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"Violent" MW2 discussed in Parliament News

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News by Robert Purchese

9 November, 2009

The UK government has defended mature videogame content, and stated that when it's rated properly grown-ups "can get what adults should be able to".

Outspoken Labour MP Keith Vaz questioned Sion Simon (Culture, Media and Sport Minister) about plans to stop "violent" game Modern Warfare 2 falling into the hands of children, since it "contains such scenes of brutality that even the manufacturers have put in warnings". "It's not about censorship," Vaz said, "it's about protecting our children."

"The clearest recommendation of the Byron Review is that content suitable for adults should be labelled as such and sold as such, that it should be an offence to sell such content to children," countered Simon.

"That's the case under current law, it will be the case with the law when it changes under the Digital Economy Bill. This game the honourable gentleman refers to is a certificate 18 game, it should not be sold to children and the government's job is to make sure that adults, clearly labelled, can get what adults should be able to, and that children are not in danger of being subjected to adult content. "

Tom Watson, Labour MP for West Bromwich East, revealed that he had seen the "unpleasant" content in the game, but said it was "no worse than many films and books" of similar rating.

He urged the Minister not to start "collaborating with the Daily Mail to create moral panic over the use of videogames" and get on with supporting the games industry instead.

You can read the entire transcript below.

Keith Vaz, Labour, Leicester East (in response to an answer from Sion Simon on the Byron Review - "What steps have been taken to implement the review on Safer Children in a digital world?")

"Is the Minister aware that at midnight tonight a new and violent videogame called Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 is to be released. It contains such scenes of brutality that even the manufacturers have put in warnings within the game telling people how they can skip particular scenes.

"Given the recommendations of the Byron Review, specifically paragraphs 32 and 33, what steps is the government proposing to take in order to ensure these violent games do not fall into the hands of children and young people. It's not about censorship, it's about protecting our children."

Sion Simon, Culture, Media and Sport Minister

The clearest recommendation of the Byron Review is that content suitable for adults should be labelled as such and sold as such, that it should be an offense to sell such content to children. That's the case under current law, it will be the case with the law when it changes under the Digital Economy Bill. This game the hon. gentleman refers to is a certificate 18 game, it should not be sold to children and the government's job is to make sure that adults, clearly labelled, can get what adults should be able to, and that children are not in danger of being subjected to adult content.

Tom Watson, Labour, West Bromwich East

"I've seen the content in this videogame, it is unpleasant, though no worse than in many films and books, it is an 18-plus game and carries the BBFC 18-plus rating as well.

"Does the Minister agree that it would be better for this House to support the many thousands of games designers and coders and the many millions of games users, rather than collaborating with the Daily Mail to create moral panic over the use of videogames?"

Sion Simon, Culture, Media and Sport Minister

"I was in Dundee last week visiting the videogames industry. I can certainly agree with him that videogames is an industry, a very large, very important industry in which we have a national competitive advantage in this country, which it's important that all members of this House, and the government, continue to support.

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Comments: 1-50 of 91 in total | next 50 »

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cianchristopher
09/11/09 @ 15:39
#1
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Won't somebody please think of the children.....
X201
09/11/09 @ 15:41
#2
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Won't somebody please think of the Daily Mail's circulation figures...
marronthered
09/11/09 @ 15:42
#3
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nowhere near as violent as an illegal war in iraq
EarlBassett
09/11/09 @ 15:42
#4
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Surprised it's not caused more fuss to be honest
Hobo
09/11/09 @ 15:44
#5
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Keith Vaz had something to say on the matter?!

MIND. BLOWN.
smernicki
09/11/09 @ 15:44
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VAZFAIL
jonsaan
09/11/09 @ 15:45
#7
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I wish Keith Vaz had been around to censor my games of war in the woods when I was growing up. I'd be a much more rounded person if I hadn't been exposed to all that senseless pretend killing.
superdelphinus
09/11/09 @ 15:46
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keith spaz
AphoticCosmos
09/11/09 @ 15:47
#9
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Don't you dare wheel out that "protecting our children" bullshit again, Vazzy. Either enforce age ratings or punish parents, or do both. Adults should be able to buy what they want.

For the record, Keith Vaz is a bona fide douche when he speaks on any issue, let alone gaming.
kangarootoo
09/11/09 @ 15:47
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That was a surprisingly balanced and sensible discussion. Even the usually raving Keith Vaz seemed to be more interested in restricting sales to just adults rather than banning the sale across the board.

Maybe there is hope for us yet.
chessboxer
09/11/09 @ 15:49
#11
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I hear children playing CS:S, Killzone 2, Unreal Tournament, L4D and GTA4 which are 15 or higher rated games. Some received them as gifts whilst other play games that were purchased by their older siblings.

If a parent (or an older sibling) decides to buy such a game for their younger child, is the shop really going to refuse the sale of the game?

