The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim Page 273

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  • ecu 29 Nov 2011 23:05:18 77,307 posts
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    Pinky_Floyd wrote:
    mikeck wrote:
    So my loading times have gotten longer, and I've just had my first system crash for Skyrim...

    ...great PS3 patch Bethesda, thanks for that.

    My PS3 has only ever crashed with Bethesda games, first Fallout 3, then New Vegas, and now it looks like Skyrim is going to start doing the same. Groan :(
    I'm averaging 1 hard lock per 10 hours play on the 360. 30 hours played in total. I wonder how many freezes were reported at qa yet never fixed given the hundreds of hours that would have gone into testing.

    I dont doubt for one second that most of the bugs in the game were already on a defect management list somewhere in Beth QA.  Makes me think that they must have spent their time fixing some real corkers to have to pass over some of what has been found.

    At the end of the day its a business decision to release a game, its never a QA decision, many folk would do well to remember that when harping on about the supposed lack of QA.

    Blame the men in suits who were presented with a full list of defects and decided to release anyway and spare a thought for the frustrations of the QA guys who are hampered at every turn, usually by people who feel that testing isn't really THAT important and that money is better spent elsewhere, perhaps in marketing.

    /sticks up for the little guy
    I wouldn't even blame the suits. Games are going to have bugs, and the bigger the game, and the more freedom and options it offers, the more bugs it's going to have. I've worked QA on one game, I won't say which, but it was nothing like an open world game like this and was a much smaller, more focused experience, and yet we reported system locks which were never fixed. There has to be a point where they release the game. They could spend the next 12 months trying to fix all the bugs in Skyrim, and still not get them all. My experience of QA was all about repro rates, and unless you can reproduce the bug, it's really hard to nail down the cause of the crash and then fix it. Late in development, most of the consistent crashes had been fixed, but people were still getting crashes here and there but they could never reproduce them. I worked through my break on a few occasions just trying to reproduce a bug, but sometimes you know it's never going to happen.

    FWIW, Skyrim has crashed once for me in about 150 hours on the 360. The idea of working as a tester on a game like Skyrim is utterly daunting to me.
  • Pinky_Floyd 29 Nov 2011 23:10:21 8,309 posts
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    ecureuil wrote:
    Pinky_Floyd wrote:
    mikeck wrote:
    So my loading times have gotten longer, and I've just had my first system crash for Skyrim...

    ...great PS3 patch Bethesda, thanks for that.

    My PS3 has only ever crashed with Bethesda games, first Fallout 3, then New Vegas, and now it looks like Skyrim is going to start doing the same. Groan :(
    I'm averaging 1 hard lock per 10 hours play on the 360. 30 hours played in total. I wonder how many freezes were reported at qa yet never fixed given the hundreds of hours that would have gone into testing.

    I dont doubt for one second that most of the bugs in the game were already on a defect management list somewhere in Beth QA.  Makes me think that they must have spent their time fixing some real corkers to have to pass over some of what has been found.

    At the end of the day its a business decision to release a game, its never a QA decision, many folk would do well to remember that when harping on about the supposed lack of QA.

    Blame the men in suits who were presented with a full list of defects and decided to release anyway and spare a thought for the frustrations of the QA guys who are hampered at every turn, usually by people who feel that testing isn't really THAT important and that money is better spent elsewhere, perhaps in marketing.

    /sticks up for the little guy
    I wouldn't even blame the suits. Games are going to have bugs, and the bigger the game, and the more freedom and options it offers, the more bugs it's going to have. I've worked QA on one game, I won't say which, but it was nothing like an open world game like this and was a much smaller, more focused experience, and yet we reported system locks which were never fixed. There has to be a point where they release the game. They could spend the next 12 months trying to fix all the bugs in Skyrim, and still not get them all. My experience of QA was all about repro rates, and unless you can reproduce the bug, it's really hard to nail down the cause of the crash and then fix it. Late in development, most of the consistent crashes had been fixed, but people were still getting crashes here and there but they could never reproduce them. I worked through my break on a few occasions just trying to reproduce a bug, but sometimes you know it's never going to happen.

