Race Driver: GRID Comments by Tom Bramwell

@jonsaan

As Beano said. And yes, Dirt was idenitical to my eye (I downloaded both 360 and PS3 demos of that). So I was surprised by the technical issues of the PS3 GRID demo. It was so bad I actually downloaded the 360 version just to see if it the engine was flawed or whether it was another example of a bad cross platform engine.

Put it this way, on my PS3 and TV the demo was tearing and stuttering pretty much all the time. On the 360 it didn't do this at all.

I'm not deliberately courting controversy, but personally I want to know about this sort of thing because I have the choice of platforms and such issues do affect my enjoyment of a game.

I didn't notice any tearing on the PS3 demo, but then again it lasted all of about 5 minutes before I thought "bugger this" and deleted it!
NICE MENUS THOUGH.

imo the PC demo played better than the 360 demo.
I would buy it for the PC if I didn't already have too many racing games uncompleted

You'd hope for a little more comment on the handling in a 3 page review.

bizarre is not doing a new MSR game. Sega owns that brand and thus it will have to be through them if Bizarre is to do a new game in the original brand.

I believe MSR is much better name than PGR, but thats another story. :)

On topic; I totally disliked the controls/handling (every assist was off) - but still everything else was pretty much spot on. Graphics are the best I've seen in a console racer and the sounds was okayish. The presentation and crashes are also much impressive and all in all, I had a good time with the demo. If the full game has softned up the controls abit instead of being so on/off (full brakes in the BMW allows you not to stear? WTF?) the I must admit I'm very much tempted to pick the final game up.

EDIT: Spelling

It'd be nice for a (reputable) PS3 owner to report back once they have it. Well for you lot anyway, as I said... played it, enthusiasm drained.

@systems - I guess the problem is that codies *used* to produce racing and rally games that were "fun" for a specific crowd of people ( myself included ) but now that they've gone all arcadey that specific group of people ( myself included ) feel a little abandoned by the very developer that we used to rally behind ( pun intended ).

Now they're *fun* for a much larger crowd - trouble is they've nicked our tricycles in the process and aren't giving them back anytime soon.

/Waits for GT with damage and that Ferrari wotsit.

I'll defo be picking this up. Loved the PS3 demo.

But the handling is still rubbish, rendering everything else redundant :(

@peterfll : Actually DIRT runs far better on PS3 than 360 (much bigger difference that on GRID), but that's primarily because the PS3 version came out later and the developers had more time to optimize the PS3 version.

Shocked! 9/10!!

I quite like all the things in the game (sponsors - yes I'm sad, building a team, hiring a team mate yey!)

But I thought the demo sucked ass on the most important aspect - handling. I thought I was driving on ice (I love Forza, but GRID didn't seem to give me any slipping/tyre feedback). It doesnt matter what is in the game if the handling is pants.

Might have to download and try the demo again...

Overall it sounds like a return to form for Codies driving stuff (which I've disliked since the last great, TOCA PS1).


EDIT - Now that I've read all the comments here it seems opinion is divided. Seems a great game for Arcade players (nothing wrong with that!) but not what I'm after. I too would have liked more review info on the most important aspect (handling).

Walks on...

Demo run perfect on my PS3 dunno what problems anyone else had.

sharing the engine with Dirt is flawed IMO, i also felt the handling was off ... rally and track racing seems incompatible to me.

Driving on ice, yes! That sums it up for me.

@Egster

You do realise that your opinion is just that: an opinion (and not a representation of fact, as you seem to be implying)! I for one quite like the arcade handling (though understand why others don't). I pretty much agree with the review and score (though perhaps would have thought an 8 was more appropriate).

With regards to the Haze score, it isn't only Eurogamer who think it is mediocre at best...

