Revolution in the middle east Page 63

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  • mcmonkeyplc 19 Nov 2012 12:26:00 39,569 posts
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    Well that's retarded too :)

    Come and get it cumslingers!

  • Moot_Point 19 Nov 2012 12:45:01 4,616 posts
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    mcmonkeyplc wrote:
    Well that's retarded too :)
    Human instinct is retarded? Are you an alien?

    ================================================================================

    mowgli wrote: I thought the 1 married the .2 and founded Islam?

  • Deleted user 19 November 2012 12:50:19
    History keeps repeating
  • RelaxedMikki 19 Nov 2012 12:56:06 941 posts
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    So much of human instinct is retarded. Animal instincts aren't always rational.

    For example, a desire for vengence is a powerful motivator. If I felt an organisation was responsible for the death of my children, I am sure that the instinct for revenge would make me attack that organisation even if it was irrational to do so.

    The other day my seven year old daughter told me that she had decided that everyone else was aliens. I asked her why. She said, "Just for fun".

    EDIT: got the age of my own eldest child wrong...!

    Edited by RelaxedMikki at 13:03:14 19-11-2012
  • Deleted user 19 November 2012 13:00:28
    To be fair this is actually about living space and security. It's pretty fundamental stuff. Not really irrational.
  • RedSparrows 19 Nov 2012 13:01:13 24,251 posts
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    Is it actually human instinct, or is it part of human frailty? They aren't the same thing.
  • RelaxedMikki 19 Nov 2012 13:11:48 941 posts
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    yup. Good points Kalel and RedSparrows.

    I wasn't really trying to explain any issues in Israel with that chunter. Just talking about how I often feel retarded (but sometimes also excited and alive) when I am being driven by instinct over rational thought. As RedSparrows says, though, this may well be frailty rather then instinct... Are our instincts noble or base?Is it base animal instinct and noble human instinct...? Or is that just typical human speciesism?! :confused:
  • RedSparrows 19 Nov 2012 13:23:14 24,251 posts
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    Our instincts are instincts - they only become noble or base because of our higher cognitive activity, capacity for self-awareness, reflection, positivism etc. So yeah, they are base or not depending on the moral framework we inhabit. For some, they are always base. We're talking about very, very complex webs of meaning.

    Same with frailty - some see that as Frailty, others as frailty. Big difference.
  • LeoliansBro 19 Nov 2012 13:25:12 44,957 posts
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    This is genuine ignorance on my part: if everyone chilled the fuck out and lived where they currently live, what would the problem be?

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

  • Fab4 19 Nov 2012 13:28:03 6,216 posts
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    LeoliansBro wrote:
    This is genuine ignorance on my part: if everyone chilled the fuck out and lived where they currently live, what would the problem be?
    Population increases.
  • RedSparrows 19 Nov 2012 13:33:12 24,251 posts
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    Impossible question!

    YOU ARE IMPOSSIBLE, LB.

    *disappears in a puff of...*
  • LeoliansBro 19 Nov 2012 13:34:03 44,957 posts
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    What? That is met with cost-of-living increases, and self-solves, same as everywhere else.

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

  • RelaxedMikki 19 Nov 2012 13:37:33 941 posts
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    @Leolian

    What would the problem be?! The problem?!!

    I don't want to live the rest of my life in a row of council houses on the edge of Macclesfield, sandwiched between a muddy patch of wasteland covered in dog shit and a grey tarmac car-park.Thankyouverymuch. Everyone else can chill the fuck out. I am going where the grass is greener...

    Greed, mate, We're all greedy. Like a pack of wild dogs ripping and the dead naked corpse of mother earth.
  • LeoliansBro 19 Nov 2012 13:39:08 44,957 posts
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    That doesn't mean anything in this context.

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

  • Deleted user 19 November 2012 13:41:33
    If there was still a problem after that point, it would be ideological. But yes, in basic terms if both sides had a fair share of the land and security that it would remain theirs forever, that would be that.
  • LeoliansBro 19 Nov 2012 13:43:20 44,957 posts
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    So we're back to the fact that, deep down, neither side actually wants a ceasefire (although international opinion forces them to say they do for political reasons).