    FWIW, Skyrim has crashed once for me in about 150 hours on the 360. The idea of working as a tester on a game like Skyrim is utterly daunting to me.
    Yeah you are right of course but the point I was trying to make is that ultimately it comes down to a business decision to release.

    I do work in software QA, but not games. I was offered a post with Realtime Worlds but it would have meant moving country so in the end I declined. I also wasn't that fussed on the hobby becoming my day job either I have to be honest. RIP RTW.
  • skuzzbag 29 Nov 2011 23:15:30 5,715 posts
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    Watched two wolves attack a couple of giants tonight. After a brief fight one of the wolves was punted directly upwards and vanished into the sky like a rocket never to return.

    Most amusing!
  • Pinky_Floyd 29 Nov 2011 23:25:58 8,309 posts
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    Managed to get the 360 version frame rate into single figures earlier. A dragon crash landed 100 feet in front of me and ploughed a huge furrow in the earth as it sped towards me, kicking up dust and smoke. It stopped just in front of me but by then it was like a very slow flicker book. I was suitably impressed to see the frame rate go so low. It recovered just in time for me to fireball the dragon up its arse.

    Edited by Pinky_Floyd at 23:26:15 29-11-2011
  • shamblemonkee 29 Nov 2011 23:38:04 14,652 posts
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    I've only had 2 hard crashes in over 100hrs of play.. given the complexity of the game and the fact that both were on loading screens where it had saved right before them... i'm not to fussed.
  • crashVoodoo 29 Nov 2011 23:51:40 4,012 posts
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    I've just started in the thieves guild and I've just decided a bit of light fingered discount is the best thing ever. I've just wandered back to whiterun and went into the apothecary and just emptied it. Pots, pans plants you name it.  It was bare when I walked out.

    Gonna head back over first thing tomorrow morning and see if she's noticed :-)

    a Nexus a day keeps the apple away

  • MrE26 29 Nov 2011 23:52:02 1,979 posts
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    I've had the Dawnstar 'Waking Nightmare' quest bug, a Dark Brotherhood quest freeze (that's apparently fairly common & took a few reloads to get past) & a couple of hard locks on loading screens. That's about it for 110+ hours play though.

    I did come across a guy i'd done a quest in Riften for earlier standing outside Whiterun with a clone of himself half sticking out of the ground. Odd sight. Went back earlier today & there are now 5 of him, all standing round in a group.
  • JoeBlade 29 Nov 2011 23:53:19 2,630 posts
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    Gah, first hirelings, then the dark brotherhood and now even justiciars are out to kill me.
    Someone very wealthy indeed must want me dead. I suspect they're in cahoots with the dragons.

    And I must say levelling does become a lot slower once past level 30. Time to spend that mountain of septims I've amassed on a bit of skill training :)
  • StixxUK 29 Nov 2011 23:54:09 7,287 posts
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    Getting stuck in now. Read a whole book today (it was much longer than I'd expected, and if I'd known how long it would be then I'd never have picked it up).

    The amount of lore to the game world is really incredible. I have started to wonder if there's any point to cooking, tanning, smithing etc. Food seems to do pretty much fuck all in terms of healing, much better with potions or magic.

    Even if there is a lot of useless crap in the world, I guess the fact that it's there makes it more of a believable world. Stunning game, for sure.
  • ecu 30 Nov 2011 00:03:29 77,307 posts
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    Haven't cooked much, but smithing is a very useful skill.
  • JoeBlade 30 Nov 2011 00:06:35 2,630 posts
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    StixxUK wrote:
    I have started to wonder if there's any point to cooking, tanning, smithing etc.
    Cooking struck me mostly as a low-level form of healing, for when potions are rare and expensive and you're not yet proficient enough to make your own. Foodstuffs tends to be top heavy though.

    Smithing and by extension tanning is well worth it for anyone frequently getting involved in melee combat or to make a bit of cash on the side. Not a must by any means but the extra protection and damage does add up nicely, as do the coins.
  • Peew971 30 Nov 2011 00:26:56 5,323 posts
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    I bought a spell for summoning a Dremora Lord or some name like that. He's so powerful he almost makes things too easy. If I had higher Conjuration skills (he sucks up all my Magicka) this would be a walk in the park.

