|VariantAEC 14 seconds ago||I agree with all but this statement "They are cheaper to buy.". PC games cost the same amount on disk at retail as console games do (at least in the US). This is what I call the "PC games pricing fallacy".|
|Lawandiii 1 minute ago||@pjbliverpool I think you're missing something. I for instance mainly play multiplayer games and playing multiplayer games on a 55' sammy with a controller linked to your pc is quite harder. For one general Tv's have a overal higher input lag then PC monitors. And the controller also adds a bit more latency to that. Also a mouse is far more price and has lower latency. If you want to keep your k/d ratio somewhere around 1.0 you're having a though time competing the majority of the pc gamers who play on a monitor with a mouse. That's why I bought a ps4|
|01lil 9 minutes ago||I think once the witcher 3 and cyberpunk 2077 come out, we will see games with true immersion into the world. Not only does CD projekt have probably the best RPG engine in the industry, they based all of their games around choices and consequences. I truly think these two games can pull it off like no other game has.|
|curryking3 10 minutes ago||So no one has watched PlayStation Access?|
|priesty_lfc 13 minutes ago||
Alot of people saying the PC runs on your tv which is
correct, but does it fit snugly in my tv unit?
My set up now suits me and it fits within how I want my living room to look. I do not want an ugly looking PC unit on display on my front room.
|craigm 13 minutes ago||
my pc upgraded over the last 2 months
case: crappy old steel thing I've had for ever
hdd: 120gb ssd had for about a year, 1tb hdd £40
CPU: i5 2500k £112
gpu: gtx 680 £177
mobo: Gigabyte GA-Z77X-DH3 £65
ram: 8gb DDR3 1600 £42.99
psu: antec 520w £47.99
Easily beats new consoles for under £500 CPU and GPU were 2nd hand everything else was bought new all bought from eBay. you could swap the 680 for a 670 or 660ti and add a decent case and you would still easily beat consoles for under £500
|Retroid 16 minutes ago||Some of those omissions are BAFFLING.|
|VariantAEC 18 minutes ago||
Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of making a budget PC?
|Manuel_Jose 19 minutes ago||For me, Solid Snake and Big Boss are both the real hero :) Solid Snake saved the world 5 times (Metal Gear, Metal Gear 2, MGS, MGS 2, MGS 4) and Big Boss 3 times (MGS 3, MGS Portable Ops, MGS Peace Walker).|
|Cold_Waste 20 minutes ago||@Deionarra It's nice to go back to ICO or Shadow of the Colossus every now and again. Almost completely devoid of collectables, making the immersion much more personal. No sub conscious nagging at you that you might have missed some important item is always good to have.|
|YorkshireTea 25 minutes ago||the real hero of the Metal Gear series is Zero, obviously|
|Kysen 26 minutes ago||@daviejambo lol at this misinformation. "No PC gamer has that turned on" Did you even read the article where it said even on beastly rigs there are frame drops in some games. Guess what happens when you get frame drops with vsync off? TEARING|
|George-Roper 27 minutes ago||
Ultimately a PC at this point isn't a mature enough platform for the living room, there are UI issues, Blu-Ray playback issues, multiple distribution platforms, hackers online, poorly optimized games, all kinds of software update annoyances, poor remote control support and other stuff to contend with. If you are willing to put up with all that, you get better looking games at higher frame rates...Please.
|RipRock_2010 31 minutes ago||
@daviejambo "As long as
the frames are slightly over 60 you won't get screen
|xandoodle 35 minutes ago||@Guy.J. It says more about your knowledge of the horror genre, really.|
|daviejambo 38 minutes ago||8320 with a £20 cooler over clocked to 4.2ghz and a r9 280x would give you 60fps in nearly all games. Why the v-sych obsession? No PC gamer has that turned on. As long as the frames are slightly over 60 you won't get screen tear|
|Snake_2011 40 minutes ago||
@frazzl that was when they did
there fuck up everyone without company love felt the same
you need help man I posted that at E3 time.
XB1 games do not show you moron if Dead Rising 3 & RYSE are not exclusives then your right.
|bad09 40 minutes ago||
"Ultimately a PC at this point isn't a mature enough platform for the living room, there are UI issues, Blu-Ray playback issues, multiple distribution platforms, hackers online, poorly optimized games, all kinds of software update annoyances, poor remote control support and other stuff to contend with"
What a load of old cobblers :)
|KrisVr 41 minutes ago||
@frunk Am I only one who
doesn't understand the hassle with drivers and Windows?
Many-many years back, XP/Vista times I would have probably understood but today...not so much.
Lets start with driver install....all you have to do is uninstall "next-next" old and install "next-next" new ones, restart, done. Last stable driver from AMD for example was 2 months ago, usually 1 month between new drivers if more games are coming out. ONCE in a month you may need to install new driver, I say may because unless you have latest GPU, u may skip some drivers, just not needed for your GPU.