Well, been playing the multiplayer on xboxlive and haven't had so much fun since I first put COD4 in the tray. I would buy this game if it was only multiplayer but the fact you get a big single player game as well is the icing on the cake. I found nothing wrong with the handling after I got used to it. Graphics are good, damage is good, presentation is slick, multiplayer is smooth. Next Friday I'll be down Gamestation with my cash.

I'll be buying this for the multiplayer alone... it's excellent.
The randomness of the 1st corner with full damage on really makes it feel like a more fun and less competitive experience.

"full brakes in the BMW allows you not to stear? WTF?"

Yeah, that's known as locking up your front wheels. To me, complaining about handling not being realistic in a videogame is pretty irrelevant, unless that game is billed as a simulation. It's like moaning that you won't play COD4 because the recoil on the M16 is all wrong. Either the game is fun or it isn't, and OutRun2, Burnout and Ridge Racer demonstrate that driving games can be immensely enjoyable with even the most fantastical interpretation of Newton's laws.

With regards to the tearing on the PS3 demo, I think somewhere on here I read that the EG framerate counting apparatus detected that it was tearing approximately 40% of the frames.

yeah i'm with monkie_king, there a lot of people spouting off about the physics and that Grid is arcadey, I think they are just repeating what others have said to give themselves some kind of snobbish high ground.

Forza 2 is supposed to be sim, but to some pc racers that is not the case they look down their noses at it. I think Grid handles fine, different to Forza, but not really 'arcadey', when i think of arcadey i think of outrun/crazy taxi/daytona.

I dont think people are looking down their noses at GRID handling, just stating its not what they want. I find Forza2 to be in the middle ground between say a PC sim (GPL) and PGR (perhaps leaning towards more difficult with aides off, but that's the point of selectable aides) and I love the handling of that.

But with everything switched off GRID doesn't give me what I want - a sense of controlling a car, so in that sense I refer to it as Arcade (and the rewind stuff certainly adds to its Arcade label in my opinion). I don't sit at home in a specially designed racing chair gripping my £200 steering wheel, but this game is quite far from handling as expected or being fun for me (I think).

I don't really want to learn to drive something Codies have 'created'.

I do however set up the controls on racing games to use right analogue stick as throttle/brake not the triggers for the latter do not give enough fine control - GEEK ALERT.

@ foray

not noticed in framerate or tearing problems on the ps3 demo either, played both and they looked and ran identical at a casual glance

Euw, you on a PlayStation pad there? It's been triggers for me since the Dreamcast, through Gamecube and Xbox to 360. Though I did have to resort to right stick for GT3 on the PS2, thanks to the utterly useless travel-free "analogue" face buttons.

X360

I've always used the sticks since F12001 on PS2.

Buttons/triggers don't give enough control for me.

Didn't EG report in the update to their GTA IV framerate article that the PS3 version tore 40% of the time using a proper test? That sounds about right from the demo I played. The 360 version had minimal tearing throughout the demo, in fact I only saw it once or twice in the dozen or so times I played it. Of course, the PS3 demo could have been an earlier build than the 360 or the 360's graphic chip may have the edge over the PS3's hence the reason the engine runs smoother. Whatever, the main reason for me pre-ordering the 360 version is I prefer its controller for racing games, it's as simple as that.

Boring. Once you've played one cack racing game with shit cars that don't steer or stop when you press the buttons, you've played them all.

Are you sure your controller was connected?

I enjoyed the demo of it for the 360, especially the San Francisco track where you hear the thud of the car as you land after a short air time. :)

"Didn't EG report in the update to their GTA IV framerate article that the PS3 version tore 40% of the time using a proper test? "

If they wrote that, they were wrong. I havn't noticed any tearing in GTA4 on PS3. It has big framerate issues, but no tearing.. or at least very minor tearing.

Have to say if the handling is anything like DIRT then this is a def no buy. There's realistic racers and arcadey racers but it still has ot fundametally feel like a car you are driving, which in my opinion dirt did not.

"GRID is a arcade racer... and sounds like a great racer, but no sim like TOCA and GTR ."

