XNA Indie Games Page 3

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  • SomaticSense 21 Feb 2008 14:13:24 8,691 posts
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    My god, Dishwasher is just immense. Really puts to shame a lot of the more 'professional' bollocks on XBLA to be honest. The game is just crazy.

    When are the full games out? Can barely wait....
  • BetsyA 21 Feb 2008 18:27:17 2 posts
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    Hi all,

    Just a quick note from someone on the Community XNA team. (I had trouble setting up my account on this site or I'd have responded earlier).

    First off, we are sorry to hear about the difficulties indownloading the 7 preview games. Because this is a preview, it's not as easy as it will be in the future to get at stuff - we hear you on the difficulties.

    To help out, I posted some links to FAQs on submitting your games and downloading the preview games on my blog (http://blogs.msdn.com/betsya). The video link I think is the best one to sort out game downloading confusion for the previews.

    Folks are also encouraged to give us feedback in our forums at http://creators.xna.com or there's a feedback form on the Web site. We are still evolving this whole thing and it means a lot to us to hear what you think. The preview is to get folks thinking about what could be, and how fun community games really are.

    Anyway, I've rambled on - thanks for taking the interest in the XNA community games and please do look at the links if you are still having trouble getting the info you need.

    Cheers,

    Betsy Aoki
    Program Manager, XNA

  • GamesConnoisseur 21 Feb 2008 18:35:21 420 posts
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    Everyone is giving Dishwasher the praises it deserve, but heck half of those XNA Community Games deserve more than the attention the retro old rehash stuff that got put up on the Marketplace!

    I consider Proximity a good strategtic game, its very simple and basic but it make you think about where to place your strong and weak titles and can be a good online/multiplayer game.

    Jellycar is reasonably good effort but niche.
  • crashVoodoo 21 Feb 2008 21:18:11 3,963 posts
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    i want a microsoft sponsored breakfast ...

    on another note, dishwasher is really good. well suprised. considering buying the full thing when it comes out \o/

    a Nexus a day keeps the apple away

  • Psychotext 21 Feb 2008 21:43:12 54,391 posts
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    /waves to Betsy
  • Syrette 21 Feb 2008 21:47:12 43,753 posts
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    Dishwasher is fucking awesome.

    What a name too.

  • J.C 21 Feb 2008 21:53:05 1,271 posts
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    Dont like jellycar. i was expecting, well proper jelly. like proper see through coloured wibbly wobbly type jelly. i guess what im trying to say is, the visuals dont appeal to me.
    balls.

    The dishwasher was great. i liked the black n white visuals and red blood yum!

    That ninja thing wasn't bad either. i would prefer that 2D version of portal though. why isn't that on LIVE?
  • seasidebaz 21 Feb 2008 21:59:27 6,134 posts
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    i will soon commit a game to the community.

    provided i can upload it from my pc, without having to pay silly amounts for a creators club account, as i have sold my 360 and don't really want to buy a new one
  • Psychotext 21 Feb 2008 22:04:02 54,391 posts
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    Testing it might be a tad on the difficult side. Still, you can always send interested people the file so they can try it on the PC. =)
  • seasidebaz 21 Feb 2008 22:08:13 6,134 posts
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    hehe as long as they like obscure games with no clear objective... think sims but where every consequence except 1 is nuclear disaster...
  • J.C 21 Feb 2008 22:10:32 1,271 posts
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    I think i'll make a gears clone. who's with me?
  • Dixons 21 Feb 2008 22:59:41 1,230 posts
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    Just played The Dishwater. Wow, what a cool little game! Loving the music, its sense of style. It's got more flair and imagination in its little finger than most XBLA games have got in their entire bodies!

    So how big do we think this latest addition to Live can be chaps? I'm thinking her-uge. Not quite YouTube huge as the barriers to entry are steeper but definitely could be The Next Big Thing as far as gaming is concerned imo. Think the scope of LBP multiplied by a very big number!
  • Peew971 21 Feb 2008 23:30:14 4,934 posts
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    They were guessing on 1Up yours that you would need a membership to download and review games instead of free for all... Any official word on that yet?
  • Dixons 21 Feb 2008 23:38:44 1,230 posts
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    For it to work it needs to be as open as possible. Using YouTube as an example, I know that I've personally never made/uploaded a video, and probably never will (could not be arsed). But there's so many other people willing to do so, and its open nature leads to a such a wealth of content, that I almost watch as much YouTube these days as I do 'regular' TV.

