The UK General Politics Thread Page 96

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  • xuiton 3 May 2013 20:14:37 297 posts
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    really? so i'm just spouting off what some politician has said or read in a tabloid?

    So there are not entire streets and estates in manchester who majority of them are on benefits bar a few families? Did I need a politician to tell me this? I wonder what party these upright citizens vote for...
  • Waffleaber 3 May 2013 20:17:43 447 posts
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    First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, and then you win.

    There is great danger in people writing UKIP off as a protest party. They are currently sat between steps two and three and outbursts like Ken Clarke's and Daily Mail-esque headlines in the media will only solidify and expand their support.

    We like to think we British are too level-headed for views like this to gain any real traction but here we are.

    What needs doing is to stop talking to UKIP about immigration and start interview them about their financial policy, international politics etc. Get them on Newsnight and ask them their opinion about Syria and the Burmese monks killing Muslims.

    Nothing kills a joke faster than taking it seriously.
  • LeoliansBro 3 May 2013 20:21:13 44,769 posts
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    UKIP are a single issue disgrace, a haven for extremist nationalists. Cunts.

    LB, you really are a massive geek.

  • mcmothercruncher 3 May 2013 20:40:50 7,563 posts
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    It's only a matter of time before the phrase "political correctness gone mad" this way comes...
  • President_Weasel 3 May 2013 21:05:42 9,607 posts
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    Goodfella wrote:
    Retroid wrote:
    xuiton wrote:
    not really immigration. was one of many things the previous government was a joke for, hardly the main factor. of course you think that though, anyone who isn't a bleeding heart liberal or criticises immigration must be a racist or closest racist in this case.
    See, you could've just said "no" without the tabloid frothing coming through.

    everything from foreign policy, to the economy, education and social policy.
    Do tell.

    I mean they have created a level of people in this country that a welfare dependant, these same people will vote labour to keep their lazy lives.
    I take it you've got evidence for this?

    Daily Mail, Express, Sun or Star stories are not evidence, by the way.

    This just reads like a 'I'm more intelligent than you' post rather than a discussion.

    Condescending, if you will.
    Well, we've moved past ignoring him. Does asking him to back up his witterings count as ridiculing him or as fighting him?
  • RobTheBuilder 3 May 2013 21:25:41 6,521 posts
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    @xuiton I didn't say I wouldn't discuss it, but I would find it very hard to take it seriously.

    Regarding benefits. People who don't work are a pain, but the number of these and the cost of these are hugely overstated. If the government hadn't allowed Vodafone not to pay their legally owed tax bill, that would have paid the entire unemployment benefit for a year with much left over.

    I've worked on benefit related business, I've seen the figures. The unemployed are used as a scapegoat to distract the middle classes from the fact that the rich get away with most of the money.

    UKIP likewise use Europe and immigration as scapegoats for policies that are based on a antiquated and racist notion of the UK as being able to stay an important country without being engaged in Europe. That's not to say it cannot be improved significantly in some areas, but outright withdrawal is such an absurdly bad idea.
  • RobTheBuilder 3 May 2013 21:30:38 6,521 posts
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    @Goodfella thank you sir!
  • Madder-Max 3 May 2013 22:00:46 11,680 posts
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    Well, if you create a vaccuum then someone or something will fill it, and the vaccuum started with labour and conservatives let it grow through ignorance.

    99 problems and being ginger is one

  • RedSparrows 3 May 2013 22:24:17 23,924 posts
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    That vacuum also exists in the electorate's understanding of most issues.

    /elitist
  • RobTheBuilder 3 May 2013 22:28:43 6,521 posts
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    @Madder-Max the vacuum is ever present, and always blamed on the previous government
  • monkehhh 3 May 2013 22:28:50 3,477 posts
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    Both parents worked in the benefit system for the vast bulk of their career, and both are very happy to be recently retired and out of the current government's setup. They were always passionate about their jobs and I remember them debating it over dinner, but now they just want out of the nastiness of the system.