Anyway, I'm enjoying MW2 at the moment. Will see how many people are on the PSN with it shortly.
MavSkipper
09/11/09 @ 15:49
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"Won't somebody please think of the Daily Fail's circulation figures..."

fixed
smernicki
09/11/09 @ 15:52
#13
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"Won't somebody please think of the Faily Mail's circulation figures..."
sneetch
09/11/09 @ 15:52
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I wholeheartedly support Tom Watson in this and encourage everyone in the UK to move to West Bromwich East (surely Central Bromwich?) and vote for him to be king, or however it is you guys handle that stuff.

To sum up, I'm not interested in getting bogged down in the fine details (I'm a big picture guy) but Tom Watson for king.
Baranga
09/11/09 @ 15:53
#15
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"Won't somebody please think of the Faily Fail's circulation figures..."
Edited 1 times, most recently on 09/11/09 @ 15:54
sneetch
09/11/09 @ 15:54
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"Won't somebody please think of the Faily Fail's circulation figures..."

I win. :P

Edit: NOOOOOO. Pipped at the post.
Edited 1 times, most recently on 09/11/09 @ 15:54
Freek
09/11/09 @ 15:58
#17
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Wow, shockingly sensible!
kangarootoo
09/11/09 @ 15:58
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"I win. :P "

I think perhaps, due to you touching the evil pun-stone, you all lose ;)
superdelphinus
09/11/09 @ 15:59
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"Won't somebody please think of the Daily Heil's circulation figures..."
Sonic_D
09/11/09 @ 16:00
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Sensible discussion shocker. What's the deal in Oz, they refuse to create an 18+ cert?
superdelphinus
09/11/09 @ 16:02
#21
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I think it's based on mental age in Australia, and so an 18 certificate is never really needed
photoboy
09/11/09 @ 16:05
#22
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Keith Vaz needs to shut up and stop pandering to the Daily Mail demographic (who apparently are too stupid to be able to read the very clear adults only rating on the game casing).

Considering he's a disgraced politician who has been caught more than once in corruption scandals I'm surprised he's still around. But then the rest of them are no better. Hopefully the looming election will get rid of most of them.
NGCes26294BIV
09/11/09 @ 16:07
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Good to see the house backhanding Vaz on yet another ill-prepared and poorly structured argument.
andywilkie35
09/11/09 @ 16:08
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At the end of the day, the ratings system has approved the game for sale. If the government were to block the sale of the game, then it completely undermines the point of the system, so well done to them for seeing sense.
zedzee
09/11/09 @ 16:09
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The violence in MW2 and other video games is nowhere near the real horrors being committed daily on the people of Gaza, by the Israelis.

Indeed, the British and especially the American armies have inflicted worse violence in Iraq and Afghanistan...And that's against civilians!
Collymilad
09/11/09 @ 16:10
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What's wrong with the British government today?

Hmm, what they said.....makes..sense?

*Head explodes*
owl
09/11/09 @ 16:14
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Maybe staff should be encouraged to ask who a game is for when someone is buying it. Do people really get offended when asked for ID when buying alcohol anymore? Not really. Just make it the norm as it is for alcohol and tobacco.

i was in the queue in game the other day and a kid with his mother bought some wrestling game which was 16+, the kid obviously was not 16+. the assistant asked if the mother was aware that the game was age restricted - she was. he sold it no more questions asked.

perhaps they should be concentrating on stopping this sort of situation.
superdelphinus
09/11/09 @ 16:14
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"What a stupid comment, enforced, yes they should have armed police there just in case a child trys to buy a 18 cert game. It's already against the law to sell an adult rated game to a minor, nothing more can be done, enforced, you muppet."

eh?
AbyssUK
09/11/09 @ 16:18
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Oh looks like MP's are realising that video games actually make the country lots of money... no longer is it "ban this sick filth" it's now "support this sick filth as they pay taxes"
Vertical Stand
09/11/09 @ 16:19
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@AbyssUk - yeah videogames are big business, who pay taxes, governments like taxes, but didn't think about this until recently, cause they're old and stupid and read the Daily Mail on the bog instead of wiping their arses with it - having finally realised that videogame companies pay lots of taxes, government remember they like firms that pay taxes, especially when overall money coming into the state coffers is down.
Edited 1 times, most recently on 09/11/09 @ 16:20
sneetch
09/11/09 @ 16:20
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@chessboxer
If a parent (or an older sibling) decides to buy such a game for their younger child, is the shop really going to refuse the sale of the game?

The shop cannot (or should not) refuse: the age rating means that you can't sell or rent it to someone under that age (or see it in a cinema if it's a movie), it doesn't mean that you can't play or watch it. For good or ill, it's basically up to the parents to know what their kids are doing.

When GTA IV was released I was in GAME and noticed this 14-15 year old pacing up and down. He was a bit agitated then his father entered the store, they had a chat and they went to the counter with a copy of GTA IV. To his credit the GAME employee pointed out that the game was rated 18 for violence, mild sexual content and foul language and asked him if he was sure, (I believe the GAME guy used the Sopranos as an example during all this) the dad had a brief conversation with his son and decided to buy it. The point is that the GAME guy was selling to the father and basically it was up to him.
Gao
09/11/09 @ 16:20
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I hate the fact that computer games have now become a valid political currency. I don't agree with Keith Vaz generalizing computer games the way he does, but equally i don't agree with Tom Watson using the opposite side of the coin to further his own political career with our past time.
And while i'm at it I don't thi...nk Infinity Ward should have included a scene which is not needed to tell the story just to get a bit more publicity / sensationalism for there game. It was always going to get record sales so why lower them selves with this kind of stunt.
If gaming is ever going to lose the childish and non artform status it currently has the developers have to stop with the stupid press stunts and act like resepected artists.
kangarootoo
09/11/09 @ 16:23
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@Negotiator

Several sources have shipped early. Literally hundreds of people around the UK already have their copy. There are even articles on the front page of this very website about it.