    If done right, XNA could be the gateway to a true gaming mecca of diversity, variety and inspiration. The only question, as always is, are MS the right company to usher such an initiative in, given their historical penchant for restricted access and control? Hmm, only time will tell I suppose...
  • Deleted user 21 February 2008 23:45:38
    Dixons wrote:
    Think the scope of LBP multiplied by a very big number!

    It's absolutely nothing like LBP.

  • Razz 21 Feb 2008 23:48:16 61,391 posts
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    ...

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    Steam/PSN/XBOX: Razztafarai | 3DS: 1246-9674-8856
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  • Dixons 21 Feb 2008 23:54:06 1,230 posts
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    betahoven wrote:
    Dixons wrote:
    Think the scope of LBP multiplied by a very big number!

    It's absolutely nothing like LBP.
    True, they're not directly comparable. I was talking more in terms of their similar 'Game 3.0' aspirations, that's all.

    edit: Also and obviously XNA isn't a game
  • Psychotext 22 Feb 2008 00:19:03 54,391 posts
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    Peew971 wrote:
    They were guessing on 1Up yours that you would need a membership to download and review games instead of free for all... Any official word on that yet?
    Here's most of what we know we know:

    Q.I'm a little concerned with the peer reviews, though. Do all Creator's Club subscribers count as peer reviewers? If so, it seems like there could be issues with people just giving out bad ratings for the fun of it and preventing good games from getting online.

    A.We have a reputation system for reviewers. Initially, several different people must review a game, and must all agree, before it will be published to Marketplace. If the initial reviewers disagree significantly, the system will wait for more reviews. After say 10 people reviewed it, and only 1 gave a different opinion to the other 9, we'd go ahead and ignore the minority opinion. If a reviewer consistently does badly, or even worse, gives the OK to a game which we later have to pull down because of a user complaint, that reviewer gets a worse reputation so their opinion counts less in future. Similiarly, if a reviewer is good (has reviwed many games, no complaints about games they review, consistently agrees with other reviewers, etc) they get a better reputation, so their opinion carries more weight.


    Q.The item in the FAQ regarding setting prices for your games is interesting. I'm very curious how this one will work out.

    A. We don't have any details on that side of things yet, other than what is in the FAQ.


    Q.Please, I would like to know if by "friends" you are referring to anybody who has XBOX Live (including Silver), anybody on your friends list, or any member of XNA Creators Club that is your friend.

    A.Anyone on Live (including Silver).


    Q.This means that we, members of the Creator's Club, may offer Games to the public, if our own community thinks the game is appropiate?

    A. Exactly.


    Q.l come out of lurking, has there been anything yet on what the filesize limits for this will be?

    A.I believe it is the same as for XBLA, currently 150 meg.

    The download is compressed, though, so it's ok to have a bigger game as long as it comes in under 150 meg when packed up. The best way to test this is to build your game into a .ccgame package and examine the size of that.


    Q.Hopefully this the correct thread for this. I assume this new system is for Original Games only. So that joe blow couldnt make a game based off mario or halo characters and then have it published on xbox live. I would assume that the original developers of those characters would go after you.

    A.The peer reviewers would hopefully catch that and prevent such a game being published in the first place. If they missed it (maybe the copied thing was very obscure so none of the reviewers recognised it) then anyone could complain after the game was published. If we investigated the complaint and found it was valid, we'd take the game down from Marketplace.

    Nothing we are doing here changes anything about how copyright law works. If a character, world, model, sound, texture, etc, belongs to someone else, you cannot use it in your game.


    Q.Will it be possible to upload newer ( Patched ) versions of a game? Such as in a situation that a critical bug slips through the peer review process and is found by users?