    Everything goes in circles with this doesn't it.

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

  • Mola_Ram 19 Nov 2012 13:44:51 8,289 posts
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    There's also desire for revenge/reprisal, which I wouldn't really count as ideology. Although it can be co-opted into ideology, I suppose.
  • mcmonkeyplc 19 Nov 2012 13:45:41 39,569 posts
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    Yup, the "Watchman Solution" would work a treat.

    Shame it's never going to happen.

    :p

    Come and get it cumslingers!

  • Deleted user 19 November 2012 13:46:08
    Well, I think they want peace. I just don't think either side fundamentally believe a ceasefire is the way to get it.
  • mcmonkeyplc 19 Nov 2012 13:48:27 39,569 posts
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    How do you achieve piece without a ceasefire? Destroy the other side?!

    Come and get it cumslingers!

  • LeoliansBro 19 Nov 2012 13:49:14 44,957 posts
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    Both sides feel they are entitled to exist there without the other.

    Edit: and to an extent, both are right.

    Edited by LeoliansBro at 13:49:31 19-11-2012

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

  • senso-ji 19 Nov 2012 13:49:16 6,043 posts
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    Both sides want peace but are not willing to sacrifice anything for a two state solution. Both want Jerusalem. Both want the land Israel seized in 1967.
  • Fab4 19 Nov 2012 13:49:49 6,216 posts
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    LeoliansBro wrote:
    What? That is met with cost-of-living increases, and self-solves, same as everywhere else.
    Israel has a dodgy time already with water reserves, so any population increase would really hurt. Also, I wonder if you can guess where the aquifers for a significant chunk of their current water reserves are located?
  • Deleted user 19 November 2012 13:50:00
    It reminds me that I read somewhere that Orwell wrote Animal Farm because he got a gammy leg fighting the commies in the Spanish civil war.

    I find it funny to think this great orator and visionary thinker created his masterpiece because the cunts gave him a limp!

    Probably wrong but I like my version.
  • Fab4 19 Nov 2012 13:52:43 6,216 posts
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    bitch_tits_zero_nine wrote:
    It reminds me that I read somewhere that Orwell wrote Animal Farm because he got a gammy leg fighting the commies in the Spanish civil war.

    I find it funny to think this great orator and visionary thinker created his masterpiece because the cunts gave him a limp!

    Probably wrong but I like my version.
    Probably wrong because Orwell fought with the Marxists :D
  • LeoliansBro 19 Nov 2012 13:54:10 44,957 posts
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    Fab4 wrote:
    LeoliansBro wrote:
    What? That is met with cost-of-living increases, and self-solves, same as everywhere else.
    Israel has a dodgy time already with water reserves, so any population increase would really hurt. Also, I wonder if you can guess where the aquifers for a significant chunk of their current water reserves are located?
    Yes, but this is not a fight over fresh water.

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

  • RedSparrows 19 Nov 2012 13:55:05 24,251 posts
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    Orwell wrote Animal Farm as part of his distaste with the way socialism was led by (especially) foul people from early 1930s onwards, i.e. the party in the USSR. He fought on the left in Spain, but narrowly escaped reprisal from the hard-liners.
  • Fab4 19 Nov 2012 13:55:36 6,216 posts
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    LeoliansBro wrote:
    Fab4 wrote:
    LeoliansBro wrote:
    What? That is met with cost-of-living increases, and self-solves, same as everywhere else.
    Israel has a dodgy time already with water reserves, so any population increase would really hurt. Also, I wonder if you can guess where the aquifers for a significant chunk of their current water reserves are located?
    Yes, but this is not a fight over fresh water.
    Yeah, you are right. Its about controlling your own destiny...water helps btw ;)
  • Deleted user 19 November 2012 13:57:24
    Cheers for the correction
  • LeoliansBro 19 Nov 2012 13:57:34 44,957 posts
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    Orwell wrote Animal Farm because he was a grumpy old socialist who'd seen his idealist milk turn to gall, and decided to wallow in despressed despair ;)

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

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