TOCA was so f'ing not a sim! Argh! Go play 2 or 3 again, race with ANY car (even the ancient skinny-wheeled types), accelerate to as high a speed as you like, then jam on the brakes... THEY WON'T LOCK UP. Yes, it doesn't even try to model braking properly. There are other issues as well, and I quite liked 2, but it was no sim.

Forza is the sim of the consoles...

@Beano - No, you misunderstood what I wrote, EG mentioned that the Race Driver GRID demo on the PS3 had torn frames 40% of the time in their GTA IV graphics comparison update.

The article is *here*.

@Darren : Ok... makes more sense ;)

I'm just curious if the retail version (of GRID) performs the same as the demo did.

"Yeah, that's known as locking up your front wheels. "

Well, if the ABS failed and the wheels are just skidding, that would be perfectly ok. But in GRID that is not what is happening. Based on the demo, what Codies have put in GRID as handling is beneath pretty much every other arcade racer out on this generation. Yes, even NFS ProStreet and Burnout Paradise.

And if you care to read most of the negative comments here is that the handling issues with GRID is what is taking away all the fun of the game. Which is very sad, since everthing else is top notch. Nobody here was expecting Forza 2 physics but we were promised something along the lines of PGR in terms of handling realism, and surely GRID doesn't deliver this.

Still, I might buy it (as I've already said)

What with this and GTA4 I'm genuinely starting to wonder if I've bought a lemon in the ps3; the only thing that swung the decision for me over the 360 were the issues over build quality. Pfft.

I'd imagine most people can afford both consoles, but still...

This needs some kind of shocking eurogamer exposé.

sadly, I will now need to buy this, having played the demo and finding out the full game remains completely awesome

*sigh* I was hoping to save some money...

Tried the 360 demo. Liked the idea of getting different bonuses for getting different places in teh game, much more interesting than just 'win the race'. Looked nice, everything good..... OMG, the handling? I didn't know that from a standing start accelerating in a BMW while turning puts you into an instant doughnut.

Jeez, it was rubbish.. At high speed it felt ok, but low speeds it was ridiculous. I am one of the Forza, PGR4, Grand Prix 3 on the PC brigade.

Whole package looks awesome, but hugely let down by the handling...

Better than Gran Turismo 5 probably.

Re: DiRT, well I downloaded the 360 demo when it first came out. Then the PS3 demo some months later so the comparison was based more on memory. Also I couldn't comment on the full retail versions was superior, I was talking only about the demos.

I find it interesting when people don't notice the tearing \ framerate issues. I thought I was starting to understand the underlying technical reasons for tearing - and I didn't think it was related to your display settings (for example, which might explain why people get different results). But basically the PS3 GRID demo had terrible tearing in it, and for a racing game that's really not good. My PS3 was running it at 720p (on a 1080p TV).

I remember when EG reviewed Unchartered Drakes Fortune and - paraphrasing it mentioned - "couldn't see any tearing". I've since bought it and it does tear quite a bit on my setup (although overall it's quite a stunning game).

\confused myself now

Sorry, I know I'm banging on about technical issues when most people here seem to dislike GRID for the handling \ gameplay, which I agree is the most important element of a game of course. I guess GRID is one of those marmite experiences (there's been a few games like that recently!).

What we really want is V rally 4! Or perhaps at least RBR 2. Either will suffice. :D :D :D :D

I tried the demo but it didn't work for me at all. Graphics flickered, the menus were buggy, there were half-invisible trailers standing in the middle of the tracks. It was virtually unplayable because of all the bugs.