    Edited by monkehhh at 22:28:58 03-05-2013
  • spamdangled 3 May 2013 22:39:13 27,427 posts
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    DaM wrote:
    RobTheBuilder wrote:
    @xuiton if the definition of 'common sense' includes the phrases 'closet racists' and 'idiotic aversion to sensible policy'.

    Ukip are common sense only for people whose opinions of politics are shaped solely by the sun or daily mail. I.e.: closet racists.
    Is that the same closet darkmorgado is in? I think the doors are well and truly wide open....

    The lurch of Southern Britain to the right can only be good news to the SNP - UKIP tend to lose deposits in Scotland.

    I appreciate that it probably makes a Labour victory more likely in 2015...but what about a Tory-UKIP coalition?

    Please tell me it's just a mid-term protest vote....
    Are you trying to imply somehow that I'm a closet racist? Because you're way off the mark if you are, trust me.

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  • spamdangled 3 May 2013 22:43:21 27,427 posts
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    xuiton wrote:
    the current government is an embarrassment, but the previous labour were even worse.
    Yeah, I really hated what they did with the minimum wage, disability discrimination, eliminating the embarrassing state of NHS waiting lists, getting rid of Section 28 and bringing in Civil Partnerships, and ending the troubles in Northern Ireland.

    Those evil bastards!

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  • spamdangled 3 May 2013 22:54:52 27,427 posts
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    xuiton wrote:
    Retroid wrote:
    xuiton wrote:
    the current government is an embarrassment
    I'd hate to see what you think a 'calamity' looks like.
    but the previous labour were even worse.
    Let me guess: immigration?
    not really immigration. was one of many things the previous government was a joke for, hardly the main factor. of course you think that though, anyone who isn't a bleeding heart liberal or criticises immigration must be a racist or closest racist in this case.

    everything from foreign policy, to the economy, education and social policy.

    I mean they have created a level of people in this country that a welfare dependant, these same people will vote labour to keep their lazy lives.
    After 5 years of economic recession and stagnation, it's not surprising so many people are out of work.

    Oh, and regarding immigration - there are more british expats living in the EU than there are foreign EU citizens living in the UK. Now, if we close the borders and send them all home, it's not unlikely other countries will do the same and send all the expats back here. So then we end up with a higher population.

    The problem being, that a large amount of those expats are retired. So they'll come back here and contribute absolutely nothing towards the economy. Immigration actually brings a net gain to the UK economy, and proportionately very few of them claim state benefits in comparison to British citizens.

    Let's look at their other "policies" - they think that we should all pay the same amount of tax as the filthy rich. They want to cut spending on the NHS and Education. Leaving the EU will also take us out of the free trade agreement, which will do untold damage to our economy as a large bulk of our income comes from exports. They want to overturn the smoking ban.

    And remember that old chestnut, the expenses scandal? The worst culprit was a UKIP MEP.

    They're a bunch of clowns and lunatics, campaigning on a single platform, with a manifesto that was arrived at on the back of a fag packet after a night out at some grubby boozer at closing time which doesn't hold up under even the slightest bit of scrutiny.

    They can't even vet their own candidates by their own admission, how anyone thinks they can honestly be trusted to form a working government is beyond me - and even they've admitted they have no chance of winning the next election. They're just picking up the protest votes. Come the next GE, they might get one or two MPs if they're extremely lucky.

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  • RobTheBuilder 3 May 2013 22:56:44 6,521 posts
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    @sajasanman yep. They have kept the false bias consistent and the papers don't help by pretending its true.

    Tories get votes because everyone likes to think of themselves as middle class (70% on last count), and they like to think that the poor aren't anything to do with them. It's lies added to incorrect perceptions added to lies...
  • spamdangled 3 May 2013 22:58:35 27,427 posts
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    DaM wrote:
    The UKIP vote, even if it doesn't translate into parliamentary seats, will drag the rest of them to the right. Not what we need at the moment.
    Very true. And not surprising that in a protracted time of hardship, the electorate moves further to the right-wing parties. Very worrying and depressing, but not surprising.

