The all-new Premier League thread Page 3644

  • Page

    of 5619 First / Last

  • Blakester 22 May 2013 14:06:17 3,652 posts
    Seen 27 minutes ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    Commander Keen wrote:
    @The-Bodybuilder Has he even tried though?

    Not being funny, but I really don't buy this idea that players are one-trick ponies in the top flight. Most of the players will have come up through academies and played for various U16-21 international teams. They will have been coached and taught for years how to play different formations, tactics, and styles of football.

    I'm not going to deny that Carroll probably excels at a certain style and that's not Rodgers' preferred style, but to ship him off unceremoniously when you've got no cover and no real plan B seems silly, but there we go!

    I'm going to stop repeating myself now!
    Having watched him play at Liverpool, the one thing Carroll lacks (and it is debatable if he'll ever have it) is a decent touch.

    If I can see that from the stands, then I imagine Rodgers was able to see it in training.

    If your system is based on possession, then that's a bit of an issue.

    When you can't see the angles on the wall you're in trouble.

  • LionheartDJH 22 May 2013 14:18:11 19,525 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 5 years ago
    Commander Keen wrote:
    Can any Pool fans on here shed any light on why Brenden Rodgers seems so keen to get rid of Andy Carroll? I mean the player would offer something different to Suarez up front and it's not like Liverpool are blessed with an abundance of options there.

    Also, the guy seems to genuinely want to do well for Liverpool but hasn't even been given any sort of chance whatsoever.

    He's obviously not a 35m player, but it seems really odd that Rodgers decided he was going to get rid without even trying. Like he made the decision first, and basically is justifying it to himself ever since...

    Do most of you guys agree with this, or would you like to see him given a chance? Genuinely curious.
    BR likes his pass and move technical football, Carroll is obviously more in the lump it up to the big man category, so he can't be as effective within the system as the smalller technical forwards.

    I agree it did seem he had made his mind up about Carroll fairly early on, he ideally wanted to sell him last summer but a loan was the only option on the table. It was a bit of an issue when Borini was injured and Suarez was our only real forward, but the loan gave him the chance to play with less pressure and put himself in the shop window again, which he has done pretty well.

    I like Carroll and I feel bad that we have stunted him as a player due to the ridiculous fee we paid for him and the weight of pressure and expectation attached to it. I think he could be a decent plan B, but his wages aren't insignificant and he would grow frustrated being on the bench regularly given he has been in the first team at WHU.

    I doubt we'll ever get more for him than we will at this moment in time, so combined with the other factors it makes sense to cut our losses, claw back some cash for him to reinvest in another player and finally cut him loose of the weight of that fee hanging around his neck.

    She dives for cheese pasties

  • Deleted user 22 May 2013 15:03:01
    Heh, his demeanour has a touch of the cult leader about it.
  • Dougs 22 May 2013 15:24:26 69,079 posts
    Seen 25 minutes ago
    Registered 12 years ago
    leader, Leader....
  • Jono62 22 May 2013 16:31:43 14,273 posts
    Seen 16 minutes ago
    Registered 6 years ago
    Petrov takes on new role as assistant development coach

    Good stuff.
  • The-Bodybuilder 22 May 2013 17:42:34 14,395 posts
    Seen 16 hours ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    @Commander Keen

    Yeah, I already made the point about the cover. Basically the board gave him the go ahead to sell because they gave him the impression they were working on getting Dempsey in. Then they dropped the ball, leaving Rogers to look like a muppet (even more so).

    As for the comment about being taught for years how to play different formations, tactics and styles? LOOOOOOOOOOL. :D

    You're talking about the English Academy system, right? That's still stuck in its 80s-90s old-boys clique and coaching mentality? It's only recently (and from a handful of clubs) that more technical players are coming out. Carroll sadly is from the English past.

    If anything, under the conditions that you think the academy system is in, it's even less likely Carroll would've made it this far.

    Edit: Out of interest, seeing as Carroll's from the Newcastle academy, are NUFC known for developing great technical young players? Especially recently?

    Maybe one of the N.United fans can fill me in.

    Edited by The-Bodybuilder at 18:23:09 22-05-2013
  • The-Bodybuilder 22 May 2013 18:21:50 14,395 posts
    Seen 16 hours ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    Blakester wrote:
    Commander Keen wrote:
    @The-Bodybuilder Has he even tried though?