Looking forward to the retail though. Sounds like a bundle of fun!

mrchuckles
You need to give it a chance, you've got to be a bit more subtle with the right trigger and the steering and you'll soon get used to it and enjoy it for what it is.
I think people complain about the handling (me included) because they are initially crap at it and don’t put the time in to understand what you can and can’t do. Try the time trial and do repeated laps and you’ll understand the handling model more as your lap times fall.
Record stands at approx 1:13.60 in the BMW, I can only manage 1:15.15

@egster

i don't think the driving feels like crap even for an arcade racer and obviously neither did the reviewer

I love this game, its great fun to play other people online, and the damage system is very cool. Cant wait to get it next week.

On the technical side, I have had NOT 1 technical tearing or stuttering problem with the game. So this leads me to think there may be other things that people are not considering, like screen resolution, crap internet providers, crappy monitors, a full up hard disk (does PS3 do defragging?) etc.

I dont know if this is the case, I am just stating Ive had a couple of hangs in the game (played it alot) but other than that I've had nothing, so I would be interested in some of these game sites actually looking into what is causing these problems than saying theres tearing... the same criticism of GTA is exactly the same, had no performance or tearing. To me there is something specific, and not just platform specific.

PS the driving of the game is not that bad once you get used to it, I do laugh at those that want realistic driving, most people would never have driven cars like this, and lets be honest using a controller or a plastic steering wheel is not the most realistic thing in the world. Perhaps one day people can have a car mock up in their living room and then complain it doesnt drive realistically.

Good news for us PS3 owners (I do have a 360 as well, but I really prefer to stick to my preferred console - and now that I have a Dualshock 3, the PS3 also fares a bit better in racing games).

http://community.codemasters.com/forum/s...

"Just a few updates: Firstly, we v-sync every frame, but allow the game to overrun if needed, which is very rare and is much preferable to a complete frame drop. Secondly, our performance tests show that the 360 is running at a rock solid 30fps and the PS3 rarely drops, being rock solid 99% of the time. San Fran in the demo is probably our worst performer when the action gets really heavy on a couple of those long straights. Thirdly, we don't lead on any platform. We have dedicated teams on each platform as that is the only way to get the best from each of them. Fourthly, there are some extra performance improvements between the demo and release on PS3 as we were tuning right to the last minute. This should be apparent in our forthcoming reviews. Just to be on the safe side, we also have some further improvements lined up our patch."

"PS the driving of the game is not that bad once you get used to it, I do laugh at those that want realistic driving, most people would never have driven cars like this, and lets be honest using a controller or a plastic steering wheel is not the most realistic thing in the world. Perhaps one day people can have a car mock up in their living room and then complain it doesnt drive realistically."

I think a lot of people are missing the point somewhat...

It's less about people wanting the cars to behave exactly as they do in real-life (because you are correct, we haven't driven them all) but more about them behaving in a way people EXPECT such cars to behave (or cars in general). Considering a lot of people have driven cars and/or realistic simulations, I think their opinion on the handling, and belief that it's less than great, is valid.

Dare I generalise and say that if you drive using the external behind-the-car-cam, that this game is right up your street. If you play cockpit/nose cam then go for the more rewarding 'simulation' Forza2 ;)


btw - I hate the fecking Guitar Hero ad popping out all over the comments box - feck off with that. Anyone suggest a good flash/ad blocker for Firefox?

@T4RG4

Flashblock is your friend. :o)

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox...

Ooh nice one infoxicated!

Cheers.

T4RG4 just hit the nail on the head. I don't want the game to handle as a racing car in real life would (I have brief experience in that field, but nowhere near enough to be able to judge properly). If I wanted that I would carry on with rFactor.

No, all I wanted was the handling to be good; to give the player something that he could get used to and control instinctively. The handling on GRID is really floaty and fluffy, and it makes it bloody hard to be smooth or consistent with lines and the like. I appreciate that it's not a full-on simulation, but at least give us handling that is simple and predictable.

jurys our on this one. Demo handling was Meh. way too easy, no testing physics at work, just screehy sounds and leany body roll but nothing else goin on.

Might give it a rent.

Fully deserved.


Apart from the drifting...