    A.I don't know this one for sure (I work on the framework itself, and there's a whole parallel team building this peer review system) but I suspect we'll have something along those lines. You'd have to go through the peer review again for your updated version, though, to make sure people didn't cheat and just upload something totally different as their "1.1" release!
  • Psychotext 22 Feb 2008 00:20:02 54,391 posts
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    Here's the FAQ:

    http://forums.xna.com/ShowThread.aspx?PostID=46554

    Some useful bits:

    Starting with the beta launch of the Xbox LIVE Community Games service later this spring, subscribers of the XNA Creators Club will be able to submit their own game creations for self-distribution through to Xbox LIVE Marketplace via the http://creators.xna.com website. A community of their subscriber peers will be given a chance to download, play and review the game and its content for appropriateness and conformance to the serviceís TOS. Should it pass, the game will then be added to the global games catalog on Xbox LIVE Marketplace and available to gamers worldwide connected to Xbox LIVE.
    Q: Do I need an XNA Creators Club subscription to make games now?
    A: No, but if you want to make the game available on the Xbox LIVE Community Games area, or peer review submitted games, you must be a subscriber.
    Q: Why does my game have to be peer-reviewed? Why canít I just post it?
    A: Peer reviewers are there to help creators write better games, and also to protect game players from experiencing highly offensive or malfunctioning games. Peer reviewers will reject your game if:

    - You have prohibited content in the game, not allowed on Xbox Live services
    - You misrepresent whatís in the game play or in the promotional materials for the game
    - The promotional content for your game ( banner, title) is not appropriate for all ages on Xbox Live marketplace
    - The game crashes, has too many bugs or is otherwise technically defective
  • Psychotext 22 Feb 2008 00:23:01 54,391 posts
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    So basically the creators club creates and peer reviews games... which then get posted to the public site for consumption. We have no idea how the charges will work at that point though.
  • Xerx3s 22 Feb 2008 00:36:42 23,944 posts
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    There are flaws in the system though. Say that I was a complete idiot - more even than normal - and had the utter will to show profane content to other people, I could just make a game bury a date check into it and only activate the content later. That way it could get through the peer review without them seeing the full game.
  • Xerx3s 22 Feb 2008 00:38:21 23,944 posts
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    Psychotext wrote:
    So basically the creators club creates and peer reviews games... which then get posted to the public site for consumption. We have no idea how the charges will work at that point though.

    Don't really care about that. Even if I wouldn't earn a penny on it, it would still be great (well, our project that was set in motion some time ago was more or less already meant to be a free game anyway)!
  • Psychotext 22 Feb 2008 00:43:30 54,391 posts
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    Xerx3s wrote:
    There are flaws in the system though. Say that I was a complete idiot - more even than normal - and had the utter will to show profane content to other people, I could just make a game bury a date check into it and only activate the content later. That way it could get through the peer review without them seeing the full game.
    Of course you could... but you'd likely have MS's legal team stamp you into the ground based on the contract you signed when you published the game.

    You really want to go up against MS's legal team? =)
  • Peew971 22 Feb 2008 01:00:28 4,934 posts
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    Thanks for the info Psychotext. That just leaves one question: How can they make sure a professional developper won't use this to cut their cost and avoid the lenghty process of having a game on XBLA?
  • Psychotext 22 Feb 2008 01:07:07 54,391 posts
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    If I was to take a guess? Like this:

    1: Margins. There's no way you'll get as tasty a cut of the cash doing it this way.

    2: Exposure. Every XBLA game gets a certain amount of exposure
    because of XBLA Wednesday. Community games wont see this exposure and they'll be fighting for recognition outside of word of mouth.

    I'm sure there's other reasons such as the tools the developer uses.
  • crashVoodoo 22 Feb 2008 08:31:37 3,963 posts
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    Peew971 wrote:
    Thanks for the info Psychotext. That just leaves one question: How can they make sure a professional developper won't use this to cut their cost and avoid the lenghty process of having a game on XBLA?
    like psychotext says above. however, what i could see happening is all the 'fake hype' thats happening in music these days.

    there was someone not long ago (female singer songwriter) that was doing internet gigs and showcasing on myspace etc. when she finally came big, it was all some music execs wetdream and fake.

    i can see this happening a lot ... not sure how i feel about this or what my actual point was .. so err .. /gets down off soapbox

    a Nexus a day keeps the apple away

  • dean_c 22 Feb 2008 15:48:54 85 posts
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    sorted now

    sorry
  • Psychotext 22 Feb 2008 15:50:26 54,391 posts
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    dean_c wrote:
    how do i get this to work i have an error which states im not subscribed then exits anyone know whats up
    When you have it selected, press Y to download games. If that doesn't work, delete the launcher and try downloading it again as I believe there's two versions.
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