If u are wrestling with Windows, I have to ask, what the hell are you doing with it? I don't shutdown my PC, I use sleep, so I can look in task manager when I last time restarted my PC...it was 74days 22hours ago, and I think that's when I installed new drivers. There may be problems of course, but far from anything disastrous like you are making it.
I have barely mid-range PC, I just play games, I don't understand what are you optimizing all the time. There may be, again, may be problems, but most of the time I just launch fraps, launch game on steam, set video settings according to what fps fraps tells me and play. If u want absolute every bit of best graphic and fps out of ur system, that's your problem. I maybe install fresh Windows 2 times a year and that's just to get that fresh feel.
"- it usually "just fucking works" and when it doesn't the onus is on the developer and publisher to get it sorted."
Again these times, where PC games just aren't working are mostly over, you're just over exaggerating. And if there's problem, Steam discussion page should get you solution quickly. And most problems are game related and on developers to fix on PC too. And if developer refuses to fix game on PC and console, there are at least modders that may fix it on PC, but on console it stays broken.
I'm pretty sure most of the time problem is pirated games and other softer and/or user pissing and adjusting their PC's all the time...like memory timings.
|chrismikehunt 43 minutes ago||You seem to have forgotten to factor the cost of an OS into your pc price.|
|Nikanoru 43 minutes ago||
Uncharitably, it's a way of stuffing a thin plot with 20 hours of pointless busywork.And to me, too much plot is a way of stuffing thin gameplay with 20 hours of watching people flap their jaws. That's not what I'm fucking playing games for.
But yeah, collectibles can be done badly? But I'd rather have them than not at all.
Almost any modern dev who sees this article is going to take it as an excuse to remove even more gameplay content, and make game worlds even more one-dimensional and self-progressing.
So screw complaining about collectibles.
|Rev0Knuckle 44 minutes ago||
@Otis_Inf Nothing to really
wonder about. It's just nobody has actually made the effort
to make one.
As Farzlepot says these guys were part of a weekly MS show and EG helped them out when MS cancelled their show. They're Xbox only because they've always been. There is no hidden agenda.
|craigcarlhowlett 45 minutes ago||Xbone, OFF!|
|George-Roper 45 minutes ago||
The fact that publishers have chosen not to to take risks with space simulation games on console doesn't prove that there isn't a market for those games. How many AAA space simulation games have we seen on PC?Define AAA though.
Off the top of my head we have the X series of games. Then, going back a bit we have Privateer. Conflict Freespace. Wingman. X-Wing/Tie Fighter.
All truly great space sims.
The reason we don't see any of the big names, like EA or Activision release AAA space sims on the PC is because they will hardly ever, if at all, release a game purely on the PC. It will always be multiplat and as such the game design needs to fit all.
The fact that we have Elite and Star Citizen generating tens of millions of dollars worth of Kickstarter funding means that the PC audience is right there, wanting more. I just don't think that had they targetted the console audience in that Kickstarter it would have resulted in anywhere near the same result.
|pjbliverpool 47 minutes ago||
Why do comparative PC builds always omit the optical disk drive?If the two machines need perfect feature parity for the comparison to be valid then the PS4's going to lose pretty badly on that score. The ability to run 30+ years of x86 software gives the PC a slight advantage in that court.
|LargeStyle 48 minutes ago||
I've not had any problems with HWiNFO or MSI AB, and heavily rely on it when playing a new game to optimise it as best as possible.
Quite a few Freeware-type apps rely on installer advertising products but I just read every step of the installation process and disable when neccessary. Each to their own though.
|Playstationman 50 minutes ago||
Screen tearing, shoddy framerate and bugs/glitches are all
far worse immersion breakers but we don't see them mentioned
in reviews do we.
I wonder why that is!?
|pjbliverpool 52 minutes ago||
I'm sure the PS4 could hit 1080p60 if you were able to fanny around with the settings also.Congratulations on making the dummest comment in the thread so far (and that's really saying something). Don;t you think the developers might have already "fannied" around with the settings to get the best possible mix of resolution and framerate that the hardware can manage?
|VariantAEC 52 minutes ago||
Games will NEVER be fully immersive
Your welcome to attempt challenging my opinion. If or when you do you will realize this is isn't an opinion at all.