    Not being funny, but I really don't buy this idea that players are one-trick ponies in the top flight. Most of the players will have come up through academies and played for various U16-21 international teams. They will have been coached and taught for years how to play different formations, tactics, and styles of football.

    I'm not going to deny that Carroll probably excels at a certain style and that's not Rodgers' preferred style, but to ship him off unceremoniously when you've got no cover and no real plan B seems silly, but there we go!

    I'm going to stop repeating myself now!
    Having watched him play at Liverpool, the one thing Carroll lacks (and it is debatable if he'll ever have it) is a decent touch.

    If I can see that from the stands, then I imagine Rodgers was able to see it in training.

    If your system is based on possession, then that's a bit of an issue.
    It's dreadful for us having to see the ball just bounce off his shins like some sort of inanimate carbon rod, so imagine being Rogers and having to watch that every morning.

    Sure one could argue he made up his mind before giving him a try, but coming from an Arsenal fan who's seen Wenger persist with the likes of Denilson (and now Gervinho), sometimes you just gotta go with that gut feeling and that knowledge which you know is true from the get go.

    We can all discuss whether he should've given him more of a chance, but at the end of they day Rogers doesn't believe he can play tikki-takka on the floor.

    And he's right.
  • President_Weasel 22 May 2013 18:56:14 9,603 posts
    Seen 39 minutes ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    And he's a Premiership manager with opposition scouts and plenty of access to video footage. Carroll wasn't playing behind closed doors in North Korea before Brendan joined Liverpool, the ball was pinging off his shins for months when he was playing for Kenny.

    I'll admit Kenny seemed a bit wandered at the end, so it's just possible Carroll is the Iniesta of the North, with amazing technical abilities that Kenny had deliberately instructed him to hide as part of some master plan - but it's a lot more likely that he spent game after game failing to trap the ball or cushion a pass because he can't.
  • Ultrasoundwave 22 May 2013 19:11:53 3,398 posts
    Seen 28 minutes ago
    Registered 4 years ago
    Shikasama wrote:
    Imagine if Rogers actually tried to train him for a bit.
    This is the thing i dont understand - a lot of people have a misconception about Big Andy that he's just a big lump that you knock the ball up to. Anyone who's actually seen the boy play will know that he's excellent with the ball at his feet and can score goals from anywhere.

    Yes, his heading ability is his main strength (i'd argue he's the best in Europe in the air) and he should be played to his strengths, but he's actually a half tidy footballer too.

    Someone should tell Brendan......

    "The worst part is, I'll have to have the break-up sex with myself!"

  • President_Weasel 22 May 2013 19:48:03 9,603 posts
    Seen 39 minutes ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    Ultrasoundwave wrote:
    Shikasama wrote:
    Imagine if Rogers actually tried to train him for a bit.
    This is the thing i dont understand - a lot of people have a misconception about Big Andy that he's just a big lump that you knock the ball up to. Anyone who's actually seen the boy play will know that he's excellent with the ball at his feet and can score goals from anywhere.

    Yes, his heading ability is his main strength (i'd argue he's the best in Europe in the air) and he should be played to his strengths, but he's actually a half tidy footballer too.

    Someone should tell Brendan......
    You're mad. Quite, quite, mad. Get help.
  • RobTheBuilder 22 May 2013 19:51:15 6,521 posts
    Seen 1 year ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    @The-Bodybuilder all hail the inanimate carbon rod, employee of the week
  • Commander-Keen 22 May 2013 19:59:50 834 posts
    Seen 24 minutes ago
    Registered 11 years ago
    @The-Bodybuilder Woah woah woah!

    Did you just call me an ARSENAL FAN?!?!
  • Dougs 22 May 2013 20:15:32 69,079 posts
    Seen 25 minutes ago
    Registered 12 years ago
    Nah, he's talking about himself!
  • prawnking1980 22 May 2013 20:29:59 4,990 posts
    Seen 3 seconds ago
    Registered 4 years ago
    Commander keen happy to be called anything but an arsenal fan
  • The-Bodybuilder 23 May 2013 00:13:09 14,395 posts
    Seen 16 hours ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    I thought it was obvious I was talking about myself.
    And is Ultrasoundwave genuinely trying to claim Carroll is "excellent" with his feet and the best on the air.....IN EUROPE?
  • Syrette 23 May 2013 00:20:13 44,098 posts
    Seen 47 minutes ago
    Registered 12 years ago
    Rodgers.

