Breaking Bad Page 86

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  • Psychotext 1 Oct 2013 01:28:29 53,919 posts
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    Feel like the end of an era, but a satisfying one.
  • Mola_Ram 1 Oct 2013 02:33:38 7,154 posts
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    Satisfying, but the more I think about it, the more I wish this last batch of 8 had been a little different.

    I think it was the villains that were the problem. The bad people on this show have usually been complex , but the nazis were anything but. I don't think they really belonged on this show.

    But whatever, it's the ending we have, and it was good for what it was.
  • FuzzyDuck 1 Oct 2013 05:31:04 4,005 posts
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    The "villain" for most of 5b has been Walt though.

    Edited by FuzzyDuck at 05:31:17 01-10-2013
  • CosmicFuzz 1 Oct 2013 06:20:57 23,772 posts
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    What a perfect finale. My favourite show ever. So glad it didn't drop the ball at the last hurdle.

    Episode 5 of our gaming podcast Open Source is a Gamescom Special. Check it out here!

  • Mola_Ram 1 Oct 2013 06:32:12 7,154 posts
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    Not really, though. Or, rather, he was the villain, but considerations of this were then lost somewhat with the introduction of guys who torture people and who have no qualms about killing women and kids. Oh, and they're Nazis too, apparently, as much a stock villain as you're likely to find.

    And that ties into why I think I felt uncomfortable about rooting for Walt at the end. It wasn't so much that I was uncomfortable about rooting for him, but rather that I was uncomfortable about being made to root for him. With those last two episodes, it's pretty clear that Vince Gilligan was on Team Walt, and no-so-subtly wanted us to be as well.

    Comepare that to earlier seasons, where there was ambiguity in the villains, who were recognisably human in addition to being bad (well, except for Tuco, but he was just a mental-case). Krazy8, Mike, Gus, Tio... all of them were complicated enough that you never really knew whether you actually wanted Walt to win. Because, in some ways, Walt was worse.

    With this ending, you pretty much *had* to be on Walt's side. Not because you had come to any sort of evolution of your views on the guy, but because HEY, LOOK, HE'S FIGHTING NAZIS. OMG THEY KILLED ANDREA AND TORTURED JESSE. KILL THEM ALL.

    That was *satisfying*, and to be clear I did think it was a good ending to what had come before. But as someone who hasn't been on Team Walt for quite some time now, I was a tiny bit disappointed as well with the back half of the season, particularly the last two eps. He deserved worse than that.

    EDIT: @FuzzyDuck

    Edited by Mola_Ram at 06:42:44 01-10-2013
  • Mola_Ram 1 Oct 2013 06:35:35 7,154 posts
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    Also, I can see that Walt was meant to have a superiority of sorts over Eliot and Gretchen, but what exactly have they done to deserve that?

    I mean, they're rich yuppies, sure, but I never got the impression that they had made any of their money underhandedly. And it's not like they've killed anyone.

    Clearly there's history there, but it was never really explained in the show.

    Edited by Mola_Ram at 06:45:02 01-10-2013
  • Physically_Insane 1 Oct 2013 07:02:21 8,741 posts
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    Gilligan was never team Walt. Watch the first episode of talking bad.
  • CharlieStCloud 1 Oct 2013 07:45:02 5,202 posts
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    @Mola_Ram

    You serious?

    They both said that the 'idea' that made Grey Matter what it was was all their doing and that Walt only came up with the company name.

    ... Walt almost single handedly created this 'idea' for Grey Matter, which was the sole reason Gretchen and Elliott went on to earn millions.

    In other words, they made Walt's creation theirs and theirs only; no credit to him at all.
  • GuiltySpark 1 Oct 2013 07:51:17 6,355 posts
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    CharlieStCloud wrote:
    @Mola_Ram

    You serious?

    They both said that the 'idea' that made Grey Matter what it was was all their doing and that Walt only came up with the company name.

    ... Walt almost single handedly created this 'idea' for Grey Matter, which was the sole reason Gretchen and Elliott went on to earn millions.

    In other words, they made Walt's creation theirs and theirs only; no credit to him at all.
    Yeah, I was thinking the same. Plus his revenge, isn't really revenge at all. He scared them, sure, but it was a facade. He could have paid off hitmen, easily.

    Get bent.

  • Doggypup 1 Oct 2013 08:48:22 165 posts
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    I really wanted the barrel box set but it's not available anymore on amazon....
  • Trane 1 Oct 2013 09:24:07 4,050 posts
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    CharlieStCloud wrote:
    @Mola_Ram

    You serious?

    They both said that the 'idea' that made Grey Matter what it was was all their doing and that Walt only came up with the company name.

    ... Walt almost single handedly created this 'idea' for Grey Matter, which was the sole reason Gretchen and Elliott went on to earn millions.

