This is starting to get a little scary Page 368

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  • mal 7 Feb 2013 12:36:32 24,497 posts
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    That's the point of the punishment isn't it? To show people in the future that their actions will be found out, and they will be punished.
  • Deleted user 7 February 2013 12:56:55
    afghan_jones wrote:
    I find it kind of unbelieveable that the narrative has gone from blaming firms to punishing individuals but there still seems a huge reluctance to actually do much about changing the underlying systems and removing the circumstances that allowed Libor etc to actually happen.

    Lots of condemning certain institutions & publicly shaming individuals into giving up bonuses but no actual plans to change things in the long term it would seem.
    I always marvel at the guys who have happily cashed their massive monthly paycheck for being Directors or Senior Managers, and then claim to have no knowledge of what the company they were Directing or Managing was doing. What is even more bizarre is when they get to keep their jobs after admitting that they can't actually perform the roles they hold. Very confusing.
  • jellyhead 7 Feb 2013 13:04:15 24,350 posts
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    It's bewildered me for years too. Mindboggling but nowt i can do about it so meh to them.
  • Khanivor 8 Feb 2013 22:33:23 42,052 posts
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    I'm worth all that money because of the massive amounts of responsibility of my job as the ultimate head of my company.

    I'm not responsible for anything that my company or any of its employees do wrong.

    Why does everyone hate me?
  • Moot_Point 9 Feb 2013 23:15:58 4,788 posts
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  • Deleted user 11 February 2013 15:50:52
    On the plus side. Spring cleaning, perhaps.

    Edited by Bremenacht at 15:51:24 11-02-2013
  • Mr_Sleep 11 Feb 2013 15:53:29 18,581 posts
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    Moot_Point wrote:
    Very interesting that. It does seem like he has solutions but they're clearly never going to happen with the way US voting seems to go. Be interesting if Obama came out and endorsed what this economist is saying. It would also be interesting to see if this gentlemen is supported by other economists.

    I do think that someone should have just pushed a big reset button in the last worldwide recession.

    Also, what happens if the US economy goes down the toilet? Wont that also mean China goes down the toilet in the same way that in business when a retailer owes loads of money to a supplier and that retailer goes under then the supplier also tends to go bust.

    Edited by Mr_Sleep at 15:55:24 11-02-2013
  • Mr_Sleep 11 Feb 2013 16:02:20 18,581 posts
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    LeoliansBro wrote:
    I can't see that vid at work but I'm vey wary of armchair economists on Youtube, especially given Mr_Sleep talking about pusing 'a big reset button' (back to when? pre Adam Smith? pre capitalism? pre feudalism?).

    Anyone care to summarise for me?
    That was a tangential point, I wasn't suggesting resetting the system, I was suggesting resetting the debt and it was a glib point really.
  • Mr_Sleep 11 Feb 2013 16:03:54 18,581 posts
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    He's essentially saying that national debt is much more than the US is disclosing because they're hiding it in their pensions.

    Ah ha, there's a transcript:


    Edited by Mr_Sleep at 16:04:36 11-02-2013
  • ResidentKnievel 11 Feb 2013 16:05:39 6,522 posts
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    "machines are taking our jerbs"
  • Deleted user 11 February 2013 16:07:26
    It's an interview on 'Russia Today' with this guy.

    Kotlikoff has written that the economic future is bleak for the United States without tax reform, health care reform, and Social Security reform in his book The Coming Generational Storm and other publications.
    Hmm. Not watched the vid yet though.
  • Mr_Sleep 11 Feb 2013 16:07:45 18,581 posts
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    Yeah, that did make me laugh, it made him sound like a literal luddite. It is, in some ways, a fair point as it is taking jobs away from cashiers but then presumably someone is getting a job designing/building the tools for the express checkouts.
  • Deleted user 11 February 2013 16:11:01
    Moot_Point wrote:
    You know RT is Russian government television, yeah? Just sayin'.
  • Deleted user 11 February 2013 16:15:21
    LeoliansBro wrote:
    Pension schemes are unsustainable worldwide. Someone described them as the ultimate Ponzi scheme hidden by a convenient fiction we are all party to. And I can't really fault that :/
    Why unsustainable?
  • Mr_Sleep 11 Feb 2013 16:15:52 18,581 posts
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    LeoliansBro wrote:
    Pension schemes are unsustainable worldwide. Someone described them as the ultimate Ponzi scheme hidden by a convenient fiction we are all party to. And I can't really fault that :/
    It might well have been this fella, I'm pretty sure he mentioned Ponzi himself.

    "LK: They’re intentionally hiding this. They’ve been spending in our country six decades, running a massive Ponzi scheme, taking from young people, giving to old people, and then telling the young people, “Don’t worry, you’ll get yours when you’re old,” promising pensions, promising healthcare benefits. And you know this is happening in all countries. Russia has a pension system, but it doesn’t seem to be in better shape than ours in terms of paying for its benefits in the future."

    There has been debate here in the UK recently about how unsustainable the pension scheme is. Partly the problem seemed to be related to government bonds but ultimately the problem to me seems to come down to a large elderly populace that is going to be producing little for the economy but taking much of the money, if not through pensions then through the NHS.

    In many ways it's hard to argue that if NI has been paid for the entirety of ones working life then a state pension is to be expected but then it's going to become unrealistic. Hard to know what the solution is to this problem.

    They should never have pushed everyone to give up cigarettes, the problem would have resolved itself ;-)
  • whatfruit 11 Feb 2013 16:21:12 2,113 posts
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    Damn ruskies putting out anti US propaganda.

    You can't trust anything they say, even if it is based on a modicum of truth.

    America may be in worse shape than Greece on paper, but it still has a huge influence thanks to it's substantial military to destabilise, overthrow and destroy governments who will not give it preferential treatment when it comes to trade.

    All Greece has is a falafel.
  • Deleted user 11 February 2013 16:22:21
    Easily adjustable, no? Insurance premiums adjust to anticipate payouts, can pensions not do the same? State pensions are a bit of a different matter, but even the UK one is changing - to a riskier model by some accounts.
  • Dangerous_Dan 11 Feb 2013 16:36:40 2,390 posts
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    Relax and have some syrup with your waffles.

    Edited by Dangerous_Dan at 16:37:12 11-02-2013
  • whatfruit 11 Feb 2013 16:37:32 2,113 posts
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    @LeoliansBro This is the crux of the problem and it has been the political elephant in the room for the last 10 years. No govement has properly addressed it other than raisng the pension entilement age which has been a way of putting off the problem. No one either has been brave enough to bring attention to the reality of the situation because it is politcal hari kuri to suggest scrapping the state pension to a bare minimum becuase of the large proportion of voters that the baby boomers comprise.
  • Deleted user 11 February 2013 17:17:51
    Well they are introducing NEST, which is a step towards a self-sustaining government scheme, even if it's privately run.
  • RichDC 14 Feb 2013 10:15:14 6,220 posts
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    Megapocalypse wrote:
    Anyone have any idea how to go about trying to claim money back from a company that's gone down the pan? Out over £100 after Jessops went bust the day after they processed an order for me. The website isn't very helpful.
    Awesome! My order arrived today. :D
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