Ear to the ground, thats you.
NGCes26294BIV
09/11/09 @ 16:24
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Negotiator, stop trolling.

First of all, MW2 has been delivered by a number of online retailers already - lovefilm and the hut already admitted as much, and numerous retail stores have broken the street date too - Gamestop even came out to admit that it broke it on purpose, so yes, people are playing it, despite the release date being tomorrow.

Secondly, get a dictionary so you can learn the meaning of the word 'enforce', because it's not exclusive to the use of 'police' enforcement.

darkmorgado
09/11/09 @ 16:24
#37
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I actually just called Sion Simon's office in the house of commons to pass along a very genuine "thank you."

It's refreshing to see an MP actually backing the industry and having the common sense to point out that the age rating is on the box for a reason.

His secretary said she was extremely grateful and that she would make sure that he is made aware that he has my support.

PS - I also mentioned that he has been shown overwhelming support on these forums ;-)

PPS - Ah, balance restored :-)

EDIT: WTf? I just got NEGGED for telling an MP thank you for supporting the gaming industry and not pandering to tabloid scaremongering? WTF IS THAT ABOUT?
Edited 2 times, most recently on 09/11/09 @ 16:27
darkmorgado
09/11/09 @ 16:26
#38
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Yes chessboxer you are enjoying MW2 at the moment, even though its not out yet, of course you are.

Newsflash idiot, several retailers have admitted to breaking the street date!

Plus, he could, y'know, actually work for a games retailer.
dr_zoidthrob
09/11/09 @ 16:28
#39
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Vaz is the UKs Jack Thompson... always has been, unfortunately always will be.

We just have to put up with the simpering idiot, let him have a rant, then disappear back to wherever he lives and wait for the next game he gets offended by.


What a a tit.


EDIT: In other news, the government seems to've figured this out too. Which can only ever be A Good Thing.
Edited 1 times, most recently on 09/11/09 @ 16:28
darkmorgado
09/11/09 @ 16:30
#40
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Sion Simon's office number at the house of commons is:

0207 219 6637

Would be nice if you could all show your support and let him know he has the backing of a community :-)

PS - His name is pronounced "sean", as was embarassingly pointed out to me over the phone lol
lavalant
09/11/09 @ 16:30
#41
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I thought Vaz was fired over his expenses.
kangarootoo
09/11/09 @ 16:32
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"PS - I also mentioned that he has been shown overwhelming support on these forums ;-) "

Christ, I hope she doesn't visit the threads directly. That would be an eye opener as to the mentality of gamers for sure :)
NGCes26294BIV
09/11/09 @ 16:34
#43
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"Vaz is the UKs Jack Thompson"

Please, you're giving him too much credit. People actually listened to Thomson on a national level - Nobody listens to Vaz, even his own party.
darkmorgado
09/11/09 @ 16:34
#44
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@kangarootoo

LOL!

She sounded REALLY pleased on the phone. I guess she isn't used to speaking to people congratulating an MP lol
kangarootoo
09/11/09 @ 16:34
#45
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@darkmorgado

Its a cool sentiment, but non-stop phone calls might get a bit incovenient in the end.

An email might be better.

simons(AT)parliament(DOT)uk
darkmorgado
09/11/09 @ 16:36
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I'm a very firm believer in using my democratic right to speak to MPs.

It's why I'm not working with my local MP to set up my county's first dedicated Autism support group.

EDIT: Oh, so now I get negged because I'm trying to set up a charity for an issue that directly affects me (having asperger's)?

Bloody hell
Edited 1 times, most recently on 09/11/09 @ 16:43
kangarootoo
09/11/09 @ 16:38
#47
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"I'm a very firm believer in using my democratic right to speak to MPs"

Me too. I'm just thinking of the logistics of it. I'm sure an email of support would be gratefully received. :)
darkmorgado
09/11/09 @ 16:40
#48
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@kangaroo

True, but phone calls are more "visible" in the sense that they will have more of a "cor blimey I have support!" impact then a "oh look, i have mail".
Especially considering the amount of emails the average MP must receive on a daily basis.

EDIT: OK, why is some troll on here negging every comment I make?
Edited 1 times, most recently on 09/11/09 @ 16:45
vincentw00t
09/11/09 @ 16:42
#49
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Oh aye, I'm thinking of taking a trip over to Dundee to see that there videogames industry.
Anthony_UK
09/11/09 @ 16:43
#50
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Kieth Vaz - Atomic Facepalm!

Comments: 1-50 of 91 in total | next 50 »

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