    XBL: Shadow Thi3f

  • ecu 30 Nov 2011 00:34:11 77,307 posts
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    Did anyone else realise that you can pull the 3rd person camera back in the console version? Just hold left stick and move the right stick up and down to move the camera back. Needs to be default controls, though you can change them back once you've set it how you like. 3rd person is way too close for me normally, but plays quite well from a little further away.
  • Mr-Brett 30 Nov 2011 00:59:37 12,887 posts
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    Managed to get my armour rating up to 907 with enchanted clothes, bracers, ring, necklace plus level 100 smithing and most of the heavy armour perks.

    Level 37 Social Justice Warrior

  • caesar_ 30 Nov 2011 01:05:43 75 posts
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    Well I've made it to 130 hours now, I think I'll leave it and play Dark Souls over the xmas holiday. Hopefully there will be some juicy DLC in 2 - 3 months so I come back to it eager and fresh again.

    Brilliant game.
  • ModishNouns 30 Nov 2011 01:30:09 4,664 posts
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    I FOUND MY DAGGER!

    I went back down into Snow Veil Catacombs and there it is in the middle of the floor in one of the rooms :-)

    /dances
  • Articulate-Troll 30 Nov 2011 01:32:52 3,101 posts
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    Does anyone else find the economy becomes quite unbalanced the more you play? I've found I get most of my useful items as quest rewards, or by scavenging loot, not by buying items from merchants. As a result, I have about 65000 unused gold pieces. I have a horse and 2 houses, so there's really else to spend money on.

    Oblivion had the same problem. Once you reach a certain level, the merchants stop stocking items of any real value.
  • Xardan 30 Nov 2011 01:38:23 717 posts
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    Be careful, you can lose some stuff in some of the bought houses. If you leave stuff lying on the floor sometimes upon re-entry it can warp off through the floor or something. Also the weapon and shield displays eat my daggers. Also lost some books from the bookshelf.

    If the game saves the location of your dropped item before sending it flying through the floor you should be alright. Just remember the player houses have not been play tested much. Just like most of the game huh?

    All in all unstable buggy glitchy game is not fit for release. But hey! As long as reviews dont count bugs as an issue why should the devs care? They can just patch it after release...

    “You are what you write.”

  • ModishNouns 30 Nov 2011 02:13:26 4,664 posts
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    Oh for fuck's sake.
  • onestepfromlost 30 Nov 2011 05:16:02 2,117 posts
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    Tryhard wrote:
    My light armoured Kajiit has been running around in silence and poison area
    ebony armour.

    It is funny to send an arrow into someone.And they come running right up next to my hidden Kajiit.And the poison makes them go argh,whose there.They are
    just frozen in confusion looking and dying slowly a few feet away.

    Only high level magic users figure out what is going on.
    Poison area?
    where did you get that from? havnt even seen it listed on the wiki
  • Deleted user 30 November 2011 05:44:16
    A buddy of my has had his main quest break (360 version) 50 or so hours in. The next guy he needs to talk to won't talk to him but rather just says a few different lines of flavour-dialogue any time he clicks on him.

    He is not best pleased and has decided to just do sidequests and hope a patch fixes it at a later date instead of ploughing another 50ish hours in.
  • Ziz0u 30 Nov 2011 08:43:57 8,647 posts
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    Hindle wrote:
    Anyone know any level glitches? I've done most of the guilds yet I'm still only level 30.
    There's the followers training exploit:

    Go to the Companions for example, and take any of them with a skill to teach on as a follower. Tell them you need training and do it till you're blue in the face/out of money. Then tell them you need to trade equipment, and take your money back from their inventory! Rinse & repeat.

    I did it once but felt guilty/worried that it would unbalance the game cause you level up really quickly doing it!
  • Lexx87 30 Nov 2011 09:11:11 20,863 posts
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    Pinky_Floyd wrote:
    Managed to get the 360 version frame rate into single figures earlier. A dragon crash landed 100 feet in front of me and ploughed a huge furrow in the earth as it sped towards me, kicking up dust and smoke. It stopped just in front of me but by then it was like a very slow flicker book. I was suitably impressed to see the frame rate go so low. It recovered just in time for me to fireball the dragon up its arse.
    I ressurecrted a Chaurus Reaver who tried to follow me down a small tunnel but couldn't fit and kept clipping into the walls. Framerate died instantly and I couldn't move until the resuurection spell wore off.