    Not Rogers.

  • teamHAM 23 May 2013 09:45:57 3,116 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    So it looks like Pardew is staying then. It's all backslapping and smiles it seems after the end of season review at SJP, and our learned owner has decided AP is the man to take us forward (or as the case may be, backward).

    Let the mass exodus begin.

    Edited by teamHAM at 10:03:36 23-05-2013

    XBox Live, Origin, PSN and Steam: teamHAM

  • 4gate 23 May 2013 09:47:22 362 posts
    Seen 1 year ago
    Registered 3 years ago
    Brian Greenhoff died yesterday :( Saw him several times for United, can't really remember how good he was but my dad never shouted at him so must have been doing something right - RIP dude.
  • TheSaint 23 May 2013 09:52:51 14,721 posts
    Seen 32 seconds ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22596125

    Interesting analysis of Lawro's predictions from Radio 4's more or less.
  • Deleted user 23 May 2013 10:02:11
    @TheSaint - yeah I saw that yesterday. He's quite on the money for the top teams but his overestimation of QPR is rather amusing.

    I don't think the bookies will be losing any sleep over the findings ;)
  • TheSaint 23 May 2013 10:04:51 14,721 posts
    Seen 32 seconds ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    QPR in 8th and Swansea third from bottom are particular shockers. Also interesting that he hardly ever predicts teams to score three or more.
  • TheSaint 23 May 2013 10:07:31 14,721 posts
    Seen 32 seconds ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    Also Stoke topped at least one table this season:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4938214/Premier-League-long-ball-kings-not-Stoke.html#ixzz2U2DMthF1
  • nickthegun 23 May 2013 10:08:31 61,057 posts
    Seen 3 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    To be fair its not a one off prediction, its week by week and QPR went through a period of 'showed promise, maybe next week' before they finally capitulated.

    ---------------------------------------------------------
    My man gives real loving that's why I call him Killer
    He's not a wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am, he's a thriller

  • mcmonkeyplc 23 May 2013 10:22:45 39,515 posts
    Seen 21 hours ago
    Registered 12 years ago
    Hey guys,

    CHAMPIONS

    Thanks

    Come and get it cumslingers!

  • teamHAM 23 May 2013 10:24:51 3,116 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    TheSaint wrote:
    Also Stoke topped at least one table this season:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4938214/Premier-League-long-ball-kings-not-Stoke.html#ixzz2U2DMthF1
    Unless I'm missing something, Newcastle are top of that table, not Stoke ;)

    XBox Live, Origin, PSN and Steam: teamHAM

  • Deleted user 23 May 2013 10:25:02
    Speaking of Champions, it's the CL final on Saturday, yay more footie \o/
  • TheSaint 23 May 2013 10:29:01 14,721 posts
    Seen 32 seconds ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    teamHAM wrote:
    TheSaint wrote:
    Also Stoke topped at least one table this season:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4938214/Premier-League-long-ball-kings-not-Stoke.html#ixzz2U2DMthF1
    Unless I'm missing something, Newcastle are top of that table, not Stoke ;)
    Stoke topped the percentage but Newcastle topped the actual number.
  • Widge Moderator 23 May 2013 10:52:22 13,728 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    President_Weasel wrote:
    Iniesta of the North
    :)

    _ _ _

    www.inverted-audio.com

  • nickthegun 23 May 2013 10:55:51 61,057 posts
    Seen 3 minutes ago
    Registered 9 years ago
    TheSaint wrote:
    teamHAM wrote:
    TheSaint wrote:
    Also Stoke topped at least one table this season:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4938214/Premier-League-long-ball-kings-not-Stoke.html#ixzz2U2DMthF1
    Unless I'm missing something, Newcastle are top of that table, not Stoke ;)
    Stoke topped the percentage but Newcastle topped the actual number.
    At least they actually tried going forward. For stoke to have a higher percentage but lower attempts is pathetic.

    ---------------------------------------------------------
    My man gives real loving that's why I call him Killer
    He's not a wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am, he's a thriller

  • teamHAM 23 May 2013 12:07:36 3,116 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    I read an article the other day about Pulis and it said Stoke had the third highest net spend in the league over the past 5 seasons combined at 80m.

    If that's true then it's incredible he's kept his job for so long.

    XBox Live, Origin, PSN and Steam: teamHAM

  • Page

    of 5619 First / Last

Log in or register to reply