The all-new Premier League thread Page 3355

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  • Deleted user 20 March 2013 11:50:03
    It's very hard to quantify value to the club as they're not directly comparable, but it seems to me that the value in monetary terms that the likes of Fergie and Mourinho bring is very much comparable with Ronaldo and Rooney, if not more so, as there's a whole ipso facto thing with these players wanting to play for these managers in the first place.
  • kentmonkey 20 Mar 2013 11:56:02 21,755 posts
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    Ooh, I agreed with Shik. Now I agree with kalel. Keep debating - this is good.
  • Mr_Sleep 20 Mar 2013 11:57:48 20,146 posts
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    kentmonkey wrote:
    Ooh, I agreed with Shik. Now I agree with kalel. Keep debating - this is good.
    Clearly I mean nothing to you! /huff
  • nickthegun 20 Mar 2013 11:58:52 67,641 posts
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    Its also one of the reasons why everton, despite being one of the 'poorer' premiership teams have made moyes one of the best paid managers in the league. Hes arguably their most valuable asset.
  • kentmonkey 20 Mar 2013 12:21:15 21,755 posts
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    Mr_Sleep wrote:
    kentmonkey wrote:
    Ooh, I agreed with Shik. Now I agree with kalel. Keep debating - this is good.
    Clearly I mean nothing to you! /huff
    I thought it went without saying that I agreed with you, as your point was so well made.

    (how did I do?)
  • Mr_Sleep 20 Mar 2013 12:30:20 20,146 posts
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    kentmonkey wrote:
    Mr_Sleep wrote:
    kentmonkey wrote:
    Ooh, I agreed with Shik. Now I agree with kalel. Keep debating - this is good.
    Clearly I mean nothing to you! /huff
    I thought it went without saying that I agreed with you, as your point was so well made.

    (how did I do?)
    I am appeased.
  • kentmonkey 20 Mar 2013 12:32:28 21,755 posts
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    \o/
  • nickthegun 20 Mar 2013 12:44:18 67,641 posts
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    To repeat a stat, Abromovic has spent more on managers than Everton have spent on players (net) since the start of the premier league.
  • kentmonkey 20 Mar 2013 12:44:47 21,755 posts
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    Liverpool are the best team in the world. Rodgers isn't high profile.

    ;o)
  • Deleted user 20 March 2013 12:46:41
    Hmmmmm, surely Chelsea is a good example of my point? In retrospect Mourinho was actually far more important to their success (particularly their financial success) than any of their big money players, particularly when you consider the likes of Torres and Shevchenko. In terms of worth, Chelsea demonstrate manager>players no?

    I suppose the comparatively lower paid Di Matteo and his CL trophy potentially scuppers that theory, but that's obviously an anomaly.
  • THFourteen 20 Mar 2013 12:47:51 40,888 posts
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    nickthegun wrote:
    To repeat a stat, Abromovic has spent more on managers than Everton have spent on players (net) since the start of the premier league.
    yeah but i reckon i've spent more on pies than Everton have spent on players in the last 20 years.
  • graysonavich 20 Mar 2013 12:54:34 8,202 posts
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    Aston Villa have more points in Premiership history than Everton have spent on Abromovics pies.
  • kentmonkey 20 Mar 2013 13:00:27 21,755 posts
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    In terms of numbers, nickthegun's forum post count is higher than Everton's average attendance figures.

    Boom. Thread ends.
  • Mr_Sleep 20 Mar 2013 13:04:39 20,146 posts
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    I think you'll find the stat is that Aston Villa and Everton, since the start of the league, have consumed more pies than any other top flight club.
  • THFourteen 20 Mar 2013 13:05:50 40,888 posts
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    Spurs have eaten more humble pies than any other team in the league.
  • kentmonkey 20 Mar 2013 13:06:51 21,755 posts
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    Spurs' allergy to Lasagne is more severe than any other team in the Premier League.
  • Deleted user 20 March 2013 13:30:32
    But the fee you can sell for is negated by the fee you pay in the first place in many cases. Sometimes in fact you make a huge loss on a player (again, Chelsea are a great example).
  • Deleted user 20 March 2013 13:38:09
    Possibly, although as per your point about how some clubs have enough prestige to attract big players whatever manager they have, you could argue something similar about clubs getting sponsorship.