    In other words, they made Walt's creation theirs and theirs only; no credit to him at all.
    This. They have made millions on the back of his chemistry genius. He never said that during the conversation, but Walt very much conveyed it as 'you owe me'. The hitmen stunt was purely to convince them.
  • Petulant_Radish 1 Oct 2013 09:58:21 603 posts
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    An excellent and satisfying end I thought, I'd not been on Walt's side for a while but I'm glad he had a redemption of sorts...though as he died in the meth lab without any trace of Jesse it means he'll be claimed as as the one making the better product that Skinny Pete and Badger described. So his choice of dying in the lab with the product he loves also means his legacy will live on, massaging his pride and ego one last time.

    At least that's what I imagined the smile on his face was for at the end...
  • Benno 1 Oct 2013 10:00:42 9,830 posts
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    Didn't think of it like that!
  • irrelevanthuman 1 Oct 2013 10:29:06 363 posts
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    I loved it,a very satisfying resolution to a great show. Can't wait for the blu rays.
  • Humperfunk 1 Oct 2013 10:29:36 2,075 posts
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    Yep that's exactly how I saw it at the end. The blue meth will go down in history as Walt's creation and his alone, and that he was still making it until the end, even when the subject of a nationwide manhunt.

    PSN & NNID: Wedjwants

  • kinky_mong 1 Oct 2013 12:22:26 10,107 posts
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    Personally I couldn't have asked for a better ending than that, especially as I was still Team Walt even after all he's done, and he got the redemption he deserved.

    I'll never get my Orc looking the same again.

  • asha 1 Oct 2013 12:30:52 1,991 posts
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    I have a question - Isn't Jesse kind of screwed now?

    The Nazi's took his confession tape, which will probably be discovered by the police now. And the camp had CCTV and almost certainly recorded him driving away.

    I would love a spin-off show or movie about what Jesse did next.

    Edited by asha at 12:31:26 01-10-2013

    ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

  • Tuffty 1 Oct 2013 12:59:46 1,534 posts
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    Everyone's entitled to their opinions but, it must be nice to troll and get paid for it.
  • frightlever 1 Oct 2013 13:54:46 31 posts
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    Tuffty wrote:
    Everyone's entitled to their opinions but, it must be nice to troll and get paid for it.
    They call it linkbait for a reason...
  • aaron0288 1 Oct 2013 15:18:38 54 posts
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    The word 'c***' comes to mind regarding that bloke.

    Read the review the guardian posted for the final episode. Think they got it bang on. I was hoping for so much more between Jesse and Walt in those final scenes, and all we got was a nod. Did seem like they had to cram too much in. Jesse deserved so much more screen time for the finale imo.

    Still by far the best thing to ever grace my television screen :)
  • sirtacos 1 Oct 2013 15:31:35 7,272 posts
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    A nod was the best that could have happened, IMO. Underplaying it is much better than overdoing it.
    And after all that's happened between them - namely, everything that Walt has done to Jesse - a nod says more than an extended speech/standoff/snogging session could. I didn't even expect Jesse to nod back. The fact that he did (kind of) speaks volumes.

    The fact that Jesse didn't shoot Walt or run him over is as much a testament to his fundamental 'goodness'/naiveté as it is to the substance of his extended relationship with Walt, and honestly, it's more than Walt deserved (even though it's supposedly what he wanted).

    I'm not implying that Jesse forgave Walt - not at all. Jesse basically tells Walt to go fuck himself by refusing to kill him. On the other hand, there is some degree of understanding shown there... and recognition of the voyage of doom they have undertaken together.

    Also, Jesse walking away from Walt - and nodding to him (kinda) is one of the most mature things he's ever done.

    The final episode was entirely predictable, - hell, I even predicted the "do it" scene between Walt and Jesse a few pages ago (yay me) - but that doesn't matter one jot. Fitting end to a brilliant and captivating series.

    But yeah, good point (that asha made). Jesse is kinda fucked now.

    Anyway, Walt's final plan was a very fragile one... surprisingly so, considering that his family's safety hinged on its success.
    I can see why YoshiMcTaggis characterised it as a bit "A-Team".
    Walt didn't even know the layout of the Nazi hideout! What if they ordered him to park too far away? What if they told him to leave his car outside? What if he had to park his car at the wrong angle? Etc.

    Then again, nearly all of Walt's previous plans were Hail Marys (Mairies?). Practically none had a plan B.
    As brilliantly executed as they were, their success was always due to luck as much as anything else... hence Jesse's description of Walt as "the Devil" - "he's luckier than you", etc.

    The finale is still kinda hard to swallow after a few seconds of reflection*, but I won't dwell on it. It was satisfying despite being facile. Todd's docile death was a bit contrived, too. Like a lamb to the slaughter. I felt bad for him (mostly because of his respect for Mr. White, as well as his simpleton facade, which he maintained to the last - bless his psychopathic heart), while at the same time cheering Jesse on. It was weird.

    *(how did the cops get there so quickly at the end? How come Walt's neighbour, after recognising him, didn't call the fuzz immediately? How the hell did his Hail Mary shotgun scheme even succeed? That was a bit shit. Etc. etc.)