    Speak the truth hussy!

  • Kew1Melon 30 Nov 2011 09:16:37 477 posts
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    @MrE26 - ...They're Coming!

    You have an imagination barrier.

  • Kew1Melon 30 Nov 2011 09:18:56 477 posts
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    Xardan wrote:
    Be careful, you can lose some stuff in some of the bought houses. If you leave stuff lying on the floor sometimes upon re-entry it can warp off through the floor or something. Also the weapon and shield displays eat my daggers. Also lost some books from the bookshelf.

    If the game saves the location of your dropped item before sending it flying through the floor you should be alright. Just remember the player houses have not been play tested much. Just like most of the game huh?

    All in all unstable buggy glitchy game is not fit for release. But hey! As long as reviews dont count bugs as an issue why should the devs care? They can just patch it after release...
    So because few crashes your saying the game shouldnt be out, just do what i do. Ignore them, the problems are going to be there... The games huge! Just deal with it and enjoy it.

    Edited by Kew1Melon at 09:20:19 30-11-2011

    You have an imagination barrier.

  • Zerobob 30 Nov 2011 09:24:22 1,618 posts
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    Sooooo, any morning PC / X360 players got the patch yet?

    I'm hoping it will be there when I'm home from work today so I can finally install the game to the HDD.
  • Alastair 30 Nov 2011 09:26:01 16,403 posts
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    I am probably way behind the curve of everyone else, but I'm struggling occasionaly with higher powered mages. I'm playing a 'sneak with bow' style and can take most single enemies down with one or maybe two shots. (Level 17 Wood Elf, Sneak~50, Archery~40) But the higher levels mages tend to be a bit tricky with their shield/protection spells and fireballs.
    How do others cope?
    Could it be because I haven't even got my first dragon soul yet so can't use any shouts...
  • Kew1Melon 30 Nov 2011 09:29:40 477 posts
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    Alastair wrote:
    I am probably way behind the curve of everyone else, but I'm struggling occasionaly with higher powered mages. I'm playing a 'sneak with bow' style and can take most single enemies down with one or maybe two shots. (Level 17 Wood Elf, Sneak~50, Archery~40) But the higher levels mages tend to be a bit tricky with their shield/protection spells and fireballs.
    How do others cope?
    Could it be because I haven't even got my first dragon soul yet so can't use any shouts...
    Shouts at first arent that good IMO, have you tried getting Conjuration up? Summon a monster to fight for you (or reanimate a corpse) and they take all attention while you rain the arrows down on them. Also always poisen your arrows helps so much!

    You have an imagination barrier.

  • mikeck 30 Nov 2011 09:42:57 1,936 posts
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    Pinky_Floyd wrote:
    mikeck wrote:
    So my loading times have gotten longer, and I've just had my first system crash for Skyrim...

    ...great PS3 patch Bethesda, thanks for that.

    My PS3 has only ever crashed with Bethesda games, first Fallout 3, then New Vegas, and now it looks like Skyrim is going to start doing the same. Groan :(
    I'm averaging 1 hard lock per 10 hours play on the 360. 30 hours played in total. I wonder how many freezes were reported at qa yet never fixed given the hundreds of hours that would have gone into testing.

    I dont doubt for one second that most of the bugs in the game were already on a defect management list somewhere in Beth QA.  Makes me think that they must have spent their time fixing some real corkers to have to pass over some of what has been found.

    At the end of the day its a business decision to release a game, its never a QA decision, many folk would do well to remember that when harping on about the supposed lack of QA.

    Blame the men in suits who were presented with a full list of defects and decided to release anyway and spare a thought for the frustrations of the QA guys who are hampered at every turn, usually by people who feel that testing isn't really THAT important and that money is better spent elsewhere, perhaps in marketing.

    /sticks up for the little guy
    Where did I point the finger at QA? I fully agree with what you've said, but I didn't accuse one particular department - working for a mid-tier publisher myself, I know better than to do this :)

    Though, it still doesn't mean as a consumer that I'm not entitled to have a little moan when a game published by a company keeps freezing my system.
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