Edit: fixed bold font.
|Innocent_Bystander 56 minutes ago||
Well, an interesting proposition here. From the living room
perspective you have:
- 10 foot user interface
- Forced controller support in all apps and games
- ~200W power draw
- Guaranteed performance in all titles
- Level playing field in online games
- Free games with network subscription
- guaranteed blu-ray playback
- Backward compatibility across your library (and I can't emphasize enough how huge that is)
- ability to configure the system with the 10ft UI of your choice, but it may be lacking in the usability department
- Variable performance across titles depending on your budget (as opposed to DF, I wouldn't go below a Haswell Core i5 and a GTX 780TI for future proof 1080P60 on ultra, even though it will cost you almost 5x as much as a console does)
Ultimately a PC at this point isn't a mature enough platform for the living room, there are UI issues, Blu-Ray playback issues, multiple distribution platforms, hackers online, poorly optimized games, all kinds of software update annoyances, poor remote control support and other stuff to contend with. If you are willing to put up with all that, you get better looking games at higher frame rates...
Ultimately the decision is up to you. The PS4 and the XBOX One make the PC choice much harder to make at this point.
|iStrikeRx 59 minutes ago||
You guys realise it just wouldn't be very productive to have
a PS one right?
Inside Xbox was very established back in the day, so plenty of people will still follow this, so it makes sense to support it.
While making a PS version would gain SOME viewers, a lot of people are likely to stick with various IGN published videos and podcasts such as the Beyond! series.
Even if you don't like IGN, Greg Miller and that Colin bloke are pretty much the faces of the PS brand where gaming news and reviews are concerned. People recognise them, even in the UK, where as if the UK had a couple of people regularly creating videos about PS, no one would know who they are, and a lot wouldn't bother watching.
|pjbliverpool 59 minutes ago||Post deleted|
|pjbliverpool 1 hour ago||
Yeah, but this is brand new hardware and 2 years from now the situation will be pretty different.What's going to be different that won't also apply to the PC? They can make the game code scale better for the consoles 6 available cores, and optimise it for the x86 and AVX instruction sets. Except the PC also has 6 x86 cores with AVX.
They can create more efficient graphics algorithms better aimed at leveraging a DX11 class GPU. Except the PC has a (faster) DX11 class GPU.
They can create better assets and art work that are aimed specifically at next gen capabilities rather than last gen consoles. Expect the PC will benefit just as much from that as the consoles.
The simple fact is that theres very little you can optimise over the next few years for these consoles that wouldn't also be irectly applicable to the PC as well. HSA and the large graphics memory are the only two major areas and thanks to t's much more powerful CPU, the HSA advantage should be nullified by the PC while the large memory advatage of the consoles can be partially nullified by the larger system memory of the PC in combination with streaming.
|pjbliverpool 1 hour ago||Post deleted|
|pjbliverpool 1 hour ago||
Sorry, But I don't see it in the list. Not arguing, I doubled checked to avoid this reply. If it is there please show me. Still, it is missing a BR Drive.The controller the PC comes with is a Keyboard & Mouse. A gamepad would indeed be extra, as would a blu0ray drive but for PC gaming that's uneccessary anyway so there isn't an argument to be made that it's required for parity.
|Yautja_Warrior 1 hour ago||
Great read. Nice to see a balanced view on things, and it
shows just how good the Performance for Value your getting
with PS4 for £349.
After reading this I would say if you want a PC for gaming, you would be better off spending more then £500 to get a big advantage because spending £150 - £200 more than the cost of PS4 and only getting a slight advantage is not the best value for money. Also the other problem with this is when we are still getting games that are not optimized to take full advantage of a PC.
Both have pros and cons but it just depends on what you want from a gaming system, Top Performance PC but at a higher cost or PS4 with Decent Performance on a tighter budget.
|Playstationman 1 hour ago||
Where does Fallout 3 drop in all this?
I found it the most immersive game I've ever played and that is all about collecting stuff.
Ahh.. Fallout 3, how i love thee!
Couldn't get into NewVegas for some reason.
Playing through AC4 now and many pointless things to collect and why, I say WHY, do they need to put what the buttons do permanently on screen?
The controls are infuriating at times too.
|Rob_Nomad 1 hour ago||@lazyboyblue why buy a PC if you wanna play games in 720p and already have a XBOne and a PS4? :P|
|GeneralAtrox 1 hour ago||
I end up collecting the collectibles out of a mad addiction
and not playing the game.
Warhammer 40K Space Marine for the Xbox 360 was completely spoiled once I missed one and gave up playing. I can't remember why I was so obsessed about getting them all.
|Pasco_ 1 hour ago||
However, PC elitists expecting a knockout blow against the consoles - PlayStation 4 in particular - may end up disappointed by our findings.Not really.
A £500 low-end PC can't really be considered part of the elite, spend £1,000 on a PC and see how the PS4 stacks up to that beast.
|muzzakus 1 hour ago||
Let's just say the PS4 continues to impress. Such a small
console, such incredible results.
And this article is comparing 1st gen console titles! Will the 2nd / 3rd / 4th gen console titles eclipse this PC build? Here's looking forward to the next round.
