaflops.

    Edited by DrStrangelove at 01:19:49 20-06-2013
  • richardiox 20 Jun 2013 01:24:18 5,734 posts
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    vizzini wrote:
    @DrStrangelove
    Late for what? How exactly do you up specs that haven't been announced to the public? They'd have to commit to more than a Raspberry Pi for any new specs to be an improvement on the first Raspberry Pi. I'm still completely amazed that anyone would be prepared to buy a console at that price without some idea way to gauge if they were being sold goods equal to the value.

    No one else find the lack of X180 specs in exchange for 430 a massive leap of blind faith?
    -Why are you even talking about a Raspberry PI you fucking loser?
    -I didn't (and still dont) know (or care about) the specs of my SNES yet it's my favourite console.
    -Blind leap of faith? Multiple games shown running 1080p 60 on final hardware. Pretty much confirmed specs been in public domain for months.

    You're a cretin. And your U turn on buying a PS4 puts Microsoft to shame.

    The most amazing thing is, despite his delusions of intelligence and talking down to every other poster, he's basically just a good old fashioned fanboy. A guy unhealthily obsessed with system specs, graphics and hardware but who doesn't actually do PC gaming. And uses a PS3 as his only platform (bar a recent WiiU)

    "If god created a console he would have called it PS3"
  • Deleted user 20 June 2013 01:25:07
    I don't recall a single magazine talking about the hardware in the SNES, and I bought practically every magazine going then. They hyped up stuff like Mode 7, but a specific spec breakdown, I don't think they did. Of course, most of the old magazines exist happily online as scans, so it should be easy to find such a thing if it did exist. But I'd put strong money on them not, given they were almost wholly aimed at 12 year olds who wouldn't have a clue what any of the hardware was, let alone understand the raw specs.

    Edited by meme at 01:26:01 20-06-2013
  • Psychotext 20 Jun 2013 01:33:37 55,032 posts
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    You've got a faulty memory vizzini. Most of us didn't have a clue what was in the consoles until they'd been out ages (if at all). Maybe that was different in Japan but I can't speak for that.

    Just about the only thing we knew is how many bits they had. Hell, we didn't even bother talking about memory back then.
  • Deleted user 20 June 2013 01:35:15
    @richardiox

    At 200 I didn't care too much about the technical specs of Wii, but at 200 for a handheld I did, and at 500-350 for a home console I deeply care about the technical specs.

    You are also wrong about the X180 videos. At best you can claim they are running on devkits of unknown specs that haven't been confirmed for the final product. I hope you are correct, but you should want to know the technical specs of final X180, so then we can look at those videos and make reasoned arguments is the 1080p? 2k? 4K? Video of BF4 shown at E3 on the projector at 60fps likely to be manageable on less than 1teraflop/sec GPU as rumoured.

    I'm not getting at MS's new console, just their lack of transparency on the value proposition being offered.

    @meme

    I can still vaguely see the annotated double page PCB image in my mind of the SNES from my friend's magazine I was reading.
  • Deleted user 20 June 2013 01:38:40
    Like I said, magazine scans exist online, so you shouldn't have too many problems finding it.
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 01:48:34 4,661 posts
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    Mode 7 was the shit though.
  • DodgyPast 20 Jun 2013 02:08:18 8,538 posts
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    beastmaster wrote:
    Didn't everyone except MS see that it would be commercial suicide with that kind of DRM? I've got one One on pre-order and was prepared to put up with it as it wouldn't really effect me that much.

    However, I'm pleased that they've gone down this route. It shouldn't really be a surprise that they've done it but I still though they'd go through with it. I suppose it's a case of seeing what they could get away with?
    Lots of people were worried though. People seriously thought Sony might be forced by the publishers do the same thing.

    Have to admit that despite being quite geeky at the time I had no idea what the differences between the SNES and the Megadrive were, I just knew that Street Fighter 2 was on the SNES so I wanted one.
  • RobTheBuilder 20 Jun 2013 02:12:03 6,521 posts
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    I remember knowing the SNES had a slower processor but better sprite handling abilities.

    Mode 7 was Nintendo at their best, take something cheap but very very useful and use it to wow people.
  • Deleted user 20 June 2013 02:17:57
    Yeah, I remember SNES vs Megadrive hardware wars in the mags, but never a detailed breakdown, and definitely not prior to launch. It never went any more specific than "SNES PROCESSOR SLOWER, MEGADRIVE ONE FASTER" etc.

    Probably the most technical they ever got was a "NES is 8bit, SNES is 16bit, that's double the bits, innit".
  • DrStrangelove 20 Jun 2013 02:23:19 4,661 posts
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    Jaguar was 64 bit, do the math!

    Sadly, few people understood maths.
  • Psychotext 20 Jun 2013 02:26:53 55,032 posts
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    Or large cats.
  • DodgyPast 20 Jun 2013 02:33:17 8,538 posts
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    Probably got quite a lot to do with gamers aging and the ability to educate ourselves provided by the internet.

    I can't remember how much of a break down Edge used to do on technical differences... But I don't remember that much from even PS1 vs. N64. Just that the N64 was better until you took into account the fact that it was buggered by a lack of storage.

    I think PS2 vs. GC vs. Xbox was the first generation I was knowledgeable about the hardware.
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