    To be honest I think we might be arguing around not much as the fees these managers get does actually seem to be line with most players. It's more that some players get paid far too much (Rooney) and some appear to be getting paid too little (Fergie).
  • Deleted user 20 March 2013 15:26:15
    \o/
  • Dougs 20 Mar 2013 15:30:41 78,323 posts
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    Yeah, that was rubbish. Being the interlull ( Arseblog), there's not much else to talk about though.
  • Mr_Sleep 20 Mar 2013 15:47:34 20,146 posts
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    Shikasama wrote:
    Yeah I'm finding it tough to get my feelings about it to make any sort of coherent sense.

    On one hand I believe that manager should be the highest salaried individual at the club because they have (ostensibly) the most influence and should be the biggest factor between success and failure.
    This would absolutely be true if football wasn't about the product and the product is largely the players. While success stems from the manager, the shirt sales, sponsorship and fame on the world stage of the club comes a great deal from the players. There are exceptions to this such as Mourinho, of course. As I say, shirt sales is massive, the amount that Beckham netted Man Utd is probably nowhere near what they paid him in wages.

    Football is more like having the talent in a business being the most important thing rather than the CEO. Yet the CEO gets treated like any other business, in that he gets sacked when things go wrong and the players hide away.
  • Deleted user 20 March 2013 15:53:40
    I remember reading somewhere that the whole shirt sales thing is a slight myth, or at least significantly overplayed, but I can't find any numbers to back it up.

    And that goes double for what I'm about to say, as this is really just a gut feeling that I can't support with numbers, but I strongly suspect that Man U's massive revenue over the last twenty years has had more to do with the success Fergie has brought them than anything else. I really do find it very surprising how low is salary is comparatively. And yes, it may well be supplemented with bonuses but still, I'm sure everyone else gets those also.
  • Mr_Sleep 20 Mar 2013 16:09:24 20,146 posts
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    kalel wrote:
    I remember reading somewhere that the whole shirt sales thing is a slight myth, or at least significantly overplayed, but I can't find any numbers to back it up.

    I'm sure it is a myth in regards of Ronaldo paying back the 80 million in shirt sales but if one considers the cost of production versus how much the retail is then I think it's logical to assume there's huge profit there and a large slice goes directly to the club and some to the player. I'm happy to be proved wrong.


    And that goes double for what I'm about to say, as this is really just a gut feeling that I can't support with numbers, but I strongly suspect that Man U's massive revenue over the last twenty years has had more to do with the success Fergie has brought them than anything else. I really do find it very surprising how low is salary is comparatively. And yes, it may well be supplemented with bonuses but still, I'm sure everyone else gets those also.
    I actually entirely agree that Fergie doesn't get paid enough for his contribution but his longevity has seen him be paid a very handsome sum, even if he's probably wasted it all on the horses and cheap wine. Not that means he doesn't deserve parity either. Saying that, presumably one pays a larger rate to protect the employment of that person as the manager, yet Fergie is never going to manage another club so you don't have to worry about another club coming in and tapping him up.
  • Mr_Sleep 20 Mar 2013 16:13:56 20,146 posts
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    Shikasama wrote:
    Mr_Sleep wrote:
    Football is more like having the talent in a business being the most important thing rather than the CEO. Yet the CEO gets treated like any other business, in that he gets sacked when things go wrong and the players hide away.
    I pretty much agree with everything you just said although the abve scenario is not too unusual. Having worked in sales for a few years I comfortably earned more than my bosses in commission and stuff. It's the same in banks and shit as well I think.

    Not to detract from the actual point you were making though, I'm just bored.
    Well it's not a bad situation I suppose, the money going to the people who actually do the work and bring in the revenue is probably the way it should be, to some degree.
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