No excuse for Lego to be less than 60 on PS4 - let's get a patch lego devs.
|obscured021 1 hour ago||
Been A pc and console gamer for over 25 years, I have owned
nearly all of the consoles on release, but this is the first
time I have not ran out and bought both consoles on release,
I get more Value and play time on my pc at the moment. I
have my PC hooked up to my 7.1 amp and TV in my liveing
room, I also use steam home streaming to sent the games to a
mac mini in my bed room hooked up to a tv which works
Maybe in a few years I will get both consoles when there are more exclusives for the ps4/X1
|Rob_Nomad 1 hour ago||
as PC enthusiast for years, i think that PS4
price/performance ratio is unbeatable at the moment. i
bought it as an investment for the years to come :)
unless you buy many games and take into account the fact that generally you can get pc games for less money (but console games get discounted too, you can lend them, you can buy them used too)
|blerk2000 1 hour ago||Great article, totally agree, sick to death of having to collect stuff all the time. Yeah had to get rid of the Farcry music too|
|Vixremento 1 hour ago||
Thanks for the article - I think it answers a question that
a lot of us already knew the answer to.
To be honest I think there are two groups of console purchasers - those that buy consoles because it doesn't require any effort to build a machine/check on up the specs before buying a pre-built machine and those that are more hardcore fans of consoles from past experiences (including fans of console-exclusive franchises).
I don't blame purchasers of consoles for these reasons because some exclusives kinda force one to own a PC and a console if you really want the best of both worlds (even worse now when you have to own two or three consoles in addition to a PC if you really want access to all of the potentially good games released). I do however dislike the fact that console games (apart from generally being poorer in performance when compared to a current PC) cost so much and come with restrictions before allowing you to play online, forced firmware updates before installing new games, loss of backwards compatibility when moving from one version of the console to the next, limitations such as not allowing you to play your own music (*on most games anyway), etc. Oh that and that they bar seems to be set lower than what it could have been had most of these titles being developed for PC first and then ported to console instead of the other way around.
Now this doesn't make me a one-platform only gamer (there were some really great games on the PS3 that I am glad that I got to play) but it does however make me wait a little longer before adopting these new consoles right now especially when the current game libraries are somewhat lacking (in my opinion of course).
|Darth_Flibble 1 hour ago||There is nothing wrong with collectibles or achievements, its how they are USED by game developers. Some developer throws a load of shit into a game to pad it out or has run out of time does not mean collectibles should be killed off. They just need to learn how to add them better.|
|subtlesnake 1 hour ago||
Yeah, I understand that but I still think, whether it's an after-the-fact port or not, that putting a game like this onto consoles must result in compromise and a degree of dumbing-down, in order to not only be functional but to also appeal. Console gamers aren't space simulation fans, if they were, there woould be a market for that genre there. Therefore, IMO the game would need to be pushed more into shooter territory then simulation territory. It's that kind of change that I think PC gamers look at and cringe over, when they see ports.The fact that publishers have chosen not to to take risks with space simulation games on console doesn't prove that there isn't a market for those games. How many AAA space simulation games have we seen on PC?
Moreover, from what I've read Elite plays very well as a straight up shooter, so if the game allows you some flexibility as to how you can approach it, it could also be successful amongst action fans.
|dogmanstaruk 1 hour ago||
As a fan of PC gaming I am all for more people building
their own rigs and entering into it.
I just would like to usher a word of caution. It is fine to build a cheap PC today, but just don't expect it to be running games in 2-3 years time with high details/resolution. Be realistic and realise you will need to continually upgrade your machine. As tech progresses one upgrade may require another e.g. New CPU may need a new Mobo/Memory.
Upgrading PCs is one of the best parts of the hobby, but it can be expensive. This is why I say unless someone has a healthy disposable income the better long term prospect may be the consoles. At least there you know your investment will last 5-6 years.
Note - I'm not saying everyone needs to go and buy an I7 or 290x, just trying to temper expectations of the lifespan of hardware as modern graphic engines develop and progress e.g. DX12 is being unveiled during GDC.
|Ninja_Tino 1 hour ago||
@jimmyhill11 Yeah, great
points. I'd say in general I'm swaying more towards your
opinion of it. I would've just liked some more dialogue
while doing it, even just Joel muttering to himself. TLoU
certainly does it better than most.
Totally with you on the Ish stuff, too. There are also other minor details in TLoU which suggest stories without explicitly telling them. Skyrim's saturated. A total mess.
Surprised also that Dark Souls wasn't mentioned for its incredible storytelling. Everyone should check out Rich Stanton's Dark Souls vs. Skyrim article on how DS does so much so right!
|darth_paul 1 hour ago||
In that case, for the same amount of money, the pc gamer would buy 2 games (A+B), and the console player only 1 (B, only this one, because A is too expensive)
Both gamers spent the same, but one got much more gameplay out of its investment, more bang for the buck
Pc is cheaper, no way of twisting it into something else, im afraid