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  • RobTheBuilder 3 May 2013 23:00:42 6,521 posts
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    @darkmorgado Margaret thatcher created the welfare groups by eliminating mining and other industries without providing any support to get new jobs.

    Yes there is an argument those industries would have died anyway, but the lack of support is exactly what took hard working families and made them start to believe work didn't pay. Not to mention the idea of no society which meant that those who had struggled and paid taxes all their lives were left with next to no support and a healthcare and education system in total meltdown
  • spamdangled 3 May 2013 23:35:53 27,427 posts
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    xuiton wrote:
    darkmorgado wrote:
    RobTheBuilder wrote:
    @xuiton I hope that's sarcasm
    Sadly, I don't think it is given his history.
    xuiton - 13 forum posts.. u wot m8?
    20 Forum Posts
    402 Comments

    Edited by darkmorgado at 23:52:00 03-05-2013

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  • DaM 4 May 2013 08:09:49 13,459 posts
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    darkmorgado wrote:
    DaM wrote:
    RobTheBuilder wrote:
    @xuiton if the definition of 'common sense' includes the phrases 'closet racists' and 'idiotic aversion to sensible policy'.

    Ukip are common sense only for people whose opinions of politics are shaped solely by the sun or daily mail. I.e.: closet racists.
    Is that the same closet darkmorgado is in? I think the doors are well and truly wide open....

    The lurch of Southern Britain to the right can only be good news to the SNP - UKIP tend to lose deposits in Scotland.

    I appreciate that it probably makes a Labour victory more likely in 2015...but what about a Tory-UKIP coalition?

    Please tell me it's just a mid-term protest vote....
    Are you trying to imply somehow that I'm a closet racist? Because you're way off the mark if you are, trust me.
    No you numpty, I was just pointing out that to me UKIP are as closeted racists as you are a closeted homosexual! :)
  • RedSparrows 4 May 2013 10:46:01 23,924 posts
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    DM is not in any closet.
  • DaM 4 May 2013 11:39:05 13,459 posts
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    RedSparrows wrote:
    DM is not in any closet.
    Doh! That's the point!
  • xuiton 4 May 2013 12:25:11 297 posts
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    darkmorgado wrote:
    xuiton wrote:
    darkmorgado wrote:
    RobTheBuilder wrote:
    @xuiton I hope that's sarcasm
    Sadly, I don't think it is given his history.
    xuiton - 13 forum posts.. u wot m8?
    20 Forum Posts
    402 Comments
    LOL look at you, you went and quoted everything in this thread separately. Gotta get that post count up.

    402 comments, have you read them all? so you fail to explain given my history. Of course if I had a history of posting in the forums, it would make more sense, try again.
  • Retroid Moderator 4 May 2013 12:28:36 45,284 posts
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    Goodfella wrote:
    Retroid wrote:
    This just reads like a 'I'm more intelligent than you' post rather than a discussion.

    Condescending, if you will.
    So asking for evidence is condescending?

    I thought the "UKIP" + "common sense" = "terrible fuckwit" might've given it away already.

    Edited by Retroid at 12:45:18 04-05-2013
  • MrTomFTW Moderator 4 May 2013 12:41:51 39,406 posts
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    How very British it is that the UKIP, a party full of middle-class white racists, is considered the "anti-establishment" vote. Ho-hum.

    Follow me on Twitter: @MrTom
    Voted by the community "Best mod" 2011, 2012 and 2013.

  • MrTomFTW Moderator 4 May 2013 12:43:57 39,406 posts
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    Hah, otto just retweeted this:

    Follow me on Twitter: @MrTom
    Voted by the community "Best mod" 2011, 2012 and 2013.

  • Retroid Moderator 4 May 2013 12:51:35 45,284 posts
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    MrTomFTW wrote:
    Hah, otto just retweeted this:

    That's a perfect summary. It really is.
  • RobTheBuilder 4 May 2013 13:37:11 6,521 posts
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    UKIP will have her in charge of negotiating EU fishing subsidies...
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