    Don't get me wrong - I thoroughly enjoyed all of it.
    I particularly enjoyed the rather obvious laser pointer trick too, although I certainly didn't expect Pete and Badger to be the ones wielding them!

    Edited by sirtacos at 17:25:01 01-10-2013
  • TOOTR 1 Oct 2013 15:59:22 9,515 posts
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    Can we stop using terms like 'Team Walt' please?

    You cunts ;)

    Walts 'Nod' to jesse was exactly the same nod he gave when telling Jack to kill Jesse after Hank was offed, while he was looking at Jesse.

    Exactly the same. I compared and froze framed between the two scenes.

    That last part may not be true

    What an absolutely brilliant show. I thought the end was immensely satisfying as well.

    Loved the genius way he tied up all the loose ends and how luck went his way (more than) a few times 'He's the devil. He's luckier than you..'

    I wonder how much he improvised on the road once he'd seen the interview and how much he 'cooked' up (/bows) while going stir crazy in the cabin but it all went Walts way.

    Loved the red laser dots and the threat of violent gunshots early and then the fusillade at the end - is that foreshadowing if it's in the same ep?

    Skinny Pete! And Badger! \o/
    But no mention of Babylon 5 :(

    Loved Jesses's angelic lit woodcarving reverie whilst going to his happy place.

    Loved and was gutted that that was the last time he was going to see his son who now hates him.

    Loved the exchange with Skylar. Pitch perfect.


    And loved the shout out to the fans at the end.


    Going to miss it. A tonne. It's fair to say - I loved it.

    Everybody should just calm down a little bit and have a nice cup of tea.

  • Salaman 1 Oct 2013 16:02:55 18,953 posts
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    Well I thoroughly enjoyed that. When he left the grey matter folk's house, I was thinking he must've tricked them, possibly with laser pointers because where would he get 2 snipers in half a day's time, without Saul about?
    Then as the two figures dashed to his car, I suddenly *knew* it had to be badger & Skinny Pete.
    Yaay! Great way to give them a last bit of screentime.

    I loved that Walt managed to get his money to Walt Jr in a roundabout way. Loved the bit with Skyler "Everything I did ... " in same old "for the family" tone to then fainlly admit to her and himself that he did it for himself.

    Loved the Jesse "middle finger" gesture in telling making him say he wants to be shot and telling him to do it himself.

    I was a bit annoyed by the Lydia thing and also a bit about the setup with the Aryans. There were so many "variables" that Walt couldn't predict or control in each of these situations that it seemed a bit un-breaking bad the way he effortlessly gets them pulled off according to his plan.
    I'm willing to forgive them that though.

    For those of you who are wondering what to do next. New season's of Elemental and Person of Interest. A whole different league but I was watching thos along with BB each week.

    I think I will rewatch all of Breaking bad at some point and after each episode, listen to the breaking bad podcast and listen to how it came to be, what the thinking behind it was, what options were discarded, how it was shot, etc.

    Been doing that for these final 3 or 4 episodes. Watch the ep and then listen to the podcast. Very insightful and it added to my enjoyment of these last few apisodes.
  • Roddles 1 Oct 2013 17:32:10 1,825 posts
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    Edited by Roddles at 17:33:04 01-10-2013
  • customfirmware 2 Oct 2013 20:53:16 783 posts
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    Post deleted
  • Dirtbox 5 Oct 2013 22:13:34 77,653 posts
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    I just realised what it was that dampened the final season and ultimately the finale for me. The Nazis were just generic scumbags, no story, no personality, nothing like Fring or Tuco, they were just a bunch of filler cannon fodder. Walt might as well have been saving Jesse from some sacks of meat.

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  • Tom_Servo 6 Oct 2013 01:54:22 17,425 posts
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    You're totally right. After Gus it felt quite underwhelming for them and Lydia to be the big baddies to round off the series. I guess that was one of the consequences of them writing the S4 finale as a potential series ender because they didn't know if they were going to be renewed. I suspect Gus would've still been around until the end otherwise.

    Still, 16 episodes should be enough to build some interesting characters.

    Apart from that I really enjoyed it. About as good an ending as they could manage, don't really have too many complaints apart from Uncle Jack's gang.

    Edited by Tom_Servo at 01:55:24 06-10-2013
  • FuzzyDuck 6 Oct 2013 01:57:44 4,005 posts
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    I think the Nazis were brought in as antagonists as Walt had become the main bad guy and they needed a vehicle to allow him to (however small a way it was) redeem himself.
  • Tom_Servo 6 Oct 2013 02:01:41 17,425 posts
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    I get that, but at the end of the day they were still pretty blank canvases (Todd aside). Did we even learn the names of the gang barring Jack?

    I didn't really care that any of them died apart from Todd, which sort of speaks volumes. It was amazing when Gus died.
  • Dirtbox 6 Oct 2013 08:20:35 77,653 posts
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    Todd was a zero entity as well, there was nothing more to him than you saw in his actions while working with Walt and Jesse. The only portion of character building he got was in a 1 minute scene with a cup.

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